Hermit/Waif

[Guest guest]

Do any of you have mothers that are Hermits.with Waif traits that you know

will not chase you if you go NC? Moms that would just as soon be rid of you

& your clarity/rationality so she did not have to deal with reality?

My mother has never fought for much of anything except her own protection.

Going NC may be the easiest way out for her.and her life.

Twyla

[Guest guest]

Yes, my mother is both.

I can relate very much to what you described, to her fighting only for her

protection. That's the thing about waifs/hermits. With my mother, she thrives on

fear and control, and if she doesn't feel safe, she'll strike out.

When I've gone NC (the longest for me was 2 months), she did chase me until I

told her to back off and give me space.

>

> Do any of you have mothers that are Hermits.with Waif traits that you know

> will not chase you if you go NC? Moms that would just as soon be rid of you

> & your clarity/rationality so she did not have to deal with reality?

>

>

>

> My mother has never fought for much of anything except her own protection.

>

>

>

> Going NC may be the easiest way out for her.and her life.

>

>

>

>

>

> Twyla

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Twyla,

I'm so glad that you asked this question! My nada was a HF BPD who spent most of

her public life as QUEEN. In private she swang wildly from WITCH to WAIF/HERMIT.

Only on the more rare occasions was anyone (parents friends, my friends, even

family) allowed past our front door. Nada in WITCH was a bully who knew that

what she was doing was wrong. She didn't want anyone else to know what she was

up to! Nada in WAIF was certain that no one loved her or treated her as she

should be treated.

The first time her fear of abandonment was directed at me was when I left on an

exchange program for a summer. Oddly enough her tantrums became public. Both

her friend (she only had one) and my friends asked what was wrong and expressed

they sympathy for me. Once I left, there was no word from her, no reply to my

letters or calls home (before the age of email). Nada and step-father moved

during this time and I did not learn of it until I landed at JFK and was handed

a message reading, " Do not fly to Town X. We no longer live there. Cash in your

ticket and fly to Town Y. "

Leaving for college was worse. As long as I lived under the same roof there were

tantrum and she even withdrew her financial support once I had been accepted to

the school of my choice. When moved out and put myself through college, there

was little contact. It was if I was out of sight and out of mind. When I asked

to be allowed to visit her during holidays, she forbade me to stay at her house

for more than a single night. I came to think of myself as being " thrown away. "

Beth

[Guest guest]

Dear Beth,

Wow!.......

So much hurt..and we honor them..until we finally become aware.

Thank you for your post...

I have just spoken to my Dr. who knows the story. She firmly suggested that

if I send something at Christmas it only re-opens the door and Mom feels she

has won. Dr. suggested it was time for mother to have more silence for

reflection and that would be my only chance of any hope of her " seeing " her

ways...and a slight chance at that. She also stated that it would be the

kindest thing for both of us..in that mother needs to own up and learn (IF

SHE CAN). And for me, I deserve the break. She also suggested that if she

passes away during this NC time to understand I am not to blame in any way.

We all have free choice and Nada is fully capable even at this age to drive,

to go on senior bus-trips to the USA...and to take flights on holidays. She

is in great health.

If Mom wants to throw me away because I " yell " at her..and this would be

what she stands by (I am so disrespectful because of this) then so be it.

I yelled at her because she lied AGAIN. She is the BEST DEFLECTOR..denying

that select conversations between her and I ever took place.

All I asked was to talk to my NC elder brother to see if he would partner

with me to help her as she ages in which it took weeks to get the truth from

her that he said " NO! " .then she blamed me for STARTING trouble!!!

This is so typical.

I believe she would rather just not bother with me...and my kids...it is

easier for her. She can continue to delude herself and listen to the sons

she and Dad raised in a twisted and violent home. You see the elder will

drive her to the Dr. and hospital (other than that he does not contact her

much ever or any of us) and the younger alcoholic she is terrified of saying

no to anything he does or asks or takes....and when he comes to stay with

her from another province (which is often) he will take her to the store and

change light bulbs etc. in her apartment. I can do nothing from this

distance except emotionally support her/send her gifts and $ which I have

always done. So she can right me off easier.but NEEDS THEM to help her.

I speak the truth she does not want to deal with.so I am a " bad " daughter..

