Guest guest Posted September 1, 2005 Report Share Posted September 1, 2005 This isn't exactly in answer to your question, but I got curious and searched a bit. Besides a ton of sites offering the stuff for sale (frequently mentioning Dr. Hans Nieper), I found these two of interest for their additional descriptions: http://home.earthlink.net/~lmstandish/nieper.htm http://www.luminet.net/~wenonah/hydro/mg.htm Although there are some statements in both that are accurate, I'm a little suspicious. These two links are to individual's " home " web pages. The first one has no attribution as to even WHEN it was written, or where it was published, but it is filled with unverifiable anecdotes of miraculous cures. The second one attributes the following three paragraphs to Dr. Nieper: --------------- " In 1961, Laborit and Nieper introduced cardiac therapy, especially protective therapy against cardiac infarction, based on magnesium aspartate. Somewhat later, in 1968, magnesium orotate - a further development - was added as longterm therapy against cardiac infarction, by Nieper. Since then, we have had a large number of patients under long-term magnesium orotate therapy because of angina pectoris and other cardiac metabolism disturbances. This treatment has such a positive effect that the patients themselves request renewed presciptions once they run out of tablets. Thus, long-term therapy necessarily results. For some time we have observed, with some surprise, that hardly any new cancer occurrences appear in this group of patients. The probability for this is so small, in fact, that in cases of doubt and for acute complaints, a diagnosis of cancer is highly unlikely. The rate of new cancerous diseases with long-term magnesium orotate therapy is perhaps less than 20% of the frequency otherwise expected, at least for the first 10 years of the observation period. Obviously further observations are necessary, and we thought this finding was so important that we wanted to mention it. In the last analysis, it is also in line with Pierre Delbet's scientific legacy. " ---------------- Above is supposedly from a book titled " Dr. Nieper's Revolution in Technology, Medicine and Society " . Sorry, but that title reminds me of the drivel promoting all sorts of cures that some lone struggling scientist (who happens to be selling his stuff right there online, usually not based in the U.S. or Europe though) offers us, despite the nearly succesful efforts of the AMA, " orthodox " researchers, and the pharmaceutical industry to suppress it. Sigh. I expect SOME in those groups actually would want to suppress real provable breakthroughs like the above, but I don't think they could. This bit about " hardly any new cancer occurrences appear in this group of patients " strikes me as rather unlikely, and therefore raises my concerns as to the accuracy of other statements. Nonetheless, immediately after the above, there appears: " In contrast to all other magnesium salts, magnesium orotate transports the magnesium atom to the membranes of the structures in the cullular plasma - the socalled mitochondria - and possibly to the cell nucleus' genetic apparatus. " which could very well be accurate, and of course highly relevant to us mitos. Another " home " link http://www.luminet.net/~wenonah/new/nieper.htm has a long wierd diatribe, including for instance this quote (apparently by the well-respected " Tommy " ) commenting on excerpts from another book by Dr. Nieper entitled " On the Subject of Medicine and the Tachyon Era " : " [ The term " Tachyon " - also known as " Zero Point Energy " - is the modern notation for the ancient concept of ether. This paradigm considers gravity to be caused by a high-powered energy field, which pushes objects together. This energy field is an energy source for many bioprocesses, chemical reactions and sub-atomic interactions. There have been several dozen experiments done by various researchers, including NASA, that cannot be explained if gravity is an attractive force. More than 30 different designs have been produced and tested that have been able to transform " Tachyon " energy into electrical or mechanical energy. - Tommy - ] " and the not-unsurprising statement: " We are selling this book and another book by Dr. Nieper. You can order it by phone or fax using your credit card. We are the home of the Hans Nieper, MD archives. " This particular link was a vast TRULY ENTERTAINING read. I hope I haven't offended anyone by my skepticism. Steve D. > Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 16:18:15 -0700 > > Subject: Magnesium Orotate > > I was wondering if anyone that went to the UMDF conference happens to > know how much Mag Orotate was discussed taking as a supplement? > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 1, 2005 Report Share Posted September 1, 2005 Steve I understand your feelings about this. Had it not been for Dr. Haas talking about it at the conferencee and then Dr. Cohen suggesting I try it, I would not be considering it at all. Since I am already on 3500 mg. magnesium a day as my kidney's spill it, I was a good person to give it a try. Since magnesium is a laxative, people need to be careful with it. laurie > > > This isn't exactly in answer to your question, but I got curious and > searched a bit. Besides a ton of sites offering the stuff for sale > (frequently mentioning Dr. Hans Nieper), I found these two of interest for > their additional descriptions: > > http://home.earthlink.net/~lmstandish/nieper.htm > http://www.luminet.net/~wenonah/hydro/mg.htm > > Although there are some statements in both that are accurate, I'm a little > suspicious. These two links are to individual's " home " web pages. The first > one has no attribution as to even WHEN it was written, or where it was > published, but it is filled with unverifiable anecdotes of miraculous cures. > The second one attributes the following three paragraphs to Dr. Nieper: > > --------------- > > " In 1961, Laborit and Nieper introduced cardiac therapy, especially > protective therapy against cardiac infarction, based on magnesium aspartate. > Somewhat later, in 1968, magnesium orotate - a further development - was > added as longterm therapy against cardiac infarction, by Nieper. > > Since then, we have had a large number of patients under long-term magnesium > orotate therapy because of angina pectoris and other cardiac metabolism > disturbances. This treatment has such a positive effect that the patients > themselves request renewed presciptions once they run out of tablets. Thus, > long-term therapy