Re: Relationship of H pylori gut infections and Thyroid Antibodies

[Guest guest]

what is recommended to take for this? is this what you take the gastro ulc (for L. gut) for? where do you get it? do you take anything else other than medication (armour, etc) for thyroid?

thanks.'

gg

From: perfecthealth68@...Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2010 00:32:16 +0000Subject: Relationship of H pylori gut infections and Thyroid Antibodies

Hi All,

Just wanted to give an update. Saw an endocrinologist yesterday and within 5 minutes she diagnosed me with Hashimoto's Thyroiditis. Diagnosis was based on blood work I had 2 years ago indicating elevated thyroid antibodies (something Patty has always suggested be tested...thank you Patty!) as well as symptoms. The doctor said that elevated thyroid antibodies are a clean indicator of Hashi's even if TSH is normal. Unfortunately it's hard to find a doc who knows enough to test for antibodies and then understand what elevated antibodies mean...saw countless docs who acted as if my thyroid is all good and fine despite debilitating symptoms.

Anyway, because I also have leaky gut from h pylori, I was curious how that impacts the thyroid and came across numerous articles discussing a relationship. So if any of you are experiencing gut issues (or not...because depending on where the infection is in the gut can affect level of symptoms), I would have your thyroid antibodies tested as Patty has always suggested from the getgo. Some people don't feel gut symptoms yet have brain fog and I have read that it's because the inflammation in the gut is in an area of the intestines where there are less nerves and they might have infection but just not feel it versus if it's present in the stomach we can feel more aches, pains and bloating.

Here's the medical article/abstract on the connection of h pylori and Hashi's/Thyroid Antibodies.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18271683

Physiol Res. 2008;57 Suppl 1:S135-41. Epub 2008 Feb 13.

Anti-Helicobacter Pylori, anti-thyroid peroxidase, anti-thyroglobulin and anti-gastric parietal cells antibodies in Czech population.

Sterzl I, Hrdá P, Matucha P, Cerovská J, Zamrazil V.

Institute of Endocrinology, Prague, Czech Republic. ister@....cz

Abstract

Autoimmune thyropathies are frequently linked to many infections, such as Helicobacter pylori, which are also supposed to play a role in their pathogenesis. The aim of this study was to evaluate the relationships between thyroid and gastric autoimmunity and H. pylori infection on a large sample of Czech population (n=1621) by monitoring the autoantibodies against thyroglobulin (anti-Tg) and thyroid peroxidase (anti-TPO) and gastric parietal cell (anti-GPC, representing thyrogastric syndrome) in correlation with antibodies against Helicobacter pylori (anti-H. pylori) of classes IgG and IgA. The interrelation between autoantibodies and H. pylori antibodies was assessed by H. pylori seropositivity. In H. pylori seropositive persons as compared to seronegative irrespective of age and sex, a higher occurrence of anti-TPO (10.4 % vs. 5.8 %, p=0.001) and anti-GPC (6.1 % vs. 1.7 %, p<0.001) was found. Differences in anti-TPO occurrence were significant in both men (7.0 % vs. 3.3 %, p=0.03) and women (12.7 % vs. 8.0 %, p=0.02), differences in anti-GPC occurrence were significant only in women (7.2 % vs. 1.7 %, p<0.001). Results of this study support the idea of a connection between infection of H. pylori and the occurrence of anti-TPO autoantibodies representing thyroid autoimmunity and gastric parietal cells autoantibodies representing the thyrogastric syndrome.

Physiol Res. 2008;57 Suppl 1:S135-41. Epub 2008 Feb 13.

[Guest guest]

Hi GG,

I'm not sure where to get the Gastro ULC as I bought it from my chiro. You

might be able to google it and see if it can be bought online. It's made by

Apex Energetics.

No, I'm not taking anything else right now. My thyroid doc wants to start me on

Synthroid if my cortisol test comes out ok. If it doesn't then she will put me

on Armour.

Good Luck!

PH

>

>

> what is recommended to take for this? is this what you take the gastro ulc

(for L. gut) for? where do you get it? do you take anything else other than

medication (armour, etc) for thyroid?

>

>

>

> thanks.'

>

>

>

> gg

>

>

>

>

> From: perfecthealth68@...

> Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2010 00:32:16 +0000

> Subject: Relationship of H pylori gut infections and Thyroid

Antibodies

>

>

>

>

>

>

> Hi All,

>

> Just wanted to give an update. Saw an endocrinologist yesterday and within 5

minutes she diagnosed me with Hashimoto's Thyroiditis. Diagnosis was based on

blood work I had 2 years ago indicating elevated thyroid antibodies (something

Patty has always suggested be tested...thank you Patty!) as well as symptoms.

The doctor said that elevated thyroid antibodies are a clean indicator of

Hashi's even if TSH is normal. Unfortunately it's hard to find a doc who knows

enough to test for antibodies and then understand what elevated antibodies

mean...saw countless docs who acted as if my thyroid is all good and fine

despite debilitating symptoms.

>

> Anyway, because I also have leaky gut from h pylori, I was curious how that

impacts the thyroid and came across numerous articles discussing a relationship.

So if any of you are experiencing gut issues (or not...because depending on

where the infection is in the gut can affect level of symptoms), I would have

your thyroid antibodies tested as Patty has always suggested from the getgo.

Some people don't feel gut symptoms yet have brain fog and I have read that it's

because the inflammation in the gut is in an area of the intestines where there

are less nerves and they might have infection but just not feel it versus if

it's present in the stomach we can feel more aches, pains and bloating.

>

> Here's the medical article/abstract on the connection of h pylori and

Hashi's/Thyroid Antibodies.

>

> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18271683

>

> Physiol Res. 2008;57 Suppl 1:S135-41. Epub 2008 Feb 13.

> Anti-Helicobacter Pylori, anti-thyroid peroxidase, anti-thyroglobulin and

anti-gastric parietal cells antibodies in Czech population.

> Sterzl I, Hrdá P, Matucha P, Cerovská J, Zamrazil V.

> Institute of Endocrinology, Prague, Czech Republic. ister@...

>

> Abstract

> Autoimmune thyropathies are frequently linked to many infections, such as

Helicobacter pylori, which are also supposed to play a role in their

pathogenesis. The aim of this study was to evaluate the relationships between

thyroid and gastric autoimmunity and H. pylori infection on a large sample of

Czech population (n=1621) by monitoring the autoantibodies against thyroglobulin

(anti-Tg) and thyroid peroxidase (anti-TPO) and gastric parietal cell (anti-GPC,

representing thyrogastric syndrome) in correlation with antibodies against

Helicobacter pylori (anti-H. pylori) of classes IgG and IgA. The interrelation

between autoantibodies and H. pylori antibodies was assessed by H. pylori

seropositivity. In H. pylori seropositive persons as compared to seronegative

irrespective of age and sex, a higher occurrence of anti-TPO (10.4 % vs. 5.8 %,

p=0.001) and anti-GPC (6.1 % vs. 1.7 %, p<0.001) was found. Differences in

anti-TPO occurrence were significant in both men (7.0 % vs. 3.3 %, p=0.03) and

women (12.7 % vs. 8.0 %, p=0.02), differences in anti-GPC occurrence were

significant only in women (7.2 % vs. 1.7 %, p<0.001). Results of this study

support the idea of a connection between infection of H. pylori and the

occurrence of anti-TPO autoantibodies representing thyroid autoimmunity and

gastric parietal cells autoantibodies representing the thyrogastric syndrome.

>

> Physiol Res. 2008;57 Suppl 1:S135-41. Epub 2008 Feb 13.

>

[Guest guest]

hi ph;

guess i'm confused - does elevated thyroid antibodies mean you have leaky gut? (there is another test for L. gut - is that how you diagnosed yours?) - and is this treated different than 'low thyroid" for which you also go on thyroid med. like armour - basically, i guess i dont understand the significance of elevated thyroid antibodies in terms of what it means and what to take for it other than the same thing you take for low thyroid.

thanks.

gg

From: perfecthealth68@...Date: Fri, 11 Jun 2010 03:02:27 +0000Subject: Re: Relationship of H pylori gut infections and Thyroid Antibodies

Hi GG,I'm not sure where to get the Gastro ULC as I bought it from my chiro. You might be able to google it and see if it can be bought online. It's made by Apex Energetics.No, I'm not taking anything else right now. My thyroid doc wants to start me on Synthroid if my cortisol test comes out ok. If it doesn't then she will put me on Armour.Good Luck!PH>> > what is recommended to take for this? is this what you take the gastro ulc (for L. gut) for? where do you get it? do you take anything else other than medication (armour, etc) for thyroid?> > > > thanks.'> > > > gg> > > > > From: perfecthealth68@...> Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2010 00:32:16 +0000> Subject: Relationship of H pylori gut infections and Thyroid Antibodies> > > > > > > Hi All,> > Just wanted to give an update. Saw an endocrinologist yesterday and within 5 minutes she diagnosed me with Hashimoto's Thyroiditis. Diagnosis was based on blood work I had 2 years ago indicating elevated thyroid antibodies (something Patty has always suggested be tested...thank you Patty!) as well as symptoms. The doctor said that elevated thyroid antibodies are a clean indicator of Hashi's even if TSH is normal. Unfortunately it's hard to find a doc who knows enough to test for antibodies and then understand what elevated antibodies mean...saw countless docs who acted as if my thyroid is all good and fine despite debilitating symptoms. > > Anyway, because I also have leaky gut from h pylori, I was curious how that impacts the thyroid and came across numerous articles discussing a relationship. So if any of you are experiencing gut issues (or not...because depending on where the infection is in the gut can affect level of symptoms), I would have your thyroid antibodies tested as Patty has always suggested from the getgo. Some people don't feel gut symptoms yet have brain fog and I have read that it's because the inflammation in the gut is in an area of the intestines where there are less nerves and they might have infection but just not feel it versus if it's present in the stomach we can feel more aches, pains and bloating.> > Here's the medical article/abstract on the connection of h pylori and Hashi's/Thyroid Antibodies.> > http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18271683> > Physiol Res. 2008;57 Suppl 1:S135-41. Epub 2008 Feb 13.> Anti-Helicobacter Pylori, anti-thyroid peroxidase, anti-thyroglobulin and anti-gastric parietal cells antibodies in Czech population.> Sterzl I, Hrdá P, Matucha P, Cerovská J, Zamrazil V.> Institute of Endocrinology, Prague, Czech Republic. ister@...> > Abstract> Autoimmune thyropathies are frequently linked to many infections, such as Helicobacter pylori, which are also supposed to play a role in their pathogenesis. The aim of this study was to evaluate the relationships between thyroid and gastric autoimmunity and H. pylori infection on a large sample of Czech population (n=1621) by monitoring the autoantibodies against thyroglobulin (anti-Tg) and thyroid peroxidase (anti-TPO) and gastric parietal cell (anti-GPC, representing thyrogastric syndrome) in correlation with antibodies against Helicobacter pylori (anti-H. pylori) of classes IgG and IgA. The interrelation between autoantibodies and H. pylori antibodies was assessed by H. pylori seropositivity. In H. pylori seropositive persons as compared to seronegative irrespective of age and sex, a higher occurrence of anti-TPO (10.4 % vs. 5.8 %, p=0.001) and anti-GPC (6.1 % vs. 1.7 %, p<0.001) was found. Differences in anti-TPO occurrence were significant in both men (7.0 % vs. 3.3 %, p=0.03) and women (12.7 % vs. 8.0 %, p=0.02), differences in anti-GPC occurrence were significant only in women (7.2 % vs. 1.7 %, p<0.001). Results of this study support the idea of a connection between infection of H. pylori and the occurrence of anti-TPO autoantibodies representing thyroid autoimmunity and gastric parietal cells autoantibodies representing the thyrogastric syndrome.> > Physiol Res. 2008;57 Suppl 1:S135-41. Epub 2008 Feb 13.>

[Guest guest]

PH,

I am just so pleased that you have finally found a doctor who is astute enough

to understand your test results! I have been praying that you would get some

answers that would help you.

