Re:osteopenia - Vic

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

I think I've told you this before but I hadn't mentioned to Vic that I was

diagnosed with osteopenia, based on my bone density test results, taken when

I was improperly treated and hypothryoid.

I have to wonder if Vic could have been marginally hypothyroid in the years

before being diagnosed with GD. Most everyone with GD has an initial period

of hypothyroidism. Often it's subclinical, and the AACE has only recently

stated that TSH levels between 3 and 5, while in the normal range, can

suggest hypothryoidism.

My point is that once I got on a high dose of Armour and began experimenting

with even higher doses, my osteopenia went away. My last two bone density

tests were perfectly normal. My doctor said that he's seen this before. And

recently there have been reports that high levels of thyroid hormone are not

associated with osteoporosis as previously thought. I'm speculating that the

initial hypothryoidism or under-treated hypothyroidism is more to blame. If

either of you have thoughts on this, I'd be interested in hearing them, Elaine

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

I think I've told you this before but I hadn't mentioned to Vic that I was

diagnosed with osteopenia, based on my bone density test results, taken when

I was improperly treated and hypothryoid.

I have to wonder if Vic could have been marginally hypothyroid in the years

before being diagnosed with GD. Most everyone with GD has an initial period

of hypothyroidism. Often it's subclinical, and the AACE has only recently

stated that TSH levels between 3 and 5, while in the normal range, can

suggest hypothryoidism.

My point is that once I got on a high dose of Armour and began experimenting

with even higher doses, my osteopenia went away. My last two bone density

tests were perfectly normal. My doctor said that he's seen this before. And

recently there have been reports that high levels of thyroid hormone are not

associated with osteoporosis as previously thought. I'm speculating that the

initial hypothryoidism or under-treated hypothyroidism is more to blame. If

either of you have thoughts on this, I'd be interested in hearing them, Elaine

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

I think I've told you this before but I hadn't mentioned to Vic that I was

diagnosed with osteopenia, based on my bone density test results, taken when

I was improperly treated and hypothryoid.

I have to wonder if Vic could have been marginally hypothyroid in the years

before being diagnosed with GD. Most everyone with GD has an initial period

of hypothyroidism. Often it's subclinical, and the AACE has only recently

stated that TSH levels between 3 and 5, while in the normal range, can

suggest hypothryoidism.

My point is that once I got on a high dose of Armour and began experimenting

with even higher doses, my osteopenia went away. My last two bone density

tests were perfectly normal. My doctor said that he's seen this before. And

recently there have been reports that high levels of thyroid hormone are not

associated with osteoporosis as previously thought. I'm speculating that the

initial hypothryoidism or under-treated hypothyroidism is more to blame. If

either of you have thoughts on this, I'd be interested in hearing them, Elaine

[Guest guest]

Hi Vic!

I'm curious about some of your experiences with osteopenia. I also found out

I have osteopenia and after a year of calcium supplementation, it's barely

holding steady with added decline in one hip. When you said that you stopped

taking the Ca/Mg/Vit. D because it became apparent that your body wasn't

making use of it - how did you know it wasn't making use of it? I'm asking

because I sometimes wonder if I'm having a similar problem. After a year of

taking Ca/Mg/Vit. D., I've still got new bone loss and my serum calcium

levels are _lower_ than they were a year ago. Where did it all go I wonder!

Also, if you ever find out if the calcitonin is definitely doing something

for you, I'd be interested to know!

Thanks - good luck at the doctor's appt!

Re: TP Ab Test Results - Vic

> Thank you, Elaine,for your information.

>

> Let me restate it, just to see if I have it straight.

>

> Right, now, before my appointment, I need to take a Vitamin A & D

> and,later, if my calcium goes down, I will need to begin taking a

> supplement.

>

> I have, before GD, taken 1200 mg of calcium with magnesium and

> Vitamin D. I just stopped when it became apparent my body was not

> making use of it. I already have osteopenia and have had, since I was

> 46, long before I had been diagnosed as having Grave's. I also take

> calcitonin (Miacalcin), which I am continuing because I have no idea

> if it is doing any good or not. I had a bone density test at 46

> years old, to just get a baseline. My last bone density showed

> declines in all areas (still osteopenia, though) and that test was

> also before Grave's. I say I don't know if the Miacalcin is working

> because the declines may have been bigger had I not been using it.

>

> Vic

> Central Coast, California, 53, diagnosed by GP 8-20-02. Taking

> natural remedy and Inderal. First endo appt., 10-11. Feel pretty

> good, get some headaches, some eye aches, some shortness of breath

> upon exertion.

>

>

>

> -------------------------------------

> The Graves' list is intended for informational purposes only and is not

intended to replace expert medical care.

