Guest guest Posted November 7, 2007 Report Share Posted November 7, 2007 Liver tox test is financially out of the question for me. I have to figure that one out the hard way. So help from all of you is very welcome. I am very sensitive to a lot of things. Gluten intolerant with no family history of it, started 2 years ago out of the blue. The antidepressant cymbalta has a starting dose of 30mg...I could handle no more than 3 eensy weensy mg. It was insane. St s Wort...I can handle 75mg sort of, but no way 300mg to 900mg. Strange, because 5 years ago SJW worked awesome for me and now it feels like poison. Ginkgo biloba, same pattern. Actually, everything...vitamins, some minerals (magnesium is real bad), herbs of all kinds, amino acids. The only things I seem to handle ok are modestly medium doses of ester C, zinc, selenium, and molybdenum. I can only handle about 100% RDA of B vitamin complexes. I see recommendations to take B25 or B50 and I just grimace and say, yeah, right. So, whether all this is slow phase I slow phase II, or fast phase I slow phase II, or what, I don't know. I just instinctively intuitively know there is a bottlejam there somewhere in the metabolism of things. What supplements could I try in order to get a better picture based on reactions to those supplements? I've heard of are grapefruit juice or niacinimide or niacin, but I don't know what they do, and I don't know what other things are out there besides those. I've heard mention of licorice, which is very nasty to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 8, 2007 Report Share Posted November 8, 2007 > So, whether all this is slow phase I slow phase II, or fast phase I > slow phase II, or what, I don't know. I just instinctively intuitively know there is a bottlejam there somewhere in the metabolism of things. > What supplements could I try in order to get a better picture based on reactions to those supplements? I've heard of are grapefruit juice or niacinimide or niacin, but I don't know what they do, and I don't know what other things are out there besides those. I've heard mention of licorice, which is very nasty to me. MY REGIMENT IN THE MCS-FAST PHASE 1-SLOW PHASE 2 dilemma My Background-49 years old, 25 years of allergy shots, a mouthful of fillings that are leaking and 40 years of nose drop/spray abuse (for bad alergies plugged nasal passgaes) and 15 years of being a diet coke addict (drank literally gallons a day). I now realize/think I am lucky to be alive and am optimistic for the first time in many years that I can beat this by cleaning up my liver which I think given thats its still working after this abuse it's gotta be strong 3-8 months ago I developed extreme MCS symptoms (I had it mild for the last 5 years but did not realize what it was); however in taking cilantro-chorella and heavy sulphur food diet, I think it was aggravated to the point where I could almost physically not work and was mentally wasted (very depressed, suicidal, severe brain fog... could not think clearly to pay bills ; was overwhelmed talking on the phone etc etc) My health has been extremely bad for the last 4 years and was probably just very bad for the last 10 years (fatigue. always tired and depressed) had lymes, liver flukes, and who knos what the hell else I feel like almost a new person after only 2+ months of AI and help from this forum. I started the AI protocol after the Labour day weekend. I am getting my fillings out starting this week. I can now function and am not nerely as depressed. No marathons yet and am still pretty weak but at least i can function and am feeling optimism Its hard to tell what effect each of the supplements I am taking have had, BUT I broke Andy's book down by reading from the index by supplement, and by symptom/topic.... otherwise it was too much for my brain at the time So here is what i have followed ***** eliminated sulphur foods; no eggs, asparagus, cauliflower, leeks, brussel sprouts and a few others that I cannot think of I think Ai says that sulphur foods can aggravate MCS ***** also follow SCD diet, basically organic meat, vergetables and fruit. NO PROCESSED FOODS and NO sulphur foods even though on the SCD diet many are Ok. I have some caffeine tea (which is Ok on the SCD diet BUT I actually think caffeine is bad for your liver so I try to limit it. NO carbs, no refined sugar, nothing in a package or can *****AI-Andy recommends niacinamide and grapefruit juice and selenomethionine. I take these in 3-4 doses through the day. Usually 1500 of niacinamide (Times 3-4) , 1000 mcg of selenomethionine; and a few mouthfuls of organic grapefruit juice. I believe niacinamide and grapefruit juice slow down phase 1 or maybe its speed up phase 2; I just know it helps. I stoped all the supplements for almost 2 weeks having blood tests and all my symptoms came back with a vengeance I believe the selenomethionine is one thing that Andy recommends as binding to mercury and rendering it inert ****zinc (I was taking 50 a dose) at 3-4 doses a day. I know this is higher than AI suggests but I alos know from the zinc taste test taken 6 weeks after I had been doing this dosage that i was/am still zinc deficient. my hair tests showed zinc and selenium deficiency with what i believe are normal mineral transport