Re: Basic questions about nutritional supplements

[Guest guest]

Is anyone out there as put off as I am by Dr.Lazoff's

rather know-it-all tone? For weeks I've bit my tongue

and just deleted her numerous condescending messages.

But it's getting to me. I have found great success

with

non-traditional medicine, much more success than with

the chemical crap doctors have thrown at me. I

understand that people may have doubts, however,

everyone experiences this disease differently and must

follow their own instincts. I find negative comments

from a doctor particularly inappropriate, as

unfortunately, people may put more stock in what

doctors have to say.

I realize Dr. Lazoff, that you are trying to help, but

I suspect you are unaware of your dogmatic tone.

Doctors do not have all the answers and certainly they

have very few answers when it comes to cea.

Enough said.

Moya Stone

--- emarjency emarjency@...> wrote:

>

> Kate23451 -- and other numbers as well :

>

> (1) I understand that borage oil has a higher

> concentration of GLA

> than does evening primrose oil, but are there other

> differences

> between the two? What's the best supplemental form

> of GLA to take,

> from the perspective of safety and convenience?

>

> (2) Like GLA, I know there's much hype about

> alpha-lipoic acid, but

> I'm not reading much hard data, or much about side

> effects. Anything

> to be concerned about from a health/safety

> standpoint, and what's the

> best supplemental/most convenient form to take?

>

> (3) Can you introduce me to resources (preferably

> online) with the

> most accurate content, and recommend companies that

> sell the best

> quality products?

>

> My major concerns with all these potentially useful

> nutritional

> supplements -- niacinamide, EFAs, ALA -- is knowing

> what I'm buying,

> and knowing what I'm doing to my body. I don't see

> the concern for

> quality information, I don't see production

> controls, and so much of

> the health food/supplement industry is not

> well-informed, biased, or

> just plain dishonest, much more so than when I deal

> with (imperfect,

> but not close to the same extent) medical companies

> and resources. I

> struggle to be openminded and thoughtful about

> non-traditional

> medicine when there's so much garbage information

> that the more

> legitimate aspects of the industry doesn't

> challenge, and when so

> many of its followers accept it, seemingly gullible

> and easily

> manipulated.

>

> I've expressed this thought before: in theory I

> don't see a

> distinction between traditional and non-traditional

> health care. I

> see one world -- one in which treatments with

> well-documentated

> safety and efficacy are dispensed in a competent,

> humane manner by

> knowledgable, well-trained practitioners without

> secondary agendas.

> I see how easy it is to get seduced by nutritional

> supplements and

> diets -- so hopeful, so comforting to believe in,

> how can something

> so " natural " be anything but healthy.

>

> But that also doesn't mean there isn't truth nestled

> here within the

> hype, and that's what I'm interested in.

>

> Marjorie

>

> Marjorie Lazoff, MD

>

>

>

>

> > Hi Jan, I need to find my book on oils, to see if

> flax and

> safflower can be

> > interchanged, but I will go ahead and answer your

> other questions.

> EFA stands

> > for essential fatty acids. Borage oil comes from

> a plant, black

> current seed

> > oil from black currents, and flax from flax seeds,

> all natural

> plants. Some

> > products are organic and some are not. There is

> also a difference

> in how the

> > oil is pressed out and processed. The Vitamin

> Shoppe products

> which I use

> > contain, borage 15 calories, and flax 10 calories.

> I have a very

> healthy diet

> > which include tuna, salmon and other fish up to

> 3-4 times per week.

> I rarely

> > eat beef, pork or deep fried foods, maybe several

> times per month,

> so the

> > calories in the oils dont worry me. To the best

> of my knowledge

> while fish

> > oils have been shown to help with inflammation in

> the body, they

> dont have an

> > impact on the eyes, in the same way as borage. In

> general, the low

> fat craze

> > of recent years has had a down side for many

> people. Good fats are

> necessary

> > for the skin and the production of hormones. A few

> women on the

> list have

> > reported changes in their cycle when they take the

> oils.

> >

> > Taking borage oil did more for my ocular rosacea

> than any thing

> else. I took

> > it for 5 years, was having no problems with my

> eyes and decided I

> didn't need

> > it anymore. After 5 months of being off the Borage

> I had major

> problems with

> > my eyes again. That proved it for me!

> >

> > I have taken 400 mg of Vitamin E for 15 years,

> but that does not

> do the work

> > of borage. It is important to include it in your

> supplements, and

> has many

> > other protective aspects for the skin. I also find

> that Selenium

> 200mcg is

> > important for the eyes and should be taken along

> with the E.

> >

> > A woman chiropractor told me about borage about

> ten years ago. It

> seems to

> > liquify the oil in the glands in the eyes,

> allowing the eyes to

> again produce

> > the natural lubrication. That is how the hot soaks

> work too,

> liquifying the

> > secretions that get " stopped up " . An

> opthalmologist told me to

> gently

> > massage around the eye, using little circles,

> before I get out of

> bed every

> > morning for the same reason. Get a book on

> acupressure and also

> hold the

> > acupressure points around the eyes. This

> stimulates the eye oil

> glands.

> >

> > One other thing which I forgot in my earlier post

> is watch out for

> eye makeup.

> > When your eyes are flaring don't use any. Also

> throw out mascara

> every 3-4

> > months. I recently used some old mascara for a

> special event and

> was I sorry!

> > Had to go back to the antibiotic ointment for

> several days. I use

> Almay

> > products when I use mascara but am on the lookout

> for other good

> eye makeup.

> >

> > I am convinced that skin care is an inside job.

> Yesterday the girl

> at the

> > local health food store was reluctant to give me

> the senior

> discount, which

> > is very gratifiying! Regards, Kate

> >

> >

> >

> > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> removed]

>

>

>

> --

> Please read the list highlights before posting to

> the whole group (http://rosacea.ii.net/toc.html).

> Your post will be delayed if you don't give a

> meaningful

=== message truncated ===

=====

The greatness of a nation & its moral progress can be judged

by the way its animals are treated. - Gandhi

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Not in the least I throughly enjoy her educated insights and

opinions. I think she shows sensitivity and humor. I don't reagard

her as having a know-it-all tone at all. I do think there are many

other posters that exhibit that trait though. Just because you don't

agree with someone doesn't mean you have to start this type of

thread. If you don't agree with what she says don't read her posts!

Easy as that! I try to be open-minded and I appreciate everyones

insight and experience. I suggest we all do the same.

Sue

> > > Hi Jan, I need to find my book on oils, to see if

> > flax and

> > safflower can be

> > > interchanged, but I will go ahead and answer your

> > other questions.

> > EFA stands

> > > for essential fatty acids. Borage oil comes from

> > a plant, black

> > current seed

> > > oil from black currents, and flax from flax seeds,

> > all natural

> > plants. Some

> > > products are organic and some are not. There is

> > also a difference

> > in how the

> > > oil is pressed out and processed. The Vitamin

> > Shoppe products

> > which I use

> > > contain, borage 15 calories, and flax 10 calories.

> > I have a very

> > healthy diet

> > > which include tuna, salmon and other fish up to

> > 3-4 times per week.

