Re: neurologists - gender issue?

May 27, 2002

Aletta,

I strongly suggest that you take your fight with neurologists OFF the

list and into the courts. This list is primarily for people with

movement disorders and their caregivers. These people NEED to depend

on their neurologists for medical care and your constant attack on neurologists

COULD cause someone to ignore valuable advice from their neurologist.

I am sorry that you had a problem with some (can't tell how many you've

seen) neuro, but we have seen about 6 neurologists (two of them women)

and got help and good advice from everyone of them.

Yes, neurologists are human and can make mistakes as pointed out,

but if we polled this group, and they all took a reasonable look at the

care they are getting (don't forget MSA is an incurable disorder), I feel

most here have had reasonably good care from their neurologist. To

make statements that run down all doctors is not only irrational but also

as biased a position as you accuse the doctors of doing. You do NOT

live in the USA where most of the people on the list live and you ARE quite

possibly HURTING people here by raising doubts in their minds as to the

care they are receiving. Attacking Fisher for perceived sex

discrimination does no one any good as I read his email and saw nothing

about sex, he was referring (from my reading of the emails) to the emails

of you and Bill Pilgrim (a male who I have met in person) attacking all

neurologists (and you admit two of your neurologists were women).

You admit that some of the doctors you saw were women, so I do not understand

why sex came into the picture at all. I CAN guarantee that your letter

that you attached to your email is so irrational that it will not be viewed

as a genuine complaint. If you are going to complain to the government,

you need to sit down and sort out facts from incoherent accusations.

I do know some of the things you have said before and this letter does

NOT make sense to me. How will it make sense to someone who does

not know about all that went on? The police in the USA have NOTHING

to do with doctors - are you saying that everyone in the government - doctors,

nurses, social workers, judges, police, healthcare aides and therapists

are all ganging up to deny you healthcare? If there is that big a

conspiracy against you, you are in trouble.

Read your letter to the government (below) and 's email (below that).

Then calmly explain to me how you can find ANYTHING said as sexist.

I agree strongly with 's statement "Folks, get off it!" Attacking

all neurologists is BAD for the people on this list. If you do not

believe your neurologist, you must not have MSA, because only a neurologist

can diagnose you as having MSA. If you do believe your neurologist,

you NEED to work with them and follow their instructions in order to get

the best care you can receive.

Take care, Bill Werre

-----------------------------------------------------------

You wrote:

Yesterday I also sent this letter

to the provincial government.

_________________________________________________________________

I'm so sick and tired of being made guilty and lowly

about being disadvantaged (due to disability mind you.) There are

the repetative hoops to jump through, no one cares if my illness is terminal

and get progressively worse. Oh no. Once the three months are

up for the liquid meals (because I often cannot swallow or chew well, and

eating is so difficult I cannot get enough food intake), I am made to beg

again to get the forms submitted to my doctor, who I have to then remind,

and then on top of it it is declined, because it was designed for post-op

therapy. Message here, if we cannot repair it just die already.

Of course there are appeals, a healthy person can do that but my energies

don't stretch that far (lucky for you, not for me.) My energies don't

stretch to standing in line for handouts either, causing me to choose between

necessities (food or eye drops.)

My homecare and home visits were cancelled because

someone (I still don't know who) complained that my son's mental illness

posed a threat. The MHT barged in one morning turned life upside

down. Even though they did not seem to consider him a threat my services

were cancelled. It took me years to finally get some help, they were

doctor ordered, and then just one month later they were gone. Somehow

magically I am to go to their offices or make phone calls (if this was

so simple,

British Columbia is denying needed services to its

citizens, the elderly the disabled and the indigent, those who cannot muster

a protest, Elderly people are being evicted from long term care facilities

with no place to go. Long-time married couples are forced to part

ways (in their 90's). Families are expected to take them in when

they are already stretched to the limits under a government which taxes

to 52% plus sundry taxes (sales tax, GST, property tax, transport tax,

gas tax, sin tax). Doctors are again threatening to srike, when the

patients are already on extended waiting lists from all the other bed closures

and other employee strikes. Add this to an already shrinking medical

professional numbers (40% of specialist will likely retire, many doctors

and nurses working south of the border). Food supplement, PT and

other therapies and homecare are cut no matter how high the need.

