Guest guest Posted January 12, 2004 Report Share Posted January 12, 2004 Thought we were done with this topic for now, but have more input from the doctor today. She asked me about protein intake, so I told her my new find, gelatin. She said certainly take it for collagen, nails, etc. It is good for many things. But she said as a protein source, it's not good, that it isn't high-quality protein. She suggested continuing if I liked, but not count it as the day's protein count. So guess I'm back to protein bar, or whatever. Mandy, do you have research on this? I seem to remember you saying something about German athletes taking this. Now, we're back to conflicting ideas about foods, protein, etc. So I am definitely going to continue taking it. But I am not going to rely on it as a part of my protein intake for now. Joan LAP RNY 11/18/03 Dr. Higa, Fresno, CA 282pre-op/275surg/236/140 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 12, 2004 Report Share Posted January 12, 2004 Thought we were done with this topic for now, but have more input from the doctor today. She asked me about protein intake, so I told her my new find, gelatin. She said certainly take it for collagen, nails, etc. It is good for many things. But she said as a protein source, it's not good, that it isn't high-quality protein. She suggested continuing if I liked, but not count it as the day's protein count. So guess I'm back to protein bar, or whatever. Mandy, do you have research on this? I seem to remember you saying something about German athletes taking this. Now, we're back to conflicting ideas about foods, protein, etc. So I am definitely going to continue taking it. But I am not going to rely on it as a part of my protein intake for now. Joan LAP RNY 11/18/03 Dr. Higa, Fresno, CA 282pre-op/275surg/236/140 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 13, 2004 Report Share Posted January 13, 2004 In a message dated 1/12/2004 9:10:00 PM Pacific Standard Time, jclinton@... writes: > But I am not going to rely on it as > a part of my protein intake for now. > Joan, ... there was a time when vitamin pills were considered ... " not a good source for vitamins " by Doctors as well, and I suppose, depending on who you talk to in the medical profession, this premises still holds true. As I said in an earlier post, PLEASE .. if the subject matter interests you.... " do your own research " . Yes, German Athletes supplement with Collagen Protein ( aka Gelatin ). This is not brain surgery!! They, more than anyone, have a vested interest in protecting their joints. ALL over-the-counter joint supplementation's are NOW made with Gelatin, proven to protect and aid in the healing of Joint cartilage challenges. See for yourself... read lables .. become informed. My interest in using Gelatin is similar. As I shared with you, there was a time where I was unable to maneuver my legs to the side of the bed without the help of rope being tied to the ends of my feet. I litterally became my own puppeteer of sorts for nearly two years. Could NOT get out of bed, Joan, go to the bathroom without aid ... get up from a sitting position without the aid of a cane/walker.. etc. Walking, movement ... LIVING....meant excruciating pain... long story short,. I now walk between two to three hours every day with near zero joint pain ( on a good day ) .. and can rise from sitting to standing position without the aid of my husband cane or walker. I agree that real food is prefurable to ANY suplimentation on any front .... I agree that there are protien suplimentation sources that " fit " our personal needs better than others. Protein made from Soy for those who are menapausal for example. For me, for MY knees ( joints ) ... for MY skin ..MY nails ... my HAIR ...for ME, Gelatin fits the bill Joan. Do I drink Knoxs ONLY and avoid real meat. Of course not !!! However, I personally would rather use Knox which has the added advantatges of healing cartlege, skin etc ...than ingest a protein shake or bar whose protein source is without these advantages .....and too, makes me want to vomit. Enough said Again, do your own DD ( due dilligance ) Joan ... this is YOUR BODY ... not your Doctors.... ** hugs and Skinny wishes from Mandy in CA 275/139/126 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 13, 2004 Report Share Posted January 13, 2004 In a message dated 1/12/2004 9:10:00 PM Pacific Standard Time, jclinton@... writes: > But I am not going to rely on it as > a part of my protein intake for now. > Joan, ... there was a time when vitamin pills were considered ... " not a good source for vitamins " by Doctors as well, and I suppose, depending on who you talk to in the medical profession, this premises still holds true. As I said in an earlier post, PLEASE .. if the subject matter interests