Self Healing Colitis and Crohns- Klein

[Guest guest]

Hi,

Does anyone have any experience with this Book and diet? I see that it is all

vegan and animal meats are " bad " .

I can't see myself trying this or anything more restrictive than SCD. Giving up

bread was the hardest with SCD and I am not giving up meat and chicken. But Dr

Klein claims a 100% success rate and a quick cure time of 2 months but looks

like you are expected to follow the diet for life to maintain results.

Just curious of any experience or opinions on this?

Thanks

K.

[Guest guest]

Does anyone have any experience with this Book and diet? Do I ever!! I went on this diet around Christmas last year. I followed his book exactly, but ended up getting down to 83 lbs. I also ended up in an ambulance to the hospital because of dehydration from so much D, and whacked electrolyte levels. Apparently I was on the verge of a seizure.On the upside, my SED rate was way down and there was no B or cramping! =)I think for me, that diet was too much too soon, and just not what my body needed at the time. This is getting a bit off topic, but I just read in "Green for Life" that people who were on the raw diet that were loosing too much weight added green smoothies to their diet and gained all their weight back..these people didn't necessarily have IBD, but I thought it was interesting. I think the diet of only fruit that Klein suggests is lacking in protein and many other nutrients that can be found abundantly in greens.Right now, I'm trying to stay middle of the road. I incorporate my raw foods through green smoothies, which are doing wonders for healing my colon, but are still easily digested since they're very blended. So while I do believe the raw diet can be very healthy, I think Klein's protocol was just not right for me, and could be improved upon. Peace =)Alyssa 15 yoUC April 2008, dx Sept 2008SCD June 2009 (restarted)No meds!

[Guest guest]

I haven't read it but I'm vegetarian scd. It was actually WAY easier to give up

meat than I thought it would be. Certainly easier than giving up bread &

chocolate!! I don't regret the decision at all...well...except that now I

think I eat too much cheese . I don't miss it, I feel healthier and more

ecologically responsible without it. I'm kind of curious about the book now. I

think I scanned it briefly a few years ago but I was really looking for

cookbooks at the time so I didn't pay too much attention. Perhaps I'll go find

it again and let you know how I feel (if I end up trying it out).

Being expected to follow that diet for life, for me, wouldn't really be any

different from SCD since I " mini flare " every month so I've never even come

close to reaching the " 1 year symptom free " mark. Sad .

Stacey

>

> Hi,

>

> Does anyone have any experience with this Book and diet? I see that it is all

vegan and animal meats are " bad " .

>

> I can't see myself trying this or anything more restrictive than SCD. Giving

up bread was the hardest with SCD and I am not giving up meat and chicken. But

Dr Klein claims a 100% success rate and a quick cure time of 2 months but looks

like you are expected to follow the diet for life to maintain results.

>

> Just curious of any experience or opinions on this?

>

> Thanks

>

> K.

>

[Guest guest]

>

> Hi,

>

> Does anyone have any experience with this Book and diet? I see that it is all

vegan and animal meats are " bad " .

>

> I can't see myself trying this or anything more restrictive than SCD. Giving

up bread was the hardest with SCD and I am not giving up meat and chicken. But

Dr Klein claims a 100% success rate and a quick cure time of 2 months but looks

like you are expected to follow the diet for life to maintain results.

>

> Just curious of any experience or opinions on this?

>

> Thanks

>

> K.

>Hi K. I also have some experience and some pretty strong opinions about this.

My husband, children and I were vegan for almost a year. During this time I had

a reaction to Humira and went off all meds. So, looking for alternative

treatments I found the Klein book and tried it. I didn't think it would be

hard to do since i was already vegan. I don't remember exactly what I was eating

on the diet except for a LOT of cantaloupe. I don't remember how long I stayed

on it for, but I know it wasn't very long because I ended up feeling so starved

and weak and it did not help clear D. I went back to eating cooked food(still

vegan) for a few more months and then started having more Crohn's symptoms(I

think the Humira finally got out of my system) as well as some other symptoms I

attribute to veganism. I lost a lot of weight(also due to Crohn's), was very

weak, light headed, my hair was falling out and my teeth were losing enamel and

gaining cavities. My husband also lost weight, which was good for him, but my

children were the ones who really suffered. I totally regret making them eat

vegan. My oldest son ended up looking

so emaciated with sunken eyes. My daughter lost weight, and my youngest son has

no enamel on his front teeth and I have a hard time getting him to eat meat now-

because he was still baby and hadn't eaten much of it when we went vegan. I was

also having intense cravings for meat and fish after having no desire for it

since going vegan. I had to convince my husband that we all needed to eat meat

again. I looked online and discovered that there is quite a large community of

ex-vegans and vegetarians who ended up having health problems because of their

diet. After just a few days of eating animal products again my children glowed.