We have only 2 opposition members in the legislature (which officially

does not constitute an opposition). The impact on the upper-middle

and upper classes is minimal, in fact corporations are being given grants,

tax cuts and bail-outs. Those of us on the scrap heap have no friends

there.

I wrote to my elected representative (one of the two

remaining opposition members) that we should have and 'adopt a pauper'

program, where wealthy families could adopt the unfortunate. They

would never have to see us (that might be embarrasing for them), but, we

could send letters and photographs to let them know we are grateful.

Perhaps Sally Struthers could donate some time. In return we could

become tax deductions, and they could pat themselves on the back for being

great humanitarians. Where I live the mood is getting ugly and desperate.

____________________________________

Fisher wrote:

Folks, get off it! Everyone faces doctors that don't have a

clue. I

just wonder how my customers feel about me sometimes!

Please remember, that in general we hire our doctors and can fire

them.

I realize this is not always the case. Even when it is not,

you have an

avenue of grievance. The important thing is to stay calm and

professional about the situation.

And yes, there is some sexual discrimination in play. My wife

and I

have gone shopping for a car, that she was purchasing. Not

me. Her

money, her choice. Well of course we get to the car lot and

the sales

'thing' would ONLY talk with me. I march into the sales manager's

office and explain what a slime ball his sales rep has been, and

we WILL

take our business elsewhere. My wife goes several times and

hears

statements such as "Bring your husband back and we can talk...".

The

difference. She does not confront. This is a male vs.

female

difference. Women on general attempt to socialize and not

confront.

Men tend to see the world in pecking orders. And I REFUSE

to have some

person paid minimal wage treat me or my wife as if I do not exist.

I

confront.

As a result of this difference doctors do pay attention to me.

Or I

fire them. I had a neurologist decide to blame the patient

and tell me

it was just anxiety. I confronted. I wondered where

he Diploma of

Psychiatry was located. I had not seen it. I then asked

her to prove

to me that it was anxiety. She could not, but did not want

to change

her diagnosis. I walked and found another doctor. That

simple. But I

bet she will think twice before blaming the patient again.

Doctors are no different than the rest of us. Believe me.

I see

similar behaviors in computer 'experts' all the time. When

in doubt,

blame the customer. When in doubt, assume the client is incompetent.

When in doubt ... And you know what? I confront them

all the time.

And I also see more male customers confront us when someone pulls

such a

maneuver on them.

So, get off it! Doctors are people too. If you don't

want them to act

as if they are on a pedestal, don't treat them that way.

May 27, 2002

Hello Bill W.

Not true, Ihave not been attacking all Neurologists or any for that mtter. I commented about the fact that I had a few experiences with GPs who treat many people with the problem that I have been said to have as Psychiatric cases. Do you have any Doctors over there who do the same? Would not dream of trying to convincing people not to take notice of their Neuros. I have not had any experiences in that area. I believe that every body's experiences are relevant and reserve the right to say so. If I was trying to force my opinions on anybody there would be room to complain. In the meantime I will email to anybody with an opinion. I don't think that I have over done anything and don't give anybody any misleading information, or medical advice, as some do, which is probably far worse.

Regards from Bill Pilgrim in Australia

Re: neurologists - gender issue?

Aletta, I strongly suggest that you take your fight with neurologists OFF the list and into the courts. This list is primarily for people with movement disorders and their caregivers. These people NEED to depend on their neurologists for medical care and your constant attack on neurologists COULD cause someone to ignore valuable advice from their neurologist. I am sorry that you had a problem with some (can't tell how many you've seen) neuro, but we have seen about 6 neurologists (two of them women) and got help and good advice from everyone of them. Yes, neurologists are human and can make mistakes as pointed out, but if we polled this group, and they all took a reasonable look at the care they are getting (don't forget MSA is an incurable disorder), I feel most here have had reasonably good care from their neurologist. To make statements that run down all doctors is not only irrational but also as biased a position as you accuse the doctors of doing. You do NOT live in the USA where most of the people on the list live and you ARE quite possibly HURTING people here by raising doubts in their minds as to the care they are receiving. Attacking Fisher for perceived sex discrimination does no one any good as I read his email and saw nothing about sex, he was referring (from my reading of the emails) to the emails of you and Bill Pilgrim (a male who I have met in person) attacking all neurologists (and you admit two of your neurologists were women). You admit that some of the doctors you saw were women, so I do not understand why sex came into the picture at all. I CAN guarantee that your letter that you attached to your email is so irrational that it will not be viewed as a genuine complaint. If you are going to complain to the government, you need to sit down and sort out facts from incoherent accusations. I do know some of the things you have said before and this letter does NOT make sense to me. How will it make sense to someone who does not know about all that went on? The police in the USA have NOTHING to do with doctors - are you saying that everyone in the government - doctors, nurses, social workers, judges, police, healthcare aides and therapists are all ganging up to deny you healthcare? If there is that big a conspiracy against you, you are in trouble. Read your letter to the government (below) and 's email (below that). Then calmly explain to me how you can find ANYTHING said as sexist. I agree strongly with 's statement "Folks, get off it!" Attacking all neurologists is BAD for the people on this list. If you do not believe your neurologist, you must not have MSA, because only a neurologist can diagnose you as having MSA. If you do believe your neurologist, you NEED to work with them and follow their instructions in order to get the best care you can receive. Take care, Bill Werre ----------------------------------------------------------- You wrote:

Yesterday I also sent this letter to the provincial government. _________________________________________________________________ I'm so sick and tired of being made guilty and lowly about being disadvantaged (due to disability mind you.) There are the repetative hoops to jump through, no one cares if my illness is terminal and get progressively worse. Oh no. Once the three months are up for the liquid meals (because I often cannot swallow or chew well, and eating is so difficult I cannot get enough food intake), I am made to beg again to get the forms submitted to my doctor, who I have to then remind, and then on top of it it is declined, because it was designed for post-op therapy. Message here, if we cannot repair it just die already. Of course there are appeals, a healthy person can do that but my energies don't stretch that far (lucky for you, not for me.) My energies don't stretch to standing in line for handouts either, causing me to choose between necessities (food or eye drops.) My homecare and home visits were cancelled because someone (I still don't know who) complained that my son's mental illness posed a threat. The MHT barged in one morning turned life upside down. Even though they did not seem to consider him a threat my services were cancelled. It took me years to finally get some help, they were doctor ordered, and then just one month later they were gone. Somehow magically I am to go to their offices or make phone calls (if this was so simple, British Columbia is denying needed services to its citizens, the elderly the disabled and the indigent, those who cannot muster a protest, Elderly people are being evicted from long term care facilities with no place to go. Long-time married couples are forced to part ways (in their 90's). Families are expected to take them in when they are already stretched to the limits under a government which taxes to 52% plus sundry taxes (sales tax, GST, property tax, transport tax, gas tax, sin tax). Doctors are again threatening to srike, when the patients are already on extended waiting lists from all the other bed closures and other employee strikes. Add this to an already shrinking medical professional numbers (40% of specialist will likely retire, many doctors and nurses working south of the border). Food supplement, PT and other therapies and homecare are cut no matter how high the need. We have only 2 opposition members in the legislature (which officially does not constitute an opposition). The impact on the upper-middle and upper classes is minimal, in fact corporations are being given grants, tax cuts and bail-outs. Those of us on the scrap heap have no friends there. I wrote to my elected representative (one of the two remaining opposition members) that we should have and 'adopt a pauper' program, where wealthy families could adopt the unfortunate. They would never have to see us (that might be embarrasing for them), but, we could send letters and photographs to let them know we are grateful. Perhaps Sally Struthers could donate some time. In return we could become tax deductions, and they could pat themselves on the back for being great humanitarians. Where I live the mood is getting ugly and desperate. ____________________________________