What has she recommended for you as far as treatment?

I'm continuing to pray that you will feel better and better!

Hugs,

Patty

>

>

> Hi All,

>

> Just wanted to give an update. Saw an endocrinologist yesterday and

> within 5 minutes she diagnosed me with Hashimoto's Thyroiditis.

> Diagnosis was based on blood work I had 2 years ago indicating elevated

> thyroid antibodies (something Patty has always suggested be

> tested...thank you Patty!) as well as symptoms. The doctor said that

> elevated thyroid antibodies are a clean indicator of Hashi's even if TSH

> is normal. Unfortunately it's hard to find a doc who knows enough to

> test for antibodies and then understand what elevated antibodies

> mean...saw countless docs who acted as if my thyroid is all good and

> fine despite debilitating symptoms.

>

> Anyway, because I also have leaky gut from h pylori, I was curious how

> that impacts the thyroid and came across numerous articles discussing a

> relationship. So if any of you are experiencing gut issues (or

> not...because depending on where the infection is in the gut can affect

> level of symptoms), I would have your thyroid antibodies tested as Patty

> has always suggested from the getgo. Some people don't feel gut

> symptoms yet have brain fog and I have read that it's because the

> inflammation in the gut is in an area of the intestines where there are

> less nerves and they might have infection but just not feel it versus if

> it's present in the stomach we can feel more aches, pains and bloating.

>

> Here's the medical article/abstract on the connection of h pylori and

> Hashi's/Thyroid Antibodies.

>

> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18271683

> <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18271683>

>

> Physiol Res. 2008;57 Suppl 1:S135-41. Epub 2008 Feb 13.

> Anti-Helicobacter Pylori, anti-thyroid peroxidase, anti-thyroglobulin

> and anti-gastric parietal cells antibodies in Czech population.

> Sterzl I </pubmed?term=%22Sterzl%20I%22%5BAuthor%5D> , Hrdá P

> </pubmed?term=%22Hrd%C3%A1%20P%22%5BAuthor%5D> , Matucha P

> </pubmed?term=%22Matucha%20P%22%5BAuthor%5D> , Cerovská J

> </pubmed?term=%22Cerovsk%C3%A1%20J%22%5BAuthor%5D> , Zamrazil V

> </pubmed?term=%22Zamrazil%20V%22%5BAuthor%5D> .

>

> Institute of Endocrinology, Prague, Czech Republic. ister@...

> Abstract

> Autoimmune thyropathies are frequently linked to many infections, such

> as Helicobacter pylori, which are also supposed to play a role in their

> pathogenesis. The aim of this study was to evaluate the relationships

> between thyroid and gastric autoimmunity and H. pylori infection on a

> large sample of Czech population (n=1621) by monitoring the

> autoantibodies against thyroglobulin (anti-Tg) and thyroid peroxidase

> (anti-TPO) and gastric parietal cell (anti-GPC, representing

> thyrogastric syndrome) in correlation with antibodies against

> Helicobacter pylori (anti-H. pylori) of classes IgG and IgA. The

> interrelation between autoantibodies and H. pylori antibodies was

> assessed by H. pylori seropositivity. In H. pylori seropositive persons

> as compared to seronegative irrespective of age and sex, a higher

> occurrence of anti-TPO (10.4 % vs. 5.8 %, p=0.001) and anti-GPC (6.1 %

> vs. 1.7 %, p<0.001) was found. Differences in anti-TPO occurrence were

> significant in both men (7.0 % vs. 3.3 %, p=0.03) and women (12.7 % vs.

> 8.0 %, p=0.02), differences in anti-GPC occurrence were significant only

> in women (7.2 % vs. 1.7 %, p<0.001). Results of this study support the

> idea of a connection between infection of H. pylori and the occurrence

> of anti-TPO autoantibodies representing thyroid autoimmunity and gastric

> parietal cells autoantibodies representing the thyrogastric syndrome.

>

> Physiol Res. 2008;57 Suppl 1:S135-41. Epub 2008 Feb 13.

>

[Guest guest]

Smart, smart doctor!!!! Most docs don't know that they need to monitor the

adrenal function before they address correct thyroid treatment. However, I am

wondering about the Armour vs Synthroid treatment? I thought it was the

reverse...that if there are indications of adrenal involvement, Synthroid should

be used....if no adrenal problems, Armour should be used...

Synthroid is T4 only, while Armour is T3 plus T4. T4 converts to T3 in the

body...

anyway, I am so happy that you will FINALLY get some help that may make a HUGE

difference for you!

Please keep us posted!

Also, be sure to give the new thyroid meds some time to work....you may feel

kind of icky the first week or so, until your body adjusts...just my experience.

Love you!

Patty

> >

> >

> > what is recommended to take for this? is this what you take the gastro ulc

(for L. gut) for? where do you get it? do you take anything else other than

medication (armour, etc) for thyroid?

> >

> >

> >

> > thanks.'

> >

> >

> >

> > gg

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > From: perfecthealth68@

> > Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2010 00:32:16 +0000

> > Subject: Relationship of H pylori gut infections and Thyroid

Antibodies

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Hi All,

> >

> > Just wanted to give an update. Saw an endocrinologist yesterday and within

5 minutes she diagnosed me with Hashimoto's Thyroiditis. Diagnosis was based on

blood work I had 2 years ago indicating elevated thyroid antibodies (something

Patty has always suggested be tested...thank you Patty!) as well as symptoms.

The doctor said that elevated thyroid antibodies are a clean indicator of

Hashi's even if TSH is normal. Unfortunately it's hard to find a doc who knows

enough to test for antibodies and then understand what elevated antibodies

mean...saw countless docs who acted as if my thyroid is all good and fine

despite debilitating symptoms.

> >

> > Anyway, because I also have leaky gut from h pylori, I was curious how that

impacts the thyroid and came across numerous articles discussing a relationship.

So if any of you are experiencing gut issues (or not...because depending on

where the infection is in the gut can affect level of symptoms), I would have

your thyroid antibodies tested as Patty has always suggested from the getgo.

Some people don't feel gut symptoms yet have brain fog and I have read that it's

because the inflammation in the gut is in an area of the intestines where there

are less nerves and they might have infection but just not feel it versus if

it's present in the stomach we can feel more aches, pains and bloating.

> >

> > Here's the medical article/abstract on the connection of h pylori and

Hashi's/Thyroid Antibodies.

> >

> > http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18271683

> >

> > Physiol Res. 2008;57 Suppl 1:S135-41. Epub 2008 Feb 13.

> > Anti-Helicobacter Pylori, anti-thyroid peroxidase, anti-thyroglobulin and

anti-gastric parietal cells antibodies in Czech population.

> > Sterzl I, Hrdá P, Matucha P, Cerovská J, Zamrazil V.

> > Institute of Endocrinology, Prague, Czech Republic. ister@

> >

> > Abstract

> > Autoimmune thyropathies are frequently linked to many infections, such as

Helicobacter pylori, which are also supposed to play a role in their

pathogenesis. The aim of this study was to evaluate the relationships between

thyroid and gastric autoimmunity and H. pylori infection on a large sample of

Czech population (n=1621) by monitoring the autoantibodies against thyroglobulin

(anti-Tg) and thyroid peroxidase (anti-TPO) and gastric parietal cell (anti-GPC,

representing thyrogastric syndrome) in correlation with antibodies against

Helicobacter pylori (anti-H. pylori) of classes IgG and IgA. The interrelation

between autoantibodies and H. pylori antibodies was assessed by H. pylori

seropositivity. In H. pylori seropositive persons as compared to seronegative

irrespective of age and sex, a higher occurrence of anti-TPO (10.4 % vs. 5.8 %,

p=0.001) and anti-GPC (6.1 % vs. 1.7 %, p<0.001) was found. Differences in

anti-TPO occurrence were significant in both men (7.0 % vs. 3.3 %, p=0.03) and

women (12.7 % vs. 8.0 %, p=0.02), differences in anti-GPC occurrence were

significant only in women (7.2 % vs. 1.7 %, p<0.001). Results of this study

support the idea of a connection between infection of H. pylori and the

occurrence of anti-TPO autoantibodies representing thyroid autoimmunity and

gastric parietal cells autoantibodies representing the thyrogastric syndrome.

> >

> > Physiol Res. 2008;57 Suppl 1:S135-41. Epub 2008 Feb 13.

> >

>

[Guest guest]

GG,

Elevated thyroid antibodies means that your own immune system is producing

soldiers/warrior cells to attack your thyroid. It is an autoimmune disease.

What it means is that as your thyroid is attacked, it needs to work harder.

Eventually, as the attack remains prolonged, your thyroid will exhaust itself,

and gradually work less efficiently. Some attacks are more serious than others,

and those with flaring Hashimoto's will feel particularly awful.

In terms of treatment, some people with milder Hashimoto's don't have a reduced

TSH, and therefore the docs won't see a need for treatment with thyroid hormone.

But it doesn't mean that you won't ever need it....you must be monitored to see

how your body is dealing with the autoimmunity and at some point, the thyroid

becomes weakened enough that you must go on meds.

Antibodies can take two forms: Anti TPO, which is anti thyroperoxidase, and

AntiTg, which is anti-thyroglobulin. That is why it is necessary to have BOTH

tests done when testing for autoimmune thyroid disease, because you can have one

normal and the other off.

Autoimmune diseases are said to be incurable, so once you are diagnosed with

Hashimoto's, you have it for life.

However, there are some people who have claimed to be cured of Hashimoto's (I

recall a book I bought on Amazon.com about a guy who claimed he cured it through

diet.)

My last test results showed that I had no thyroid antibodies!! I originally had

anti-TPO antibodies, so this was a nice surprise. How did I cure it? (Did I

cure it?) I have no idea, except constant dedication to detoxing and healthy

eating.

Patty

> >

> >

> > what is recommended to take for this? is this what you take the gastro ulc

(for L. gut) for? where do you get it? do you take anything else other than

medication (armour, etc) for thyroid?

> >

> >

> >

> > thanks.'

> >

> >

> >

> > gg

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > From: perfecthealth68@

> > Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2010 00:32:16 +0000

> > Subject: Relationship of H pylori gut infections and Thyroid

Antibodies

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Hi All,

> >

> > Just wanted to give an update. Saw an endocrinologist yesterday and within 5

minutes she diagnosed me with Hashimoto's Thyroiditis. Diagnosis was based on

blood work I had 2 years ago indicating elevated thyroid antibodies (something

Patty has always suggested be tested...thank you Patty!) as well as symptoms.

