Hi, new here.

[Guest guest]

Hi,

I just joined this group tonight. In July, my father told me that my mother has

BPD, along with a list of other mental issues. I've known my whole life

something was wrong, but to have a names(s) for it brings everything into a

whole new dimension. I feel like I'm in a free fall. I tried to talk to my best

friend about it (she's known me for eleven years), but she shut me out. I tried

to talk to my husband about it, but he doesn't get it. I've never had a close

relationship with my father, so even though he says I can talk to him, I don't

want to. I do talk to my aunt, but I'm so afraid of losing her as well that I'm

not totally honest with her. I feel like I'm losing everything and everyone.

My husband says we can't afford counseling, and because our income is too high

we don't qualify for a sliding scale. Insurance doesn't cover it. I've been

writing in my journal, working out, joining mom groups, and working more. I've

been reading what I can online, and I started reading " Surviving the Borderline

Parent " but I'm still falling.

Suggestions? Books that helped you? Words of wisdom? I'll take any and all

advice.

Thank you,

.

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

I'm new here too, and it sounds like we're coming to the BPD conclusions about

our mothers at almost exactly the same time!

My therapist (who I can only afford to see VERY rarely, and only to keep my

Valium prescription current -- I struggle a bit with anxiety, which I believe is

common for children of BPD parents), he suggested I read up on the condition as

it seems to fit my mother perfectly.

I, too, am reading 'Surviving the Borderline Parent' and am finding it immensely

helpful. (I read the Kindle version on my laptop, which allows me to highlight

and make notes without worrying that anyone else will see them!)

But I'll warn you that as you get this new information and process it, you'll

probably experience added stress. While it's a relief to know that what you went

through growing up has a name, and that other people have had similar

experiences, actually researching BPD will probably dredge up some unpleasant

memories and realizations. BPD and your struggles with your mother will probably

preoccupy you even more for a while.

You didn't say whether your parents are still together, but if they are, it

might be especially difficult for your father to truly be there for you as

you're sorting out the complicated feelings around your mother's BPD. Your

father likely feels guilt. (I am dealing with the fact that the only other

person in the world who has experienced my mother as I have -- my father -- is

likely not in a position to be my confidante. He, too, dealt with terrible

treatment from her, but he had a much more powerful, even complicit role in it,

so it's not like our experiences were all that parallel).

Someone in this group just recommended this book to me. I haven't read it, but

plan to:

http://www.amazon.com/Understanding-Borderline-Mother-Unpredictable-Relationship\

/dp/0765703319

So I guess my only real advice is to use this group as a sounding board, but

also as validation that your experiences with your mother are real and for many

of us, familiar. I'd encourage you to keep posting, especially since it doesn't

sound like anyone in your circle quite understands the BPD experience.

Also, go easy on yourself. Of course you feel you're in a freefall -- you're

integrating so much information into your own painful experiences. I would say,

allow yourself to feel kind of awful from time to time, but know that the pain

will lessen the more you sit with all this.

And rather than seeking out individual therapists in your area, I recommend that

you find a regional mental health/counseling organization that can offer more

resources to help you find affordable counseling.

Good luck.

>

> Hi,

>

> I just joined this group tonight. In July, my father told me that my mother

has BPD, along with a list of other mental issues. I've known my whole life

something was wrong, but to have a names(s) for it brings everything into a

whole new dimension. I feel like I'm in a free fall. I tried to talk to my best

friend about it (she's known me for eleven years), but she shut me out. I tried

to talk to my husband about it, but he doesn't get it. I've never had a close

relationship with my father, so even though he says I can talk to him, I don't

want to. I do talk to my aunt, but I'm so afraid of losing her as well that I'm

not totally honest with her. I feel like I'm losing everything and everyone.

>

> My husband says we can't afford counseling, and because our income is too high

we don't qualify for a sliding scale. Insurance doesn't cover it. I've been

writing in my journal, working out, joining mom groups, and working more. I've

been reading what I can online, and I started reading " Surviving the Borderline

Parent " but I'm still falling.

>

> Suggestions? Books that helped you? Words of wisdom? I'll take any and all

advice.

>

> Thank you,

> .

>

[Guest guest]

Hi, and welcome!

This group is about the best " parachute " you could have found!

You're going to be ok, but right now it feels really, really scary.

