Guest guest Posted October 13, 1999 Report Share Posted October 13, 1999 Oh, bummer, my binge may mess me up ....oh well, thanks....Jean Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 9, 2005 Report Share Posted March 9, 2005 Just a word of caution. Not all with mito can handle this. I am one of them. laurie > > This rather negative remark from > http://www.dietsimple.info/the_atkins_diet.html : > > " Atkins says the essence of the diet is to eat all the meat, animal fat and > fat you want, but keep your carbohydrate intake to a minimum - about 20 > grams per day (virtually zero carb-containing foods) - in order to produce > a > condition in your body called " ketosis. " Ketosis is an unnatural > physiological state your body goes into when you are ill or starving - and > causes weight loss, if you think being ill is the best way to lose weight! > Atkins and other proponents of a no-carbohydrate diet believe being in > ketosis is desirable - as it leads to lowering of the appetite. " > > This more benign statement from > http://atkins.com/Archive/2002/1/11-257541.html : > > " Ketones are a natural fuel source for the brain and body. Ketones are used > when carbohydrate stores within the body are depleted, resulting in burning > fat for energy instead of glucose. Ketosis is safe in healthy individuals; > however, there are many metabolic abnormalities that produce excess ketones > in the blood. Benign ketosis as experienced on a controlled carbohydrate > intake should not to be confused with ketoacidosis, an elevation in the > acidity of blood, associated with specific disease conditions as noted > above. " > > I have a great highly technical nutrition textbook, which neutrally says > essentially the same thing, but doesn't comment on the Atkins diet. This > textbook talks about the fed state, the postabsorptive state, the fasting > state, and the starvation state. In the last, a " protein-sparing shift from > gluconeogenesis to lipolysis " occurs and " the blood level of fatty acids > increases sharply " . BTW: " The brain cannot use fatty acids for energy " but > it can " oxidize ketones instead of glucose " . There's a long bit about this > process of " favoring the formation ... of ketone bodies " (one of which is > acetone) which leads to ketosis, but spares " valuable protein " in > starvation. My textbook does not distinguish ketosis and ketoacidosis, but > one can infer that it's mainly a matter of degree. Ketosis is dangerous on > several grounds, including acidification generally, but it's what the body > does to barely survive, when starving. > > SUPPOSEDLY this is not so bad WHEN the body has ample other nutrients (i.e. > sort of SIMULATED starvation), but I don't trust this Atkins bit at all. > Especially for mito people. The " burning of fat " that Atkins diet > stimulates > is NECESSITATED by the deliberate forced turn-off of glucose production. > Great, provided your body WILL burn fat. In my body, at least, there is > already way too much triglycerides, i.e. stored fat released into the blood > for use in muscles when " signaled " by needy muscles. This excess occurs > because my muscle cells, though crying for energy, aren't able to properly > metabolize this released fat. So just " backs up " in my blood. > > I know the people on this list have many variations of metabolic > dysfunction, and some here use the Atkins diet. I'm not intending to offend > anyone, or claim superior knowledge. Just my two cents. > > Steve D. > > P.S. Atkins websites have ketone test strips available cheaply, OTC. > > Date: Tue, 08 Mar 2005 04:23:16 -0000 > > Subject: Re: rubbing alcohol smell > > > Here's my question. If you have ketones... what do you do about > it? (I have the acetone smell in my urine on and off). We already > know I've had labs which indicate ketosis but my local doctor didn't > have any suggestions. My mito doctor is investigating a diagnosis- > but didn't specifically address this issue. At least, not that I > recall. > > Maggie > > > > > Good suggestion Malissa. Also, I know my mother used to used > strips you pass thru your urine to test for ketones. I do not use > them, probably should, but I am sure they are available over the > counter. > > > > Janet Sample > > Re: rubbing alcohol smell > > > > > > > > In a message dated 3/7/2005 5:14:34 PM Eastern Standard Time, > > loisanns@e... writes: > > > > I asked the > > pediatrician, he said there > > are diseases that put off a smell, but would have to do some > researching, > > so, I thought > > I would go to the experts. Has anyone ever had this? Any ideas > would be > > appreciated. > > > > > > > > > > HI Lois, > > It's possible that your daughters are producing ketones during > a fever. Nail > > polish remover has acetone in it which is what is also in > ketones, so > > sometimes people can get that type of smell when they are > producing ketones. > > Ketones are also what produces a similar smell in patients with > diabetes, > > especially before or during diabetic ketoacidosis, which is a > life threatening > > condition due to severely high blood sugars. I doubt that's what > is happening with > > your daughters since you said it often occurs during fevers and > they don't > > have diabetes. During fevers, metabolic patients have a harder > type compensating > > due to the physical stress their bodies are under. This can be > precipitated > > by the combination of an increased metabolic rate with the > fever and also the > > fasting which commonly occurs when people are acutely ill and > have decreased > > appetites. When your daughters have another fever and have that > smell, ask > > your