> > I rarely

> > > eat beef, pork or deep fried foods, maybe several

> > times per month,

> > so the

> > > calories in the oils dont worry me. To the best

> > of my knowledge

> > while fish

> > > oils have been shown to help with inflammation in

> > the body, they

> > dont have an

> > > impact on the eyes, in the same way as borage. In

> > general, the low

> > fat craze

> > > of recent years has had a down side for many

> > people. Good fats are

> > necessary

> > > for the skin and the production of hormones. A few

> > women on the

> > list have

> > > reported changes in their cycle when they take the

> > oils.

> > >

> > > Taking borage oil did more for my ocular rosacea

> > than any thing

> > else. I took

> > > it for 5 years, was having no problems with my

> > eyes and decided I

> > didn't need

> > > it anymore. After 5 months of being off the Borage

> > I had major

> > problems with

> > > my eyes again. That proved it for me!

> > >

> > > I have taken 400 mg of Vitamin E for 15 years,

> > but that does not

> > do the work

> > > of borage. It is important to include it in your

> > supplements, and

> > has many

> > > other protective aspects for the skin. I also find

> > that Selenium

> > 200mcg is

> > > important for the eyes and should be taken along

> > with the E.

> > >

> > > A woman chiropractor told me about borage about

> > ten years ago. It

> > seems to

> > > liquify the oil in the glands in the eyes,

> > allowing the eyes to

> > again produce

> > > the natural lubrication. That is how the hot soaks

> > work too,

> > liquifying the

> > > secretions that get " stopped up " . An

> > opthalmologist told me to

> > gently

> > > massage around the eye, using little circles,

> > before I get out of

> > bed every

> > > morning for the same reason. Get a book on

> > acupressure and also

> > hold the

> > > acupressure points around the eyes. This

> > stimulates the eye oil

> > glands.

> > >

> > > One other thing which I forgot in my earlier post

> > is watch out for

> > eye makeup.

> > > When your eyes are flaring don't use any. Also

> > throw out mascara

> > every 3-4

> > > months. I recently used some old mascara for a

> > special event and

> > was I sorry!

> > > Had to go back to the antibiotic ointment for

> > several days. I use

> > Almay

> > > products when I use mascara but am on the lookout

> > for other good

> > eye makeup.

> > >

> > > I am convinced that skin care is an inside job.

> > Yesterday the girl

> > at the

> > > local health food store was reluctant to give me

> > the senior

> > discount, which

> > > is very gratifiying! Regards, Kate

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > removed]

> >

> >

> >

> > --

> > Please read the list highlights before posting to

> > the whole group (http://rosacea.ii.net/toc.html).

> > Your post will be delayed if you don't give a

> > meaningful

> === message truncated ===

>

>

> =====

> The greatness of a nation & its moral progress can be judged

> by the way its animals are treated. - Gandhi

>

> __________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

Not in the least I throughly enjoy her educated insights and

opinions. I think she shows sensitivity and humor. I don't reagard

her as having a know-it-all tone at all. I do think there are many

other posters that exhibit that trait though. Just because you don't

agree with someone doesn't mean you have to start this type of

thread. If you don't agree with what she says don't read her posts!

Easy as that! I try to be open-minded and I appreciate everyones

insight and experience. I suggest we all do the same.

Sue

> > > Hi Jan, I need to find my book on oils, to see if

> > flax and

> > safflower can be

> > > interchanged, but I will go ahead and answer your

> > other questions.

> > EFA stands

> > > for essential fatty acids. Borage oil comes from

> > a plant, black

> > current seed

> > > oil from black currents, and flax from flax seeds,

> > all natural

> > plants. Some

> > > products are organic and some are not. There is

> > also a difference

> > in how the

> > > oil is pressed out and processed. The Vitamin

> > Shoppe products

> > which I use

> > > contain, borage 15 calories, and flax 10 calories.

> > I have a very

> > healthy diet

> > > which include tuna, salmon and other fish up to

> > 3-4 times per week.

> > I rarely

> > > eat beef, pork or deep fried foods, maybe several

> > times per month,

> > so the

> > > calories in the oils dont worry me. To the best

> > of my knowledge

> > while fish

> > > oils have been shown to help with inflammation in

> > the body, they

> > dont have an

> > > impact on the eyes, in the same way as borage. In

> > general, the low

> > fat craze

> > > of recent years has had a down side for many

> > people. Good fats are

> > necessary

> > > for the skin and the production of hormones. A few

> > women on the

> > list have

> > > reported changes in their cycle when they take the

> > oils.

> > >

> > > Taking borage oil did more for my ocular rosacea

> > than any thing

> > else. I took

> > > it for 5 years, was having no problems with my

> > eyes and decided I

> > didn't need

> > > it anymore. After 5 months of being off the Borage

> > I had major

> > problems with

> > > my eyes again. That proved it for me!

> > >

> > > I have taken 400 mg of Vitamin E for 15 years,

> > but that does not

> > do the work

> > > of borage. It is important to include it in your

> > supplements, and

> > has many

> > > other protective aspects for the skin. I also find

> > that Selenium

> > 200mcg is

> > > important for the eyes and should be taken along

> > with the E.

> > >

> > > A woman chiropractor told me about borage about

> > ten years ago. It

> > seems to

> > > liquify the oil in the glands in the eyes,

> > allowing the eyes to

> > again produce

> > > the natural lubrication. That is how the hot soaks

> > work too,

> > liquifying the

> > > secretions that get " stopped up " . An

> > opthalmologist told me to

> > gently

> > > massage around the eye, using little circles,

> > before I get out of

> > bed every

> > > morning for the same reason. Get a book on

> > acupressure and also

> > hold the

> > > acupressure points around the eyes. This

> > stimulates the eye oil

> > glands.

> > >

> > > One other thing which I forgot in my earlier post

> > is watch out for

> > eye makeup.

> > > When your eyes are flaring don't use any. Also

> > throw out mascara

> > every 3-4

> > > months. I recently used some old mascara for a

> > special event and

> > was I sorry!

> > > Had to go back to the antibiotic ointment for

> > several days. I use

> > Almay

> > > products when I use mascara but am on the lookout

> > for other good

> > eye makeup.

> > >

> > > I am convinced that skin care is an inside job.

> > Yesterday the girl

> > at the

> > > local health food store was reluctant to give me

> > the senior

> > discount, which

> > > is very gratifiying! Regards, Kate

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > removed]

> >

> >

> >

> > --

> > Please read the list highlights before posting to

> > the whole group (http://rosacea.ii.net/toc.html).

> > Your post will be delayed if you don't give a

> > meaningful

> === message truncated ===

>

>

> =====

> The greatness of a nation & its moral progress can be judged

> by the way its animals are treated. - Gandhi

>

> __________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

Not in the least I throughly enjoy her educated insights and

opinions. I think she shows sensitivity and humor. I don't reagard

her as having a know-it-all tone at all. I do think there are many

other posters that exhibit that trait though. Just because you don't

agree with someone doesn't mean you have to start this type of

thread. If you don't agree with what she says don't read her posts!

Easy as that! I try to be open-minded and I appreciate everyones

insight and experience. I suggest we all do the same.

Sue

> > > Hi Jan, I need to find my book on oils, to see if

> > flax and

> > safflower can be

> > > interchanged, but I will go ahead and answer your

> > other questions.

