Re: little by little im starting to think..........

[Guest guest]

I'm a little skeptical also about photorderm from

reading the posts. But isn't this how Dr. Nase

finally got rid of his red face or did he use other

stuff?

--- nightrun2200@... wrote:

> photoderm is worthless after 1 or 2 treatments,I

> truly beleive

> photoderm has its limits ,and it is more limited

> than it is being

> advertised. I have had 5 treatments and i have no

> flare ups for about

> a week and a half and then kaboom we are right back

> to normal,yes it

> did clear the superficial vessels ,they were all

> gone after 2

> treatments ,but the flush is going strong and yes he

> used deep flters

> 590 and 645 and high energy,more and more i am

> hearing of people

> having 10 and more treatments possibly chasing an

> unacheivable

> goal ,i am starting to think. pulse dye would have

> been better ,sure

> there is down time but they zap you once wait 3

> weeks zap you again

> and your done ,photoderm drags on and on,and results

> are hard to

> gauge,apparently for me i have complete flush

> clearance for a week to

> a week and a half and then im redder as usual ,its

> like its only good

> for days,I think i will wait for something better to

> come along

> photoderm is too new and all the doctors ,even

> bitter and his

> traineess,I ve been to both ,dont seem to know truly

> how to maximize

> the laser,I am sick of wasting my time and money,i

> think i will try

> the pulse dye,and maybe the nos,because in my

> opiniomn .photoderm

> isnt worth it

>

>

>

> --

> Please read the list highlights before posting to

> the whole group. See http://rosacea.ii.net/toc.html

>

> To leave the list send any email to

> rosacea-support-unsubscribe

>

>

[Guest guest]

I'm a little skeptical also about photorderm from

reading the posts. But isn't this how Dr. Nase

finally got rid of his red face or did he use other

stuff?

--- nightrun2200@... wrote:

> photoderm is worthless after 1 or 2 treatments,I

> truly beleive

> photoderm has its limits ,and it is more limited

> than it is being

> advertised. I have had 5 treatments and i have no

> flare ups for about

> a week and a half and then kaboom we are right back

> to normal,yes it

> did clear the superficial vessels ,they were all

> gone after 2

> treatments ,but the flush is going strong and yes he

> used deep flters

> 590 and 645 and high energy,more and more i am

> hearing of people

> having 10 and more treatments possibly chasing an

> unacheivable

> goal ,i am starting to think. pulse dye would have

> been better ,sure

> there is down time but they zap you once wait 3

> weeks zap you again

> and your done ,photoderm drags on and on,and results

> are hard to

> gauge,apparently for me i have complete flush

> clearance for a week to

> a week and a half and then im redder as usual ,its

> like its only good

> for days,I think i will wait for something better to

> come along

> photoderm is too new and all the doctors ,even

> bitter and his

> traineess,I ve been to both ,dont seem to know truly

> how to maximize

> the laser,I am sick of wasting my time and money,i

> think i will try

> the pulse dye,and maybe the nos,because in my

> opiniomn .photoderm

> isnt worth it

>

>

>

> --

> Please read the list highlights before posting to

> the whole group. See http://rosacea.ii.net/toc.html

>

> To leave the list send any email to

> rosacea-support-unsubscribe

>

>

[Guest guest]

Yes, according to his book it sounds like Photoderm and low-dose

Accutane were two of the biggest contributors to his success. I'm

trying to follow a similar course. Remember, the results can also

depend on the skill of the doctor or technician doing the

treatments. And although finding someone who has been trained by Dr.

Bitter is probably a good place to start, remember the lady who

severely burned one of our members on the chin was supposedly trained

by Dr. Bitter also.

A technician does my treatments but I listened to her explain to

another tech about the method she uses to ensure the amount of

overlapping on the pulses, and how she adjusts the distance between

the skin and the device depending on how the skin starts reacting

during the treatment. She's extremely careful and thorough, and so

far the treatments have been going well. If you search the past

messages here you will find some from people who have achieved a

great deal of success through Photoderm treatments. But like every

other treatment mentioned in this support group, it's probably not

for everyone.

