Guest guest Posted January 24, 2008 Report Share Posted January 24, 2008 I thin you need more HC in your two morning time blocks with the earliest being the most HC. Do you use cream for both those doses? I got that same fatigue you describe until I got high enough. My temps now are averaging 98.4 with no thyroid supplementation, which even surprises me. Cheri -----Original Message----- I increased my dose of Armour by 1/8 grain two nights ago (temps have not budged even 1/10 - I think that the 4 dose schedule is definitely an improvement for my adrenals) and " stress-dosed " by using HC gel in the AM (assuming that I'm absorbing it better than the oral) and before bed instead of my usual which is just using it at bed-time. I've had some pretty serious 2-3PM dips over the past two days like I haven't had since before I even started on Armour and HC - like the good old days when I would be falling asleep at my desk at 2:30 or so and get up to eat that snack of M & Ms, a bag of pretzels and a Mountain Dew. I'm wondering whether I'm just that tired (I've slept poorly the last two night in particular, and not well for months), or that I'm not getting enough HC from the gel in the morning. Any ideas? I guess that I can test it by taking the oral HC tomorrow in the AM and see if I dip again tomorrow. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 25, 2008 Report Share Posted January 25, 2008 Switched back to cream from gel for last night's dose and slept from 11PM to 5:45 which was a slight improvement, but not what I was hoping. I need to be able to sleep until 7AM. I took the oral for my AM dose instead of cream or gel to see if I fade as hard as I have been all week taking the gel in the AM. So far so good, but it's early. Val and Cheri have said it to me a dozen times at least and I believe that I don't have enough cortisol in me, but with temps steady, BPs good, and blood sugar good, I don't know where to go from 40mg. Val's friend who is on 60-80mg/day might feel good that way, but I want my adrenals to come back on-line some day and I don't want to risk making that less likely unless I absolutely need to. I'm kind of like Sol that way - show me something objective that indicates that I need to be on more other than a buzzy head and a stomach ache. I guess that the other thing that I need to try is to back that last dose down to 8PM instead of bed-time and see if I still wake up at 5AM. Worst case is that I'll wake up at 2 or 3AM and need to take more and eat a snack and lay there for a while afterward which is no worse than waking up at 5:30 and laying there until the alarm goes off at 7AM just as I'm ready to fall back to sleep. > > , > > The cream, oinment and so on definately doesn't work as well for me. Today > is my 3rd day using it and I have felt worse than usual. However, the first > day when I started having low cortisol symptoms, I started adding more cream > until I felt better. So I've actually been using almost twice the amount of > HC with the cream that I have been taking orally. The weird thing is that > like you, my temps are steady the last 3 days. 98.3, 98.5, 98.4. They have > been averaging anywhere from 98.6-99.4. Very weird. I'm not on thyroid yet, > so it isn't related to that unless my body is producing on it's own in a > wacky way. It will be interesting to see what happens when I start taking it > orally again tomorrow. > > Cherie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 25, 2008 Report Share Posted January 25, 2008 there is one more thing you could try to not raise the dose but get better coverage at night. You could try a small PRED dose at bedtime. It comes in 1MG doses so that would be equal to 4mg HC so you could tailor it to your needs easily. Pred lasts abotu 8-12 hours. -- Artistic Grooming- Hurricane WV http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/ http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 25, 2008 Report Share Posted January 25, 2008 One of my docs suggested that I might not be getting enough cortisol because my intestines are in a perpetual state of inflammation and are soaking up the cortisol from the HC before it makes it into my blood stream. He even suggested doubling my dose of HC on weekends to help heal and reduce that inflammation so that for the rest of the week they're better able to pass along the cortisol to the rest of my body where it needs to go. I doubt that Val would agree with that suggestion and I haven't done it, but it is an interesting theory that squares with what you are thinking. > > Yep, I've been rubbing it in anywhere I can see blood vessels. I even tried > my neck to see if that would work better. Who knows. Whenever I've had to > take prednisone in the past, my body really likes it. I don't get all moody > or anything. I just felt great. Now whenever I had to wean down that was > another story. The odd thing to me is how many people have digestive > problems taking HC, but I don't. In fact, my stomach has been very not happy > with the cream as opposed to the pills. I wonder if it has a topical effect > on my guts as I'm digesting it that is helpful to me with Chrons disease. > > Cherie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 25, 2008 Report Share Posted January 25, 2008 Most people need to be on a high dose for a long time to shut down the pituitary permanently. I was reading a report last week where the person was on 100 mg Prednisone (which is what, something like 300-500 mg hydrocortisone?) for a year and was shut down but in 3 months off came back to normal. You can always try 5 mg increments because if you are getting too much you would start to get symptoms. I think when you get some gut issues addresses you will need less to because your liver and overall body can process it better. Cheri -----Original Message----- I'm kind of like Sol that way - show me something objective that indicates that I need to be on more other than a buzzy head and a stomach ache. I guess that the other thing that I need to try is to back that last . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 25, 2008 Report Share Posted January 25, 2008 Sorry Sol, I know that some of you have had it harder than me and for much longer. My mother is a little older than you and she (and her mother before she died) has lousy sleeping patterns similar to yours. Of course I am absolutely convinced that she, my grandmother, my two sisters and her brother (my uncle) all have thyroid issues inherited through that side of the family so I've become much less surprised at all of the similarities. I could live with the 6 1/2 hours of sleep and being tired all of the time if my adrenals were healing, but that's the part that bothers me - removing stress and getting adequate sleep are supposed to be the two most important things for healing and we're not getting #2 (working on #1). > > Switched back to cream from gel for last night's dose and slept from > > 11PM to 5:45 which was a slight improvement, but not what I was > > hoping. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 25, 2008 Report Share Posted January 25, 2008 6 times/day, ugh. Another alarm to set. I was thinking more of compressing it to 4 doses to see if I'm like Cheri and Jim and that the bed-time dose is what is interfering with my sleep. I did go back to pills for my AM dose today and, despite getting the same amount of sleep last night as the previous two nights, I was much more awake through the day and didn't dip between 2 and 3. I don't think that the gel was working well for me at all. I've been thinking about prednisolone for a while now and even Val who doesn't like it much thinks that it might be the thing. Dunno. I wish that this wasn't so much of a guessing game. > > 12.5mg at 7:30AM > 10mg at 11:30AM. > 7.5mg at 3:30. > 5mg at 6:30 - 7PM and > 5mg of the gel before bed. > > , since it's not recommended you increase your HC, how about > playing around with your current dose? When your first dose is too > high, it lowers your ACTH for the day, making you much more dependent > on external supplmentation, and doesn't give your own adrenals a > chance. So instead of 5x/day dosing, how about trying 6x/day, at > shorter intervals. Might also give you better coverage so you won't > feel so low. I reduced DH's first dose and it seems to be helping > him sleep. I had him at 5, 4, 3, 1 (syringe notches) and moved him > to 4, 4, 3, 1. One notch could be counted as 2.5 mg. > > How about: > 10 at 7:30 > 10 at 10:30 > 7.5 at 1:30 > 5 at 4:30 > 5 at 7:30 > 2.5 at bed > > Barb > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 25, 2008 Report Share Posted January 25, 2008 Ditto. I think that is why doctors tend to just give us a " one size fits all " because the complexity of our individual cases is too much for them to deal with. Heck, it is too much for US to deal with, lol. Cheri -----Original Message----- I wish that this wasn't so much of a guessing game. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 26, 2008 Report Share Posted January 26, 2008 I felt better on the pills too, although GI was lousy yesterday and didn't sleep well - pretty normal for me these days. Cheri would say that my intestinal inflammation is b/c I am toxic and I agree. I have been eating all of the wrong things for my whole life, especially if I can put any faith in the ALCAT food sensitivity report that I finally got a copy of yesterday. I have 8 fillings that probably need to go some day, and I'm exposed to all of the same bad stuff in air and water that we all are (trying to do small things like not using toothpaste w/fluoride anymore). I think that most of it is food and being hypo for a long, long time, and T4 therapy for last 5 years making it worse. > > Well, I was able to dose with pills again today and can definately tell a > difference. I don't feel good by any means, but definately better than with > the cream. Now i just need to lay in a good supply of HC so I don't run out! > > BTW, , do you know what causes your intestinal inflammation? > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 26, 2008 Report Share Posted January 26, 2008 's Powersmile has no fluoride. A shower filter and faucet filter help with the chlorine and a lot of other contaminants. You can get Hepa air purifiers just for the bedroom since we spend the most hours there and the important time...sleeping (or trying too, lol). Sorry to hear the pills cause so much GI upset and the cream is not strong enough. Cheri -----Original Message----- I felt better on the pills too, although GI was lousy yesterday and didn't sleep well - pretty normal for me these days. Cheri would say that my intestinal inflammation is b/c I am toxic and I agree. I have been eating all of the wrong things for my whole life, especially if I can put any faith in the ALCAT food sensitivity report that I finally got a copy of yesterday. I have 8 fillings that probably need to go some day, and I'm exposed to all of the same bad stuff in air and water that we all are (trying to do small things like not using toothpaste w/fluoride anymore). I think that most of it is food and being hypo for a long, long time, and T4 therapy for last 5 years making it worse. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 26, 2008 Report Share Posted January 26, 2008 He has mercury poisoning, which is a big part of it. I remember reading that from his labs awhile back. That is also what led to my gut issues. Cheri -----Original Message----- Well, I was able to dose with pills again today and can definately tell a difference. I don't feel good by any means, but definately better than with the cream. Now i just need to lay in a good supply of HC so I don't run out! BTW, , do you know what causes your intestinal inflammation? . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 27, 2008 Report Share Posted January 27, 2008 I've been using HC cream when convenient and when away I use HC sublingually. Seems to be a good plan so far. I've only been doing this about one week. I was in Atlanta Friday in very heavy afternoon traffic and remembered my HC and popped it in my mouth. (Already had pill portions easily accessible). No way could I have used the cream. Delores RE: Re: Really tired last few days while using HC gel in the AM > Didn't someone else on here try taking their HC pills sublingually? I wonder > how that would work for you. I have several fillings as well and it is > probably affecting me, but I must focus on one thing at a time. I've also > had a couple that have fallen out and had to be replaced. > > Cherie > > A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy > enough people to make it worth the effort. Herm Albright > > > > > > I felt better on the pills too, although GI was lousy yesterday and > > didn't sleep well - pretty normal for me these days. > > > > Cheri would say that my intestinal inflammation is b/c I am toxic and > > I agree. I have been eating all of the wrong things for my whole > > life, especially if I can put any faith in the ALCAT food sensitivity > > report that I finally got a copy of yesterday. I have 8 fillings that > > probably need to go some day, and I'm exposed to all of the same bad > > stuff in air and water that we all are (trying to do small things like > > not using toothpaste w/fluoride anymore). I think that most of it is > > food and being hypo for a long, long time, and T4 therapy for last 5 > > years making it worse. > > > > > > > > > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.11/1244 - Release Date: 1/25/2008 > 7:44 PM > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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