The doctor said that elevated thyroid antibodies are a clean indicator of

Hashi's even if TSH is normal. Unfortunately it's hard to find a doc who knows

enough to test for antibodies and then understand what elevated antibodies

mean...saw countless docs who acted as if my thyroid is all good and fine

despite debilitating symptoms.

> >

> > Anyway, because I also have leaky gut from h pylori, I was curious how that

impacts the thyroid and came across numerous articles discussing a relationship.

So if any of you are experiencing gut issues (or not...because depending on

where the infection is in the gut can affect level of symptoms), I would have

your thyroid antibodies tested as Patty has always suggested from the getgo.

Some people don't feel gut symptoms yet have brain fog and I have read that it's

because the inflammation in the gut is in an area of the intestines where there

are less nerves and they might have infection but just not feel it versus if

it's present in the stomach we can feel more aches, pains and bloating.

> >

> > Here's the medical article/abstract on the connection of h pylori and

Hashi's/Thyroid Antibodies.

> >

> > http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18271683

> >

> > Physiol Res. 2008;57 Suppl 1:S135-41. Epub 2008 Feb 13.

> > Anti-Helicobacter Pylori, anti-thyroid peroxidase, anti-thyroglobulin and

anti-gastric parietal cells antibodies in Czech population.

> > Sterzl I, Hrdá P, Matucha P, Cerovská J, Zamrazil V.

> > Institute of Endocrinology, Prague, Czech Republic. ister@

> >

> > Abstract

> > Autoimmune thyropathies are frequently linked to many infections, such as

Helicobacter pylori, which are also supposed to play a role in their

pathogenesis. The aim of this study was to evaluate the relationships between

thyroid and gastric autoimmunity and H. pylori infection on a large sample of

Czech population (n=1621) by monitoring the autoantibodies against thyroglobulin

(anti-Tg) and thyroid peroxidase (anti-TPO) and gastric parietal cell (anti-GPC,

representing thyrogastric syndrome) in correlation with antibodies against

Helicobacter pylori (anti-H. pylori) of classes IgG and IgA. The interrelation

between autoantibodies and H. pylori antibodies was assessed by H. pylori

seropositivity. In H. pylori seropositive persons as compared to seronegative

irrespective of age and sex, a higher occurrence of anti-TPO (10.4 % vs. 5.8 %,

p=0.001) and anti-GPC (6.1 % vs. 1.7 %, p<0.001) was found. Differences in

anti-TPO occurrence were significant in both men (7.0 % vs. 3.3 %, p=0.03) and

women (12.7 % vs. 8.0 %, p=0.02), differences in anti-GPC occurrence were

significant only in women (7.2 % vs. 1.7 %, p<0.001). Results of this study

support the idea of a connection between infection of H. pylori and the

occurrence of anti-TPO autoantibodies representing thyroid autoimmunity and

gastric parietal cells autoantibodies representing the thyrogastric syndrome.

> >

> > Physiol Res. 2008;57 Suppl 1:S135-41. Epub 2008 Feb 13.

> >

>

[Guest guest]

you're saying a few different things here and i'm trying to keep it all straight - starting with step 1 - you go to your doc, you tell him youwant test for hashimotos which i'm assuming he knows is testing for elevated thyroid antibodies ; do you have to tell him to do anti tpo and anti tg? does he only look for reduced tsh when prescribing meds or determing if you have elevated antibodies?

i've had autoimmune testing done (in general i think) and was found to have it when i first got the silicone, but when it was cut out, the autoimmune went speckled and then finallly disapeared. i assume this isnt what youre talking about, but a more specific test called the hashimotos.

sorry, its all very confusing. there are thyroid issues in the family, and think there is also leaky gut. also seems like youre connecting L.gut to hashimotos. right?

whats then different about the tests for 'low thyroid'?

thanks patty.

From: glory2glory1401@...Date: Fri, 11 Jun 2010 19:21:36 +0000Subject: Re: Relationship of H pylori gut infections and Thyroid Antibodies

GG,Elevated thyroid antibodies means that your own immune system is producing soldiers/warrior cells to attack your thyroid. It is an autoimmune disease.What it means is that as your thyroid is attacked, it needs to work harder. Eventually, as the attack remains prolonged, your thyroid will exhaust itself, and gradually work less efficiently. Some attacks are more serious than others, and those with flaring Hashimoto's will feel particularly awful.In terms of treatment, some people with milder Hashimoto's don't have a reduced TSH, and therefore the docs won't see a need for treatment with thyroid hormone. But it doesn't mean that you won't ever need it....you must be monitored to see how your body is dealing with the autoimmunity and at some point, the thyroid becomes weakened enough that you must go on meds.Antibodies can take two forms: Anti TPO, which is anti thyroperoxidase, and AntiTg, which is anti-thyroglobulin. That is why it is necessary to have BOTH tests done when testing for autoimmune thyroid disease, because you can have one normal and the other off. Autoimmune diseases are said to be incurable, so once you are diagnosed with Hashimoto's, you have it for life.However, there are some people who have claimed to be cured of Hashimoto's (I recall a book I bought on Amazon.com about a guy who claimed he cured it through diet.)My last test results showed that I had no thyroid antibodies!! I originally had anti-TPO antibodies, so this was a nice surprise. How did I cure it? (Did I cure it?) I have no idea, except constant dedication to detoxing and healthy eating.Patty> >> > > > what is recommended to take for this? is this what you take the gastro ulc (for L. gut) for? where do you get it? do you take anything else other than medication (armour, etc) for thyroid?> > > > > > > > thanks.'> > > > > > > > gg> > > > > > > > > > From: perfecthealth68@> > Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2010 00:32:16 +0000> > Subject: Relationship of H pylori gut infections and Thyroid Antibodies> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi All,> > > > Just wanted to give an update. Saw an endocrinologist yesterday and within 5 minutes she diagnosed me with Hashimoto's Thyroiditis. Diagnosis was based on blood work I had 2 years ago indicating elevated thyroid antibodies (something Patty has always suggested be tested...thank you Patty!) as well as symptoms. The doctor said that elevated thyroid antibodies are a clean indicator of Hashi's even if TSH is normal. Unfortunately it's hard to find a doc who knows enough to test for antibodies and then understand what elevated antibodies mean...saw countless docs who acted as if my thyroid is all good and fine despite debilitating symptoms. > > > > Anyway, because I also have leaky gut from h pylori, I was curious how that impacts the thyroid and came across numerous articles discussing a relationship. So if any of you are experiencing gut issues (or not...because depending on where the infection is in the gut can affect level of symptoms), I would have your thyroid antibodies tested as Patty has always suggested from the getgo. Some people don't feel gut symptoms yet have brain fog and I have read that it's because the inflammation in the gut is in an area of the intestines where there are less nerves and they might have infection but just not feel it versus if it's present in the stomach we can feel more aches, pains and bloating.> > > > Here's the medical article/abstract on the connection of h pylori and Hashi's/Thyroid Antibodies.> > > > http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18271683> > > > Physiol Res. 2008;57 Suppl 1:S135-41. Epub 2008 Feb 13.> > Anti-Helicobacter Pylori, anti-thyroid peroxidase, anti-thyroglobulin and anti-gastric parietal cells antibodies in Czech population.> > Sterzl I, Hrdá P, Matucha P, Cerovská J, Zamrazil V.> > Institute of Endocrinology, Prague, Czech Republic. ister@> > > > Abstract> > Autoimmune thyropathies are frequently linked to many infections, such as Helicobacter pylori, which are also supposed to play a role in their pathogenesis. The aim of this study was to evaluate the relationships between thyroid and gastric autoimmunity and H. pylori infection on a large sample of Czech population (n=1621) by monitoring the autoantibodies against thyroglobulin (anti-Tg) and thyroid peroxidase (anti-TPO) and gastric parietal cell (anti-GPC, representing thyrogastric syndrome) in correlation with antibodies against Helicobacter pylori (anti-H. pylori) of classes IgG and IgA. The interrelation between autoantibodies and H. pylori antibodies was assessed by H. pylori seropositivity. In H. pylori seropositive persons as compared to seronegative irrespective of age and sex, a higher occurrence of anti-TPO (10.4 % vs. 5.8 %, p=0.001) and anti-GPC (6.1 % vs. 1.7 %, p<0.001) was found. Differences in anti-TPO occurrence were significant in both men (7.0 % vs. 3.3 %, p=0.03) and women (12.7 % vs. 8.0 %, p=0.02), differences in anti-GPC occurrence were significant only in women (7.2 % vs. 1.7 %, p<0.001). Results of this study support the idea of a connection between infection of H. pylori and the occurrence of anti-TPO autoantibodies representing thyroid autoimmunity and gastric parietal cells autoantibodies representing the thyrogastric syndrome.> > > > Physiol Res. 2008;57 Suppl 1:S135-41. Epub 2008 Feb 13.> >>

[Guest guest]

Hi GG,

Sorry...I never got your last post. I'm on the forum in a hit or miss like

fashion. Yes, from everything I have I do think Hashi's is connected to leaky

gut. The more I read, I think all degenerative and autoimmune illnesses are

created from pathogens, metals, toxins in the gut. So much of our hormones,

neurotransmitters and enzymes are produced in the gut. When an infection occurs

and creates leaky gut our body can no longer receive the proper signals from the

body in order to function.

For example, there is an enzyme called DMT which is located in the gut and helps

the body excrete heavy metals. If a gut infection is present, the DMT enzyme is

wiped out and heavy metals increase in the body. Given that implants are made of

heavy metal catalysts, it becomes a vicious cycle...heavy metals increase

infection and infection increases heavy metals. That's why so many of us have

high levels of heavy metals and inflammation.

So in answer to your question, I wish I would have pursued the thyroid

antibodies test sooner and pressed to find a doc who understood HOW to test

thyroid antibodies and HOW to treat. It's sad but I think one reason I finally

found one is that this last time I didn't mention a thing about implants.

Before when I would mention it every doc would roll their eyes and not take me

seriously from that point on. Now that my thyroid is going to be treated that

should help clean the gut (with diet and cleansing)...have read that thyroid

hormone modulates parasitic levels in the gut.

Love,

PH

> > >

> > >

> > > what is recommended to take for this? is this what you take the gastro ulc

(for L. gut) for? where do you get it? do you take anything else other than

medication (armour, etc) for thyroid?

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > thanks.'

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > gg

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > From: perfecthealth68@

> > > Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2010 00:32:16 +0000

> > > Subject: Relationship of H pylori gut infections and

Thyroid Antibodies

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Hi All,

> > >

> > > Just wanted to give an update. Saw an endocrinologist yesterday and within

5 minutes she diagnosed me with Hashimoto's Thyroiditis. Diagnosis was based on

blood work I had 2 years ago indicating elevated thyroid antibodies (something

Patty has always suggested be tested...thank you Patty!) as well as symptoms.

The doctor said that elevated thyroid antibodies are a clean indicator of

Hashi's even if TSH is normal. Unfortunately it's hard to find a doc who knows

enough to test for antibodies and then understand what elevated antibodies

mean...saw countless docs who acted as if my thyroid is all good and fine

despite debilitating symptoms.

