Other major difficulties in your life?

[Guest guest]

Its a very scary situation Pam. Especially when you are married!! I

have never had anyone tell me I was beautiful or attractive or sexy

etc. And suddenly I did. You have to really know what you want and

can live with or some one can get hurt....especially you. Just stay

true to who you are and you will find the way to handle the

attention.

Huggles

> > > > First let me state the obvious: this group is

> > > awesome, maybe it

> > > should be made into one of the better reality

> > shows,

> > > ;^P

> > > >

> > > > Among the many things I am experiencing as I

> > start

> > > on this road

> > > and continually evalute all of its turns...

> > > > Do any of you have any other

> > > " " issues/difficulties/whatever you

> > > want to call them " , that are at least as big as

> > the

> > > weight issue???

> > > >

> > > > I guess I'd just like to find out how others

> > > manage this

> > > major " life juggling " , especially when this GB

> > > demands a lot of

> > > attention and life changes.

> > > >

> > > > This is a good day for reflection for me. I'm

> > > going to a memorial

> > > service for the 18 year old son of a co-worker and

> > > friend. He was

> > > recently killed in the park for what appears to be

> > > the fact that he

> > > wore the wrong color T-shirt.

> > > >

> > > > dean

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > ____________________________________________________

> > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page

> > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

> >

> >

>

>

>

>

> ____________________________________________________

> Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page

> http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

[Guest guest]

Robynn asked whether she was answering my question. I was going to make it more specific but I thought I would get a better idea of the other things people are facing if I made it somewhat ambiguous. Indeed, I did. Robynn....I have come to the conclusion you are really 4 people. How do you make the time for all those activities???? <hug>.

And Francisco, how can you keep which day and which guy str8? Boy, I feel like such an underachiever.

Pam B. brought up one of the areas I was thinking about. If anyone knows of a website that would answer some of the questions below, please let me know?

What are the percentages of male/female, married/single, etc. that go through this surgery?

Are there many people who go through GB primarily to change their relationship status? People who want to go into a relationship, people who want to change their current relationship? How many people actually do?

[bTW at the funeral today the priest spoke about the tragedy of our violent society. He had recently transferred from Oakland to this more suburban area. He mentioned that in Oakland he was used to shots and people being killed and his mind just dismissed the shots he heard while holding Mass for a local guy who was shot in Oakland. His mind just considered this as 'normal'. Later he realized that he was in a more suburban area and why should he be hearing shots. The shots turned out to be the ones that killed and another and injured a third.

I lost it when I saw his urn with ashes wrapped in his tiny baptismal gown....

Composure returned and since I have ocassional visits from people who have crossed over, I said to myself ", I know your here and watching. Could you please send me a sign so I can tell your parents... " Within 2 seconds his father who was in the first pew, tripped and fell over. I thanked him and laughed; it was so like him to bug his dad......]

dean

[Guest guest]

Pam, I know your respite time is totally taken up right now with the

meetings and stuff relating to the surgery - but when you said " Kick

it with my son " it jogged a memory loose. . .

I had a friend who had a LOT of issues around attention from men -

hated it! - until she realized that a lot of her issues focussed

around feelings of powerlessness. (She also had weight problems, but

food wasn't her particular way of dealing with her feelings, she used

other equally unhealthy means.) Anyway, one of her ways of overcoming

her " attenion-phobia " was to take steps to feel her own power;

specifically joining classes in kick-boxing and self-defense.

After about six months, she realized that she could beat any of the

men in the class, and she realized that she also didn't feel so

powerless around guys for the first time in her life. She never

needed to DO anything to anyone, but knowing in her gut that she was

strong and capable made a real change in her life.

Don't know if anyone else has had something like this happen, but it

was certainly a healthier way for her to deal with her issues than

trying to numb herself by drinking too much.

Cathy

> and Pam, you both touched on something that I

> too am very frightened about: the attention from men.

> In fact, I think that alot of the reason why I still

> may want the weight is because of this unwanted

> attention.

>

> Although I have always been heavy, I was a

> large-sized model, (many moons and 200 lbs ago!!!),

> and even at 225, I got ALOT of attention. I DID NOT

> LIKE IT!!! I never have liked it. (Kinda wierd that I

> became a model, but it was in front of the camera, or

> on a run-way, not at a bar or store etc where you

> really could be " picked-up " or flirted with.)

> And now that I am single, I am even more scared. I

> am not really sure what to do about this situation,

> but I do like what Pam M said, " keep it real and pray

> for strength " . What I am sure of however, is that I

> want to start feeling good again, (physically!!) and I

> want to have fun and " kick it " with my son. And in

> order to do this, the weight has to come off. So here

> goes.... (I almost feel as if I am holding my breath

> and am about to dive in)

>

> Pam b

[Guest guest]

That's just great, Cathy! Peel the onion and find out why the fear exists. Many of us were molested as children, and so that kind of attention triggers a feeling of fear. Where will this attention stop? Am I safe? Can I trust myself not to be a slut? Can i trust myself to make good decisions? Am I ready for a relationship? Will I be able to carve out my own space for me, if I am with someone else?

