Guest guest Posted February 18, 2008 Report Share Posted February 18, 2008 The actually makes decent sense. Through feedback loops, if there is new artificial adrenal support that the system is not accustomed to, then sensitive feedback loops could immediately shut things down, causing a reduction or stoppage of norepinephrine/noradrenaline, and thus result in fatigue and depression. For me it was profound. So profound in fact that a mere 3 drops of licorice root extract, versus the recommended dose of 30 drops, sent me into a tailspin totally unexpected. Two hours after that tiny dose I sank fast and hard and it really took me by surprise. I was sure 3 drops would do nothing and I totally forgot about it for the 2 hours. The only purpose was to introduce it to my system and then ramp it over the next few days. Then the crash. Isocort, same thing...except I had the endurance to try miniscule, low, and regular doses for comparison. All were like poison. And now the popular ACE that everyone here raves about. Makes me wonder if I should ever go anywhere near HC. Kinda scared about that. -- In frequent-dose-chelation , " " wrote: > > If your adrenal problem involves having a lot of adrenaline, > then taking any form of adrenal support might calm you down > a lot, to that point that you feel really crashed out. > > When I got up to 10-15 mg HC, I started calming down in a > way that felt uncomfortable. I was really out of it and could > not get up from the couch. Hard to explain. Very strange > experience. > > I realize that sounds different from your experience, because > I didn't have what I would call " depression " (although I did > have a lot of internal negativity). Still, I wonder if you were > experiencing an effect of reduced adrenaline. > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 18, 2008 Report Share Posted February 18, 2008 The actually makes decent sense. Through feedback loops, if there is new artificial adrenal support that the system is not accustomed to, then sensitive feedback loops could immediately shut things down, causing a reduction or stoppage of norepinephrine/noradrenaline, and thus result in fatigue and depression. For me it was profound. So profound in fact that a mere 3 drops of licorice root extract, versus the recommended dose of 30 drops, sent me into a tailspin totally unexpected. Two hours after that tiny dose I sank fast and hard and it really took me by surprise. I was sure 3 drops would do nothing and I totally forgot about it for the 2 hours. The only purpose was to introduce it to my system and then ramp it over the next few days. Then the crash. Isocort, same thing...except I had the endurance to try miniscule, low, and regular doses for comparison. All were like poison. And now the popular ACE that everyone here raves about. Makes me wonder if I should ever go anywhere near HC. Kinda scared about that. -- In frequent-dose-chelation , " " wrote: > > If your adrenal problem involves having a lot of adrenaline, > then taking any form of adrenal support might calm you down > a lot, to that point that you feel really crashed out. > > When I got up to 10-15 mg HC, I started calming down in a > way that felt uncomfortable. I was really out of it and could > not get up from the couch. Hard to explain. Very strange > experience. > > I realize that sounds different from your experience, because > I didn't have what I would call " depression " (although I did > have a lot of internal negativity). Still, I wonder if you were > experiencing an effect of reduced adrenaline. > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 18, 2008 Report Share Posted February 18, 2008 The actually makes decent sense. Through feedback loops, if there is new artificial adrenal support that the system is not accustomed to, then sensitive feedback loops could immediately shut things down, causing a reduction or stoppage of norepinephrine/noradrenaline, and thus result in fatigue and depression. For me it was profound. So profound in fact that a mere 3 drops of licorice root extract, versus the recommended dose of 30 drops, sent me into a tailspin totally unexpected. Two hours after that tiny dose I sank fast and hard and it really took me by surprise. I was sure 3 drops would do nothing and I totally forgot about it for the 2 hours. The only purpose was to introduce it to my system and then ramp it over the next few days. Then the crash. Isocort, same thing...except I had the endurance to try miniscule, low, and regular doses for comparison. All were like poison. And now the popular ACE that everyone here raves about. Makes me wonder if I should ever go anywhere near HC. Kinda scared about that. -- In frequent-dose-chelation , " " wrote: > > If your adrenal problem involves having a lot of adrenaline, > then taking any form of adrenal support might calm you down > a lot, to that point that you feel really crashed out. > > When I got up to 10-15 mg HC, I started calming down in a > way that felt uncomfortable. I was really out of it and could > not get up from the couch. Hard to explain. Very strange > experience. > > I realize that sounds different from your experience, because > I didn't have what I would call " depression " (although I did > have a lot of internal negativity). Still, I wonder if you were > experiencing an effect of reduced adrenaline. > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 18, 2008 Report Share Posted February 18, 2008 This is interesting. I will have to go back over my tests to take a look. I do remember my hair test showed extremely low magnesium and low calcium. But for that matter, all metals and heavy