Nada Never Apologized

[Guest guest]

Many members report that their nada's apologized. I am wondering if there are

other members, such as myself, who had nada's who NEVER apologized and gave only

glancing acknowledgement of their abusing and or violent behaviours.

MB

[Guest guest]

My nada has NEVER apologized..

when I was 13 my nada beat me so severely there were bruises and my friend

saw them. She told her mom, who then contacted children's aid. Children's

aid picked me up from my friend's house, and then after sitting there for

hours, my fada picked me up.

He went into a room and spoke privately with someone, then came and took me

home with a look of disgust on his face.

I have no idea what he told them.

My nada went in a few days later for a hysterectomy and my father took me to

the hospital to see her, she wouldn't look at me. My father blamed me for

upsetting my mother.

No one talked to me in the house for months.

She never hit me again but that was when the silent treatments and emotional

abuse really started. It was worse than the beatings.

It sends shivers up my spine thinking about that again..

Not only did she never apologize, if she was upset it was always somehow my

fault.

No wonder I became the fawn.

I have 3 boys and cannot imagine treating them that way. Thinking about this

right now - she disgusts me.

_____

From: WTOAdultChildren1

[mailto:WTOAdultChildren1 ] On Behalf Of Rico and Beth

Sent: November-19-12 3:12 PM

To: WTOAdultChildren1

Subject: Nada Never Apologized

Many members report that their nada's apologized. I am wondering if there

are other members, such as myself, who had nada's who NEVER apologized and

gave only glancing acknowledgement of their abusing and or violent

behaviours.

MB

[Guest guest]

My nada never makes meaningful apologies. She does say " I'm

sorry " here and there, particularly when the subject of my

sister comes up, but as far as I can tell, what she's sorry for

is the bad consequences she has suffered due to whatever it is

she's " sorry " about. I see no evidence that she's actually sorry

that she did the things she did. She's sorry that my sister no

longer speaks to her but she doesn't see anything wrong with

having kicked her out of her house at 2 AM with no

transportation apart from her feet. Real apologies require

admitting that you were wrong in some way. Nadas are never

wrong. I think the whole concept of a sincere apology is too

emotionally mature for them to understand. Some of them have

learned what words to say to manipulate others though.

At 03:12 PM 11/19/2012 Rico and Beth wrote:

>Many members report that their nada's apologized. I am

>wondering if there are other members, such as myself, who had

>nada's who NEVER apologized and gave only glancing

>acknowledgement of their abusing and or violent behaviours.

>

>MB

>

--

Katrina

[Guest guest]

My Nada is of the " never apologize " breed. If she's completely backed into

a corner and desperate, I might get one of those non-apologies out of her

that goes something like " I'm sorry you're so upset " (i.e. it's your

problem, I didn't do anything wrong.) Three months into my current NC

with her she broke down enough to write an email that contained an apology

of sorts for " the awful things I said " , which shocked me as it was the

first time I ever caught her actually owning up to behaving badly. Of

course she then went on and on about how much she " really loved me " and I

" should know that " and I " had to forgive her " . There wasn't anything in

there resembling any kind of promise to avoid screaming abusive fits in the

future, though. I'm not clear I'd have believed it if there had been, but

I would really have loved to have her say not just " well, I guess I messed

up " , but follow that up with something like, " and I promise you I'll cut

out my own tongue rather than say things like that to you ever again, and

if I do break this promise, I will take out an ad in the local newspaper

saying 'I am a horrible mother who viciously abuses my daughter and I have

done this all her life. I am ashamed of myself,' " or some other suitably

publicly embarrassing forfeit if she broke the promise to refrain from

abuse in the future.

It's a nice fantasy, isn't it?

But all my life my Nada's been one of the ones for whom her every cruel

action was basically forced on her by the bad behavior around her -- " If

you kids hadn't, " " If your father hadn't " , " You made me, " " This is really

YOUR fault, " types of garbage. I strongly suspect she actually does feel

real shame and guilt around her awful behavior, but I also strongly suspect

she's convinced she'd keel over dead rather than admit it. Before I

started this last (final) NC, I asked her for an explanation of some really

egregious physically abusive episodes from my teenage years, as I wanted to

know why she thought that behavior was called for -- and she claims she

can't remember doing those things, and that she " would never have done

anything like that! " She's lying, but what can you do?

