Guest guest Posted March 27, 2003 Report Share Posted March 27, 2003 I have never seen a documented research paper that concluded that proximal RNY patients have a long term problem absorbing adequate protein from regular food. There is some research that due to the shortened common channel, BPD/DS patients have a problem with protein absorption. You can get some information on this at http://www.duodenalswitch.com Since distal RNY patients also have a very short common channel, it can be inferred that they too could have a problem with protein absorption. In his article, Managing the Obese Patient After Bariatric Surgery: A Case Report of Severe Malnutrition and Review of the Literature, Journal of Parenteral and Enternal Nutrition, Vol 9 Issue 2, 2000, pp 126-132, Dr. Kushner, an internist with a master's degree in nutrition states: " Patients often are provided modular protein supplements during the first 6 postoperative months until solid food intake increases. Thereafter, counseling on adequate protein intake continues to be a priority, because intolerance of meat products is one of the most common long-term dietary changes. " , p 128. There is some evidence that protein supplementation enhances bone mineral density among the general population of those over 60 years of age. Ray Hooks For WLS nutrition info, visit http://www.bariatricsupplementsystem.com nanpug2001 wrote: > > Hi All........was wondering if anyone felt like helping me out with > something?? Yesterday when I was at my new PS's office a funny thing > happened. We were talking about support groups and he asked if I > went to my other surgeons. I replied No, that I belonged to a rather > large on-line support group.....3,000 members total. He was floored > and VERY interested. He asked me if we happened to talk about post- > op diets, and did I ever notice any conversations about " protein " and > lack of and the need for supplementation. I actually thought he was > joking and that maybe it was a trick question. He went on to explain > that he and several of his associates had started to notice that it > seemed to be mostly WLS patients that had problems > with " wounds " ......they figured that it probably had something to do > with the malnutrition. They then noticed that these particular > patients happen to be terrible low in protein. They want to start a > program of dietary requirements for pre-plastic surgery, post-op WLS > patients. I explained that it was probably because some of > the 'reports' that I have read indicated that we may absorb as little > as 10% of our food protein intake.........he asked where I had read > this and if I could forward this info to him........my problem is > that I don't remember exactly " where " I did read this.........any > body have any suggestions.....I am going to research on > obesityhelp.com and other websites......but if any of you have > any " published " reports hanging around......would you mind forwarding > them to me!! THANKS SO MUCH........... P. > > Homepage: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Graduate-OSSG > > Unsubscribe: mailto:Graduate-OSSG-unsubscribe > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 27, 2003 Report Share Posted March 27, 2003 I have never seen a documented research paper that concluded that proximal RNY patients have a long term problem absorbing adequate protein from regular food. There is some research that due to the shortened common channel, BPD/DS patients have a problem with protein absorption. You can get some information on this at http://www.duodenalswitch.com Since distal RNY patients also have a very short common channel, it can be inferred that they too could have a problem with protein absorption. In his article, Managing the Obese Patient After Bariatric Surgery: A Case Report of Severe Malnutrition and Review of the Literature, Journal of Parenteral and Enternal Nutrition, Vol 9 Issue 2, 2000, pp 126-132, Dr. Kushner, an internist with a master's degree in nutrition states: " Patients often are provided modular protein supplements during the first 6 postoperative months until solid food intake increases. Thereafter, counseling on adequate protein intake continues to be a priority, because intolerance of meat products is one of the most common long-term dietary changes. " , p 128. There is some evidence that protein supplementation enhances bone mineral density among the general population of those over 60 years of age. Ray Hooks For WLS nutrition info, visit http://www.bariatricsupplementsystem.com nanpug2001 wrote: > > Hi All........was wondering if anyone felt like helping me out with > something?? Yesterday when I was at my new PS's office a funny thing > happened. We were talking about support groups and he asked if I > went to my other surgeons. I replied No, that I belonged to a rather > large on-line support group.....3,000 members total. He was floored > and VERY interested. He asked me if we happened to talk about post- > op diets, and did I ever notice any conversations about " protein " and > lack of and the need for supplementation. I actually thought he was > joking and that maybe it was a trick question. He went on to explain > that he and several of his associates had started to notice that it > seemed to be mostly WLS patients that had problems > with " wounds " ......they figured that it probably had something to do > with the malnutrition. They then noticed that these particular > patients happen to be terrible low in protein. They want to start a > program