necessarily results. > > For some time we have observed, with some surprise, that hardly any new > cancer occurrences appear in this group of patients. The probability for > this is so small, in fact, that in cases of doubt and for acute complaints, > a diagnosis of cancer is highly unlikely. The rate of new cancerous diseases > with long-term magnesium orotate therapy is perhaps less than 20% of the > frequency otherwise expected, at least for the first 10 years of the > observation period. Obviously further observations are necessary, and we > thought this finding was so important that we wanted to mention it. In the > last analysis, it is also in line with Pierre Delbet's scientific legacy. " > > ---------------- > > Above is supposedly from a book titled " Dr. Nieper's Revolution in > Technology, Medicine and Society " . Sorry, but that title reminds me of the > drivel promoting all sorts of cures that some lone struggling scientist (who > happens to be selling his stuff right there online, usually not based in the > U.S. or Europe though) offers us, despite the nearly succesful efforts of > the AMA, " orthodox " researchers, and the pharmaceutical industry to suppress > it. Sigh. I expect SOME in those groups actually would want to suppress real > provable breakthroughs like the above, but I don't think they could. > > This bit about " hardly any new cancer occurrences appear in this group of > patients " strikes me as rather unlikely, and therefore raises my concerns as > to the accuracy of other statements. Nonetheless, immediately after the > above, there appears: " In contrast to all other magnesium salts, magnesium > orotate transports the magnesium atom to the membranes of the structures in > the cullular plasma - the socalled mitochondria - and possibly to the cell > nucleus' genetic apparatus. " which could very well be accurate, and of > course highly relevant to us mitos. > > Another " home " link > http://www.luminet.net/~wenonah/new/nieper.htm > has a long wierd diatribe, including for instance this quote (apparently by > the well-respected " Tommy " ) commenting on excerpts from another book by Dr. > Nieper entitled " On the Subject of Medicine and the Tachyon Era " : > > " [ The term " Tachyon " - also known as " Zero Point Energy " - is the modern > notation for the ancient concept of ether. This paradigm considers gravity > to be caused by a high-powered energy field, which pushes objects together. > This energy field is an energy source for many bioprocesses, chemical > reactions and sub-atomic interactions. There have been several dozen > experiments done by various researchers, including NASA, that cannot be > explained if gravity is an attractive force. More than 30 different designs > have been produced and tested that have been able to transform " Tachyon " > energy into electrical or mechanical energy. - Tommy - ] " > > and the not-unsurprising statement: " We are selling this book and another > book by Dr. Nieper. You can order it by phone or fax using your credit card. > We are the home of the Hans Nieper, MD archives. " > > This particular link was a vast TRULY ENTERTAINING read. I hope I haven't > offended anyone by my skepticism. > > Steve D. > > > Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 16:18:15 -0700 > > > > Subject: Magnesium Orotate > > > > I was wondering if anyone that went to the UMDF conference happens to > > know how much Mag Orotate was discussed taking as a supplement? > > > > > > > > Medical advice, information, opinions, data and statements contained herein are not necessarily those of the list moderators. The author of this e mail is entirely responsible for its content. List members are reminded of their responsibility to evaluate the content of the postings and consult with their physicians regarding changes in their own treatment. > > Personal attacks are not permitted on the list and anyone who sends one is automatically moderated or removed depending on the severity of the attack. > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 1, 2005 Report Share Posted September 1, 2005 I don't believe that this is recommended by the big three of mito--Cohen, Shoffner, or Whiteman. Right now it is mostly speculative. I went to the professional side of the conference and didn't hear talk about this at all. Mom to the two best kids in the world! http://www.caringbridge.org/visit/thomasandkatie ____________________________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 1, 2005 Report Share Posted September 1, 2005 Dr. Cohen recommended it for me two weeks ago. laurie > I don't believe that this is recommended by the big > three of mito--Cohen, Shoffner, or Whiteman. Right now > it is mostly speculative. > > I went to the professional side of the conference and > didn't hear talk about this at all. > > > > Mom to the two best kids in the world! > http://www.caringbridge.org/visit/thomasandkatie > > > > ____________________________________________________ > Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > > > > > > > Medical advice, information, opinions, data and statements contained herein are not necessarily those of the list moderators. The author of this e mail is entirely responsible for its content. List members are reminded of their responsibility to evaluate the content of the postings and consult with their physicians regarding changes in their own treatment. > > Personal attacks are not permitted on the list and anyone who sends one is automatically moderated or removed depending on the severity of the attack. > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 30, 2005 Report Share Posted September 30, 2005 Hi I had an appointment with my neuro today. I told him that Dr. Cohen recommended replacing some of my magnesium with mag orotate. My neuro has been in touch with the mito doc in OZ (can't remember his name) who is using it. My neuro has a 5 year old mito patient whose seizures haven't been able to be controlled. After starting the mag oro, he is almost seizure free. I thought this might be of interest to some. I asked if it might work to reduce stroke like events and he said it was something worth trying. I'm sure it wouldn't be appropriate to start it on your own, but with a docs okay. He also supported my need for sodium to reduce cramping. He says that those who drink a lot of fluid, which is usually good for us, usually loose sodium. He wants me to drink about 16 ounces of Gatorade or Powerade. laurie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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