Guest guest Posted January 13, 2005 Report Share Posted January 13, 2005 Sunny, It takes a LOT of energy to digest food even for non-mito folks. Remember all the naps after Thanksgiving dinners? If makes perfect sense to be tired at about the time you are after eating. z39z@... wrote: >Thanks, Lea > > for the connection between carbs, especially simple carbs, and >lactate. I can assoclate all of my major crashes with eating too many >carbs. It took a while to make the connection, but now that I have I >am convinced that I am much better off on protein and fats, and I make >sure that the restricted carbs I do take are with fats. I thought that >problem was due more to low blood sugar, since I tested strongly >hypoglycemic on the glucose tolerance test. It didn't add up totally >though, and I think the increased lactate is another piece of the >puzzle for me. Very interesting. A major relationship I am still >testing is between all food and getting very tired, to the point of >non-functional sometimes, 30-60 minutes afterwards. Seems I do best in >the part of the day that I don't eat anything at all. > >I have read that exercise, and here defined as movement, not >necessarily strength work, helps the body " clear " lactic acid. Also >that some things act as buffers for lactic acid, among them L-glutamine >and Alka Selzer. (For sure I cant take all the sodium in Alka Selzer) >Unfortunately, I can't find that source - I think it was in one of the >muscle magazines, but just cant locate it at this point. While it >won't cure us, if we can do something to reduce, eliminate, or >neutralize the lactate, it seems like it might help to reduce some of >our symptoms. I wish I knew more! > >It is so comforting to be able to share experiences and share (mostly >learn) on this site. I appreciate everyone's postings. > >Regards > >Sunny > > > > > > > > >>I also find this thread interesting. I have always known I do better >> with protein, but anymore, if I do eat simple carbs, I get muscle pain >> within 10-15 minutes of me eating the carbs. It is different pain >>than >> the cramping pain I get from any type of activity. >> >> >> >> Barbara Seaman wrote: >> >> >Thanks, Lea. I can understand why you'd want to take your daughter >>along as >> > " interpreter. " Many times I have wished for one of those too! >>Anyway, I >> >appreciated your posts and when I can I will keep searching for more >>on this >> >connection. It got me to thinking about other possibilities beyond my >> >hyperinsulinemia as to why carbohydrates make some of my symptoms >>worse. >> > >> > >> > >> >Take care, >> > >> >Barbara >> > >> > >> > >> > _____ >> > >> >From: Lea >> >Sent: Thursday, January 13, 2005 12:44 PM >> >To: >> >Subject: Re: carbs and lactic acid >> > >> > >> > >> > >> >Hi Barbara, >> > >> >I'm afraid I don't have the answers to all your questions...although >>I have >> >asked my daughter who majored in microbiology to explain why sugar >>might >> >raise lactate a lot...she said she would try to give me a scientific >> >explanation in the next day or so. >> > >> >Also, I am going back to see Dr. Shoffner sometime this Spring after >>he is >> >finished sequencing my mito DNA and I will take a list of questions >>for him >> >to answer. I am hoping that my daughter could accompany me on the >>trip as >> >she could understand a lot of the scientific stuff a lot better than >>I can. >> >My brain seems to be affected by this mito thing and gets tired very >> >quickly, as does every other part of me! >> > >> >Personally, I think that since our mitochondria are damaged we tend >>to take >> >the lactate pathway frequently and when a lot of glucose is >>available...such >> >as when we eat a lot of sugar or refined carbs...our lactate pathway >>starts >> >going into overdrive. That is only my opinion, however...but it >>would make >> >sense since lactate levels rise when we have eaten. Perhaps that is >>why >> >they want us to fast when they do the testing. >> > >> >I know that both Tim and I seem to feel better before we eat. Both >>he and I >> >have a lot anerobic threshold so our oxygen utilization is badly >>impaired. >> >Tim doesn't have the same diagnosis as I do...they are still trying >>to >> >figure out what is causing his problems. >> > >> >I have been diagnosed with a complex I defect by Shoffner. I figure >>that >> >means that I have a kind of " short circuit " even before I can begin >> >Oxidatative Phosphorylation and that is probably why I produce so >>much >> >lactate and to anerobic so quickly since I don't produce much energy >> >aerobically. I also have high pyruvate which I guess means that it >>is there >> >ready to go into the ATP cycle and produce energy but somehow can't >>get in >> >to do its job and is just left lying around in my body. >> > >> >As for what determines what path or " fork in the road " the glucose >>takes, I >> >don't know...I don't know if the docs know either, but I will keep >>looking >> >and will post when I get any info. Take care. >> > >> >Lea >> > Re: Re: Calcium supplements and teenage girls >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > Gookinaid is better for hydration because it doesn't have all >>that sugar >> > and >> > artificial stuff in it. Sugar can raise levels of lactate. >>Look up >> > Gookinaid online at Google...it needs to be ordered online as >>well. >> > >> > Also, a couple of the best forms of calcium are calcium citrate, >>or >> > calcium >> > malate. Calcium carbonate is not absorbed well and can mess up >> >digestion >> > too. Calcium is best taken when it is in combination with >>magnesium, >> >zinc >> > and vitamin D in a balanced formula and like all vitamins should >>be >> > purchased from a quality company. Also, it is best to take it >>with >> >meals. >> > >> > Lea >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > , you might want to give her Gator Aid. This time of year >> > hydration has to be of consideration. It's really easy to get >> > dehydrated, and supplements can certainly make us even more >> > dehydrated. This would help with an electrolyte imbalance as >>well. >> > Good luck, I hope she feels better ! >> > >> > bug >> > >> > >> > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 13, 2005 Report Share Posted January 13, 2005 Sunny, It takes a LOT of energy to digest food even for non-mito folks. Remember all the naps after Thanksgiving dinners? If makes perfect sense to be tired at about the time you are after eating. z39z@... wrote: >Thanks, Lea > > for the connection between carbs, especially simple carbs, and >lactate. I can assoclate all of my major crashes with eating too many >carbs. It took a while to make the connection, but now that I have I >am convinced that I am much better off on protein and fats, and I make >sure that the restricted carbs I do take are with fats. I thought that >problem was due more to low blood sugar, since I tested strongly >hypoglycemic on the glucose tolerance test. It didn't add up totally >though, and I think the increased lactate is another piece of the >puzzle for me. Very interesting. A major relationship I am still >testing is between all food and getting very tired, to the point of >non-functional sometimes, 30-60 minutes afterwards. Seems I do best in >the part of the day that I don't eat anything at all. > >I have read that exercise, and here defined as movement, not >necessarily strength work, helps the body " clear " lactic acid. Also >that some things act as buffers for lactic acid, among them L-glutamine >and Alka Selzer. (For sure I cant take all the sodium in Alka Selzer) >Unfortunately, I can't find that source - I think it was in one of the >muscle magazines, but just cant locate it at this point. While it >won't cure us, if we can do something to reduce, eliminate, or >neutralize the lactate, it seems like it might help to reduce some of >our symptoms. I wish I knew more! > >It is so comforting to be able to share experiences and share (mostly >learn) on this site. I appreciate everyone's postings. > >Regards > >Sunny > > > > > > > > >>I also find this thread interesting. I have always known I do better >> with protein, but anymore, if I do eat simple carbs, I get muscle pain >> within 10-15 minutes of me eating the carbs. It is different pain >>than >> the cramping pain I get from any type of activity. >> >> >> >> Barbara Seaman wrote: >> >> >Thanks, Lea. I can understand why you'd want to take your daughter >>along as >> > " interpreter. " Many times I have wished for one of those too! >>Anyway, I >> >appreciated your posts and when I can I will keep searching for more >>on this >> >connection. It got me to thinking about other possibilities beyond my >> >hyperinsulinemia as to why carbohydrates make some of my symptoms >>worse. >> > >> > >> > >> >Take care, >> > >> >Barbara >> > >> > >> > >> > _____ >> > >> >From: Lea >> >Sent: Thursday, January 13, 2005 12:44 PM >> >To: >> >Subject: Re: carbs and lactic acid >> > >> > >> > >> > >> >Hi Barbara, >> > >> >I'm afraid I don't have the answers to all your questions...although >>I have >> >asked my daughter who majored in microbiology to explain why sugar >>might >> >raise lactate a lot...she said she would try to give me a scientific >> >explanation in the next day or so. >> > >> >Also, I am going back to see Dr. Shoffner sometime this Spring after >>he is >> >finished sequencing my mito DNA and I will take a list of questions >>for him >> >to answer. I am hoping that my daughter could accompany me on the >>trip as >> >she could understand a lot of the scientific stuff a lot better than >>I can. >> >My brain seems to be affected by this mito thing and gets tired very >> >quickly, as does every other part of me! >> > >> >Personally, I think that since our mitochondria are damaged we tend >>to take >> >the lactate pathway frequently and when a lot of glucose is >>available...such >> >as when we eat a lot of sugar or