They all gained some weight and are now(except for my little one's teeth) very

healthy. I've since done a lot of reading about nutrition and have come to the

opinion that while some people can do well for a time without animal products,

human beings have and always will need animal fats to survive. Even Ghandi ended

up having to add goat's milk to his diet after his health suffered from

veganism. If you want more info - check out a book called Nourishing Traditions

by Sally Fallon. Anything by or about Weston A. Price' s research is very

interesting, eye-opening, and what Nourishing Tradition's is based on. Also, the

Weston A. Price Foundation has a website, westonaprice.org. I honestly worry

about Klein and don't think he will be able to continue his diet for life.

I do think a raw vegan diet can and does help people overcome illnesses. I don't

think it can be continued healthfully for life, though, nor do I think it's the

best diet to overcome digestive disorders. The SCD, in my opinion, makes much

more sense.

Hope this helps. Sorry if I come across as very opinionated, but after seeing my

children suffer, and feeling horribly guilty for it, I think I have a good

reason to feel this way. I wouldn't want anyone else to suffer like we did

because I kept my opinion to myself.

[Guest guest]

What is a green smoothie? I can't imagine eating raw fruit right now!!! I would live on the toilet! I am just curious. I think a green smoothie might be something for later. I always feel better when I am able to eat the greens. I believe it is essential.

Subject: Re: Self Healing Colitis and Crohns- KleinTo: BTVC-SCD Date: Monday, November 2, 2009, 3:53 PM

Does anyone have any experience with this Book and diet?

Do I ever!! I went on this diet around Christmas last year. I followed his book exactly, but ended up getting down to 83 lbs. I also ended up in an ambulance to the hospital because of dehydration from so much D, and whacked electrolyte levels. Apparently I was on the verge of a seizure.

On the upside, my SED rate was way down and there was no B or cramping! =)

I think for me, that diet was too much too soon, and just not what my body needed at the time. This is getting a bit off topic, but I just read in "Green for Life" that people who were on the raw diet that were loosing too much weight added green smoothies to their diet and gained all their weight back..these people didn't necessarily have IBD, but I thought it was interesting. I think the diet of only fruit that Klein suggests is lacking in protein and many other nutrients that can be found abundantly in greens.

Right now, I'm trying to stay middle of the road. I incorporate my raw foods through green smoothies, which are doing wonders for healing my colon, but are still easily digested since they're very blended.

So while I do believe the raw diet can be very healthy, I think Klein's protocol was just not right for me, and could be improved upon.

Peace =)

Alyssa 15 yo

UC April 2008, dx Sept 2008

SCD June 2009 (restarted)

No meds!

[Guest guest]

I lost a lot of weight(also due to Crohn's), was very weak, light headed, my hair was falling out and my teeth were losing enamel and gaining cavities. My husband also lost weight, which was good for him, but my children were the ones who really suffered. I totally regret making them eat vegan. My oldest son ended up lookingso emaciated with sunken eyes. I've heard this from a lot of people on raw vegan diets, but here's the amazing thing..In "Green for Life" (yeah I know, that book again) Boutenko tells how her whole family had severe health issues, so she transferred them all to raw vegan diets to heal them. For about a year or two, all their health problems improved drastically or vanished, and they felt great. Then they started declining; no change in their diets, but many (maybe all, I don't remember) of the symptoms you mention above began showing up in her and her family. After searching frantically for the answer, she finally came up with (you guessed it) GREEN SMOOTHIES!! Woot =) Long story short, her family started drinking green smoothies in addition to their raw vegan diet, the above symptoms vanished, and they returned to glowing health.Her conclusion is that emphasis on greens is missing from the raw vegan diet, and they contain vital nutrients that our bodies don't get from other raw vegan foods. And while eating greens in salads and such is great, many people don't chew them thoroughly enough and the cellulose is left unbroken. Also, I've found that I go through many more greens much easier in a green smoothie than I ever would in a salad. Peace =)Alyssa 15 yoUC April 2008, dx Sept 2008SCD June 2009 (restarted)No meds!