metals across the board were rock bottom. I remember somewhere in the book Andy said that pattern itself indicated toxicity. I was quite well nourished, so there is no reason all metals should have been near zero in hair, especially when just a year earlier I showed lots of metals in hair....my my what mercury can do in a year's time. So not sure what help that will be. I'll have to dig up my latest blood work to take a look at potassium and sodium. Further tests are financially impossible so I have to just go with what I have and what I learn here. > > , DeanSA, or anyone with adrenal problems and who have had a hair test: > > What said about adrenaline got me thinking about what Andy says in HTI page 112-113. " Potassium and sodium up, with calcium and magnesium down, means the person's adrenals are shot, making way too much adrenaline but not enough cortisol. " Then, " Potassium and sodium down, with calcium and magnesium up, means the person's adrenals not making enough cortisol or adrenaline and their thyroid is somewhat low too. " > > So could this adrenaline thing and its relation to Cal/Mag and Na/K being up or down, have anything to do with who tolerates adrenal support or not, especially ACE? > > For example, my hair test shows Cal/Mag down, really low, and Na/K in the middle, not high, so according to this, Andy says I make too much adrenaline and not enough cortisol. But I am taking ACE and HC right now, and tolerate both of them just fine. So could others tell us what their hair tests says and how they react to ACE? I'm just curious if there's any pattern to it.-----------Jackie > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 18, 2008 Report Share Posted February 18, 2008 The way I think about it is my brain is pumping out lots of ACTH telling my adrenals to make cortisol. My adrenals can't make enough cortisol, so they make as much adrenaline as they can trying to compensate. When I take effective adrenal support it tells my brain it can stop asking for more cortisol and when it stops the adrenaline drops off and there is not enough cortisol either and I am falling out of the sky like Icarus who has lost his wings, dropping a mile a minute into oblivion. Pardon the dramatic imagery. The crash is probably not so precipitous if you take enough replacement cortisol. Too bad I didn't do it that way. You may not be able to get enough replacement effect from ACE or licorice or other natural stuff. HC would really work a lot better for this. If you really are low in cortisol, you need it to stay well and get through chelation. It is really far better to have a reliable flying machine (cortisol) than to rely on homemade wings with very melty glue (adrenaline). -- > > > > If your adrenal problem involves having a lot of adrenaline, > > then taking any form of adrenal support might calm you down > > a lot, to that point that you feel really crashed out. > > > > When I got up to 10-15 mg HC, I started calming down in a > > way that felt uncomfortable. I was really out of it and could > > not get up from the couch. Hard to explain. Very strange > > experience. > > > > I realize that sounds different from your experience, because > > I didn't have what I would call " depression " (although I did > > have a lot of internal negativity). Still, I wonder if you were > > experiencing an effect of reduced adrenaline. > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 18, 2008 Report Share Posted February 18, 2008 The way I think about it is my brain is pumping out lots of ACTH telling my adrenals to make cortisol. My adrenals can't make enough cortisol, so they make as much adrenaline as they can trying to compensate. When I take effective adrenal support it tells my brain it can stop asking for more cortisol and when it stops the adrenaline drops off and there is not enough cortisol either and I am falling out of the sky like Icarus who has lost his wings, dropping a mile a minute into oblivion. Pardon the dramatic imagery. The crash is probably not so precipitous if you take enough replacement cortisol. Too bad I didn't do it that way. You may not be able to get enough replacement effect from ACE or licorice or other natural stuff. HC would really work a lot better for this. If you really are low in cortisol, you need it to stay well and get through chelation. It is really far better to have a reliable flying machine (cortisol) than to rely on homemade wings with very melty glue (adrenaline). -- > > > > If your adrenal problem involves having a lot of adrenaline, > > then taking any form of adrenal support might calm you down > > a lot, to that point that you feel really crashed out. > > > > When I got up to 10-15 mg HC, I started calming down in a > > way that felt uncomfortable. I was really out of it and could > > not get up from the couch. Hard to explain. Very strange > > experience. > > > > I realize that sounds different from your experience, because > > I didn't have what I would call " depression " (although I did > > have a lot of internal negativity). Still, I wonder if you were > > experiencing an effect of reduced adrenaline. > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 18, 2008 Report Share Posted February 18, 2008 The way I think about it is my brain is pumping out lots of ACTH telling my adrenals to make cortisol. My adrenals can't make enough cortisol, so they make as much adrenaline as they can trying to compensate. When I take effective adrenal support it tells my brain it can stop asking for more cortisol and when it stops the adrenaline drops off and there is not enough cortisol either and I am falling out of the sky like