Fisher wrote: Folks, get off it! Everyone faces doctors that don't have a clue. I just wonder how my customers feel about me sometimes! Please remember, that in general we hire our doctors and can fire them. I realize this is not always the case. Even when it is not, you have an avenue of grievance. The important thing is to stay calm and professional about the situation. And yes, there is some sexual discrimination in play. My wife and I have gone shopping for a car, that she was purchasing. Not me. Her money, her choice. Well of course we get to the car lot and the sales 'thing' would ONLY talk with me. I march into the sales manager's office and explain what a slime ball his sales rep has been, and we WILL take our business elsewhere. My wife goes several times and hears statements such as "Bring your husband back and we can talk...". The difference. She does not confront. This is a male vs. female difference. Women on general attempt to socialize and not confront. Men tend to see the world in pecking orders. And I REFUSE to have some person paid minimal wage treat me or my wife as if I do not exist. I confront. As a result of this difference doctors do pay attention to me. Or I fire them. I had a neurologist decide to blame the patient and tell me it was just anxiety. I confronted. I wondered where he Diploma of Psychiatry was located. I had not seen it. I then asked her to prove to me that it was anxiety. She could not, but did not want to change her diagnosis. I walked and found another doctor. That simple. But I bet she will think twice before blaming the patient again. Doctors are no different than the rest of us. Believe me. I see similar behaviors in computer 'experts' all the time. When in doubt, blame the customer. When in doubt, assume the client is incompetent. When in doubt ... And you know what? I confront them all the time. And I also see more male customers confront us when someone pulls such a maneuver on them. So, get off it! Doctors are people too. If you don't want them to act as if they are on a pedestal, don't treat them that way. If you do not wish to belong to shydrager, you may unsubscribe by sending a blank email to shydrager-unsubscribe

May 27, 2002

Hello Bill W.

Not true, Ihave not been attacking all Neurologists or any for that mtter. I commented about the fact that I had a few experiences with GPs who treat many people with the problem that I have been said to have as Psychiatric cases. Do you have any Doctors over there who do the same? Would not dream of trying to convincing people not to take notice of their Neuros. I have not had any experiences in that area. I believe that every body's experiences are relevant and reserve the right to say so. If I was trying to force my opinions on anybody there would be room to complain. In the meantime I will email to anybody with an opinion. I don't think that I have over done anything and don't give anybody any misleading information, or medical advice, as some do, which is probably far worse.

Regards from Bill Pilgrim in Australia

Re: neurologists - gender issue?

Aletta, I strongly suggest that you take your fight with neurologists OFF the list and into the courts. This list is primarily for people with movement disorders and their caregivers. These people NEED to depend on their neurologists for medical care and your constant attack on neurologists COULD cause someone to ignore valuable advice from their neurologist. I am sorry that you had a problem with some (can't tell how many you've seen) neuro, but we have seen about 6 neurologists (two of them women) and got help and good advice from everyone of them. Yes, neurologists are human and can make mistakes as pointed out, but if we polled this group, and they all took a reasonable look at the care they are getting (don't forget MSA is an incurable disorder), I feel most here have had reasonably good care from their neurologist. To make statements that run down all doctors is not only irrational but also as biased a position as you accuse the doctors of doing. You do NOT live in the USA where most of the people on the list live and you ARE quite possibly HURTING people here by raising doubts in their minds as to the care they are receiving. Attacking Fisher for perceived sex discrimination does no one any good as I read his email and saw nothing about sex, he was referring (from my reading of the emails) to the emails of you and Bill Pilgrim (a male who I have met in person) attacking all neurologists (and you admit two of your neurologists were women). You admit that some of the doctors you saw were women, so I do not understand why sex came into the picture at all. I CAN guarantee that your letter that you attached to your email is so irrational that it will not be viewed as a genuine complaint. If you are going to complain to the government, you need to sit down and sort out facts from incoherent accusations. I do know some of the things you have said before and this letter does NOT make sense to me. How will it make sense to someone who does not know about all that went on? The police in the USA have NOTHING to do with doctors - are you saying that everyone in the government - doctors, nurses, social workers, judges, police, healthcare aides and therapists are all ganging up to deny you healthcare? If there is that big a conspiracy against you, you are in trouble. Read your letter to the government (below) and 's email (below that). Then calmly explain to me how you can find ANYTHING said as sexist. I agree strongly with 's statement "Folks, get off it!" Attacking all neurologists is BAD for the people on this list. If you do not believe your neurologist, you must not have MSA, because only a neurologist can diagnose you as having MSA. If you do believe your neurologist, you NEED to work with them and follow their instructions in order to get the best care you can receive. Take care, Bill Werre ----------------------------------------------------------- You wrote:

Yesterday I also sent this letter to the provincial government. _________________________________________________________________ I'm so sick and tired of being made guilty and lowly about being disadvantaged (due to disability mind you.) There are the repetative hoops to jump through, no one cares if my illness is terminal and get progressively worse. Oh no. Once the three months are up for the liquid meals (because I often cannot swallow or chew well, and eating is so difficult I cannot get enough food intake), I am made to beg again to get the forms submitted to my doctor, who I have to then remind, and then on top of it it is declined, because it was designed for post-op therapy. Message here, if we cannot repair it just die already. Of course there are appeals, a healthy person can do that but my energies don't stretch that far (lucky for you, not for me.) My energies don't stretch to standing in line for handouts either, causing me to choose between necessities (food or eye drops.) My homecare and home visits were cancelled because someone (I still don't know who) complained that my son's mental illness posed a threat. The MHT barged in one morning turned life upside down. Even though they did not seem to consider him a threat my services were cancelled. It took me years to finally get some help, they were doctor ordered, and then just one month later they were gone. Somehow magically I am to go to their offices or make phone calls (if this was so simple, British Columbia is denying needed services to its citizens, the elderly the disabled and the indigent, those who cannot muster a protest, Elderly people are being evicted from long term care facilities with no place to go. Long-time married couples are forced to part ways (in their 90's). Families are expected to take them in when they are already stretched to the limits under a government which taxes to 52% plus sundry taxes (sales tax, GST, property tax, transport tax, gas tax, sin tax). Doctors are again threatening to srike, when the patients are already on extended waiting lists from all the other bed closures and other employee strikes. Add this to an already shrinking medical professional numbers (40% of specialist will likely retire, many doctors and nurses working south of the border). Food supplement, PT and other therapies and homecare are cut no matter how high the need. We have only 2 opposition members in the legislature (which officially does not constitute an opposition). The impact on the upper-middle and upper classes is minimal, in fact corporations are being given grants, tax cuts and bail-outs. Those of us on the scrap heap have no friends there. I wrote to my elected representative (one of the two remaining opposition members) that we should have and 'adopt a pauper' program, where wealthy families could adopt the unfortunate. They would never have to see us (that might be embarrasing for them), but, we could send letters and photographs to let them know we are grateful. Perhaps Sally Struthers could donate some time. In return we could become tax deductions, and they could pat themselves on the back for being great humanitarians. Where I live the mood is getting ugly and desperate. ____________________________________

Fisher wrote: Folks, get off it! Everyone faces doctors that don't have a clue. I just wonder how my customers feel about me sometimes! Please remember, that in general we hire our doctors and can fire them. I realize this is not always the case. Even when it is not, you have an avenue of grievance. The important thing is to stay calm and professional about the situation. And yes, there is some sexual discrimination in play. My wife and I have gone shopping for a car, that she was purchasing. Not me. Her money, her choice. Well of course we get to the car lot and the sales 'thing' would ONLY talk with me. I march into the sales manager's office and explain what a slime ball his sales rep has been, and we WILL take our business elsewhere. My wife goes several times and hears statements such as "Bring your husband back and we can talk...". The difference. She does not confront. This is a male vs. female difference. Women on general attempt to socialize and not confront. Men tend to see the world in pecking orders. And I REFUSE to have some person paid minimal wage treat me or my wife as if I do not exist. I confront. As a result of this difference doctors do pay attention to me. Or I fire them. I had a neurologist decide to blame the patient and tell me it was just anxiety. I confronted. I wondered where he Diploma of Psychiatry was located. I had not seen it. I then asked her to prove to me that it was anxiety. She could not, but did not want to change her diagnosis. I walked and found another doctor. That simple. But I bet she will think twice before blaming the patient again. Doctors are no different than the rest of us. Believe me. I see similar behaviors in computer 'experts' all the time. When in doubt, blame the customer. When in doubt, assume the client is incompetent. When in doubt ... And you know what? I confront them all the time. And I also see more male customers confront us when someone pulls such a maneuver on them. So, get off it! Doctors are people too. If you don't want them to act as if they are on a pedestal, don't treat them that way. If you do not wish to belong to shydrager, you may unsubscribe by sending a blank email to shydrager-unsubscribe

May 27, 2002

Hello Bill W.

Not true, Ihave not been attacking all Neurologists or any for that mtter. I commented about the fact that I had a few experiences with GPs who treat many people with the problem that I have been said to have as Psychiatric cases. Do you have any Doctors over there who do the same? Would not dream of trying to convincing people not to take notice of their Neuros. I have not had any experiences in that area. I believe that every body's experiences are relevant and reserve the right to say so. If I was trying to force my opinions on anybody there would be room to complain. In the meantime I will email to anybody with an opinion. I don't think that I have over done anything and don't give anybody any misleading information, or medical advice, as some do, which is probably far worse.

