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> Ruthie

>

> I hope everything was a bit more settled this Sabbath.

> As I am slightly sozzled I have a thought for you. Next time the

teenager decides to make his presence know in the wind up mode think '

I am a swan, I am beautiful, elegant and serene, I will not rise to

this bait, ' just glide through it and remember don't let Yeshaya see

you paddling like stink to keep afloat and if he really get you

uptight remind yourself you can always give him a good peck!!!!

Yup it was much better. Even though there was just the three of us

for Friday night dinner last night, it went fine. Admittedly DH was a

bit grumpy and " Out of it " and kept falling asleep at the table but

that's nothing unusual either for him or many of our friends (the

falling asleep on Sabbath eve bit! It's the day of rest, and by

, they're going to rest LOL ). After supper DH went up to bed

early (well, early for him, it was 11.30, but Sabbath meals start late

and end late at this time of year) and then Yeshaya fetched Zevi over

and the 3 of us played Cluedo until about 12.45 am. And had a pretty

good laugh too.

Today Zevi and another boy Yitzi came for lunch so that nicely

diluted poor deaf old MIL who tends to retreat into a world of her own

when conversations flow around her that she can't follow. Every now

and then she'd pipe up with a comment on the last conversation gambit

we actually managed to get thru to her by yelling, and which had long

since passed the rest of us by.

Before Yeshaya and Zevi came home from synagogue, Yitzi was already

here, as he went to another service. After the two of us had prepared

lunch, I had a lovely and very informative chat with Yitzi about the

general state of play with regard to his peers, including Yeshaya. It

was reassuring in a way to know Yeshaya is well liked by his peers,

and not considered a " lost cause " religously or socially by any means.

Yitzi told me, and I found this very shocking, about a small group of

out of town (Manchester mainly) boys of 15-16 who were so rebellious

and difficult that their parents had more or less done the " and never

darken our doors again " bit on them. These boys had drifted to London

(and in once case *driven* in his father's stolen car) and were now

the really bad element in the local Jewish teenage crowd. Smoking

drugs, not observing Sabbath etc. Yeshaya had told me vaguely about

such a bad element but hadn't gone into any details, except to say

that one of his school friends had got in with them and was now

smoking drugs etc.

Yitzi reassured me that Yeshaya and none of his peers had got involved

with these boys.

After lunch Yeshaya had invited about 19 (I kid you not) boys over for

a game of Risk so he warned me that if I wanted my Sabbath afternoon

snooze I had better wear earplugs! Which I did, and slept through

what was a tremendous racket. Risk is a very noisy game as all the

would be conquerors of the world yell a lot at each other. When I

woke up and came downstairs the living room was full of large and

rowdy teenaged boys lying all over my Parket Knoll recliners tipping

them every which way, and throwing my NCT cushions at each other, but

no serious damage seemed to have occured. They had also eaten their

way through several dozen packets of crisps and other snacks and drunk

several bottles of fizzy drinks. But all seemed to be having a good

time and were polite to me. I left them and walked over to my

daughter Tammy for a bit of peace (with her, her DH, and her four

kids!!) Besides Tammy and her DH lecturing me on how terribly

dangerous it was for Yeshaya to use his mobile phone so much, (brain

tumour wise) and how Tammy told off a woman in the street whom she saw

(shock horror) *using her mobile phone near her BABY!!!!!*, the visit

passed relatively peacefully. Tammy can be terribly opinionated at

times and is still persona non grata with Yeshaya since the

phone-rollicking she gave him last Saturday night at Azariah's. She

has a lot to learn about dealing with teenagers, and really expected

him to come running when she ordered him to " come over right this

minute!! " hehehe!

When I came back at about 8.15 pm. only about six boys remained and

they had done a creditable job of tidying up the lounge. They all

went out to synagogue for afternoon service. Yeshaya came in a bit

later on his own and we had a good talk about his view of life. Or

rather he talked and I listened LOL.

