Re: Re: not talking

[Guest guest]

I completely disagree. Sorry. I am a speech pathologist. I've used PECS

(picture Exchange Communication System) for years with kids with autism very

successfully. Many children use it as a starter system and begin saying the

words as they hand over the picture. The important part is to do the first

step correctly even if you seem to be there a long time. You want the child to

cognitively figure out how to spontaneously hand over the picture before

moving to choices. Yes, I have used other techniques as well working equally

as

good (signs and natural gestures) For some kids these make more sense,

especially since they are more universally understood. Some considerations

when

choosing between systems is that signs and gestures are always with you and

less cumbersome, but if you have motor planning difficulties signs can be

difficult. All techniques are guides to support eventual verbal output. A

child

waves bye bye before he says it. Just my two cents.

[Guest guest]

Jody,

The program we used for my son did not involve PECS. Our speech path wanted

us to go this route but my Autism Expert from the Option Institute suggested

we start by labelling different object as we took them from the shelf.

The shelf was too high for him to reach so we got everything for him. At

first he would simply look at an object and we would give it to him. We

would hold the object beside our face as we took it down and labelled it.

We never pulled it away from him . We were always user friendly. We wanted

him to experience that he could move his word. The stages he went through

were first looking at the toy, second by taking us to the shelf and putting

our arm up toward the object and eventually he verbalized.

We did a Son-Rise program for 3 years. We did many biomedical interventions

(diet, detox, and supplementation). Tommy was main streamed into school at

grade one and he is now in grade 3.

Laurie

Re: not talking

,

I would ask that PECS not be used.

When my son was younger and was evaluated for using PECS, the SLP said

that there was no way that he should be given the option of using PECS

because he was able to make some verbalizations. She said to build on his

ability to make sounds and not to allow him to use PECS.

That's my experience with PECS.

We did implement a modified PECS system for foods and for places to go

because it made things easier, but I still required him to make some

vocalization to get the food that he pointed to.

We originally used sign language, but that was dropped once he began using

some vocalizations.

Jody

For information on the Specific Carbohydrate Diet, please read the book

_Breaking the Vicious Cycle_ by Elaine Gottschall and read the following

websites:

http://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.info

and

http://www.pecanbread.com

[Guest guest]

Jody,

The program we used for my son did not involve PECS. Our speech path wanted

us to go this route but my Autism Expert from the Option Institute suggested

we start by labelling different object as we took them from the shelf.

The shelf was too high for him to reach so we got everything for him. At

first he would simply look at an object and we would give it to him. We

would hold the object beside our face as we took it down and labelled it.

We never pulled it away from him . We were always user friendly. We wanted

him to experience that he could move his word. The stages he went through

were first looking at the toy, second by taking us to the shelf and putting

our arm up toward the object and eventually he verbalized.

We did a Son-Rise program for 3 years. We did many biomedical interventions

(diet, detox, and supplementation). Tommy was main streamed into school at

grade one and he is now in grade 3.

Laurie

Re: not talking

,

I would ask that PECS not be used.

When my son was younger and was evaluated for using PECS, the SLP said

that there was no way that he should be given the option of using PECS

because he was able to make some verbalizations. She said to build on his

ability to make sounds and not to allow him to use PECS.

That's my experience with PECS.

We did implement a modified PECS system for foods and for places to go

because it made things easier, but I still required him to make some

vocalization to get the food that he pointed to.

We originally used sign language, but that was dropped once he began using

some vocalizations.

Jody

For information on the Specific Carbohydrate Diet, please read the book

_Breaking the Vicious Cycle_ by Elaine Gottschall and read the following

websites:

http://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.info

and

http://www.pecanbread.com

[Guest guest]

Hola:

Donde consigo información de PECS

gracias

DORA INES

-----Mensaje original-----

De: pecanbread [mailto:pecanbread ]En

nombre de Jim & Jennie

Enviado el: Jueves, 22 de Septiembre de 2005 12:59 p.m.