> > EFA stands

> > > for essential fatty acids. Borage oil comes from

> > a plant, black

> > current seed

> > > oil from black currents, and flax from flax seeds,

> > all natural

> > plants. Some

> > > products are organic and some are not. There is

> > also a difference

> > in how the

> > > oil is pressed out and processed. The Vitamin

> > Shoppe products

> > which I use

> > > contain, borage 15 calories, and flax 10 calories.

> > I have a very

> > healthy diet

> > > which include tuna, salmon and other fish up to

> > 3-4 times per week.

> > I rarely

> > > eat beef, pork or deep fried foods, maybe several

> > times per month,

> > so the

> > > calories in the oils dont worry me. To the best

> > of my knowledge

> > while fish

> > > oils have been shown to help with inflammation in

> > the body, they

> > dont have an

> > > impact on the eyes, in the same way as borage. In

> > general, the low

> > fat craze

> > > of recent years has had a down side for many

> > people. Good fats are

> > necessary

> > > for the skin and the production of hormones. A few

> > women on the

> > list have

> > > reported changes in their cycle when they take the

> > oils.

> > >

> > > Taking borage oil did more for my ocular rosacea

> > than any thing

> > else. I took

> > > it for 5 years, was having no problems with my

> > eyes and decided I

> > didn't need

> > > it anymore. After 5 months of being off the Borage

> > I had major

> > problems with

> > > my eyes again. That proved it for me!

> > >

> > > I have taken 400 mg of Vitamin E for 15 years,

> > but that does not

> > do the work

> > > of borage. It is important to include it in your

> > supplements, and

> > has many

> > > other protective aspects for the skin. I also find

> > that Selenium

> > 200mcg is

> > > important for the eyes and should be taken along

> > with the E.

> > >

> > > A woman chiropractor told me about borage about

> > ten years ago. It

> > seems to

> > > liquify the oil in the glands in the eyes,

> > allowing the eyes to

> > again produce

> > > the natural lubrication. That is how the hot soaks

> > work too,

> > liquifying the

> > > secretions that get " stopped up " . An

> > opthalmologist told me to

> > gently

> > > massage around the eye, using little circles,

> > before I get out of

> > bed every

> > > morning for the same reason. Get a book on

> > acupressure and also

> > hold the

> > > acupressure points around the eyes. This

> > stimulates the eye oil

> > glands.

> > >

> > > One other thing which I forgot in my earlier post

> > is watch out for

> > eye makeup.

> > > When your eyes are flaring don't use any. Also

> > throw out mascara

> > every 3-4

> > > months. I recently used some old mascara for a

> > special event and

> > was I sorry!

> > > Had to go back to the antibiotic ointment for

> > several days. I use

> > Almay

> > > products when I use mascara but am on the lookout

> > for other good

> > eye makeup.

> > >

> > > I am convinced that skin care is an inside job.

> > Yesterday the girl

> > at the

> > > local health food store was reluctant to give me

> > the senior

> > discount, which

> > > is very gratifiying! Regards, Kate

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > removed]

> >

> >

> >

> > --

> > Please read the list highlights before posting to

> > the whole group (http://rosacea.ii.net/toc.html).

> > Your post will be delayed if you don't give a

> > meaningful

> === message truncated ===

>

>

> =====

> The greatness of a nation & its moral progress can be judged

> by the way its animals are treated. - Gandhi

>

> __________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

I am, Moya.

I have been unable to locate any " Ignore user " function on this

group...not that I'm sure it would do any good.

If it means anything to you, I take your post and every other useful

one like it to heart and am not persuaded by the nonsense questions

and dismissive comments that tend to follow.

And I appreciate all the time and effort you put into your posts.

I'm glad you're here!

~Jan

> > > Hi Jan, I need to find my book on oils, to see if

> > flax and

> > safflower can be

> > > interchanged, but I will go ahead and answer your

> > other questions.

> > EFA stands

> > > for essential fatty acids. Borage oil comes from

> > a plant, black

> > current seed

> > > oil from black currents, and flax from flax seeds,

> > all natural

> > plants. Some

> > > products are organic and some are not. There is

> > also a difference

> > in how the

> > > oil is pressed out and processed. The Vitamin

> > Shoppe products

> > which I use

> > > contain, borage 15 calories, and flax 10 calories.

> > I have a very

> > healthy diet

> > > which include tuna, salmon and other fish up to

> > 3-4 times per week.

> > I rarely

> > > eat beef, pork or deep fried foods, maybe several

> > times per month,

> > so the

> > > calories in the oils dont worry me. To the best

> > of my knowledge

> > while fish

> > > oils have been shown to help with inflammation in

> > the body, they

> > dont have an

> > > impact on the eyes, in the same way as borage. In

> > general, the low

> > fat craze

> > > of recent years has had a down side for many

> > people. Good fats are

> > necessary

> > > for the skin and the production of hormones. A few

> > women on the

> > list have

> > > reported changes in their cycle when they take the

> > oils.

> > >

> > > Taking borage oil did more for my ocular rosacea

> > than any thing

> > else. I took

> > > it for 5 years, was having no problems with my

> > eyes and decided I

> > didn't need

> > > it anymore. After 5 months of being off the Borage

> > I had major

> > problems with

> > > my eyes again. That proved it for me!

> > >

> > > I have taken 400 mg of Vitamin E for 15 years,

> > but that does not

> > do the work

> > > of borage. It is important to include it in your

> > supplements, and

> > has many

> > > other protective aspects for the skin. I also find

> > that Selenium

> > 200mcg is

> > > important for the eyes and should be taken along

> > with the E.

> > >

> > > A woman chiropractor told me about borage about

> > ten years ago. It

> > seems to

> > > liquify the oil in the glands in the eyes,

> > allowing the eyes to

> > again produce

> > > the natural lubrication. That is how the hot soaks

> > work too,

> > liquifying the

> > > secretions that get " stopped up " . An

> > opthalmologist told me to

> > gently

> > > massage around the eye, using little circles,

> > before I get out of

> > bed every

> > > morning for the same reason. Get a book on

> > acupressure and also

> > hold the

> > > acupressure points around the eyes. This

> > stimulates the eye oil

> > glands.

> > >

> > > One other thing which I forgot in my earlier post

> > is watch out for

> > eye makeup.

> > > When your eyes are flaring don't use any. Also

> > throw out mascara

> > every 3-4

> > > months. I recently used some old mascara for a

> > special event and

> > was I sorry!

> > > Had to go back to the antibiotic ointment for

> > several days. I use

> > Almay

> > > products when I use mascara but am on the lookout

> > for other good

> > eye makeup.

> > >

> > > I am convinced that skin care is an inside job.

> > Yesterday the girl

> > at the

> > > local health food store was reluctant to give me

> > the senior

> > discount, which

> > > is very gratifiying! Regards, Kate

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > removed]

> >

> >

> >

> > --

> > Please read the list highlights before posting to

> > the whole group (http://rosacea.ii.net/toc.html).

> > Your post will be delayed if you don't give a

> > meaningful

> === message truncated ===

>

>

> =====

> The greatness of a nation & its moral progress can be judged

> by the way its animals are treated. - Gandhi

>

> __________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

I am, Moya.

I have been unable to locate any " Ignore user " function on this

group...not that I'm sure it would do any good.

