Re: My mom's having a difficult time

May 1, 2002

In a message dated 05/01/2002 1:18:05 PM US Mountain Standard Time,

mjwb1@... writes:

<< My sisters and I keep assuring her that we know

that she took excellent care of him and that there was

nothing she could have done. It doesn't seem to help >>

,

I will bet it does help and that she really needs to hear you say this. She

did do the best she could and there was nothing she could do. In time she

will realize it.

Jean (phx)

May 1, 2002

,

Yes, those are standard feelings and hopefully she will get over them soon.

Does her church offer grieving consuling? If not have her talk to her

minister about her feelings or look for grieving consuling locally. If you

think it will help and she will agree I can telephone her (send me the number

off list). Or have her there sometime and we can set up a special chat for

caregivers who have lost a loved one.

Here is an exerpt from a website on grieving:

http://fl.essortment.com/stagesgrief_rbdm.htm

There are certain stages of grief. 1) Shock – Immediately following the death

of a loved one it is difficult to accept the loss. A feeling of unreality

occurs.

During those first days and through any religious rituals or memorials

there is a feeling of being-out-of-touch. 2) Emotional Release – the

awareness of just

how dreadful the loss is accompanied by intense pangs of grief. In this

stage a grieving individuals sleeps badly and weeps uncontrollably 3) Panic -

For some

time a grieving person can feel in the grip of mental instability. They

can find themselves wandering around aimlessly, forgetting things, and not

being able to

finish what they started. Physical symptoms also can appear -- tightness

in the throat, heaviness in the chest, an empty feeling in the stomach,

tiredness

and fatigue, headaches, migraine headaches, gastric and bowel upsets. 4)

Guilt – At this stage an individual can begin to feel guilty about failures

to do

enough for the deceased, guilt over what happened or what didn’t happen.

5) Hostility – Some individuals feel anger at what “caused” the loss of the

loved

one. 6) Inability to Resume Business-as-Usual Activities - the ability to

concentrate on day-to-day activities may be severely limited. It is important

to know

and recognize that this is a normal phenomenon. A grieving person’s entire

being – emotional, physical and spiritual, is focused on the loss that just

occurred.

Grief is a 100% experience. No one does it at 50%. 7) Reconciliation of

Grief – balance in life returns little by little, much like healing from a

severe physical

wound. There are no set timeframes for healing. Each individual is

different. 8) Hope - the sharp, ever present pain of grief will lessen and

hope for a

continued, yet different life emerges. Plans are made for the future and

the individual is able to move forward in life with good feelings knowing

they will

always remember and have memories of the loved one.

Grieving is difficult work. The following are some suggestion to help in

navigating the journey through grief.

-Take time. Don’t let others rush you into “getting over” your feelings.

-Don’t make major decisions. The time of grief is a time of instability.

-Avoid the temptation to use alcohol or drugs to numb the painful

feelings.

-Cry. Tears are the healthiest expression of grief. Don’t try to hold back

crying to the sake of others.

-Know that there will be good days and bad days. Pangs of intense grief

can surface during holidays, significant events such as birthdays or

anniversaries.

-Remember the loved one often and as much as you need to. Look at

photographs, read old letters and retell your memories to friends and other

members of

the family.

-Seek people who will understand your need to talk about what happened.

Seek out people who will really listen to your remembrances.

-Allow yourself time to heal. Pay attention to your health. Make sure you

are getting enough sleep. Eat a healthy diet. Get outside in the sunshine for

exercise or a mild walk.

-Ask for what you need from others. Accept what help they offer. Now is

not the time to try to do everything by yourself.

-Seek out grief counseling if you feel you cannot cope alone. Grief

counseling is available through community resources, churches and licensed

therapists.

Join a grief support group. Local community papers will usually have

listings. Use the Internet and join an electronic bulletin board dedicated to

supporting

individuals who have lost loved ones.

-Remember your grief is individual to you. Not everyone’s grief is

identical to yours. You will share some similarities with others, but

grieving is a very personal

and very individual process.

Take care, Bill Werre

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------\

---

M Bruner wrote:

> I know she is going to go through this, but I'm

> wondering if any of you who have been through this

> have some words of wisdom for me.

>

> She is really feeling guilty about everything

> surrounding my father's death. Logically, we all know

> that if God was ready to take him, there was nothing

> any of us could have done, but right now that's not

> much comfort. While it would have been awful to see

> him linger for months with tubes, etc., I don't think

> she would have felt guilty about things if he had gone

> that way. She's having such a hard time with the fact

> that he seemed really good on Monday (relatively

> speaking, of course) and was so bad on Tuesday and

> then just died that afternoon. She wonders if he had

> pneumonia and she didn't know it, and that maybe he'd

> be here if she had taken him to the Dr. that morning.

> (I admit that I wonder that, too, although I would

> never tell her that).