results ***I have taurine deficiency from amino acid tests. Tuarine and zinc from what i have read work synergistically in the brain as an antioxidant. I take 1000 mgs (3 times a day) *** I also take 5-6 tablespoons of fish oil and flax oil. Borage oil did not seem to help me. Again this is per AI protcol. Andy says your brain gets fried (I am not sure if these are his words) and it can take months to lubricate with fish oil/flax oil *** I have low DHEA from adrenal tests. DHEA messed me u and there is a section in the AI book that I believe says if you have a liver sulfate problem you may have a reaction to dhea and then suggest trying epsom salts orally. These oral epsom salts made me ill. in a recent post suggested epsom salt baths. I think these epsom salts help phase 2 from what i can interpret from AI. I have been doing them for two days and think i feel better and it has helped me sleep *** 10 mgs of melatonin.(2 doses of 5 mg, one at about 9:00pm and the other one at 9:30 pm) this really helps me sleep.I still wake up but usually can go back to sleep *** chromium pocolinate to reduce my blood sugar, it has been in the high range for the last 3 years and no dopey dr ever said anything about it. I take 2 doses of 200 mcg . Andy's book recommends this as well **bromelain, Avena minerals and other ewnzymes for my stomach. I still have problems digesting some foods (mostly raw fruits and vegtables). I belive SCD diet recommends cooking these to assist metabolism **swiss kriss and organic psyllium for constipation I have spent the last two months cross referencing Andy's book by topic from the index and just my own reading. If anyone wants me to email this summary to them pls email me. Having this organized by topic has helped me keep it all straight sorry for the long post but I think we have to treat all components of our deficiencies and its hard to tell where one benefit stops and others start. good luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 8, 2007 Report Share Posted November 8, 2007 > So, whether all this is slow phase I slow phase II, or fast phase I > slow phase II, or what, I don't know. I just instinctively intuitively know there is a bottlejam there somewhere in the metabolism of things. > What supplements could I try in order to get a better picture based on reactions to those supplements? I've heard of are grapefruit juice or niacinimide or niacin, but I don't know what they do, and I don't know what other things are out there besides those. I've heard mention of licorice, which is very nasty to me. MY REGIMENT IN THE MCS-FAST PHASE 1-SLOW PHASE 2 dilemma My Background-49 years old, 25 years of allergy shots, a mouthful of fillings that are leaking and 40 years of nose drop/spray abuse (for bad alergies plugged nasal passgaes) and 15 years of being a diet coke addict (drank literally gallons a day). I now realize/think I am lucky to be alive and am optimistic for the first time in many years that I can beat this by cleaning up my liver which I think given thats its still working after this abuse it's gotta be strong 3-8 months ago I developed extreme MCS symptoms (I had it mild for the last 5 years but did not realize what it was); however in taking cilantro-chorella and heavy sulphur food diet, I think it was aggravated to the point where I could almost physically not work and was mentally wasted (very depressed, suicidal, severe brain fog... could not think clearly to pay bills ; was overwhelmed talking on the phone etc etc) My health has been extremely bad for the last 4 years and was probably just very bad for the last 10 years (fatigue. always tired and depressed) had lymes, liver flukes, and who knos what the hell else I feel like almost a new person after only 2+ months of AI and help from this forum. I started the AI protocol after the Labour day weekend. I am getting my fillings out starting this week. I can now function and am not nerely as depressed. No marathons yet and am still pretty weak but at least i can function and am feeling optimism Its hard to tell what effect each of the supplements I am taking have had, BUT I broke Andy's book down by reading from the index by supplement, and by symptom/topic.... otherwise it was too much for my brain at the time So here is what i have followed ***** eliminated sulphur foods; no eggs, asparagus, cauliflower, leeks, brussel sprouts and a few others that I cannot think of I think Ai says that sulphur foods can aggravate MCS ***** also follow SCD diet, basically organic meat, vergetables and fruit. NO PROCESSED FOODS and NO sulphur foods even though on the SCD diet many are Ok. I have some caffeine tea (which is Ok on the SCD diet BUT I actually think caffeine is bad for your liver so I try to limit it. NO carbs, no refined sugar, nothing in a package or can *****AI-Andy recommends niacinamide and grapefruit juice and selenomethionine. I take these in 3-4 doses through the day. Usually 1500 of niacinamide (Times 3-4) , 1000 mcg of selenomethionine; and a few mouthfuls of organic grapefruit juice. I believe niacinamide and grapefruit juice slow down phase 1 or maybe its speed up phase 2; I just know it helps. I stoped all the supplements for almost 2 weeks having blood tests and all my symptoms came back with a vengeance I