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Saliva vs. Blood Labs

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Just got new labs!

Nov 07 on 1.75 grains

FT4 1.0 (.8-1.8)

FT3 304 (230-420)

TSH .12 (.4-4.5) LOW

Mar 08 on 2 grains

FT4 1.0 (.8-1.8)

FT3 364 (230-420)

TSH .03 (.4-4.5) LOW

DHEA Sulfate 101 (15-170)

Cortisol a.m. 21 (4-22)

Q1. Since FT4 didn't change even though dose was 1/4 grain higher,

but FT3 increased, does that mean I had better conversion and was

getting better? After reading about Vit D here, started getting some

daily afternoon sun. Could it make that much difference?

Saliva Mar 08 on 2 grains

fTSH 175 (26-85) HIGH

fT4 .21 (.17-.42)

fT3 .59 (.28-1.1)

TPO Negative

Cortisol

17 (13-24) 8 a.m.

12 (5-10) noon ELEVATED

6 (3-8) 5 p.m.

2 (1-4) 11 p.m.

Cortisol burden 37 (23-42)

DHEA 2 (3-10) DEPRESSED

Estradiol 12 (7-20 Luteal)

Progesterone 595 (65-500 Luteal) HIGH

Free Testosterone 8 (8-20)

Chart shows me at Stage 4

" Noon value is elevated indicating a stress response or rebound

effect oftn associated with glucose counter regulation process.

Elevated cortisol levels usually indicate increased ACTH stimulus.

When this elevation is coupled with decreased DHEA levels, then a

divergence of pregnenolone to the cortisol pathway has occurred. Low

DHEAS levels indicate relative depletion of the adrenal gland.

Precursor(s) and/or anabolic enhancement suggested: DHEA or

pregnenolone augmentation. "

Q2. So this means I should try 5 mg DHEA? And I got doc to raise me

to 2.5 grain BEFORE I had saliva labs back, based on the argument

that FT4 should be closer to 1.4 and that you have to ignore TSH when

someone's on Armour. Since I'm his only patient on Armour, he tends

to believe what I say LOL!

Q3. Current cortisol labs don't look that bad, but wasn't I low

cortisol if I had severe hypoglycemia (I don't anymore)? Also, the

area above my lip lost pigment last year, but the color is slowly

returning.

Another observation: once I raise to 2.5 grain, my TSH will probably

be .00X!

Thanks,

Barb

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>>17 (13-24) 8 a.m.

12 (5-10) noon ELEVATED

6 (3-8) 5 p.m.

2 (1-4) 11 p.m.

Cortisol burden 37 (23-42)

DHEA 2 (3-10) DEPRESSED

Estradiol 12 (7-20 Luteal)

Progesterone 595 (65-500 Luteal) HIGH

Free Testosterone 8 (8-20)

Chart shows me at Stage 4<<

Here si a good example of when I disagree with the stages! The whole reason fo

rthat stage 4 is your DHEA and your cortisl is really not bad at all. I would

start 5m DHEA nd aldo the usual ashwaganda an rhodiola and sea salt to help

support your adenals, a hormone free glandular would nto be a bad idea wither

just for further support, but I think if oyu continue with sloe thyroid increass

you will be fine. Yes your TSH is likely to be 0 when you are no longer

hypothyroid. My last one was .015 which si pretty close.

--

Artistic Grooming- Hurricane WV

http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/RT3_T3/

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Bar,

Hi, Did you get any input on your new labs?

Was wondering if you started a raise in armour yet, and if you are

raising 1/4 grain at a time or 1/2 grain all at once.

I've followed your DH's experiences with DHEA with a great deal of

interest. And it does sure seem like in his case DHEA lowered thyroid.

When I try it again, now I know to watch and see if my " feeling worse "

is defined by hypo symptoms.

I'm puzzled by your elevated noon saliva cortisol, but then, cortisol

results that have elevations in the middle of the day and afternoon do

puzzle me. I don't really " get " what the mechanism is. Could you feel

anything symptomatic then?

sol

Barb wrote:

> Just got new labs!

>

> Nov 07 on 1.75 grains

> FT4 1.0 (.8-1.8)

> FT3 304 (230-420)

> TSH .12 (.4-4.5) LOW

>

> Mar 08 on 2 grains

> FT4 1.0 (.8-1.8)

> FT3 364 (230-420)

> TSH .03 (.4-4.5) LOW

> DHEA Sulfate 101 (15-170)

> Cortisol a.m. 21 (4-22)

>

> Q1. Since FT4 didn't change even though dose was 1/4 grain higher,

> but FT3 increased, does that mean I had better conversion and was

> getting better? After reading about Vit D here, started getting some

> daily afternoon sun. Could it make that much difference?

>

> Saliva Mar 08 on 2 grains

> fTSH 175 (26-85) HIGH

> fT4 .21 (.17-.42)

> fT3 .59 (.28-1.1)

> TPO Negative

>

> Cortisol

> 17 (13-24) 8 a.m.

> 12 (5-10) noon ELEVATED

> 6 (3-8) 5 p.m.

> 2 (1-4) 11 p.m.

> Cortisol burden 37 (23-42)

> DHEA 2 (3-10) DEPRESSED

>

> Estradiol 12 (7-20 Luteal)

> Progesterone 595 (65-500 Luteal) HIGH

> Free Testosterone 8 (8-20)

>

> Chart shows me at Stage 4

> " Noon value is elevated indicating a stress response or rebound

> effect oftn associated with glucose counter regulation process.

> Elevated cortisol levels usually indicate increased ACTH stimulus.

> When this elevation is coupled with decreased DHEA levels, then a

> divergence of pregnenolone to the cortisol pathway has occurred. Low

> DHEAS levels indicate relative depletion of the adrenal gland.

> Precursor(s) and/or anabolic enhancement suggested: DHEA or

> pregnenolone augmentation. "

>

> Q2. So this means I should try 5 mg DHEA? And I got doc to raise me

> to 2.5 grain BEFORE I had saliva labs back, based on the argument

> that FT4 should be closer to 1.4 and that you have to ignore TSH when

> someone's on Armour. Since I'm his only patient on Armour, he tends

> to believe what I say LOL!

>

> Q3. Current cortisol labs don't look that bad, but wasn't I low

> cortisol if I had severe hypoglycemia (I don't anymore)? Also, the

> area above my lip lost pigment last year, but the color is slowly

> returning.

>

> Another observation: once I raise to 2.5 grain, my TSH will probably

> be .00X!

>

> Thanks,

> Barb

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

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sol wrote:

> Hi, Did you get any input on your new labs?

Val said they didn't look too bad and to just keep up with the

natural supplements.

> Was wondering if you started a raise in armour yet, and if you are

> raising 1/4 grain at a time or 1/2 grain all at once.

Last time I raised 1/4, I got those sharp adrenal twinges of pain in

the back so had to back off. I raised 1/8 grain last week and will

raise another 1/8 tomorrow.

> I'm puzzled by your elevated noon saliva cortisol, but then,

cortisol results that have elevations in the middle of the day and

afternoon do puzzle me. I don't really " get " what the mechanism is.

Could you feel anything symptomatic then?

The lab report said it could be hypoglycemia or stress. I believe

I'd had a good breakfast and wasn't hungry, but was kinda tired that

day and took a nap between 10:30 and 11. Don't know if that's like

hitting reset on your body cause you have to wake up again so the

cortisol starts out high again. Or I vaguely remember looking at the

clock and thinking, OMG, it's almost noon, I need to do the saliva

RIGHT NOW! That little stress might've done it. Don't know.

Thanks for asking Sol!

Barb

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