Guest guest Posted August 16, 2004 Report Share Posted August 16, 2004 Both of my kids are vaccinated, but my oldest daughter had really bad reactions to two of them including getting shakes and becoming unresponsive when she was about 4 months and then when she was 4 the arm they gave it in literally turned purple and swelled up. It is a personal choice, I think, just know the risks both of NOT having them and the risks of having them and weigh them against each other. As for circumcision, another personal choice. As another mentioned, it has been proven that there is no health benefit to doing it and I can't imagine that it doesn't hurt. My little guy was black and blue for days. We choose to have it done only because daddy was circumcised and we thought it would be easier for him to identify if they were the same, otherwise, I probably would not have done it. My pediatrician is even against it. They say that now the ration of circ to uncirc nowadays is about 1/2 and 1/2 so chances are whatever you decide, there will be plenty of other boys the same as he. (http://lilypie.com/) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 16, 2004 Report Share Posted August 16, 2004 =================== MODERATOR'S NOTE: Circumcision is a hot-button topic. Restating the rules: Please feel free to share YOUR OWN EXPERIENCE AND/OR DECISION regarding this topic. Do NOT feel free to belittle, demean, attack, or use inflammatory words in an attempt to persuade anyone else to make a decision that isn't their own. I want us to be able to freely discuss hot-button topics on this forum, but I don't want things to disintegrate into a shouting match. Thanks, Kris ==================== In a message dated 8/16/2004 2:19:57 PM Eastern Daylight Time, juliaz@... writes: " Few people are aware of the fact that circumcision was introduced to our culture in an attempt to eliminate masturbation. " Do not forfeit this decision out of respectful submission to your doctor. There are many benefits to keeping the foreskin intact. [...] People mistakenly believe the circumcised penis is cleaner. The myth that the penis with a foreskin is difficult to clean is exactly that -- a myth. [...] The big hoopla over hygiene is pure and unnecessary paranoia. --------------------------------------------- Incorrect info 1) Circumcision was introduced to Abraham in the Old Testament.. it was part of the Covenant that God had with his chosen people. 2) If you are familiar with Jewish law... it is all about Clean vs Unclean. The uncirc'd penis IS unclean... and the reason behind the circ was about hygenics. I don't mind people who are fanatics about not circ thier children.. that is thier right.. but please do not give out inaccurate facts. *************************************************** K in Ft Lauderdale Noah - 10/14/02 - 31 weeker Jonah - edd 11/18/04 ( currently High Risk Pg.. not WLS related) Open RNY - 12/02/03 262/200/someday maybe in the 120's?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 16, 2004 Report Share Posted August 16, 2004 I need to get information on circumcision and also vaccinations. My husband is against both but I want to read more about both to make an informed decision on these-- I don't know where to go to get info on BOTH sides... it seems that the doctors are slanted with their views (pro) and I cannot get unbaised information so I can make an informed decision on both. Anyone out there not vaccinated their children? I would really love to hear from you... would you please email me privately if you feel comforable. I have so many questions! sij2003@... Any ideas where to get info??? Thanks! Ivy Nielsen EDD 8/22/04 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 16, 2004 Report Share Posted August 16, 2004 In a message dated 8/16/2004 3:17:33 PM Eastern Daylight Time, juliaz@... writes: The religious origin of Jewish circumcision is in the Torah. It says that God told Abraham " every male among you shall be circumcised " (Gen. 17) as part of a covenant between God and the Jewish people. However, most Jews are unaware of this origin, and in a survey of American Jews, the large majority (87%) do not believe that the Torah is the actual word of God. Jewish circumcision has never had anything to do with health concerns. -------------------------------------------- It doesn't matter to me what someone believes as to be the truth about thier religion or the origin ... For every handful of rabbis who say one thing.. one can find another handful to say another. Same with statistics.. numbers can be manipulated to mean anything a person wants it to mean. While there is