refined carbs...our lactate pathway >>starts >> >going into overdrive. That is only my opinion, however...but it >>would make >> >sense since lactate levels rise when we have eaten. Perhaps that is >>why >> >they want us to fast when they do the testing. >> > >> >I know that both Tim and I seem to feel better before we eat. Both >>he and I >> >have a lot anerobic threshold so our oxygen utilization is badly >>impaired. >> >Tim doesn't have the same diagnosis as I do...they are still trying >>to >> >figure out what is causing his problems. >> > >> >I have been diagnosed with a complex I defect by Shoffner. I figure >>that >> >means that I have a kind of " short circuit " even before I can begin >> >Oxidatative Phosphorylation and that is probably why I produce so >>much >> >lactate and to anerobic so quickly since I don't produce much energy >> >aerobically. I also have high pyruvate which I guess means that it >>is there >> >ready to go into the ATP cycle and produce energy but somehow can't >>get in >> >to do its job and is just left lying around in my body. >> > >> >As for what determines what path or " fork in the road " the glucose >>takes, I >> >don't know...I don't know if the docs know either, but I will keep >>looking >> >and will post when I get any info. Take care. >> > >> >Lea >> > Re: Re: Calcium supplements and teenage girls >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > Gookinaid is better for hydration because it doesn't have all >>that sugar >> > and >> > artificial stuff in it. Sugar can raise levels of lactate. >>Look up >> > Gookinaid online at Google...it needs to be ordered online as >>well. >> > >> > Also, a couple of the best forms of calcium are calcium citrate, >>or >> > calcium >> > malate. Calcium carbonate is not absorbed well and can mess up >> >digestion >> > too. Calcium is best taken when it is in combination with >>magnesium, >> >zinc >> > and vitamin D in a balanced formula and like all vitamins should >>be >> > purchased from a quality company. Also, it is best to take it >>with >> >meals. >> > >> > Lea >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > , you might want to give her Gator Aid. This time of year >> > hydration has to be of consideration. It's really easy to get >> > dehydrated, and supplements can certainly make us even more >> > dehydrated. This would help with an electrolyte imbalance as >>well. >> > Good luck, I hope she feels better ! >> > >> > bug >> > >> > >> > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 13, 2005 Report Share Posted January 13, 2005 Lea, Hope you don't mind me asking, but when were you tested at Dr. Shoffner's? I had my muscle biopsy in fall 2002, and am *still* waiting for my genetic testing results. Dr. Shoffner actually returned my message last February (yes, that's 2004) and said it would be " 2 - 3 months longer " . I called in October 2004, and the woman I spoke to said " we've got quite a backlog, I'm sure they'll get to it soon. " At this point, I'm afraid to even call... Take care, RH > > Hi Barbara, > > I'm afraid I don't have the answers to all your questions...although I have asked my daughter who majored in microbiology to explain why sugar might raise lactate a lot...she said she would try to give me a scientific explanation in the next day or so. > > Also, I am going back to see Dr. Shoffner sometime this Spring after he is finished sequencing my mito DNA and I will take a list of questions for him to answer. I am hoping that my daughter could accompany me on the trip as she could understand a lot of the scientific stuff a lot better than I can. My brain seems to be affected by this mito thing and gets tired very quickly, as does every other part of me! > > Personally, I think that since our mitochondria are damaged we tend to take the lactate pathway frequently and when a lot of glucose is available...such as when we eat a lot of sugar or refined carbs...our lactate pathway starts going into overdrive. That is only my opinion, however...but it would make sense since lactate levels rise when we have eaten. Perhaps that is why they want us to fast when they do the testing. > > I know that both Tim and I seem to feel better before we eat. Both he and I have a lot anerobic threshold so our oxygen utilization is badly impaired. Tim doesn't have the same diagnosis as I do...they are still trying to figure out what is causing his problems. > > I have been diagnosed with a complex I defect by Shoffner. I figure that means that I have a kind of " short circuit " even before I can begin Oxidatative Phosphorylation and that is probably why I produce so much lactate and to anerobic so quickly since I don't produce much energy aerobically. I also have high pyruvate which I guess means that it is there ready to go into the ATP cycle and produce energy but somehow can't get in to do its job and is just left lying around in my body. > > As for what determines what path or " fork in the road " the