of dietary requirements for pre-plastic surgery, post-op WLS > patients. I explained that it was probably because some of > the 'reports' that I have read indicated that we may absorb as little > as 10% of our food protein intake.........he asked where I had read > this and if I could forward this info to him........my problem is > that I don't remember exactly " where " I did read this.........any > body have any suggestions.....I am going to research on > obesityhelp.com and other websites......but if any of you have > any " published " reports hanging around......would you mind forwarding > them to me!! THANKS SO MUCH........... P. > > Homepage: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Graduate-OSSG > > Unsubscribe: mailto:Graduate-OSSG-unsubscribe > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 27, 2003 Report Share Posted March 27, 2003 A study was done by the New York Obesity Research Center, Dept of Medicine and Surgery, St Lukes's Roosebelt Hospital, Columbia University College of Physicians and Surgeons, New York, NY, USA and Unit of Obesity, Hospital Clinico, Barcelona, Spain. It is just published the latest issue by Obesity Surgery, which you can get to online and see a synopsis of without membership. http://obesitysurgery.com The study was done on GBS patients up to 1 year post-op, but that's all, so the conclusions are related to those post-ops up to 1 yr after surgery, but not confined to those only. The article is called " Obese Patients Have Inadequate Protein Intake Related to Protein Intolerance Up to 1 Year Following Roux-en-Y Gastric Bypass " . ------------------------------------------ (Quoted from article) " Conclusions: These results suggest that postoperative patients consume insufficient amounts of protein, possibly mediated by protein intolerance. Protein supplementation following RYGBP deserves further consideration. " ----------------------------------- My note: By the way...this is a publication for bariatric physicians. Chrissie Surgery: August 31, 2000: Open RNY/GB Removal/hernia repair Start: 373lbs Height 5'2 " BMI 70 8/16 Abdominoplasty(-8 lbs)/thigh lipectomy 1/20/03 breast reduction(-6lbs)/rhytidectomy of sides/brachioplasty 2/7/03 - 163 BMI 29.8 total loss - 210 lbs shihtzumom@... http://users.snip.net/~shihtzumom My WLS Journey: http://millennium.fortunecity.com/doddington/691/WLS/this_is_me.htm Re: Info needed!! I have never seen a documented research paper that concluded that proximal RNY patients have a long term problem absorbing adequate protein from regular food. There is some research that due to the shortened common channel, BPD/DS patients have a problem with protein absorption. You can get some information on this at http://www.duodenalswitch.com Since distal RNY patients also have a very short common channel, it can be inferred that they too could have a problem with protein absorption. In his article, Managing the Obese Patient After Bariatric Surgery: A Case Report of Severe Malnutrition and Review of the Literature, Journal of Parenteral and Enternal Nutrition, Vol 9 Issue 2, 2000, pp 126-132, Dr. Kushner, an internist with a master's degree in nutrition states: " Patients often are provided modular protein supplements during the first 6 postoperative months until solid food intake increases. Thereafter, counseling on adequate protein intake continues to be a priority, because intolerance of meat products is one of the most common long-term dietary changes. " , p 128. There is some evidence that protein supplementation enhances bone mineral density among the general population of those over 60 years of age. Ray Hooks For WLS nutrition info, visit http://www.bariatricsupplementsystem.com nanpug2001 wrote: > > Hi All........was wondering if anyone felt like helping me out with > something?? Yesterday when I was at my new PS's office a funny thing > happened. We were talking about support groups and he asked if I > went to my other surgeons. I replied No, that I belonged to a rather > large on-line support group.....3,000 members total. He was floored > and VERY interested. He asked me if we happened to talk about post- > op diets, and did I ever notice any conversations about " protein " and > lack of and the need for supplementation. I actually thought he was > joking and that maybe it was a trick question. He went on to explain > that he and several of his associates had started to notice that it > seemed to be mostly WLS patients that had problems > with " wounds " ......they figured that it probably had something to do > with the malnutrition. They then noticed that these particular > patients happen to be terrible low in protein. They want to start a > program of dietary requirements for pre-plastic surgery, post-op WLS > patients. I explained that it was probably because some of > the 'reports' that I have read indicated that we may absorb as little > as 10% of our food protein intake.........he asked where I had read > this and if I could forward this info to him........my problem is > that I don't remember exactly " where " I did read this.........any > body have any suggestions.....I am going to research on > obesityhelp.com and other websites......but if any of you have > any " published " reports hanging around......would you mind forwarding > them to me!! THANKS SO MUCH........... P. > > Homepage: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Graduate-OSSG > > Unsubscribe: mailto:Graduate-OSSG-unsubscribe > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 