What do people think -- is it worse to have a Nada (or Fada) who admits

they are being cruel but won't make the effort to stop, or to have a Nada

(or Fada) who wont even openly admit how atrocious their behavior has been?

I've wondered about this question before.

-- Jen H.

> **

>

>

> Many members report that their nada's apologized. I am wondering if there

> are other members, such as myself, who had nada's who NEVER apologized and

> gave only glancing acknowledgement of their abusing and or violent

> behaviours.

>

> MB

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Since my nada did both these behaviors on occasion: usually it was the sobbing

apologies and promises (that meant nothing), and more rarely it was the

affronted denial (followed by accusations that Sister or I were lying about

her), I think they're both equally sick, horrid and destructive, mind-f**king

behaviors. They both indicate an extremely disordered mind, and they're equally

damaging to the target of the abuse, particularly to a vulnerable minor child.

In my opinion. Its like, which is worse: ovarian cancer or brain cancer?

They're both bad.

-Annie

PS:

And sometimes after having a screaming rage-tantrum at me or Sister, terrifying

us, grinding our self-esteem into the dirt, and perhaps smacking us around, nada

would act like nothing at all had just happened. I'd be on the floor quivering

from shock, trying not to cry, and my nada would turn up the stereo and sing a

cheerful song. Like she'd just had a stimulating tennis game or workout.

La-la-la, all perky and cheerful.

Sometimes I wonder how Sister and I wound up as relatively functional as we are.

>

> My Nada is of the " never apologize " breed. If she's completely backed into

> a corner and desperate, I might get one of those non-apologies out of her

> that goes something like " I'm sorry you're so upset " (i.e. it's your

> problem, I didn't do anything wrong.) Three months into my current NC

> with her she broke down enough to write an email that contained an apology

> of sorts for " the awful things I said " , which shocked me as it was the

> first time I ever caught her actually owning up to behaving badly. Of

> course she then went on and on about how much she " really loved me " and I

> " should know that " and I " had to forgive her " . There wasn't anything in

> there resembling any kind of promise to avoid screaming abusive fits in the

> future, though. I'm not clear I'd have believed it if there had been, but

> I would really have loved to have her say not just " well, I guess I messed

> up " , but follow that up with something like, " and I promise you I'll cut

> out my own tongue rather than say things like that to you ever again, and

> if I do break this promise, I will take out an ad in the local newspaper

> saying 'I am a horrible mother who viciously abuses my daughter and I have

> done this all her life. I am ashamed of myself,' " or some other suitably

> publicly embarrassing forfeit if she broke the promise to refrain from

> abuse in the future.

>

> It's a nice fantasy, isn't it?

>

> But all my life my Nada's been one of the ones for whom her every cruel

> action was basically forced on her by the bad behavior around her -- " If

> you kids hadn't, " " If your father hadn't " , " You made me, " " This is really

> YOUR fault, " types of garbage. I strongly suspect she actually does feel

> real shame and guilt around her awful behavior, but I also strongly suspect

> she's convinced she'd keel over dead rather than admit it. Before I

> started this last (final) NC, I asked her for an explanation of some really

> egregious physically abusive episodes from my teenage years, as I wanted to

> know why she thought that behavior was called for -- and she claims she

> can't remember doing those things, and that she " would never have done

> anything like that! " She's lying, but what can you do?

>

> What do people think -- is it worse to have a Nada (or Fada) who admits

> they are being cruel but won't make the effort to stop, or to have a Nada

> (or Fada) who wont even openly admit how atrocious their behavior has been?

> I've wondered about this question before.

>

> -- Jen H.

[Guest guest]

Nada's NEVER apologize because they simply don't understand what they did

wrong.  In their mind they are  never wrong therefore whatever you're upset

about is your problem not theirs.  Sometimes its just easier knowing that up

front

To: WTOAdultChildren1

Sent: Monday, November 19, 2012 3:51 PM

Subject: RE: Nada Never Apologized

 

My nada has NEVER apologized..

when I was 13 my nada beat me so severely there were bruises and my friend

saw them. She told her mom, who then contacted children's aid. Children's

aid picked me up from my friend's house, and then after sitting there for

hours, my fada picked me up.

He went into a room and spoke privately with someone, then came and took me

home with a look of disgust on his face.