believe the selenomethionine is one thing that Andy recommends as binding to mercury and rendering it inert ****zinc (I was taking 50 a dose) at 3-4 doses a day. I know this is higher than AI suggests but I alos know from the zinc taste test taken 6 weeks after I had been doing this dosage that i was/am still zinc deficient. my hair tests showed zinc and selenium deficiency with what i believe are normal mineral transport results ***I have taurine deficiency from amino acid tests. Tuarine and zinc from what i have read work synergistically in the brain as an antioxidant. I take 1000 mgs (3 times a day) *** I also take 5-6 tablespoons of fish oil and flax oil. Borage oil did not seem to help me. Again this is per AI protcol. Andy says your brain gets fried (I am not sure if these are his words) and it can take months to lubricate with fish oil/flax oil *** I have low DHEA from adrenal tests. DHEA messed me u and there is a section in the AI book that I believe says if you have a liver sulfate problem you may have a reaction to dhea and then suggest trying epsom salts orally. These oral epsom salts made me ill. in a recent post suggested epsom salt baths. I think these epsom salts help phase 2 from what i can interpret from AI. I have been doing them for two days and think i feel better and it has helped me sleep *** 10 mgs of melatonin.(2 doses of 5 mg, one at about 9:00pm and the other one at 9:30 pm) this really helps me sleep.I still wake up but usually can go back to sleep *** chromium pocolinate to reduce my blood sugar, it has been in the high range for the last 3 years and no dopey dr ever said anything about it. I take 2 doses of 200 mcg . Andy's book recommends this as well **bromelain, Avena minerals and other ewnzymes for my stomach. I still have problems digesting some foods (mostly raw fruits and vegtables). I belive SCD diet recommends cooking these to assist metabolism **swiss kriss and organic psyllium for constipation I have spent the last two months cross referencing Andy's book by topic from the index and just my own reading. If anyone wants me to email this summary to them pls email me. Having this organized by topic has helped me keep it all straight sorry for the long post but I think we have to treat all components of our deficiencies and its hard to tell where one benefit stops and others start. good luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 8, 2007 Report Share Posted November 8, 2007 Just wanted to comment on a couple of items below: > *** I also take 5-6 tablespoons of fish oil and flax oil. Borage oil > did not seem to help me. Again this is per AI protcol. Andy says your > brain gets fried (I am not sure if these are his words) and it can > take months to lubricate with fish oil/flax oil This has helped me a lot too. My brain was really fried at one point. I drink a lot of fish oil and it has really helped my brain. I still need a lot. I expect we will continue needing it as long as our brains and bodies are under reconstruction via chelation. > *** I have low DHEA from adrenal tests. DHEA messed me u and there is > a section in the AI book that I believe says if you have a liver > sulfate problem you may have a reaction to dhea and then suggest > trying epsom salts orally. These oral epsom salts made me ill. > in a recent post suggested epsom salt baths. I think these > epsom salts help phase 2 from what i can interpret from AI. I have > been doing them for two days and think i feel better and it has > helped me sleep You will get both sulfate and magnesium from the epsom salts. The mag is more likely to help with sleep. The sulfate will help with liver issues. If you can't do the baths every day, you can get epsom salt cream to use some of the time in addition to baths. www.kirkmanlabs.com sells it. > **bromelain, Avena minerals and other ewnzymes for my stomach. I > still have problems digesting some foods (mostly raw fruits and > vegtables). I belive SCD diet recommends cooking these to assist > metabolism This is a high sulfur supplement. (See AI p. 146) -- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 8, 2007 Report Share Posted November 8, 2007 Just wanted to comment on a couple of items below: > *** I also take 5-6 tablespoons of fish oil and flax oil. Borage oil > did not seem to help me. Again this is per AI protcol. Andy says your > brain gets fried (I am not sure if these are his words) and it can > take months to lubricate with fish oil/flax oil This has helped me a lot too. My brain was really fried at one point. I drink a lot of fish oil and it has really helped my brain. I still need a lot. I expect we will continue needing it as long as our brains and bodies are under reconstruction via chelation. > *** I have low DHEA from adrenal tests. DHEA messed me u and there is > a section in the AI book that I believe says if you have a liver > sulfate problem you may have a reaction to dhea and then suggest > trying epsom salts orally. These oral epsom salts made me ill. > in a recent post suggested epsom salt baths. I think these > epsom salts help phase 2 from what i can interpret from AI. I have > been doing them for two days and think i feel better and it has > helped me sleep You will get both sulfate and magnesium from the epsom salts. The mag