you.... " do your own research " . Yes, German Athletes supplement with Collagen Protein ( aka Gelatin ). This is not brain surgery!! They, more than anyone, have a vested interest in protecting their joints. ALL over-the-counter joint supplementation's are NOW made with Gelatin, proven to protect and aid in the healing of Joint cartilage challenges. See for yourself... read lables .. become informed. My interest in using Gelatin is similar. As I shared with you, there was a time where I was unable to maneuver my legs to the side of the bed without the help of rope being tied to the ends of my feet. I litterally became my own puppeteer of sorts for nearly two years. Could NOT get out of bed, Joan, go to the bathroom without aid ... get up from a sitting position without the aid of a cane/walker.. etc. Walking, movement ... LIVING....meant excruciating pain... long story short,. I now walk between two to three hours every day with near zero joint pain ( on a good day ) .. and can rise from sitting to standing position without the aid of my husband cane or walker. I agree that real food is prefurable to ANY suplimentation on any front .... I agree that there are protien suplimentation sources that " fit " our personal needs better than others. Protein made from Soy for those who are menapausal for example. For me, for MY knees ( joints ) ... for MY skin ..MY nails ... my HAIR ...for ME, Gelatin fits the bill Joan. Do I drink Knoxs ONLY and avoid real meat. Of course not !!! However, I personally would rather use Knox which has the added advantatges of healing cartlege, skin etc ...than ingest a protein shake or bar whose protein source is without these advantages .....and too, makes me want to vomit. Enough said Again, do your own DD ( due dilligance ) Joan ... this is YOUR BODY ... not your Doctors.... ** hugs and Skinny wishes from Mandy in CA 275/139/126 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 13, 2004 Report Share Posted January 13, 2004 In a message dated 1/13/2004 3:43:27 PM Pacific Standard Time, jclinton@... writes: > I kept coming across it being inferior due to a lack of > specific amino acids, what Gelatin IS EXCEPTIONALLY HIGH IN JOAN is two amino acids which play an important part in collagen formation,...... proline and glycine. It would take 43 grams of dried egg whites or 35 grams of dried non fat milk or 89grams of lean beef to equal the amount of proline in just 10 grams of hydrolyzed gelatin. ( take from " bodybuildingforyou.com ) I suspect " inferior " is very much a subjective statement and very much dependant on what your body needs......to become healthy. If you are NOT suffering from osteoarthritis, rheumatoid arthritis, aka, your once smooth carilage becoming rough thus causing more and more friction and PAIN... then for you ... proline and glycine the high amino acids found in Gelatin ...might seem inferior. If you are NOT sufering from bursitis... aka, the small fluid sacks called bursae that become inflamed due to injury .. and cause cronic PAIN ... then for you proline and glycine the high amino acids found in Gelatin, might seem " inferior " ... If you are NOT not suffering from Tendonitis, the most common cause of pain to body builders and other athletes, .... aka, the tendons around a joint that have become severly inflamed from over use micro injury etc ... then for you proline and glycine the HIGH AMINO ACID FOUND IN GELATIN might seem inferior. I do understand the point you are trying to make, Joan, and your point is valid and well taken, but too, YOUR POINT is very dependant upon THE context in which it is written.... Now if you wish, we could debate the pro's and con's of isolates and the micro filtered vs. ion exhange regarding Whey Protein Isolates tomorrow ... but for today ... I wish you to understand this much. No one is marketing " Whey Protein Isolates " for joint pain, nails, skin or hair improvement. And.....???... tell me Joan, what do WLS patients suffer from most?? Protien deficiency?? NO ... They suffer from joint pain ... sagging skin ... hair falling out. I rest my case for including Gelatin. I will say this AGAIN and AGAIN and AGAIN ... do your own DD ...