Guest guest Posted March 31, 2008 Report Share Posted March 31, 2008 Hi Val, I was just typing a message and lost it, so if this posts twice I apologize! I have been holding a dose of 32.5mg HC for 3 months, and based on temps for a while there that seemed to be sufficient. Over the last 2 months I've been slowing raising Armour (I'm up to 4 3/4 grains). I've had very little relief of thyroid symptoms, despite my T3 and T4 labs being both over the top of the range. My doc feels I've never reached my appropriate dose of Amour, since my basal temps were still low, and he feels the labs ranges are low so isn't concerned about going over them. I'm concerned I might still have low cortisol...I restarted temps, and Thursday my daily average was 98.7, Saturday it was 98.0. I know I shouldn't base HC dosing on 2 days of temps, but I also feel like I have the symptoms...eyes very sensitive to light, irritability, shakiness/weakness, fatigue...I dose my HC 5 times a day...15mg at wakeup, 7.5mg 3 hours later, 5mg 3 hours later, 2.5mg 3 hours later and 2.5mg at bedtime. I've noticed that 1/2 to 1 hour before my next HC dose, I feel really awful...worn out and sleepy. I guess my questions are...could raising Armour increase the need for more HC? Could the fact that I'm already at 32.5mg HC but still appearing to need more mean that Medrol would be a better option? What would be the appropriate dose of Medrol if I'm at 32.5mg HC but that doesn't really seem enough? My saliva tests pre-HC showed stage 7 adrenal fatigue...low at all time periods and low DHEA (I take 10 mg DHEA), so I'm not surprised I would need more than 20mg HC, but I am concerned about being more than 32.5... Any suggestions appreciated, and if you'd need more info, let me know. Many thanks, Teressa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 31, 2008 Report Share Posted March 31, 2008 >>I dose my HC 5 times a day...15mg at wakeup, 7.5mg 3 hours later, 5mg 3 hours later, 2.5mg 3 hours later and 2.5mg at bedtime. I've noticed that 1/2 to 1 hour before my next HC dose, I feel really awful...worn out and sleepy. << First can you post the numbers for your thyroid labs? Ids the T4 over range? If it si you can be certain you have RT3 and need to lower the dose of Amrour. if not go to all T3. But about this dosing you are top loading your day WAY too much. With taking 15mg first thing you are shutting doewn the ACTH for later in your day and by night with the two 2.5mg doses, I am certain all thyroid stops flowing to the cells at all. I suspect high AM cortils and low PM cortiosl wiht your dosing. Try this: 10 wake; 10 3 hours later, 5 3 hours, 5 3 hours and 5. This will be 35 mg and I bet it will work better for you. -- Artistic Grooming- Hurricane WV http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/ http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/ http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 31, 2008 Report Share Posted March 31, 2008 > First can you post the numbers for your thyroid labs? Ids the T4 over range? If it si you can be certain you have RT3 and need to lower the dose of Amrour. if not go to all T3. But about this dosing you are top loading your day WAY too much. With taking 15mg first thing you are shutting doewn the ACTH for later in your day and by night with the two 2.5mg doses, I am certain all thyroid stops flowing to the cells at all. I suspect high AM cortils and low PM cortiosl wiht your dosing. Try this: > 10 wake; 10 3 hours later, 5 3 hours, 5 3 hours and 5. This will be 35 mg and I bet it will work better for you. Wow, Val, I had no idea...thanks so much for that. I will try that new HC dosing first thing tomorrow. As for my labs, I don't have the most recent numbers in front of me, but I think my free T4 was a 1.8 or 1.87 on a .61-1.76 scale, and the free T3 has been high for a while...4.4 pg/mL on a 2.3-4.2 scale was the number in January, and I believe it's still around the same. The same time I had that 4.4 T3 test, I had reverse T3 tested--it was 307 pg/mL on a 90-350 scale. I know that means my ratio is bad (14%) and I should go on Cytomel, but I wanted to make sure I had eliminated all other possibilities...e.g that I was taking enough Armour and HC, that I wasn't just testing that high because my HC was off... My doc isn't familiar with Cytomel...he's told me that he's had much more success with Armour, that patients he's had come in on Cytomel that he's switched to Armour do much better. He was willing to try Cytomel, but as a last resort. Janie mentioned the same thing to me...to make sure everything else was " correct " before trying Cytomel...I'm really scared. I don't want to do the wrong thing, and what I have been trying hasn't been working. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 31, 2008 Report Share Posted March 31, 2008 JUst don;t do as I did and try things for 13 stoopid years! LOL I FINALLY went to all T3 last year and it really was a good choice for me, and now I am on partial T3 and partial Armour and doing better. I think I wil lalways need extra T3 as for some reason I just do nto convert well, btu so be it! Better than struggling with 15 different dosing s hedules to nto have any of thenm work! -- Artistic Grooming- Hurricane WV http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/ http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/ http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 31, 2008 Report Share Posted March 31, 2008 > JUst don;t do as I did and try things for 13 stoopid years! LOL I > FINALLY went to all T3 last year and it really was a good choice for me, > and now I am on partial T3 and partial Armour and doing better. I think > I wil lalways need extra T3 as for some reason I just do nto convert > well, btu so be it! Better than struggling with 15 different dosing s > hedules to nto have any of thenm work! OMG, Val, I don't know how you went 13 years...I was diagnosed in 2000, so it's only been 8 for me, but I definitely have days when I feel like I'm at the end of my rope and I just can't take it anymore...of course, if I am now feeling worse, it may be just as you said...my HC dosing schedule is all wrong. Does increasing Armour sometimes add additional stress to the adrenals? I was feeling better after my last Armour increase...about 3 weeks after, I thought, " Finally, some relief! " and I was so excited, only to feel even worse than before at about week 5 after the increase... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 31, 2008 Report Share Posted March 31, 2008 As thyroid increases your metabolism your body needs more cortisl to deal wiht it, and more cortisl causes a need for more thyroid so the two have to be adjusted slwoly up together. Imbalances in either feel liek crap as then nothig is working right. -- Artistic Grooming- Hurricane WV http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/ http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/ http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 1, 2008 Report Share Posted April 1, 2008 > > As thyroid increases your metabolism your body needs more cortisl to > deal wiht it, and more cortisl causes a need for more thyroid so the two > have to be adjusted slwoly up together. Imbalances in either feel liek > crap as then nothig is working right. > > -- > Artistic Grooming- Hurricane WV > > http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/ > http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/ > http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/ > Hi Val, i was just wondering why more Cortisl causes a need for more thyroid if your simply just replacing low Cortisol levels? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 1, 2008 Report Share Posted April 1, 2008 >>Hi Val, i was just wondering why more Cortisl causes a need for more thyroid if your simply just replacing low Cortisol levels?<< It doesn;t once you get BOTH optimal. But as you buil;d to ioptimal doses you will need to raise both because raising one causes a need for more of the other. But once you hit the amount YOU need that will stop. -- Artistic Grooming- Hurricane WV http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/ http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/ http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 1, 2008 Report Share Posted April 1, 2008 > > >>Hi Val, i was just wondering why more Cortisl causes a need for more > thyroid if your simply just replacing low Cortisol levels?<< > > It doesn;t once you get BOTH optimal. But as you buil;d to ioptimal doses you will need to raise both because raising one causes a need for more of the other. But once you hit the amount YOU need that will stop. > > -- > Artistic Grooming- Hurricane WV > > http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/ > http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/ > http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/ > Thanks Val, i think i understand what your saying. So im taking 2.5mg of Pred in the morning, i have low moring cortisol and high afternoon cortisol. So should i be taking any T3 with my morning Pred dose? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 2, 2008 Report Share Posted April 2, 2008 >>So im taking 2.5mg of Pred in the morning, i have low moring cortisol and high afternoon cortisol. So should i be taking any T3 with my morning Pred dose?<< How much T3 are you on? You need to divide it evenly through out the day., Small doses 4 to 5 times a day. -- Artistic Grooming- Hurricane WV http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/ http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/ http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 2, 2008 Report Share Posted April 2, 2008 >>So im taking 2.5mg of Pred in the morning, i have low moring cortisol and high afternoon cortisol. So should i be taking any T3 with my morning Pred dose?<< How much T3 are you on? You need to divide it evenly through out the day., Small doses 4 to 5 times a day. -- Artistic Grooming- Hurricane WV http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/ http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/ http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 2, 2008 Report Share Posted April 2, 2008 I would give the pred a month then retest thyroid. -- Artistic Grooming- Hurricane WV http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/ http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/ http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 2, 2008 Report Share Posted April 2, 2008 > > I would give the pred a month then retest thyroid. > > -- > Artistic Grooming- Hurricane WV > > http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/ > http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/ > http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/ > Okay thanks Val, will do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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