Icarus who has lost his wings, dropping a mile a minute into oblivion. Pardon the dramatic imagery. The crash is probably not so precipitous if you take enough replacement cortisol. Too bad I didn't do it that way. You may not be able to get enough replacement effect from ACE or licorice or other natural stuff. HC would really work a lot better for this. If you really are low in cortisol, you need it to stay well and get through chelation. It is really far better to have a reliable flying machine (cortisol) than to rely on homemade wings with very melty glue (adrenaline). -- > > > > If your adrenal problem involves having a lot of adrenaline, > > then taking any form of adrenal support might calm you down > > a lot, to that point that you feel really crashed out. > > > > When I got up to 10-15 mg HC, I started calming down in a > > way that felt uncomfortable. I was really out of it and could > > not get up from the couch. Hard to explain. Very strange > > experience. > > > > I realize that sounds different from your experience, because > > I didn't have what I would call " depression " (although I did > > have a lot of internal negativity). Still, I wonder if you were > > experiencing an effect of reduced adrenaline. > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 18, 2008 Report Share Posted February 18, 2008 > > > > > > If your adrenal problem involves having a lot of adrenaline, > > > then taking any form of adrenal support might calm you down > > > a lot, to that point that you feel really crashed out. > > > > > > When I got up to 10-15 mg HC, I started calming down in a > > > way that felt uncomfortable. I was really out of it and could > > > not get up from the couch. Hard to explain. Very strange > > > experience. > > > > > > I realize that sounds different from your experience, because > > > I didn't have what I would call " depression " (although I did > > > have a lot of internal negativity). Still, I wonder if you were > > > experiencing an effect of reduced adrenaline. > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 18, 2008 Report Share Posted February 18, 2008 Thanks for explaining this again. My Potassium and sodium are very low esp potassim(2.5th percent) and my ca and mg are about 95th percent, so this mean what ? > > > > , DeanSA, or anyone with adrenal problems and who have > had a hair test: > > > > What said about adrenaline got me thinking about what > Andy says in HTI page 112-113. " Potassium and sodium up, with > calcium and magnesium down, means the person's adrenals are shot, > making way too much adrenaline but not enough cortisol. " > Then, " Potassium and sodium down, with calcium and magnesium up, > means the person's adrenals not making enough cortisol or adrenaline > and their thyroid is somewhat low too. " > > > > So could this adrenaline thing and its relation to Cal/Mag and > Na/K being up or down, have anything to do with who tolerates > adrenal support or not, especially ACE? > > > > For example, my hair test shows Cal/Mag down, really low, and Na/K > in the middle, not high, so according to this, Andy says I make too > much adrenaline and not enough cortisol. But I am taking ACE and HC > right now, and tolerate both of them just fine. So could others > tell us what their hair tests says and how they react to ACE? I'm > just curious if there's any pattern to it.-----------Jackie > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 18, 2008 Report Share Posted February 18, 2008 Thanks for explaining this again. My Potassium and sodium are very low esp potassim(2.5th percent) and my ca and mg are about 95th percent, so this mean what ? > > > > , DeanSA, or anyone with adrenal problems and who have > had a hair test: > > > > What said about adrenaline got me thinking about what > Andy says in HTI page 112-113. " Potassium and sodium up, with > calcium and magnesium down, means the person's adrenals are shot, > making way too much adrenaline but not enough cortisol. " > Then, " Potassium and sodium down, with calcium and magnesium up, > means the person's adrenals not making enough cortisol or adrenaline > and their thyroid is somewhat low too. " > > > > So could this adrenaline thing and its relation to Cal/Mag and > Na/K being up or down, have anything to do with who tolerates > adrenal support or not, especially ACE? > > > > For example, my hair test shows Cal/Mag down, really low, and Na/K > in the middle, not high, so according to this, Andy says I make too > much adrenaline and not enough cortisol. But I am taking ACE and HC > right now, and tolerate both of them just fine. So could others > tell us what their hair tests says and how they react to ACE? I'm > just curious if there's any pattern to it.-----------Jackie > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 18, 2008 Report Share Posted February 18, 2008 > Thanks for explaining this again. My Potassium and sodium are very > low esp potassium(2.5th percent) and my ca and mg are about 95th > percent, so this mean what ? This is a sign of exhaustion. Andy say this: 'Potassium and Sodium down, with Calcium and Magnesium up means the person's adrenals are not making enough cortisol or adrenaline and their thyroid is somewhat low too. This generally goes along with sluggishness and weight gain. [pg. 112 HTI] This means you are likely to benefit from adrenal and thyroid support. DeanSA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 18, 2008 Report Share Posted February 18, 2008 > Thanks for explaining this again. My Potassium and sodium are very > low esp potassium(2.5th percent) and my ca and mg are about 95th > percent, so this mean what ? This