glucose takes, I don't know...I don't know if the docs know either, but I will keep looking and will post when I get any info. Take care. > > Lea > Re: Re: Calcium supplements and teenage girls > > > > > Gookinaid is better for hydration because it doesn't have all that sugar > and > artificial stuff in it. Sugar can raise levels of lactate. Look up > Gookinaid online at Google...it needs to be ordered online as well. > > Also, a couple of the best forms of calcium are calcium citrate, or > calcium > malate. Calcium carbonate is not absorbed well and can mess up digestion > too. Calcium is best taken when it is in combination with magnesium, zinc > and vitamin D in a balanced formula and like all vitamins should be > purchased from a quality company. Also, it is best to take it with meals. > > Lea > > > > > , you might want to give her Gator Aid. This time of year > hydration has to be of consideration. It's really easy to get > dehydrated, and supplements can certainly make us even more > dehydrated. This would help with an electrolyte imbalance as well. > Good luck, I hope she feels better ! > > bug > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 13, 2005 Report Share Posted January 13, 2005 Lea, Hope you don't mind me asking, but when were you tested at Dr. Shoffner's? I had my muscle biopsy in fall 2002, and am *still* waiting for my genetic testing results. Dr. Shoffner actually returned my message last February (yes, that's 2004) and said it would be " 2 - 3 months longer " . I called in October 2004, and the woman I spoke to said " we've got quite a backlog, I'm sure they'll get to it soon. " At this point, I'm afraid to even call... Take care, RH > > Hi Barbara, > > I'm afraid I don't have the answers to all your questions...although I have asked my daughter who majored in microbiology to explain why sugar might raise lactate a lot...she said she would try to give me a scientific explanation in the next day or so. > > Also, I am going back to see Dr. Shoffner sometime this Spring after he is finished sequencing my mito DNA and I will take a list of questions for him to answer. I am hoping that my daughter could accompany me on the trip as she could understand a lot of the scientific stuff a lot better than I can. My brain seems to be affected by this mito thing and gets tired very quickly, as does every other part of me! > > Personally, I think that since our mitochondria are damaged we tend to take the lactate pathway frequently and when a lot of glucose is available...such as when we eat a lot of sugar or refined carbs...our lactate pathway starts going into overdrive. That is only my opinion, however...but it would make sense since lactate levels rise when we have eaten. Perhaps that is why they want us to fast when they do the testing. > > I know that both Tim and I seem to feel better before we eat. Both he and I have a lot anerobic threshold so our oxygen utilization is badly impaired. Tim doesn't have the same diagnosis as I do...they are still trying to figure out what is causing his problems. > > I have been diagnosed with a complex I defect by Shoffner. I figure that means that I have a kind of " short circuit " even before I can begin Oxidatative Phosphorylation and that is probably why I produce so much lactate and to anerobic so quickly since I don't produce much energy aerobically. I also have high pyruvate which I guess means that it is there ready to go into the ATP cycle and produce energy but somehow can't get in to do its job and is just left lying around in my body. > > As for what determines what path or " fork in the road " the glucose takes, I don't know...I don't know if the docs know either, but I will keep looking and will post when I get any info. Take care. > > Lea > Re: Re: Calcium supplements and teenage girls > > > > > Gookinaid is better for hydration because it doesn't have all that sugar > and > artificial stuff in it. Sugar can raise levels of lactate. Look up > Gookinaid online at Google...it needs to be ordered online as well. > > Also, a couple of the best forms of calcium are calcium citrate, or > calcium > malate. Calcium carbonate is not absorbed well and can mess up digestion > too. Calcium is best taken when it is in combination with magnesium, zinc > and vitamin D in a balanced formula and like all vitamins should be > purchased from a quality company. Also, it is best to take it with meals. > > Lea > > > > > , you might want to give her Gator Aid. This time of year > hydration has to be of consideration. It's really easy to get > dehydrated, and supplements can certainly make us even more > dehydrated. This would help with an electrolyte imbalance as well. > Good luck, I hope she feels better ! > > bug > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 13, 2005 Report Share Posted January 13, 2005 I was told by my mito doc to *avoid* the Atkins diet, she was concerned that my fat metabolism would be messed up because of my