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Re: Lipase and cea

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I am assuming that the lipase levels you are referring to were

measured in blood. Marjorie is more qualified than me to comment on

the significance of reduced blood lipase levels in humans (if any).

I will tell you that the pancreas is both an endocrine and exocrine

organ, that is it secretes both enzymes for digestion and hormones.

A reduction in the production of digestive enzymes in dogs is called

Exocrine Pancreatic Insufficiency and results in an emaciated

appearance and chronic severe diarrhoea (due to undigested food making

it to the colon which, as you can imagine, makes the colonic flora

stand up and salute).

In any case, I don't see why a reduced production of lipase would

result in an increase in postprandial lipaemia.........the opposite

would be true.

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Guest guest

I am assuming that the lipase levels you are referring to were

measured in blood. Marjorie is more qualified than me to comment on

the significance of reduced blood lipase levels in humans (if any).

I will tell you that the pancreas is both an endocrine and exocrine

organ, that is it secretes both enzymes for digestion and hormones.

A reduction in the production of digestive enzymes in dogs is called

Exocrine Pancreatic Insufficiency and results in an emaciated

appearance and chronic severe diarrhoea (due to undigested food making

it to the colon which, as you can imagine, makes the colonic flora

stand up and salute).

In any case, I don't see why a reduced production of lipase would

result in an increase in postprandial lipaemia.........the opposite

would be true.

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Guest guest

I am assuming that the lipase levels you are referring to were

measured in blood. Marjorie is more qualified than me to comment on

the significance of reduced blood lipase levels in humans (if any).

I will tell you that the pancreas is both an endocrine and exocrine

organ, that is it secretes both enzymes for digestion and hormones.

A reduction in the production of digestive enzymes in dogs is called

Exocrine Pancreatic Insufficiency and results in an emaciated

appearance and chronic severe diarrhoea (due to undigested food making

it to the colon which, as you can imagine, makes the colonic flora

stand up and salute).

In any case, I don't see why a reduced production of lipase would

result in an increase in postprandial lipaemia.........the opposite

would be true.

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Englishtexvet, from what Adam has told us about the study, I'm far

from convinced it identified an association between low lipase levels

and rosacea. The percentage spread sounds unreliable, and we are not

told whether the results are statistically significant (which makes

me suspect they aren't). Finally, a low lipase in humans is

associated with longstanding diseases and conditions that should not

otherwise escape detection in any reasonably-designed study.

Adam, I think it's a waste of all of our time to speculate about a

study's results that has not been fully communicated -- at least

provide an abstract for us, or the Web site -- or your subsequent

thoughts which, as englishvet kindly pointed out, are not based in

fact.

I already told you my opinion concerning the flurry of initial

research that aren't followed up by subsequent studies -- you just

see it in rosacea but it's actually common in science, and usually

indicates that subsequent work didn't pan out (unfortunately, few

negative studies are published, so the absense of studies is often

our only hint.)

Marjorie

Marjorie Lazoff, MD

> I am assuming that the lipase levels you are referring to were

> measured in blood. Marjorie is more qualified than me to comment on

> the significance of reduced blood lipase levels in humans (if any).

>

> I will tell you that the pancreas is both an endocrine and exocrine

> organ, that is it secretes both enzymes for digestion and hormones.

>

> A reduction in the production of digestive enzymes in dogs is called

> Exocrine Pancreatic Insufficiency and results in an emaciated

> appearance and chronic severe diarrhoea (due to undigested food

making

> it to the colon which, as you can imagine, makes the colonic flora

> stand up and salute).

>

> In any case, I don't see why a reduced production of lipase would

> result in an increase in postprandial lipaemia.........the opposite

> would be true.

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I aplogise.. and you're right, I should've supplied an abstract with my

Email. The last thing I wanna do here is waste everyone's time. My thought

process as I wrote the Email was basically " this seems interesting, I wonder

if anyone else has ever heard of this " Again I'm no doctor, so, maybe the

percentage spread is unreliable, but the way it was written, I believe it

means that some people had as little as 18% lipase reduction while others

had as much as 66% lipase reduction.. It wasnt that somewhere between 18-66%

of ceans suffered from this problem... When looking at it in this

context (Sorry I wasn't more clear) it doesn't seem unreliable to me,

because it could simply correlate to the severity of each patient's cea.

Anyway, below is the name of the article and the abstract:

Unfortunately with cea, I sometimes am concerned when I read these old

articles that perhaps the lack of further research has nothing to do with an

experiment not panning out, but simply a lack of funding. For instance,

there was another article that was written in 1982 that discusses a

misfunctioning hypothalimus in cea that causes the skin to overheat by

trying too hard to cool down the brain.. (Or something along these lines, I

dont really understand the human body, so I didn't understand the article

completely) This has been mentioned many times since then, in Dr. Nase's

book, a few times in this forum, and in a bunch of other articles and

websites. However, as near as I can tell, no further studies have ever been

undertaken that have attempted to prove or disprove this theory.. (But when

half of the six yearly research studies taking place on cea are testing

different formulations of Metronidazole... Its no surprise that there

haven't been any major advances in a while..)