All in all Sabbath was survived with flying colours. Thank Heavens!!

Ruthie

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> Ruthie

>

> I hope everything was a bit more settled this Sabbath.

> As I am slightly sozzled I have a thought for you. Next time the

teenager decides to make his presence know in the wind up mode think '

I am a swan, I am beautiful, elegant and serene, I will not rise to

this bait, ' just glide through it and remember don't let Yeshaya see

you paddling like stink to keep afloat and if he really get you

uptight remind yourself you can always give him a good peck!!!!

Yup it was much better. Even though there was just the three of us

for Friday night dinner last night, it went fine. Admittedly DH was a

bit grumpy and " Out of it " and kept falling asleep at the table but

that's nothing unusual either for him or many of our friends (the

falling asleep on Sabbath eve bit! It's the day of rest, and by

, they're going to rest LOL ). After supper DH went up to bed

early (well, early for him, it was 11.30, but Sabbath meals start late

and end late at this time of year) and then Yeshaya fetched Zevi over

and the 3 of us played Cluedo until about 12.45 am. And had a pretty

good laugh too.

Today Zevi and another boy Yitzi came for lunch so that nicely

diluted poor deaf old MIL who tends to retreat into a world of her own

when conversations flow around her that she can't follow. Every now

and then she'd pipe up with a comment on the last conversation gambit

we actually managed to get thru to her by yelling, and which had long

since passed the rest of us by.

Before Yeshaya and Zevi came home from synagogue, Yitzi was already

here, as he went to another service. After the two of us had prepared

lunch, I had a lovely and very informative chat with Yitzi about the

general state of play with regard to his peers, including Yeshaya. It

was reassuring in a way to know Yeshaya is well liked by his peers,

and not considered a " lost cause " religously or socially by any means.

Yitzi told me, and I found this very shocking, about a small group of

out of town (Manchester mainly) boys of 15-16 who were so rebellious

and difficult that their parents had more or less done the " and never

darken our doors again " bit on them. These boys had drifted to London

(and in once case *driven* in his father's stolen car) and were now

the really bad element in the local Jewish teenage crowd. Smoking

drugs, not observing Sabbath etc. Yeshaya had told me vaguely about

such a bad element but hadn't gone into any details, except to say

that one of his school friends had got in with them and was now

smoking drugs etc.

Yitzi reassured me that Yeshaya and none of his peers had got involved

with these boys.

After lunch Yeshaya had invited about 19 (I kid you not) boys over for

a game of Risk so he warned me that if I wanted my Sabbath afternoon

snooze I had better wear earplugs! Which I did, and slept through

what was a tremendous racket. Risk is a very noisy game as all the

would be conquerors of the world yell a lot at each other. When I

woke up and came downstairs the living room was full of large and

rowdy teenaged boys lying all over my Parket Knoll recliners tipping

them every which way, and throwing my NCT cushions at each other, but

no serious damage seemed to have occured. They had also eaten their

way through several dozen packets of crisps and other snacks and drunk

several bottles of fizzy drinks. But all seemed to be having a good

time and were polite to me. I left them and walked over to my

daughter Tammy for a bit of peace (with her, her DH, and her four

kids!!) Besides Tammy and her DH lecturing me on how terribly

dangerous it was for Yeshaya to use his mobile phone so much, (brain

tumour wise) and how Tammy told off a woman in the street whom she saw

(shock horror) *using her mobile phone near her BABY!!!!!*, the visit

passed relatively peacefully. Tammy can be terribly opinionated at

times and is still persona non grata with Yeshaya since the

phone-rollicking she gave him last Saturday night at Azariah's. She

has a lot to learn about dealing with teenagers, and really expected

him to come running when she ordered him to " come over right this

minute!! " hehehe!

When I came back at about 8.15 pm. only about six boys remained and

they had done a creditable job of tidying up the lounge. They all

went out to synagogue for afternoon service. Yeshaya came in a bit

later on his own and we had a good talk about his view of life. Or

rather he talked and I listened LOL.