If it means anything to you, I take your post and every other useful

one like it to heart and am not persuaded by the nonsense questions

and dismissive comments that tend to follow.

And I appreciate all the time and effort you put into your posts.

I'm glad you're here!

~Jan

> > > Hi Jan, I need to find my book on oils, to see if

> > flax and

> > safflower can be

> > > interchanged, but I will go ahead and answer your

> > other questions.

> > EFA stands

> > > for essential fatty acids. Borage oil comes from

> > a plant, black

> > current seed

> > > oil from black currents, and flax from flax seeds,

> > all natural

> > plants. Some

> > > products are organic and some are not. There is

> > also a difference

> > in how the

> > > oil is pressed out and processed. The Vitamin

> > Shoppe products

> > which I use

> > > contain, borage 15 calories, and flax 10 calories.

> > I have a very

> > healthy diet

> > > which include tuna, salmon and other fish up to

> > 3-4 times per week.

> > I rarely

> > > eat beef, pork or deep fried foods, maybe several

> > times per month,

> > so the

> > > calories in the oils dont worry me. To the best

> > of my knowledge

> > while fish

> > > oils have been shown to help with inflammation in

> > the body, they

> > dont have an

> > > impact on the eyes, in the same way as borage. In

> > general, the low

> > fat craze

> > > of recent years has had a down side for many

> > people. Good fats are

> > necessary

> > > for the skin and the production of hormones. A few

> > women on the

> > list have

> > > reported changes in their cycle when they take the

> > oils.

> > >

> > > Taking borage oil did more for my ocular rosacea

> > than any thing

> > else. I took

> > > it for 5 years, was having no problems with my

> > eyes and decided I

> > didn't need

> > > it anymore. After 5 months of being off the Borage

> > I had major

> > problems with

> > > my eyes again. That proved it for me!

> > >

> > > I have taken 400 mg of Vitamin E for 15 years,

> > but that does not

> > do the work

> > > of borage. It is important to include it in your

> > supplements, and

> > has many

> > > other protective aspects for the skin. I also find

> > that Selenium

> > 200mcg is

> > > important for the eyes and should be taken along

> > with the E.

> > >

> > > A woman chiropractor told me about borage about

> > ten years ago. It

> > seems to

> > > liquify the oil in the glands in the eyes,

> > allowing the eyes to

> > again produce

> > > the natural lubrication. That is how the hot soaks

> > work too,

> > liquifying the

> > > secretions that get " stopped up " . An

> > opthalmologist told me to

> > gently

> > > massage around the eye, using little circles,

> > before I get out of

> > bed every

> > > morning for the same reason. Get a book on

> > acupressure and also

> > hold the

> > > acupressure points around the eyes. This

> > stimulates the eye oil

> > glands.

> > >

> > > One other thing which I forgot in my earlier post

> > is watch out for

> > eye makeup.

> > > When your eyes are flaring don't use any. Also

> > throw out mascara

> > every 3-4

> > > months. I recently used some old mascara for a

> > special event and

> > was I sorry!

> > > Had to go back to the antibiotic ointment for

> > several days. I use

> > Almay

> > > products when I use mascara but am on the lookout

> > for other good

> > eye makeup.

> > >

> > > I am convinced that skin care is an inside job.

> > Yesterday the girl

> > at the

> > > local health food store was reluctant to give me

> > the senior

> > discount, which

> > > is very gratifiying! Regards, Kate

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > removed]

> >

> >

> >

> > --

> > Please read the list highlights before posting to

> > the whole group (http://rosacea.ii.net/toc.html).

> > Your post will be delayed if you don't give a

> > meaningful

> === message truncated ===

>

>

> =====

> The greatness of a nation & its moral progress can be judged

> by the way its animals are treated. - Gandhi

>

> __________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

I am, Moya.

I have been unable to locate any " Ignore user " function on this

group...not that I'm sure it would do any good.

If it means anything to you, I take your post and every other useful

one like it to heart and am not persuaded by the nonsense questions

and dismissive comments that tend to follow.

And I appreciate all the time and effort you put into your posts.

I'm glad you're here!

~Jan

> > > Hi Jan, I need to find my book on oils, to see if

> > flax and

> > safflower can be

> > > interchanged, but I will go ahead and answer your

> > other questions.

> > EFA stands

> > > for essential fatty acids. Borage oil comes from

> > a plant, black

> > current seed

> > > oil from black currents, and flax from flax seeds,

> > all natural

> > plants. Some

> > > products are organic and some are not. There is

> > also a difference

> > in how the

> > > oil is pressed out and processed. The Vitamin

> > Shoppe products

> > which I use

> > > contain, borage 15 calories, and flax 10 calories.

> > I have a very

> > healthy diet

> > > which include tuna, salmon and other fish up to

> > 3-4 times per week.

> > I rarely

> > > eat beef, pork or deep fried foods, maybe several

> > times per month,

> > so the

> > > calories in the oils dont worry me. To the best

> > of my knowledge

> > while fish

> > > oils have been shown to help with inflammation in

> > the body, they

> > dont have an

> > > impact on the eyes, in the same way as borage. In

> > general, the low

> > fat craze

> > > of recent years has had a down side for many

> > people. Good fats are

> > necessary

> > > for the skin and the production of hormones. A few

> > women on the

> > list have

> > > reported changes in their cycle when they take the

> > oils.

> > >

> > > Taking borage oil did more for my ocular rosacea

> > than any thing

> > else. I took

> > > it for 5 years, was having no problems with my

> > eyes and decided I

> > didn't need

> > > it anymore. After 5 months of being off the Borage

> > I had major

> > problems with

> > > my eyes again. That proved it for me!

> > >

> > > I have taken 400 mg of Vitamin E for 15 years,

> > but that does not

> > do the work

> > > of borage. It is important to include it in your

> > supplements, and

> > has many

> > > other protective aspects for the skin. I also find

> > that Selenium

> > 200mcg is

> > > important for the eyes and should be taken along

> > with the E.

> > >

> > > A woman chiropractor told me about borage about

> > ten years ago. It

> > seems to

> > > liquify the oil in the glands in the eyes,

> > allowing the eyes to

> > again produce

> > > the natural lubrication. That is how the hot soaks

> > work too,

> > liquifying the

> > > secretions that get " stopped up " . An

> > opthalmologist told me to

> > gently

> > > massage around the eye, using little circles,

> > before I get out of

> > bed every

> > > morning for the same reason. Get a book on

> > acupressure and also

> > hold the

> > > acupressure points around the eyes. This

> > stimulates the eye oil

> > glands.

> > >

> > > One other thing which I forgot in my earlier post

> > is watch out for

> > eye makeup.

> > > When your eyes are flaring don't use any. Also

> > throw out mascara

> > every 3-4

> > > months. I recently used some old mascara for a

> > special event and

> > was I sorry!

> > > Had to go back to the antibiotic ointment for

> > several days. I use

> > Almay

> > > products when I use mascara but am on the lookout

> > for other good

> > eye makeup.

> > >

> > > I am convinced that skin care is an inside job.