Para: pecanbread

Asunto: Re: Re: not talking

PECS was great for us at first but, Kali just changed from PECS to a

different program that has intensified her verbal learning tremendously in

just 2 weeks! PECS as well as ABA, in my opinion, are there for stepping

stones only.

Re: Re: not talking

> I completely disagree. Sorry. I am a speech pathologist. I've used

PECS

> (picture Exchange Communication System) for years with kids with autism

very

> successfully. Many children use it as a starter system and begin

saying

the

> words as they hand over the picture. The important part is to do the

first

> step correctly even if you seem to be there a long time. You want the

child to

> cognitively figure out how to spontaneously hand over the picture

before

> moving to choices. Yes, I have used other techniques as well working

equally as

> good (signs and natural gestures) For some kids these make more sense,

> especially since they are more universally understood. Some

considerations when

> choosing between systems is that signs and gestures are always with you

and

> less cumbersome, but if you have motor planning difficulties signs can

be

> difficult. All techniques are guides to support eventual verbal

output.

A child

> waves bye bye before he says it. Just my two cents.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

PECS was great for us at first but, Kali just changed from PECS to a

different program that has intensified her verbal learning tremendously in

just 2 weeks! PECS as well as ABA, in my opinion, are there for stepping

stones only.

Re: Re: not talking

> I completely disagree. Sorry. I am a speech pathologist. I've used PECS

> (picture Exchange Communication System) for years with kids with autism

very

> successfully. Many children use it as a starter system and begin saying

the

> words as they hand over the picture. The important part is to do the

first

> step correctly even if you seem to be there a long time. You want the

child to

> cognitively figure out how to spontaneously hand over the picture before

> moving to choices. Yes, I have used other techniques as well working

equally as

> good (signs and natural gestures) For some kids these make more sense,

> especially since they are more universally understood. Some

considerations when

> choosing between systems is that signs and gestures are always with you

and

> less cumbersome, but if you have motor planning difficulties signs can be

> difficult. All techniques are guides to support eventual verbal output.

A child

> waves bye bye before he says it. Just my two cents.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

PECS was great for us at first but, Kali just changed from PECS to a

different program that has intensified her verbal learning tremendously in

just 2 weeks! PECS as well as ABA, in my opinion, are there for stepping

stones only.

Re: Re: not talking

> I completely disagree. Sorry. I am a speech pathologist. I've used PECS

> (picture Exchange Communication System) for years with kids with autism

very

> successfully. Many children use it as a starter system and begin saying

the

> words as they hand over the picture. The important part is to do the

first

> step correctly even if you seem to be there a long time. You want the

child to

> cognitively figure out how to spontaneously hand over the picture before

> moving to choices. Yes, I have used other techniques as well working

equally as

> good (signs and natural gestures) For some kids these make more sense,

> especially since they are more universally understood. Some

considerations when

> choosing between systems is that signs and gestures are always with you

and

> less cumbersome, but if you have motor planning difficulties signs can be

> difficult. All techniques are guides to support eventual verbal output.

A child

> waves bye bye before he says it. Just my two cents.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I agree.I started some verbal behavior techniques withg my daughter over the

summer. She would mand for all her food, some animal toys, books and had some

echoic language. She did not start talking at all on a regular basis until I

started the manding in VBA . I went to fabulous workshop in May. Now the school

is complaining that she is no longer speaking in sentences with PECS. Last year

she used the I want sentence strip in school and did very wellnot talking just

using the pictures to communicate. However there was not much verbal at home

until I started working with her. She was not speaking in sentences just

copying what she was told. There was not functional language being used. Since

she has gone back to school she is not talking again.I cannot get her to mand

for anything and I believe it is because they use PECS at school and it is

easier. Since she was 18mo old they have used that as a first choice of

communication. Teaching her sign and using verbal behavior is very

involved and takes time. The school system does not have that time therefore

they are using the easiest method as opposed to the best method. Signing

illicits much more eye contact and interaction with her than her just handing me

a picture. Unfortuantely, I do not have enough money as do many other parents to

give there child the best so we have to settle for the public education and what

they offer. I think there is gross inadequacy on the part of the school system

as to what services and techniques are used teaching autistic children. Of

course that is where I live.