All in all Sabbath was survived with flying colours. Thank Heavens!!

Ruthie

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> All in all Sabbath was survived with flying colours. Thank Heavens!!

>

> Ruthie

>

Glad you had a good one :o) The thought of 19 teenage boys in the house!!

Ack!

Hannah, 27 (not looking forwards to the teenage years)

Mum to Bethany 7, Lawrence 5 1/2, Verity 3, Alfie 4 months

Visit me on the web at :-

http://hannahshome.20m.com

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> Glad you had a good one :o) The thought of 19 teenage boys in the

house!!

> Ack!

>

> Hannah, 27 (not looking forwards to the teenage years)

That's why I got the h*ll out and went to Tammy's :) Zevi said his

Mum would have *never* allowed him to invite so many, so I am

considered either Mum of the Month, or Mug of the Month depending on

how you look at it :-))

I just wish Yeshaya and Tammy would make it up. They both think the

other owes them an apology, meanwhile they are miffed with each other.

Personally I think Tammy was a bit foolish (even though her heart was

in the right place) to launch into her kid bro like that without

previous consultation with us as to what would and would not work. A

bit like Zevi's Mum Vivienne who has succeeded in putting Yeshaya off

going to the Jewish study program by telling him his motives for going

(ie being with his peers) were wrong. Who gives a TOSS about his

motives? At least he went!!

As a Rabbi once said to Tammy's FIL " it's better to fall asleep in a

Jewish study lecture than in front of the TV. " hehehe

Ruthie

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> >Yup it was much better.

>

>

>

>

> Wow, thanks for this Ruthie - it sounds like you had a hit there.

Isn't

> being a parent of a teenager all about listening? I am so pleased

it was a

> success.

>

> Sue

Yes, the dictatorial parenting you can get away with when they're

little " do it cos I say so " doesn't work once they get into their

teens. Parenting becomes a democracy. And they notice if you aren't

really listening; they'll test you on it later LOL :))

Ruthie

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At 22:34 07/07/2001 +0000, you wrote:

>Yup it was much better.

Wow, thanks for this Ruthie - it sounds like you had a hit there. Isn't

being a parent of a teenager all about listening? I am so pleased it was a

success.

Sue

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Excellent, Ruthie - I'm so glad it all went well. In fact, it sounds

positively triumphant! I hope the chat with Yitzi managed to put your mind

at rest, too. I was thinking of you all day, wondering how you were getting

on.

Hugs

Vicki Portman

http://www.plushpants.co.uk

Re: This Sabbath

>

> > Ruthie

> >

> > I hope everything was a bit more settled this Sabbath.

> > As I am slightly sozzled I have a thought for you. Next time the

> teenager decides to make his presence know in the wind up mode think '

> I am a swan, I am beautiful, elegant and serene, I will not rise to

> this bait, ' just glide through it and remember don't let Yeshaya see

> you paddling like stink to keep afloat and if he really get you

> uptight remind yourself you can always give him a good peck!!!!

>

> Yup it was much better. Even though there was just the three of us

> for Friday night dinner last night, it went fine. Admittedly DH was a

> bit grumpy and " Out of it " and kept falling asleep at the table but

> that's nothing unusual either for him or many of our friends (the

> falling asleep on Sabbath eve bit! It's the day of rest, and by

> , they're going to rest LOL ). After supper DH went up to bed

> early (well, early for him, it was 11.30, but Sabbath meals start late

> and end late at this time of year) and then Yeshaya fetched Zevi over

> and the 3 of us played Cluedo until about 12.45 am. And had a pretty

> good laugh too.

>

> Today Zevi and another boy Yitzi came for lunch so that nicely

> diluted poor deaf old MIL who tends to retreat into a world of her own

> when conversations flow around her that she can't follow. Every now

> and then she'd pipe up with a comment on the last conversation gambit

> we actually managed to get thru to her by yelling, and which had long

> since passed the rest of us by.