mitochondrial disease (I have Complex I and other defects). But, I decided to try it last June, and it's worked well for me. I may be an exception to the rule, but for the first time in 10 years I was able to walk in the mall without getting tired (this was still using my daughter's stroller as a walker though, so not exactly sprinting). I'm on an easier phase of the Atkins diet now, I eat some carbs now and then, mostly veggies and some fruits, but I avoid pasta and regular breads. I try to completely avoid carbs if I need to drive or do other physical activities; I get double vision pretty quickly if I start eating too many carbs. I also lost about 15 lbs., and as long as I don't binge too much (on carbs, you can eat as much of allowed stuff as you want) I keep the weight off easily. I do wonder if the reason I am doing well on a high protein, high fat, low carb diet is because I am glucose intolerant (not quite diabetes, but close - failed one of four GTT levels, two failed would be diabetes) and have reactive hypoglycemia. The latter is when you eat too much, your body gives out too much insulin, and ends up reducing your blood sugar too much. YMMV, I'm not a doctor, but that's what I've found. I think one should know within a day or two whether the diet is " working " in terms of increasing energy and decreasing symptoms, and I would never have tried the diet if I had kidney or liver problems. The funny part is, me and my husband (no mito, but also on the diet for weight loss) are now sharing a bowl of low-carb ice cream every night, and still keeping the weight off. Turkey Hill Carb IQ Ice Cream is the BEST!!! It tastes as good as regular Welsh Farms... Sometimes I wonder if the problem starts with the saliva not " preprocessing " the carbohydrates correctly, either because of dysphagia and improper chewing or something inherently wrong with the amylase (enzyme that is first step in carb breakdown) in saliva. Take care, RH > > > > >Thanks, Lea. I can understand why you'd want to take your daughter > > along as > > > " interpreter. " Many times I have wished for one of those too! > > Anyway, I > > >appreciated your posts and when I can I will keep searching for more > > on this > > >connection. It got me to thinking about other possibilities beyond my > > >hyperinsulinemia as to why carbohydrates make some of my symptoms > > worse. > > > > > > > > > > > >Take care, > > > > > >Barbara > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > >From: Lea [mailto:leafish@m...] > > >Sent: Thursday, January 13, 2005 12:44 PM > > >To: > > >Subject: Re: carbs and lactic acid > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Hi Barbara, > > > > > >I'm afraid I don't have the answers to all your questions...although > > I have > > >asked my daughter who majored in microbiology to explain why sugar > > might > > >raise lactate a lot...she said she would try to give me a scientific > > >explanation in the next day or so. > > > > > >Also, I am going back to see Dr. Shoffner sometime this Spring after > > he is > > >finished sequencing my mito DNA and I will take a list of questions > > for him > > >to answer. I am hoping that my daughter could accompany me on the > > trip as > > >she could understand a lot of the scientific stuff a lot better than > > I can. > > >My brain seems to be affected by this mito thing and gets tired very > > >quickly, as does every other part of me! > > > > > >Personally, I think that since our mitochondria are damaged we tend > > to take > > >the lactate pathway frequently and when a lot of glucose is > > available...such > > >as when we eat a lot of sugar or refined carbs...our lactate pathway > > starts > > >going into overdrive. That is only my opinion, however...but it > > would make > > >sense since lactate levels rise when we have eaten. Perhaps that is > > why > > >they want us to fast when they do the testing. > > > > > >I know that both Tim and I seem to feel better before we eat. Both > > he and I > > >have a lot anerobic threshold so our oxygen utilization is badly > > impaired. > > >Tim doesn't have the same diagnosis as I do...they are still trying > > to > > >figure out what is causing his problems. > > > > > >I have been diagnosed with a complex I defect by Shoffner. I figure > > that > > >means that I have a kind of " short circuit " even before I can begin > > >Oxidatative Phosphorylation and that is probably why I produce so > > much > > >lactate and to anerobic so quickly since I don't produce much energy > > >aerobically. I also have high pyruvate which I guess means that it > > is there > > >ready to go into the ATP cycle and produce energy but somehow can't > > get in > > >to do its job and is just left lying around in my body. > > > > > >As for what determines what path or " fork in the road " the glucose > > takes, I > > >don't know...I don't know if the docs know either, but I will keep > > looking > > >and will post when I get any info. Take