Re: Re: Ava's funky leg crease & REDUCED HOURS!!!!

February 25, 2005

,

I can so relate to this, and I think it is a normal feeling. Kai was about 6

months old when I got the birth records from the doctor and there were things in

there that my husband hadnt even told me had happened or that no one knew - like

the fact that Kai had to be recuscitated (DH knew) and that the cord was wrapped

around his neck (Dr hid this from DH). And there were things missing that we

all remembered happening and that the intern told me about the next day - the

fact that he was forcefully delivered after a failed attempt to rotate him face

down and had shoulder dystocia. Even his Apgar scores were deceptive .. his

first score was an 8 even tho he did not breath on his own and was blue for

several minutes after delivery.

When I read all that, I was so angry, and scared (he could have died during the

delivery thanks to this idiot's incompetence!) and it was quite some time before

I began dealing with it, and honestly, it has only been in the last few months

that the three of us that were in that delivery room (myself, DH, and my dad)

have begun to fully " recover " from the experience.

Give it time. Eventually you will look back and simply be thankful. For now,

mourn " what could have been " and tell yourself it is all ok and your daughter is

okay

Angel

--------------------------------------------

" ...But for some reason I'm playing the " what-if " game...Oh well, it just means

extra hugs & kisses for my beautiful girl tonight. I just can't shake this

feeling. It's almost the same feeling I had after our first ortho visit. I can't

really explain it, I think it's just coming to terms with the condition " my

daughter has, even if it's 6 months after her birth. And as stupid as it is, I'm

feeling some guilt again. "

February 25, 2005

Wow , that is scary! That reminds of an Oprah episode where the

Dad ran over their 2 year old with the family van and the kid died. The

dad was beside himself. It was a freak accident, but his wife (now

ex-wife), could not forgive him. I felt bad for the guy, because as bad

as it hurts, the fact of the matter is he didn't do it on purpose. He

will feel aweful guilt for the rest of his life and his wife had to go and

push him down even further. I guess we don't know how we would react

unless we experience it ourselves.

Thank god your story has a happy ending!!

Shook

Retail Operations Manager/Baking Instructor

Vie de France Yamazaki, Inc.

2070 Chain Bridge Rd. Suite 500

Vienna, VA 22182

x374

fax

February 25, 2005

Wow! I don't know how I would handle that! You have my respect big time!

As for how big Kai was ... he delivered at 35 weeks at 7 lb 4 oz and a 15 " head.

Not huge by any means (well, except his head!) but definitely the biggest of my

kids even tho he was the only preemie of the bunch. His delivery went so bad

because no one read the obvious signs that he was turned face up until I was 8

cm and the doc was pushing pitocin (very bad with a baby turned wrong). At

almost 10 cm they attempted to turn him, which is most likely what wrapped the

cord. The doc managed to deliver his head, but got his shoulders vertical and

stuck on my pelvis. I seriously thought the were going to break my pelvis!

Instead of trying to rotate his shoulders the doc had the intern pull down then

up, which did dislodge his shoulders, but could have also hurt him pretty bad.

Also, it tore every supporting muscle in my pelvic floor. Oh how I wish they

had told me that the midwife, whose care MY ob had left me in, was going to be

back at midnight! We would have waited and that would have never happened!

Angel

--------------------------------------------

" Thanks guys so much for all your support. Angel, your experience sounds really

traumatic. How big was Kai? Your experience " reminded " me of when my first

daughter was run over. She's fine... "

February 27, 2005

Oh, yeah, I had drugs! I chickened out on the epidural (how stupid!) but I had

both stadol and a pudential ... the only problem is that a pudential does not

block the upper area, and that is where all the pain was!

As far as the intern, I almost thing I was better off with her doing it, but you

are very right that the doc had no business letting her do it given the

potential danger. He just used it as a learning moment for her, I guess. I

still dont see why they did not even attempt the shoulder rotation, tho ... or,

as you said, just let him come out posterior ... it causes more back pain, but

otherwise usually works out fine as long as the baby's chin is tucked.

And I would have LOVED to be under the total care of a midwife, but it was a

high risk pregnancy since I had PTL at 34 weeks with my first (stopped) and at

27 weeks with my second (controlled with terbutaline) and the PTL with Kai

started at 30 weeks.

February 27, 2005

My came sunny side up. I did have him natural at a birthing center with

a midwife - but the hours of pushing, holy cow Batman. I thought I was going to

die. I passed out a couple times. 's vital signs stayed strong though,

and as long as he was hanging in there I did to. It did crack my pelvis though

when he finally came out.

I agree, why do women keep having babies!?! LOL

s.