[Guest guest]

I can't imagine eating raw fruit right now!!! I would live on the toilet! Lol =) Actually I can't either, but I can imagine drinking them =) I think there's a big difference between drinking liquefied raw fruits and veggies and chewing them up. I'm too scared to eat anything raw except for banana, but I'll happily drink it after my lovely Blentec has pre-digested it for me! I hope you can tolerate green smoothies one day too! Peace =)Alyssa 15 yoUC April 2008, dx Sept 2008SCD June 2009 (restarted)No meds!

[Guest guest]

>

> > I lost a lot of weight(also due to Crohn's), was very weak, light

> > headed, my hair was falling out and my teeth were losing enamel and

> > gaining cavities. My husband also lost weight, which was good for

> > him, but my children were the ones who really suffered. I totally

> > regret making them eat vegan. My oldest son ended up looking

> > so emaciated with sunken eyes.

>

>

> I've heard this from a lot of people on raw vegan diets, but here's

> the amazing thing..

>

> In " Green for Life " (yeah I know, that book again) Boutenko

> tells how her whole family had severe health issues, so she

> transferred them all to raw vegan diets to heal them. For about a year

> or two, all their health problems improved drastically or vanished,

> and they felt great. Then they started declining; no change in their

> diets, but many (maybe all, I don't remember) of the symptoms you

> mention above began showing up in her and her family.

>

> After searching frantically for the answer, she finally came up with

> (you guessed it) GREEN SMOOTHIES!! Woot =) Long story short, her

> family started drinking green smoothies in addition to their raw vegan

> diet, the above symptoms vanished, and they returned to glowing health.

>

> Her conclusion is that emphasis on greens is missing from the raw

> vegan diet, and they contain vital nutrients that our bodies don't get

> from other raw vegan foods. And while eating greens in salads and such

> is great, many people don't chew them thoroughly enough and the

> cellulose is left unbroken. Also, I've found that I go through many

> more greens much easier in a green smoothie than I ever would in a

> salad.

>

> Peace =)

> Alyssa 15 yo

> UC April 2008, dx Sept 2008

> SCD June 2009 (restarted)

> No meds!

>

Hi Alyssa! I have a book by Boutenko called " Raw for Life. " I totally

agree that green smoothies are awesome! They taste really delicious, too. You've

got me craving one, though I know I couldn't tolerate it yet. I'll definitely be

drinking them in the future. But I also want to add that while green smoothies

are really good for you, in my opinion, they are still no substitute for animal

fats.

I also just wanted to say that you strike me as a very intelligent young woman.

It sounds like you've chosen to educate yourself about your health and

nutrition, and I find that very commendable for someone your age. I was

diagnosed with Crohn's when I was 16. I wish I had educated myself about this

stuff then, instead of just listening to the doctors.

[Guest guest]

Note - if you incorporate green smoothies into your diet, great! BUT be sure to

vary the greens that you're using, otherwise you're likely to have slightly

toxic side effects. I don't say this in order to steer anyone away from them,

quite the opposite in fact! But I thought that people should know that you need

variety in the greens in order to keep it healthy.

From what I've read and experienced (my own and friend's experiences) I think

vegan is the healthiest way to live *when done right* (because let's face it,

ANY diet can be unhealthy). I'm not there yet (read: cheese addict! )but I'm

a step in the right direction. Seems like a really odd reaction to being vegan.

My bf, for example, has been vegan for over 5 years and he's never been

healthier (weight maintained, hair is great albeit too long for my liking ,

never has any dental problems and tons of energy). He went raw vegan for a

while and actually felt like he had a little *too much* energy! Everyone is

different I suppose.

Stacey

>

> > I lost a lot of weight(also due to Crohn's), was very weak, light

> > headed, my hair was falling out and my teeth were losing enamel and

> > gaining cavities. My husband also lost weight, which was good for

> > him, but my children were the ones who really suffered. I totally

> > regret making them eat vegan. My oldest son ended up looking

> > so emaciated with sunken eyes.