is a sign of exhaustion. Andy say this: 'Potassium and Sodium down, with Calcium and Magnesium up means the person's adrenals are not making enough cortisol or adrenaline and their thyroid is somewhat low too. This generally goes along with sluggishness and weight gain. [pg. 112 HTI] This means you are likely to benefit from adrenal and thyroid support. DeanSA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 19, 2008 Report Share Posted February 19, 2008 thanks Dean, Yes very tired , chelation is making even more tired. On 2 grains of armour and 10mg hc and addrenal cortex 1 tab a day. The hair was done before staring the hc,armour,ac but still very tired. I prob need to go up, having blood work soon. > > > Thanks for explaining this again. My Potassium and sodium are very > > low esp potassium(2.5th percent) and my ca and mg are about 95th > > percent, so this mean what ? > > This is a sign of exhaustion. > Andy say this: > 'Potassium and Sodium down, with Calcium and Magnesium up means the person's > adrenals are not making enough cortisol or adrenaline and their thyroid is > somewhat low too. This generally goes along with sluggishness and weight > gain. [pg. 112 HTI] > This means you are likely to benefit from adrenal and thyroid support. > DeanSA > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 19, 2008 Report Share Posted February 19, 2008 thanks Dean, Yes very tired , chelation is making even more tired. On 2 grains of armour and 10mg hc and addrenal cortex 1 tab a day. The hair was done before staring the hc,armour,ac but still very tired. I prob need to go up, having blood work soon. > > > Thanks for explaining this again. My Potassium and sodium are very > > low esp potassium(2.5th percent) and my ca and mg are about 95th > > percent, so this mean what ? > > This is a sign of exhaustion. > Andy say this: > 'Potassium and Sodium down, with Calcium and Magnesium up means the person's > adrenals are not making enough cortisol or adrenaline and their thyroid is > somewhat low too. This generally goes along with sluggishness and weight > gain. [pg. 112 HTI] > This means you are likely to benefit from adrenal and thyroid support. > DeanSA > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 19, 2008 Report Share Posted February 19, 2008 In frequent-dose-chelation email4ebay2005 wrote: thanks Dean, Yes very tired , chelation is making even more tired. On 2 grains of armour and 10mg hc and addrenal cortex 1 tab a day. The hair was done before staring the hc,armour,ac but still very tired. I prob need to go up, having blood work soon. ---------My potassium was low red also, and told me that was a sign of adrenal fatigue, and may have said even severe, I don't remember her exact words. But this isn't in HTI. And I agree that chelation is stress on the body, so yes, more stress on the adrenals, and you probably aren't taking enough to support them. How many mgs is your ACE? I would try more of that, and possibly up your HC, if you can. But probably do them one at a time, so you know what is doing what. If you are tolerating the ACE, I would definitely try more. I have tolerated alot of it lately, and if I have too much, then I can't sleep. So you just have to play with the dosage and how many times a day, etc. But it has helped.---------Jackie > > > Thanks for explaining this again. My Potassium and sodium are very > > low esp potassium(2.5th percent) and my ca and mg are about 95th > > percent, so this mean what ? > > This is a sign of exhaustion. > Andy say this: > 'Potassium and Sodium down, with Calcium and Magnesium up means the person's > adrenals are not making enough cortisol or adrenaline and their thyroid is > somewhat low too. This generally goes along with sluggishness and weight > gain. [pg. 112 HTI] > This means you are likely to benefit from adrenal and thyroid support. > DeanSA > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 19, 2008 Report Share Posted February 19, 2008 In frequent-dose-chelation email4ebay2005 wrote: thanks Dean, Yes very tired , chelation is making even more tired. On 2 grains of armour and 10mg hc and addrenal cortex 1 tab a day. The hair was done before staring the hc,armour,ac but still very tired. I prob need to go up, having blood work soon. ---------My potassium was low red also, and told me that was a sign of adrenal fatigue, and may have said even severe, I don't remember her exact words. But this isn't in HTI. And I agree that chelation is stress on the body, so yes, more stress on the adrenals, and you probably aren't taking enough to support them. How many mgs is your ACE? I would try more of that, and possibly up your HC, if you can. But probably do them one at a time, so you know what is doing what. If you are tolerating the ACE, I would definitely try more. I have tolerated alot of it lately, and if I have too much, then I can't sleep. So you just have to play with the dosage and how many times a day, etc. But it has helped.---------Jackie > > > Thanks for explaining this again. My Potassium and sodium are very > > low esp potassium(2.5th percent) and my ca and mg are about 95th > > percent, so this mean what ? > > This is a sign of exhaustion. > Andy say this: > 'Potassium and Sodium down, with Calcium and Magnesium up means the person's > adrenals are not making enough cortisol or adrenaline and their thyroid is > somewhat low too. This generally goes along with sluggishness and weight > gain. [pg. 112 HTI] > This means you are likely to benefit from adrenal and thyroid support. > DeanSA > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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