Re: Ava's funky leg crease & REDUCED HOURS!!!!

Angel,

Kai was a pretty good size for 5 weeks early! I bet you thank your

stars you didn't go " on time " and have a 10 lb. monster or

something! That's awful your doc didn't realize he was face up. I

coached a friend through an 8 lb baby delivered " sunny side up " and

they kept the pit pumping for HOURS!!! She pushed for almost 5 hrs

and ended up needing vacuum extraction...what a mess..Anyway, I

don't understand why they would try to turn him at that point. Alot

of the time a posterior baby will turn as it moves down the birth

canal...but if you're that far along, it's a little late IMO! (not

that I'm a doctor!) The up & down thing is okay as far as I know for

stuck shoulders, I just question why the doc would allow an intern

to do it. That is potentially life threatening, not something to be

handled by an intern. Did you have any pain meds? I'm a natural

birther, but please tell me you had drugs during all this! There's a

time and a place for everything--and that sounds like the time &

place to me!!! And as far as the midwife thing, I think just about

everybody would be better off in the care of a midwife! Sounds like

you had a pretty rough time of it...I salute you! Are we crazy to

keep having these kids??!?!? :-)

mommy of:

Guinevere, harrison, Ava 8/4/04 right CF DBB 16-18/7

> As for how big Kai was ... he delivered at 35 weeks at 7 lb 4 oz

and a 15 " head. Not huge by any means (well, except his head!) but

definitely the biggest of my kids even tho he was the only preemie

of the bunch. His delivery went so bad because no one read the

obvious signs that he was turned face up until I was 8 cm and the

doc was pushing pitocin (very bad with a baby turned wrong). At

almost 10 cm they attempted to turn him, which is most likely what

wrapped the cord. The doc managed to deliver his head, but got his

shoulders vertical and stuck on my pelvis. I seriously thought the

were going to break my pelvis! Instead of trying to rotate his

shoulders the doc had the intern pull down then up, which did

dislodge his shoulders, but could have also hurt him pretty bad.

Also, it tore every supporting muscle in my pelvic floor. Oh how I

wish they had told me that the midwife, whose care MY ob had left me

in, was going to be back at midnight! We would have waited and that

would have never happened!

>

> Angel

>

> --------------------------------------------

> " Thanks guys so much for all your support. Angel, your experience

sounds really traumatic. How big was Kai? Your experience " reminded "

me of when my first daughter was run over. She's fine... "

>

March 1, 2005

my first was posterior, and I had back labor but didn't tell anyone,

duh!. So, after 3 hours of pushing here at home I went to the

hospital. And pushed for another 6+ hours. They tried to turn him at the

end, but it was docs doing it instead of me turning on my front side and

allowing it to happen. Excruciating pain (like the 9 hours I'd spent at

10cm wasn't excruciating, but this was worse) so I said no go and told them

to stop. C-section time. My first. It took them over 4 minutes to get

him unstuck because I'd pushed him into my pelvis to hard. ugh!

My second wasn't posterior but 6w premature and footling. So automatic

second c-section. 12days in the NICU but he came out of it a nursing child

which I know isn't typical. I put a lot of effort into nursing him and

being there for every feeding so he wouldn't get a bottle and it worked for

us. I'm pretty happy about that. They called him the nursing baby because

so few of the other babies in the NICU nursed at all. With my third, I got

to 10 in about 3 hours but she remained at -3 station (as high as she could

possibly be) and didn't descend when I pushed. They had me monitored this

time and the docs who came in insisted her HR was going down (although my

midwife felt my uterus was doing fine). 2 scars on my uterus freaked them

out and the midwife didn't see that she was going to come down at all so

thus, my 3rd section. She too was posterior. My babies tend to turn

during labor and are all across the board in the weeks prior to delivery so

we kept thinking it would be ok and then there she is sunny side up

again. Ugh! The couldn't make the incision in the same spot as the

previous two because the LUS (lower uterine segment) was too thin and they

wouldn't have been able to sew it up without the tissue shredding. So I

have two incision sites in my uterus. Which left it very painful for a

long time after delivery. I got pg last summer (m/c) and I honestly

couldn't convey how painful it was to be pg again. My uterus hurt so bad

it wasn't funny. I ended up with a d&e which also was mega painful when it

was supposed to be not so painful at all. I was not a happy mama last

September...

