Guest guest Posted February 16, 2005 Report Share Posted February 16, 2005 , if you can believe a TSH test you are very HYPO. Your Free T4 should be higher too, and your antibodies are off the scale high! You definitely have Hashi's. What meds have you been on? They are certainly NOT working for you and I bet you will feel lots better with the Thyroid-S. I am willing to bet you will need at least 3 grains and probably more, but work up to it slowly, and expect to feel worse for a short while. It is necessary t go slowly to not shock your system with too much REAL hormones all at once. *Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WV Fat cat? Diabetes? Listowner for overweight or hypothyroid cats http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hypokitties/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 16, 2005 Report Share Posted February 16, 2005 , if you can believe a TSH test you are very HYPO. Your Free T4 should be higher too, and your antibodies are off the scale high! You definitely have Hashi's. What meds have you been on? They are certainly NOT working for you and I bet you will feel lots better with the Thyroid-S. I am willing to bet you will need at least 3 grains and probably more, but work up to it slowly, and expect to feel worse for a short while. It is necessary t go slowly to not shock your system with too much REAL hormones all at once. *Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WV Fat cat? Diabetes? Listowner for overweight or hypothyroid cats http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hypokitties/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 16, 2005 Report Share Posted February 16, 2005 , if you can believe a TSH test you are very HYPO. Your Free T4 should be higher too, and your antibodies are off the scale high! You definitely have Hashi's. What meds have you been on? They are certainly NOT working for you and I bet you will feel lots better with the Thyroid-S. I am willing to bet you will need at least 3 grains and probably more, but work up to it slowly, and expect to feel worse for a short while. It is necessary t go slowly to not shock your system with too much REAL hormones all at once. *Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WV Fat cat? Diabetes? Listowner for overweight or hypothyroid cats http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hypokitties/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 16, 2005 Report Share Posted February 16, 2005 Val, I've been taking synthroid 75mcg , my last tests were done in july and the tsh was 0.222 , free thyroxine index 3.3. I've never had the thyroid peroxidase done before. I'm way confused now. The test were done thru my " crazy people doctor " , they will do the test but won't treat it. They shoved antidepressant on me before treating my thyroid. Im now weaning off the antidepressants, do you think they could be the problem? I have been having a terrible time remembering anything and very depressed. kk > , if you can believe a TSH test you are very HYPO. Your Free T4 should be higher too, and your antibodies are off the scale high! You definitely have Hashi's. What meds have you been on? They are certainly NOT working for you and I bet you will feel lots better with the Thyroid-S. I am willing to bet you will need at least 3 grains and probably more, but work up to it slowly, and expect to feel worse for a short while. It is necessary t go slowly to not shock your system with too much REAL hormones all at once. > *Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WV > Fat cat? Diabetes? Listowner for overweight or hypothyroid cats > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hypokitties/ > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 16, 2005 Report Share Posted February 16, 2005 Val, I've been taking synthroid 75mcg , my last tests were done in july and the tsh was 0.222 , free thyroxine index 3.3. I've never had the thyroid peroxidase done before. I'm way confused now. The test were done thru my " crazy people doctor " , they will do the test but won't treat it. They shoved antidepressant on me before treating my thyroid. Im now weaning off the antidepressants, do you think they could be the problem? I have been having a terrible time remembering anything and very depressed. kk > , if you can believe a TSH test you are very HYPO. Your Free T4 should be higher too, and your antibodies are off the scale high! You definitely have Hashi's. What meds have you been on? They are certainly NOT working for you and I bet you will feel lots better with the Thyroid-S. I am willing to bet you will need at least 3 grains and probably more, but work up to it slowly, and expect to feel worse for a short while. It is necessary t go slowly to not shock your system with too much REAL hormones all at once. > *Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WV > Fat cat? Diabetes? Listowner for overweight or hypothyroid cats > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hypokitties/ > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 16, 2005 Report Share Posted February 16, 2005 >>Im now weaning off the antidepressants, do you think they could be the problem? I have been having a terrible time remembering anything and very depressed.