Surgeon Selection..misinformation..Pre-ops...TOm.

[Guest guest]

I understand that Dr Ren and were trained during their

fellowships. This is post residency and lasts a year generally. Some

hospitals may offer 2 year fellowships. Important distinction.

in Seattle

----- Original Message -----

>

> DS Dr.s: Dr. Keshishian, Dr. Lutrzykowski, Dr. Ren,

> and Dr. are the only DS Doctors who

> actually where trained in their residency to do this

> surgery. Long term 5+ years. Most other bariatric

> doctors go to another surgeon's surgery for a

> day or two maybe a week or two and then they go back

> and start on patients.

[Guest guest]

Hello Janice:

> FYI..........Sure wish people would not comment on

> " whether or not the surgeon even knows how to do the

> DS without " without any knowledge.....

The questioner indicated that he/she didn't know anything about this

doctor. I replied, " Be very careful before you agree to be

somebody's little " experiment " in performing the DS. It's a very

complex operation, and takes quite a bit of skill and practice to do

it well. " In other words, before you choose this or any other doc,

do your research.

HOW CAN YOU POSSIBLY FIND FAULT WITH THIS ADVICE?

> 1----Read each Doctors Information/Bio on the DS

> site....very informative

Not really. Actually QUITE minimal. But a good starting point

nonetheless.

> 2----Check them out professionally.....licensing

> agencies, state boards,,,,,etc

Couldn't find the doc referred to at the American Society for

Bariatric Surgery or the American College of Surgeons. Given that

the info was for somebody else, and I think we are all responsible

for researching our own docs, I stopped there. So shoot me.

> 3-----Talk to their ACTUAL PATIENTS....or people who

> know their patients and can connect you.

Not good advice, IMHO. All we patients really know about our doc

from personal experience is whether he/she is a nice person and

whether we survived the surgery. Not much info on which to base a

life or death decision.

> 4----e-mail them...talk to them....consult with

> them....and research, research, research !

Gee, now you're paraphrasing me!

> Would be great if we could really try not to give out

> bad advice and insult Doctors we havent even

> researched on the DS Site.....

1. Unless you consider not choosing a doctor about whom one knows

nothing to be bad advice, then I didn't give any bad advice.

2. Since when is saying that I don't know if this guy is any good or

not an insult?

3. I researched the doc in question on the DS site and beyond.

> (Dr. Lutrzykowski...and

> NO...HE IS NOT MY Doctor...just hate that

> misinformation is given out here....He does know what

> a DS is !!!!)......

What insults and what misinformation? All I said about the man is:

1. I never heard of him. That's a FACT.

2. Since the person requesting info also doesn't know about the guy,

RESEARCH HIM FIRST just to be sure he's not a first-timer.

> Also.....don't dish on Joe Frost ....he has helped and

> responded to more people here than any of us I

> think....

I never meant to " dish " on Joe (or anyone else for that matter).

For the record: JOE, IF I INSULTED YOU IN ANY WAY, I SINCERELY AND

HUMBLY REQUEST THAT YOU ACCEPT MY APOLOGY. I THINK YOU'RE A GREAT

ASSET TO THIS LIST.

With that said, neither Joe, nor I, nor YOU, Janice, are an expert on

the DS or bariatric surgery. Joe has certainly never claimed to be

an expert, and I most certainly would not claim to be one either.

Perhaps you would claim to be an expert, Janice, I don't know. But I

stand by my statement! WE ARE NOT EXPERTS!

Tom

NOT AN EXPERT, just SICK AND TIRED OF BEING ATTACKED FOR EXPRESSING

MY OPINIONS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Guest guest]

<<<

>>>

I don't think Dr Gagner did obesity surgery for his residency: He previously

specialized in cancer surgery. It most likely was abdominal cancer surgery,

though. Also, even though he didn't have his residency specifically in

bariatric surgery, BOTH Drs Ren and (mentioned above) TRAINED UNDER

HIM, so I really think that he should be mentioned on the list above.

all the best,

teresa

lap ds with gallbladder removal

January 25, 2001

four months post-op and still feelin' fab!

pre-op: 307 lbs/bmi 45

NOw; 249!