I don't know which was worse for me, knowing there was something

terribly " off " about my Nada, but having everybody (almost) tell me I was

wrong, or finally getting absolute, irrefutable proof, that I was right.

Either way, it is a nightmare, for a while, and it seems like it will never

end, but it does get better.

There are some really great books out - the reading list on OZ is

amazing, there are some great films out, too. " Gaslight, " is one of my

favorites!

My Dad too, knew, from the beginning, that something was not quite 100%

right with my Nada. He believed that with therapy, time, love, and a stable

home life, she would work thru it.

She didn't. She did get better at covering up her motivations and

machinations, and he became acclimated to her behaviors.

They were both mental health professionals

I have been thrashing thru my feelings about this for some time now.

I am still confused over my own issues - I am terrified of her, *and*, I

miss her, and long for her. I will never, ever, under any circumstances

allow her back into my life.

Once I quit trying to solve the conundrum, and just accepted it as a

conundrum, things got a little easier for me to face.

I hope things will get better for you, too.

Peace and solace be with you, you are not alone!

Warm Regards, Sunspot

On Sun, Nov 4, 2012 at 12:40 AM, michellejames892 <

michellejames892@...> wrote:

> **

>

>

> Hi,

>

> I just joined this group tonight. In July, my father told me that my

> mother has BPD, along with a list of other mental issues. I've known my

> whole life something was wrong, but to have a names(s) for it brings

> everything into a whole new dimension. I feel like I'm in a free fall. I

> tried to talk to my best friend about it (she's known me for eleven years),

> but she shut me out. I tried to talk to my husband about it, but he doesn't

> get it. I've never had a close relationship with my father, so even though

> he says I can talk to him, I don't want to. I do talk to my aunt, but I'm

> so afraid of losing her as well that I'm not totally honest with her. I

> feel like I'm losing everything and everyone.

>

> My husband says we can't afford counseling, and because our income is too

> high we don't qualify for a sliding scale. Insurance doesn't cover it. I've

> been writing in my journal, working out, joining mom groups, and working

> more. I've been reading what I can online, and I started reading " Surviving

> the Borderline Parent " but I'm still falling.

>

> Suggestions? Books that helped you? Words of wisdom? I'll take any and all

> advice.

>

> Thank you,

> .

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Sunspot- I am fascinated by what you said about your parents being mental health

professionals.

I believe (as I said above) that my mother suffers from BPD. I also believe that

my parents went into parenthood with a sense of compensating (and perhaps

over-compensating) for their own terrible childhoods. Both seemed to suffer some

form of fear, but mainly, emotional neglect.

What's interesting to me is that both my parents seem to relate heavily to

Al-Anon, and also the ideas of detachment. I have watched 'Stuart Saves His

Family' (a GREAT film about family dysfunction) many times with my parents. I am

now struck by the irony of it -- a huge theme of that film is detachment. The

idea that loyalty or no, our philosophies of family being paramount or not,

what's important is to identify toxic relationships and then DETACH when

necessary...even if it's your mother or father.

I saw my own mother integrate this idea when it came to her

(alcoholic/hystrionic) sister, her (quite possibly) narcissistic father, her

co-dependent mother.

I have had to integrate the idea with her, however -- I am almost certain my

mother suffers BPD. I just turned 30, and have long acknowledged that something

was off with my mother...but at the same time, realized that I am closer to her

than most of my friends have ever been to their mothers. How is it possible,

then, that this relationship could bring so much pain?

To bring this back to the point, I often think that people are more

attentive/more attracted to fields/areas of study that concern them on a

personal level. There's a popular idea that mental health professionals were

attracted to that line of work because they dealt with mental illness in their

own families, or even within themselves.

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

I wanted to reinforce that YOU ARE NOT ALONE. We've all been there too, reeling

from the enlightenment. I found that although everything was different for me as

I put this new piece of information into place in my life and memories, but

NOTHING was different for anyone else. It was quite an adjustment and growth for

me. It was like putting on glasses and being able to see things clearly, but

everyone else still viewed things the the way they were. And then no one else

would put on the glasses!

Then I joined this group and it was like a neighborhood shop full of the

regulars that nodded and waved when I walked in. We're all different, have

different interested and experiences, but all have the same HUGE DARK SHADOW

over our lives. I'm sorry that you have the BPD shadow in your life, but I'm so

glad that you joined us. I hope that you find some solace and understanding

here. This is the best place I've found to be able to discuss, question,

rant/rave, understand and BE UNDERSTOOD. (Yay, *I* am not alone!!)

