Periodic regressions on SCD / WAS: Re: Another Chlorine question

[Guest guest]

Thanks for that post . It really helps to hear what it was like for other

parents and their children.I read in the book from Dr. Baker and Pangborn that

parents experieced a regression at 5,7,9 months and that there other regression

afterwards but milder.It is nice to hear from parents who have recovered their

child or children . I know with Autism Spectrum Disorder I often feel like I am

on a rollercoaster and when I am feeling down I need to hear of someone elses

success as well as what it took from them to get their. Thanks so much for being

there . Toni mom to Matteo ASD 4 yrs old. SCD since Oct/05

Re: Periodic regressions on SCD / WAS: Re: Another

Chlorine question

Tracey's post pretty much sums up our first year experience with SCD. We had

periodic regressions, they became less and less over time, both in duration and

severity, until about 11 months, we had a whopper then. Usually the regressions

followed from slight infractions, after Halloween, Hunter found a corner of one

red gummy bear, 1/4 centimeter in size piece he ate, minute, and that triggered

a huge regression. He found it on the floor at a grocery store, I did not give

it to him. I think if the yeast get any chance, they will fight until their

death for their space in the intestine. They are fighting for their lives! I

haven't read Sid Baker's book, but would be interesting to pull out my food

journals and take a peak. We have been doing dandy for a long time, but Hunter

just pulled out of a long regression, not severe, but behavoirally annoying, and

I believe it was triggered from a flu that he had. Regressions now are nowhere

near 11/2 years ago, not even close.

Generally, there seems to be an exacting trigger, while in the past, it seemed

more out of the sky.

I don't care about stimming, I encourage it when it happens and try to make

art out of it, and by embracing it, it always disappears. Hunter used to tear up

paper real small, then I got the idea, if he is going to do this, he should make

art out of it, and he would tear up all the paper, and I would hand him glue and

poster board, he would make mosaic designs from his stimming. Stimming becomes

rarer and rarer in this house, and whatever is going on with the yeast,

embracing the behavoir when it happens and redirecting nips it in the bud for

us. Stimming and yeast are connected, but I don't know if lack of stimming is

because of better control over yeast, or our home-made way of dealing with it.

That's all I know.

Summer

Suzanne wrote:

Tracey,

Does your DAN doc happen to be Sid Baker? This sounds like him. I

would like to have this discussion on-list about the regression

periods. I bet some of the more seasoned members would know a lot

about this, but I don't other than what's in Sid Baker's book, which

is pretty much just what you mentioned.

I wonder how often kids fluctuate from this pattern?

Someone suggested to me that yeasts seem to die off in layers, and I

wonder if this acccounts for the periodic regressions.

I'd love other listmates who know more than I do to address this.

Suzanne

Tom, ASD, SCD 3 months

>

> Hi Sandy.

> No high tech answers here, but has anyone heard of or seen so-

called regressions periodically happening during the first year on

SCD, which can't be explained by other factors like a new food?

> My Dan doctor (Long Island, NY) gave me a handout created by a

mom in his practice that followed about 9 kids during their first

year of SCD, looking for patterns. This handout reported that the

vast majority of these 9 ASD kids on SCD experienced noticeable

regressions throughtout the year, starting at about the 2 month

interval and recurring every 2 months thereafter. The regressions

can last anywhere from a few days to about 3 weeks. Its usually

return of/increase in stimming, " bad " behaviors, sleep disturbances,

things like that...

> I not know if this is reliable info, but thought I'd mention

it to see if any veterans out there have seen this to be true. So

how about it you " old timers " : Anyone notice a pattern of

unexplained regressions?

> If so, maybe this is going on for you Sandy and hopefully

it'll subside soon since its been 2-1/2 weeks already. I do hope

that the veterans will have a more concrete answer for you. Good

Luck.

> Tracey, mom of Clay, 4, autism. SCD 9 mos.

