Law and Order/Bill

[Guest guest]

Stirred the imagination but did not change my mind.

Yes I remembered it was fiction. Life is sometimes stranger than

fiction.

WE ARE STILL " FEARFULLY AND WONDERFULLY MADE "

Barb

--

Grand Parent. A thing so simple, even a small child can operate it.

[Guest guest]

Stirred the imagination but did not change my mind.

Yes I remembered it was fiction. Life is sometimes stranger than

fiction.

WE ARE STILL " FEARFULLY AND WONDERFULLY MADE "

Barb

--

Grand Parent. A thing so simple, even a small child can operate it.

[Guest guest]

Barb,

That was the worst distortion of facts that I have ever seen. First of

all there was a six week old fetus involved (which had been conceived in

the womb from all indications) which totally removed it from the realm

of the stem cell research which has produced a cure for mice with PD.

Those stem cells would be adult stem cells which have never proved to

be any good for growing dopamine producing neurons.

The story was obviously written by someone totally ignorant of stem cell

research and slanted toward stopping stem cell research. It is typical

of many vocal opponents of stem cell research. There are several

" Christian " websites still saying that stem cell research will produce

" body parts such as arms, legs and organs to be used for sale " . That is

simply NOT TRUE. They would only produce a single type of cell such as

dopamine producing neurons and pray that they would replace dead

dopamine producing neurons (if that is God's will). If God does not

want it to work, He can decide. We do not decide, we only hope and pray.

BUT, you have to admit that telling a lie is not obeying the

commandments any more than killing a human is obeying " Thou shalt not

kill " . So a " Christian " website spreading lies has to be breaking God's

word. In truth, over 40,000 blastocysts have been destroyed since

Bush's executive order - just wasted, BUT the cells ARE dead and

benefited NO one. That is over 4,000,000 stem cells which could be

ALIVE today and possibly curing someone of PD, juvenile diabetes,

cancer, MSA, or some other rare disease. Medical research scientists

admit they do not know if stem cells will actually cure people, they

just want to try to find cures. I wish the scientists who are claiming

they can shoot down missiles with a $90 billion research program were

as honest - BUT they are methodical and continue to do research in a

logical manner.

A Christian discussion should be open and honest. You and I disagree on

when life starts and that is a honest debate. Calling neurons " body

parts such as arms, legs, and organs " is NOT a honest statement and has

no place in a " Christian " debate. I personally feel God is showing us

the way to heal people as Christ did so many times. However, I still

have yet to see where Christ said " make bombs " or " execute people " . If

he forgave the thief on the cross, I am sure he will forgive me for

believing that He is showing us how to cure a disease.

Because the story was so slanted, I have written the station and asked

that they formally announce that that was a ficticious story totally

devoid of fact. I also asked for an apology to medical researchers as

no self respecting scientist would ever conduct medical research in that

manner. I have a list of every sponsor of that show and will write each

of them demanding an apology. I am tired of everyone lying and getting

away with it.

Christ said lying was as bad as killing. (I am not accusing you of

lying or distortion - you believe it is killing, but have aknowledged

that it is not making body parts). I personally believe that God is

showing us how to heal. God taught us to use blood transfusions to save

lives in spite of many religious leaders who claimed it was immoral.

Then he taught us that organ transplants could save lives. A hundred

years ago a preacher said that if God had intended man to fly, he would

have given us wings.

Take care, Bill Werre

=========================================

Barb wrote:

>Stirred the imagination but did not change my mind.

>

>Yes I remembered it was fiction. Life is sometimes stranger than

>fiction.

>

>WE ARE STILL " FEARFULLY AND WONDERFULLY MADE "

>

>Barb

>

>--

>

> Grand Parent. A thing so simple, even a small child can operate it.

>

>

>

>If you do not wish to belong to shydrager, you may

>unsubscribe by sending a blank email to

>

>shydrager-unsubscribe

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Barb,

That was the worst distortion of facts that I have ever seen. First of

all there was a six week old fetus involved (which had been conceived in

the womb from all indications) which totally removed it from the realm

of the stem cell research which has produced a cure for mice with PD.

Those stem cells would be adult stem cells which have never proved to

be any good for growing dopamine producing neurons.

The story was obviously written by someone totally ignorant of stem cell

research and slanted toward stopping stem cell research. It is typical

of many vocal opponents of stem cell research. There are several

" Christian " websites still saying that stem cell research will produce

" body parts such as arms, legs and organs to be used for sale " . That is

simply NOT TRUE. They would only produce a single type of cell such as

dopamine producing neurons and pray that they would replace dead

dopamine producing neurons (if that is God's will). If God does not

want it to work, He can decide. We do not decide, we only hope and pray.