> Please consult your doctor before changing or trying new treatments.

> ----------------------------------------

> DISCLAIMER

>

> Advertisments placed on this yahoo groups list do not have the endorsement

of

> the listowner. I have no input as to what ads are attached to emails.

> --------------------------------------------------------------------------

------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hello, :

You asked: When you said that you stopped taking the Ca/Mg/Vit. D

because it became apparent that your body wasn't making use of it -

how did you know it wasn't making use of it? I'm asking because I

sometimes wonder if I'm having a similar problem.

Since October of last year, I have had one health problem after

another and I went to my GP and was told I had allergies. I guess,

intuitively, I knew that that wasn't all that I had, so I started

doing some research on the Web and I came across a site that offered

hair analysis. The results of that showed a high amount of calcium

in my hair. I was told that that meant that my body wasn't using

it. I didn't stop taking my calcium/D/magnesium supplement, then,

but I did when my serum calcium on my diagnostic test for Grave's was

high. I understand this to mean that the calcium isn't in the bones,

where it should be, if it shows up in the blood.

My naturopath agreed with me that I didn't need to take calcium,

right now, but to start taking it, again, when treatment is underway

for the Grave's.

I have been told several times, from various sources, that the type

of supplements that we take is important. Some of them simply just

pass through the body. I haven't found a liquid supplement for

osteoporosis, but I am wondering if liquid or tablets taken under the

tongue might be more readily absorbed, and, therefore, be more

effective.

I am still in the middle of trying to find out as much as I can on

how to treat Grave's, and, then, I will go back to researching other

health problems. I am finding the information to be very good, but a

little hard to put together into a complete picture of how to go on

from here.

Now, I am trying to figure out if the osteopenia is caused by Grave's

or if I have a separate problem of osteopenia, totally unrelated to

my current state of health.

Vic

Age 53, California, Diagnosed August 20, 2002, Taking Inderal and

natural supplement of bugleweed, skullcap and lemon balm. First endo

appointment, October 11. (TSH <0.01, Calcium 10.8, high resting pulse

without inderal at about 142, restless legs, insomnia, bowel

problems, and irritated eyes. Elevated my bed six inches and the

pain behind my eyes went away.)

[Guest guest]

Hello, Elaine,

I responded to 's question before I had read yours. My

feeling, now, after recent research, is I may have been subclinically

hypothyroid for most of my life. I have battled depression for most

of my life and, now, I discover that hypothryroidism can cause that.

I once suspected that I had hypothyroidism because I would exercise

my head off and had given up all of my favorite comfort foods, but

would not lose weight. I only had about 20 pounds to lose, so it

must have seemed to the doctors that I may not have been heavy enough

to indicate hypothyroidism, I don't know. Anyway, my doctor finally

agreed to test for it and the tests came back showing normal

results. That was about three years ago.

My last bone density test was October 11, 2001, when there was a

decline in bone density at the spine of approximately 4.8% and at the

hip of approximately 11.7%. " Despite these declines, the hip study

remains within normal limits and only a mild degree of osteopenia is

noted at the vertebral sites " . I will probably wait a couple of

years to get to a point where whatever treatment I am getting is

working and then see about getting another bone density. The results

of that test will probably answer the question of whether the

osteopenia was caused by untreated hypothyroidism.

I am tempted to feel sorry for myself that my hypothyroidism was not

discovered since I have led a somewhat difficult life, but I only

have to think about other diseases and conditions that are so much

more terrible.

Vic

[Guest guest]

,

No, my naturopath has not indicated what supplement would be good. I

think we are focussing just on the Grave's and we will address the

other things, later, when I have seen the endo. I will let you know

what I find out.

I forgot to mention in my previous email that my cholesterol level

went from 230, to 265, to 305 within a two-year period. In my

research, I have discovered that, in an ideal world, a doctor will

check for hypothyroidism, first, before prescribing cholesterol-

lowering drugs. I think that is another clue that I was hypo before

I turned hyper.

Change of subject, you say you are using alternative remedies. My

remedy has not reduced my heart rate, nor taken away my shortness of

breath, nor affected my weak muscles. Is your alternative approach

helping you in all of the ways that you were affected?

Vic

[Guest guest]

,

No, my naturopath has not indicated what supplement would be good. I

think we are focussing just on the Grave's and we will address the

other things, later, when I have seen the endo. I will let you know

what I find out.

I forgot to mention in my previous email that my cholesterol level

went from 230, to 265, to 305 within a two-year period. In my

research, I have discovered that, in an ideal world, a doctor will

check for hypothyroidism, first, before prescribing cholesterol-

lowering drugs. I think that is another clue that I was hypo before

I turned hyper.