> > >

> > > Anyway, because I also have leaky gut from h pylori, I was curious how

that impacts the thyroid and came across numerous articles discussing a

relationship. So if any of you are experiencing gut issues (or not...because

depending on where the infection is in the gut can affect level of symptoms), I

would have your thyroid antibodies tested as Patty has always suggested from the

getgo. Some people don't feel gut symptoms yet have brain fog and I have read

that it's because the inflammation in the gut is in an area of the intestines

where there are less nerves and they might have infection but just not feel it

versus if it's present in the stomach we can feel more aches, pains and

bloating.

> > >

> > > Here's the medical article/abstract on the connection of h pylori and

Hashi's/Thyroid Antibodies.

> > >

> > > http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18271683

> > >

> > > Physiol Res. 2008;57 Suppl 1:S135-41. Epub 2008 Feb 13.

> > > Anti-Helicobacter Pylori, anti-thyroid peroxidase, anti-thyroglobulin and

anti-gastric parietal cells antibodies in Czech population.

> > > Sterzl I, Hrdá P, Matucha P, Cerovská J, Zamrazil V.

> > > Institute of Endocrinology, Prague, Czech Republic. ister@

> > >

> > > Abstract

> > > Autoimmune thyropathies are frequently linked to many infections, such as

Helicobacter pylori, which are also supposed to play a role in their

pathogenesis. The aim of this study was to evaluate the relationships between

thyroid and gastric autoimmunity and H. pylori infection on a large sample of

Czech population (n=1621) by monitoring the autoantibodies against thyroglobulin

(anti-Tg) and thyroid peroxidase (anti-TPO) and gastric parietal cell (anti-GPC,

representing thyrogastric syndrome) in correlation with antibodies against

Helicobacter pylori (anti-H. pylori) of classes IgG and IgA. The interrelation

between autoantibodies and H. pylori antibodies was assessed by H. pylori

seropositivity. In H. pylori seropositive persons as compared to seronegative

irrespective of age and sex, a higher occurrence of anti-TPO (10.4 % vs. 5.8 %,

p=0.001) and anti-GPC (6.1 % vs. 1.7 %, p<0.001) was found. Differences in

anti-TPO occurrence were significant in both men (7.0 % vs. 3.3 %, p=0.03) and

women (12.7 % vs. 8.0 %, p=0.02), differences in anti-GPC occurrence were

significant only in women (7.2 % vs. 1.7 %, p<0.001). Results of this study

support the idea of a connection between infection of H. pylori and the

occurrence of anti-TPO autoantibodies representing thyroid autoimmunity and

gastric parietal cells autoantibodies representing the thyrogastric syndrome.

> > >

> > > Physiol Res. 2008;57 Suppl 1:S135-41. Epub 2008 Feb 13.

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Thank you Patty! If it wasn't for you, I'd probably still be wondering the

earth trying to figure out what was wrong with me! I'm not sure about Synthroid

vs Armour and adrenal function. I should read about it. It's so hard to read

when my head constantly hurts though and vision is a mess! I do know that I

have high Reverse T3. Do you know anything about that?

All I can say is it is a relief to know that I am finally going to get the

proper treatment I need!

Thanks for the advice on giving the meds time. My doc said to give the meds 6

weeks before we retest to see if anything changes either by blood or symptoms.

Love,

PH

> > >

> > >

> > > what is recommended to take for this? is this what you take the gastro

ulc (for L. gut) for? where do you get it? do you take anything else other

than medication (armour, etc) for thyroid?

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > thanks.'

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > gg

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > From: perfecthealth68@

> > > Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2010 00:32:16 +0000

> > > Subject: Relationship of H pylori gut infections and

Thyroid Antibodies

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Hi All,

> > >

> > > Just wanted to give an update. Saw an endocrinologist yesterday and

within 5 minutes she diagnosed me with Hashimoto's Thyroiditis. Diagnosis was

based on blood work I had 2 years ago indicating elevated thyroid antibodies

(something Patty has always suggested be tested...thank you Patty!) as well as

symptoms. The doctor said that elevated thyroid antibodies are a clean

indicator of Hashi's even if TSH is normal. Unfortunately it's hard to find a

doc who knows enough to test for antibodies and then understand what elevated

antibodies mean...saw countless docs who acted as if my thyroid is all good and

fine despite debilitating symptoms.

> > >

> > > Anyway, because I also have leaky gut from h pylori, I was curious how

that impacts the thyroid and came across numerous articles discussing a

relationship. So if any of you are experiencing gut issues (or not...because

depending on where the infection is in the gut can affect level of symptoms), I

would have your thyroid antibodies tested as Patty has always suggested from the

getgo. Some people don't feel gut symptoms yet have brain fog and I have read

that it's because the inflammation in the gut is in an area of the intestines

where there are less nerves and they might have infection but just not feel it

versus if it's present in the stomach we can feel more aches, pains and

bloating.

> > >

> > > Here's the medical article/abstract on the connection of h pylori and

Hashi's/Thyroid Antibodies.

> > >

> > > http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18271683

> > >

> > > Physiol Res. 2008;57 Suppl 1:S135-41. Epub 2008 Feb 13.

> > > Anti-Helicobacter Pylori, anti-thyroid peroxidase, anti-thyroglobulin and

anti-gastric parietal cells antibodies in Czech population.

> > > Sterzl I, Hrdá P, Matucha P, Cerovská J, Zamrazil V.

> > > Institute of Endocrinology, Prague, Czech Republic. ister@

> > >

> > > Abstract

> > > Autoimmune thyropathies are frequently linked to many infections, such as

Helicobacter pylori, which are also supposed to play a role in their

pathogenesis. The aim of this study was to evaluate the relationships between

thyroid and gastric autoimmunity and H. pylori infection on a large sample of

Czech population (n=1621) by monitoring the autoantibodies against thyroglobulin

(anti-Tg) and thyroid peroxidase (anti-TPO) and gastric parietal cell (anti-GPC,

representing thyrogastric syndrome) in correlation with antibodies against

Helicobacter pylori (anti-H. pylori) of classes IgG and IgA. The interrelation

between autoantibodies and H. pylori antibodies was assessed by H. pylori

seropositivity. In H. pylori seropositive persons as compared to seronegative

irrespective of age and sex, a higher occurrence of anti-TPO (10.4 % vs. 5.8 %,

p=0.001) and anti-GPC (6.1 % vs. 1.7 %, p<0.001) was found. Differences in

anti-TPO occurrence were significant in both men (7.0 % vs. 3.3 %, p=0.03) and

women (12.7 % vs. 8.0 %, p=0.02), differences in anti-GPC occurrence were

significant only in women (7.2 % vs. 1.7 %, p<0.001). Results of this study

support the idea of a connection between infection of H. pylori and the

occurrence of anti-TPO autoantibodies representing thyroid autoimmunity and

gastric parietal cells autoantibodies representing the thyrogastric syndrome.

> > >

> > > Physiol Res. 2008;57 Suppl 1:S135-41. Epub 2008 Feb 13.

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

hi ph;

i agree that toxins metals and parasites cause problems, but what exactly does the word INFECTION mean? i think of antibiotics when i think infection. where did you hear about the DMT enzyme and what it does?

a family member is on thyroid hormone and still has gut (allergys, etc.) problems. was it curezone that gave info. on thyroid vs. gut? i'm a little hesitant on this one. i know organs are all related to some extent, but it seems they need more testing or ways of knowing EXACTLY whats going on in the gut to be able to tell a lot of this stuff. it s interesting to hear and of course, the more knowledge the better.

thanks ph

gg

From: perfecthealth68@...Date: Sun, 13 Jun 2010 22:38:39 +0000Subject: Re: Relationship of H pylori gut infections and Thyroid Antibodies

Hi GG,Sorry...I never got your last post. I'm on the forum in a hit or miss like fashion. Yes, from everything I have I do think Hashi's is connected to leaky gut. The more I read, I think all degenerative and autoimmune illnesses are created from pathogens, metals, toxins in the gut. So much of our hormones, neurotransmitters and enzymes are produced in the gut. When an infection occurs and creates leaky gut our body can no longer receive the proper signals from the body in order to function.For example, there is an enzyme called DMT which is located in the gut and helps the body excrete heavy metals. If a gut infection is present, the DMT enzyme is wiped out and heavy metals increase in the body. Given that implants are made of heavy metal catalysts, it becomes a vicious cycle...heavy metals increase infection and infection increases heavy metals. That's why so many of us have high levels of heavy metals and inflammation.So in answer to your question, I wish I would have pursued the thyroid antibodies test sooner and pressed to find a doc who understood HOW to test thyroid antibodies and HOW to treat. It's sad but I think one reason I finally found one is that this last time I didn't mention a thing about implants. Before when I would mention it every doc would roll their eyes and not take me seriously from that point on. Now that my thyroid is going to be treated that should help clean the gut (with diet and cleansing)...have read that thyroid hormone modulates parasitic levels in the gut.Love,PH > > >> > > > > > what is recommended to take for this? is this what you take the gastro ulc (for L. gut) for? where do you get it? do you take anything else other than medication (armour, etc) for thyroid?> > > > > > > > > > > > thanks.'> > > > > > > > > > > > gg> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > From: perfecthealth68@> > > Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2010 00:32:16 +0000> > > Subject: Relationship of H pylori gut infections and Thyroid Antibodies> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi All,> > > > > > Just wanted to give an update. Saw an endocrinologist yesterday and within 5 minutes she diagnosed me with Hashimoto's Thyroiditis. Diagnosis was based on blood work I had 2 years ago indicating elevated thyroid antibodies (something Patty has always suggested be tested...thank you Patty!) as well as symptoms. The doctor said that elevated thyroid antibodies are a clean indicator of Hashi's even if TSH is normal. Unfortunately it's hard to find a doc who knows enough to test for antibodies and then understand what elevated antibodies mean...saw countless docs who acted as if my thyroid is all good and fine despite debilitating symptoms. > > > > > > Anyway, because I also have leaky gut from h pylori, I was curious how that impacts the thyroid and came across numerous articles discussing a relationship. So if any of you are experiencing gut issues (or not...because depending on where the infection is in the gut can affect level of symptoms), I would have your thyroid antibodies tested as Patty has always suggested from the getgo. Some people don't feel gut symptoms yet have brain fog and I have read that it's because the inflammation in the gut is in an area of the intestines where there are less nerves and they might have infection but just not feel it versus if it's present in the stomach we can feel more aches, pains and bloating.> > > > > > Here's the medical article/abstract on the connection of h pylori and Hashi's/Thyroid Antibodies.> > > > > > http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18271683> > > > > > Physiol Res. 2008;57 Suppl 1:S135-41. Epub 2008 Feb 13.> > > Anti-Helicobacter Pylori, anti-thyroid peroxidase, anti-thyroglobulin and anti-gastric parietal cells antibodies in Czech population.> > > Sterzl I, Hrdá P, Matucha P, Cerovská J, Zamrazil V.> > > Institute of Endocrinology, Prague, Czech Republic. ister@> > > > > > Abstract> > > Autoimmune thyropathies are frequently linked to many infections, such as Helicobacter pylori, which are also supposed to play a role in their pathogenesis. The aim of this study was to evaluate the relationships between thyroid and gastric autoimmunity and H. pylori infection on a large sample of Czech population (n=1621) by monitoring the autoantibodies against thyroglobulin (anti-Tg) and thyroid peroxidase (anti-TPO) and gastric parietal cell (anti-GPC, representing thyrogastric syndrome) in correlation with antibodies against Helicobacter pylori (anti-H. pylori) of classes IgG and IgA. The interrelation between autoantibodies and H. pylori antibodies was assessed by H. pylori seropositivity. In H. pylori seropositive persons as compared to seronegative irrespective of age and sex, a higher occurrence of anti-TPO (10.4 % vs. 5.8 %, p=0.001) and anti-GPC (6.1 % vs. 1.7 %, p<0.001) was found. Differences in anti-TPO occurrence were significant in both men (7.0 % vs. 3.3 %, p=0.03) and women (12.7 % vs. 8.0 %, p=0.02), differences in anti-GPC occurrence were significant only in women (7.2 % vs. 1.7 %, p<0.001). Results of this study support the idea of a connection between infection of H. pylori and the occurrence of anti-TPO autoantibodies representing thyroid autoimmunity and gastric parietal cells autoantibodies representing the thyrogastric syndrome.> > > > > > Physiol Res. 2008;57 Suppl 1:S135-41. Epub 2008 Feb 13.> > >> >>

[Guest guest]

Hi GG,

To me infection equals inflammation and can come in the form of bacteria, fungi or parasites. What I've read is that if one is dealing with one form, they are also likely dealing with the others as well because the cells and organs can no longer detox organisms as well due to the first infection.