BUT, you have to admit that telling a lie is not obeying the

commandments any more than killing a human is obeying " Thou shalt not

kill " . So a " Christian " website spreading lies has to be breaking God's

word. In truth, over 40,000 blastocysts have been destroyed since

Bush's executive order - just wasted, BUT the cells ARE dead and

benefited NO one. That is over 4,000,000 stem cells which could be

ALIVE today and possibly curing someone of PD, juvenile diabetes,

cancer, MSA, or some other rare disease. Medical research scientists

admit they do not know if stem cells will actually cure people, they

just want to try to find cures. I wish the scientists who are claiming

they can shoot down missiles with a $90 billion research program were

as honest - BUT they are methodical and continue to do research in a

logical manner.

A Christian discussion should be open and honest. You and I disagree on

when life starts and that is a honest debate. Calling neurons " body

parts such as arms, legs, and organs " is NOT a honest statement and has

no place in a " Christian " debate. I personally feel God is showing us

the way to heal people as Christ did so many times. However, I still

have yet to see where Christ said " make bombs " or " execute people " . If

he forgave the thief on the cross, I am sure he will forgive me for

believing that He is showing us how to cure a disease.

Because the story was so slanted, I have written the station and asked

that they formally announce that that was a ficticious story totally

devoid of fact. I also asked for an apology to medical researchers as

no self respecting scientist would ever conduct medical research in that

manner. I have a list of every sponsor of that show and will write each

of them demanding an apology. I am tired of everyone lying and getting

away with it.

Christ said lying was as bad as killing. (I am not accusing you of

lying or distortion - you believe it is killing, but have aknowledged

that it is not making body parts). I personally believe that God is

showing us how to heal. God taught us to use blood transfusions to save

lives in spite of many religious leaders who claimed it was immoral.

Then he taught us that organ transplants could save lives. A hundred

years ago a preacher said that if God had intended man to fly, he would

have given us wings.

Take care, Bill Werre

=========================================

Barb wrote:

>Stirred the imagination but did not change my mind.

>

>Yes I remembered it was fiction. Life is sometimes stranger than

>fiction.

>

>WE ARE STILL " FEARFULLY AND WONDERFULLY MADE "

>

>Barb

>

>--

>

> Grand Parent. A thing so simple, even a small child can operate it.

>

>

>

>If you do not wish to belong to shydrager, you may

>unsubscribe by sending a blank email to

>

>shydrager-unsubscribe

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Greetings All,

I hope no one will mind if I try to make a point here. Bill noted:

> Christ said lying was as bad as killing.

Actually, from my study of the Bible and my faith over the past 15 years, I

can honestly say that God makes it clear that ANY sin, no matter how small

or big is the same to God. Any and every sin removes us from God. So, it

doesn't matter if it's a lie, or killing, or ignoring others in need. For

that reason, Christ warned us not to worry about the mote in the eyes of

others when we have a log in our eyes.

So, let's back up an look at the fundamental question that seems to arise.

Either the process of fertilizing eggs to help parents conceive and have

children is evil or not. If you think it is acceptable to do this, then it

also means you accept 'killing' all the excess blastocysts. This really is

black and white. So, helping children is either evil or not. (Note this is

the same reason Catholisism does not believe in invitro fertilization).

Are fertility clinics evil? If so, then " Ooops! " - we encounter another one

of those delimas. As humans we do the same thing. Many eggs are fertilized

in comparison to the number that turn into children. Is that evil?

There is some hard thinking all of us must do on this topic. However, we

also must remember that our own eyes might just have a log in it. When I

focus always on how I can help others, I worry less about their sins and

more about their needs. THAT is the one thing most of these arguements seem

to forget. The command is not " Police one another " . It's not " Hold

accountable one another " . It is simply " Love one another " . And THAT is a

very difficult, simple command.

Regards,

=jbf=

B. Fisher

[Guest guest]

Greetings All,

I hope no one will mind if I try to make a point here. Bill noted:

> Christ said lying was as bad as killing.

Actually, from my study of the Bible and my faith over the past 15 years, I

can honestly say that God makes it clear that ANY sin, no matter how small

or big is the same to God. Any and every sin removes us from God. So, it

doesn't matter if it's a lie, or killing, or ignoring others in need. For

that reason, Christ warned us not to worry about the mote in the eyes of

others when we have a log in our eyes.

So, let's back up an look at the fundamental question that seems to arise.

Either the process of fertilizing eggs to help parents conceive and have

children is evil or not. If you think it is acceptable to do this, then it

also means you accept 'killing' all the excess blastocysts. This really is

black and white. So, helping children is either evil or not. (Note this is

the same reason Catholisism does not believe in invitro fertilization).

Are fertility clinics evil? If so, then " Ooops! " - we encounter another one

of those delimas. As humans we do the same thing. Many eggs are fertilized

in comparison to the number that turn into children. Is that evil?

There is some hard thinking all of us must do on this topic. However, we

also must remember that our own eyes might just have a log in it. When I

focus always on how I can help others, I worry less about their sins and

more about their needs. THAT is the one thing most of these arguements seem

to forget. The command is not " Police one another " . It's not " Hold

accountable one another " . It is simply " Love one another " . And THAT is a

very difficult, simple command.

Regards,

=jbf=

B. Fisher