These are all questions that need to be explored. And there is nothing wrong with being single forever, if that is what you choose in a healthy state of mind. But, if you choose it (and when i'm saying "you", I'm not referencing anyone in particular) because you are afraid...that is not a healthy choice...and you may be missing out on alot of personal growth and happiness by cocooning yourself away behind the wall of self-protective chub.

And you may be missing out one of the greatest miracles and gifts we've been given: being known and loved. Loving someone else. Sex.

So...figure out why you are afraid, and try to deal with the underlying issues. Don't rob yourself of joy. Learn to take the compliments and attention from men with a grain of salt. After awhile, it isn't so scary. If it is inappropriate attention, learn to set down clear boundaries. You are an adult now, and you can draw the line in the sand...you can decide what is safe for you, and what you will accept from others.

I've shared before that I was molested for 10 years by my former step-father. I hated my body for blossoming at an early age, and I blamed myself. Sexual attention frightened me, and triggered a post-traumatic stress response for a long time. But, at war with the fear was my own natural sexuality which was quite strong. Finally, after getting some therapy, I learned to distinguish between sexual advances from a pervert to a powerless child...and from a normal guy and a powerful woman. There is a difference. One is horrible, and one is quite beautiful and natural.

Now, I enjoy the attentions of men, as long as the man observes appropriate boundaries. What I really appreciated about (my internet love) is that he did not go down the sexual path immediately. He was very respectful, and didn't even ask for my photo for the first few weeks. He let me know that he was interested in ME, and not just as a masturbatory tool for him. And now that we've moved along in the relationship, he is obviously a very sexual being, and he is very sexually interested in me. And I'm great and happy with that. It feels safe and loving, as well as passionate...and I look forward to going to the next step. No fear.

So...it's really about learning your own power (like Cathy so aptly said), and understanding why you feel uncomfortable. And then, by all means...work on it. You deserve love and attention and sex and passion in your life. And all of that can and should be extremely healthy, safe and lovely.

RobynnCathy wrote:

Pam, I know your respite time is totally taken up right now with the meetings and stuff relating to the surgery - but when you said "Kick it with my son" it jogged a memory loose. . .I had a friend who had a LOT of issues around attention from men - hated it! - until she realized that a lot of her issues focussed around feelings of powerlessness. (She also had weight problems, but food wasn't her particular way of dealing with her feelings, she used other equally unhealthy means.) Anyway, one of her ways of overcoming her "attenion-phobia" was to take steps to feel her own power; specifically joining classes in kick-boxing and self-defense. After about six months, she realized that she could beat any of the men in the class, and she realized that she also didn't feel so powerless around guys for the first time in her

life. She never needed to DO anything to anyone, but knowing in her gut that she was strong and capable made a real change in her life.Don't know if anyone else has had something like this happen, but it was certainly a healthier way for her to deal with her issues than trying to numb herself by drinking too much.Cathy> and Pam, you both touched on something that I> too am very frightened about: the attention from men.> In fact, I think that alot of the reason why I still> may want the weight is because of this unwanted> attention.> > Although I have always been heavy, I was a> large-sized model, (many moons and 200 lbs ago!!!),> and even at 225, I got ALOT of attention. I DID NOT> LIKE IT!!! I never have liked it. (Kinda wierd that I>

became a model, but it was in front of the camera, or> on a run-way, not at a bar or store etc where you> really could be "picked-up" or flirted with.)> And now that I am single, I am even more scared. I> am not really sure what to do about this situation,> but I do like what Pam M said, "keep it real and pray> for strength". What I am sure of however, is that I> want to start feeling good again, (physically!!) and I> want to have fun and "kick it" with my son. And in> order to do this, the weight has to come off. So here> goes.... (I almost feel as if I am holding my breath> and am about to dive in)> > Pam b

[Guest guest]

Wow !!!! Don't get me wrong, I have been married for 38 years and

have no intention of starting over. But being called beautiful,

honey and some flirtattious attention would be kind of nice for a

change. Do you think a 61 year old thin person has a chance for that

kind of attention?????

> > > > > First let me state the obvious: this group is

> > > > awesome, maybe it

> > > > should be made into one of the better reality

> > > shows,

> > > > ;^P

> > > > >

> > > > > Among the many things I am experiencing as I

> > > start

> > > > on this road

> > > > and continually evalute all of its turns...

> > > > > Do any of you have any other

> > > > " " issues/difficulties/whatever you

> > > > want to call them " , that are at least as big as

> > > the

> > > > weight issue???

> > > > >

> > > > > I guess I'd just like to find out how others

> > > > manage this

> > > > major " life juggling " , especially when this GB

> > > > demands a lot of

> > > > attention and life changes.