care. > > > > > >Lea > > > Re: Re: Calcium supplements and teenage girls > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >   Gookinaid is better for hydration because it doesn't have all > > that sugar > > > and > > >   artificial stuff in it. Sugar can raise levels of lactate. > > Look up > > >   Gookinaid online at Google...it needs to be ordered online as > > well. > > > > > >   Also, a couple of the best forms of calcium are calcium citrate, > > or > > > calcium > > >   malate. Calcium carbonate is not absorbed well and can mess up > > >digestion > > >   too. Calcium is best taken when it is in combination with > > magnesium, > > >zinc > > >   and vitamin D in a balanced formula and like all vitamins should > > be > > >   purchased from a quality company. Also, it is best to take it > > with > > >meals. > > > > > >   Lea > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >   , you might want to give her Gator Aid. This time of year > > >   hydration has to be of consideration. It's really easy to get > > >   dehydrated, and supplements can certainly make us even more > > >   dehydrated. This would help with an electrolyte imbalance as > > well. > > >   Good luck, I hope she feels better ! > > > > > >   bug > > > > > > > > >   Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 13, 2005 Report Share Posted January 13, 2005 > > Sunny, > > It takes a LOT of energy to digest food even for non-mito folks. > Remember all the naps after Thanksgiving dinners? If makes perfect > sense to be tired at about the time you are after eating. Two things here to consider. One is that turkey contains triptophan (sp) which helps put people to sleep if taken at night, that is the connection between getting sleepy after Thanksgiving dinners! The other is that if one's blood sugar after a meal rises too high this can produce feelings of intense sleepiness/drowsiness and it usually happens around the 1 hour mark give or take 15 minutes or so. Having a blood sugar monitor such as that which diabetics use can solve the riddle here, in fact diabetes may be part of the picture itself. Margo> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 15, 2005 Report Share Posted January 15, 2005 If you buy PLAIN full fat yogurt (dannon makes one, and wal mart sells it around here) you can actually deduct a carb per ounce from what is listed on the package, and it is actually pretty low carb. (what it is, is that some of the " carbs " listed are actually the acidophilus which is the healthy bacteria in it, and not actually carbs, since the acidophilus have eaten a lot of the milk sugars in the yogurt) and there is a low carb milk on the market called carb countdown, which I like. it is twice as much as regular milk, but I get it sometimes. It is pretty good too They also make it in chocolate! z39z@... wrote: Thank you, Margo. I get really really low on energy and mental function after a meal, even a very small one. Observing my friends and husband, this just does not happen to them at all to the same degree. Something is irregular. I would guess that my blood sugar level goes down after a meal. Post prandial hypoglycemia. My glucose level went to 31 (and the lab said they checked it twice) at the two hour mark of the glucose tolerance test, and at that time is when I felt my worse during that test. So, my guess was that my unwell feelings are due to low and not high blood sugar. But, the idea that carbs may result in the lactate level being elevated may also explain some of the fatigue, and that stimulates me to go back and do a " pure " low carb for a few days, to see if it makes any difference. I have been eating things like yoghurt and milk, which have some carbs, and sometimes downright cheating with a piece of candy or slice of pizza! Thanks for your comments. Always good to consider all the possibilities. Regards Sunny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 15, 2005 Report Share Posted January 15, 2005 I'm glad the South Beach diet is working for you. Like with any diet, it depends on the person whether it is easier or harder to follow, and even specific food choices may make a difference (Atkins with chicken and fish only, vs. Atkins with hot dogs and cold cuts only). For those of us who need carb supplementation at night, I'd think these type diets would be a no-no. I'm about to go shopping to buy some whole grain, low-carb waffles and breads. Just had a slice of low carb bread with low carb peanut butter and butter... Take care, RH > > Hey Friends, > Sorry I have been out of touch for a few days but my computer got > infected with a " backdoor trojan virus " and I had to wipe out all the > files and reboot the entire system. This caused me to LOSE all the > info I had stored for the past 4 months on this new computer. We are > back up and running with a gazillion virus protectors and firewalls!! > > I just want to add that I began South Beach on Jan. 1st. The diet has > been relatively easy to follow. I bought the book and the recipe > book. I have found that eliminating the carbs with the high glycemic > load has really helped. Although I would not say the fatigue and all > the " Mito Symptoms " have vanished I do feel healthier. I really > thought the opposite might happen to be honest. In my mind I thought > that reducing carbs would be bad for people with lactic acid and > reduced energy production. I did Arkins a year or so back and felt > awful. So far SBD has not made me feel nearly as fatigued. > > Maybe there is something to the high glycemic foods that are just not > so good for people like us. > Just my 2 cents. > > > ps please tell Alison she is on the Prayer List at my Church. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 15, 2005 Report Share Posted January 15, 2005 Hi, I am glad you are feeling healthier. I am wondering, if you have any thoughts as to why the Atkins made you feel bad last year, and the South Beach now is not? That is very curious to me. I DO completely believe you, I just am having a hard time undertstanding it, because as far as I know they both have a similar effect and work on similar theoriys. The main difference I see is in the types of fats each say is ok to have. I guess I am asking, what did you do differently on the South Beach vs the Atkins that might explain feeling better on the South Beach? Thanks for sharing Regards Sunny > > Hey Friends, > Sorry I have been out of touch for a few days but my computer got > infected with a " backdoor trojan virus " and I had to wipe out all the > files and reboot the entire system. This caused me to LOSE all the > info I had stored for the past 4 months on this new computer. We are > back up and running with a gazillion virus protectors and firewalls!! > > I just want to add that I began South Beach on Jan. 1st. The diet has > been relatively easy to follow. I bought the book and the recipe > book. I have found that eliminating the carbs with the high glycemic > load has really helped. Although I would not say the fatigue and all > the " Mito Symptoms " have vanished I do feel healthier. I really > thought the opposite might happen to be honest. In my mind I thought > that reducing carbs would be bad for people with lactic acid and > reduced energy production. I did Arkins a year or so back and felt > awful. So far SBD has not made me feel nearly as fatigued. > > Maybe there is something to the high glycemic foods that are just not > so good for people like us. > Just my 2 cents. > > > ps please tell Alison she is on the Prayer List at my Church. > > > > > > Medical advice, information, opinions, data and statements contained > herein are not necessarily those of the list moderators. The author of > this e mail is entirely responsible for its content. List members are > reminded of their responsibility to evaluate the content of the > postings and consult with their physicians regarding changes in their > own treatment. > > Personal attacks are not permitted on the list and anyone who sends > one is automatically moderated or removed depending on the severity of > the attack. > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 15, 2005 Report Share Posted January 15, 2005 Sunny, Thanks for replying to my post. As far as the diffrence of Atkins vs SB I believe it is the " good carb vs bad carb and good fat vs bad fat " difference that each diet totes. Atkins basically tells you that you can eat any protein (including high fat foods like fast food and deli meat each and everyday) SB is much healthier overall and it encourages supplemental vitamins and co-enzymes. Possible theory maybe that better choices of fats and lower glycemic goods in ADDITION to supplements maybe the trick. I have added several supplements to my mito cocktail and maybe the synergystic effect is responsible for my feeling better. I was very fatigued, nauseous, and had severe muscle cramping on Atkins. I also had trouble keeping by Blood Sugars in normal range. Both boys and I suffer with low blood sugar and when I " bottom out " I go into a rapid crash that requires an IV infusion of D10 and Potassium. So far so good with SB! I hope some of this makes sense........ > > > > > Hey Friends, > > Sorry I have been out of touch for a few days but my computer got > > infected with a " backdoor trojan virus " and I had to wipe out all the > > files and reboot the entire system. This caused me to LOSE all the > > info I had stored for the past 4 months on this new computer. We are > > back up and running with a gazillion virus protectors and firewalls!! > > > > I just want to add that I began South Beach on Jan. 1st. The diet has > > been relatively easy to follow. I bought the book and the recipe > > book. I have found that eliminating the carbs with the high glycemic > > load has really helped. Although I would not say the fatigue and all > > the " Mito Symptoms " have vanished I do feel healthier. I really > > thought the opposite