Re: Ornish diet and other questions

June 12, 2000

Blair, I do crave veggies and fruit. I get my fruit in my smoothie and I am

just starting to get my veggies mainly in soups and really mashed carrot and

potatoes. I dream about eating a tomato out of my garden,

But IM not ready yet. Im trying to be somewhat good. Sweets after my first

one do not appeal to me at all. Actually Im tired of yogurt because it is

sweet.

Trisha

jst my 2 cents

Im trying to keep up with Flo

June 12, 2000

Your immediate post surgery diet will be perfectly fine, for about 3

days -- liquids, jello, bland soup.

Then, you get creative and start adding different kinds of soup, some

yogurt, new jello colors, maybe some soups with veggies, or cream

soups.

About 8 days into that routine, you get *really* bored with it and

add a bite of banana, some crackers, you try the " protein supplements "

and maybe a smoothie (a euphemism for protein slop with fruit added.

Some people actually like them).

What you are reading about are the people who are about 3 weeks to a

month post-op who have a calorie-deprived version of cabin-fever,

running out to try some actual food with their new stomachs.

However:

(1) The Ornish diet is for after the time you are on liquids.

(2) The Ornish diet has *never* been a weight loss diet. It is a

*heart* and *artery* diet, used to reverse plaque buildup in the

arteries, which assumes you have trouble with that (I don't).

It is a predominantly *complex-carbohydrate,* no meat, low fat diet.

My body is *very* efficient at converting carbohydrates to fat,

thanks, and the only time I ever tried a high-carb diet, I gained

about 15 pounds in record time. The results since surgery only

verify this further for me.

My chances of following the Ornish diet now are absolutely ZERO. If

there is one thing I have researched in my life, it's is these damned

diets.

I am at this time trying to get to a point where I can eat enough

protein to stay on the Adkins diet as much as possible -- high

protein, low fat, low carbs; however, being somewhat limited as to

foods I could actually eat up until recently, that has been a little

challenging.

Now, another thing that is sort of aggravating to me is that either

this surgery works or it doesn't. Right now, I'm in the doubting

category because it has been one full month, on Thursday, since my

surgery. I lost 11 pounds the week of surgery (which was water

weight. Everyone loses weight the week of surgery, which Dr. R. says

is due to water.)

In the THREE WEEKS since surgery, I've only lost 4 pounds.

Additionally, I have carefully monitored my calorie intake since

surgery and have not had a day over 600 calories, usually 350

calories a day, and most of it complex-carbohydrates, very low fat,

up until this week, which is in fact the " Ornish Diet. "

FOUR LOUSY POUNDS IN THREE WEEKS, surgery or no surgery, and even

though I've been eating VERY LOW CALORIE, complex-carbs, low fat

foods, and precious little of that.

I have had much better weight loss in the past on Herbal Life and

virtually any diet there is. In a word, the weight loss is PATHETIC.

It is NOT satisfactory. It was *not* worth risking my life for. I

am really angry about this right now, so it probably is not a good

time to ask me, but I'd say that also had something to do with going

to Pizza Hut. Might as well eat something I enjoy if I'm not going

to lose weight anyway. Pizza, by the way, is a pretty nutritious

food, other than the high fat content, but I had no other fat that

day

and still came in just fine on the fat intake. My carbs were out the

roof, though.

I did not risk my life and spend thousands of dollars just to have to

go on a low-calorie diet for the rest of my life, either.

I am also not finding people who are losing " 30 pounds in a month, "

the supposed average the first month after surgery, either (other

than one woman who has become Dr. Rutledge's poster child).

As it is now, I have a small crampy stomach that dumps into an

intestine and often I can feel the food being pushed into the

intestine. It reminds of scenes from movies like " Alien. " I feel

the food moving and dumping and any minute, I expect some slimey

thing to burst through, writhing and shrieking, as the aliens

use us for birth pods. It's *not* a good feeling.

I'm only taking in starvation quantities of foods and I don't

enjoy what I do eat because there's so damned little of it

that it isn't any fun anymore, and I'm not losing weight.

I feel like I've been conned, actually.

Kind regards,

> Dear Post-Ops:

>

> I have a question for you: has anybody tried going on an

Ornish-type

diet

> after the surgery, as recommended by Dr. Rutledge? I keep reading

about trips

> to Cracker Barrel and Pizza Hut, and wondering what my post-surgery

diet will

> really be like...

>

> I'm also surprised that I'm not hearing more about post-ops craving

fruits

> and vegetables - that seemed to be one of the big revelations in

the

clinic I

> attended. One of the reasons I'm not looking into the RNY surgery

is

because

> the sugar cravings don't seem to go away, as I thought they did

with

the MGB.

> Have your sugar cravings gone away? Do you crave fresh fruits and

vegetables?

>

> Next question: I'm really confused about the medical history form

thread

> that's recently come up. That's different from the Patient

Information form

> - but we're supposed to send it in with our doctor's letter and

current

> physical? Please enlighten!

>

> Thanks,

> Blair

> MGB wannabe

June 13, 2000

Hey Barbie,

What's up????? You don't sound too happy today!!!!! Give the weight

loss a chance,

you'll probably drop several pounds all at once and then you'll be fine. You

know the one thing I've really been wanting is pizza. I've had a real

variety of food so far but I haven't gotten around to the pizza yet.

Everything seems to be sitting real well. I just don't have much of an

appetite. I am really trying not to obsess about what I eat but I think once

I try something I want it satisfies me and I move on to the next food item

to try. My Pokeno group met tonight and I brought my gatorade and watermelon

and passed up the wonderful desserts that the hostess prepared. I was afraid

that if I sampled any I might get sick and I would have to go home.

Hang in there.....it has to get better.

Best Wishes,

Genz

wrote:

> I wasn't being a smart aleck or making any kind of dig about you

> being only two weeks out. You must have missed the previous (long)

> post I wrote, same subject, and the P.S.

>

> The point was that people only seem to crave vegetables during the

> time they are on the liquids. I " craved " vegetables, too,

> during the first 2-3 weeks, especially, when I was on nothing

> but soups, jello, juices.

>

> But I *don't* crave them now that I'm eating real food again.

>

> That was the point. I haven't heard from anybody who " craves "

> vegetables (who didn't crave them before surgery) who craves them

> now, if they are more than a week or so past the stage where they

> were taking nothing but liquids.

>

> Kind regards,

>

> > In a message dated 6/13/2000 12:01:36 AM Eastern Daylight Time,

> > lindat@f... writes:

> >

> > <<

> >

> > Yes, but you should mention you are only about 2 weeks post op,

> too.

> >

> > >>

> > Pee on you! Get off my back what are you 4 weeks out. Gee I

> wasn't

> > trying to take your spot light from the sticks, I was just giving

> my

> 2 cents

> > or didn't you read that part..smarty pants..Geez again

>

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June 13, 2000