doctor to do a urinalysis for ketones and maybe even get > their 3 > > beta-hydroxybutyrate (marker for ketones) tested in their blood. > > > > Hope this helps. > > Malisa > > > > Medical advice, information, opinions, data and statements contained herein > are not necessarily those of the list moderators. The author of this e mail > is entirely responsible for its content. List members are reminded of their > responsibility to evaluate the content of the postings and consult with > their physicians regarding changes in their own treatment. > > Personal attacks are not permitted on the list and anyone who sends one is > automatically moderated or removed depending on the severity of the attack. > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 9, 2005 Report Share Posted March 9, 2005 My mito doc, a neurologist, said it would be a bad idea to try the low carb diet because fat metabolism may be impaired in mito patients. I forget exactly why I disregarded her guidance, but it turns out this diet works for me. My current thought is that I'm low in taurine (an amino acid), which is abundant in red meat. I get reactive hyperglycemia (insulin goes too high after a high carb meal), so I thought it would be a good idea for me to limit my carbs and see what happened. I lost weight and got more stamina. I don't however have any kidney or liver issues, and this has been confirmed since I've been on the Atkins diet for a while. My total cholesterol was a bit raised (220), but my good cholesterol was good (above 40). YMMV. On the other hand, I believe there are several people on this list who have to eat complex carbs many times per day because they'll crash if they don't. It's important to remember we all have disorders of the same organelle, the mitochondria, but saying we all have the same disease may be like saying all thyroid or kidney or liver disease is the same. Regarding ketosis, a low level of it (indicated by a slight color change on a ketostix urine testing strip) isn't a problem for most people. The Atkins diet guidance clearly states that " starvation mode " should be avoided at all costs, as your metabolism will slow and weight will not be lost (in addition to possible health effects). It is unfortunate that there is a lot of info out there being interpreted as black and white, as opposed to fitting some situations and not others. Even the " miracle drug " CoQ10 for mito doesn't work for all people, myself included. FYI - there is a glucose meter that detects blood ketones as well - by Medisense. I have one, have to buy different strips for glucose and ketones. If one is worried about ketones in the blood, I'd suggest looking into it, the cost was about $50 when I bought it about a year ago. http://www.glucerna-precision.com/servlet/nutrio?page=224&cat=0 IMHO, it needs to be understood that ketosis from starvation, i.e., burning of one's own muscle, is different from ketosis from ingested proteins and low carbs. Certainly the latter is the goal of low carb diets. Take care, RH > > > Good suggestion Malissa. Also, I know my mother used to used > > strips you pass thru your urine to test for ketones. I do not use > > them, probably should, but I am sure they are available over the > > counter. > > > > > > Janet Sample > > > Re: rubbing alcohol smell > > > > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 3/7/2005 5:14:34 PM Eastern Standard Time, > > > loisanns@e... writes: > > > > > > I asked the > > > pediatrician, he said there > > > are diseases that put off a smell, but would have to do some > > researching, > > > so, I thought > > > I would go to the experts. Has anyone ever had this? Any ideas > > would be > > > appreciated. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > HI Lois, > > > It's possible that your daughters are producing ketones during > > a fever. Nail > > > polish remover has acetone in it which is what is also in > > ketones, so > > > sometimes people can get that type of smell when they are > > producing ketones. > > > Ketones are also what produces a similar smell in patients with > > diabetes, > > > especially before or during diabetic ketoacidosis, which is a > > life threatening > > > condition due to severely high blood sugars. I doubt that's what > > is happening with > > > your daughters since you said it often occurs during fevers and > > they don't > > > have diabetes. During fevers, metabolic patients have a harder > > type compensating > > > due to the physical stress their bodies are under. This can be > > precipitated > > > by the combination of an increased metabolic rate with the > > fever and also the > > > fasting which commonly occurs when people are acutely ill and > > have decreased > > > appetites. When your daughters have another fever and have that > > smell, ask > > > your doctor to do a urinalysis for ketones and maybe even get > > their 3 > > > beta-hydroxybutyrate (marker for ketones) tested in their blood. > > > > > > Hope this helps. > > > Malisa > > > > > > > > Medical advice, information, opinions, data and statements contained herein > > are not necessarily those of the list moderators. The author of this e mail > > is entirely responsible for its content. List members are reminded of their > > responsibility to evaluate the content of the postings and consult with > > their physicians regarding changes in their own treatment. > > > > Personal attacks are not permitted on the list and anyone who sends one is > > automatically moderated or removed depending on the severity of the attack. > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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