> > > > >

> > > > > This is a good day for reflection for me. I'm

> > > > going to a memorial

> > > > service for the 18 year old son of a co-worker and

> > > > friend. He was

> > > > recently killed in the park for what appears to be

> > > > the fact that he

> > > > wore the wrong color T-shirt.

> > > > >

> > > > > dean

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > ____________________________________________________

> > > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page

> > > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

> > >

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > ____________________________________________________

> > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page

> > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

[Guest guest]

It is really nice, but that attention can lead you to wonder what

else is out there. When it first happened to me I soaked it up like a

dry sponge....but then it scared me. I have been married 24 years as

of this past Monday and the attention I was receiving almost cost me

my marriage. I had to really think about my life and what I wanted.

What I want is my marriage, he is a great man and I love him dearly.

Now he was raised very conservative and not to show emotion. On a

camping trip recently with his brother, Ive learned how harsh and

void of loving attention his childhood was. I asked him(in the midst

of all the attention I was receiving) if he really ever loved me

because he doesnt tell me all the things I was hearing(I didnt tell

him I was hearing it from some one else). He looked like I had

punched him in the stomache. He thought I knew!! He shows me in so

many ways that he does but when I was hearing all the really really

flattering words, I got caught up in the newness of it. I guess what

Im trying to say is that the grass isnt always greener. You really

need to prepare yourself for come ons, attention, whether empty

flattery or true feelings from others and know in advance how you

will handle it. I had absolutely no idea!! No one had ever prepared

me for that part of WLS. They talked pure mechanics...never anything

about the complete emotional turmoil it can cause. I felt like my

entire apple cart had been turned upside down. Things in my marriage

are so much better. Im communicating more with my hubby, tell him

what I need and he is trying. Our sex life has done a complete turn

around...its awesome LOL!!! We are rediscovering each other all over

again and Im so glad I didnt lose him. Just by being aware of it,

you will handle it fine.

Good Luck and Huggles

> > > > > > First let me state the obvious: this group is

> > > > > awesome, maybe it

> > > > > should be made into one of the better reality

> > > > shows,

> > > > > ;^P

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Among the many things I am experiencing as I

> > > > start

> > > > > on this road

> > > > > and continually evalute all of its turns...

> > > > > > Do any of you have any other

> > > > > " " issues/difficulties/whatever you

> > > > > want to call them " , that are at least as big as

> > > > the

> > > > > weight issue???

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I guess I'd just like to find out how others

> > > > > manage this

> > > > > major " life juggling " , especially when this GB

> > > > > demands a lot of

> > > > > attention and life changes.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > This is a good day for reflection for me. I'm

> > > > > going to a memorial

> > > > > service for the 18 year old son of a co-worker and

> > > > > friend. He was

> > > > > recently killed in the park for what appears to be

> > > > > the fact that he

> > > > > wore the wrong color T-shirt.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > dean

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > ____________________________________________________

> > > > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page

> > > > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > ____________________________________________________

> > > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page

> > > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

[Guest guest]

, I second everything you say except there has

not been issues with the marriage. I mean I get hit

on all the time..it is crazy and yes the attentino is

nice and it is overwhelming honey let me tell you. As

a matter of fact, I had shared with Robynn that I had

lunch with this gentleman but it was strictly just

that. Robynn said that is cool but just to be

careful. I felt it was okay because there is not one

thing that I keep fromy husband. If I am having lunch

with another man, he knows about it. The last thing I

want to have happen is for some one to feel they have

to be sprending rumors or telling what I am doing or

not doing. It is better coming straight from me. I

think as long as you know what you have at home then

you won't do anything to mess that up. I mean when

you know what you value its not hard to make the

correct decisions.

is right. They bring it on hard and if you have

not been hearing those things, it makes you wonder.

But I just keep telling myself...its not worth it.

That person has just as many issues if not more as my

husband has it just that this is new and I have not

yet discovered them yet. Smile, be nice/friendly but

don't take it any further than that. If you can't

handle lunch (some times on a blue moon) then don't do

it because pretty soon it will be a movie, dance then

you know what else. At least had enough sense

to say hey...this is not right because she values her

husband...her family and she has self respect.

I hope that helps.

Pam Marsh

--- Diane Duenas brendadiane64@...>

wrote:

> It is really nice, but that attention can lead you

> to wonder what

> else is out there. When it first happened to me I

> soaked it up like a

> dry sponge....but then it scared me. I have been

> married 24 years as

> of this past Monday and the attention I was

> receiving almost cost me

> my marriage. I had to really think about my life and

> what I wanted.

> What I want is my marriage, he is a great man and I

> love him dearly.