Dermatologica 1982;165(6):601-6 Related Articles, Books, LinkOut

Pancreatic exocrine function in rosacea.

Barba A, B, Angelini G, Sapuppo A, Brocco G, Scuro LA, Cavallini G.

As some rosacea patients complain of gastrointestinal troubles and the

administration of pancreatic extracts ameliorates both dyspepsia and skin

lesions, the pancreatic exocrine function in 21 subjects affected with

rosacea has been investigated by means of the secretin-cerulein infusion

test. 21 healthy controls have been studied for comparison. No difference

was found between rosacea and control subjects for flow rate, bicarbonate

and chymotrypsin concentration and output, while lipase concentration and

output was significantly lower in rosacea patients, with a decrease ranging

from 18.5 to 66% of normal values. Therefore, a deficient lipase secretion

could be responsible, at least partly, for the clinical manifestations of

rosacea.

PMID: 6220929 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

Re: Lipase and cea

>

> Englishtexvet, from what Adam has told us about the study, I'm far

> from convinced it identified an association between low lipase levels

> and rosacea. The percentage spread sounds unreliable, and we are not

> told whether the results are statistically significant (which makes

> me suspect they aren't). Finally, a low lipase in humans is

> associated with longstanding diseases and conditions that should not

> otherwise escape detection in any reasonably-designed study.

>

> Adam, I think it's a waste of all of our time to speculate about a

> study's results that has not been fully communicated -- at least

> provide an abstract for us, or the Web site -- or your subsequent

> thoughts which, as englishvet kindly pointed out, are not based in

> fact.

>

> I already told you my opinion concerning the flurry of initial

> research that aren't followed up by subsequent studies -- you just

> see it in rosacea but it's actually common in science, and usually

> indicates that subsequent work didn't pan out (unfortunately, few

> negative studies are published, so the absense of studies is often

> our only hint.)

>

> Marjorie

>

> Marjorie Lazoff, MD

>

>

>

>

> > I am assuming that the lipase levels you are referring to were

> > measured in blood. Marjorie is more qualified than me to comment on

> > the significance of reduced blood lipase levels in humans (if any).

> >

> > I will tell you that the pancreas is both an endocrine and exocrine

> > organ, that is it secretes both enzymes for digestion and hormones.

> >

> > A reduction in the production of digestive enzymes in dogs is called

> > Exocrine Pancreatic Insufficiency and results in an emaciated

> > appearance and chronic severe diarrhoea (due to undigested food

> making

> > it to the colon which, as you can imagine, makes the colonic flora

> > stand up and salute).

> >

> > In any case, I don't see why a reduced production of lipase would

> > result in an increase in postprandial lipaemia.........the opposite

> > would be true.

>

>

>

> --

> Please read the list highlights before posting to the whole group

(http://rosacea.ii.net/toc.html). Your post will be delayed if you don't

give a meaningful subject or trim your reply text. You must change the

subject when replying to a digest !

>

> See http://www.drnase.com for info on his recently published book.

>

> To leave the list send an email to

rosacea-support-unsubscribe

>

>

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Guest guest

I aplogise.. and you're right, I should've supplied an abstract with my

Email. The last thing I wanna do here is waste everyone's time. My thought

process as I wrote the Email was basically " this seems interesting, I wonder

if anyone else has ever heard of this " Again I'm no doctor, so, maybe the

percentage spread is unreliable, but the way it was written, I believe it

means that some people had as little as 18% lipase reduction while others

had as much as 66% lipase reduction.. It wasnt that somewhere between 18-66%

of ceans suffered from this problem... When looking at it in this

context (Sorry I wasn't more clear) it doesn't seem unreliable to me,

because it could simply correlate to the severity of each patient's cea.

Anyway, below is the name of the article and the abstract:

Unfortunately with cea, I sometimes am concerned when I read these old

articles that perhaps the lack of further research has nothing to do with an

experiment not panning out, but simply a lack of funding. For instance,

there was another article that was written in 1982 that discusses a

misfunctioning hypothalimus in cea that causes the skin to overheat by

trying too hard to cool down the brain.. (Or something along these lines, I

dont really understand the human body, so I didn't understand the article

completely) This has been mentioned many times since then, in Dr. Nase's

book, a few times in this forum, and in a bunch of other articles and

websites. However, as near as I can tell, no further studies have ever been

undertaken that have attempted to prove or disprove this theory.. (But when

half of the six yearly research studies taking place on cea are testing

different formulations of Metronidazole... Its no surprise that there

haven't been any major advances in a while..)

Dermatologica 1982;165(6):601-6 Related Articles, Books, LinkOut

Pancreatic exocrine function in rosacea.

Barba A, B, Angelini G, Sapuppo A, Brocco G, Scuro LA, Cavallini G.