> > Yesterday the girl

> > at the

> > > local health food store was reluctant to give me

> > the senior

> > discount, which

> > > is very gratifiying! Regards, Kate

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > removed]

> >

> >

> >

> > --

> > Please read the list highlights before posting to

> > the whole group (http://rosacea.ii.net/toc.html).

> > Your post will be delayed if you don't give a

> > meaningful

> === message truncated ===

>

>

> =====

> The greatness of a nation & its moral progress can be judged

> by the way its animals are treated. - Gandhi

>

> __________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

> Is anyone out there as put off as I am by Dr.Lazoff's

> rather know-it-all tone? For weeks I've bit my tongue

No, because as a lurker (usually), I really appreciate hearing BOTH from

people who believe in the medical establishment AND from others.

I am, however, put off by the way everyone is interpreting other's posts

in the least charitable way possible.

Can't you all just get along and stop attacking each other?

-- Eva

--

Eva Crider crider@...

[Guest guest]

Try Actions >> Junk e-mail (if you use Outlook)

Most e-mail services have some sort of blocking facility

Barry Hunt

Re: Basic questions about nutritional supplements

I am, Moya.

I have been unable to locate any " Ignore user " function on this

group...not that I'm sure it would do any good.

If it means anything to you, I take your post and every other useful

one like it to heart and am not persuaded by the nonsense questions

and dismissive comments that tend to follow.

And I appreciate all the time and effort you put into your posts.

I'm glad you're here!

~Jan

> > > Hi Jan, I need to find my book on oils, to see if

> > flax and

> > safflower can be

> > > interchanged, but I will go ahead and answer your

> > other questions.

> > EFA stands

> > > for essential fatty acids. Borage oil comes from

> > a plant, black

> > current seed

> > > oil from black currents, and flax from flax seeds,

> > all natural

> > plants. Some

> > > products are organic and some are not. There is

> > also a difference

> > in how the

> > > oil is pressed out and processed. The Vitamin

> > Shoppe products

> > which I use

> > > contain, borage 15 calories, and flax 10 calories.

> > I have a very

> > healthy diet

> > > which include tuna, salmon and other fish up to

> > 3-4 times per week.

> > I rarely

> > > eat beef, pork or deep fried foods, maybe several

> > times per month,

> > so the

> > > calories in the oils dont worry me. To the best

> > of my knowledge

> > while fish

> > > oils have been shown to help with inflammation in

> > the body, they

> > dont have an

> > > impact on the eyes, in the same way as borage. In

> > general, the low

> > fat craze

> > > of recent years has had a down side for many

> > people. Good fats are

> > necessary

> > > for the skin and the production of hormones. A few

> > women on the

> > list have

> > > reported changes in their cycle when they take the

> > oils.

> > >

> > > Taking borage oil did more for my ocular rosacea

> > than any thing

> > else. I took

> > > it for 5 years, was having no problems with my

> > eyes and decided I

> > didn't need

> > > it anymore. After 5 months of being off the Borage

> > I had major

> > problems with

> > > my eyes again. That proved it for me!

> > >

> > > I have taken 400 mg of Vitamin E for 15 years,

> > but that does not

> > do the work

> > > of borage. It is important to include it in your

> > supplements, and

> > has many

> > > other protective aspects for the skin. I also find

> > that Selenium

> > 200mcg is

> > > important for the eyes and should be taken along

> > with the E.

> > >

> > > A woman chiropractor told me about borage about

> > ten years ago. It

> > seems to

> > > liquify the oil in the glands in the eyes,

> > allowing the eyes to

> > again produce

> > > the natural lubrication. That is how the hot soaks

> > work too,

> > liquifying the

> > > secretions that get " stopped up " . An

> > opthalmologist told me to

> > gently

> > > massage around the eye, using little circles,

> > before I get out of

> > bed every

> > > morning for the same reason. Get a book on

> > acupressure and also

> > hold the

> > > acupressure points around the eyes. This

> > stimulates the eye oil

> > glands.

> > >

> > > One other thing which I forgot in my earlier post

> > is watch out for

> > eye makeup.

> > > When your eyes are flaring don't use any. Also

> > throw out mascara

> > every 3-4

> > > months. I recently used some old mascara for a

> > special event and

> > was I sorry!

> > > Had to go back to the antibiotic ointment for

> > several days. I use

> > Almay

> > > products when I use mascara but am on the lookout

> > for other good

> > eye makeup.

> > >

> > > I am convinced that skin care is an inside job.

> > Yesterday the girl

> > at the

> > > local health food store was reluctant to give me

> > the senior

> > discount, which

> > > is very gratifiying! Regards, Kate

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > removed]

> >

> >

> >

> > --

> > Please read the list highlights before posting to

> > the whole group (http://rosacea.ii.net/toc.html).

> > Your post will be delayed if you don't give a

> > meaningful

> === message truncated ===

>

>

> =====

> The greatness of a nation & its moral progress can be judged

> by the way its animals are treated. - Gandhi

>

> __________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

Try Actions >> Junk e-mail (if you use Outlook)

Most e-mail services have some sort of blocking facility

Barry Hunt

Re: Basic questions about nutritional supplements

I am, Moya.

I have been unable to locate any " Ignore user " function on this

group...not that I'm sure it would do any good.

If it means anything to you, I take your post and every other useful

one like it to heart and am not persuaded by the nonsense questions

and dismissive comments that tend to follow.

And I appreciate all the time and effort you put into your posts.

I'm glad you're here!

~Jan

> > > Hi Jan, I need to find my book on oils, to see if

> > flax and

> > safflower can be

> > > interchanged, but I will go ahead and answer your

> > other questions.

> > EFA stands

> > > for essential fatty acids. Borage oil comes from

> > a plant, black

> > current seed

> > > oil from black currents, and flax from flax seeds,

> > all natural

> > plants. Some

> > > products are organic and some are not. There is

> > also a difference

> > in how the

> > > oil is pressed out and processed. The Vitamin

> > Shoppe products

> > which I use

> > > contain, borage 15 calories, and flax 10 calories.

> > I have a very

> > healthy diet

> > > which include tuna, salmon and other fish up to

> > 3-4 times per week.

> > I rarely

> > > eat beef, pork or deep fried foods, maybe several

> > times per month,

> > so the

> > > calories in the oils dont worry me. To the best

> > of my knowledge

> > while fish

> > > oils have been shown to help with inflammation in

> > the body, they

> > dont have an

> > > impact on the eyes, in the same way as borage. In

> > general, the low

> > fat craze

> > > of recent years has had a down side for many

> > people. Good fats are

> > necessary

> > > for the skin and the production of hormones. A few

> > women on the

> > list have

> > > reported changes in their cycle when they take the

> > oils.

> > >

> > > Taking borage oil did more for my ocular rosacea

> > than any thing

> > else. I took

> > > it for 5 years, was having no problems with my

> > eyes and decided I

> > didn't need

> > > it anymore. After 5 months of being off the Borage

> > I had major

> > problems with

> > > my eyes again. That proved it for me!

> > >

> > > I have taken 400 mg of Vitamin E for 15 years,

> > but that does not

> > do the work

> > > of borage. It is important to include it in your

> > supplements, and

> > has many

> > > other protective aspects for the skin. I also find

> > that Selenium

> > 200mcg is

> > > important for the eyes and should be taken along

> > with the E.