I honestly don't know if I can ever have more children because of

this. The c-sections messed up a perfectly capable uterus (that labors

rather well and I progress quickly - my footling baby I didn't even know I

was in labor and it took about 7 ctx to go from 4cm to 8) and I am not

pleased at all. I CAN labor just fine (natural). Darbi was my biggest, at

9#15oz (after she pooped) and I have PCOS which tends to create large

babies in the first place. I'm stuck, if I should get pg again they want

to do a scheduled c-section, and the idea of which I am not fond of at

all. Finding a midwife who will do a homebirth after 3C's isn't going to

be easy. And that's my only option other than the repeat C.

I know so many people wish they'd ended up with a section after a less than

good vaginal birth. But in my experience, the sections messed me up way

more than an awful birth ever would have much because my less than perfect

uterus may not handle another pregnancy, let alone labor again. Granted

I've got my fair share of children with 3 under 7yo and I don't even know

if I want another but it'd be nice not to wonder if I ever did get pg,

would I die or the child die because of all this?. I have at least one

friend who had a huge baby and has said time and again she wished she'd had

a c-section. I honestly believe her that she's got some lasting problems

because of it (incontinence the big issue) but I often wonder which is the

lesser of the two evils? She doesn't know she wouldn't have come out of

surgery with a serious infection like Maureen has been dealing with, she

doesn't know that she wouldn't have bled out and lost her uterus, and she

also doesn't know what recovery from a major abdominal surgery is like with

a newborn. Peeing your pants doesn't really sound so bad when you consider

that a mistake on our part may mean doctors might tell me I must terminate

a pregnancy or I'll die.

I don't know, one really has to have BTDT to be able to say one terrible

experience is worse than another terrible experience and I've never had a

VB, let alone a bad VB so this is hard to say one way or the other. But I

sure as heck would like my choice of fertility back. If I could do it all

over again, I'd do a lot of things differently starting with the first

homebirth.

I also want to make sure everyone knows I don't want to diminish any of

their experiences, this is just how I feel personally about my experiences

with childbirth.

Kori

At 12:41 PM 2/27/2005, you wrote:

>Angel,

>Kai was a pretty good size for 5 weeks early! I bet you thank your

>stars you didn't go " on time " and have a 10 lb. monster or

>something! That's awful your doc didn't realize he was face up. I

>coached a friend through an 8 lb baby delivered " sunny side up " and

>they kept the pit pumping for HOURS!!! She pushed for almost 5 hrs

>and ended up needing vacuum extraction...what a mess..Anyway, I

>don't understand why they would try to turn him at that point. Alot

>of the time a posterior baby will turn as it moves down the birth

>canal...but if you're that far along, it's a little late IMO! (not

>that I'm a doctor!) The up & down thing is okay as far as I know for

>stuck shoulders, I just question why the doc would allow an intern

>to do it. That is potentially life threatening, not something to be

>handled by an intern. Did you have any pain meds? I'm a natural

>birther, but please tell me you had drugs during all this! There's a

>time and a place for everything--and that sounds like the time &

>place to me!!! And as far as the midwife thing, I think just about

>everybody would be better off in the care of a midwife! Sounds like

>you had a pretty rough time of it...I salute you! Are we crazy to

>keep having these kids??!?!? :-)

> mommy of:

>Guinevere, harrison, Ava 8/4/04 right CF DBB 16-18/7

>

> > As for how big Kai was ... he delivered at 35 weeks at 7 lb 4 oz

>and a 15 " head. Not huge by any means (well, except his head!) but

>definitely the biggest of my kids even tho he was the only preemie

>of the bunch. His delivery went so bad because no one read the

>obvious signs that he was turned face up until I was 8 cm and the

>doc was pushing pitocin (very bad with a baby turned wrong). At

>almost 10 cm they attempted to turn him, which is most likely what

>wrapped the cord. The doc managed to deliver his head, but got his

>shoulders vertical and stuck on my pelvis. I seriously thought the

>were going to break my pelvis! Instead of trying to rotate his

>shoulders the doc had the intern pull down then up, which did

>dislodge his shoulders, but could have also hurt him pretty bad.

>Also, it tore every supporting muscle in my pelvic floor. Oh how I

>wish they had told me that the midwife, whose care MY ob had left me

>in, was going to be back at midnight! We would have waited and that

>would have never happened!

> >

> > Angel

> >

> > --------------------------------------------

> > " Thanks guys so much for all your support. Angel, your experience

>sounds really traumatic. How big was Kai? Your experience " reminded "

>me of when my first daughter was run over. She's fine... "

> >

March 1, 2005

You have my respect Kori, and my sympathy.

I am thankful I was with a midwife when came out posterior - I am very

confident a hospital would have done a c-section rather than let me fight it out

to deliver naturally/vaginally. It took hours, but she and her nurses kept on

trying different positions, etc. to help him move on down rather than give up

and send me to the hospital.