As an example that I believe I posted here before but may be revealing for

who reads this now, my uncle molested me at about 5 yrs. old..he threatened

if I told anyone my dad would beat me as he did my brother. I was naturally

scared but even at that age I KNEW what he did was wrong but I could not

tell mom and dad until I was about 11 or so..I remember when I told them

*they thought so highly of my uncle) they were furious with me and

immediately made an appointment with their family doctor to have me tested

for VD because they believed I was with some boy. They never addressed that

I MIGHT be telling the truth...Mom was right behind Dad..dragging me to the

Dr. (it was later found out my uncle was a sexual abuser; he died years and

years ago).

Twyla

From: WTOAdultChildren1

[mailto:WTOAdultChildren1 ] On Behalf Of Rico and Beth

Sent: Saturday, December 01, 2012 02:09 PM

To: WTOAdultChildren1

Subject: Re: Hermit/Waif

Hi Twyla,

I'm so glad that you asked this question! My nada was a HF BPD who spent

most of her public life as QUEEN. In private she swang wildly from WITCH to

WAIF/HERMIT. Only on the more rare occasions was anyone (parents friends, my

friends, even family) allowed past our front door. Nada in WITCH was a bully

who knew that what she was doing was wrong. She didn't want anyone else to

know what she was up to! Nada in WAIF was certain that no one loved her or

treated her as she should be treated.

The first time her fear of abandonment was directed at me was when I left on

an exchange program for a summer. Oddly enough her tantrums became public.

Both her friend (she only had one) and my friends asked what was wrong and

expressed they sympathy for me. Once I left, there was no word from her, no

reply to my letters or calls home (before the age of email). Nada and

step-father moved during this time and I did not learn of it until I landed

at JFK and was handed a message reading, " Do not fly to Town X. We no longer

live there. Cash in your ticket and fly to Town Y. "

Leaving for college was worse. As long as I lived under the same roof there

were tantrum and she even withdrew her financial support once I had been

accepted to the school of my choice. When moved out and put myself through

college, there was little contact. It was if I was out of sight and out of

mind. When I asked to be allowed to visit her during holidays, she forbade

me to stay at her house for more than a single night. I came to think of

myself as being " thrown away. "

Beth

[Guest guest]

Twyla,

Just wanted to say your doctor sounds really great. I love the advice she

gave you...sounds like she really " gets it " and that is so helpful. The

more support you have the better!

Tracey

[Guest guest]

Twyla,

I agree fully that NC is " the kindest thing " for both the KO and the nada. There

comes a point when no " Fix " to the abuse can be found. At that time, not being

in nada's reach is best for both of you.

As a KO whose mother died during NC, I can say that in my own case I felt

relieve that she could no longer harm or threaten me. I no longer wait for the

explosions. There had been times during the NC when I longed to contact nada but

I knew what such contact would bring and chose to stay NC. It's a sad thing to

fear one's parent with good reason.

I feel no blame for nada's death. She died because she abused alcohol and drugs

for many years. When doctors discovered her liver disease in the mid 1980's they

warned her that it would eventually kill her. They pled with her to end her use

of alcohol and cocaine. While there were times that she cut back, she was never

able to stop. Nada killed nada. It was a long, slow suicide by lifestyle. I

feel no blame. I took no part in it and had nothing to do with it.

Ulimately, a KO has to ask themselves, " What am I willing to do to create peace

in my life? " If the KO is no longer addicted to high drama, unwilling to upset

themselves /their spouse/their children and committed fully to their own

recoveryfrom childhood abuse, the KO can survive NC. It is not always easy.

There are times when it will be lonely. Every KO aches for parental love.

However, selecting not to engage is a safe and healthy alternative when dealing

with a nada.

Beth

[Guest guest]

My mother is a waif/hermit. I wrote a letter detailing my wish for NC from both

parents about 2 years ago and have not had contact from them since. With the

exception of one butt dial, lol (it was obvious from the msg on the machine that

she did not know her phone was on.)

Do you want your mother to chase you?

Sveta

>

> Twyla,

>

> I agree fully that NC is " the kindest thing " for both the KO and the nada.

There comes a point when no " Fix " to the abuse can be found. At that time, not

being in nada's reach is best for both of you.