27, 2003 Report Share Posted March 27, 2003 A study was done by the New York Obesity Research Center, Dept of Medicine and Surgery, St Lukes's Roosebelt Hospital, Columbia University College of Physicians and Surgeons, New York, NY, USA and Unit of Obesity, Hospital Clinico, Barcelona, Spain. It is just published the latest issue by Obesity Surgery, which you can get to online and see a synopsis of without membership. http://obesitysurgery.com The study was done on GBS patients up to 1 year post-op, but that's all, so the conclusions are related to those post-ops up to 1 yr after surgery, but not confined to those only. The article is called " Obese Patients Have Inadequate Protein Intake Related to Protein Intolerance Up to 1 Year Following Roux-en-Y Gastric Bypass " . ------------------------------------------ (Quoted from article) " Conclusions: These results suggest that postoperative patients consume insufficient amounts of protein, possibly mediated by protein intolerance. Protein supplementation following RYGBP deserves further consideration. " ----------------------------------- My note: By the way...this is a publication for bariatric physicians. Chrissie Surgery: August 31, 2000: Open RNY/GB Removal/hernia repair Start: 373lbs Height 5'2 " BMI 70 8/16 Abdominoplasty(-8 lbs)/thigh lipectomy 1/20/03 breast reduction(-6lbs)/rhytidectomy of sides/brachioplasty 2/7/03 - 163 BMI 29.8 total loss - 210 lbs shihtzumom@... http://users.snip.net/~shihtzumom My WLS Journey: http://millennium.fortunecity.com/doddington/691/WLS/this_is_me.htm Re: Info needed!! I have never seen a documented research paper that concluded that proximal RNY patients have a long term problem absorbing adequate protein from regular food. There is some research that due to the shortened common channel, BPD/DS patients have a problem with protein absorption. You can get some information on this at http://www.duodenalswitch.com Since distal RNY patients also have a very short common channel, it can be inferred that they too could have a problem with protein absorption. In his article, Managing the Obese Patient After Bariatric Surgery: A Case Report of Severe Malnutrition and Review of the Literature, Journal of Parenteral and Enternal Nutrition, Vol 9 Issue 2, 2000, pp 126-132, Dr. Kushner, an internist with a master's degree in nutrition states: " Patients often are provided modular protein supplements during the first 6 postoperative months until solid food intake increases. Thereafter, counseling on adequate protein intake continues to be a priority, because intolerance of meat products is one of the most common long-term dietary changes. " , p 128. There is some evidence that protein supplementation enhances bone mineral density among the general population of those over 60 years of age. Ray Hooks For WLS nutrition info, visit http://www.bariatricsupplementsystem.com nanpug2001 wrote: > > Hi All........was wondering if anyone felt like helping me out with > something?? Yesterday when I was at my new PS's office a funny thing > happened. We were talking about support groups and he asked if I > went to my other surgeons. I replied No, that I belonged to a rather > large on-line support group.....3,000 members total. He was floored > and VERY interested. He asked me if we happened to talk about post- > op diets, and did I ever notice any conversations about " protein " and > lack of and the need for supplementation. I actually thought he was > joking and that maybe it was a trick question. He went on to explain > that he and several of his associates had started to notice that it > seemed to be mostly WLS patients that had problems > with " wounds " ......they figured that it probably had something to do > with the malnutrition. They then noticed that these particular > patients happen to be terrible low in protein. They want to start a > program of dietary requirements for pre-plastic surgery, post-op WLS > patients. I explained that it was probably because some of > the 'reports' that I have read indicated that we may absorb as little > as 10% of our food protein intake.........he asked where I had read > this and if I could forward this info to him........my problem is > that I don't remember exactly " where " I did read this.........any > body have any suggestions.....I am going to research on > obesityhelp.com and other websites......but if any of you have > any " published " reports hanging around......would you mind forwarding > them to me!! THANKS SO MUCH........... P. > > Homepage: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Graduate-OSSG > > Unsubscribe: mailto:Graduate-OSSG-unsubscribe > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 27, 2003 Report Share Posted March 27, 2003 (Quoted from article) " Conclusions: These results suggest that postoperative patients consume insufficient amounts of protein, possibly mediated by protein intolerance. Protein supplementation following RYGBP deserves further consideration. " The abstract also states " Although energy and protein intake increased significantly over the 12-month period, protein intake at 12 months remained significantly lower (P=.01) than the daily recommended guidelines (1.5 g/kg IBW) for a low-energy restrictive diet. " In other words, the study subjects simply did not eat enough protein in the first place. This does not mean that had the study subjects eaten the recommended daily amount of protein, they would still be deficient. This just proves that if you do not eat enough protein in the first place, you will not be able to absorb enough protein. This would seem to be the expected result independent of whether a study subject had had WLS or not. Ray Hooks For WLS nutrition info, visit http://www.bariatricsupplementsystem.