>

> Before Yeshaya and Zevi came home from synagogue, Yitzi was already

> here, as he went to another service. After the two of us had prepared

> lunch, I had a lovely and very informative chat with Yitzi about the

> general state of play with regard to his peers, including Yeshaya. It

> was reassuring in a way to know Yeshaya is well liked by his peers,

> and not considered a " lost cause " religously or socially by any means.

> Yitzi told me, and I found this very shocking, about a small group of

> out of town (Manchester mainly) boys of 15-16 who were so rebellious

> and difficult that their parents had more or less done the " and never

> darken our doors again " bit on them. These boys had drifted to London

> (and in once case *driven* in his father's stolen car) and were now

> the really bad element in the local Jewish teenage crowd. Smoking

> drugs, not observing Sabbath etc. Yeshaya had told me vaguely about

> such a bad element but hadn't gone into any details, except to say

> that one of his school friends had got in with them and was now

> smoking drugs etc.

>

> Yitzi reassured me that Yeshaya and none of his peers had got involved

> with these boys.

>

> After lunch Yeshaya had invited about 19 (I kid you not) boys over for

> a game of Risk so he warned me that if I wanted my Sabbath afternoon

> snooze I had better wear earplugs! Which I did, and slept through

> what was a tremendous racket. Risk is a very noisy game as all the

> would be conquerors of the world yell a lot at each other. When I

> woke up and came downstairs the living room was full of large and

> rowdy teenaged boys lying all over my Parket Knoll recliners tipping

> them every which way, and throwing my NCT cushions at each other, but

> no serious damage seemed to have occured. They had also eaten their

> way through several dozen packets of crisps and other snacks and drunk

> several bottles of fizzy drinks. But all seemed to be having a good

> time and were polite to me. I left them and walked over to my

> daughter Tammy for a bit of peace (with her, her DH, and her four

> kids!!) Besides Tammy and her DH lecturing me on how terribly

> dangerous it was for Yeshaya to use his mobile phone so much, (brain

> tumour wise) and how Tammy told off a woman in the street whom she saw

> (shock horror) *using her mobile phone near her BABY!!!!!*, the visit

> passed relatively peacefully. Tammy can be terribly opinionated at

> times and is still persona non grata with Yeshaya since the

> phone-rollicking she gave him last Saturday night at Azariah's. She

> has a lot to learn about dealing with teenagers, and really expected

> him to come running when she ordered him to " come over right this

> minute!! " hehehe!

>

> When I came back at about 8.15 pm. only about six boys remained and

> they had done a creditable job of tidying up the lounge. They all

> went out to synagogue for afternoon service. Yeshaya came in a bit

> later on his own and we had a good talk about his view of life. Or

> rather he talked and I listened LOL.

>

> All in all Sabbath was survived with flying colours. Thank Heavens!!

>

> Ruthie

>

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> *** NCT enquiry line - 0 ***

>

> Live chat http://www.yahoogroups.com/chat/nct-coffee

>

> Have you found out about all the other groups for the NCT online?

>

>

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Guest guest

Excellent, Ruthie - I'm so glad it all went well. In fact, it sounds

positively triumphant! I hope the chat with Yitzi managed to put your mind

at rest, too. I was thinking of you all day, wondering how you were getting

on.

Hugs

Vicki Portman

http://www.plushpants.co.uk

Re: This Sabbath

>

> > Ruthie

> >

> > I hope everything was a bit more settled this Sabbath.

> > As I am slightly sozzled I have a thought for you. Next time the

> teenager decides to make his presence know in the wind up mode think '

> I am a swan, I am beautiful, elegant and serene, I will not rise to

> this bait, ' just glide through it and remember don't let Yeshaya see

> you paddling like stink to keep afloat and if he really get you

> uptight remind yourself you can always give him a good peck!!!!