> Now he was raised very conservative and not to show

> emotion. On a

> camping trip recently with his brother, Ive learned

> how harsh and

> void of loving attention his childhood was. I asked

> him(in the midst

> of all the attention I was receiving) if he really

> ever loved me

> because he doesnt tell me all the things I was

> hearing(I didnt tell

> him I was hearing it from some one else). He looked

> like I had

> punched him in the stomache. He thought I knew!! He

> shows me in so

> many ways that he does but when I was hearing all

> the really really

> flattering words, I got caught up in the newness of

> it. I guess what

> Im trying to say is that the grass isnt always

> greener. You really

> need to prepare yourself for come ons, attention,

> whether empty

> flattery or true feelings from others and know in

> advance how you

> will handle it. I had absolutely no idea!! No one

> had ever prepared

> me for that part of WLS. They talked pure

> mechanics...never anything

> about the complete emotional turmoil it can cause. I

> felt like my

> entire apple cart had been turned upside down.

> Things in my marriage

> are so much better. Im communicating more with my

> hubby, tell him

> what I need and he is trying. Our sex life has done

> a complete turn

> around...its awesome LOL!!! We are rediscovering

> each other all over

> again and Im so glad I didnt lose him. Just by

> being aware of it,

> you will handle it fine.

>

> Good Luck and Huggles

>

>

>

>

>

> > > > >

> > > > > > WOW Dean...please relay my sympathies and

> thoughts

> > > > > > to the family and

> > > > > > friends!!

>

=== message truncated ===

____________________________________________________

Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page

http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

[Guest guest]

YES Lucia. You are too cute. You just might find

some of those 20/30 something men trying to get at

you.

I told my husband that I keep attracting these 50/60

year old men. I said whats up with that. We both just

chuckled. I am not so sure if I said they were in

their 20s if he would have found it that funny.

Nonetheless, we take it in strides and I aint going

anywhere but it is nice to know that someone finds you

attractive.

Pam Marsh

--- Lucia jlsirugo@...> wrote:

> Wow !!!! Don't get me wrong, I have been married for

> 38 years and

> have no intention of starting over. But being

> called beautiful,

> honey and some flirtattious attention would be kind

> of nice for a

> change. Do you think a 61 year old thin person has a

> chance for that

> kind of attention?????

>

>

>

>

> > > > > > First let me state the obvious: this group

> is

> > > > > awesome, maybe it

> > > > > should be made into one of the better

> reality

> > > > shows,

> > > > > ;^P

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Among the many things I am experiencing as

> I

> > > > start

> > > > > on this road

>

=== message truncated ===

____________________________________________________

Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page

http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

[Guest guest]

Thanks, , for the post. Given my past

experiences with how uncomfortable I was with unwanted

attention, I think that this subject will be, by far,

the most difficult for me to contend with. I just need

to determine the best way for me to handle this...

Pam b

--- Diane Duenas brendadiane64@...>

wrote:

> Its a very scary situation Pam. Especially when you

> are married!! I

> have never had anyone tell me I was beautiful or

> attractive or sexy

> etc. And suddenly I did. You have to really know

> what you want and

> can live with or some one can get hurt....especially

> you. Just stay

> true to who you are and you will find the way to

> handle the

> attention.

>

> Huggles

>

>

>

> > > > > First let me state the obvious: this group

> is

> > > > awesome, maybe it

> > > > should be made into one of the better reality

> > > shows,

> > > > ;^P

> > > > >

> > > > > Among the many things I am experiencing as I

> > > start

> > > > on this road

> > > > and continually evalute all of its turns...

> > > > > Do any of you have any other

> > > > " " issues/difficulties/whatever you

> > > > want to call them " , that are at least as big

> as

> > > the

> > > > weight issue???

> > > > >

> > > > > I guess I'd just like to find out how others

> > > > manage this

> > > > major " life juggling " , especially when this GB

> > > > demands a lot of

> > > > attention and life changes.

> > > > >

> > > > > This is a good day for reflection for me.

> I'm

> > > > going to a memorial

> > > > service for the 18 year old son of a co-worker

> and

> > > > friend. He was

> > > > recently killed in the park for what appears

> to be

> > > > the fact that he

> > > > wore the wrong color T-shirt.

> > > > >

>

=== message truncated ===

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Lucia...take a trip to Europe. European men of all ages were oogling my mom (who granted, is an epic babe...but she's 72). They don't believe that a woman's beauty is unworthy after the age of 21.

The thing you'll discover is that you yourself will become more flirty and direct with others...thereby making yourself open for positive attention. There is nothing wrong with that, as long as you keep it in perspective. It can put a little spring in your step, a sashay in your walk...and a twinkle in your eye.

Besides, with a name like Lucia, I'm sure you are a luscious woman and you'll be getting plenty of attention!!