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 27, 2003 Report Share Posted March 27, 2003 (Quoted from article) " Conclusions: These results suggest that postoperative patients consume insufficient amounts of protein, possibly mediated by protein intolerance. Protein supplementation following RYGBP deserves further consideration. " The abstract also states " Although energy and protein intake increased significantly over the 12-month period, protein intake at 12 months remained significantly lower (P=.01) than the daily recommended guidelines (1.5 g/kg IBW) for a low-energy restrictive diet. " In other words, the study subjects simply did not eat enough protein in the first place. This does not mean that had the study subjects eaten the recommended daily amount of protein, they would still be deficient. This just proves that if you do not eat enough protein in the first place, you will not be able to absorb enough protein. This would seem to be the expected result independent of whether a study subject had had WLS or not. Ray Hooks For WLS nutrition info, visit http://www.bariatricsupplementsystem.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 27, 2003 Report Share Posted March 27, 2003 Thank you SO much Ray........this is the kind of stuff I was looking for.....I figured if I could get him headed in the right direction he should be able to pick it up from there........he IS the doc afterall!! Thanks again Ray..... P. Re: Info needed!! > I have never seen a documented research paper that concluded that > proximal RNY patients have a long term problem absorbing adequate > protein from regular food. There is some research that due to the > shortened common channel, BPD/DS patients have a problem with protein > absorption. You can get some information on this at > http://www.duodenalswitch.com Since distal RNY patients also have a > very short common channel, it can be inferred that they too could have a > problem with protein absorption. > > In his article, Managing the Obese Patient After Bariatric Surgery: A > Case Report of Severe Malnutrition and Review of the Literature, Journal > of Parenteral and Enternal Nutrition, Vol 9 Issue 2, 2000, pp 126-132, > Dr. Kushner, an internist with a master's degree in nutrition > states: " Patients often are provided modular protein supplements during > the first 6 postoperative months until solid food intake increases. > Thereafter, counseling on adequate protein intake continues to be a > priority, because intolerance of meat products is one of the most common > long-term dietary changes. " , p 128. > > There is some evidence that protein supplementation enhances bone > mineral density among the general population of those over 60 years of > age. > > Ray Hooks > For WLS nutrition info, visit > http://www.bariatricsupplementsystem.com > > > > nanpug2001 wrote: > > > > Hi All........was wondering if anyone felt like helping me out with > > something?? Yesterday when I was at my new PS's office a funny thing > > happened. We were talking about support groups and he asked if I > > went to my other surgeons. I replied No, that I belonged to a rather > > large on-line support group.....3,000 members total. He was floored > > and VERY interested. He asked me if we happened to talk about post- > > op diets, and did I ever notice any conversations about " protein " and > > lack of and the need for supplementation. I actually thought he was > > joking and that maybe it was a trick question. He went on to explain > > that he and several of his associates had started to notice that it > > seemed to be mostly WLS patients that had problems > > with " wounds " ......they figured that it probably had something to do > > with the malnutrition. They then noticed that these particular > > patients happen to be terrible low in protein. They want to start a > > program of dietary requirements for pre-plastic surgery, post-op WLS > > patients. I explained that it was probably because some of > > the 'reports' that I have read indicated that we may absorb as little > > as 10% of our food protein intake.........he asked where I had read > > this and if I could forward this info to him........my problem is > > that I don't remember exactly " where " I did read this.........any > > body have any suggestions.....I am going to research on > > obesityhelp.com and other websites......but if any of you have > > any " published " reports hanging around......would you mind forwarding > > them to me!! THANKS SO MUCH........... P. > > > > Homepage: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Graduate-OSSG > > > > Unsubscribe: mailto:Graduate-OSSG-unsubscribe > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 27, 2003 Report Share Posted March 27, 2003 Thank you SO much Ray........this is the kind of stuff I was looking for.....I figured if I could get him headed in the right direction he should be able to pick it up from there........he IS the doc afterall!! Thanks again Ray..... P. Re: Info needed!! > I have never seen a documented research paper that concluded that > proximal RNY patients have a long term problem absorbing adequate > protein from regular food. There is some research that due to the > shortened common channel, BPD/DS patients have a problem with protein > absorption. You