As some rosacea patients complain of gastrointestinal troubles and the

administration of pancreatic extracts ameliorates both dyspepsia and skin

lesions, the pancreatic exocrine function in 21 subjects affected with

rosacea has been investigated by means of the secretin-cerulein infusion

test. 21 healthy controls have been studied for comparison. No difference

was found between rosacea and control subjects for flow rate, bicarbonate

and chymotrypsin concentration and output, while lipase concentration and

output was significantly lower in rosacea patients, with a decrease ranging

from 18.5 to 66% of normal values. Therefore, a deficient lipase secretion

could be responsible, at least partly, for the clinical manifestations of

rosacea.

PMID: 6220929 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

Re: Lipase and cea

>

> Englishtexvet, from what Adam has told us about the study, I'm far

> from convinced it identified an association between low lipase levels

> and rosacea. The percentage spread sounds unreliable, and we are not

> told whether the results are statistically significant (which makes

> me suspect they aren't). Finally, a low lipase in humans is

> associated with longstanding diseases and conditions that should not

> otherwise escape detection in any reasonably-designed study.

>

> Adam, I think it's a waste of all of our time to speculate about a

> study's results that has not been fully communicated -- at least

> provide an abstract for us, or the Web site -- or your subsequent

> thoughts which, as englishvet kindly pointed out, are not based in

> fact.

>

> I already told you my opinion concerning the flurry of initial

> research that aren't followed up by subsequent studies -- you just

> see it in rosacea but it's actually common in science, and usually

> indicates that subsequent work didn't pan out (unfortunately, few

> negative studies are published, so the absense of studies is often

> our only hint.)

>

> Marjorie

>

> Marjorie Lazoff, MD

>

>

>

>

> > I am assuming that the lipase levels you are referring to were

> > measured in blood. Marjorie is more qualified than me to comment on

> > the significance of reduced blood lipase levels in humans (if any).

> >

> > I will tell you that the pancreas is both an endocrine and exocrine

> > organ, that is it secretes both enzymes for digestion and hormones.

> >

> > A reduction in the production of digestive enzymes in dogs is called

> > Exocrine Pancreatic Insufficiency and results in an emaciated

> > appearance and chronic severe diarrhoea (due to undigested food

> making

> > it to the colon which, as you can imagine, makes the colonic flora

> > stand up and salute).

> >

> > In any case, I don't see why a reduced production of lipase would

> > result in an increase in postprandial lipaemia.........the opposite

> > would be true.

>

>

>

> --

> Please read the list highlights before posting to the whole group

(http://rosacea.ii.net/toc.html). Your post will be delayed if you don't

give a meaningful subject or trim your reply text. You must change the

subject when replying to a digest !

>

> See http://www.drnase.com for info on his recently published book.

>

> To leave the list send an email to

rosacea-support-unsubscribe

>

>

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Share on other sites

Guest guest

> > > I am assuming that the lipase levels you are referring to were

> > > measured in blood. Marjorie is more qualified than me to

comment on

> > > the significance of reduced blood lipase levels in humans (if

any).

> > >

> > > I will tell you that the pancreas is both an endocrine and

exocrine

> > > organ, that is it secretes both enzymes for digestion and

hormones.

> > >

> > > A reduction in the production of digestive enzymes in dogs is

called

> > > Exocrine Pancreatic Insufficiency and results in an emaciated

> > > appearance and chronic severe diarrhoea (due to undigested food

> > making

> > > it to the colon which, as you can imagine, makes the colonic

flora

> > > stand up and salute).

> > >

> > > In any case, I don't see why a reduced production of lipase

would

> > > result in an increase in postprandial lipaemia.........the

opposite

> > > would be true.

> >

> >

> >

> > --

> > Please read the list highlights before posting to the whole group

> (http://rosacea.ii.net/toc.html). Your post will be delayed if you

don't

> give a meaningful subject or trim your reply text. You must change

the

> subject when replying to a digest !

> >

> > See http://www.drnase.com for info on his recently published book.

> >

> > To leave the list send an email to

> rosacea-support-unsubscribe@y...

> >

> >

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Share on other sites

Guest guest

> > > I am assuming that the lipase levels you are referring to were

> > > measured in blood. Marjorie is more qualified than me to

comment on

> > > the significance of reduced blood lipase levels in humans (if

any).

> > >

> > > I will tell you that the pancreas is both an endocrine and

exocrine

> > > organ, that is it secretes both enzymes for digestion and

hormones.

> > >

> > > A reduction in the production of digestive enzymes in dogs is

called

> > > Exocrine Pancreatic Insufficiency and results in an emaciated

> > > appearance and chronic severe diarrhoea (due to undigested food

> > making

> > > it to the colon which, as you can imagine, makes the colonic

flora

> > > stand up and salute).

> > >

> > > In any case, I don't see why a reduced production of lipase

would

> > > result in an increase in postprandial lipaemia.........the

opposite

> > > would be true.

> >

> >

> >

> > --

> > Please read the list highlights before posting to the whole group

> (http://rosacea.ii.net/toc.html). Your post will be delayed if you

don't

> give a meaningful subject or trim your reply text. You must change

the

> subject when replying to a digest !

> >

> > See http://www.drnase.com for info on his recently published book.

> >

> > To leave the list send an email to

> rosacea-support-unsubscribe@y...

> >

> >

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