>

> As a KO whose mother died during NC, I can say that in my own case I felt

relieve that she could no longer harm or threaten me. I no longer wait for the

explosions. There had been times during the NC when I longed to contact nada but

I knew what such contact would bring and chose to stay NC. It's a sad thing to

fear one's parent with good reason.

>

> I feel no blame for nada's death. She died because she abused alcohol and

drugs for many years. When doctors discovered her liver disease in the mid

1980's they warned her that it would eventually kill her. They pled with her to

end her use of alcohol and cocaine. While there were times that she cut back,

she was never able to stop. Nada killed nada. It was a long, slow suicide by

lifestyle. I feel no blame. I took no part in it and had nothing to do with it.

>

> Ulimately, a KO has to ask themselves, " What am I willing to do to create

peace in my life? " If the KO is no longer addicted to high drama, unwilling to

upset themselves /their spouse/their children and committed fully to their own

recoveryfrom childhood abuse, the KO can survive NC. It is not always easy.

There are times when it will be lonely. Every KO aches for parental love.

However, selecting not to engage is a safe and healthy alternative when dealing

with a nada.

>

> Beth

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Sveta,

Thanks for responding.

My Hermit/Waif Nada I have is one of the lamest people I know. It is her

survival patterning. It is called " all about her/her needs " . She does not

like the spotlight of truth shone on her.

To answer the question u posed below.I would like my mother to show

SOMETHING....I DO NOT want the grief of the NADAs who DO chase and drive

their daughters/sons crazy so I do not want her to chase me and continue to

hurt me. No way.

I would like some validation...but then I would also like someone who could

be a real mother, not an image. Good luck to me.

I am only into not quite 2 months NC for the first time. Your 2 years of NC

without sincere contact from your FOO must feel horrible, some like what I

am only starting to feel.

My Nada is so lame she cannot even be bothered to call to save the

relationship with her only daughter that she must see is dying for good now.

Our last conversation ended badly once again, me being accused of being such

a bad daughter for yelling at her because she once more told me lies that I

caught her in to which she immediately covered with another lie, told me I

was an abuser because I was yelling, demanding my DH come on the phone (she

has being doing this lately) and after his reply was he did not want to

speak with her, Nada told me DH could go to h*ll also and promptly hung up.

She loves to hang up after dozens of promises she will stop. After too many

times to count she states that she DOES NOT lie to me, only forgets

sometimes. Selective memory to what serves her. This has been a habit for a

long time.

My typical pattern is to call back.wait until she puts the phone back on the

receiver whenever that may be and try to get her to calm down enough to get

the truth of the situation at hand and show her where she is hurting me and

ask her to stop it. The blame will continue on some teeny perceived wrong I

did which takes all focus off her " crime " ..

One perceived wrong of me then builds onto the next perceived wrong etc.

that she uses to continue to berate me and my family here.

My Nada cannot tolerate me catching her on lies and lame behavior/lack of

responsibility and lack of penitence. She tells me she is " my Mother " and I

should be respectful. I tell her " I am her daughter and I should be shown

some respect " . If I am quiet and supply her with nice words, helpful

information on her health issues by researching for her or sending gifts or

listening endlessly to her crying and her problems then I am an angel. If I

try to have a real relation with her, we end up in huge fights on the phone

separated by many miles. It centers around what I should be doing to fix

the family, never questioning her behavior or demanding to know why she

fabricated stories to cover things she has done.she cannot keep promises,

has spread my private conversations to her to my NC sibs and others, bashes

me and my DH and her grandkids then glosses it all over like all is forgiven

and all is well. She has out rightly denied physical and mental abuse she

and father were responsible for to then come back and say that she has

forgotten most of it and it is in the past anyways, why do I have to dwell

on the past? It is all so crazy making.

The only way to have a relationship with her is to expect nothing, give all

you can to her and never ever hint that she made any errors in her mothering

past or present. Do not expect the truth from her, put up with her blame to

you, her open jealously and insults, her expectance of many calls that I am

supposed to make per week/per day no matter how much you have to deal with

in your own life, to accept my sociopath brother, and never expect her to

come visit as it was always too hard for her (but she does travel to her

places) the list goes on.