<, Antidepressants will cause memory problems by them selves, BUT you being very hypo will also cause both depression and short term memory problems..ask me, I forget who tell me what on this list even minutes later..LOL *Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WV Fat cat? Diabetes? Listowner for overweight or hypothyroid cats http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hypokitties/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 16, 2005 Report Share Posted February 16, 2005 >>Im now weaning off the antidepressants, do you think they could be the problem? I have been having a terrible time remembering anything and very depressed.<, Antidepressants will cause memory problems by them selves, BUT you being very hypo will also cause both depression and short term memory problems..ask me, I forget who tell me what on this list even minutes later..LOL *Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WV Fat cat? Diabetes? Listowner for overweight or hypothyroid cats http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hypokitties/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 16, 2005 Report Share Posted February 16, 2005 Can the antidepressants effect the thyroid peroxidase (tpo) test? Can you explain just what that is? kk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 16, 2005 Report Share Posted February 16, 2005 >>Can the antidepressants effect the thyroid peroxidase (tpo) test? Can you explain just what that is?<< NO. Thyroid antibodies are just like ANY antibodies in your system, they are there to ward off diseases, but in the case of Hashimoto's Thyroid Disease, the antibodies attack your own thyroid instead of protecting it form disease. They also will bind thyroid hormones making them useless to your body, which means your test results for the hormones may not be accurate at all. Antidepressants simply mask your depression, and with depression from hypo they really are ineffective at that. Antidepressants are drugs where thyroid meds are hormones, HUGE difference in how they work. *Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WV Fat cat? Diabetes? Listowner for overweight or hypothyroid cats http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hypokitties/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 16, 2005 Report Share Posted February 16, 2005 Tsh - 6.186 0350-5.50 ________________________ You must be feeling awful at this. Anything above 3.0 is hypothyroid according to the new ranges, which have yet to be adopted labs. It's been at least two years since they changed the ranges and I have not seen one US lab that has kept with the times. I felt terrible with a TSH of 3.4. ___________________________ > T4, free (direct) 0.99 0.60-1.76 ___________________________ This middle of the range for this is 1.18. You are well below that. I would consider this unsatisfactory for somebody who has been on thyroid medication for some time. Thyroid test ranges are skewed slightly downward due to how the ranges are deterimined. There is error in the ranges due to the overly large percentage of hypothyroid people in the groups used to determine the ranges. So, this skews them down. Researchers are aware of this problem, but nothing has been done about it, probably due to the difficuties in finding people that you are sure are not hypothyroid and who are difinitely healthy for determineing the proper ranges. Most of the wiser doctors like to see patients in the upper half of the range minimum and the upper 1/3 is probably the healthiest spot. ____________________ > Thyroid peroxidase (tpo) >1000 0-34 ______________________________ This means that you can forget about using tests to know whether your are hypothyroid or on enough medication. The presence of antibodies both mess up tests and make them meaningless, since you have no idea how much thyroid is being lost to antibody attack. In these situations doses need to be adjusted to whereever the patient feels good. This can be a lot of thyroid for some who need much more to compensate for the thyroid being destroyed before it can get into tissues. The best tests for those with anitbodies are the basal body temperature test, reflex test, appearance, and physical symptoms - the way it was done for 75 years before these tests. _________________________ > > T3 uptake 27 24-39 ________________ Tish Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 17, 2005 Report Share Posted February 17, 2005 I have been having a terrible time remembering > anything and very depressed. ______________________ It's probably because you are hypothyroid and the brain is not getting enough energy. Memory poblems are one of the halmarks of hypothyroidism. Depression is a symptom of hypothyroidism as well, or really it is low T3 levels in the brain. Lots of studies have found that depression is cured by T3 in adequate doses. Tish Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 17, 2005 Report Share Posted February 17, 2005 Tish, Thank you for the info, it was very helpful. I was going to start my thyroid-s with 1 grain in am and 1/2 in pm, does that sound ok? > > Tsh - 6.186 