> > >

> > > A woman chiropractor told me about borage about

> > ten years ago. It

> > seems to

> > > liquify the oil in the glands in the eyes,

> > allowing the eyes to

> > again produce

> > > the natural lubrication. That is how the hot soaks

> > work too,

> > liquifying the

> > > secretions that get " stopped up " . An

> > opthalmologist told me to

> > gently

> > > massage around the eye, using little circles,

> > before I get out of

> > bed every

> > > morning for the same reason. Get a book on

> > acupressure and also

> > hold the

> > > acupressure points around the eyes. This

> > stimulates the eye oil

> > glands.

> > >

> > > One other thing which I forgot in my earlier post

> > is watch out for

> > eye makeup.

> > > When your eyes are flaring don't use any. Also

> > throw out mascara

> > every 3-4

> > > months. I recently used some old mascara for a

> > special event and

> > was I sorry!

> > > Had to go back to the antibiotic ointment for

> > several days. I use

> > Almay

> > > products when I use mascara but am on the lookout

> > for other good

> > eye makeup.

> > >

> > > I am convinced that skin care is an inside job.

> > Yesterday the girl

> > at the

> > > local health food store was reluctant to give me

> > the senior

> > discount, which

> > > is very gratifiying! Regards, Kate

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > removed]

> >

> >

> >

> > --

> > Please read the list highlights before posting to

> > the whole group (http://rosacea.ii.net/toc.html).

> > Your post will be delayed if you don't give a

> > meaningful

> === message truncated ===

>

>

> =====

> The greatness of a nation & its moral progress can be judged

> by the way its animals are treated. - Gandhi

>

> __________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

Try Actions >> Junk e-mail (if you use Outlook)

Most e-mail services have some sort of blocking facility

Barry Hunt

Re: Basic questions about nutritional supplements

I am, Moya.

I have been unable to locate any " Ignore user " function on this

group...not that I'm sure it would do any good.

If it means anything to you, I take your post and every other useful

one like it to heart and am not persuaded by the nonsense questions

and dismissive comments that tend to follow.

And I appreciate all the time and effort you put into your posts.

I'm glad you're here!

~Jan

> > > Hi Jan, I need to find my book on oils, to see if

> > flax and

> > safflower can be

> > > interchanged, but I will go ahead and answer your

> > other questions.

> > EFA stands

> > > for essential fatty acids. Borage oil comes from

> > a plant, black

> > current seed

> > > oil from black currents, and flax from flax seeds,

> > all natural

> > plants. Some

> > > products are organic and some are not. There is

> > also a difference

> > in how the

> > > oil is pressed out and processed. The Vitamin

> > Shoppe products

> > which I use

> > > contain, borage 15 calories, and flax 10 calories.

> > I have a very

> > healthy diet

> > > which include tuna, salmon and other fish up to

> > 3-4 times per week.

> > I rarely

> > > eat beef, pork or deep fried foods, maybe several

> > times per month,

> > so the

> > > calories in the oils dont worry me. To the best

> > of my knowledge

> > while fish

> > > oils have been shown to help with inflammation in

> > the body, they

> > dont have an

> > > impact on the eyes, in the same way as borage. In

> > general, the low

> > fat craze

> > > of recent years has had a down side for many

> > people. Good fats are

> > necessary

> > > for the skin and the production of hormones. A few

> > women on the

> > list have

> > > reported changes in their cycle when they take the

> > oils.

> > >

> > > Taking borage oil did more for my ocular rosacea

> > than any thing

> > else. I took

> > > it for 5 years, was having no problems with my

> > eyes and decided I

> > didn't need

> > > it anymore. After 5 months of being off the Borage

> > I had major

> > problems with

> > > my eyes again. That proved it for me!

> > >

> > > I have taken 400 mg of Vitamin E for 15 years,

> > but that does not

> > do the work

> > > of borage. It is important to include it in your

> > supplements, and

> > has many

> > > other protective aspects for the skin. I also find

> > that Selenium

> > 200mcg is

> > > important for the eyes and should be taken along

> > with the E.

> > >

> > > A woman chiropractor told me about borage about

> > ten years ago. It

> > seems to

> > > liquify the oil in the glands in the eyes,

> > allowing the eyes to

> > again produce

> > > the natural lubrication. That is how the hot soaks

> > work too,

> > liquifying the

> > > secretions that get " stopped up " . An

> > opthalmologist told me to

> > gently

> > > massage around the eye, using little circles,

> > before I get out of

> > bed every

> > > morning for the same reason. Get a book on

> > acupressure and also

> > hold the

> > > acupressure points around the eyes. This

> > stimulates the eye oil

> > glands.

> > >

> > > One other thing which I forgot in my earlier post

> > is watch out for

> > eye makeup.

> > > When your eyes are flaring don't use any. Also

> > throw out mascara

> > every 3-4

> > > months. I recently used some old mascara for a

> > special event and

> > was I sorry!

> > > Had to go back to the antibiotic ointment for

> > several days. I use

> > Almay

> > > products when I use mascara but am on the lookout

> > for other good

> > eye makeup.

> > >

> > > I am convinced that skin care is an inside job.

> > Yesterday the girl

> > at the

> > > local health food store was reluctant to give me

> > the senior

> > discount, which

> > > is very gratifiying! Regards, Kate

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > removed]

> >

> >

> >

> > --

> > Please read the list highlights before posting to

> > the whole group (http://rosacea.ii.net/toc.html).

> > Your post will be delayed if you don't give a

> > meaningful

> === message truncated ===

>

>

> =====

> The greatness of a nation & its moral progress can be judged

> by the way its animals are treated. - Gandhi

>

> __________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Sue,

I can only speak from my own experience here, but I think there's a

fundamental difference between expressing how you feel about a reply

to your own post, and disagreeing with the content of a post.

You wrote, " If you don't agree with what she says don't read her

posts!

> Easy as that! "

Your advice makes no sense. How can you know you disagree with

someone UNLESS you read their post?

You also seem to contradict yourself, suggesting that Moya was wrong

to tell us how she feels about Marjorie's posts, and then saying that

you feel " other posters " have a know-it-all attitude. Why is it right

for you to say so and not her? (Or me?) Is it because you didn't name

these " know-it-all " posters?

While I'm thinking of it, there is also a huge difference between

using your own words to say what you believe, and twisting someone

else's in service of your own ideas. case in point:

As a new member, up until very recently I believed that this was

Marjorie's group, that it was moderated by her, and that all of her

posts were *the* final say on the care & treatment of rosecea.

I think her wording can easily mislead other new members into

believing the same thing.

I love hearing all sorts of advice and input from as many people as

possible, including Marjorie.

However, I don't think manipulation or disrespect is appropriate

ANYWHERE, least of all a support group, and I feel if I sit by silent

when it happens, it's as if I condone it. Much like not keeping

silent when racist remarks are made in my presence. It's uncalled for

and in my opinion diminishes everyone it touches.

I think it's unfortunate that so much discussion has revolved around

this very issue, it certainly wouldn't have been my choice to see

things going this way, and it's not how I like to spend *my* time.

I hope I won't be experiencing any more of this any time soon.

Sincerely,

Jan

> > > > Hi Jan, I need to find my book on oils, to see if

> > > flax and

> > > safflower can be

> > > > interchanged, but I will go ahead and answer your

> > > other questions.