For information on the Specific Carbohydrate Diet, please read the book

_Breaking the Vicious Cycle_ by Elaine Gottschall and read the following

websites:

http://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.info

and

http://www.pecanbread.com

[Guest guest]

This could be related. Over on lymestrategies, there are people who

are treating Lyme by taking good quality salt and vitamin C, ramping

up their dose gradually. They say they herx about every month as the

salt kills off the beasties.

Helen

>

> > Someone suggested to me that yeasts seem to die off in layers,

and

> I

> > wonder if this acccounts for the periodic regressions.

> >

> > I'd love other listmates who know more than I do to address this.

>

>

> When researching c.diff, I came across a site (I can't find it

again,

> and didn't bookmark it) where it was said that c.diff procreates by

> spores. No matter how long you take the stuff that kills them,

they

> don't go away right away. The spores go into hiding, and when

> conditions are favorable, they make themselves known. So the

theory

> was to take the meds for 2 weeks to kill the active ones, then

stop.

> When the symptoms began again, within a few days, to begin the meds

> again for another 2 weeks. You continue in the schedule until the

> symptoms are gone.

>

> If I remember correctly, at least some yeasts produce spores. My

> theory - if this is the case, then at certain times, as more foods

> are added into the diet the yeast rears its ugly heads because the

> environment has become more friendly. The regressions are less

> severe because there are fewer yeasts. Most parents have noted

that

> when regressions hit they return to the intro diet for a short time

> (making the environment unfriendly for the beasties) and the

> regression ends. Then a few months later the same thing happens.

It

> seems to be every 2-3 months, until about a year. BJ had them

pretty

> much on schedule. It's been a year for him now, and he's a

> completely different child. We've still got a long way to go - I

am

> so tired of changing wet sheets - but we've come so, so far.

>

> Just my theory - I'd love to hear others.

>

> Sue B

>

[Guest guest]

Suzanne,

I love to teach, I enjoy teaching. When I was teaching professionally, I

always received the " rejects " from other music teachers, the children who were

failing, who didn't want to play, had dyslexia, mental disabilities, and so on.

I never had a problem, and my studio was packed.

I absorbed in all teaching methods, and with each new student, worked out

something anew, and it grew organically, not forced. I often just sat there and

played with new students, music games, got to know them individual. New families

just signing up sometimes wondered what I was doing. You see, so many teachers,

when given a student, want to teach them " their " way, teach the established

methods, with little variation. I have a knack knowing when a student, and how a

student should learn, and how to steadily have them progress. I try to see who

they are, what they like, what is fun for them, how they learn best...the

numerous games I play with children is so fun with them, and data collection on

my part, accessing hand eye coordination, weaknesses, strengths, likes, learning

style, etc.

I do not believe there is any one way to teach each of our children, not

yours, not mine, and many paths can be taken successfully.

From my own life, I stimmed for as long as I could remember. My earliest

recollections are from age of 3, and I definitely had a very consistent stim

program going on, hand flapping, finger flapping, a language spoken quickly no

one could understand.

I stimmed until age 19. As I became a teen, I learned to save my stimming

impulse and go find somewhere private to do it...go use the restroom if I were

in school, go in a closet.

My main relief came from when I wasn't focused and embarressed over my own

stims, playing piano was a relief for me.

I learned piano at a very young age, overseas in Korea. I did not speak any

Korean at the time, and my teacher spoke no english. After my first lesson, my

teacher held up my hand to my parents and said " gao " trying to say " good " , as in

good hands.

I did not learn ABC and traditional methods used to teach in the west. From my

first lessons, not knowing what the notes were called, I simply learned to read

patterns. To this day, when reading music and playing, I read patterns, not the

individual note, although, later I learned how to do that too.

If my teacher knew english, and has insisted I learn note names before playing

beethoven, I may have hated piano. I started piano competitions when quite

young. Is there a right way to learn?

Finding that platform, that key to what your child sees and understands, that

is the base for other learning.

For Hunter, he started drawing before age 2, just squibbles, but he enjoyed it

so. Then I gave him a paintbrush, a glass of water and water paints, showed him

how to dip his brush. What fun! He started mixing colours at age 2...he couldn't

talk to me, but he could paint, we could speak that way. Since he enjoyed art so

much, and seemed interested in it, when he stimmed, I let him do so for a few

minutes then each time present something new for him to do, whether tearing up

paper to glue onto posterboard for a mosaic, or coloring each of the torn of

paper pieces, making colored confetti, and so on.