0350-5.50 > ________________________ > You must be feeling awful at this. Anything above 3.0 is hypothyroid > according to the new ranges, which have yet to be adopted labs. It's > been at least two years since they changed the ranges and I have not > seen one US lab that has kept with the times. > > I felt terrible with a TSH of 3.4. > ___________________________ > > > T4, free (direct) 0.99 0.60-1.76 > ___________________________ > This middle of the range for this is 1.18. You are well below that. > I would consider this unsatisfactory for somebody who has been on > thyroid medication for some time. Thyroid test ranges are skewed > slightly downward due to how the ranges are deterimined. There is > error in the ranges due to the overly large percentage of > hypothyroid people in the groups used to determine the ranges. So, > this skews them down. Researchers are aware of this problem, but > nothing has been done about it, probably due to the difficuties in > finding people that you are sure are not hypothyroid and who are > difinitely healthy for determineing the proper ranges. > > Most of the wiser doctors like to see patients in the upper half of > the range minimum and the upper 1/3 is probably the healthiest spot. > ____________________ > > > Thyroid peroxidase (tpo) >1000 0-34 > ______________________________ > This means that you can forget about using tests to know whether > your are hypothyroid or on enough medication. The presence of > antibodies both mess up tests and make them meaningless, since you > have no idea how much thyroid is being lost to antibody attack. In > these situations doses need to be adjusted to whereever the patient > feels good. This can be a lot of thyroid for some who need much more > to compensate for the thyroid being destroyed before it can get into > tissues. The best tests for those with anitbodies are the basal body > temperature test, reflex test, appearance, and physical symptoms - > the way it was done for 75 years before these tests. > _________________________ > > > > T3 uptake 27 24-39 > ________________ > > Tish Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 17, 2005 Report Share Posted February 17, 2005 Tish, Thank you for the info, it was very helpful. I was going to start my thyroid-s with 1 grain in am and 1/2 in pm, does that sound ok? > > Tsh - 6.186 0350-5.50 > ________________________ > You must be feeling awful at this. Anything above 3.0 is hypothyroid > according to the new ranges, which have yet to be adopted labs. It's > been at least two years since they changed the ranges and I have not > seen one US lab that has kept with the times. > > I felt terrible with a TSH of 3.4. > ___________________________ > > > T4, free (direct) 0.99 0.60-1.76 > ___________________________ > This middle of the range for this is 1.18. You are well below that. > I would consider this unsatisfactory for somebody who has been on > thyroid medication for some time. Thyroid test ranges are skewed > slightly downward due to how the ranges are deterimined. There is > error in the ranges due to the overly large percentage of > hypothyroid people in the groups used to determine the ranges. So, > this skews them down. Researchers are aware of this problem, but > nothing has been done about it, probably due to the difficuties in > finding people that you are sure are not hypothyroid and who are > difinitely healthy for determineing the proper ranges. > > Most of the wiser doctors like to see patients in the upper half of > the range minimum and the upper 1/3 is probably the healthiest spot. > ____________________ > > > Thyroid peroxidase (tpo) >1000 0-34 > ______________________________ > This means that you can forget about using tests to know whether > your are hypothyroid or on enough medication. The presence of > antibodies both mess up tests and make them meaningless, since you > have no idea how much thyroid is being lost to antibody attack. In > these situations doses need to be adjusted to whereever the patient > feels good. This can be a lot of thyroid for some who need much more > to compensate for the thyroid being destroyed before it can get into > tissues. The best tests for those with anitbodies are the basal body > temperature test, reflex test, appearance, and physical symptoms - > the way it was done for 75 years before these tests. > _________________________ > > > > T3 uptake 27 24-39 > ________________ > > Tish Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 17, 2005 Report Share Posted February 17, 2005 Tish, Thank you for the info, it was very helpful. I was going to start my thyroid-s with 1 grain in am and 1/2 in pm, does that sound ok? > > Tsh - 6.186 0350-5.50 > ________________________ > You must be feeling awful at this. Anything above 3.0 is hypothyroid > according to the new ranges, which have yet to be adopted labs. It's > been at least two years since they changed the ranges and I have not > seen one US lab that has kept with the times. > > I felt terrible with a TSH of 3.4. > ___________________________ > > > T4, free (direct) 0.99 0.60-1.76 > ___________________________ > This middle of the range for this is 1.18. You are well below that. > I would consider this