I have no idea what he told them.

My nada went in a few days later for a hysterectomy and my father took me to

the hospital to see her, she wouldn't look at me. My father blamed me for

upsetting my mother.

No one talked to me in the house for months.

She never hit me again but that was when the silent treatments and emotional

abuse really started. It was worse than the beatings.

It sends shivers up my spine thinking about that again..

Not only did she never apologize, if she was upset it was always somehow my

fault.

No wonder I became the fawn.

I have 3 boys and cannot imagine treating them that way. Thinking about this

right now - she disgusts me.

_____

From: mailto:WTOAdultChildren1%40yahoogroups.com

[mailto:mailto:WTOAdultChildren1%40yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Rico and

Beth

Sent: November-19-12 3:12 PM

To: mailto:WTOAdultChildren1%40yahoogroups.com

Subject: Nada Never Apologized

Many members report that their nada's apologized. I am wondering if there

are other members, such as myself, who had nada's who NEVER apologized and

gave only glancing acknowledgement of their abusing and or violent

behaviours.

MB

[Guest guest]

Dear Gagne,

Thank you for bravely replying and sharing your story with me. I can only

imagine the pain of all those silent treatments. Nada was a screamer when she

became enraged and often became physically violent. Only once did she fall

silent. I had intentionally broken curfew to stat out past 7:00 pm at the State

Fair. I was 16 and it was a summer Satureday night. It wasn't usual for me to

rebel. This time however, I thought my mother was being unreasonable. I was

supposed to return home when my with my friend's little brother's (8 year old

twins) when her mother came topick them up. Instead, I stayed out with my friend

and her cousins for the midnight fireworks show. When I got home, I was in

terror because I knew what I had done. So, being rather foolish I tried to sneak

in through the basement door, waking up both nada and step-father. Perhaps that

was lucky because while nada was emotionally and verbally abusive in front of

step-father, she never let him see her beat me. She came down the stairs first

screaming " Where have you been? Why did you come in the basement door? YOU are

nothing but a lying little whore! " At this point step-father put his head down

the stairs and asking what was going on. Nada glared at me and hissed, " Just go

to bed. " The entire incident was never mentioned again. That upset me more than

a beating. It was the first time I ever felt that she did not really care what I

did or didn't do. It was the first time I realize that she had gone stone cold

toward me and couldn't be bothered parent.

MB

Nada Never Apologized

Many members report that their nada's apologized. I am wondering if there

are other members, such as myself, who had nada's who NEVER apologized and

gave only glancing acknowledgement of their abusing and or violent

behaviours.

MB

[Guest guest]

Dear Katrina,

You wrote that " I think the whole concept of a sincere apology is too

emotionally mature for them to understand. Some of them have

learned what words to say to manipulate others though. "

You have given me a powerful insight. Thank you!

MB

..

[Guest guest]

My experience was a lot like Jen's. Nada has never once in her life apologized

(genuine or fake) to anyone. She wouldn't be. Able to handle the shame of

admitting to herself she was imperfect.

>

> > **

> >

> >

> > Many members report that their nada's apologized. I am wondering if there

> > are other members, such as myself, who had nada's who NEVER apologized and

> > gave only glancing acknowledgement of their abusing and or violent

> > behaviours.

> >

> > MB

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Dear ,

For years my fantasty was that nada would repent her abusive behavior and

admit to that she had spread vicious lies about me during a family

gathering. I wanted my grandparents, Aunts, Uncles, and Cousins to love me.

Little did I realize that they too were Hoovered in and that some of them

actually live to be her flying monkeys(funny what some people do for cash or

gifts!) Not one of these people showed at her funeral. I know they had come

to hate her but it hurt to realize that they had no respect for me either.

Because I see the first step toward asking for forgiveness as admiting that

one has committed an agrejust act, I wish nada would have openly admitted

how atrocious had behavior has been before she died.

MB

[Guest guest]

Dear mdg,

My experience was a lot like Jen's. Nada has never once in her life apologized

(genuine or fake) to anyone. She wouldn't be. Able to handle the shame of

admitting to herself she was imperfect.

This is part of the the illness I can't wraop my head around. Nada knew

something was wrong with her. She knew her anger was out of control. Yet, she

chose to go on about her life as if she was in a play where everyone was to look

at and admire nada and never mind what was going on behind the curtains. I'm

trying to decide if knowing something is wrong and selecting to do nothing about

it (rational denial?) is a symtom of HF BPD.