>

> Yup it was much better. Even though there was just the three of us

> for Friday night dinner last night, it went fine. Admittedly DH was a

> bit grumpy and " Out of it " and kept falling asleep at the table but

> that's nothing unusual either for him or many of our friends (the

> falling asleep on Sabbath eve bit! It's the day of rest, and by

> , they're going to rest LOL ). After supper DH went up to bed

> early (well, early for him, it was 11.30, but Sabbath meals start late

> and end late at this time of year) and then Yeshaya fetched Zevi over

> and the 3 of us played Cluedo until about 12.45 am. And had a pretty

> good laugh too.

>

> Today Zevi and another boy Yitzi came for lunch so that nicely

> diluted poor deaf old MIL who tends to retreat into a world of her own

> when conversations flow around her that she can't follow. Every now

> and then she'd pipe up with a comment on the last conversation gambit

> we actually managed to get thru to her by yelling, and which had long

> since passed the rest of us by.

>

> Before Yeshaya and Zevi came home from synagogue, Yitzi was already

> here, as he went to another service. After the two of us had prepared

> lunch, I had a lovely and very informative chat with Yitzi about the

> general state of play with regard to his peers, including Yeshaya. It

> was reassuring in a way to know Yeshaya is well liked by his peers,

> and not considered a " lost cause " religously or socially by any means.

> Yitzi told me, and I found this very shocking, about a small group of

> out of town (Manchester mainly) boys of 15-16 who were so rebellious

> and difficult that their parents had more or less done the " and never

> darken our doors again " bit on them. These boys had drifted to London

> (and in once case *driven* in his father's stolen car) and were now

> the really bad element in the local Jewish teenage crowd. Smoking

> drugs, not observing Sabbath etc. Yeshaya had told me vaguely about

> such a bad element but hadn't gone into any details, except to say

> that one of his school friends had got in with them and was now

> smoking drugs etc.

>

> Yitzi reassured me that Yeshaya and none of his peers had got involved

> with these boys.

>

> After lunch Yeshaya had invited about 19 (I kid you not) boys over for

> a game of Risk so he warned me that if I wanted my Sabbath afternoon

> snooze I had better wear earplugs! Which I did, and slept through

> what was a tremendous racket. Risk is a very noisy game as all the

> would be conquerors of the world yell a lot at each other. When I

> woke up and came downstairs the living room was full of large and

> rowdy teenaged boys lying all over my Parket Knoll recliners tipping

> them every which way, and throwing my NCT cushions at each other, but

> no serious damage seemed to have occured. They had also eaten their

> way through several dozen packets of crisps and other snacks and drunk

> several bottles of fizzy drinks. But all seemed to be having a good

> time and were polite to me. I left them and walked over to my

> daughter Tammy for a bit of peace (with her, her DH, and her four

> kids!!) Besides Tammy and her DH lecturing me on how terribly

> dangerous it was for Yeshaya to use his mobile phone so much, (brain

> tumour wise) and how Tammy told off a woman in the street whom she saw

> (shock horror) *using her mobile phone near her BABY!!!!!*, the visit

> passed relatively peacefully. Tammy can be terribly opinionated at

> times and is still persona non grata with Yeshaya since the

> phone-rollicking she gave him last Saturday night at Azariah's. She

> has a lot to learn about dealing with teenagers, and really expected

> him to come running when she ordered him to " come over right this

> minute!! " hehehe!

>

> When I came back at about 8.15 pm. only about six boys remained and

> they had done a creditable job of tidying up the lounge. They all

> went out to synagogue for afternoon service. Yeshaya came in a bit

> later on his own and we had a good talk about his view of life. Or

> rather he talked and I listened LOL.

>

> All in all Sabbath was survived with flying colours. Thank Heavens!!

>

> Ruthie

>

>

>

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>

>

> *** NCT enquiry line - 0 ***

>

> Live chat http://www.yahoogroups.com/chat/nct-coffee

>

> Have you found out about all the other groups for the NCT online?