unsatisfactory for somebody who has been on > thyroid medication for some time. Thyroid test ranges are skewed > slightly downward due to how the ranges are deterimined. There is > error in the ranges due to the overly large percentage of > hypothyroid people in the groups used to determine the ranges. So, > this skews them down. Researchers are aware of this problem, but > nothing has been done about it, probably due to the difficuties in > finding people that you are sure are not hypothyroid and who are > difinitely healthy for determineing the proper ranges. > > Most of the wiser doctors like to see patients in the upper half of > the range minimum and the upper 1/3 is probably the healthiest spot. > ____________________ > > > Thyroid peroxidase (tpo) >1000 0-34 > ______________________________ > This means that you can forget about using tests to know whether > your are hypothyroid or on enough medication. The presence of > antibodies both mess up tests and make them meaningless, since you > have no idea how much thyroid is being lost to antibody attack. In > these situations doses need to be adjusted to whereever the patient > feels good. This can be a lot of thyroid for some who need much more > to compensate for the thyroid being destroyed before it can get into > tissues. The best tests for those with anitbodies are the basal body > temperature test, reflex test, appearance, and physical symptoms - > the way it was done for 75 years before these tests. > _________________________ > > > > T3 uptake 27 24-39 > ________________ > > Tish Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 17, 2005 Report Share Posted February 17, 2005 , Thank you for all the info. I don't mean to sound so dumb, just when I think I know (about being hypo), something else comes up. I had previously gone to another forum and they never mention half the stuff this one does. I had never heard of the TPO test before nor had it ever been run on me. The Nurse that sent me my results, did not add any notes explaining the results to me, just said that I need to give them to my primary Doctor-- They know I self treat-because I have no Insurance and they no longer treat anything other than Mental illness. Just shows you how little Doctors really care unless it's money in their pocket. Sorry for going on and on. Thanks again, kk > , if you can believe a TSH test you are very HYPO. Your Free T4 should be higher too, and your antibodies are off the scale high! You definitely have Hashi's. What meds have you been on? They are certainly NOT working for you and I bet you will feel lots better with the Thyroid-S. I am willing to bet you will need at least 3 grains and probably more, but work up to it slowly, and expect to feel worse for a short while. It is necessary t go slowly to not shock your system with too much REAL hormones all at once. > *Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WV > Fat cat? Diabetes? Listowner for overweight or hypothyroid cats > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hypokitties/ > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 17, 2005 Report Share Posted February 17, 2005 Believe it or not, studies have found that people need a tiny bit more thyroid at night than during the day. They think the reason is that the body does a lot of repair and mainenance at night and so requires a bit more energy. Typically, people on Armour take equal doses twice a day. But, I have adrenal problems and it is easier on me to take 3 doses, once every 8 hours. I take just a tiny bit more at bedtime than the two doses in the day. The healthy human thyroid makes between 3 a 5 grains a day. You can't really overdose on a dose less than your thyroid makes. However, you can have serious problems on small doses of thyroid if you have low adrenal function and other mineral and nutritional deficiencies. So, it's best to make thyroid dose raises pretty small and gradually work up over time to give your body time to recover from each raise and adapt to a higher metabolic rate. So, most people will make a 1/4 grain to 1/2 grain dose raise every 2 to 4 weeks. If you have any problems with a dose raise, then back down a bit and wait untill you feel ready before attempting another raise. You might then make the next raise smaller. Make small dose raises waiting 2 to 4 weeks between them untill you feel well and have good energy. Keep a record of your temps, symptoms and pulse. (See http://www.drrind.com/tempgraph.asp) Use these to help you determine if another raise may be needed. The object is to find the dose at which you feel the best and have the best health. When you get to your dose up close to 3 grains, then really slow down on raises. Make them small, about 1/4 grain and wait a minimum of 4 weeks before making another. When your dose approaches level of output of a heatlhy thyroid (3-5 grains), it can be very easy to become too hyperthyoid or go too far too fast if you go up too quickly. You don't want this, as it might send you to the hospital for beta blockers. You want to approach your best dose slowly and if you go over it accidentally and become hyperthyroid, you just want it to be very mild hyperthyroidism so you can correct