MB

[Guest guest]

Sometimes I've gotten the impression that their minds are doing so much

negative self talk that they just can't handle someone from the outside

saying something negative about them. It's just too much so they're putting

up this " I'm perfect " front because they can't take the outside criticism

plus their negative inner dialogue.

On Mon, Nov 19, 2012 at 10:41 PM, Rico and Beth rama@...>wrote:

> **

>

>

> Dear mdg,

>

> My experience was a lot like Jen's. Nada has never once in her life

> apologized (genuine or fake) to anyone. She wouldn't be. Able to handle the

> shame of admitting to herself she was imperfect.

>

> This is part of the the illness I can't wraop my head around. Nada knew

> something was wrong with her. She knew her anger was out of control. Yet,

> she chose to go on about her life as if she was in a play where everyone

> was to look at and admire nada and never mind what was going on behind the

> curtains. I'm trying to decide if knowing something is wrong and selecting

> to do nothing about it (rational denial?) is a symtom of HF BPD.

>

> MB

>

>

[Guest guest]

Dear Millicent,

I agree. Nada spent a great deal of time cruelly judging other. Yet, it was

their judgement or opinions that her frail (under developed?) Ego could not

handle.

MB

Re: Re: Nada Never Apologized

> Sometimes I've gotten the impression that their minds are doing so much

> negative self talk that they just can't handle someone from the outside

> saying something negative about them. It's just too much so they're

> putting

> up this " I'm perfect " front because they can't take the outside criticism

> plus their negative inner dialogue.

>

> On Mon, Nov 19, 2012 at 10:41 PM, Rico and Beth

> rama@...>wrote:

>

>> **

>>

>>

>> Dear mdg,

>>

>> My experience was a lot like Jen's. Nada has never once in her life

>> apologized (genuine or fake) to anyone. She wouldn't be. Able to handle

>> the

>> shame of admitting to herself she was imperfect.

>>

>> This is part of the the illness I can't wraop my head around. Nada knew

>> something was wrong with her. She knew her anger was out of control. Yet,

>> she chose to go on about her life as if she was in a play where everyone

>> was to look at and admire nada and never mind what was going on behind

>> the

>> curtains. I'm trying to decide if knowing something is wrong and

>> selecting

>> to do nothing about it (rational denial?) is a symtom of HF BPD.

>>

>> MB

>>

>>

[Guest guest]

They difference between us and them, our negative self talk is wrong theirs

is right. So they are coming from a much more hopeless position. That's why

there's no dealing with them. They are hopeless and all they can do is take

us down while they drown. At least they don't have to go down alone. Why

should they? It's not their fault they are who they are, they think. They

really are mentally ill. It's very sad.

> **

>

>

> Dear Millicent,

>

> I agree. Nada spent a great deal of time cruelly judging other. Yet, it

> was

> their judgement or opinions that her frail (under developed?) Ego could

> not

> handle.

>

> MB

>

> Re: Re: Nada Never Apologized

>

> > Sometimes I've gotten the impression that their minds are doing so much

> > negative self talk that they just can't handle someone from the outside

> > saying something negative about them. It's just too much so they're

> > putting

> > up this " I'm perfect " front because they can't take the outside criticism

> > plus their negative inner dialogue.

> >

> > On Mon, Nov 19, 2012 at 10:41 PM, Rico and Beth

> > rama@...>wrote:

> >

> >> **

> >>

> >>

> >> Dear mdg,

> >>

> >> My experience was a lot like Jen's. Nada has never once in her life

> >> apologized (genuine or fake) to anyone. She wouldn't be. Able to handle

> >> the

> >> shame of admitting to herself she was imperfect.

> >>

> >> This is part of the the illness I can't wraop my head around. Nada knew

> >> something was wrong with her. She knew her anger was out of control.

> Yet,

> >> she chose to go on about her life as if she was in a play where everyone

> >> was to look at and admire nada and never mind what was going on behind

> >> the

> >> curtains. I'm trying to decide if knowing something is wrong and

> >> selecting

> >> to do nothing about it (rational denial?) is a symtom of HF BPD.

> >>

> >> MB

> >>

> >>