RobynnLucia wrote:

Wow !!!! Don't get me wrong, I have been married for 38 years and have no intention of starting over. But being called beautiful, honey and some flirtattious attention would be kind of nice for a change. Do you think a 61 year old thin person has a chance for that kind of attention?????> > > > > First let me state the obvious: this group is> > > > awesome, maybe it > > > > should be made into one of the better reality> > > shows,> > > > ;^P> > > > > > > > > > Among the many things I am experiencing as I> > > start> > > > on this road > > > > and continually evalute all of its turns...> > > > > Do any of you have any other> > > > ""issues/difficulties/whatever you > > > > want to call them", that are at least as big as> > > the> > > > weight issue???>

> > > > > > > > > I guess I'd just like to find out how others> > > > manage this > > > > major "life juggling", especially when this GB> > > > demands a lot of > > > > attention and life changes.> > > > > > > > > > This is a good day for reflection for me. I'm> > > > going to a memorial > > > > service for the 18 year old son of a co-worker and> > > > friend. He was > > > > recently killed in the park for what appears to be> > > > the fact that he > > > > wore the wrong color T-shirt.> > > > > > > > > > dean> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > ____________________________________________________> > > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > > > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________> > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

[Guest guest]

Great ideas!! Kaiser does not offer any kind of

psycho-therapy, however, does offer some good groups.

And, I have thought that writing would be a great

outlet for me. Also, I have learned alot about myself

just reading and posting on this group.

Pam b

--- Robynn VanPatten robynnsf@...> wrote:

> The not turning to the food thing is made easier by

> the fact that food doesn't like me much anymore...at

> this point...because I can't eat sugar (that was my

> best friend) or bread. So, the rest is pretty

> uninspiring when you are talking about nurture

> eating. Now, granted...that all could change (and

> probably will change) when the tummy gets all healed

> up and starts to stretch. That's why I'm diong

> everything I can to try and force myself to develop

> more successful coping mechanisms.

>

> For one thing, I'm getting used to saying, " No.

> Nope. Sorry. Can't do it. " without feeling

> guilty. I have to learn how to confront (funny

> thing for a lawyer to say, non?) rather than stuff

> down my feelings with cookies and ice cream.

>

> For another thing, I'm working with a therapist, and

> really confronting my own feelings and issues.

>

> I'm also exercising as a way to deal. And I'm

> talking to friends. And I'm writing.

>

> Basically...I'm trying to get down beneath the

> surface, instead of eating myself into a sugar coma.

>

> And realizing that I have a lot more control of my

> own life and my own reactions than I ever realized I

> had before...well that's been powerful. I don't

> feel so helpless, you know?

>

> Robynn

>

> Pamela florenceboss@...> wrote:

> Robynn, what an inspirational post... (and to think

> that I had difficulties in my life to contend

> with!!)

> Just shows to go ya, not anybody is left unscathed

> in

> this world.

> I can only hope that I can face such adversities

> with the grace that you exhibit once food is no

> longer

> an option...

>

> Pam b

>

> ps Remind me, how do you guys do it without turning

> to

> the food?

>

> --- Robynn VanPatten robynnsf@...> wrote:

>

> > Dean:

> >

> > I think what you are asking is how to you maintain

> > focus on yourself, your weight loss, your

> > health...when you have lots of wolves howling at

> the

> > doors? It's not easy to put ourselves first. Not

> > at all.

> >

> > For me, I do have other difficulties in my life:

> my

> > marriage broke up about 17 months ago, but I am

> > still friends with him, and he wants to be with

> > me...and I don't feel the same. Dealing with the

> > idea of breaking the heart of someone I care about

> > so much is very very tough.

> >

> > While I was losing the pre-surgery weight, I was

> > also dealing with somebody who I had fallen deeply

> > in love with while we were both married to others.

>

> > His life was full of a lot of overwhelming trials

> > (none of them were his fault, save the demise of

> his

> > bad marriage), and I wanted to stick by him...but

> > those trials wound up destroying him, and I had to

> > watch helplessly as he slipped away, more and

> > more...deeper into his shell. I also had to deal

> > with the guilt and pain of being in love with

> > somebody else for three years when I had made a

> vow

> > to love and honor somebody else. This was a

> > horrifically painful trial for me...and moving out

> > was terribly difficult. The man I loved and I

> never

> > had a full-fledged affair while we were married,

> but

> > we were too intimate, and it was inappropriate,

> and

> > it wreaked havoc.

> >

> > He came to see me in March (I had the surgery in

> > June), and in the month following, we both

> realized

> > it wasn't going to work...after four and a half

> > years invested. I had seen this coming for a long

> > time...but it was unbelievably painful to finally

> > confront reality.

> >

> > And then, rather than turning back to my husband

> > (which a large part of me hoped I could/would do),

> I

> > met somebody else...fell madly in love (to my

> shock

> > and surprise), and now I am dealing with a very

> long

> > distance romance (he lives in France),

> contemplating

> > him moving here...thinking about sleeping with a

> new

> > lover post-surgery...worrying about my body and

> skin

> > tone...wondering how painful this is going to be

> for

> > my ex-husband...and floating on air, all at the

> same

> > time.