( due dillagance ) ... if Gelatin is not for you ... its not for you. No problem and too, no skin off my shozzzzzzo ... Peace,... and a hug to you ...am exhausted ... Skinny wishes from Mandy in CA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 13, 2004 Report Share Posted January 13, 2004 In a message dated 1/13/2004 3:43:27 PM Pacific Standard Time, jclinton@... writes: > I kept coming across it being inferior due to a lack of > specific amino acids, what Gelatin IS EXCEPTIONALLY HIGH IN JOAN is two amino acids which play an important part in collagen formation,...... proline and glycine. It would take 43 grams of dried egg whites or 35 grams of dried non fat milk or 89grams of lean beef to equal the amount of proline in just 10 grams of hydrolyzed gelatin. ( take from " bodybuildingforyou.com ) I suspect " inferior " is very much a subjective statement and very much dependant on what your body needs......to become healthy. If you are NOT suffering from osteoarthritis, rheumatoid arthritis, aka, your once smooth carilage becoming rough thus causing more and more friction and PAIN... then for you ... proline and glycine the high amino acids found in Gelatin ...might seem inferior. If you are NOT sufering from bursitis... aka, the small fluid sacks called bursae that become inflamed due to injury .. and cause cronic PAIN ... then for you proline and glycine the high amino acids found in Gelatin, might seem " inferior " ... If you are NOT not suffering from Tendonitis, the most common cause of pain to body builders and other athletes, .... aka, the tendons around a joint that have become severly inflamed from over use micro injury etc ... then for you proline and glycine the HIGH AMINO ACID FOUND IN GELATIN might seem inferior. I do understand the point you are trying to make, Joan, and your point is valid and well taken, but too, YOUR POINT is very dependant upon THE context in which it is written.... Now if you wish, we could debate the pro's and con's of isolates and the micro filtered vs. ion exhange regarding Whey Protein Isolates tomorrow ... but for today ... I wish you to understand this much. No one is marketing " Whey Protein Isolates " for joint pain, nails, skin or hair improvement. And.....???... tell me Joan, what do WLS patients suffer from most?? Protien deficiency?? NO ... They suffer from joint pain ... sagging skin ... hair falling out. I rest my case for including Gelatin. I will say this AGAIN and AGAIN and AGAIN ... do your own DD ...( due dillagance ) ... if Gelatin is not for you ... its not for you. No problem and too, no skin off my shozzzzzzo ... Peace,... and a hug to you ...am exhausted ... Skinny wishes from Mandy in CA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 13, 2004 Report Share Posted January 13, 2004 Okay Mandy, researched gelatin for hours and hours & didn't seem to be getting anywhere. I kept coming across it being inferior due to a lack of specific amino acids, but these sources that claimed that were selling products too! So I'm going to assume they're biased to some degree. I finally gave up on that line, and tried Nutrition Data, and USDA sources. What I found there did say it's got the protein, but as to digestibility, it hadn't been factored in which could lower the protein value. One source talked about the % of daily value you get from it, and the Knox box says 0. Another source talked about a ratio that if the daily value % was under 1.0, it was inferior protein. But then found sources that say it's 1.0, so it's okay. So, without spending a lot more time confusing myself on this, I'm definitely taking it for many reasons, hair, skin, nails, joints, etc. I'll take a happy medium on it and count 1/2 of it as protein. I even found sources that said taking this after this specific surgery could significantly lower your chances of hair loss. My head hurts!!!! Joan LAP RNY 11/18/03 Dr. Higa, Fresno, CA 282pre-op/275surg/236/140 Re: Gelatin AGAIN! In a message dated 1/12/2004 9:10:00 PM Pacific Standard Time, jclinton@... writes: > But I am not going to rely on it as > a part of my protein intake for now. > Joan, ... there was a time when vitamin pills were considered ... " not a good source for vitamins " by Doctors as well, and I suppose, depending on who you talk to in the medical profession, this premises still holds true. As I said in an earlier post, PLEASE .. if the subject matter interests you.... " do your own research " . Yes, German Athletes supplement with Collagen Protein ( aka Gelatin ). This is not brain surgery!! They, more than anyone, have a vested interest in protecting their joints. ALL over-the-counter joint supplementation's are NOW made with Gelatin, proven to protect and aid in the healing of Joint cartilage challenges. See for yourself... read lables .. become informed. My interest in using Gelatin is similar. As I shared with you, there was a time where I was unable to maneuver my legs to the side of the bed without the help of rope being tied to the ends of my feet. I litterally became my own puppeteer of sorts for nearly two years. Could NOT get out of bed, Joan, go to the bathroom without aid ... get up from a sitting position without the aid of a cane/walker.. etc. Walking, movement ... LIVING....meant excruciating pain... long story short,. I now walk between two to three hours every day with near zero joint pain ( on a good day ) .. and can rise from sitting to standing