What I was doing is, through art and fun, repatterning his brain. Those neural

impulses get into a rut, its like I am putting down a wooden board under the

wagon wheel to get it out of the mud. The wagon is not really stuck for good,

just seems that way.

I don't know about that Sid Baker, I don't think anything applies to

everybody, but we seemed to follow that schedule close enough.

For Hunter, regressions can be external or internal, either an infraction of

food, something in the air, a chemical sensitivity, a yeast flare, it is not

always the same, and it is always a puzzle to figure out.

Summer

Suzanne wrote:

Summer,

I continue to be intrigued to hear how you manage autism. Your

creativity always gives me good ideas. We have taken an altogether

different (but succesful) path to managing stims, but I will keep

your idea in my back pocket in case we need a new approach! Tom

doesn't stim too much that we can't manage with yeast control - he's

not all that stimmy a kid anymore anyhow.

It's also interesting to hear about infractions triggering

regression. Tom has NEVER had an infraction (maybe I'm too much the

food nazi, but his allergies make me very nervous), and yet he has

regressions. With his, they always tie to yeast getting out of

control when his yeast meds lapse. And since he's been on heavy

antifungals ever since we started SCD, I don't know if he'd ever

have the chance to experience the typical regressions that other

kids do. Food for thought. Anyhow, contrary to what Sid Baker says,

I would be surprised if kids all experience their regressions at

identical times. That just seems too unlikely given how unique our

kids are in general. I do like the theory of yeast dying off " in

layers " - that makes sense to me and explains why they don't all

just go away at the start of the diet and with consistent stringency

with foods.

> >

> > Hi Sandy.

> > No high tech answers here, but has anyone heard of or seen

so-

> called regressions periodically happening during the first year on

> SCD, which can't be explained by other factors like a new food?

> > My Dan doctor (Long Island, NY) gave me a handout created by

a

> mom in his practice that followed about 9 kids during their first

> year of SCD, looking for patterns. This handout reported that the

> vast majority of these 9 ASD kids on SCD experienced noticeable

> regressions throughtout the year, starting at about the 2 month

> interval and recurring every 2 months thereafter. The regressions

> can last anywhere from a few days to about 3 weeks. Its usually

> return of/increase in stimming, " bad " behaviors, sleep

disturbances,

> things like that...

> > I not know if this is reliable info, but thought I'd mention

> it to see if any veterans out there have seen this to be true. So

> how about it you " old timers " : Anyone notice a pattern of

> unexplained regressions?

> > If so, maybe this is going on for you Sandy and hopefully

> it'll subside soon since its been 2-1/2 weeks already. I do hope

> that the veterans will have a more concrete answer for you. Good

> Luck.

> > Tracey, mom of Clay, 4, autism. SCD 9 mos.

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> For information on the Specific Carbohydrate Diet, please read the

book _Breaking the Vicious Cycle_ by Elaine Gottschall and read the

following websites:

> http://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.info

> and

> http://www.pecanbread.com

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Just want to thank you all as well for these posts on periodic regressions.

Shredding pieces of paper has also become an art for us. When I'm feeling

overwhelmed/discouraged it's such a blessing to have this wonderful support.

May God continue to guide and bless all of us, especially our precious

children.

Anita Carlini- mama to Lucas 5 years old - resection of hypothalamic

hamartoma tumour in '04, ASD, SCD 80 days

>

>Reply-To: pecanbread

>To: <pecanbread >

>Subject: Re: Periodic regressions on SCD / WAS: Re: Another

>Chlorine question

>Date: Fri, 19 May 2006 23:20:05 -0400

>

>Thanks for that post . It really helps to hear what it was like for other

>parents and their children.I read in the book from Dr. Baker and Pangborn

>that parents experieced a regression at 5,7,9 months and that there other

>regression afterwards but milder.It is nice to hear from parents who have

>recovered their child or children . I know with Autism Spectrum Disorder I

>often feel like I am on a rollercoaster and when I am feeling down I need

>to hear of someone elses success as well as what it took from them to get

>their. Thanks so much for being there . Toni mom to Matteo ASD 4 yrs old.