Thanks for everyones input.

Jim & Jennie jlessard@...> wrote:

PECS was great for us at first but, Kali just changed from PECS to a

different program that has intensified her verbal learning tremendously in

just 2 weeks! PECS as well as ABA, in my opinion, are there for stepping

stones only.

Re: Re: not talking

> I completely disagree. Sorry. I am a speech pathologist. I've used PECS

> (picture Exchange Communication System) for years with kids with autism

very

> successfully. Many children use it as a starter system and begin saying

the

> words as they hand over the picture. The important part is to do the

first

> step correctly even if you seem to be there a long time. You want the

child to

> cognitively figure out how to spontaneously hand over the picture before

> moving to choices. Yes, I have used other techniques as well working

equally as

> good (signs and natural gestures) For some kids these make more sense,

> especially since they are more universally understood. Some

considerations when

> choosing between systems is that signs and gestures are always with you

and

> less cumbersome, but if you have motor planning difficulties signs can be

> difficult. All techniques are guides to support eventual verbal output.

A child

> waves bye bye before he says it. Just my two cents.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I agree with . PECS have been huge for us, but only when they have been

used correctly. Dakota becomes far less verbal to nonverbal the first few

weeks of school therapy programs (he is mostly homeschooled) or when working

with someone knew. After he copes with the transition and he feels

comfortable, the words resume. We have had people only use PECS without

encouraging speech production, and this has backfired. Try to get speech

first, then resort to PECS--even if it is just for clarification. When PECS

are used as a tool to help the kids continue to communicate (times of

increased and profound apraxia, sensory overload, confusion, pre and post

seizure activity, etc.), they greatly reduce stress. With kids with severe

and profound artic. issues and apraxia, the PECS help the kids continue to

communicate without placing the burden of effectively speaking on them.

Teachers, staff, and other children were more likely to communicate with

Dakota when PECS and communication boards are used, they are more relaxed

and work harder to understand him knowing that they probably will with PECS.

It has been the best thing in helping with inclusion. Now kids will

interact with Dakota rather than running/turning away. This then foster to

communicate more with them and language production soared within the group

setting.

This is just our experience, and every kid is different. Obviously, you

have to work with what is best for the family and child and the goals for

the child. www.tacanow.com has an interesting and succinct write-up on PECS

under the therapy link that addresses how they helped one child greatly.

There is a lot out there at other sources.

whole family SCD 2 years

Mom to Dakota (8--NF, BWS, CDD, and seizures)

and (5--happy, healthy, supportive little brother)

[Guest guest]

I agree with . PECS have been huge for us, but only when they have been

used correctly. Dakota becomes far less verbal to nonverbal the first few

weeks of school therapy programs (he is mostly homeschooled) or when working

with someone knew. After he copes with the transition and he feels

comfortable, the words resume. We have had people only use PECS without

encouraging speech production, and this has backfired. Try to get speech

first, then resort to PECS--even if it is just for clarification. When PECS

are used as a tool to help the kids continue to communicate (times of

increased and profound apraxia, sensory overload, confusion, pre and post

seizure activity, etc.), they greatly reduce stress. With kids with severe

and profound artic. issues and apraxia, the PECS help the kids continue to

communicate without placing the burden of effectively speaking on them.

Teachers, staff, and other children were more likely to communicate with

Dakota when PECS and communication boards are used, they are more relaxed

and work harder to understand him knowing that they probably will with PECS.

It has been the best thing in helping with inclusion. Now kids will

interact with Dakota rather than running/turning away. This then foster to

communicate more with them and language production soared within the group

setting.

This is just our experience, and every kid is different. Obviously, you

have to work with what is best for the family and child and the goals for

the child. www.tacanow.com has an interesting and succinct write-up on PECS

under the therapy link that addresses how they helped one child greatly.

There is a lot out there at other sources.

whole family SCD 2 years

Mom to Dakota (8--NF, BWS, CDD, and seizures)

and (5--happy, healthy, supportive little brother)