To ERIKA/Re: Dr Ren [long] equally long

[Guest guest]

At 7:26 AM -0700 4/20/01, Montgomery wrote:

>...Let Deb be where she needs to be without defending herself. Just

>being present and a witness is a great gift to give a person in pain.

In other words: " Don't just do something; sit there! "

Right on,

--Steve

[Guest guest]

A part of healing is feeling the feelings... going though it.. wading into

the river, so to speak, experiencing what is there. Each of us heals on

our own schedule, in our own way. People in pain rarely need to be told to

" hurry up " or " get over it " or handle it like someone else handled theirs.

In fact, most need to be heard, to know that they are heard. Despite the

temptation to do so, rarely is giving advice useful when not asked for. I

have not seen Deb ask for advice.

Deb is a very bright savvy woman. There is probably nothing about coping

that you can tell her that she is not qualified to teach to others. When

she is ready to move in a different direction, she will do so.

Lend your ears, eyes and heart. Save the advice. Usually it feels like

invalidation to the person who is in pain. Let Deb be where she needs to be

without defending herself. Just being present and a witness is a great gift

to give a person in pain.

in Seattle

----- Original Message -----

> I DO care very much about Deb as she goes through this

> challenging ordeal. As we go through life, we can respond to

> challenges in a way that facilitates our coping with it or we can

> respond in a way that makes it more difficult. Someone once

> said to me, " When you find yourself in `problem mode', get

> out of problem and into solution. " A bit of anger can serve to

> compel someone to act. I think that Deb's anger is working

> against her because it's overwhelming her.

>

> I am not naive enough to think that the activities I suggested are

> Band-Aids that will make her problem go away. However, I do

> know that whenever one has been sick a very long time, or

> depressed an extended period of time, or even working too hard

> for too long, things that are merely diversions serve to take one's

> mind off the problem. Things that are pleasurable serve as a

> respite from bearing a difficult burden. These things do not cure

> ills in and of themselves; but they can serve as a life preserver

> helping us to cope better.

>

> I DO feel compassion for Deb. If I didn't I would not have taken

> the time to contemplate what to write and then to post it. My

> prayers are with Deb, but I pray that she copes with her life, not

> `slay the dragon'. `Slaying the Dragon' speaks of anger, fight and

> negativity. `Coping with her life' DOES NOT mean that she

> just ignore the situation or simply `get over it'. It's not

> that simple. My prayer that she copes with her life speaks of

> healing. Healing includes treating ourselves. Part of that might

> still include challenging Dr. Ren. Only Deb can decide that.

>

> gobo

> " Sometimes We Never Know How We Influence the Lives of

> Others, Yet We Touch Those Lives Just the Same "

>

>

> ----------------------------------------------------------------------

>

[Guest guest]

A part of healing is feeling the feelings... going though it.. wading into

the river, so to speak, experiencing what is there. Each of us heals on

our own schedule, in our own way. People in pain rarely need to be told to

" hurry up " or " get over it " or handle it like someone else handled theirs.

In fact, most need to be heard, to know that they are heard. Despite the

temptation to do so, rarely is giving advice useful when not asked for. I

have not seen Deb ask for advice.

Deb is a very bright savvy woman. There is probably nothing about coping

that you can tell her that she is not qualified to teach to others. When

she is ready to move in a different direction, she will do so.

Lend your ears, eyes and heart. Save the advice. Usually it feels like

invalidation to the person who is in pain. Let Deb be where she needs to be

without defending herself. Just being present and a witness is a great gift

to give a person in pain.

in Seattle

----- Original Message -----

> I DO care very much about Deb as she goes through this

> challenging ordeal. As we go through life, we can respond to

> challenges in a way that facilitates our coping with it or we can

> respond in a way that makes it more difficult. Someone once

> said to me, " When you find yourself in `problem mode', get

> out of problem and into solution. " A bit of anger can serve to

> compel someone to act. I think that Deb's anger is working

> against her because it's overwhelming her.

>

> I am not naive enough to think that the activities I suggested are

> Band-Aids that will make her problem go away. However, I do

> know that whenever one has been sick a very long time, or

> depressed an extended period of time, or even working too hard

> for too long, things that are merely diversions serve to take one's

> mind off the problem. Things that are pleasurable serve as a

> respite from bearing a difficult burden. These things do not cure

> ills in and of themselves; but they can serve as a life preserver

> helping us to cope better.

>

> I DO feel compassion for Deb. If I didn't I would not have taken

> the time to contemplate what to write and then to post it. My

> prayers are with Deb, but I pray that she copes with her life, not

> `slay the dragon'. `Slaying the Dragon' speaks of anger, fight and

> negativity. `Coping with her life' DOES NOT mean that she

> just ignore the situation or simply `get over it'. It's not

> that simple. My prayer that she copes with her life speaks of

> healing. Healing includes treating ourselves. Part of that might

> still include challenging Dr. Ren. Only Deb can decide that.

>

> gobo

> " Sometimes We Never Know How We Influence the Lives of

> Others, Yet We Touch Those Lives Just the Same "

>

>

> ----------------------------------------------------------------------

>

[Guest guest]

A part of healing is feeling the feelings... going though it.. wading into

the river, so to speak, experiencing what is there. Each of us heals on

our own schedule, in our own way. People in pain rarely need to be told to

" hurry up " or " get over it " or handle it like someone else handled theirs.

In fact, most need to be heard, to know that they are heard. Despite the

temptation to do so, rarely is giving advice useful when not asked for. I

have not seen Deb ask for advice.