it easily by dropping your dose. Studies have been done that have found that no changes were made in people's thryoid levels and metabolic rates at doses less than 3 to 5 grains. For some reason, the pituitary works against you and zeros out low dose thryoid therapy. So, if you take 1 grain of thyroid, your pituitary drops production of TSH so much that your thyroid makes 1 grain or more less and thus blood levels stay the same. The result is that most people will not get any real affect from thyroid therapy on less than about 3 to 5 grains. Some lucky people can do ok on 2 grains. Before the TSH test, thyroid doses averaged 2 to 5 grains and were 2 to 3 times higher from the late 1800s up untill about 1975. Thyroid patients were quite heatlhy at these higher replacement levels. Doses were adjusted mostly by symptoms for 50 years or more. Most people need to get up to 3 grains minimum before they start to really improve and feel good. http://thyroid.about.com/library/derry/bl11.htm The reason you can't technically overdose on a dose less than your thyroid makes has to do with the pituitary. In theory, if you take 1 grain of Armour, your pituitary is supposed to notice that and adjust TSH production to tell your thryoid to make the rest of the thyroid hormone you need for the day. So, if you take 1 grain, your thyriod is supposed to make another 2 to 4 grains to get the total up to 3 to 5 grains or whatever you need. In reality it does not work this way. Often the pituitary will be overly suppressed by medication and then your thyroid will not get the message, via TSH, to make enough hormone to get you up to the daily total you need to be healthy or 3 to 5 grains. In this case, you will have to raise up your dose high enough to overcome this suppression and to get thyroid levels up where you need them to be for heatlh. Also, many hypothryoid people have developed pituitary dysfunction and their pituitary gland does not make enough TSH. To read a good page on doing it yourself, http://www.fudgedesign.co.uk/tuk/treat/glandulars.htm Anyway, just take your time, make small dose raises, and keep slowly working your way up untill you feel good. Tish Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 17, 2005 Report Share Posted February 17, 2005 Believe it or not, studies have found that people need a tiny bit more thyroid at night than during the day. They think the reason is that the body does a lot of repair and mainenance at night and so requires a bit more energy. Typically, people on Armour take equal doses twice a day. But, I have adrenal problems and it is easier on me to take 3 doses, once every 8 hours. I take just a tiny bit more at bedtime than the two doses in the day. The healthy human thyroid makes between 3 a 5 grains a day. You can't really overdose on a dose less than your thyroid makes. However, you can have serious problems on small doses of thyroid if you have low adrenal function and other mineral and nutritional deficiencies. So, it's best to make thyroid dose raises pretty small and gradually work up over time to give your body time to recover from each raise and adapt to a higher metabolic rate. So, most people will make a 1/4 grain to 1/2 grain dose raise every 2 to 4 weeks. If you have any problems with a dose raise, then back down a bit and wait untill you feel ready before attempting another raise. You might then make the next raise smaller. Make small dose raises waiting 2 to 4 weeks between them untill you feel well and have good energy. Keep a record of your temps, symptoms and pulse. (See http://www.drrind.com/tempgraph.asp) Use these to help you determine if another raise may be needed. The object is to find the dose at which you feel the best and have the best health. When you get to your dose up close to 3 grains, then really slow down on raises. Make them small, about 1/4 grain and wait a minimum of 4 weeks before making another. When your dose approaches level of output of a heatlhy thyroid (3-5 grains), it can be very easy to become too hyperthyoid or go too far too fast if you go up too quickly. You don't want this, as it might send you to the hospital for beta blockers. You want to approach your best dose slowly and if you go over it accidentally and become hyperthyroid, you just want it to be very mild hyperthyroidism so you can correct it easily by dropping your dose. Studies have been done that have found that no changes were made in people's thryoid levels and metabolic rates at doses less than 3 to 5 grains. For some reason, the pituitary works against you and zeros out low dose thryoid therapy. So, if you take 1 grain of thyroid, your pituitary drops production of TSH so much that your thyroid makes 1 grain or more less and thus blood levels stay the same. The result is that most people will not get any real affect from thyroid therapy on less than about 3 to 5 grains. Some lucky people can do ok on 2 grains. Before the TSH test, thyroid doses averaged 2 to 5 grains and were 2 to 3 times higher from the late 1800s up untill about 1975. Thyroid patients were quite heatlhy at these higher replacement levels. Doses were adjusted mostly by symptoms for 50 years or more. Most people need to get up