> I'm a little skeptical also about photorderm from

> reading the posts. But isn't this how Dr. Nase

> finally got rid of his red face or did he use other

> stuff?

>

>

[Guest guest]

Yes, according to his book it sounds like Photoderm and low-dose

Accutane were two of the biggest contributors to his success. I'm

trying to follow a similar course. Remember, the results can also

depend on the skill of the doctor or technician doing the

treatments. And although finding someone who has been trained by Dr.

Bitter is probably a good place to start, remember the lady who

severely burned one of our members on the chin was supposedly trained

by Dr. Bitter also.

A technician does my treatments but I listened to her explain to

another tech about the method she uses to ensure the amount of

overlapping on the pulses, and how she adjusts the distance between

the skin and the device depending on how the skin starts reacting

during the treatment. She's extremely careful and thorough, and so

far the treatments have been going well. If you search the past

messages here you will find some from people who have achieved a

great deal of success through Photoderm treatments. But like every

other treatment mentioned in this support group, it's probably not

for everyone.

> I'm a little skeptical also about photorderm from

> reading the posts. But isn't this how Dr. Nase

> finally got rid of his red face or did he use other

> stuff?

>

>

[Guest guest]

As with just about any other rosacea treatment, we all tend to

respond differently to photoderm. I've had 5 treatments, and it's

had a huge impact. My case was extremely severe and literally drove

me underground until after 2 to 3 treatments. After 5, my permanent

dark red mask is completely gone, but I do still have some flushing,

so I plan to have more. I have improved substantially after each and

every treatment. This includes improvement in level of permanent

redness, flushing episodes (frequency, severity and duration),

dryness, flakiness, itchiness, etc.

Unfortunately, it may not work for you. But I wouldn't want to

discourage anyone with severe symptoms from giving it a shot. I have

paid less for 5 treatments with Dr. Bitter than I paid for medicines

and other topical solutions in the three months preceding my

photoderm treatments. If I had to do it all over again, I would have

skipped the meds and topicals and gone straight for the photoderm.

[Guest guest]

-yes thats what he says,like i said i think it helps ,but i also

think it is overrated and only gives 10% of the people or less great

results.,plus the doctors charging $500 for a 30 miute procedure are

really scamming hard,how about cosmetologists charging $500 bucks for

30 mioutes,hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm,that is bogus,they are definitely

overcharging,bitter went from $350 a treatment to $500 just because

he knows people are desperate and guess what you can fly all the way

out to bitterts and end up with his physicians assistant !!!!!

bitters probably on the golf course enjoyong his spoils,i mean come

on that machine pays for itself in a months time,and docs that use

the low seetings or low energy,well they need you to keep coming back

for more and low energy and the wrong filters can get you in there 10

times,or more !!!!!!!the people most happy with photoderm that i have

spoken with always had heavy blistering and bruising,it seems that is

the only way to get optimal results with this machine,yes

downtime,you want the best results you will have to pay,remeber no

side effect no effect,no downtime =no real results,if you walk out of

the office with what looks like a sunburn or heavy flareup,and not a

lot of bruises and some blisters well ,you just had

a $500 worthless facial.

-- In rosacea-support@y..., Zee Golinski wrote:

> I'm a little skeptical also about photorderm from

> reading the posts. But isn't this how Dr. Nase

> finally got rid of his red face or did he use other

> stuff?

>

>

> --- nightrun2200@y... wrote:

> > photoderm is worthless after 1 or 2 treatments,I

> > truly beleive

> > photoderm has its limits ,and it is more limited

> > than it is being

> > advertised. I have had 5 treatments and i have no

> > flare ups for about

> > a week and a half and then kaboom we are right back

> > to normal,yes it

> > did clear the superficial vessels ,they were all

> > gone after 2

> > treatments ,but the flush is going strong and yes he

> > used deep flters

> > 590 and 645 and high energy,more and more i am

> > hearing of people

> > having 10 and more treatments possibly chasing an

> > unacheivable

> > goal ,i am starting to think. pulse dye would have

> > been better ,sure

> > there is down time but they zap you once wait 3

> > weeks zap you again

> > and your done ,photoderm drags on and on,and results

> > are hard to

> > gauge,apparently for me i have complete flush

> > clearance for a week to

> > a week and a half and then im redder as usual ,its

> > like its only good

> > for days,I think i will wait for something better to

> > come along

> > photoderm is too new and all the doctors ,even

> > bitter and his

> > traineess,I ve been to both ,dont seem to know truly

> > how to maximize

> > the laser,I am sick of wasting my time and money,i

> > think i will try

> > the pulse dye,and maybe the nos,because in my

> > opiniomn .photoderm

> > isnt worth it

> >

> >

> >

> > --

> > Please read the list highlights before posting to

> > the whole group. See http://rosacea.ii.net/toc.html

> >

> > To leave the list send any email to

> > rosacea-support-unsubscribe@y...

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

I paid $500 for my first photoderm treatment on face,neck and chest,

last Friday. So far I cannot tell any difference whatsoever. $500

is a lot of money for me and 3 or 4 treatments will be $1500 -

$2000. I wonder how many treatments I should give it? Are there

other people on the board who had 1 or 2 treatments with little

result and then went on to have a better result? I have a very red T-

zone with visible vessels on my nose. Looks exactly the same to me.

> photoderm is worthless after 1 or 2 treatments,I truly beleive

> photoderm has its limits ,and it is more limited than it is being

> advertised. I have had 5 treatments and i have no flare ups for

about

> a week and a half and then kaboom we are right back to normal,yes

it

> did clear the superficial vessels ,they were all gone after 2

> treatments ,but the flush is going strong and yes he used deep

flters

> 590 and 645 and high energy,more and more i am hearing of people

> having 10 and more treatments possibly chasing an unacheivable

> goal ,i am starting to think. pulse dye would have been

better ,sure

> there is down time but they zap you once wait 3 weeks zap you again

> and your done ,photoderm drags on and on,and results are hard to

> gauge,apparently for me i have complete flush clearance for a week

to

> a week and a half and then im redder as usual ,its like its only

good

> for days,I think i will wait for something better to come along

> photoderm is too new and all the doctors ,even bitter and his

> traineess,I ve been to both ,dont seem to know truly how to

maximize

> the laser,I am sick of wasting my time and money,i think i will try

> the pulse dye,and maybe the nos,because in my opiniomn .photoderm

> isnt worth it

[Guest guest]

Nightrun, sounds like Photoderm is definitely not for you, regardless

of the success some people are having. Are you finding something

else that works for you? Anything you can share with all the members

of this group?

> -yes thats what he says,like i said i think it helps ,but i also

> think it is overrated and only gives 10% of the people or less

great

> results.,plus the doctors charging $500 for a 30 miute procedure

are

> really scamming hard,how about cosmetologists charging $500 bucks

for

> 30 mioutes,hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm,that is bogus,they are definitely

> overcharging,bitter went from $350 a treatment to $500 just because

> he knows people are desperate and guess what you can fly all the

way

> out to bitterts and end up with his physicians assistant !!!!!

> bitters probably on the golf course enjoyong his spoils,i mean come

> on that machine pays for itself in a months time,and docs that use

> the low seetings or low energy,well they need you to keep coming

back

> for more and low energy and the wrong filters can get you in there

10

> times,or more !!!!!!!the people most happy with photoderm that i

have

> spoken with always had heavy blistering and bruising,it seems that

is

> the only way to get optimal results with this machine,yes

> downtime,you want the best results you will have to pay,remeber no

> side effect no effect,no downtime =no real results,if you walk out

of

> the office with what looks like a sunburn or heavy flareup,and not

a

> lot of bruises and some blisters well ,you just had

> a $500 worthless facial.

>

>

[Guest guest]

I guess he used several treatments and maybe the

photoderm wasn't the best treatment. I really don't

think I'm ready for that photoderm roller coaster

ride. Maybe someone who's been through the treatment

and haven't really had a bad time can post their

experience. I was also thinking about the PUlse Dye

Laser but on one of my doctor's appointment there was

a patient there that had just had laser treatment.