>

>

> I've heard this from a lot of people on raw vegan diets, but here's

> the amazing thing..

>

> In " Green for Life " (yeah I know, that book again) Boutenko

> tells how her whole family had severe health issues, so she

> transferred them all to raw vegan diets to heal them. For about a year

> or two, all their health problems improved drastically or vanished,

> and they felt great. Then they started declining; no change in their

> diets, but many (maybe all, I don't remember) of the symptoms you

> mention above began showing up in her and her family.

>

> After searching frantically for the answer, she finally came up with

> (you guessed it) GREEN SMOOTHIES!! Woot =) Long story short, her

> family started drinking green smoothies in addition to their raw vegan

> diet, the above symptoms vanished, and they returned to glowing health.

>

> Her conclusion is that emphasis on greens is missing from the raw

> vegan diet, and they contain vital nutrients that our bodies don't get

> from other raw vegan foods. And while eating greens in salads and such

> is great, many people don't chew them thoroughly enough and the

> cellulose is left unbroken. Also, I've found that I go through many

> more greens much easier in a green smoothie than I ever would in a

> salad.

>

> Peace =)

> Alyssa 15 yo

> UC April 2008, dx Sept 2008

> SCD June 2009 (restarted)

> No meds!

>

[Guest guest]

At 10:03 PM 11/2/2009, you wrote:

I think there's a big difference

between drinking liquefied raw fruits and veggies and chewing them up.

Depends on the person.

I did not tolerate much in the way of fruits, cooked or raw, for a very

long time. And then I only tolerated them in conjunction with plenty of

protein and fat.

—

Marilyn

New

Orleans, Louisiana, USA

Undiagnosed IBS since 1976, SCD since 2001

Darn Good SCD Cook

No Human Children

Shadow & Sunny Longhair Dachshund

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

Thank you for sharing your experiences. Sorry for the pain you and your Family went through, while I respect that Klein might work for some I see comments here about weight loss and problems on this diet that would be my main concern. I would only try it if SCD stopped working and my Crohns symptoms were so bad that I would have "nothing to lose" by trying it.

So far I still have not gained weight back (lost 30lbs since 7/08) on SCD (since 8/6/09) but this week I am feeling much better and think the 2-3 month flare is behind me. Now my appetite is coming back so strong and I am always hungry. I am eating a lot more steak and chicken to try to "fill up"! Usually served with cooked carrots basted in butter and honey!

Be Well.

K.

Subject: Re: Self Healing Colitis and Crohns- KleinTo: BTVC-SCD Date: Monday, November 2, 2009, 7:55 PM

>> Hi,> > Does anyone have any experience with this Book and diet? I see that it is all vegan and animal meats are "bad".> > I can't see myself trying this or anything more restrictive than SCD. Giving up bread was the hardest with SCD and I am not giving up meat and chicken. But Dr Klein claims a 100% success rate and a quick cure time of 2 months but looks like you are expected to follow the diet for life to maintain results. > > Just curious of any experience or opinions on this?> > Thanks> > K.>Hi K. I also have some experience and some pretty strong opinions about this. My husband, children and I were vegan for almost a

year. During this time I had a reaction to Humira and went off all meds. So, looking for alternative treatments I found the Klein book and tried it. I didn't think it would be hard to do since i was already vegan. I don't remember exactly what I was eating on the diet except for a LOT of cantaloupe. I don't remember how long I stayed on it for, but I know it wasn't very long because I ended up feeling so starved and weak and it did not help clear D. I went back to eating cooked food(still vegan) for a few more months and then started having more Crohn's symptoms(I think the Humira finally got out of my system) as well as some other symptoms I attribute to veganism. I lost a lot of weight(also due to Crohn's), was very weak, light headed, my hair was falling out and my teeth were losing enamel and gaining cavities. My husband also lost weight, which was good for him, but my children were the ones who really suffered. I totally regret making them