> > > EFA stands

> > > > for essential fatty acids. Borage oil comes from

> > > a plant, black

> > > current seed

> > > > oil from black currents, and flax from flax seeds,

> > > all natural

> > > plants. Some

> > > > products are organic and some are not. There is

> > > also a difference

> > > in how the

> > > > oil is pressed out and processed. The Vitamin

> > > Shoppe products

> > > which I use

> > > > contain, borage 15 calories, and flax 10 calories.

> > > I have a very

> > > healthy diet

> > > > which include tuna, salmon and other fish up to

> > > 3-4 times per week.

> > > I rarely

> > > > eat beef, pork or deep fried foods, maybe several

> > > times per month,

> > > so the

> > > > calories in the oils dont worry me. To the best

> > > of my knowledge

> > > while fish

> > > > oils have been shown to help with inflammation in

> > > the body, they

> > > dont have an

> > > > impact on the eyes, in the same way as borage. In

> > > general, the low

> > > fat craze

> > > > of recent years has had a down side for many

> > > people. Good fats are

> > > necessary

> > > > for the skin and the production of hormones. A few

> > > women on the

> > > list have

> > > > reported changes in their cycle when they take the

> > > oils.

> > > >

> > > > Taking borage oil did more for my ocular rosacea

> > > than any thing

> > > else. I took

> > > > it for 5 years, was having no problems with my

> > > eyes and decided I

> > > didn't need

> > > > it anymore. After 5 months of being off the Borage

> > > I had major

> > > problems with

> > > > my eyes again. That proved it for me!

> > > >

> > > > I have taken 400 mg of Vitamin E for 15 years,

> > > but that does not

> > > do the work

> > > > of borage. It is important to include it in your

> > > supplements, and

> > > has many

> > > > other protective aspects for the skin. I also find

> > > that Selenium

> > > 200mcg is

> > > > important for the eyes and should be taken along

> > > with the E.

> > > >

> > > > A woman chiropractor told me about borage about

> > > ten years ago. It

> > > seems to

> > > > liquify the oil in the glands in the eyes,

> > > allowing the eyes to

> > > again produce

> > > > the natural lubrication. That is how the hot soaks

> > > work too,

> > > liquifying the

> > > > secretions that get " stopped up " . An

> > > opthalmologist told me to

> > > gently

> > > > massage around the eye, using little circles,

> > > before I get out of

> > > bed every

> > > > morning for the same reason. Get a book on

> > > acupressure and also

> > > hold the

> > > > acupressure points around the eyes. This

> > > stimulates the eye oil

> > > glands.

> > > >

> > > > One other thing which I forgot in my earlier post

> > > is watch out for

> > > eye makeup.

> > > > When your eyes are flaring don't use any. Also

> > > throw out mascara

> > > every 3-4

> > > > months. I recently used some old mascara for a

> > > special event and

> > > was I sorry!

> > > > Had to go back to the antibiotic ointment for

> > > several days. I use

> > > Almay

> > > > products when I use mascara but am on the lookout

> > > for other good

> > > eye makeup.

> > > >

> > > > I am convinced that skin care is an inside job.

> > > Yesterday the girl

> > > at the

> > > > local health food store was reluctant to give me

> > > the senior

> > > discount, which

> > > > is very gratifiying! Regards, Kate

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > > removed]

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > --

> > > Please read the list highlights before posting to

> > > the whole group (http://rosacea.ii.net/toc.html).

> > > Your post will be delayed if you don't give a

> > > meaningful

> > === message truncated ===

> >

> >

> > =====

> > The greatness of a nation & its moral progress can be judged

> > by the way its animals are treated. - Gandhi

> >

> > __________________________________________________

> >

[Guest guest]

Hi Sue,

I can only speak from my own experience here, but I think there's a

fundamental difference between expressing how you feel about a reply

to your own post, and disagreeing with the content of a post.

You wrote, " If you don't agree with what she says don't read her

posts!

> Easy as that! "

Your advice makes no sense. How can you know you disagree with

someone UNLESS you read their post?

You also seem to contradict yourself, suggesting that Moya was wrong

to tell us how she feels about Marjorie's posts, and then saying that

you feel " other posters " have a know-it-all attitude. Why is it right

for you to say so and not her? (Or me?) Is it because you didn't name

these " know-it-all " posters?

While I'm thinking of it, there is also a huge difference between

using your own words to say what you believe, and twisting someone

else's in service of your own ideas. case in point:

As a new member, up until very recently I believed that this was

Marjorie's group, that it was moderated by her, and that all of her

posts were *the* final say on the care & treatment of rosecea.

I think her wording can easily mislead other new members into

believing the same thing.

I love hearing all sorts of advice and input from as many people as

possible, including Marjorie.

However, I don't think manipulation or disrespect is appropriate

ANYWHERE, least of all a support group, and I feel if I sit by silent

when it happens, it's as if I condone it. Much like not keeping

silent when racist remarks are made in my presence. It's uncalled for

and in my opinion diminishes everyone it touches.

I think it's unfortunate that so much discussion has revolved around

this very issue, it certainly wouldn't have been my choice to see

things going this way, and it's not how I like to spend *my* time.

I hope I won't be experiencing any more of this any time soon.

Sincerely,

Jan

> > > > Hi Jan, I need to find my book on oils, to see if

> > > flax and

> > > safflower can be

> > > > interchanged, but I will go ahead and answer your

> > > other questions.

> > > EFA stands

> > > > for essential fatty acids. Borage oil comes from

> > > a plant, black

> > > current seed

> > > > oil from black currents, and flax from flax seeds,

> > > all natural

> > > plants. Some

> > > > products are organic and some are not. There is

> > > also a difference

> > > in how the

> > > > oil is pressed out and processed. The Vitamin

> > > Shoppe products

> > > which I use

> > > > contain, borage 15 calories, and flax 10 calories.

> > > I have a very

> > > healthy diet

> > > > which include tuna, salmon and other fish up to

> > > 3-4 times per week.

> > > I rarely

> > > > eat beef, pork or deep fried foods, maybe several

> > > times per month,

> > > so the

> > > > calories in the oils dont worry me. To the best

> > > of my knowledge

> > > while fish

> > > > oils have been shown to help with inflammation in

> > > the body, they

> > > dont have an

> > > > impact on the eyes, in the same way as borage. In

> > > general, the low

> > > fat craze

> > > > of recent years has had a down side for many

> > > people. Good fats are

> > > necessary

> > > > for the skin and the production of hormones. A few

> > > women on the

> > > list have

> > > > reported changes in their cycle when they take the

> > > oils.

> > > >

> > > > Taking borage oil did more for my ocular rosacea

> > > than any thing

> > > else. I took

> > > > it for 5 years, was having no problems with my

> > > eyes and decided I

> > > didn't need

> > > > it anymore. After 5 months of being off the Borage

> > > I had major

> > > problems with

> > > > my eyes again. That proved it for me!

> > > >

> > > > I have taken 400 mg of Vitamin E for 15 years,

> > > but that does not

> > > do the work

> > > > of borage. It is important to include it in your

> > > supplements, and

> > > has many

> > > > other protective aspects for the skin. I also find

> > > that Selenium

> > > 200mcg is

> > > > important for the eyes and should be taken along

> > > with the E.