I may be wrong but it is my present belief that no matter how much I have

done for her, the fact that I will not call her now will set her into a

pattern of absolving herself from any wrong she has done. She will focus on

yelling and MY NC as a way to justify once more I am BAAAAD. No thought of

the good I have done for 35+ years will entre into her head because THEN she

would have to look at herself and some truth. It is easier to deflect and

deny and to turn me out, quite possibly for good. She will feed my sibs more

b.s. and twists and they will welcome this to continue to have bashing

parties so they can all feel justified and vent their poison onto the scape

goat.

It means the end of a FOO unit for me.

It means potentially I will never know when she dies or how.

These are all the issues I will be dealing with as I can, day by day, trying

not to ruminate too much as then again she/they will still have my power. I

need my power back.

Twyla

From: WTOAdultChildren1

[mailto:WTOAdultChildren1 ] On Behalf Of svaktshka

Sent: Sunday, December 16, 2012 09:32 AM

To: WTOAdultChildren1

Subject: Re: Hermit/Waif

My mother is a waif/hermit. I wrote a letter detailing my wish for NC from

both parents about 2 years ago and have not had contact from them since.

With the exception of one butt dial, lol (it was obvious from the msg on the

machine that she did not know her phone was on.)

Do you want your mother to chase you?

Sveta

>

> Twyla,

>

> I agree fully that NC is " the kindest thing " for both the KO and the nada.

There comes a point when no " Fix " to the abuse can be found. At that time,

not being in nada's reach is best for both of you.

>

> As a KO whose mother died during NC, I can say that in my own case I felt

relieve that she could no longer harm or threaten me. I no longer wait for

the explosions. There had been times during the NC when I longed to contact

nada but I knew what such contact would bring and chose to stay NC. It's a

sad thing to fear one's parent with good reason.

>

> I feel no blame for nada's death. She died because she abused alcohol and

drugs for many years. When doctors discovered her liver disease in the mid

1980's they warned her that it would eventually kill her. They pled with her

to end her use of alcohol and cocaine. While there were times that she cut

back, she was never able to stop. Nada killed nada. It was a long, slow

suicide by lifestyle. I feel no blame. I took no part in it and had nothing

to do with it.

>

> Ulimately, a KO has to ask themselves, " What am I willing to do to create

peace in my life? " If the KO is no longer addicted to high drama, unwilling

to upset themselves /their spouse/their children and committed fully to

their own recoveryfrom childhood abuse, the KO can survive NC. It is not

always easy. There are times when it will be lonely. Every KO aches for

parental love. However, selecting not to engage is a safe and healthy

alternative when dealing with a nada.

>

> Beth

>

>

[Guest guest]

I can definitely understand your need for a mother who cares about you. That is

a very basic human need. So often with a PDd parent, though, the tables are

turned...WE are expected to take care of THEM. We are held responsible when they

can't cope with adult life. It can be very difficult to accept that the parents

we got are not capable of being the parents we need, no matter how hard we try

to make them.

Honestly, NC has been a huge relief for me. It was hardest in the beginning when

I felt guilt and feared retribution. But I am finally starting to feel free and

am using the space to do some much needed work on me. Sometimes I still feel a

little sad around the holidays when I think it would be nice to have even some

kind of very distant connection with my folks, but I know they are not safe for

me yet. Like you, I understood that there would be the possibility of them

passing away when I chose NC. It was a risk I was willing to take for my own

well-being.

I am sorry you have been scapegoated and that your FOO is not willing or able to

understand you and help you. In these situations we have to learn to nurture

ourselves instead and look for safe substitutes for the mother role. T can be

very helpful, too.

You deserve to be loved. Remember that the words and actions of your FOO do not

determine your worth.

Sveta

> >

> > Twyla,

> >

> > I agree fully that NC is " the kindest thing " for both the KO and the nada.

> There comes a point when no " Fix " to the abuse can be found. At that time,

> not being in nada's reach is best for both of you.

> >

> > As a KO whose mother died during NC, I can say that in my own case I felt

> relieve that she could no longer harm or threaten me. I no longer wait for

> the explosions. There had been times during the NC when I longed to contact

> nada but I knew what such contact would bring and chose to stay NC. It's a

> sad thing to fear one's parent with good reason.