to 3 grains minimum before they start to really improve and feel good. http://thyroid.about.com/library/derry/bl11.htm The reason you can't technically overdose on a dose less than your thyroid makes has to do with the pituitary. In theory, if you take 1 grain of Armour, your pituitary is supposed to notice that and adjust TSH production to tell your thryoid to make the rest of the thyroid hormone you need for the day. So, if you take 1 grain, your thyriod is supposed to make another 2 to 4 grains to get the total up to 3 to 5 grains or whatever you need. In reality it does not work this way. Often the pituitary will be overly suppressed by medication and then your thyroid will not get the message, via TSH, to make enough hormone to get you up to the daily total you need to be healthy or 3 to 5 grains. In this case, you will have to raise up your dose high enough to overcome this suppression and to get thyroid levels up where you need them to be for heatlh. Also, many hypothryoid people have developed pituitary dysfunction and their pituitary gland does not make enough TSH. To read a good page on doing it yourself, http://www.fudgedesign.co.uk/tuk/treat/glandulars.htm Anyway, just take your time, make small dose raises, and keep slowly working your way up untill you feel good. Tish Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 17, 2005 Report Share Posted February 17, 2005 Thanks for the great post and links, Tish. I was taking my extra T4 at night for a while and it makes so much sense why it worked so well. Nat > > Believe it or not, studies have found that people need a tiny bit > more thyroid at night than during the day. They think the reason is > that the body does a lot of repair and mainenance at night and so > requires a bit more energy. > > Typically, people on Armour take equal doses twice a day. But, I > have adrenal problems and it is easier on me to take 3 doses, once > every 8 hours. I take just a tiny bit more at bedtime than the two > doses in the day. > > The healthy human thyroid makes between 3 a 5 grains a day. You > can't really overdose on a dose less than your thyroid makes. > However, you can have serious problems on small doses of thyroid if > you have low adrenal function and other mineral and nutritional > deficiencies. So, it's best to make thyroid dose raises pretty small > and gradually work up over time to give your body time to recover > from each raise and adapt to a higher metabolic rate. So, most > people will make a 1/4 grain to 1/2 grain dose raise every 2 to 4 > weeks. If you have any problems with a dose raise, then back down a > bit and wait untill you feel ready before attempting another raise. > You might then make the next raise smaller. > > Make small dose raises waiting 2 to 4 weeks between them untill you > feel well and have good energy. Keep a record of your temps, > symptoms and pulse. (See http://www.drrind.com/tempgraph.asp) Use > these to help you determine if another raise may be needed. The > object is to find the dose at which you feel the best and have the > best health. When you get to your dose up close to 3 grains, then > really slow down on raises. Make them small, about 1/4 grain and > wait a minimum of 4 weeks before making another. When your dose > approaches level of output of a heatlhy thyroid (3-5 grains), it can > be very easy to become too hyperthyoid or go too far too fast if you > go up too quickly. You don't want this, as it might send you to the > hospital for beta blockers. You want to approach your best dose > slowly and if you go over it accidentally and become hyperthyroid, > you just want it to be very mild hyperthyroidism so you can correct > it easily by dropping your dose. > > Studies have been done that have found that no changes were made in > people's thryoid levels and metabolic rates at doses less than 3 to > 5 grains. For some reason, the pituitary works against you and zeros > out low dose thryoid therapy. So, if you take 1 grain of thyroid, > your pituitary drops production of TSH so much that your thyroid > makes 1 grain or more less and thus blood levels stay the same. The > result is that most people will not get any real affect from thyroid > therapy on less than about 3 to 5 grains. Some lucky people can do > ok on 2 grains. Before the TSH test, thyroid doses averaged 2 to 5 > grains and were 2 to 3 times higher from the late 1800s up untill > about 1975. Thyroid patients were quite heatlhy at these higher > replacement levels. Doses were adjusted mostly by symptoms for 50 > years or more. Most people need to get up to 3 grains minimum before > they start to really improve and feel good. > http://thyroid.about.com/library/derry/bl11.htm > > The reason you can't technically overdose on a dose less than your > thyroid makes has to do with the pituitary. In theory, if you take 1 > grain of Armour, your pituitary is supposed to notice that and > adjust TSH production to tell your thryoid to make the rest of the > thyroid hormone you need for the day. So, if you take 1 grain, your > thyriod is supposed to make another 2 to 4 grains to get the total > up to 3 to 5 grains or whatever you need. In reality it does not > work this way. Often the