Yes, antibiotics can help in some cases (see www.bacteriality.com) to read about the Marshall Protocol. But it seems that everybody has a different experience with antibiotics. I am seeing just as many people become worse from antibiotics as I do those who have been helped. The PCR test can identify which antibiotics and herbals you are resistant to (for example I am resistant to Penicillan but Tetracycline should work great for me...interestingly that's been my experience as well before this whole implant nightmare). Other ways to kill infections include herbals (olive leaf extract, caprylic acid, oregano oil, grapeseed extract, wormwood) and cleansing protocols like Kopera's, Humaworm and Dr. Shulze...so antibiotics aren't the only answer.

My chiro is the one who told me about the DMT enzyme. He has been researching gut infections and it's relationship to thyroid illness and is even writing a book on it. He found out this info by going to DAN! (Defeat Autsim Now!) conferences.

He also said thyroid hormone is partly responsible for the level of parasites in the gut (20% of our thyroid hormone is manufactured in the gut). If our thyroid is out of whack then infections can occur and vice versa (not sure which happens first). Thyroid is also responsible for gut motility...that's why those who are hypo often have constipation and some who are hyper have loose stools. Gut motility can influence parasitic growth as well. It's a huge vicious cycle and I think that's why the ones on this forum who have recovered have usually (for the most part) done it all...diet, cleansing, thyroid hormones. Not saying everyone has to do all this...but in my experience so far the first 2 things haven't worked...have helped me improve but not yet cured.

Take care.

PH

> > > >> > > > > > > > what is recommended to take for this? is this what you take the gastro ulc (for L. gut) for? where do you get it? do you take anything else other than medication (armour, etc) for thyroid?> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks.'> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > gg> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > From: perfecthealth68@> > > > Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2010 00:32:16 +0000> > > > Subject: Relationship of H pylori gut infections and Thyroid Antibodies> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi All,> > > > > > > > Just wanted to give an update. Saw an endocrinologist yesterday and within 5 minutes she diagnosed me with Hashimoto's Thyroiditis. Diagnosis was based on blood work I had 2 years ago indicating elevated thyroid antibodies (something Patty has always suggested be tested...thank you Patty!) as well as symptoms. The doctor said that elevated thyroid antibodies are a clean indicator of Hashi's even if TSH is normal. Unfortunately it's hard to find a doc who knows enough to test for antibodies and then understand what elevated antibodies mean...saw countless docs who acted as if my thyroid is all good and fine despite debilitating symptoms. > > > > > > > > Anyway, because I also have leaky gut from h pylori, I was curious how that impacts the thyroid and came across numerous articles discussing a relationship. So if any of you are experiencing gut issues (or not...because depending on where the infection is in the gut can affect level of symptoms), I would have your thyroid antibodies tested as Patty has always suggested from the getgo. Some people don't feel gut symptoms yet have brain fog and I have read that it's because the inflammation in the gut is in an area of the intestines where there are less nerves and they might have infection but just not feel it versus if it's present in the stomach we can feel more aches, pains and bloating.> > > > > > > > Here's the medical article/abstract on the connection of h pylori and Hashi's/Thyroid Antibodies.> > > > > > > > http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18271683> > > > > > > > Physiol Res. 2008;57 Suppl 1:S135-41. Epub 2008 Feb 13.> > > > Anti-Helicobacter Pylori, anti-thyroid peroxidase, anti-thyroglobulin and anti-gastric parietal cells antibodies in Czech population.> > > > Sterzl I, Hrdá P, Matucha P, Cerovská J, Zamrazil V.> > > > Institute of Endocrinology, Prague, Czech Republic. ister@> > > > > > > > Abstract> > > > Autoimmune thyropathies are frequently linked to many infections, such as Helicobacter pylori, which are also supposed to play a role in their pathogenesis. The aim of this study was to evaluate the relationships between thyroid and gastric autoimmunity and H. pylori infection on a large sample of Czech population (n=1621) by monitoring the autoantibodies against thyroglobulin (anti-Tg) and thyroid peroxidase (anti-TPO) and gastric parietal cell (anti-GPC, representing thyrogastric syndrome) in correlation with antibodies against Helicobacter pylori (anti-H. pylori) of classes IgG and IgA. The interrelation between autoantibodies and H. pylori antibodies was assessed by H. pylori seropositivity. In H. pylori seropositive persons as compared to seronegative irrespective of age and sex, a higher occurrence of anti-TPO (10.4 % vs. 5.8 %, p=0.001) and anti-GPC (6.1 % vs. 1.7 %, p<0.001) was found. Differences in anti-TPO occurrence were significant in both men (7.0 % vs. 3.3 %, p=0.03) and women (12.7 % vs. 8.0 %, p=0.02), differences in anti-GPC occurrence were significant only in women (7.2 % vs. 1.7 %, p<0.001). Results of this study support the idea of a connection between infection of H. pylori and the occurrence of anti-TPO autoantibodies representing thyroid autoimmunity and gastric parietal cells autoantibodies representing the thyrogastric syndrome.> > > > > > > > Physiol Res. 2008;57 Suppl 1:S135-41. Epub 2008 Feb 13.> > > >> > >> >>

[Guest guest]

hi ph;

i have a lot of gut symptom of gas, bloat, etc. but dr. said stool test didnt show inflammation (which he said you have if you have leaky gut) he said there is no test for L. gut, altho a few yrs. back i heard there was. he said i had yeast problems, and bacteria. do you know of a test for it - not just symptom, but actual test?

you mentioned humaworm from gina - sandy wrote a few days ago to get from an indian family and gave the number - do you know if its the same thing?

thanks.

gg

From: perfecthealth68@...Date: Wed, 16 Jun 2010 01:35:02 +0000Subject: Re: Relationship of H pylori gut infections and Thyroid Antibodies

Hi GG,

To me infection equals inflammation and can come in the form of bacteria, fungi or parasites. What I've read is that if one is dealing with one form, they are also likely dealing with the others as well because the cells and organs can no longer detox organisms as well due to the first infection.

Yes, antibiotics can help in some cases (see www.bacteriality.com) to read about the Marshall Protocol. But it seems that everybody has a different experience with antibiotics. I am seeing just as many people become worse from antibiotics as I do those who have been helped. The PCR test can identify which antibiotics and herbals you are resistant to (for example I am resistant to Penicillan but Tetracycline should work great for me...interestingly that's been my experience as well before this whole implant nightmare). Other ways to kill infections include herbals (olive leaf extract, caprylic acid, oregano oil, grapeseed extract, wormwood) and cleansing protocols like Kopera's, Humaworm and Dr. Shulze...so antibiotics aren't the only answer.

My chiro is the one who told me about the DMT enzyme. He has been researching gut infections and it's relationship to thyroid illness and is even writing a book on it. He found out this info by going to DAN! (Defeat Autsim Now!) conferences.

He also said thyroid hormone is partly responsible for the level of parasites in the gut (20% of our thyroid hormone is manufactured in the gut). If our thyroid is out of whack then infections can occur and vice versa (not sure which happens first). Thyroid is also responsible for gut motility...that's why those who are hypo often have constipation and some who are hyper have loose stools. Gut motility can influence parasitic growth as well. It's a huge vicious cycle and I think that's why the ones on this forum who have recovered have usually (for the most part) done it all...diet, cleansing, thyroid hormones. Not saying everyone has to do all this...but in my experience so far the first 2 things haven't worked...have helped me improve but not yet cured.

Take care.

PH

> > > >> > > > > > > > what is recommended to take for this? is this what you take the gastro ulc (for L. gut) for? where do you get it? do you take anything else other than medication (armour, etc) for thyroid?> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks.'> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > gg> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > From: perfecthealth68@> > > > Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2010 00:32:16 +0000> > > > Subject: Relationship of H pylori gut infections and Thyroid Antibodies> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi All,> > > > > > > > Just wanted to give an update. Saw an endocrinologist yesterday and within 5 minutes she diagnosed me with Hashimoto's Thyroiditis. Diagnosis was based on blood work I had 2 years ago indicating elevated thyroid antibodies (something Patty has always suggested be tested...thank you Patty!) as well as symptoms. The doctor said that elevated thyroid antibodies are a clean indicator of Hashi's even if TSH is normal. Unfortunately it's hard to find a doc who knows enough to test for antibodies and then understand what elevated antibodies mean...saw countless docs who acted as if my thyroid is all good and fine despite debilitating symptoms. > > > > > > > > Anyway, because I also have leaky gut from h pylori, I was curious how that impacts the thyroid and came across numerous articles discussing a relationship. So if any of you are experiencing gut issues (or not...because depending on where the infection is in the gut can affect level of symptoms), I would have your thyroid antibodies tested as Patty has always suggested from the getgo. Some people don't feel gut symptoms yet have brain fog and I have read that it's because the inflammation in the gut is in an area of the intestines where there are less nerves and they might have infection but just not feel it versus if it's present in the stomach we can feel more aches, pains and bloating.> > > > > > > > Here's the medical article/abstract on the connection of h pylori and Hashi's/Thyroid Antibodies.> > > > > > > > http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18271683> > > > > > > > Physiol Res. 2008;57 Suppl 1:S135-41. Epub 2008 Feb 13.> > > > Anti-Helicobacter Pylori, anti-thyroid peroxidase, anti-thyroglobulin and anti-gastric parietal cells antibodies in Czech population.> > > > Sterzl I, Hrdá P, Matucha P, Cerovská J, Zamrazil V.> > > > Institute of Endocrinology, Prague, Czech Republic. ister@> > > > > > > > Abstract> > > > Autoimmune thyropathies are frequently linked to many infections, such as Helicobacter pylori, which are also supposed to play a role in their pathogenesis. The aim of this study was to evaluate the relationships between thyroid and gastric autoimmunity and H. pylori infection on a large sample of Czech population (n=1621) by monitoring the autoantibodies against thyroglobulin (anti-Tg) and thyroid peroxidase (anti-TPO) and gastric parietal cell (anti-GPC, representing thyrogastric syndrome) in correlation with antibodies against Helicobacter pylori (anti-H. pylori) of classes IgG and IgA. The interrelation between autoantibodies and H. pylori antibodies was assessed by H. pylori seropositivity. In H. pylori seropositive persons as compared to seronegative irrespective of age and sex, a higher occurrence of anti-TPO (10.4 % vs. 5.8 %, p=0.001) and anti-GPC (6.1 % vs. 1.7 %, p<0.001) was found. Differences in anti-TPO occurrence were significant in both men (7.0 % vs. 3.3 %, p=0.03) and women (12.7 % vs. 8.0 %, p=0.02), differences in anti-GPC occurrence were significant only in women (7.2 % vs. 1.7 %, p<0.001). Results of this study support the idea of a connection between infection of H. pylori and the occurrence of anti-TPO autoantibodies representing thyroid autoimmunity and gastric parietal cells autoantibodies representing the thyrogastric syndrome.> > > > > > > > Physiol Res. 2008;57 Suppl 1:S135-41. Epub 2008 Feb 13.> > > >> > >> >>

[Guest guest]

Hi GG,

My stool tests from gastroeneterologists revealed the same thing...everything

was normal...yet I had symptoms of inflammation and could even feel an aching

pain and had a positive breath test indicating bacterial overgrowth. The

typical stool test prescribed by a GI is not very accurate according to my MD/ND

and another chiro. They both believe (as does Kolb) that the only true way to

determine what is going on in the gut is through a PCR stool test. Has to be

PCR and not the others!!

