carbs and lactic acid

[Guest guest]

Hello everyone,

I am the " Tim " that Lea spoke of. I wanted to explain a little more about

the connection (if any) between carbs and lactate.

Dr. Shoffner told me that he has seen other patients in whom lactate is

normal fasting but spikes postprandially. He said he thinks he knows the

approximate place in the metabolic pathway where the block is occurring,

but is not certain. He said it may take a few years of research to become

certain. His current studies on my biopsied muscle are as follows:

1. Sequence Complex V genes (ATP6 and ATP8) of the mtDNA.

2. Send muscle for glycolytic enzyme testing.

Since my antinuclear antibodies also only spike postprandially, I think

there is also the possibility that I have an autoimmune disease rather

than a mitochondrial disease, in which case this discussion is irrelevant

to the members of this list. Time will tell. However, Dr. Shoffner did

say that simple sugars are best avoided.

Tim

P.S. (For Barbara) My fasting insulin is abnormally low! And I am

extrememly thin, so I am not happy about avoiding sugar.

Subject: Re: carbs and lactic acid

Hi Barbara,

I'm afraid I don't have the answers to all your questions...although I

have asked my daughter who majored in microbiology to explain why sugar

might raise lactate a lot...she said she would try to give me a

scientific explanation in the next day or so.

Also, I am going back to see Dr. Shoffner sometime this Spring after he

is finished sequencing my mito DNA and I will take a list of questions

for him to answer. I am hoping that my daughter could accompany me on

the trip as she could understand a lot of the scientific stuff a lot

better than I can. My brain seems to be affected by this mito thing and

gets tired very quickly, as does every other part of me!

Personally, I think that since our mitochondria are damaged we tend to

take the lactate pathway frequently and when a lot of glucose is

available...such as when we eat a lot of sugar or refined carbs...our

lactate pathway starts going into overdrive. That is only my opinion,

however...but it would make sense since lactate levels rise when we have

eaten. Perhaps that is why they want us to fast when they do the

testing.

I know that both Tim and I seem to feel better before we eat. Both he

and I have a lot anerobic threshold so our oxygen utilization is badly

impaired. Tim doesn't have the same diagnosis as I do...they are still

trying to figure out what is causing his problems.

I have been diagnosed with a complex I defect by Shoffner. I figure that

means that I have a kind of " short circuit " even before I can begin

Oxidatative Phosphorylation and that is probably why I produce so much

lactate and to anerobic so quickly since I don't produce much energy

aerobically. I also have high pyruvate which I guess means that it is

there ready to go into the ATP cycle and produce energy but somehow can't

get in to do its job and is just left lying around in my body.

As for what determines what path or " fork in the road " the glucose takes,

I don't know...I don't know if the docs know either, but I will keep

looking and will post when I get any info. Take care.

Lea

RE: Re: Calcium supplements and teenage girls

Lea, I'm interested in your information that sugar can raise levels

of

lactate. Do you know the mechanism involved or can you point me to

some

web

resources that might illuminate the connection?

Thanks.

Barbara