> >

> > To further complicate matters, Olivier (the other

> > man, who I recently let go of) found out about the

> > new guy, and is now trying to fight for me...but

> > coming out here in September, the month before

>

> > will be here. I hope that I am emotionally

> prepared

> > to handle that...to handle the possibility that he

> > may say all of the words that I longed to hear for

> > such a long time. But, in my heart of hears, I

> know

> > that Olivier is very very damaged, and will never

> be

> > able to give enough. And that, well that...is

> > heartbreaking. See, if things had worked out with

> > Olivier, I could have somehow mentally justified

> > breaking up with my husband. You know...like

> > Olivier was my destiny, and I jsut couldn't fight

> > fate. (Is my destiny? Was Olivier the path

> to

> > ...quite possibly.)

> >

> > On top of that, my dear brother in law, who I

> adore,

> > has cancer. Olivier's mother has cancer. One of

> my

> > dearest friends died unexpectedly from colon

> cancer

> > just a few days before my surgery. was like

> a

> > brother to me, and we'd known each other since the

> > 3rd grade. I went to the funeral two days before

> > the surgery. The day before the surgery, my other

> > closest friend had to terminate a pregnancy that

> she

> > and her husband had been longing for for years due

> > to severe severe genetic deformity. I took her

> > there the day before. It was very emotional and

> > difficult.

> >

> > In the past year, I lost my beloved grandfather,

> who

> > was more of a father figure to me than anything.

> >

> > I also have a very stressful, highly demanding

> > job...and trying to figure out how in the heck I

> was

> > going to be able to leave for a few weeks...well.

> > That was tough.

> >

> > Now, I'm very tired and having a hard time

> adjusting

> > to the workload demand that hasn't diminished at

> all

> > for me during my recovery.

> >

> > My father is on the edge of homelessness, and I've

> > been having to scrape up enough money to pay his

> > rent...even though I am overwhelmed with debt

> > because I felt so guilty when I left that I took

> > nothing except for all of the credit card

> debt...and

> > then I had to rack up more to buy furniture,

> etc...

> >

> > I am the Secretary/Treasurer of an organization I

> > started (Association for the Preservation of

> Afghan

> > Archeology), and the organization is exploding

> right

> > now...and I'm trying to find the time/energy to

> stay

> > on top of it all.

> >

> > My new love, even though he is conveniently

> located

> > 6,000 miles a day, requires a lot of attention (as

> > do I.) So, we talk for a couple of hours every

> > day...even more on weekends...and my head is

> > frequently off with him.

>

=== message truncated ===

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Very interesting... perhaps this might be something I

should try as well...

Pam b

--- Cathy catic15@...> wrote:

> Pam, I know your respite time is totally taken up

> right now with the

> meetings and stuff relating to the surgery - but

> when you said " Kick

> it with my son " it jogged a memory loose. . .

>

> I had a friend who had a LOT of issues around

> attention from men -

> hated it! - until she realized that a lot of her

> issues focussed

> around feelings of powerlessness. (She also had

> weight problems, but

> food wasn't her particular way of dealing with her

> feelings, she used

> other equally unhealthy means.) Anyway, one of her

> ways of overcoming

> her " attenion-phobia " was to take steps to feel her

> own power;

> specifically joining classes in kick-boxing and

> self-defense.

>

> After about six months, she realized that she could

> beat any of the

> men in the class, and she realized that she also

> didn't feel so

> powerless around guys for the first time in her

> life. She never

> needed to DO anything to anyone, but knowing in her

> gut that she was

> strong and capable made a real change in her life.

>

> Don't know if anyone else has had something like

> this happen, but it

> was certainly a healthier way for her to deal with

> her issues than

> trying to numb herself by drinking too much.

>

> Cathy

>

> > and Pam, you both touched on something that

> I

> > too am very frightened about: the attention from

> men.

> > In fact, I think that alot of the reason why I

> still

> > may want the weight is because of this unwanted

> > attention.

> >

> > Although I have always been heavy, I was a

> > large-sized model, (many moons and 200 lbs

> ago!!!),

> > and even at 225, I got ALOT of attention. I DID

> NOT

> > LIKE IT!!! I never have liked it. (Kinda wierd

> that I

> > became a model, but it was in front of the camera,

> or

> > on a run-way, not at a bar or store etc where you

> > really could be " picked-up " or flirted with.)

> > And now that I am single, I am even more scared.

> I

> > am not really sure what to do about this

> situation,

> > but I do like what Pam M said, " keep it real and

> pray

> > for strength " . What I am sure of however, is that

> I

> > want to start feeling good again, (physically!!)

> and I

> > want to have fun and " kick it " with my son. And in

> > order to do this, the weight has to come off. So

> here

> > goes.... (I almost feel as if I am holding my

> breath

> > and am about to dive in)

> >

> > Pam b

>

>

>

____________________________________________________

Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page

http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

[Guest guest]

Thank you Pam

You are right I value and love my husband and family more than

anything in the world and I do not want to ever jeopordize losing

them.

Huggles

> > > > > >

> > > > > > > WOW Dean...please relay my sympathies and

> > thoughts

> > > > > > > to the family and

> > > > > > > friends!!