But no, I don't know of an actual test for leaky gut. You can bet you have it

though if you are feeling brain foggy or have headaches. The intestinal barrier

is one of the first barriers to break when there is inflammation. If it breaks

then the brain becomes inflamed as well (in almost all cases) because proteins

from food that are meant to stay in the gut are now circulating through the body

and affecting brain function (and other functions).

PH

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > what is recommended to take for this? is this what you take the gastro

ulc (for L. gut) for? where do you get it? do you take anything else other than

medication (armour, etc) for thyroid?

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > thanks.'

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > gg

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > From: perfecthealth68@

> > > > > Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2010 00:32:16 +0000

> > > > > Subject: Relationship of H pylori gut infections and

Thyroid Antibodies

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Hi All,

> > > > >

> > > > > Just wanted to give an update. Saw an endocrinologist yesterday and

within 5 minutes she diagnosed me with Hashimoto's Thyroiditis. Diagnosis was

based on blood work I had 2 years ago indicating elevated thyroid antibodies

(something Patty has always suggested be tested...thank you Patty!) as well as

symptoms. The doctor said that elevated thyroid antibodies are a clean indicator

of Hashi's even if TSH is normal. Unfortunately it's hard to find a doc who

knows enough to test for antibodies and then understand what elevated antibodies

mean...saw countless docs who acted as if my thyroid is all good and fine

despite debilitating symptoms.

> > > > >

> > > > > Anyway, because I also have leaky gut from h pylori, I was curious how

that impacts the thyroid and came across numerous articles discussing a

relationship. So if any of you are experiencing gut issues (or not...because

depending on where the infection is in the gut can affect level of symptoms), I

would have your thyroid antibodies tested as Patty has always suggested from the

getgo. Some people don't feel gut symptoms yet have brain fog and I have read

that it's because the inflammation in the gut is in an area of the intestines

where there are less nerves and they might have infection but just not feel it

versus if it's present in the stomach we can feel more aches, pains and

bloating.

> > > > >

> > > > > Here's the medical article/abstract on the connection of h pylori and

Hashi's/Thyroid Antibodies.

> > > > >

> > > > > http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18271683

> > > > >

> > > > > Physiol Res. 2008;57 Suppl 1:S135-41. Epub 2008 Feb 13.

> > > > > Anti-Helicobacter Pylori, anti-thyroid peroxidase, anti-thyroglobulin

and anti-gastric parietal cells antibodies in Czech population.

> > > > > Sterzl I, Hrdá P, Matucha P, Cerovská J, Zamrazil V.

> > > > > Institute of Endocrinology, Prague, Czech Republic. ister@

> > > > >

> > > > > Abstract

> > > > > Autoimmune thyropathies are frequently linked to many infections, such

as Helicobacter pylori, which are also supposed to play a role in their

pathogenesis. The aim of this study was to evaluate the relationships between

thyroid and gastric autoimmunity and H. pylori infection on a large sample of

Czech population (n=1621) by monitoring the autoantibodies against thyroglobulin

(anti-Tg) and thyroid peroxidase (anti-TPO) and gastric parietal cell (anti-GPC,

representing thyrogastric syndrome) in correlation with antibodies against

Helicobacter pylori (anti-H. pylori) of classes IgG and IgA. The interrelation

between autoantibodies and H. pylori antibodies was assessed by H. pylori

seropositivity. In H. pylori seropositive persons as compared to seronegative

irrespective of age and sex, a higher occurrence of anti-TPO (10.4 % vs. 5.8 %,

p=0.001) and anti-GPC (6.1 % vs. 1.7 %, p<0.001) was found. Differences in

anti-TPO occurrence were significant in both men (7.0 % vs. 3.3 %, p=0.03) and

women (12.7 % vs. 8.0 %, p=0.02), differences in anti-GPC occurrence were

significant only in women (7.2 % vs. 1.7 %, p<0.001). Results of this study

support the idea of a connection between infection of H. pylori and the

occurrence of anti-TPO autoantibodies representing thyroid autoimmunity and

gastric parietal cells autoantibodies representing the thyrogastric syndrome.

> > > > >

> > > > > Physiol Res. 2008;57 Suppl 1:S135-41. Epub 2008 Feb 13.

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Hi GG,

Forgot to answer your other question. doesn't have Humaworm. She sells

her own products which are like Dr. Schulze's which she used herself to

heal. I've never used Humaworm but have only heard good things.

PH

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > what is recommended to take for this? is this what you take the gastro

ulc (for L. gut) for? where do you get it? do you take anything else other than

medication (armour, etc) for thyroid?

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > thanks.'

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > gg

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > From: perfecthealth68@

> > > > > Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2010 00:32:16 +0000

> > > > > Subject: Relationship of H pylori gut infections and

Thyroid Antibodies

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Hi All,

> > > > >

> > > > > Just wanted to give an update. Saw an endocrinologist yesterday and

within 5 minutes she diagnosed me with Hashimoto's Thyroiditis. Diagnosis was

based on blood work I had 2 years ago indicating elevated thyroid antibodies

(something Patty has always suggested be tested...thank you Patty!) as well as

symptoms. The doctor said that elevated thyroid antibodies are a clean indicator

of Hashi's even if TSH is normal. Unfortunately it's hard to find a doc who

knows enough to test for antibodies and then understand what elevated antibodies

mean...saw countless docs who acted as if my thyroid is all good and fine

despite debilitating symptoms.

> > > > >

> > > > > Anyway, because I also have leaky gut from h pylori, I was curious how

that impacts the thyroid and came across numerous articles discussing a

relationship. So if any of you are experiencing gut issues (or not...because

depending on where the infection is in the gut can affect level of symptoms), I

would have your thyroid antibodies tested as Patty has always suggested from the

getgo. Some people don't feel gut symptoms yet have brain fog and I have read

that it's because the inflammation in the gut is in an area of the intestines

where there are less nerves and they might have infection but just not feel it

versus if it's present in the stomach we can feel more aches, pains and

bloating.

> > > > >

> > > > > Here's the medical article/abstract on the connection of h pylori and

Hashi's/Thyroid Antibodies.

> > > > >

> > > > > http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18271683

> > > > >

> > > > > Physiol Res. 2008;57 Suppl 1:S135-41. Epub 2008 Feb 13.

> > > > > Anti-Helicobacter Pylori, anti-thyroid peroxidase, anti-thyroglobulin

and anti-gastric parietal cells antibodies in Czech population.

> > > > > Sterzl I, Hrdá P, Matucha P, Cerovská J, Zamrazil V.

> > > > > Institute of Endocrinology, Prague, Czech Republic. ister@

> > > > >

> > > > > Abstract

> > > > > Autoimmune thyropathies are frequently linked to many infections, such

as Helicobacter pylori, which are also supposed to play a role in their

pathogenesis. The aim of this study was to evaluate the relationships between

thyroid and gastric autoimmunity and H. pylori infection on a large sample of

Czech population (n=1621) by monitoring the autoantibodies against thyroglobulin

(anti-Tg) and thyroid peroxidase (anti-TPO) and gastric parietal cell (anti-GPC,

representing thyrogastric syndrome) in correlation with antibodies against

Helicobacter pylori (anti-H. pylori) of classes IgG and IgA. The interrelation

between autoantibodies and H. pylori antibodies was assessed by H. pylori

seropositivity. In H. pylori seropositive persons as compared to seronegative

irrespective of age and sex, a higher occurrence of anti-TPO (10.4 % vs. 5.8 %,

p=0.001) and anti-GPC (6.1 % vs. 1.7 %, p<0.001) was found. Differences in

anti-TPO occurrence were significant in both men (7.0 % vs. 3.3 %, p=0.03) and

women (12.7 % vs. 8.0 %, p=0.02), differences in anti-GPC occurrence were

significant only in women (7.2 % vs. 1.7 %, p<0.001). Results of this study

support the idea of a connection between infection of H. pylori and the

occurrence of anti-TPO autoantibodies representing thyroid autoimmunity and

gastric parietal cells autoantibodies representing the thyrogastric syndrome.

> > > > >

> > > > > Physiol Res. 2008;57 Suppl 1:S135-41. Epub 2008 Feb 13.