can get some information on this at > http://www.duodenalswitch.com Since distal RNY patients also have a > very short common channel, it can be inferred that they too could have a > problem with protein absorption. > > In his article, Managing the Obese Patient After Bariatric Surgery: A > Case Report of Severe Malnutrition and Review of the Literature, Journal > of Parenteral and Enternal Nutrition, Vol 9 Issue 2, 2000, pp 126-132, > Dr. Kushner, an internist with a master's degree in nutrition > states: " Patients often are provided modular protein supplements during > the first 6 postoperative months until solid food intake increases. > Thereafter, counseling on adequate protein intake continues to be a > priority, because intolerance of meat products is one of the most common > long-term dietary changes. " , p 128. > > There is some evidence that protein supplementation enhances bone > mineral density among the general population of those over 60 years of > age. > > Ray Hooks > For WLS nutrition info, visit > http://www.bariatricsupplementsystem.com > > > > nanpug2001 wrote: > > > > Hi All........was wondering if anyone felt like helping me out with > > something?? Yesterday when I was at my new PS's office a funny thing > > happened. We were talking about support groups and he asked if I > > went to my other surgeons. I replied No, that I belonged to a rather > > large on-line support group.....3,000 members total. He was floored > > and VERY interested. He asked me if we happened to talk about post- > > op diets, and did I ever notice any conversations about " protein " and > > lack of and the need for supplementation. I actually thought he was > > joking and that maybe it was a trick question. He went on to explain > > that he and several of his associates had started to notice that it > > seemed to be mostly WLS patients that had problems > > with " wounds " ......they figured that it probably had something to do > > with the malnutrition. They then noticed that these particular > > patients happen to be terrible low in protein. They want to start a > > program of dietary requirements for pre-plastic surgery, post-op WLS > > patients. I explained that it was probably because some of > > the 'reports' that I have read indicated that we may absorb as little > > as 10% of our food protein intake.........he asked where I had read > > this and if I could forward this info to him........my problem is > > that I don't remember exactly " where " I did read this.........any > > body have any suggestions.....I am going to research on > > obesityhelp.com and other websites......but if any of you have > > any " published " reports hanging around......would you mind forwarding > > them to me!! THANKS SO MUCH........... P. > > > > Homepage: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Graduate-OSSG > > > > Unsubscribe: mailto:Graduate-OSSG-unsubscribe > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 28, 2003 Report Share Posted March 28, 2003 Your response only goes to prove that it is possible to twist a simple conclusion into anything you " want " it to say. Chrissie Re: Info needed!! (Quoted from article) " Conclusions: These results suggest that postoperative patients consume insufficient amounts of protein, possibly mediated by protein intolerance. Protein supplementation following RYGBP deserves further consideration. " The abstract also states " Although energy and protein intake increased significantly over the 12-month period, protein intake at 12 months remained significantly lower (P=.01) than the daily recommended guidelines (1.5 g/kg IBW) for a low-energy restrictive diet. " In other words, the study subjects simply did not eat enough protein in the first place. This does not mean that had the study subjects eaten the recommended daily amount of protein, they would still be deficient. This just proves that if you do not eat enough protein in the first place, you will not be able to absorb enough protein. This would seem to be the expected result independent of whether a study subject had had WLS or not. Ray Hooks For WLS nutrition info, visit http://www.bariatricsupplementsystem.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 28, 2003 Report Share Posted March 28, 2003 Your response only goes to prove that it is possible to twist a simple conclusion into anything you " want " it to say. Chrissie Re: Info needed!! (Quoted from article) " Conclusions: These results suggest that postoperative patients consume insufficient amounts of protein, possibly mediated by protein intolerance. Protein supplementation following RYGBP deserves further consideration. " The abstract also states " Although energy and protein intake increased significantly over the 12-month period, protein intake at 12 months remained significantly lower (P=.01) than the daily recommended guidelines (1.5 g/kg IBW) for a low-energy restrictive diet. " In other words, the study subjects simply did not eat enough protein in the first place. This does not mean that had the study subjects eaten the recommended daily amount of protein, they would still be deficient. This just proves that if you do not eat enough protein in the first place, you will not be able to absorb enough protein. This would seem to be the expected result independent of whether a study subject had had WLS or not. Ray Hooks For WLS nutrition info, visit http://www.bariatricsupplementsystem.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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