> > > >

> > > > A woman chiropractor told me about borage about

> > > ten years ago. It

> > > seems to

> > > > liquify the oil in the glands in the eyes,

> > > allowing the eyes to

> > > again produce

> > > > the natural lubrication. That is how the hot soaks

> > > work too,

> > > liquifying the

> > > > secretions that get " stopped up " . An

> > > opthalmologist told me to

> > > gently

> > > > massage around the eye, using little circles,

> > > before I get out of

> > > bed every

> > > > morning for the same reason. Get a book on

> > > acupressure and also

> > > hold the

> > > > acupressure points around the eyes. This

> > > stimulates the eye oil

> > > glands.

> > > >

> > > > One other thing which I forgot in my earlier post

> > > is watch out for

> > > eye makeup.

> > > > When your eyes are flaring don't use any. Also

> > > throw out mascara

> > > every 3-4

> > > > months. I recently used some old mascara for a

> > > special event and

> > > was I sorry!

> > > > Had to go back to the antibiotic ointment for

> > > several days. I use

> > > Almay

> > > > products when I use mascara but am on the lookout

> > > for other good

> > > eye makeup.

> > > >

> > > > I am convinced that skin care is an inside job.

> > > Yesterday the girl

> > > at the

> > > > local health food store was reluctant to give me

> > > the senior

> > > discount, which

> > > > is very gratifiying! Regards, Kate

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > > removed]

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > --

> > > Please read the list highlights before posting to

> > > the whole group (http://rosacea.ii.net/toc.html).

> > > Your post will be delayed if you don't give a

> > > meaningful

> > === message truncated ===

> >

> >

> > =====

> > The greatness of a nation & its moral progress can be judged

> > by the way its animals are treated. - Gandhi

> >

> > __________________________________________________

> >

[Guest guest]

Hi Sue,

I can only speak from my own experience here, but I think there's a

fundamental difference between expressing how you feel about a reply

to your own post, and disagreeing with the content of a post.

You wrote, " If you don't agree with what she says don't read her

posts!

> Easy as that! "

Your advice makes no sense. How can you know you disagree with

someone UNLESS you read their post?

You also seem to contradict yourself, suggesting that Moya was wrong

to tell us how she feels about Marjorie's posts, and then saying that

you feel " other posters " have a know-it-all attitude. Why is it right

for you to say so and not her? (Or me?) Is it because you didn't name

these " know-it-all " posters?

While I'm thinking of it, there is also a huge difference between

using your own words to say what you believe, and twisting someone

else's in service of your own ideas. case in point:

As a new member, up until very recently I believed that this was

Marjorie's group, that it was moderated by her, and that all of her

posts were *the* final say on the care & treatment of rosecea.

I think her wording can easily mislead other new members into

believing the same thing.

I love hearing all sorts of advice and input from as many people as

possible, including Marjorie.

However, I don't think manipulation or disrespect is appropriate

ANYWHERE, least of all a support group, and I feel if I sit by silent

when it happens, it's as if I condone it. Much like not keeping

silent when racist remarks are made in my presence. It's uncalled for

and in my opinion diminishes everyone it touches.

I think it's unfortunate that so much discussion has revolved around

this very issue, it certainly wouldn't have been my choice to see

things going this way, and it's not how I like to spend *my* time.

I hope I won't be experiencing any more of this any time soon.

Sincerely,

Jan

> > > > Hi Jan, I need to find my book on oils, to see if

> > > flax and

> > > safflower can be

> > > > interchanged, but I will go ahead and answer your

> > > other questions.

> > > EFA stands

> > > > for essential fatty acids. Borage oil comes from

> > > a plant, black

> > > current seed

> > > > oil from black currents, and flax from flax seeds,

> > > all natural

> > > plants. Some

> > > > products are organic and some are not. There is

> > > also a difference

> > > in how the

> > > > oil is pressed out and processed. The Vitamin

> > > Shoppe products

> > > which I use

> > > > contain, borage 15 calories, and flax 10 calories.

> > > I have a very

> > > healthy diet

> > > > which include tuna, salmon and other fish up to

> > > 3-4 times per week.

> > > I rarely

> > > > eat beef, pork or deep fried foods, maybe several

> > > times per month,

> > > so the

> > > > calories in the oils dont worry me. To the best

> > > of my knowledge

> > > while fish

> > > > oils have been shown to help with inflammation in

> > > the body, they

> > > dont have an

> > > > impact on the eyes, in the same way as borage. In

> > > general, the low

> > > fat craze

> > > > of recent years has had a down side for many

> > > people. Good fats are

> > > necessary

> > > > for the skin and the production of hormones. A few

> > > women on the

> > > list have

> > > > reported changes in their cycle when they take the

> > > oils.

> > > >

> > > > Taking borage oil did more for my ocular rosacea

> > > than any thing

> > > else. I took

> > > > it for 5 years, was having no problems with my

> > > eyes and decided I

> > > didn't need

> > > > it anymore. After 5 months of being off the Borage

> > > I had major

> > > problems with

> > > > my eyes again. That proved it for me!

> > > >

> > > > I have taken 400 mg of Vitamin E for 15 years,

> > > but that does not

> > > do the work

> > > > of borage. It is important to include it in your

> > > supplements, and

> > > has many

> > > > other protective aspects for the skin. I also find

> > > that Selenium

> > > 200mcg is

> > > > important for the eyes and should be taken along

> > > with the E.

> > > >

> > > > A woman chiropractor told me about borage about

> > > ten years ago. It

> > > seems to

> > > > liquify the oil in the glands in the eyes,

> > > allowing the eyes to

> > > again produce

> > > > the natural lubrication. That is how the hot soaks

> > > work too,

> > > liquifying the

> > > > secretions that get " stopped up " . An

> > > opthalmologist told me to

> > > gently

> > > > massage around the eye, using little circles,

> > > before I get out of

> > > bed every

> > > > morning for the same reason. Get a book on

> > > acupressure and also

> > > hold the

> > > > acupressure points around the eyes. This

> > > stimulates the eye oil

> > > glands.

> > > >

> > > > One other thing which I forgot in my earlier post

> > > is watch out for

> > > eye makeup.

> > > > When your eyes are flaring don't use any. Also

> > > throw out mascara

> > > every 3-4

> > > > months. I recently used some old mascara for a

> > > special event and

> > > was I sorry!

> > > > Had to go back to the antibiotic ointment for

> > > several days. I use

> > > Almay

> > > > products when I use mascara but am on the lookout

> > > for other good

> > > eye makeup.

> > > >

> > > > I am convinced that skin care is an inside job.

> > > Yesterday the girl

> > > at the

> > > > local health food store was reluctant to give me

> > > the senior

> > > discount, which

> > > > is very gratifiying! Regards, Kate

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > > removed]

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > --

> > > Please read the list highlights before posting to

> > > the whole group (http://rosacea.ii.net/toc.html).

> > > Your post will be delayed if you don't give a

> > > meaningful

> > === message truncated ===

> >

> >

> > =====

> > The greatness of a nation & its moral progress can be judged

> > by the way its animals are treated. - Gandhi

> >

> > __________________________________________________

> >