Regards from Bill Pilgrim in Australia

Re: neurologists - gender issue?

Aletta, I strongly suggest that you take your fight with neurologists OFF the list and into the courts. This list is primarily for people with movement disorders and their caregivers. These people NEED to depend on their neurologists for medical care and your constant attack on neurologists COULD cause someone to ignore valuable advice from their neurologist. I am sorry that you had a problem with some (can't tell how many you've seen) neuro, but we have seen about 6 neurologists (two of them women) and got help and good advice from everyone of them. Yes, neurologists are human and can make mistakes as pointed out, but if we polled this group, and they all took a reasonable look at the care they are getting (don't forget MSA is an incurable disorder), I feel most here have had reasonably good care from their neurologist. To make statements that run down all doctors is not only irrational but also as biased a position as you accuse the doctors of doing. You do NOT live in the USA where most of the people on the list live and you ARE quite possibly HURTING people here by raising doubts in their minds as to the care they are receiving. Attacking Fisher for perceived sex discrimination does no one any good as I read his email and saw nothing about sex, he was referring (from my reading of the emails) to the emails of you and Bill Pilgrim (a male who I have met in person) attacking all neurologists (and you admit two of your neurologists were women). You admit that some of the doctors you saw were women, so I do not understand why sex came into the picture at all. I CAN guarantee that your letter that you attached to your email is so irrational that it will not be viewed as a genuine complaint. If you are going to complain to the government, you need to sit down and sort out facts from incoherent accusations. I do know some of the things you have said before and this letter does NOT make sense to me. How will it make sense to someone who does not know about all that went on? The police in the USA have NOTHING to do with doctors - are you saying that everyone in the government - doctors, nurses, social workers, judges, police, healthcare aides and therapists are all ganging up to deny you healthcare? If there is that big a conspiracy against you, you are in trouble. Read your letter to the government (below) and 's email (below that). Then calmly explain to me how you can find ANYTHING said as sexist. I agree strongly with 's statement "Folks, get off it!" Attacking all neurologists is BAD for the people on this list. If you do not believe your neurologist, you must not have MSA, because only a neurologist can diagnose you as having MSA. If you do believe your neurologist, you NEED to work with them and follow their instructions in order to get the best care you can receive. Take care, Bill Werre ----------------------------------------------------------- You wrote:

Yesterday I also sent this letter to the provincial government. _________________________________________________________________ I'm so sick and tired of being made guilty and lowly about being disadvantaged (due to disability mind you.) There are the repetative hoops to jump through, no one cares if my illness is terminal and get progressively worse. Oh no. Once the three months are up for the liquid meals (because I often cannot swallow or chew well, and eating is so difficult I cannot get enough food intake), I am made to beg again to get the forms submitted to my doctor, who I have to then remind, and then on top of it it is declined, because it was designed for post-op therapy. Message here, if we cannot repair it just die already. Of course there are appeals, a healthy person can do that but my energies don't stretch that far (lucky for you, not for me.) My energies don't stretch to standing in line for handouts either, causing me to choose between necessities (food or eye drops.) My homecare and home visits were cancelled because someone (I still don't know who) complained that my son's mental illness posed a threat. The MHT barged in one morning turned life upside down. Even though they did not seem to consider him a threat my services were cancelled. It took me years to finally get some help, they were doctor ordered, and then just one month later they were gone. Somehow magically I am to go to their offices or make phone calls (if this was so simple, British Columbia is denying needed services to its citizens, the elderly the disabled and the indigent, those who cannot muster a protest, Elderly people are being evicted from long term care facilities with no place to go. Long-time married couples are forced to part ways (in their 90's). Families are expected to take them in when they are already stretched to the limits under a government which taxes to 52% plus sundry taxes (sales tax, GST, property tax, transport tax, gas tax, sin tax). Doctors are again threatening to srike, when the patients are already on extended waiting lists from all the other bed closures and other employee strikes. Add this to an already shrinking medical professional numbers (40% of specialist will likely retire, many doctors and nurses working south of the border). Food supplement, PT and other therapies and homecare are cut no matter how high the need. We have only 2 opposition members in the legislature (which officially does not constitute an opposition). The impact on the upper-middle and upper classes is minimal, in fact corporations are being given grants, tax cuts and bail-outs. Those of us on the scrap heap have no friends there. I wrote to my elected representative (one of the two remaining opposition members) that we should have and 'adopt a pauper' program, where wealthy families could adopt the unfortunate. They would never have to see us (that might be embarrasing for them), but, we could send letters and photographs to let them know we are grateful. Perhaps Sally Struthers could donate some time. In return we could become tax deductions, and they could pat themselves on the back for being great humanitarians. Where I live the mood is getting ugly and desperate. ____________________________________