Deb is a very bright savvy woman. There is probably nothing about coping

that you can tell her that she is not qualified to teach to others. When

she is ready to move in a different direction, she will do so.

Lend your ears, eyes and heart. Save the advice. Usually it feels like

invalidation to the person who is in pain. Let Deb be where she needs to be

without defending herself. Just being present and a witness is a great gift

to give a person in pain.

in Seattle

----- Original Message -----

> I DO care very much about Deb as she goes through this

> challenging ordeal. As we go through life, we can respond to

> challenges in a way that facilitates our coping with it or we can

> respond in a way that makes it more difficult. Someone once

> said to me, " When you find yourself in `problem mode', get

> out of problem and into solution. " A bit of anger can serve to

> compel someone to act. I think that Deb's anger is working

> against her because it's overwhelming her.

>

> I am not naive enough to think that the activities I suggested are

> Band-Aids that will make her problem go away. However, I do

> know that whenever one has been sick a very long time, or

> depressed an extended period of time, or even working too hard

> for too long, things that are merely diversions serve to take one's

> mind off the problem. Things that are pleasurable serve as a

> respite from bearing a difficult burden. These things do not cure

> ills in and of themselves; but they can serve as a life preserver

> helping us to cope better.

>

> I DO feel compassion for Deb. If I didn't I would not have taken

> the time to contemplate what to write and then to post it. My

> prayers are with Deb, but I pray that she copes with her life, not

> `slay the dragon'. `Slaying the Dragon' speaks of anger, fight and

> negativity. `Coping with her life' DOES NOT mean that she

> just ignore the situation or simply `get over it'. It's not

> that simple. My prayer that she copes with her life speaks of

> healing. Healing includes treating ourselves. Part of that might

> still include challenging Dr. Ren. Only Deb can decide that.

>

> gobo

> " Sometimes We Never Know How We Influence the Lives of

> Others, Yet We Touch Those Lives Just the Same "

>

>

> ----------------------------------------------------------------------

>

[Guest guest]

this is also true .sometimes we all need to vent. doesnot necessarily mean that we are looking for an immediate solution. though it is human nature to want to help.

[Guest guest]

this is also true .sometimes we all need to vent. doesnot necessarily mean that we are looking for an immediate solution. though it is human nature to want to help.

[Guest guest]

this is also true .sometimes we all need to vent. doesnot necessarily mean that we are looking for an immediate solution. though it is human nature to want to help.

[Guest guest]

I'm sorry to hear that gobo. I think offering " helpful " advice is the

unfortunate response of many well meaning people. Listening and supporting

without making suggestions can be much harder to do. IMHO it's a great

skill to develop.

in Seattle

----- Original Message -----

I cannot listen to someone tell

> me how much they are suffering and then simply say, " thanks for

> sharing " , at least not when something occurs to me that might

> be helpful.

[Guest guest]

I'm sorry to hear that gobo. I think offering " helpful " advice is the

unfortunate response of many well meaning people. Listening and supporting

without making suggestions can be much harder to do. IMHO it's a great

skill to develop.

in Seattle

----- Original Message -----

I cannot listen to someone tell

> me how much they are suffering and then simply say, " thanks for

> sharing " , at least not when something occurs to me that might

> be helpful.

[Guest guest]

This thing is making me laugh. I'm sorry but you are doing the same

thing to Gobo that you said she shouldn't do to Deb. You guys crack

me up!

I didn't see Deb having any trouble communicating with Gobo. Maybe

two-sided conversations should remain just that, TWO sided. Then no

one feels ganged up on, no matter what the intentions...

My opinion is that everyone here seems to have pure intentions, and

maybe we should think about that when responding to each other.

I,for one, hope Gobo stays and continues to do what she does best, be

herself. Oh, and too. And Deb.

D

> I'm sorry to hear that gobo. I think offering " helpful " advice is

the

> unfortunate response of many well meaning people. Listening and

supporting

> without making suggestions can be much harder to do. IMHO it's a

great

> skill to develop.

>

> in Seattle

[Guest guest]

At this emotional time in our lives, we will be harmed and lessoned with the

loss of even one of our members because of being afraid to speak. I thought

that was the whole idea behind this support group. I agree with Donna -

that everyone here seems to have pure intentions and that we should consider

this when responding to each other. We need to honor all sides. If we are

worried about every little thing we say then this does not become the

support group it should be. I have enjoyed and been helped by Gobo and

would feel such loss without her candid and thoughtful posts.

Janice in Texas

To ERIKA/Re: Dr Ren [long] equally long

> This thing is making me laugh. I'm sorry but you are doing the same

> thing to Gobo that you said she shouldn't do to Deb. You guys crack

> me up!

>

> I didn't see Deb having any trouble communicating with Gobo. Maybe

> two-sided conversations should remain just that, TWO sided. Then no

> one feels ganged up on, no matter what the intentions...

>

> My opinion is that everyone here seems to have pure intentions, and

> maybe we should think about that when responding to each other.

>

> I,for one, hope Gobo stays and continues to do what she does best, be

> herself. Oh, and too. And Deb.

>

> D

>

>

> > I'm sorry to hear that gobo. I think offering " helpful " advice is

> the

> > unfortunate response of many well meaning people. Listening and

> supporting

> > without making suggestions can be much harder to do. IMHO it's a

> great

> > skill to develop.

> >

> > in Seattle

>

>

> ----------------------------------------------------------------------

>