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

hi ph;

it s all very confusing to me, sorry to keep askiing you ques. trying to figure it all out! if i'm reading right, PCR test DOES NOT test or indicate leaky gut, right? i have tremor along with all over body weakness (brain related) but dr. said no inflammation from comprehensive stool test (its a very comprehensive test for stool done by a dr. who sees chemically sensitive people thru drs. data lab, not just a regular m.d., and i did it for this very reason - so he says no L. gut). you mention brain fog as indicating L. gut - i have had that to some degree some years ago, but my main problem is the tremor and weakness made worse by certain foods- dont know if its related to yeast or allergy related foods, seems to me like both. tho i did test hi for yeast and bacteria. maybe there is yeast or candida in the brain, i dont know, and that may not show inflammation on a stool test. i just wish they had better tests for this stuff. my problem is even if i stay off certain foods for awhile, even a long while, it diminishes, but gradually comes back - its like you can never totally get rid of it.

thanks.

gg

From: perfecthealth68@...Date: Thu, 17 Jun 2010 15:46:57 +0000Subject: Re: Relationship of H pylori gut infections and Thyroid Antibodies

Hi GG,My stool tests from gastroeneterologists revealed the same thing...everything was normal...yet I had symptoms of inflammation and could even feel an aching pain and had a positive breath test indicating bacterial overgrowth. The typical stool test prescribed by a GI is not very accurate according to my MD/ND and another chiro. They both believe (as does Kolb) that the only true way to determine what is going on in the gut is through a PCR stool test. Has to be PCR and not the others!!But no, I don't know of an actual test for leaky gut. You can bet you have it though if you are feeling brain foggy or have headaches. The intestinal barrier is one of the first barriers to break when there is inflammation. If it breaks then the brain becomes inflamed as well (in almost all cases) because proteins from food that are meant to stay in the gut are now circulating through the body and affecting brain function (and other functions).PH> > > > >> > > > > > > > > > what is recommended to take for this? is this what you take the gastro ulc (for L. gut) for? where do you get it? do you take anything else other than medication (armour, etc) for thyroid?> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks.'> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > gg> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > From: perfecthealth68@> > > > > Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2010 00:32:16 +0000> > > > > Subject: Relationship of H pylori gut infections and Thyroid Antibodies> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi All,> > > > > > > > > > Just wanted to give an update. Saw an endocrinologist yesterday and within 5 minutes she diagnosed me with Hashimoto's Thyroiditis. Diagnosis was based on blood work I had 2 years ago indicating elevated thyroid antibodies (something Patty has always suggested be tested...thank you Patty!) as well as symptoms. The doctor said that elevated thyroid antibodies are a clean indicator of Hashi's even if TSH is normal. Unfortunately it's hard to find a doc who knows enough to test for antibodies and then understand what elevated antibodies mean...saw countless docs who acted as if my thyroid is all good and fine despite debilitating symptoms. > > > > > > > > > > Anyway, because I also have leaky gut from h pylori, I was curious how that impacts the thyroid and came across numerous articles discussing a relationship. So if any of you are experiencing gut issues (or not...because depending on where the infection is in the gut can affect level of symptoms), I would have your thyroid antibodies tested as Patty has always suggested from the getgo. Some people don't feel gut symptoms yet have brain fog and I have read that it's because the inflammation in the gut is in an area of the intestines where there are less nerves and they might have infection but just not feel it versus if it's present in the stomach we can feel more aches, pains and bloating.> > > > > > > > > > Here's the medical article/abstract on the connection of h pylori and Hashi's/Thyroid Antibodies.> > > > > > > > > > http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18271683> > > > > > > > > > Physiol Res. 2008;57 Suppl 1:S135-41. Epub 2008 Feb 13.> > > > > Anti-Helicobacter Pylori, anti-thyroid peroxidase, anti-thyroglobulin and anti-gastric parietal cells antibodies in Czech population.> > > > > Sterzl I, Hrdá P, Matucha P, Cerovská J, Zamrazil V.> > > > > Institute of Endocrinology, Prague, Czech Republic. ister@> > > > > > > > > > Abstract> > > > > Autoimmune thyropathies are frequently linked to many infections, such as Helicobacter pylori, which are also supposed to play a role in their pathogenesis. The aim of this study was to evaluate the relationships between thyroid and gastric autoimmunity and H. pylori infection on a large sample of Czech population (n=1621) by monitoring the autoantibodies against thyroglobulin (anti-Tg) and thyroid peroxidase (anti-TPO) and gastric parietal cell (anti-GPC, representing thyrogastric syndrome) in correlation with antibodies against Helicobacter pylori (anti-H. pylori) of classes IgG and IgA. The interrelation between autoantibodies and H. pylori antibodies was assessed by H. pylori seropositivity. In H. pylori seropositive persons as compared to seronegative irrespective of age and sex, a higher occurrence of anti-TPO (10.4 % vs. 5.8 %, p=0.001) and anti-GPC (6.1 % vs. 1.7 %, p<0.001) was found. Differences in anti-TPO occurrence were significant in both men (7.0 % vs. 3.3 %, p=0.03) and women (12.7 % vs. 8.0 %, p=0.02), differences in anti-GPC occurrence were significant only in women (7.2 % vs. 1.7 %, p<0.001). Results of this study support the idea of a connection between infection of H. pylori and the occurrence of anti-TPO autoantibodies representing thyroid autoimmunity and gastric parietal cells autoantibodies representing the thyrogastric syndrome.> > > > > > > > > > Physiol Res. 2008;57 Suppl 1:S135-41. Epub 2008 Feb 13.> > > > >> > > >> > >> >>

[Guest guest]

Hi GG,

That's ok...it's all confusing to me too! Seems like the more I read and the

more I find out and think I know something, I'll hear of something that doesn't

fit the profile. Am giving this info out based on my own experience and that of

others I have connected with on other forums as well as docs I have had.

No, PCR test does not say for certain if you have leaky gut. PCR test tells you

what pathogens are in your body and at what level (both dead and alive)...that's

why it is preferable to the test you had. It also tells you what antibiotics

and herbals your body is sensitive and resistant to. I had the same Doctor's

Data Lab tests you did. Came out normal both times yet I still had bloating,

gas, pain, brain fog (all signs of inflammation). PCR explained that I was

dealing with high levels of h pylori and yersinia, both of which are linked to

Hashimoto's.

I wouldn't worry about testing whether you have leaky gut or not...because you

can't. I would assume you do since your say that your symptoms are made worse by

food (a pretty good indicator of leaky gut as food intolerances are a symptom of

it). All inflammation (whether it's in the blood, the brain, the liver,

anywhere) can only be helped by having a clean colon with an intestinal lining

free of holes. If your colon/gut/intestines are clean then you have a better

chance of eradicating overall inflammation. If your colon is full of bad

bacteria and parasites it's hard for your body to excrete pathogens the way it

was meant to. I would treat yourself as if you do have leaky gut and work on

diet, repairing the lining and cleansing.

I wish they had better testing too. Yeast is often associated with h pylori

(they are synergistic) but both are treated in a similar fashion w/ herbals,

diet, cleansing.

Ph

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > what is recommended to take for this? is this what you take the

gastro ulc (for L. gut) for? where do you get it? do you take anything else

other than medication (armour, etc) for thyroid?

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > thanks.'

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > gg

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > From: perfecthealth68@

> > > > > > Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2010 00:32:16 +0000

> > > > > > Subject: Relationship of H pylori gut infections and

Thyroid Antibodies

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Hi All,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Just wanted to give an update. Saw an endocrinologist yesterday and

within 5 minutes she diagnosed me with Hashimoto's Thyroiditis. Diagnosis was

based on blood work I had 2 years ago indicating elevated thyroid antibodies

(something Patty has always suggested be tested...thank you Patty!) as well as

symptoms. The doctor said that elevated thyroid antibodies are a clean indicator

of Hashi's even if TSH is normal. Unfortunately it's hard to find a doc who

knows enough to test for antibodies and then understand what elevated antibodies

mean...saw countless docs who acted as if my thyroid is all good and fine

despite debilitating symptoms.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Anyway, because I also have leaky gut from h pylori, I was curious

how that impacts the thyroid and came across numerous articles discussing a

relationship. So if any of you are experiencing gut issues (or not...because

depending on where the infection is in the gut can affect level of symptoms), I

would have your thyroid antibodies tested as Patty has always suggested from the

getgo. Some people don't feel gut symptoms yet have brain fog and I have read

that it's because the inflammation in the gut is in an area of the intestines

where there are less nerves and they might have infection but just not feel it

versus if it's present in the stomach we can feel more aches, pains and

bloating.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Here's the medical article/abstract on the connection of h pylori

and Hashi's/Thyroid Antibodies.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18271683

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Physiol Res. 2008;57 Suppl 1:S135-41. Epub 2008 Feb 13.

> > > > > > Anti-Helicobacter Pylori, anti-thyroid peroxidase,

anti-thyroglobulin and anti-gastric parietal cells antibodies in Czech

population.

> > > > > > Sterzl I, Hrdá P, Matucha P, Cerovská J, Zamrazil V.

> > > > > > Institute of Endocrinology, Prague, Czech Republic. ister@

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Abstract

> > > > > > Autoimmune thyropathies are frequently linked to many infections,

such as Helicobacter pylori, which are also supposed to play a role in their

pathogenesis. The aim of this study was to evaluate the relationships between

thyroid and gastric autoimmunity and H. pylori infection on a large sample of

Czech population (n=1621) by monitoring the autoantibodies against thyroglobulin

(anti-Tg) and thyroid peroxidase (anti-TPO) and gastric parietal cell (anti-GPC,

representing thyrogastric syndrome) in correlation with antibodies against

Helicobacter pylori (anti-H. pylori) of classes IgG and IgA. The interrelation

between autoantibodies and H. pylori antibodies was assessed by H. pylori

seropositivity. In H. pylori seropositive persons as compared to seronegative

irrespective of age and sex, a higher occurrence of anti-TPO (10.4 % vs. 5.8 %,

p=0.001) and anti-GPC (6.1 % vs. 1.7 %, p<0.001) was found. Differences in

anti-TPO occurrence were significant in both men (7.0 % vs. 3.3 %, p=0.03) and

women (12.7 % vs. 8.0 %, p=0.02), differences in anti-GPC occurrence were

significant only in women (7.2 % vs. 1.7 %, p<0.001). Results of this study

support the idea of a connection between infection of H. pylori and the

occurrence of anti-TPO autoantibodies representing thyroid autoimmunity and

gastric parietal cells autoantibodies representing the thyrogastric syndrome.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Physiol Res. 2008;57 Suppl 1:S135-41. Epub 2008 Feb 13.

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

hi ph;

i'm surprised that if the PCR test shows much better in general than the dr data stool that more drs dont do it. i would think a comprehensive stool test (theyre not cheap), would show inflammation. my dr.. has seen inflamation from this test, but said i didnt show it. why wouldnt i show it then? i cant believe you had gas,, bloat, and all those symptoms and the test showed nothing. did you have the comprehensive test? that one shows more than a regular stool test. what kind of dr. did you see for this stool test that found nothing? what dr. did you see on the PCR? that could also make a difference. the dr. i see is out of texas environ. health ctr. and very familiar with the stool test and does quite a few. he works with people with a lot of allergys and sensitivities to many things, he not a regular m.d. i've never heard that h-pyllori is associated with yeast. who told you that? isnt h-pylori like an stomach ulcer?

yes i agree that we need a clean gut, but some of these diagnostic measures are a little disconcerning to me, esp. not being able to see inflammation, and in your case with all those symptoms, nothing shows up. every time i've had symptoms, something always shows up on the comprehensive stool. could be also i guess, that the level of inflammation i have is not that significant. i will have to ask my dr about the differences in these 2 tests in relation to some of this. i realize some of these drs on the internet mean well, but i've found everyone is different, and theres nothing like a dr. who can test you individually.

thanks ph.

gg

From: perfecthealth68@...Date: Thu, 17 Jun 2010 20:08:42 +0000Subject: Re: Relationship of H pylori gut infections and Thyroid Antibodies