>

> She asked me today if I thought she caused him to

> aspirate when she turned him over on the bed. (He had

> fallen on the bed on his side when she was

> transferring him from the wheelchair). I think she

> wants to believe that his heart just stopped, but

> she's having a hard time truly believing it. She's

> also worried that he just gave up. I think, " Who could

> blame him if he did? " , but she worries that she didn't

> do enough to keep his spirits up so he gave up. She

> keeps asking me if others on this list died the way he

> did...so suddenly. She so needs to believe that there

> were others.

>

> She is also feeling that she didn't do enough for him

> while he was alive...didn't take him to see enough of

> the things he enjoyed, didn't take him out to eat

> enough, etc. She's feeling guilty for the times that

> she lost her patience and was a little short with him.

> I should tell you that she devoted 24 hours a day to

> his care and would never accept help from anyone.

>

> I'm rambling. For those of you who have been through

> this, are these normal feelings? What can I do to

> help? My sisters and I keep assuring her that we know

> that she took excellent care of him and that there was

> nothing she could have done. It doesn't seem to help

> much.

>

> Thx.

>

> __________________________________________________

>

May 1, 2002

,

My mother went through a similar thing when my father died. He

didn't have MSA (that's my hsuband) but had been very ill for several

months, and hospitalized for most of that time. She beat herself up

for about a year, off and on, until she finally accepted that nothing

she could have done would have made a real difference. Maybe a few

days or a month, but not a real difference.

I think it's a normal part of grieving to question these things.

When my father was so ill I was going through a difficult time

myself, both with health problems and with work and I sometimes think

I should have gotten down to see him one more time before he died.

(I actually did, but the last time I saw him he was not conscious and

I don't think he knew I was there.) But he knew I loved him and most

important, he was ready to go. I think if you can help your mother

accept that he was ready to go it will ease her mind a little. Other

than that it will just take time and tears to heal her heart.

Peace,

Carol & Rob

> I know she is going to go through this, but I'm

> wondering if any of you who have been through this

> have some words of wisdom for me.

>

> She is really feeling guilty about everything

> surrounding my father's death. Logically, we all know

> that if God was ready to take him, there was nothing

> any of us could have done, but right now that's not

> much comfort. While it would have been awful to see

> him linger for months with tubes, etc., I don't think

> she would have felt guilty about things if he had gone

> that way. She's having such a hard time with the fact

> that he seemed really good on Monday (relatively

> speaking, of course) and was so bad on Tuesday and

> then just died that afternoon. She wonders if he had

> pneumonia and she didn't know it, and that maybe he'd

> be here if she had taken him to the Dr. that morning.

> (I admit that I wonder that, too, although I would

> never tell her that).

>

> She asked me today if I thought she caused him to

> aspirate when she turned him over on the bed. (He had

> fallen on the bed on his side when she was

> transferring him from the wheelchair). I think she

> wants to believe that his heart just stopped, but

> she's having a hard time truly believing it. She's

> also worried that he just gave up. I think, " Who could

> blame him if he did? " , but she worries that she didn't

> do enough to keep his spirits up so he gave up. She

> keeps asking me if others on this list died the way he

> did...so suddenly. She so needs to believe that there

> were others.

>

> She is also feeling that she didn't do enough for him

> while he was alive...didn't take him to see enough of

> the things he enjoyed, didn't take him out to eat

> enough, etc. She's feeling guilty for the times that

> she lost her patience and was a little short with him.

> I should tell you that she devoted 24 hours a day to

> his care and would never accept help from anyone.

>

> I'm rambling. For those of you who have been through

> this, are these normal feelings? What can I do to

> help? My sisters and I keep assuring her that we know

> that she took excellent care of him and that there was

> nothing she could have done. It doesn't seem to help

> much.

>

> Thx.

>

> __________________________________________________

>

May 1, 2002

,

I can tell you that I am already worrying aobut guilt and my husband is

still alive. He is unable to move anything,but feed himself with lots of

trouble. Even so, I worry how I am going to feel once he is gone. (of

course I might go first) I also worry that maybe I shoudl be doing more.

Our PCP finally set me down and told me to stop searcging for cures and only

deal with the symptoms. That helped, but really and truly, I want him to be

back tohis normal atheletic self who loved to work in his yard, and loved to

pick up his gradchildren and swing them around.

I think the worry of guilt is in all of us. Somethings I wish that my

husband did not have to suffere the humilities of this illness, then I

really feel guilty, because I know now that the only way out is death.

I would be happy to talk with your mother. I am enrolling in counseling for

myself..

Marilyn

>

> Reply-To: shydrager

> Date: Wed, 1 May 2002 13:06:12 -0700 (PDT)

> To: shydrager

> Subject: My mom's having a difficult time

>

> I know she is going to go through this, but I'm

> wondering if any of you who have been through this

> have some words of wisdom for me.

>

> She is really feeling guilty about everything

> surrounding my father's death. Logically, we all know

> that if God was ready to take him, there was nothing

> any of us could have done, but right now that's not

> much comfort. While it would have been awful to see

> him linger for months with tubes, etc., I don't think

> she would have felt guilty about things if he had gone

> that way. She's having such a hard time with the fact

> that he seemed really good on Monday (relatively

> speaking, of course) and was so bad on Tuesday and

> then just died that afternoon. She wonders if he had

> pneumonia and she didn't know it, and that maybe he'd

> be here if she had taken him to the Dr. that morning.