She had some really bad bruises on her face. I guess

there is no easy way out of this cea.

I'm just fed up with this red face but I don't really

have it too bad and was thinking that maybe I should

get it treated now before it gets worse but I don't

know which treatment is the best.

--- Rlchenault@... wrote:

> he also used pulsed dye and ETS surgery

>

> HAVE A BLESSED DAY, GLORIA:)

>

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Hi,

You are right, there seem to be some people that photoderm is very

ineffective for, I guess with rosaea there is no panacea for all.

However, having acknowledged that I can say that from my personal

experience (i have had over 10 tx's) that I have achieved 100%

clearance of my rosacea. My red face is a very normal colour - olive

like the rest of my body!. The burning has totally gone as has my

sensitivity to many products. The only things that now make me flush

are extreme heat or embarrassement. Photoderm has been the most

amazing treatment for me.

One thing I would like to add is that I have never had a blister or

bruise. I have met a number of rosacea suffers during my tx who

where also getting treated. They too, have had great results 70-100%

clearance on average, without any blistering or bruising. With a

machine capable of thousands of individualised settings I firmly

believe that you do not need to blister or bruise to have great

effects. I and other people at my clinic and on this support group

are testimant to this.

Blistering and bruising risks permant damage to the skin, which could

be worse than rosacea itself. As such, I would caution against this

frame of mind. I personally, feel that photoderm success depends on

the operators skill, you skin, and the number of treatments you have.

I would do it all again in an instant. The money means nothing if

your results are positive. I feel I have reclaimed my life.

Cheers and thanks for the interesting discussion

TS

[Guest guest]

TS,

Can you tell us the name of the clinic you go to and its location? It sounds

like

they are quite successful at treating rosacea.

a

Re: little by little im starting to think..........

>Hi,

>

>You are right, there seem to be some people that photoderm is very

>ineffective for, I guess with rosaea there is no panacea for all.

>However, having acknowledged that I can say that from my personal

>experience (i have had over 10 tx's) that I have achieved 100%

>clearance of my rosacea. My red face is a very normal colour - olive

>like the rest of my body!. The burning has totally gone as has my

>sensitivity to many products. The only things that now make me flush

>are extreme heat or embarrassement. Photoderm has been the most

>amazing treatment for me.

>

>One thing I would like to add is that I have never had a blister or

>bruise. I have met a number of rosacea suffers during my tx who

>where also getting treated. They too, have had great results 70-100%

>clearance on average, without any blistering or bruising. With a

>machine capable of thousands of individualised settings I firmly

>believe that you do not need to blister or bruise to have great

>effects. I and other people at my clinic and on this support group

>are testimant to this.

>

>Blistering and bruising risks permant damage to the skin, which could

>be worse than rosacea itself. As such, I would caution against this

>frame of mind. I personally, feel that photoderm success depends on

>the operators skill, you skin, and the number of treatments you have.

>

>I would do it all again in an instant. The money means nothing if

>your results are positive. I feel I have reclaimed my life.

>

>Cheers and thanks for the interesting discussion

>

>TS

>

>

>

>--

>Please read the list highlights before posting to the whole group. See

http://rosacea.ii.net/toc.html

>

>To leave the list send any email to rosacea-support-unsubscribe

>

>

[Guest guest]

trasmith@... wrote:

You are right, there seem to be some people that

> photoderm is very ineffective for, I guess with

rosaea there is no panacea for all.

My personal theory is that photoderm will be

ineffective for people who have rosacea symptoms

caused by allergy to food, a cosmetic, or environmetal

irritant.

Photoderm can't stop an allergic reaction (maybe makes

it worse in some people?), and that's why the results

aren't as expected.

Unfortunately, doctors don't identify allergies very

well.

If antihistamines control your rosacea well, that may

indicate you're not a good photoderm candidate. That

would be the corollary I'd draw.