Welcome, you are not alone, we understand what you are feeling, we want you to

feel safe in sharing and exploring your experiences and newly altered

perspective. BPD does not go away, nadas and others do not change. The only

control you have is over yourself and how you will change your behavior. I know

this 'enlightenment' is a lot to take in, but it does get easier!

Here's to keeping on keeping on!

> >

> > Hi,

> >

> > I just joined this group tonight. In July, my father told me that my mother

has BPD, along with a list of other mental issues. I've known my whole life

something was wrong, but to have a names(s) for it brings everything into a

whole new dimension. I feel like I'm in a free fall. I tried to talk to my best

friend about it (she's known me for eleven years), but she shut me out. I tried

to talk to my husband about it, but he doesn't get it. I've never had a close

relationship with my father, so even though he says I can talk to him, I don't

want to. I do talk to my aunt, but I'm so afraid of losing her as well that I'm

not totally honest with her. I feel like I'm losing everything and everyone.

> >

> > My husband says we can't afford counseling, and because our income is too

high we don't qualify for a sliding scale. Insurance doesn't cover it. I've been

writing in my journal, working out, joining mom groups, and working more. I've

been reading what I can online, and I started reading " Surviving the Borderline

Parent " but I'm still falling.

> >

> > Suggestions? Books that helped you? Words of wisdom? I'll take any and all

advice.

> >

> > Thank you,

> > .

> >

>

[Guest guest]

I think you are right about people being attracted to professions that

affect them on a personal level. My fathers mother was deeply histrionic,

with a very loving, but passive father. My nada's family was severely

disfunctional, with alcoholism, and passive enablers on one side, and

clearly cruel (and possibly criminal) BPD issues on the other side.

I believe my parents were trying to address inherited issues, but the

effects of their own character-issues got in the way.

The concept of over compensation was a real sticky one, for me. My nada

gifted me with ultra fancy, expensive " stuff " I didn't want, then would

scream at me and beat me up for thinking( I never thought this) that I was

a princess.

My father clearly recognized that something was " off " about my nada, but

he genuinely believed that these issues could be overcome, with love, time,

therapy, etc.

What he never understood, was that she used therapy, not as a springboard

for mental health, but as a guide-book for manipulative navigation. He also

became acclimated her behaviors over time, and was also somewhat blind to

the very manipulative nature of her being. She knew how to work him.

It is almost as though she is an alien life-form, who can behave,

more-or-less like a human, but misses the point of the interactions, and is

frustrated, and enraged when things don't go exactly as she believed they

should.

She seems to believe that human interaction is an " investment, " for which

she is due specific return. If her expected returns do not manifest, she

becomes enraged. She gets revenge.

She searches out ways to " work the system, " and to manipulate interactions

to her own benefit, but has little concept of the potential variables

involved within such systems, and feels cheated, frightened, confused and,

once again, enraged, if things do not go as she believed they should.

Since she takes great pains to cover her bad behaviors, to marginalize

those against whom she has plotted, and most frighteningly,* to sometimes

befriend those whom she is about to wound*, I believe she is dangerous.

Something just seems to be missing, or wired weird, within her.

She can *appear* to be incredibly compassionate, kind, supportive, and

loving, but it is all based in her theory of emotional-relational

investment.

Her selected friends absolutely adore her, and are carefully groomed and

cultivated for credibility, access to various social events, and prestige.

Others are used for the moment, and then fade away.

I too, felt more " connected " to my mother, than most of my friends and

acquaintances. As I look back at this dynamic, I see unhealthy enmeshment,

with a deeply manipulative and controlling mother, in charge of a

vulnerable, and innocent child. As I became old enough to challenge her, or

disprove her " truths, " she began a campaign of character assassination,

propaganda, and disinformation.

For my nada. I was a canopic container. for her unwanted feelings,

memories, emotions, and fantasies. She could dump them into me, then kick

the jar (me) around the room, or set me back on the shelf, until the next

time she needed to unload.

In order to stun me into compassionate compliance she would " confess "

horrible, devastatingly ugly stories ( and I mean* really *ugly, vile

stuff, that I was *way* too young to hear) to me, that left me reeling and

wounded, but traumatically bonded to her, since I now knew the " truth "

about her own secret psychic wounds.