Fisher wrote: Folks, get off it! Everyone faces doctors that don't have a clue. I just wonder how my customers feel about me sometimes! Please remember, that in general we hire our doctors and can fire them. I realize this is not always the case. Even when it is not, you have an avenue of grievance. The important thing is to stay calm and professional about the situation. And yes, there is some sexual discrimination in play. My wife and I have gone shopping for a car, that she was purchasing. Not me. Her money, her choice. Well of course we get to the car lot and the sales 'thing' would ONLY talk with me. I march into the sales manager's office and explain what a slime ball his sales rep has been, and we WILL take our business elsewhere. My wife goes several times and hears statements such as "Bring your husband back and we can talk...". The difference. She does not confront. This is a male vs. female difference. Women on general attempt to socialize and not confront. Men tend to see the world in pecking orders. And I REFUSE to have some person paid minimal wage treat me or my wife as if I do not exist. I confront. As a result of this difference doctors do pay attention to me. Or I fire them. I had a neurologist decide to blame the patient and tell me it was just anxiety. I confronted. I wondered where he Diploma of Psychiatry was located. I had not seen it. I then asked her to prove to me that it was anxiety. She could not, but did not want to change her diagnosis. I walked and found another doctor. That simple. But I bet she will think twice before blaming the patient again. Doctors are no different than the rest of us. Believe me. I see similar behaviors in computer 'experts' all the time. When in doubt, blame the customer. When in doubt, assume the client is incompetent. When in doubt ... And you know what? I confront them all the time. And I also see more male customers confront us when someone pulls such a maneuver on them. So, get off it! Doctors are people too. If you don't want them to act as if they are on a pedestal, don't treat them that way. If you do not wish to belong to shydrager, you may unsubscribe by sending a blank email to shydrager-unsubscribe

May 27, 2002

Bill,

Thanks for your comments. They were well needed. It is so important that we all remain positive during the time that we have left with our loved ones suffering from MSA Shy-Drager. To those that our suffering, I know that it is hard to keep a positive attitude, but it is so important to look on the good side of things. All this negativity only brings people down, whether they be caregivers or suffering from the disease. We should know that our neurologists are not God, and we should know that they are doing everything they can to help us. We also should know that neurologists do not have all of the answers to this disease, because there are no answers at this time in our life. We have to trust in God and know that whatever happens it is part of His plan for us.

This list should be for help and support for both caregivers and for those that are suffering. If we stray away from that, then the list will be of no help to any of us.

Love and Gentle Hugs,

Verlene

May 27, 2002

Bless you, one day I hope we can meet, and I'll buy you a

beer. If they decide to deport me for being a huge pain in the ass,

I just might have no place to go but down-under.

At 5/27/02 06:20 AM Monday, you wrote:

Hello

Bill W.

Not true, Ihave not been attacking all

Neurologists or any for that mtter. I commented about the fact that

I had a few experiences with GPs who treat many people with the problem

that I have been said to have as Psychiatric cases. Do you have any

Doctors over there who do the same? Would not dream of trying

to convincing people not to take notice of their Neuros. I have not

had any experiences in that area. I believe that every body's

experiences are relevant and reserve the right to say so. If I was

trying to force my opinions on anybody there would be room to

complain. In the meantime I will email to anybody with an

opinion. I don't think that I have over done anything and don't

give anybody any misleading information, or medical advice, as some do,

which is probably far worse.

Regards from Bill Pilgrim in

Australia

Re: neurologists - gender issue?

Aletta,

I strongly suggest that you take your fight with neurologists OFF the list and into the courts. This list is primarily for people with movement disorders and their caregivers. These people NEED to depend on their neurologists for medical care and your constant attack on neurologists COULD

aletta mes

vancouver, bc Canada

web: http://aletta.0catch.com

May 27, 2002