might happen to be honest. In my mind I thought > > that reducing carbs would be bad for people with lactic acid and > > reduced energy production. I did Arkins a year or so back and felt > > awful. So far SBD has not made me feel nearly as fatigued. > > > > Maybe there is something to the high glycemic foods that are just not > > so good for people like us. > > Just my 2 cents. > > > > > > ps please tell Alison she is on the Prayer List at my Church. > > > > > > > > > > > > Medical advice, information, opinions, data and statements contained > > herein are not necessarily those of the list moderators. The author of > > this e mail is entirely responsible for its content. List members are > > reminded of their responsibility to evaluate the content of the > > postings and consult with their physicians regarding changes in their > > own treatment. > > > > Personal attacks are not permitted on the list and anyone who sends > > one is automatically moderated or removed depending on the severity of > > the attack. > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 17, 2005 Report Share Posted January 17, 2005 Narp stands for neuropathy, ataxia, and retinitis pigmentosa. It is a point mutation in atpase 6 T 8993 G or C. Mine is the G version. That is the long version LOL. Basically it is purely mitochondrial and therefore of purely maternal inheritance. The difference between them is that those who are severely, severely affected get Leigh's disease which usually leads to death at a very young or young age. The rest of us live but with varying degrees of disability from severe to not too noticeable other than for a few " oddities " . I fall more in the latter category. 3 of my children fell in the leigh's disease category (btw other mito defects can also lead to leighs disease, we are just one of many). They died early on. My living daughter is more like me, but slightly more affected, and my living son is retarded with seizures and neuropathy. With the C defect, people with Leigh's disease are more apt to show symptoms closer to puberty. Like from age 7 on. There are probably a few oddities, but nothing that would make a person with no mito knowledge aware of something THAT devastating going on. I obviously don't know as much about the C defect. With " G " things like failure to thrive, inability to suck and swallow, etc. failure to develop skills on time, or actually lose skills as infants often point to something wrong, but again indefinite until such time as something more major happens, such in my children's case, strokes to the brain stems which led to brain swelling, and vast amounts of brain damage and seizures, then later, another stroke which led to death. We were one of those families that knew that something weird was present in the family gene pool, but had no clue what till my children started dying. Until then, nothing that devastating had happened, at least not in the last few generations, and even if it had occurred before, no one knew it was interrelated with all those other family " oddities " . My mother is diabetic, blind, (from the diabetes not rp) and early stages of dementia. My great uncle died from complications of diabetes (kidney failure), my grandmother has dementia, a cousin is mentally retarded with seizures, some have fertility issues, stomach issues, mental issues, etc. All of us have crashes periodically. I was very failure to thrive as a child with severe gi issues such as constant diarrhea, etc. I weighed an entire 13 pounds on my first birthday, and that with a birthweight of 7 pounds 2 ounces! According to my mother, I had sucking and swallowing issues, but back then, things like that werent that noticed by the medical community. I eventually outgrew it, but am still short. (4 foot 11 and 3/4 inches) ll@... wrote: , I believe Dr. Shoffner has ruled out defects in Complexes I thru IV, but has not yet ruled out V. What does narp mean? Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 17, 2005 Report Share Posted January 17, 2005 I agree! MitomomX3@... wrote: There seem to be several of us on the list with a autoimmune component along with the mito, I think it is possible that the two are tied and not seperate. Look at how many on the mito list that are immunedeficient yet the docs say there is no tie. there are way too many for it not to be, that and a clotting disorder..just my two cents. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 17, 2005 Report Share Posted January 17, 2005 I agree! MitomomX3@... wrote: There seem to be several of us on the list with a autoimmune component along with the mito, I think it is possible that the two are tied and not seperate. Look at how many on the mito list that are immunedeficient yet the docs say there is no tie. there are way too many for it not to be, that and a clotting disorder..just my two cents. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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