>SCD since Oct/05

> Re: Periodic regressions on SCD / WAS: Re: Another

>Chlorine question

>

>

> Tracey's post pretty much sums up our first year experience with SCD. We

>had periodic regressions, they became less and less over time, both in

>duration and severity, until about 11 months, we had a whopper then.

>Usually the regressions followed from slight infractions, after Halloween,

>Hunter found a corner of one red gummy bear, 1/4 centimeter in size piece

>he ate, minute, and that triggered a huge regression. He found it on the

>floor at a grocery store, I did not give it to him. I think if the yeast

>get any chance, they will fight until their death for their space in the

>intestine. They are fighting for their lives! I haven't read Sid Baker's

>book, but would be interesting to pull out my food journals and take a

>peak. We have been doing dandy for a long time, but Hunter just pulled out

>of a long regression, not severe, but behavoirally annoying, and I believe

>it was triggered from a flu that he had. Regressions now are nowhere near

>11/2 years ago, not even close.

> Generally, there seems to be an exacting trigger, while in the past, it

>seemed more out of the sky.

>

> I don't care about stimming, I encourage it when it happens and try to

>make art out of it, and by embracing it, it always disappears. Hunter used

>to tear up paper real small, then I got the idea, if he is going to do

>this, he should make art out of it, and he would tear up all the paper, and

>I would hand him glue and poster board, he would make mosaic designs from

>his stimming. Stimming becomes rarer and rarer in this house, and whatever

>is going on with the yeast, embracing the behavoir when it happens and

>redirecting nips it in the bud for us. Stimming and yeast are connected,

>but I don't know if lack of stimming is because of better control over

>yeast, or our home-made way of dealing with it.

>

> That's all I know.

> Summer

>

> Suzanne wrote:

> Tracey,

> Does your DAN doc happen to be Sid Baker? This sounds like him. I

> would like to have this discussion on-list about the regression

> periods. I bet some of the more seasoned members would know a lot

> about this, but I don't other than what's in Sid Baker's book, which

> is pretty much just what you mentioned.

>

> I wonder how often kids fluctuate from this pattern?

>

> Someone suggested to me that yeasts seem to die off in layers, and I

> wonder if this acccounts for the periodic regressions.

>

> I'd love other listmates who know more than I do to address this.

>

> Suzanne

> Tom, ASD, SCD 3 months

>

>

> >

> > Hi Sandy.

> > No high tech answers here, but has anyone heard of or seen so-

> called regressions periodically happening during the first year on

> SCD, which can't be explained by other factors like a new food?

> > My Dan doctor (Long Island, NY) gave me a handout created by a

> mom in his practice that followed about 9 kids during their first

> year of SCD, looking for patterns. This handout reported that the

> vast majority of these 9 ASD kids on SCD experienced noticeable

> regressions throughtout the year, starting at about the 2 month

> interval and recurring every 2 months thereafter. The regressions

> can last anywhere from a few days to about 3 weeks. Its usually

> return of/increase in stimming, " bad " behaviors, sleep disturbances,

> things like that...

> > I not know if this is reliable info, but thought I'd mention

> it to see if any veterans out there have seen this to be true. So

> how about it you " old timers " : Anyone notice a pattern of

> unexplained regressions?

> > If so, maybe this is going on for you Sandy and hopefully

> it'll subside soon since its been 2-1/2 weeks already. I do hope

> that the veterans will have a more concrete answer for you. Good

> Luck.

> > Tracey, mom of Clay, 4, autism. SCD 9 mos.

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> For information on the Specific Carbohydrate Diet, please read the book

>_Breaking the Vicious Cycle_ by Elaine Gottschall and read the following

>websites:

> http://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.info

> and

> http://www.pecanbread.com

>

>

>

>

>