> >

> === message truncated ===

>

>

>

>

> ____________________________________________________

> Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page

> http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

[Guest guest]

Absolutely!!

--- Lucia jlsirugo@...> wrote:

> Wow !!!! Don't get me wrong, I have been married for

> 38 years and

> have no intention of starting over. But being

> called beautiful,

> honey and some flirtattious attention would be kind

> of nice for a

> change. Do you think a 61 year old thin person has a

> chance for that

> kind of attention?????

>

>

>

>

> > > > > > First let me state the obvious: this group

> is

> > > > > awesome, maybe it

> > > > > should be made into one of the better

> reality

> > > > shows,

> > > > > ;^P

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Among the many things I am experiencing as

> I

> > > > start

> > > > > on this road

>

=== message truncated ===

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

I still think that it would be such a great idea if we

could meet for some sort of support group re this

subject...

Pam b

--- Diane Duenas brendadiane64@...>

wrote:

> It is really nice, but that attention can lead you

> to wonder what

> else is out there. When it first happened to me I

> soaked it up like a

> dry sponge....but then it scared me. I have been

> married 24 years as

> of this past Monday and the attention I was

> receiving almost cost me

> my marriage. I had to really think about my life and

> what I wanted.

> What I want is my marriage, he is a great man and I

> love him dearly.

> Now he was raised very conservative and not to show

> emotion. On a

> camping trip recently with his brother, Ive learned

> how harsh and

> void of loving attention his childhood was. I asked

> him(in the midst

> of all the attention I was receiving) if he really

> ever loved me

> because he doesnt tell me all the things I was

> hearing(I didnt tell

> him I was hearing it from some one else). He looked

> like I had

> punched him in the stomache. He thought I knew!! He

> shows me in so

> many ways that he does but when I was hearing all

> the really really

> flattering words, I got caught up in the newness of

> it. I guess what

> Im trying to say is that the grass isnt always

> greener. You really

> need to prepare yourself for come ons, attention,

> whether empty

> flattery or true feelings from others and know in

> advance how you

> will handle it. I had absolutely no idea!! No one

> had ever prepared

> me for that part of WLS. They talked pure

> mechanics...never anything

> about the complete emotional turmoil it can cause. I

> felt like my

> entire apple cart had been turned upside down.

> Things in my marriage

> are so much better. Im communicating more with my

> hubby, tell him

> what I need and he is trying. Our sex life has done

> a complete turn

> around...its awesome LOL!!! We are rediscovering

> each other all over

> again and Im so glad I didnt lose him. Just by

> being aware of it,

> you will handle it fine.

>

> Good Luck and Huggles

>

>

>

>

>

> > > > >

> > > > > > WOW Dean...please relay my sympathies and

> thoughts

> > > > > > to the family and

> > > > > > friends!!

>

=== message truncated ===

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

A sugar coma sounds so good right about now...

Laurie

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Thank you for the invitation, Robynn, but 1) SF is too

far for me to travel given my circumstances at home,

and 2) the idea of having to ask permission before

being allowed to attend kinda turns me off just a

little. But I do think that it's great that you

" posties " will have a meeting of your own, though!

I am sure that " Posties " have circumstance all their

own that we " Premies " would not understand until we

are there ourselves.

I would love to see a group get started here in the

Valley that deals with issues that some women deal

with re relationships/sex/attraction/attention, etc

during the WLS process and following WLS. (For both

pre and post-ops) I don't know if anyone out there

would be interested in that type of thing, but if so,

please let me know! I would be more than happy to have

the meeting at my home if space were to be an issue.

Anyway, I don't know if anyone would be interested,

but thought it would be worthwhile to inquire...

And much luck to you and Francisco on your new

group. Pardon the redundancy, but again, I think it a

superb idea to touch on the many changes that occur

following WLS!

Pam b

--- Robynn VanPatten robynnsf@...> wrote:

> Pam B: Please see the announcement I sent out today

> about the support group that Francisco and I are

> starting in SF. That will be one of the discussion

> topics. If that is of special interest to some of

> you pre-ops, you can approach us beforehand on the

> issue, and we can include you for that specific

> meeting.

>

> Robynn

>

> Pamela florenceboss@...> wrote:

> Robynn, You touched on alot of feelings today. I am

> so

> very uncomfortable with attention, but am unsure as

> to

> why.... at any rate, wouldn't it be great if those

> of

> us, (women) who are traveling down the path of WLS

> and

> are scared of the attention that we will someday

> soon

> be getting (or perhaps already receiving), could

> meet

> and discuss the topic? Just a thought....

>

> Pam b

>

> --- Robynn VanPatten robynnsf@...> wrote:

>

> > That's just great, Cathy! Peel the onion and find

> > out why the fear exists. Many of us were molested

> > as children, and so that kind of attention

> triggers

> > a feeling of fear. Where will this attention

> stop?

> > Am I safe? Can I trust myself not to be a slut?