>

>

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Guest guest

> Excellent, Ruthie - I'm so glad it all went well. In fact, it

sounds

> positively triumphant! I hope the chat with Yitzi managed to put

your mind

> at rest, too. I was thinking of you all day, wondering how you were

getting

> on.

>

> Hugs

>

> Vicki Portman

Well, for Yeshaya, it was good. Triumphant would have been him sitting

down and doing some Talmudic study with either his friends or (much

hoped for but hardly expected any more) with his Dad, who constantly

asks him if he would like to learn something with him, but is always

rejected. But we can't expect too much of him, at least he doesn't

seem to be a lost cause. And he is with very a good and supportive

peer group and friends.

Today is a fast day commemorating the beginning of the

destruction of the Temple (not one of the two major ones but pretty

important, I only fast on the two major ones, Yom Kippur and Tisha

B'Av, I'm ashamed to say.) Yeshaya and DH are fasting. As it ends at

dark that's quite late (10.17 pm.) and involves not drinking as well

as not eating, so they were up late drinking loads of water and eating

sensibly. Today' fast began at dawn (about 3.45) but the two major

ones are 25 hours, ie begin at sundown the night before and go on

until dark of the following day, like a Sabbath.

Ruthie

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Guest guest

> Excellent, Ruthie - I'm so glad it all went well. In fact, it

sounds

> positively triumphant! I hope the chat with Yitzi managed to put

your mind

> at rest, too. I was thinking of you all day, wondering how you were

getting

> on.

>

> Hugs

>

> Vicki Portman

Well, for Yeshaya, it was good. Triumphant would have been him sitting

down and doing some Talmudic study with either his friends or (much

hoped for but hardly expected any more) with his Dad, who constantly

asks him if he would like to learn something with him, but is always

rejected. But we can't expect too much of him, at least he doesn't

seem to be a lost cause. And he is with very a good and supportive

peer group and friends.

Today is a fast day commemorating the beginning of the

destruction of the Temple (not one of the two major ones but pretty

important, I only fast on the two major ones, Yom Kippur and Tisha

B'Av, I'm ashamed to say.) Yeshaya and DH are fasting. As it ends at

dark that's quite late (10.17 pm.) and involves not drinking as well

as not eating, so they were up late drinking loads of water and eating

sensibly. Today' fast began at dawn (about 3.45) but the two major

ones are 25 hours, ie begin at sundown the night before and go on

until dark of the following day, like a Sabbath.

Ruthie

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Sounds highly successful after last weekend. What a relief for you.

Todman

Treasurer, Stansted Branch (R5)

Mum to , 3½

> All in all Sabbath was survived with flying colours. Thank Heavens!!

>

> Ruthie

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Sounds highly successful after last weekend. What a relief for you.

Todman

Treasurer, Stansted Branch (R5)

Mum to , 3½

> All in all Sabbath was survived with flying colours. Thank Heavens!!

>

> Ruthie

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Sounds highly successful after last weekend. What a relief for you.

Todman

Treasurer, Stansted Branch (R5)

Mum to , 3½

> All in all Sabbath was survived with flying colours. Thank Heavens!!

>

> Ruthie

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Guest guest

>

>> >Yup it was much better.

>>

>>

>>

>>

>> Wow, thanks for this Ruthie - it sounds like you had a hit there.

>Isn't

>> being a parent of a teenager all about listening? I am so pleased

>it was a

>> success.

>>

>> Sue

>

>Yes, the dictatorial parenting you can get away with when they're

>little " do it cos I say so " doesn't work once they get into their

>teens.

Oh, how little do they have to be - did I miss that bit? :-)

> Parenting becomes a democracy. And they notice if you aren't

>really listening; they'll test you on it later LOL :))

>

>Ruthie

>

>

>

>

>*** NCT enquiry line - 0 ***

>

>Live chat http://www.yahoogroups.com/chat/nct-coffee

>

>Have you found out about all the other groups for the NCT online?

>

>

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