Re: To DEB/Re: Dr Ren [long] equally long

[Guest guest]

first, let me say to deb: excuse me if i'm overstepping my bounds. i know

you'll do a wonderful job of responding to this post but i just have to open my

big mouth.

> I'm so sorry about your unexpected outcome. Indeed you sound

> so incredibly angry that it's no wonder you're having such a hard

> time.

she not having an incredibly hard time because she's angry, she's having an

incredibly hard time because she can not eat ANYTHING without DUMPING. she's

having a hard time because she feels that she has been VIOLATED. she is the

victim of a recent and severe trauma and no one recovers from something like

that over night. she is going through the stages of GRIEF which is entirely

reasonable for someone in her position. i won't get into an argument about ren

and her competence, but i will say that anyone who has suffered a great loss

like deb has would be grieving. if one underwent

a surgery for a cyst in a leg, and woke up with no leg because of a surgical

mishap, they would GRIEVE for that leg and they would be ANGRY and they would be

DEPRESSED. these feelings are all real, appropriate and legitimate.

> You sound like you may be clinically depressed.

she is REASONABLY depressed. i have talked with deb in chat and she's a very

funny, personable individual. she's not clinically or chemically depressed, but

she certainly is depressed about what has happened to her and what it means for

the rest of her life. and she is within her rights to be. it's not a sign that

there is something wrong with her, but a sign that she is normal.

> >> " Exceptional patients want to know every detail of their x-ray

> > reports. They want to know what every number in their lab test

> means.

>

> Many years ago I too wanted to know what every single solitary

> value meant on my medical tests. Finally I realized that I was

> simply being overly pre-occupied with test results about which I

> could do little. My role came in following my doctor's instructions

> and asking enough questions so that I might understand why I

> was being asked to do certain things. Pouring over x-rays and

> lab tests like you describe just sounds oddly obsessed. I don't

> mean to sound offensive; this really is something I used to do all

> the time and can still relate to.

gobo, i don't want to be mean and i also want to express my feelings clearly.

GIVE ME A BREAK! deb is absolutely right. it is in a patient's best interests

to be as informed as possible and as involved as possible. my role is sure as

hell not to just do as i'm told, my role is to be an informed and involved

partner in my health care. i have personal experience with what happens when a

patient isn't active enough in their own care and it involved loss of life.

there are many wonderful doctors in the world, but it is our responsibility as

consumers to be as informed and involved as

possible.

> I'm sorry if it feels like I'm being harsh on you. I don't mean to

> treat you that way. I'm just thinking that if you could get on with

> your life and put the surgery behind you, you might be much

> happier. Try therapy and go to a mini-spa. Get a facial, a

> manicure, a massage and a mineral or mud soak! Your body will

> love you for it.

i can't believe that you are dismissing her experience in this way. i'm

insulted by it and it's not even about me! get a FACIAL! gobo, please get

SERIOUS. have you not been paying attention? have you not been present when

deb has described the dumping that she lives with every single day?? she's not

an idiot. i'm sure she is doing what she can to take care of herself and help

herself heal from this tragedy, but dumping after every meal can't be soaked

away in mud. i understand you wanting to encourage her, but have a little

f---ing compassion, man. think about what life is

like for her every day. think about how you would feel if something like this

happened to you. i think that deb is remarkably cheerful and positive

considering what has happened. i have spent hours with her in chat and she

spends very little time (virtually NONE) talking about the terrible thing that

happened to her and most of the time being her upbeat, delightful self and

supporting and encouraging others. you can't judge her based on the the anger

and sadness expressed in some of her posts, which by the way is completely

reasonable. if you want to help, then spend some time

thinking about things from her point of view before dismissing her very real

feelings and experience with rhetoric.

erika

5'2 " , 281.5#, bmi 51.5

surgery date 5.11.01 11:30 am

dr. herron

ps. with regards to deb's dumping, i would guess (and i underscore the word

GUESS) that her sleeve gastrectomy makes the situation worse. unlike with the

rny where the intestine is attached to the side of the pouch, hers is attached

at the bottom, meaning gravity would cause all food to move quickly downward

into the small intestine. from my LAYMAN'S UNINFORMED OPINION, a very bad

design. also, keep in mind what loss of the duodenum means. there are reasons

why we dsers are so passionate about this surgery so keep that in mind when

making judgments about deb's feelings regarding

not getting it and instead getting something that can't be changed or reversed

ever. she now lives with things many of us have said that we could not and

would not live with like dumping, the extreme chewing, no liquid with meals and

many other RNY restrictions.