eat vegan. My oldest son ended up lookingso emaciated with sunken eyes. My daughter lost weight, and my youngest son has no enamel on his front teeth and I have a hard time getting him to eat meat now- because he was still baby and hadn't eaten much of it when we went vegan. I was also having intense cravings for meat and fish after having no desire for it since going vegan. I had to convince my husband that we all needed to eat meat again. I looked online and discovered that there is quite a large community of ex-vegans and vegetarians who ended up having health problems because of their diet. After just a few days of eating animal products again my children glowed. They all gained some weight and are now(except for my little one's teeth) very healthy. I've since done a lot of reading about nutrition and have come to the opinion that while some people can do well for a time without animal products, human beings have and always will need animal fats

to survive. Even Ghandi ended up having to add goat's milk to his diet after his health suffered from veganism. If you want more info - check out a book called Nourishing Traditions by Sally Fallon. Anything by or about Weston A. Price' s research is very interesting, eye-opening, and what Nourishing Tradition's is based on. Also, the Weston A. Price Foundation has a website, westonaprice. org. I honestly worry about Klein and don't think he will be able to continue his diet for life. I do think a raw vegan diet can and does help people overcome illnesses. I don't think it can be continued healthfully for life, though, nor do I think it's the best diet to overcome digestive disorders. The SCD, in my opinion, makes much more sense.Hope this helps. Sorry if I come across as very opinionated, but after seeing my children suffer, and feeling horribly guilty for it, I think I have a good reason to feel this way. I wouldn't want anyone else to

suffer like we did because I kept my opinion to myself.

[Guest guest]

Note - if you incorporate green smoothies into your diet, great! BUT be sure to vary the greens that you're using, otherwise you're likely to have slightly toxic side effects. Here's an interesting article on this note: http://debbietookrawforlife.blogspot.com/2009/04/spinach-and-oxalate-acid-thing.html Peace =)Alyssa 15 yoUC April 2008, dx Sept 2008SCD June 2009 (restarted)No meds!

[Guest guest]

> Hi,

>

> Does anyone have any experience with this Book and diet? I see

that it is all vegan and animal meats are " bad " .

>

> I can't see myself trying this or anything more restrictive than

SCD. Giving up bread was the hardest with SCD and I am not giving up

meat and chicken. But Dr Klein claims a 100% success rate and a quick

cure time of 2 months but looks like you are expected to follow the

diet for life to maintain results.

I have a hard time believing a diet this restrictive is good for

anyone, except maybe a few weeks or something as cleansing.

My IBS etc hit me suddenly 27 years ago after a very bad flu, and

have never gone away. I've only gotten smarter as time has gone on

about what I can and cannot eat, with SCD deleting the rice a few months ago.

When I had this dramatic start to my illnesses, I lost whole

categories of food: all animal products, fish, dairy, eggs, gluten,

and this pitched me immediatley into vegetarianism. This was fine for

awhile (or so I thought). I like red beans and rice, black-eyed peas

and cornbread (you can tell where my parents grew up, can't you?),

etc. But after several years I could no longer handle legumes and I

lost corn as well. I had nearly 20 years with only fruits and

veggies and rice and for some of it, potatoes. I really could barely

stagger across the room. I was a subset of vegan at this point and

was miserable. I had NO energy at all. And had to deal with moving,

the deaths of several of our parents, etc. I finally had a treatment

that helped the leaky gut enough that very slowly, in baby steps, I

was able to get chicken/turkey back in small quantities. At first I

was munching on the cartiledge and gristle and everything and I am

sure I was terribly deficient (wish I'd know about our broth then!).

Anyhow, having been on pretty close to what I understand this diet to

be, I really don't think it's a good idea. And I am one who gets

along fine with a lot of fresh and raw fruits and veggies. Too many

things missing. It reminds me a bit of a Fruitarian diet I read

about ages ago. They were sort of airy in concept, that we should all

get back to nature and have a diet as close to just plucking fruit

off the trees as possible. I remember they said if you got hungry,

OK, just eat a pound of dates or something -- oh, sure, and spend

the next three days in the bathroom!

I think SCD is a lot better. We DON'T need the illegal carbs. We do

need other stuff than what vegan allows.

[Guest guest]

Hm. That sounds awfully familiar. It's something I thought before starting

SCD!

Stacey

>

> I have a hard time believing a diet this restrictive is good for

> anyone, except maybe a few weeks or something as cleansing.