> >

> > I feel no blame for nada's death. She died because she abused alcohol and

> drugs for many years. When doctors discovered her liver disease in the mid

> 1980's they warned her that it would eventually kill her. They pled with her

> to end her use of alcohol and cocaine. While there were times that she cut

> back, she was never able to stop. Nada killed nada. It was a long, slow

> suicide by lifestyle. I feel no blame. I took no part in it and had nothing

> to do with it.

> >

> > Ulimately, a KO has to ask themselves, " What am I willing to do to create

> peace in my life? " If the KO is no longer addicted to high drama, unwilling

> to upset themselves /their spouse/their children and committed fully to

> their own recoveryfrom childhood abuse, the KO can survive NC. It is not

> always easy. There are times when it will be lonely. Every KO aches for

> parental love. However, selecting not to engage is a safe and healthy

> alternative when dealing with a nada.

> >

> > Beth

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Do u ever expect to contact your parents again Svaktshka?

From: WTOAdultChildren1

[mailto:WTOAdultChildren1 ] On Behalf Of svaktshka

Sent: Sunday, December 16, 2012 09:32 AM

To: WTOAdultChildren1

Subject: Re: Hermit/Waif

My mother is a waif/hermit. I wrote a letter detailing my wish for NC from

both parents about 2 years ago and have not had contact from them since.

With the exception of one butt dial, lol (it was obvious from the msg on the

machine that she did not know her phone was on.)

Do you want your mother to chase you?

Sveta

>

> Twyla,

>

> I agree fully that NC is " the kindest thing " for both the KO and the nada.

There comes a point when no " Fix " to the abuse can be found. At that time,

not being in nada's reach is best for both of you.

>

> As a KO whose mother died during NC, I can say that in my own case I felt

relieve that she could no longer harm or threaten me. I no longer wait for

the explosions. There had been times during the NC when I longed to contact

nada but I knew what such contact would bring and chose to stay NC. It's a

sad thing to fear one's parent with good reason.

>

> I feel no blame for nada's death. She died because she abused alcohol and

drugs for many years. When doctors discovered her liver disease in the mid

1980's they warned her that it would eventually kill her. They pled with her

to end her use of alcohol and cocaine. While there were times that she cut

back, she was never able to stop. Nada killed nada. It was a long, slow

suicide by lifestyle. I feel no blame. I took no part in it and had nothing

to do with it.

>

> Ulimately, a KO has to ask themselves, " What am I willing to do to create

peace in my life? " If the KO is no longer addicted to high drama, unwilling

to upset themselves /their spouse/their children and committed fully to

their own recoveryfrom childhood abuse, the KO can survive NC. It is not

always easy. There are times when it will be lonely. Every KO aches for

parental love. However, selecting not to engage is a safe and healthy

alternative when dealing with a nada.

>

> Beth

>

>

[Guest guest]

I don't know. I am considering it, only because I know they were seeking

therapy. If yhey have made progress, I might be able to handle some very limited

contact. But right now I am still working through some things with my own T. We

will see.

Sveta

> >

> > Twyla,

> >

> > I agree fully that NC is " the kindest thing " for both the KO and the nada.

> There comes a point when no " Fix " to the abuse can be found. At that time,

> not being in nada's reach is best for both of you.

> >

> > As a KO whose mother died during NC, I can say that in my own case I felt

> relieve that she could no longer harm or threaten me. I no longer wait for

> the explosions. There had been times during the NC when I longed to contact

> nada but I knew what such contact would bring and chose to stay NC. It's a

> sad thing to fear one's parent with good reason.

> >

> > I feel no blame for nada's death. She died because she abused alcohol and

> drugs for many years. When doctors discovered her liver disease in the mid

> 1980's they warned her that it would eventually kill her. They pled with her

> to end her use of alcohol and cocaine. While there were times that she cut

> back, she was never able to stop. Nada killed nada. It was a long, slow

> suicide by lifestyle. I feel no blame. I took no part in it and had nothing

> to do with it.

> >

> > Ulimately, a KO has to ask themselves, " What am I willing to do to create

> peace in my life? " If the KO is no longer addicted to high drama, unwilling

> to upset themselves /their spouse/their children and committed fully to

> their own recoveryfrom childhood abuse, the KO can survive NC. It is not

> always easy. There are times when it will be lonely. Every KO aches for

> parental love. However, selecting not to engage is a safe and healthy

> alternative when dealing with a nada.

> >

> > Beth

> >

> >