Hi GG,That's ok...it's all confusing to me too! Seems like the more I read and the more I find out and think I know something, I'll hear of something that doesn't fit the profile. Am giving this info out based on my own experience and that of others I have connected with on other forums as well as docs I have had.No, PCR test does not say for certain if you have leaky gut. PCR test tells you what pathogens are in your body and at what level (both dead and alive)...that's why it is preferable to the test you had. It also tells you what antibiotics and herbals your body is sensitive and resistant to. I had the same Doctor's Data Lab tests you did. Came out normal both times yet I still had bloating, gas, pain, brain fog (all signs of inflammation). PCR explained that I was dealing with high levels of h pylori and yersinia, both of which are linked to Hashimoto's.I wouldn't worry about testing whether you have leaky gut or not...because you can't. I would assume you do since your say that your symptoms are made worse by food (a pretty good indicator of leaky gut as food intolerances are a symptom of it). All inflammation (whether it's in the blood, the brain, the liver, anywhere) can only be helped by having a clean colon with an intestinal lining free of holes. If your colon/gut/intestines are clean then you have a better chance of eradicating overall inflammation. If your colon is full of bad bacteria and parasites it's hard for your body to excrete pathogens the way it was meant to. I would treat yourself as if you do have leaky gut and work on diet, repairing the lining and cleansing.I wish they had better testing too. Yeast is often associated with h pylori (they are synergistic) but both are treated in a similar fashion w/ herbals, diet, cleansing.Ph> > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > what is recommended to take for this? is this what you take the gastro ulc (for L. gut) for? where do you get it? do you take anything else other than medication (armour, etc) for thyroid?> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks.'> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > gg> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > From: perfecthealth68@> > > > > > Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2010 00:32:16 +0000> > > > > > Subject: Relationship of H pylori gut infections and Thyroid Antibodies> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi All,> > > > > > > > > > > > Just wanted to give an update. Saw an endocrinologist yesterday and within 5 minutes she diagnosed me with Hashimoto's Thyroiditis. Diagnosis was based on blood work I had 2 years ago indicating elevated thyroid antibodies (something Patty has always suggested be tested...thank you Patty!) as well as symptoms. The doctor said that elevated thyroid antibodies are a clean indicator of Hashi's even if TSH is normal. Unfortunately it's hard to find a doc who knows enough to test for antibodies and then understand what elevated antibodies mean...saw countless docs who acted as if my thyroid is all good and fine despite debilitating symptoms. > > > > > > > > > > > > Anyway, because I also have leaky gut from h pylori, I was curious how that impacts the thyroid and came across numerous articles discussing a relationship. So if any of you are experiencing gut issues (or not...because depending on where the infection is in the gut can affect level of symptoms), I would have your thyroid antibodies tested as Patty has always suggested from the getgo. Some people don't feel gut symptoms yet have brain fog and I have read that it's because the inflammation in the gut is in an area of the intestines where there are less nerves and they might have infection but just not feel it versus if it's present in the stomach we can feel more aches, pains and bloating.> > > > > > > > > > > > Here's the medical article/abstract on the connection of h pylori and Hashi's/Thyroid Antibodies.> > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18271683> > > > > > > > > > > > Physiol Res. 2008;57 Suppl 1:S135-41. Epub 2008 Feb 13.> > > > > > Anti-Helicobacter Pylori, anti-thyroid peroxidase, anti-thyroglobulin and anti-gastric parietal cells antibodies in Czech population.> > > > > > Sterzl I, Hrdá P, Matucha P, Cerovská J, Zamrazil V.> > > > > > Institute of Endocrinology, Prague, Czech Republic. ister@> > > > > > > > > > > > Abstract> > > > > > Autoimmune thyropathies are frequently linked to many infections, such as Helicobacter pylori, which are also supposed to play a role in their pathogenesis. The aim of this study was to evaluate the relationships between thyroid and gastric autoimmunity and H. pylori infection on a large sample of Czech population (n=1621) by monitoring the autoantibodies against thyroglobulin (anti-Tg) and thyroid peroxidase (anti-TPO) and gastric parietal cell (anti-GPC, representing thyrogastric syndrome) in correlation with antibodies against Helicobacter pylori (anti-H. pylori) of classes IgG and IgA. The interrelation between autoantibodies and H. pylori antibodies was assessed by H. pylori seropositivity. In H. pylori seropositive persons as compared to seronegative irrespective of age and sex, a higher occurrence of anti-TPO (10.4 % vs. 5.8 %, p=0.001) and anti-GPC (6.1 % vs. 1.7 %, p<0.001) was found. Differences in anti-TPO occurrence were significant in both men (7.0 % vs. 3.3 %, p=0.03) and women (12.7 % vs. 8.0 %, p=0.02), differences in anti-GPC occurrence were significant only in women (7.2 % vs. 1.7 %, p<0.001). Results of this study support the idea of a connection between infection of H. pylori and the occurrence of anti-TPO autoantibodies representing thyroid autoimmunity and gastric parietal cells autoantibodies representing the thyrogastric syndrome.> > > > > > > > > > > > Physiol Res. 2008;57 Suppl 1:S135-41. Epub 2008 Feb 13.> > > > > >> > > > >> > > >> > >> >>

[Guest guest]

Hi GG,

When I asked for the PCR test at Infectious Disease, they said they do

them but it's very expensive and so they reserve them for AIDS patients

or those who are on their death bed. My chiro through whom I had this

test done said that the reason my Doctor's Data Labs didn't show

anything is because when they do the testing, the stool is exposed to

air. When air hits the stool many of the pathogens die from the oxygen.

With a PCR test you won't get the oxygen exposure, plus the PCR test

will tell what your body has already killed naturally where a

comprehensive test is only testing what is still alive (after shipment

and air exposure).

I agree, testing is not 100% accurate...you have to weigh in whether the

patient followed directions, the length of time and temp the sample was

in the mail and lab, lab tecnician error, report error...so many

variables. Results can also differ because we have 20 something feet

of intestines and in a sample one is only putting a couple tablespoons

of the feces so the actual infection may be missed. Even with my PCR

test...everyone has h pylori and yersinia...however, I have the symptoms

and diagnosis of Hashi's that go along with it. After reading about

Hashi's and finding numerous journal articles citing a connection, there

is little doubt that the PCR test (for me) is inaccurate. I had the

symptoms of h pylori for years but didn't realize it. Docs told me I

had IBS and there was nothing I could do for it.

Yes, I had the comprehensive stool tests by 2 gastroenterologists and a

D.O/MD at Mercola's office. All showed no inflammation and one showed

zero beneficial bacteria. The PCR test was done by a chiro .

I read that h pylori is associated with yeast. I have read that in many

sources, especially in treatment protocols for children with autism

(because autism is nothing more than gut infections that have broken

through the intestinal barrier and effect the brain). Hompes also

writes on h pylori and he mentions the same thing.

Yes, h pylori can cause stomach ulcers. When I had an endoscopy it

showed some inflammation but my GI said it wasn't enough to treat (this

was years ago before it became worse).

Diagnostic procedures are far from accurate (based on the experiences of

many women here). Even knowing what I know now, if your body feels

like it has inflammation, treat for inflammation rather than going by a

test. We all have inflammation in our body and in western medicine it's

usually not detected until it comes in the form of cancer.

I asked my chiro why my SED rate (level of inflammation by blood) has

always been normal even though the PCR test indicates a lot of

inflammation. He said often times the immune system is so bogged down

that in the lab the blood cannot even produce an immune response so it

looks like things are normal. Once treatment begins (cleansing/diet)

and the SED rate is tested again, it becomes higher because the body can

then produce a response. That has been my case too...my SED is

increasing as I treat (although it's still within normal range). I

wonder if that's why so many of us have obvious immune probs but tests

come out normal...because the immune system is so overworked it can't

even produce a response in some. One can have a raging infection

anywhere and the inflammation won't necessairy show up in blood. If you

have a horrific tooth infection, it's not likely to reflect in blood

work or a stool test, but will most likely show in a PCR test. That

raging tooth infection might not even show up on dental xrays yet it can

cause very uncomfortable symptoms...same goes for any infection in the

body. If you don't feel well, you probably have inflammation.

Hang in there!'

PH

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > what is recommended to take for this? is this what you

take the gastro ulc (for L. gut) for? where do you get it? do you take

anything else other than medication (armour, etc) for thyroid?

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > thanks.'

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > gg

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > From: perfecthealth68@

> > > > > > > Date: Thu, 10 Jun 2010 00:32:16 +0000

> > > > > > > Subject: Relationship of H pylori gut

infections and Thyroid Antibodies

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Hi All,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Just wanted to give an update. Saw an endocrinologist

yesterday and within 5 minutes she diagnosed me with Hashimoto's

Thyroiditis. Diagnosis was based on blood work I had 2 years ago

indicating elevated thyroid antibodies (something Patty has always

suggested be tested...thank you Patty!) as well as symptoms. The doctor

said that elevated thyroid antibodies are a clean indicator of Hashi's

even if TSH is normal. Unfortunately it's hard to find a doc who knows

enough to test for antibodies and then understand what elevated

antibodies mean...saw countless docs who acted as if my thyroid is all

good and fine despite debilitating symptoms.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Anyway, because I also have leaky gut from h pylori, I was

curious how that impacts the thyroid and came across numerous articles

discussing a relationship. So if any of you are experiencing gut issues

(or not...because depending on where the infection is in the gut can

affect level of symptoms), I would have your thyroid antibodies tested

as Patty has always suggested from the getgo. Some people don't feel gut

symptoms yet have brain fog and I have read that it's because the

inflammation in the gut is in an area of the intestines where there are

less nerves and they might have infection but just not feel it versus if

it's present in the stomach we can feel more aches, pains and bloating.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Here's the medical article/abstract on the connection of h

pylori and Hashi's/Thyroid Antibodies.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18271683

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Physiol Res. 2008;57 Suppl 1:S135-41. Epub 2008 Feb 13.

> > > > > > > Anti-Helicobacter Pylori, anti-thyroid peroxidase,

anti-thyroglobulin and anti-gastric parietal cells antibodies in Czech

population.

> > > > > > > Sterzl I, Hrdá P, Matucha P, Cerovská J, Zamrazil V.

> > > > > > > Institute of Endocrinology, Prague, Czech Republic. ister@

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Abstract

> > > > > > > Autoimmune thyropathies are frequently linked to many

infections, such as Helicobacter pylori, which are also supposed to play

a role in their pathogenesis. The aim of this study was to evaluate the

relationships between thyroid and gastric autoimmunity and H. pylori

infection on a large sample of Czech population (n=1621) by monitoring

the autoantibodies against thyroglobulin (anti-Tg) and thyroid

peroxidase (anti-TPO) and gastric parietal cell (anti-GPC, representing

thyrogastric syndrome) in correlation with antibodies against

Helicobacter pylori (anti-H. pylori) of classes IgG and IgA. The

interrelation between autoantibodies and H. pylori antibodies was

assessed by H. pylori seropositivity. In H. pylori seropositive persons

as compared to seronegative irrespective of age and sex, a higher

occurrence of anti-TPO (10.4 % vs. 5.8 %, p=0.001) and anti-GPC (6.1 %

vs. 1.7 %, p<0.001) was found. Differences in anti-TPO occurrence were

significant in both men (7.0 % vs. 3.3 %, p=0.03) and women (12.7 % vs.

8.0 %, p=0.02), differences in anti-GPC occurrence were significant only

in women (7.2 % vs. 1.7 %, p<0.001). Results of this study support the

idea of a connection between infection of H. pylori and the occurrence

of anti-TPO autoantibodies representing thyroid autoimmunity and gastric

parietal cells autoantibodies representing the thyrogastric syndrome.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Physiol Res. 2008;57 Suppl 1:S135-41. Epub 2008 Feb 13.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

>