is more likely to help with sleep. The sulfate will help with liver issues. If you can't do the baths every day, you can get epsom salt cream to use some of the time in addition to baths. www.kirkmanlabs.com sells it. > **bromelain, Avena minerals and other ewnzymes for my stomach. I > still have problems digesting some foods (mostly raw fruits and > vegtables). I belive SCD diet recommends cooking these to assist > metabolism This is a high sulfur supplement. (See AI p. 146) -- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 8, 2007 Report Share Posted November 8, 2007 > > Liver tox test is financially out of the question for me. I have to > figure that one out the hard way. So help from all of you is very > welcome. > > I am very sensitive to a lot of things. Gluten intolerant with no You probably have a dysbiosis problem and clearing it up might eventually improve your tolerance of gluten. I'm not aware of any way this could be related to liver metabolism. > family history of it, started 2 years ago out of the blue. The > antidepressant cymbalta has a starting dose of 30mg...I could handle > no more than 3 eensy weensy mg. It was insane. St s Wort...I can > handle 75mg sort of, but no way 300mg to 900mg. Strange, because 5 You might want to look at http://medicine.iupui.edu/flockhart/table.htm to see which liver pathways metabolize these things. Might help you predict which other drugs you will have trouble with, and which ones you may do better with. (Andy has this chart in the book, but the online version is current.) > years ago SJW worked awesome for me and now it feels like poison. > Ginkgo biloba, same pattern. Actually, everything...vitamins, some > minerals (magnesium is real bad), herbs of all kinds, amino acids. The > only things I seem to handle ok are modestly medium doses of ester C, > zinc, selenium, and molybdenum. I can only handle about 100% RDA of B > vitamin complexes. I see recommendations to take B25 or B50 and I just > grimace and say, yeah, right. There are various reasons for intolerance, not just liver metabolism. Magnesium you may have to start with small doses and don't use oxide. You may find some forms better than others - citrate and glycinate are commonly used, malate is another. You can also try getting magnesium through topical use of epsom salts or magnesium oil. With all of the supplements, you could be intolerant to the main ingredient, but sometimes it is other ingredients/fillers. If you have a leaky gut, you can get intolerant to a whole bunch of stuff and you have to fix the leaky gut to prevent developing more intolerances. NAET can help with intolerances for some people. www.naet.com Bioset is a similar method, and there are some others. Some people need to use the coenzyme forms of B vitamins, such as pantethine or p5p. > So, whether all this is slow phase I slow phase II, or fast phase I > slow phase II, or what, I don't know. I just instinctively intuitively > know there is a bottlejam there somewhere in the metabolism of things. > > What supplements could I try in order to get a better picture based on > reactions to those supplements? I've heard of are grapefruit juice or > niacinimide or niacin, but I don't know what they do, and I don't know > what other things are out there besides those. I've heard mention of > licorice, which is very nasty to me. The drug reactions could be liver metabolism issues, not sure about the supplement reactions, those can have lots of reasons. Grapefruit juice and niacinamide slow down phase 1. This reduces reactions for people who have problems caused by fast phase 1. Niacin is hard on the liver and should not be used. Anxiety is a common reaction with fast phase 1. Other symptoms are possible, too. If you read the relevant sections in Amalgam Illness it should give you some clue about whether your problems are due to liver metabolism problems, and you can experiment with some of Andy's suggestions to see if they help. -- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 8, 2007 Report Share Posted November 8, 2007 > > **bromelain, Avena minerals and other ewnzymes for my stomach. I > > still have problems digesting some foods (mostly raw fruits and > > vegtables). I belive SCD diet recommends cooking these to assist > > metabolism This is a high sulfur supplement. (See AI p. 146) -- thank you. is it just the Bromelain and Papain that are high in sulphur components? any recommendations for enzymes that have the animal derived products or protease enzymes that page 146 mentions Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 8, 2007 Report Share Posted November 8, 2007 > The drug reactions could be liver metabolism issues, not sure about > the supplement reactions, those can have lots of reasons. It could be a mercury induced Gilbert's. In Gilberts the 'glucoronidation' phase 2 pathway is out/slow. Gilbert's people can't tolerate high dosages of B-vitamins and some other supplements. The only thing that helps this is thyroid hormone that I'm aware off. Does thyroid hormone speed up phase 2 in general? And Cortisol slow phase 1 in general? I get the feeling that is true, but have no references. Thanks, Dean Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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