> (I admit that I wonder that, too, although I would

> never tell her that).

>

> She asked me today if I thought she caused him to

> aspirate when she turned him over on the bed. (He had

> fallen on the bed on his side when she was

> transferring him from the wheelchair). I think she

> wants to believe that his heart just stopped, but

> she's having a hard time truly believing it. She's

> also worried that he just gave up. I think, " Who could

> blame him if he did? " , but she worries that she didn't

> do enough to keep his spirits up so he gave up. She

> keeps asking me if others on this list died the way he

> did...so suddenly. She so needs to believe that there

> were others.

>

> She is also feeling that she didn't do enough for him

> while he was alive...didn't take him to see enough of

> the things he enjoyed, didn't take him out to eat

> enough, etc. She's feeling guilty for the times that

> she lost her patience and was a little short with him.

> I should tell you that she devoted 24 hours a day to

> his care and would never accept help from anyone.

>

> I'm rambling. For those of you who have been through

> this, are these normal feelings? What can I do to

> help? My sisters and I keep assuring her that we know

> that she took excellent care of him and that there was

> nothing she could have done. It doesn't seem to help

> much.

>

> Thx.

>

> __________________________________________________

>

May 1, 2002

,

I can tell you that I am already worrying aobut guilt and my husband is

still alive. He is unable to move anything,but feed himself with lots of

trouble. Even so, I worry how I am going to feel once he is gone. (of

course I might go first) I also worry that maybe I shoudl be doing more.

Our PCP finally set me down and told me to stop searcging for cures and only

deal with the symptoms. That helped, but really and truly, I want him to be

back tohis normal atheletic self who loved to work in his yard, and loved to

pick up his gradchildren and swing them around.

I think the worry of guilt is in all of us. Somethings I wish that my

husband did not have to suffere the humilities of this illness, then I

really feel guilty, because I know now that the only way out is death.

I would be happy to talk with your mother. I am enrolling in counseling for

myself..

Marilyn

>

> Reply-To: shydrager

> Date: Wed, 1 May 2002 13:06:12 -0700 (PDT)

> To: shydrager

> Subject: My mom's having a difficult time

>

> I know she is going to go through this, but I'm

> wondering if any of you who have been through this

> have some words of wisdom for me.

>

> She is really feeling guilty about everything

> surrounding my father's death. Logically, we all know

> that if God was ready to take him, there was nothing

> any of us could have done, but right now that's not

> much comfort. While it would have been awful to see

> him linger for months with tubes, etc., I don't think

> she would have felt guilty about things if he had gone

> that way. She's having such a hard time with the fact

> that he seemed really good on Monday (relatively

> speaking, of course) and was so bad on Tuesday and

> then just died that afternoon. She wonders if he had

> pneumonia and she didn't know it, and that maybe he'd

> be here if she had taken him to the Dr. that morning.

> (I admit that I wonder that, too, although I would

> never tell her that).

>

> She asked me today if I thought she caused him to

> aspirate when she turned him over on the bed. (He had

> fallen on the bed on his side when she was

> transferring him from the wheelchair). I think she

> wants to believe that his heart just stopped, but

> she's having a hard time truly believing it. She's

> also worried that he just gave up. I think, " Who could

> blame him if he did? " , but she worries that she didn't

> do enough to keep his spirits up so he gave up. She

> keeps asking me if others on this list died the way he

> did...so suddenly. She so needs to believe that there

> were others.

>

> She is also feeling that she didn't do enough for him

> while he was alive...didn't take him to see enough of

> the things he enjoyed, didn't take him out to eat

> enough, etc. She's feeling guilty for the times that

> she lost her patience and was a little short with him.

> I should tell you that she devoted 24 hours a day to

> his care and would never accept help from anyone.

>

> I'm rambling. For those of you who have been through

> this, are these normal feelings? What can I do to

> help? My sisters and I keep assuring her that we know

> that she took excellent care of him and that there was

> nothing she could have done. It doesn't seem to help

> much.

>

> Thx.

>

> __________________________________________________

>

May 2, 2002

, I was so guilt ridden over my mother's death at times that I was

convinced that it was my phone call to her at the hospital (which she never

answered) that caused her to dislodge the tubes from her nose that caused

her aspiration (don't even know if that is what happened). Or, if you like

this one better: my kids and I were set to see my mom the weekend she ended

up in the hospital. We decided to wait until she got out. However, I am

convinced that if we had gone to NY as planned, we would have been at the

hospital when she aspirated and we would have caught it in time. You can go

on forever. There is always something more each one of us could have done.

But it doesn't work that way. Perhaps your mom should also realize that if

it hadn't been for her, your father might have gone a lot earlier. Debbie

May 2, 2002