position without the aid of my husband cane or walker. I agree that real food is prefurable to ANY suplimentation on any front ..... I agree that there are protien suplimentation sources that " fit " our personal needs better than others. Protein made from Soy for those who are menapausal for example. For me, for MY knees ( joints ) ... for MY skin ..MY nails .... my HAIR ...for ME, Gelatin fits the bill Joan. Do I drink Knoxs ONLY and avoid real meat. Of course not !!! However, I personally would rather use Knox which has the added advantatges of healing cartlege, skin etc ...than ingest a protein shake or bar whose protein source is without these advantages .....and too, makes me want to vomit. Enough said Again, do your own DD ( due dilligance ) Joan ... this is YOUR BODY ... not your Doctors.... ** hugs and Skinny wishes from Mandy in CA 275/139/126 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 13, 2004 Report Share Posted January 13, 2004 Okay Mandy, researched gelatin for hours and hours & didn't seem to be getting anywhere. I kept coming across it being inferior due to a lack of specific amino acids, but these sources that claimed that were selling products too! So I'm going to assume they're biased to some degree. I finally gave up on that line, and tried Nutrition Data, and USDA sources. What I found there did say it's got the protein, but as to digestibility, it hadn't been factored in which could lower the protein value. One source talked about the % of daily value you get from it, and the Knox box says 0. Another source talked about a ratio that if the daily value % was under 1.0, it was inferior protein. But then found sources that say it's 1.0, so it's okay. So, without spending a lot more time confusing myself on this, I'm definitely taking it for many reasons, hair, skin, nails, joints, etc. I'll take a happy medium on it and count 1/2 of it as protein. I even found sources that said taking this after this specific surgery could significantly lower your chances of hair loss. My head hurts!!!! Joan LAP RNY 11/18/03 Dr. Higa, Fresno, CA 282pre-op/275surg/236/140 Re: Gelatin AGAIN! In a message dated 1/12/2004 9:10:00 PM Pacific Standard Time, jclinton@... writes: > But I am not going to rely on it as > a part of my protein intake for now. > Joan, ... there was a time when vitamin pills were considered ... " not a good source for vitamins " by Doctors as well, and I suppose, depending on who you talk to in the medical profession, this premises still holds true. As I said in an earlier post, PLEASE .. if the subject matter interests you.... " do your own research " . Yes, German Athletes supplement with Collagen Protein ( aka Gelatin ). This is not brain surgery!! They, more than anyone, have a vested interest in protecting their joints. ALL over-the-counter joint supplementation's are NOW made with Gelatin, proven to protect and aid in the healing of Joint cartilage challenges. See for yourself... read lables .. become informed. My interest in using Gelatin is similar. As I shared with you, there was a time where I was unable to maneuver my legs to the side of the bed without the help of rope being tied to the ends of my feet. I litterally became my own puppeteer of sorts for nearly two years. Could NOT get out of bed, Joan, go to the bathroom without aid ... get up from a sitting position without the aid of a cane/walker.. etc. Walking, movement ... LIVING....meant excruciating pain... long story short,. I now walk between two to three hours every day with near zero joint pain ( on a good day ) .. and can rise from sitting to standing position without the aid of my husband cane or walker. I agree that real food is prefurable to ANY suplimentation on any front ..... I agree that there are protien suplimentation sources that " fit " our personal needs better than others. Protein made from Soy for those who are menapausal for example. For me, for MY knees ( joints ) ... for MY skin ..MY nails .... my HAIR ...for ME, Gelatin fits the bill Joan. Do I drink Knoxs ONLY and avoid real meat. Of course not !!! However, I personally would rather use Knox which has the added advantatges of healing cartlege, skin etc ...than ingest a protein shake or bar whose protein source is without these advantages .....and too, makes me want to vomit. Enough said Again, do your own DD ( due dilligance ) Joan ... this is YOUR BODY ... not your Doctors.... ** hugs and Skinny wishes from Mandy in CA 275/139/126 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 13, 2004 Report Share Posted January 13, 2004 Shoot if it will help with my hair I will try it!!!!! Candi Re: Gelatin AGAIN! In a message dated 1/12/2004 9:10:00 PM Pacific Standard Time, jclinton@... writes: > But I am not going to rely on it as > a part of my protein intake for