> > Can i trust myself to make good decisions? Am I

> > ready for a relationship? Will I be able to carve

> > out my own space for me, if I am with someone

> else?

> >

> > These are all questions that need to be explored.

> > And there is nothing wrong with being single

> > forever, if that is what you choose in a healthy

> > state of mind. But, if you choose it (and when

> i'm

> > saying " you " , I'm not referencing anyone in

> > particular) because you are afraid...that is not a

> > healthy choice...and you may be missing out on

> alot

> > of personal growth and happiness by cocooning

> > yourself away behind the wall of self-protective

> > chub.

> >

> > And you may be missing out one of the greatest

> > miracles and gifts we've been given: being known

> and

> > loved. Loving someone else. Sex.

> >

> > So...figure out why you are afraid, and try to

> deal

> > with the underlying issues. Don't rob yourself of

> > joy. Learn to take the compliments and attention

> > from men with a grain of salt. After awhile, it

> > isn't so scary. If it is inappropriate attention,

> > learn to set down clear boundaries. You are an

> > adult now, and you can draw the line in the

> > sand...you can decide what is safe for you, and

> what

> > you will accept from others.

> >

> > I've shared before that I was molested for 10

> years

> > by my former step-father. I hated my body for

> > blossoming at an early age, and I blamed myself.

> > Sexual attention frightened me, and triggered a

> > post-traumatic stress response for a long time.

> > But, at war with the fear was my own natural

> > sexuality which was quite strong. Finally, after

> > getting some therapy, I learned to distinguish

> > between sexual advances from a pervert to a

> > powerless child...and from a normal guy and a

> > powerful woman. There is a difference. One is

> > horrible, and one is quite beautiful and natural.

> >

> > Now, I enjoy the attentions of men, as long as the

> > man observes appropriate boundaries. What I

> really

> > appreciated about (my internet love) is that

> he

> > did not go down the sexual path immediately. He

> was

> > very respectful, and didn't even ask for my photo

> > for the first few weeks. He let me know that he

> was

> > interested in ME, and not just as a masturbatory

> > tool for him. And now that we've moved along in

> the

> > relationship, he is obviously a very sexual being,

> > and he is very sexually interested in me. And I'm

> > great and happy with that. It feels safe and

> > loving, as well as passionate...and I look forward

> > to going to the next step. No fear.

> >

> > So...it's really about learning your own power

> (like

> > Cathy so aptly said), and understanding why you

> feel

> > uncomfortable. And then, by all means...work on

> it.

> > You deserve love and attention and sex and

> passion

> > in your life. And all of that can and should be

> > extremely healthy, safe and lovely.

> >

> > Robynn

> >

> > Cathy catic15@...> wrote:

> > Pam, I know your respite time is totally taken up

> > right now with the

> > meetings and stuff relating to the surgery - but

> > when you said " Kick

> > it with my son " it jogged a memory loose. . .

> >

> > I had a friend who had a LOT of issues around

> > attention from men -

> > hated it! - until she realized that a lot of her

> > issues focussed

> > around feelings of powerlessness. (She also had

> > weight problems, but

> > food wasn't her particular way of dealing with her

> > feelings, she used

> > other equally unhealthy means.) Anyway, one of her

> > ways of overcoming

> > her " attenion-phobia " was to take steps to feel

> her

> > own power;

> > specifically joining classes in kick-boxing and

> > self-defense.

> >

> > After about six months, she realized that she

> could

> > beat any of the

> > men in the class, and she realized that she also

> > didn't feel so

> > powerless around guys for the first time in her

> > life. She never

> > needed to DO anything to anyone, but knowing in

> her

> > gut that she was

> > strong and capable made a real change in her life.

> >

> > Don't know if anyone else has had something like

> > this happen, but it

> > was certainly a healthier way for her to deal with

> > her issues than

> > trying to numb herself by drinking too much.

> >

> > Cathy

> >

> > > and Pam, you both touched on something

> that

> > I

> > > too am very frightened about: the attention from

> > men.

> > > In fact, I think that alot of the reason why I

> > still

> > > may want the weight is because of this unwanted

> > > attention.

> > >

> > > Although I have always been heavy, I was a

> > > large-sized model, (many moons and 200 lbs

> > ago!!!),

> > > and even at 225, I got ALOT of attention. I DID

> > NOT

> > > LIKE IT!!! I never have liked it. (Kinda wierd

> > that I

> > > became a model, but it was in front of the

> camera,

> > or

> > > on a run-way, not at a bar or store etc where

> you

> > > really could be " picked-up " or flirted with.)

> > > And now that I am single, I am even more

> scared.

> > I

> > > am not really sure what to do about this

> > situation,

> > > but I do like what Pam M said, " keep it real and

> > pray

> > > for strength " . What I am sure of however, is

> that

> > I

> > > want to start feeling good again, (physically!!)

> > and I

> > > want to have fun and " kick it " with my son. And

> in

>

=== message truncated ===

____________________________________________________

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