Change of subject, you say you are using alternative remedies. My

remedy has not reduced my heart rate, nor taken away my shortness of

breath, nor affected my weak muscles. Is your alternative approach

helping you in all of the ways that you were affected?

Vic

[Guest guest]

,

No, my naturopath has not indicated what supplement would be good. I

think we are focussing just on the Grave's and we will address the

other things, later, when I have seen the endo. I will let you know

what I find out.

I forgot to mention in my previous email that my cholesterol level

went from 230, to 265, to 305 within a two-year period. In my

research, I have discovered that, in an ideal world, a doctor will

check for hypothyroidism, first, before prescribing cholesterol-

lowering drugs. I think that is another clue that I was hypo before

I turned hyper.

Change of subject, you say you are using alternative remedies. My

remedy has not reduced my heart rate, nor taken away my shortness of

breath, nor affected my weak muscles. Is your alternative approach

helping you in all of the ways that you were affected?

Vic

[Guest guest]

Hi Vic -

Cool! I'll be waiting to hear what your naturopath has to say later!

That's quite an increase in your cholesterol for just 2 years. I'd sure

suspect being hypo during that time also. Especially if you hadn't changed

your diet (for the worse) in that time. My mum incidentally had the same

problem. She's got Hashi's and is on synthroid, but since finishing

menopause, her synthroid dose hasn't been quite right and now she's slightly

hypo again. During this same time when her TSH was going up, her cholesterol

did also - similar jump to what you had! And she wasn't eating any worse, in

fact, better. So I think there is a real connection between increases in TSH

and cholesterol. It'll be interesting to see if yours goes down now that

you're hyper.

So far the most beneficial thing I have found to reduce my heartrate is

Magnesium. It was one of the first things I started taking, and I saw a

difference in my heart rate within a couple weeks. I usually take 250 mg. a

day, but if it's been particularly stressful and I'm feeling racey, I'll

take another. As for muscle weakness, mine's better than a year ago since my

levels have been stable, but I'm still weak compared to before GD. For that,

about the only thing as far I can tell is exercise. No magic supplement for

that I've been using weights while walking and that

has made my arms better. I started taking Tai Chi again, and that's really

great for building up the strength. My legs feel stronger already. I also

like it becuase it's slower paced and relaxing. Doesn't tax my heart rate

It's also good for the osteopenia - really the main reason I got back to it.

How much longer until your endo visit? Is it in Nov?

Re:osteopenia - Vic

> ,

>

> No, my naturopath has not indicated what supplement would be good. I

> think we are focussing just on the Grave's and we will address the

> other things, later, when I have seen the endo. I will let you know

> what I find out.

>

> I forgot to mention in my previous email that my cholesterol level

> went from 230, to 265, to 305 within a two-year period. In my

> research, I have discovered that, in an ideal world, a doctor will

> check for hypothyroidism, first, before prescribing cholesterol-

> lowering drugs. I think that is another clue that I was hypo before

> I turned hyper.

>

> Change of subject, you say you are using alternative remedies. My

> remedy has not reduced my heart rate, nor taken away my shortness of

> breath, nor affected my weak muscles. Is your alternative approach

> helping you in all of the ways that you were affected?

>

> Vic

>

>

>

> -------------------------------------

> The Graves' list is intended for informational purposes only and is not

intended to replace expert medical care.

> Please consult your doctor before changing or trying new treatments.

> ----------------------------------------

> DISCLAIMER

>

> Advertisments placed on this yahoo groups list do not have the endorsement

of

> the listowner. I have no input as to what ads are attached to emails.

> --------------------------------------------------------------------------

------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi,

>You wrote: It'll be interesting to see if yours goes down now that

you're hyper.<

My cholesterol is 191 with 65 for my good cholesterol. I should have

indicated that in my previous email. This is another clue that

points to hypothyroidism before becoming hyper. (It is 191 and this

is after I have been eating ALL of my comfort foods because of an

overpowering craving for sweet buns and ice cream. Now, I know that

my craving is because of Grave's. I am trying to rein it in, but I

have a tendency to think I deserve SOMETHING nice since I am ill. My

naturopath said I should give up sugar. I don't know what the

consequences are going to be of my losing control. Before Grave's, I

was very proud of all I had given up.)

I don't think I am a candidate for using magnesium to reduce my heart

rate. My naturopath gave me some magnesium pills to try for my

headaches and they caused diarrhea.

>As for muscle weakness, mine's better than a year ago since my

levels have been stable, but I'm still weak compared to before GD.<

Did your levels become stable through the natural approach?

> How much longer until your endo visit? Is it in Nov?<

It is October 11. Not too far away, now.

Vic