[Guest guest]

Actually, this isn't true in all cases. Dr trained to do the DS

with Dr Booth. He assisted for around 6 months before starting to

perform them on his own. the other surgeons currently working with Dr

Booth went through the same training period before beginning to act as

a lead surgeon. What medical school is it providing this bariatrics

residency? I find this interesting.. because a surgeon cannot be

certified in a specialty (such as bariatrics) without proving that

he/she has completed x amount of time in training/assisting another

certified surgeon. And.. if working as a fellow makes for a better

surgeon,.. what happened with Dr Ren during Deb Mullin's surgery?

Granted, that's one surgery out of hundreds.. but it hasn't happened

to Drs , Warden, Kim, Booth, or any others that were not on the

short list...

Just my .02

Liane

> FYI..........Sure wish people would not comment on

> " whether or not the surgeon even knows how to do the

> DS without " without any knowledge.....

> 1----Read each Doctors Information/Bio on the DS

> site....very informative

> 2----Check them out professionally.....licensing

> agencies, state boards,,,,,etc (Do we have links on

> how to do this on the DS Site ??? Might be helpful.)

> 3-----Talk to their ACTUAL PATIENTS....or people who

> know their patients and can connect you.

> 4----e-mail them...talk to them....consult with

> them....and research, research, research !

>

> Here is a tidbit....

>

> DS Dr.s: Dr. Keshishian, Dr. Lutrzykowski, Dr. Ren,

> and Dr. are the only DS Doctors who

> actually where trained in their residency to do this

> surgery. Long term 5+ years. Most other bariatric

> doctors go to another surgeon's surgery for a

> day or two maybe a week or two and then they go back

> and start on patients.

>

> Would be great if we could really try not to give out

> bad advice and insult Doctors we havent even

> researched on the DS Site.....(Dr. Lutrzykowski...and

> NO...HE IS NOT MY Doctor...just hate that

> misinformation is given out here....He does know what

> a DS is !!!!)......

> Also.....don't dish on Joe Frost ....he has helped and

> responded to more people here than any of us I

> think.... sigh...... BEST OF LUCK Pre-OPS....DO

> YOUR HOMEWORK !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

>

> __________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

As far as I know, there is *no* such thing as a bariatric residency program

in surgery. Bariatric surgeons are trained as " general surgeons " and then

have to find available options for learning more about bariatrics. If place

they do their residency has a good WLS program then they get trained. If

not, they don't. Most hospitals do the RNY so that is the training offered

to most surgical residents.

Dr Ren and Dr (and others) were actually Surgical Lap Fellows. I

suspect they had to do other lap procedures, not just WLS.

Until the DS is offered at many teaching hospitals, we will continue to have

a scarce supply of DS surgeons. And yes, working *with* another surgeon and

assisting at surgery is the traditional way of learning how to do something.

For an experienced surgeon who has performed many weight loss or

stomach/small intestine surgeries, learning the DS will take less time than

for someone just starting in practice.

in Seattle

DS 1/5/01 295# BMI 47.6

6/5/01 220# BMI 35.5

Dr Welker - OHSU

----- Original Message -----

> <<<

and Dr. are the only DS Doctors who

> actually where trained in their residency to do this

> surgery. Long term 5+ years. Most other bariatric

> doctors go to another surgeon's surgery for a

> day or two maybe a week or two and then they go back

> and start on patients.>>>>

>

> I don't think Dr Gagner did obesity surgery for his residency: He

previously

> specialized in cancer surgery. It most likely was abdominal cancer

surgery,

> though. Also, even though he didn't have his residency specifically in

> bariatric surgery, BOTH Drs Ren and (mentioned above) TRAINED

UNDER

> HIM, so I really think that he should be mentioned on the list above.

>

> all the best,

> teresa

> lap ds with gallbladder removal

> January 25, 2001

>

> four months post-op and still feelin' fab!

>

> pre-op: 307 lbs/bmi 45

> NOw; 249!