Suzi

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

I agree with this, i did not respond to antihistamines at all, and i don't

think my rosacea is affected by food except for spicy food and alcohol. i

think i have some sort of genetic predisposition to rosacea that's not

linked to allergies because i've always had red skin, and have been flushing

for years and years to heat, wind etc. I've had broken capillaries since i

was 11, because i can remember the day someone looked at my face and said i

had broken veins all over my cheeks and they were caused by drinking! i have

also always been quite paranoid of the sun as I have very fair skin that

burns easily so I don't think I have rosacea from sun damage either. It's

just something I've always had. I've now had 3 photoderm treatments in

sydney and i am happy with the results. It has eliminated the daily flushing

i would get around 1 every day, as well as the flushing i always got from

eating any food that was even slightly warm. i still flush a bit from

alcohol but nothing like before. i wouldn't say the result is perfect yet,

however i am very happy so far.rg

>

>To: trasmith@..., rosacea-support

>Subject: Re: little by little im starting to think..........

>Date: Thu, 26 Jul 2001 08:30:43 -0700 (PDT)

>

>trasmith@... wrote:

>You are right, there seem to be some people that

> > photoderm is very ineffective for, I guess with

>rosaea there is no panacea for all.

>

>My personal theory is that photoderm will be

>ineffective for people who have rosacea symptoms

>caused by allergy to food, a cosmetic, or environmetal

>irritant.

>

>Photoderm can't stop an allergic reaction (maybe makes

>it worse in some people?), and that's why the results

>aren't as expected.

>

>Unfortunately, doctors don't identify allergies very

>well.

>

>If antihistamines control your rosacea well, that may

>indicate you're not a good photoderm candidate. That

>would be the corollary I'd draw.

>

>Suzi

>

>__________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

-I posed the question a few posts back which no one answered and I am

still really curious about. My skin did not respond to my $500

photoderm treatment and I am wondering if there are other folks on

this board who started out with no response who later got good

results. One thing I got from the posts is that I will go back to my

dr. and ask him to try some different settings on me. He did one

half of my face and had his technician do the other half, as well as

my neck and chest. She said she had been doing it for 3 years....I

believe he was trained by Dr. Bitter.

I-- In rosacea-support@y..., " Gordon " wrote:

>

> I agree with this, i did not respond to antihistamines at all, and

i don't

> think my rosacea is affected by food except for spicy food and

alcohol. i

> think i have some sort of genetic predisposition to rosacea that's

not

> linked to allergies because i've always had red skin, and have been

flushing

> for years and years to heat, wind etc. I've had broken capillaries

since i

> was 11, because i can remember the day someone looked at my face

and said i

> had broken veins all over my cheeks and they were caused by

drinking! i have

> also always been quite paranoid of the sun as I have very fair skin

that

> burns easily so I don't think I have rosacea from sun damage

either. It's

> just something I've always had. I've now had 3 photoderm treatments

in

> sydney and i am happy with the results. It has eliminated the daily

flushing

> i would get around 1 every day, as well as the flushing i always

got from

> eating any food that was even slightly warm. i still flush a bit

from

> alcohol but nothing like before. i wouldn't say the result is

perfect yet,

> however i am very happy so far.rg

>

> >From: Suzi LeBaron

> >To: trasmith@u..., rosacea-support@y...

> >Subject: Re: little by little im starting to

think..........

> >Date: Thu, 26 Jul 2001 08:30:43 -0700 (PDT)

> >

> >trasmith@u... wrote:

> >You are right, there seem to be some people that

> > > photoderm is very ineffective for, I guess with

> >rosaea there is no panacea for all.

> >

> >My personal theory is that photoderm will be

> >ineffective for people who have rosacea symptoms

> >caused by allergy to food, a cosmetic, or environmetal

> >irritant.

> >

> >Photoderm can't stop an allergic reaction (maybe makes

> >it worse in some people?), and that's why the results

> >aren't as expected.

> >

> >Unfortunately, doctors don't identify allergies very

> >well.

> >

> >If antihistamines control your rosacea well, that may

> >indicate you're not a good photoderm candidate. That

> >would be the corollary I'd draw.

> >

> >Suzi

> >

> >__________________________________________________

> >