now. > Joan, ... there was a time when vitamin pills were considered ... " not a good source for vitamins " by Doctors as well, and I suppose, depending on who you talk to in the medical profession, this premises still holds true. As I said in an earlier post, PLEASE .. if the subject matter interests you.... " do your own research " . Yes, German Athletes supplement with Collagen Protein ( aka Gelatin ). This is not brain surgery!! They, more than anyone, have a vested interest in protecting their joints. ALL over-the-counter joint supplementation's are NOW made with Gelatin, proven to protect and aid in the healing of Joint cartilage challenges. See for yourself... read lables .. become informed. My interest in using Gelatin is similar. As I shared with you, there was a time where I was unable to maneuver my legs to the side of the bed without the help of rope being tied to the ends of my feet. I litterally became my own puppeteer of sorts for nearly two years. Could NOT get out of bed, Joan, go to the bathroom without aid ... get up from a sitting position without the aid of a cane/walker.. etc. Walking, movement ... LIVING....meant excruciating pain... long story short,. I now walk between two to three hours every day with near zero joint pain ( on a good day ) .. and can rise from sitting to standing position without the aid of my husband cane or walker. I agree that real food is prefurable to ANY suplimentation on any front .... I agree that there are protien suplimentation sources that " fit " our personal needs better than others. Protein made from Soy for those who are menapausal for example. For me, for MY knees ( joints ) ... for MY skin ..MY nails ... my HAIR ...for ME, Gelatin fits the bill Joan. Do I drink Knoxs ONLY and avoid real meat. Of course not !!! However, I personally would rather use Knox which has the added advantatges of healing cartlege, skin etc ...than ingest a protein shake or bar whose protein source is without these advantages .....and too, makes me want to vomit. Enough said Again, do your own DD ( due dilligance ) Joan ... this is YOUR BODY ... not your Doctors.... ** hugs and Skinny wishes from Mandy in CA 275/139/126 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 13, 2004 Report Share Posted January 13, 2004 Shoot if it will help with my hair I will try it!!!!! Candi Re: Gelatin AGAIN! In a message dated 1/12/2004 9:10:00 PM Pacific Standard Time, jclinton@... writes: > But I am not going to rely on it as > a part of my protein intake for now. > Joan, ... there was a time when vitamin pills were considered ... " not a good source for vitamins " by Doctors as well, and I suppose, depending on who you talk to in the medical profession, this premises still holds true. As I said in an earlier post, PLEASE .. if the subject matter interests you.... " do your own research " . Yes, German Athletes supplement with Collagen Protein ( aka Gelatin ). This is not brain surgery!! They, more than anyone, have a vested interest in protecting their joints. ALL over-the-counter joint supplementation's are NOW made with Gelatin, proven to protect and aid in the healing of Joint cartilage challenges. See for yourself... read lables .. become informed. My interest in using Gelatin is similar. As I shared with you, there was a time where I was unable to maneuver my legs to the side of the bed without the help of rope being tied to the ends of my feet. I litterally became my own puppeteer of sorts for nearly two years. Could NOT get out of bed, Joan, go to the bathroom without aid ... get up from a sitting position without the aid of a cane/walker.. etc. Walking, movement ... LIVING....meant excruciating pain... long story short,. I now walk between two to three hours every day with near zero joint pain ( on a good day ) .. and can rise from sitting to standing position without the aid of my husband cane or walker. I agree that real food is prefurable to ANY suplimentation on any front .... I agree that there are protien suplimentation sources that " fit " our personal needs better than others. Protein made from Soy for those who are menapausal for example. For me, for MY knees ( joints ) ... for MY skin ..MY nails ... my HAIR ...for ME, Gelatin fits the bill Joan. Do I drink Knoxs ONLY and avoid real meat. Of course not !!! However, I personally would rather use Knox which has the added advantatges of healing cartlege, skin etc ...than ingest a protein shake or bar whose protein source is without these advantages .....and too, makes me want to vomit. Enough said Again, do your own DD ( due dilligance ) Joan ... this is YOUR BODY ... not your Doctors.... ** hugs and Skinny wishes from Mandy in CA 275/139/126 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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