However, as I became an adult, and had the ability to investigate these

stories, I now know, beyond the shadow of any doubt, that most of these

stories were outright lies, propaganda, etc., told to wound, control, and

manipulate.

She is really good at selecting wounded people, discerning the locus of

their psychic injury, and working it to her benefit.

She did the same thing to my sibling, except my sibling still believes that

she was telling the truth.

To my nada, the truth is whatever she believes will get her the best

return-of -the-moment.

.....back to the point, I think your question about how can such close

relationship with a parent bring so much pain, is sometimes an issue of

enmeshment, rather than genuine closeness - at least it was for me.

People often perceived our relationship as an enviable mother/daughter

bonded pair, and are horrified at our split, which suites nada just

fine.......she can get teary eyed, and avoid telling exactly what caused

our split.......blah blah blah........

Her current story. is that I have brain cancer, or brain lesions due to

chemotherapy, and have become violent, paranoid, crazy, etc. This is all a

lie. I have had recurring cancer, but the rest is purely fabrication.

She has created this fabrication, in order to justify (at least in her own

mind - it doesn't have to make sense to anyone else...) disowning me, due

to my " insanity, " and resting the bulk of her estate on my sibling, the

" golden child "

I live in a different state, so almost no-one in her town knows the truth.

The rest of my family is afraid to talk to me, because of her lies.

The $64,000.00 dollar question, is why would a mother, who was

*soooooooo *close

to her daughter, tell such horrible stories, unless they were true?

If past justifications for bad behavior, predict future justifications

for bad behavior, she, herself, sees this as a bold and heroic " Sophie's

Choice " type move on her part.

Because she is a borderline, because it suits her, because it feeds her

disorder.

Detachment is indeed a desirable goal, but difficult to reach, due, I

believe to the emotional enmeshment, and sometimes emotionally incestious

nature of the relationship with the BPD parent or caregiver. I'm still

working hard on this one! I just ordered the film you recomended, " Stuart

Saves His Family " and look forward to watching it with my DH.

Our mothers are our first loves, the queens of our tiny yearning hearts.

We do everything possible to avoid facing the fact that she may also

cannibolize us emotionally, and destroy us physically. Or, just screw with

our heads and our hearts until we can't think straight, and can barely

function.

BB King says it best, " don't nobody love me but my mother, tho she could

just be jiving too.... "

Good Grief.....

Warm Regards, Sunspot

On Tue, Nov 6, 2012 at 12:05 AM, helenpaltrow helenpaltrow@...>wrote:

> **

>

>

> Sunspot- I am fascinated by what you said about your parents being mental

> health professionals.

>

> I believe (as I said above) that my mother suffers from BPD. I also

> believe that my parents went into parenthood with a sense of compensating

> (and perhaps over-compensating) for their own terrible childhoods. Both

> seemed to suffer some form of fear, but mainly, emotional neglect.

>

> What's interesting to me is that both my parents seem to relate heavily to

> Al-Anon, and also the ideas of detachment. I have watched 'Stuart Saves His

> Family' (a GREAT film about family dysfunction) many times with my parents.

> I am now struck by the irony of it -- a huge theme of that film is

> detachment. The idea that loyalty or no, our philosophies of family being

> paramount or not, what's important is to identify toxic relationships and

> then DETACH when necessary...even if it's your mother or father.

>

> I saw my own mother integrate this idea when it came to her

> (alcoholic/hystrionic) sister, her (quite possibly) narcissistic father,

> her co-dependent mother.

>

> I have had to integrate the idea with her, however -- I am almost certain

> my mother suffers BPD. I just turned 30, and have long acknowledged that

> something was off with my mother...but at the same time, realized that I am

> closer to her than most of my friends have ever been to their mothers. How

> is it possible, then, that this relationship could bring so much pain?

>

> To bring this back to the point, I often think that people are more

> attentive/more attracted to fields/areas of study that concern them on a

> personal level. There's a popular idea that mental health professionals

> were attracted to that line of work because they dealt with mental illness

> in their own families, or even within themselves.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

" she used therapy, not as a springboard for mental health, but as a guide-book

for manipulative navigation "

Oh my God. This is what really scares the crap out of me. My mom does this all

the time. It's why I don't even bother suggesting that she get help anymore.