pituitary will be overly suppressed by > medication and then your thyroid will not get the message, via TSH, > to make enough hormone to get you up to the daily total you need to > be healthy or 3 to 5 grains. In this case, you will have to raise up > your dose high enough to overcome this suppression and to get > thyroid levels up where you need them to be for heatlh. Also, many > hypothryoid people have developed pituitary dysfunction and their > pituitary gland does not make enough TSH. > > To read a good page on doing it yourself, > http://www.fudgedesign.co.uk/tuk/treat/glandulars.htm > > Anyway, just take your time, make small dose raises, and keep slowly > working your way up untill you feel good. > > Tish Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 17, 2005 Report Share Posted February 17, 2005 Thanks for the great post and links, Tish. I was taking my extra T4 at night for a while and it makes so much sense why it worked so well. Nat > > Believe it or not, studies have found that people need a tiny bit > more thyroid at night than during the day. They think the reason is > that the body does a lot of repair and mainenance at night and so > requires a bit more energy. > > Typically, people on Armour take equal doses twice a day. But, I > have adrenal problems and it is easier on me to take 3 doses, once > every 8 hours. I take just a tiny bit more at bedtime than the two > doses in the day. > > The healthy human thyroid makes between 3 a 5 grains a day. You > can't really overdose on a dose less than your thyroid makes. > However, you can have serious problems on small doses of thyroid if > you have low adrenal function and other mineral and nutritional > deficiencies. So, it's best to make thyroid dose raises pretty small > and gradually work up over time to give your body time to recover > from each raise and adapt to a higher metabolic rate. So, most > people will make a 1/4 grain to 1/2 grain dose raise every 2 to 4 > weeks. If you have any problems with a dose raise, then back down a > bit and wait untill you feel ready before attempting another raise. > You might then make the next raise smaller. > > Make small dose raises waiting 2 to 4 weeks between them untill you > feel well and have good energy. Keep a record of your temps, > symptoms and pulse. (See http://www.drrind.com/tempgraph.asp) Use > these to help you determine if another raise may be needed. The > object is to find the dose at which you feel the best and have the > best health. When you get to your dose up close to 3 grains, then > really slow down on raises. Make them small, about 1/4 grain and > wait a minimum of 4 weeks before making another. When your dose > approaches level of output of a heatlhy thyroid (3-5 grains), it can > be very easy to become too hyperthyoid or go too far too fast if you > go up too quickly. You don't want this, as it might send you to the > hospital for beta blockers. You want to approach your best dose > slowly and if you go over it accidentally and become hyperthyroid, > you just want it to be very mild hyperthyroidism so you can correct > it easily by dropping your dose. > > Studies have been done that have found that no changes were made in > people's thryoid levels and metabolic rates at doses less than 3 to > 5 grains. For some reason, the pituitary works against you and zeros > out low dose thryoid therapy. So, if you take 1 grain of thyroid, > your pituitary drops production of TSH so much that your thyroid > makes 1 grain or more less and thus blood levels stay the same. The > result is that most people will not get any real affect from thyroid > therapy on less than about 3 to 5 grains. Some lucky people can do > ok on 2 grains. Before the TSH test, thyroid doses averaged 2 to 5 > grains and were 2 to 3 times higher from the late 1800s up untill > about 1975. Thyroid patients were quite heatlhy at these higher > replacement levels. Doses were adjusted mostly by symptoms for 50 > years or more. Most people need to get up to 3 grains minimum before > they start to really improve and feel good. > http://thyroid.about.com/library/derry/bl11.htm > > The reason you can't technically overdose on a dose less than your > thyroid makes has to do with the pituitary. In theory, if you take 1 > grain of Armour, your pituitary is supposed to notice that and > adjust TSH production to tell your thryoid to make the rest of the > thyroid hormone you need for the day. So, if you take 1 grain, your > thyriod is supposed to make another 2 to 4 grains to get the total > up to 3 to 5 grains or whatever you need. In reality it does not > work this way. Often the pituitary will be overly suppressed by > medication and then your thyroid will not get the message, via TSH, > to make enough hormone to get you up to the daily total you need to > be healthy or 3 to 5 grains. In this case, you will have to raise up > your dose high enough to overcome this suppression and to get > thyroid levels up where you need them to be for heatlh. Also, many > hypothryoid people have developed pituitary dysfunction and their > pituitary gland does not make enough TSH. > > To read a good page on doing it yourself, > http://www.fudgedesign.co.uk/tuk/treat/glandulars.htm > > Anyway, just take your time, make small dose raises, and keep slowly > working your way up untill you feel good. > > Tish Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 18, 2005 Report Share Posted February 18, 2005 , Can Hash's come on that quick? My tsh was low in july. I feel like a pumpkin-- large and round. My face and hands are so swollen and my belly gets bigger every day. What dose should I start with on the thyroid -s ? I so hope I get it in the mail today. Thank you for all your help! kk > , if you can believe a TSH test you are very HYPO. Your Free T4 should be higher too, and your antibodies are off the scale high! You definitely have Hashi's. What meds have you been on? They are certainly NOT working for you and I bet you will feel lots better with the Thyroid-S. I am willing to bet you will need at least 3 grains and probably more, but work up to it slowly, and expect to feel worse for a short while. It is necessary t go slowly to not shock your system with too much REAL hormones all at once. > *Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WV > Fat cat? Diabetes? Listowner for overweight or hypothyroid cats > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hypokitties/ > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 18, 2005 Report Share Posted February 18, 2005 , Can Hash's come on that quick? My tsh was low in july. I feel like a pumpkin-- large and round. My face and hands are so swollen and my belly gets bigger every day. What dose should I start with on the thyroid -s ? I so hope I get it in the mail today. Thank you for all your help! kk > , if you can believe a TSH test you are very HYPO. Your Free T4 should be higher too, and your antibodies are off the scale high! You definitely have Hashi's. What meds have you been on? They are certainly NOT working for you and I bet you will feel lots better with the Thyroid-S. I am willing to bet you will need at least 3 grains and probably more, but work up to it slowly, and expect to feel worse for a short while. It is necessary t go slowly to not shock your system with too much REAL hormones all at once. > *Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WV > Fat cat? Diabetes? Listowner for overweight or hypothyroid cats > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hypokitties/ > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 18, 2005 Report Share Posted February 18, 2005 , Can Hash's come on that quick? My tsh was low in july. I feel like a pumpkin-- large and round. My face and hands are so swollen and my belly gets bigger every day. What dose should I start with on the thyroid -s ? I so hope I get it in the mail today. Thank you for all your help! kk > , if you can believe a TSH test you are very HYPO. Your Free T4 should be higher too, and your antibodies are off the scale high! You definitely have Hashi's. What meds have you been on? They are certainly NOT working for you and I bet you will feel lots better with the Thyroid-S. I am willing to bet you will need at least 3 grains and probably more, but work up to it slowly, and expect to feel worse for a short while. It is necessary t go slowly to not shock your system with too much REAL hormones all at once. > *Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WV > Fat cat? Diabetes? Listowner for overweight or hypothyroid cats > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hypokitties/ > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 18, 2005 Report Share Posted February 18, 2005 >>Can Hash's come on that quick?<< Hashi's can lie fairly dormant with little or no symptoms for many years then something triggers it. You can have flare ups then go back to normal or you can go hyper. Hashi's causes some really strange symptoms! *Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WV Fat cat? Diabetes? Listowner for overweight or hypothyroid cats http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hypokitties/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 18, 2005 Report Share Posted February 18, 2005 >>Can Hash's come on that quick?<< Hashi's can lie fairly dormant with little or no symptoms for many years then something triggers it. You can have flare ups then go back to normal or you can go hyper. Hashi's causes some really strange symptoms! *Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WV Fat cat? Diabetes? Listowner for overweight or hypothyroid cats http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hypokitties/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 18, 2005 Report Share Posted February 18, 2005 , Can you give me a suggestion on what dose to start at. kk > >>Can Hash's come on that quick?<< > Hashi's can lie fairly dormant with little or no symptoms for many years then something triggers it. You can have flare ups then go back to normal or you can go hyper. Hashi's causes some really strange symptoms! > *Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WV > Fat cat? Diabetes? Listowner for overweight or hypothyroid cats > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hypokitties/ > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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