no medical reason for circumcism... that does NOT mean that if we choose to circ our boys.. we are mutilating our children. Unless an intact male is going to wash the head of his penis every time he urinates... the intact male penis will remain unclean. Most men I know after using the restroom.. " shake it off'. For an circ'd male this is no problem. I will tell you that I have broken up with 2 men BECAUSE they were intact. Just the thought of certain activities with an intact penis revolts me. We circ because it has a religious meaning and we believe in the Bible... and because it IS cleaner. *************************************************** K in Ft Lauderdale Noah - 10/14/02 - 31 weeker Jonah - edd 11/18/04 ( currently High Risk Pg.. not WLS related) Open RNY - 12/02/03 262/200/someday maybe in the 120's?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 16, 2004 Report Share Posted August 16, 2004 I have to agree with K. My son was circed because of 1- Cleanliness, and 2- Our beliefs. Meridth Wife to Larry (02/22/02) Mother to Forrest (01/21/01) Expecting #2 02/14/05 Gastric ByPass 02/23/04 370/268pg/175 goalweight Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 16, 2004 Report Share Posted August 16, 2004 My daughter is only partially vaccinated, having had severe reactions to several vaccines. My sister is not vaccinating her three daughters at all. My brother vaccinated her daughter and she has reactions but they are doing it anyway. I hope they are doing the right thing but it's hard to know. This is a great website for vaccine and vaccine reaction information. http://www.909shot.com/ I'm personally really against circumcision. The health " reasons " for doing it have been rejected by the APA and all kinds of other organizations, and to me, it is mutilation. If it's there, it's probably there for a reason. Why do we find female genital mutilation so abhorrent when we just shrug about male circumcision, or worse, actually have it done? This information from one of the sites sums it up for me. " Routine infant circumcision is not practiced in most medically advanced nations. Unlike American parents, few parents worldwide are actually faced with this choice. Their babies are automatically brought home intact. 82% of the world's living men are intact. " Few people are aware of the fact that circumcision was introduced to our culture in an attempt to eliminate masturbation. " Do not forfeit this decision out of respectful submission to your doctor. There are many benefits to keeping the foreskin intact. [...] People mistakenly believe the circumcised penis is cleaner. The myth that the penis with a foreskin is difficult to clean is exactly that -- a myth. [...] The big hoopla over hygiene is pure and unnecessary paranoia. " Circumcision is painful. Although many suggest that anesthesia solves that problem, there are risks associated with anesthesia, including recent death. It isn't always effective and the needle itself is extremely painful. " Here are some sites, some more balanced than others, on this issue. http://www.cirp.org/ http://www.circumcision.org/ http://www.mothersagainstcirc.org/ Z Alan 02/11/84 Joanne Natasha 01/13/00 born at home Open RNY 09/17/01 Auntie to: Emma 08/02/00 Maisy 05/21/02 Sophia Louise 11/02/03 08/13/04 Draeden Atticus due 08/23/04! Where to get info??? To: ossg-pregnant I need to get information on circumcision and also vaccinations. My husband is against both but I want to read more about both to make an informed decision on these-- I don't know where to go to get info on BOTH sides... it seems that the doctors are slanted with their views (pro) and I cannot get unbaised information so I can make an informed decision on both. Anyone out there not vaccinated their children? I would really love to hear from you... would you please email me privately if you feel comforable. I have so many questions! sij2003@... Any ideas where to get info??? Thanks! Ivy Nielsen EDD 8/22/04 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 16, 2004 Report Share Posted August 16, 2004 , You're right, it's a hot-button topic. Not everyone on this board is a Christian, either, and honestly, I don't care a bit about what's in the Old Testament. Sadly, you are completely wrong about Jewish law. According to the Encyclopedia Judaica, " any child born of a Jewish mother is a Jew, whether circumcised or not. " The religious origin of Jewish circumcision is in the Torah. It says that God told Abraham " every male among you shall be circumcised " (Gen. 17) as part of a covenant between God and the Jewish people. However, most Jews are unaware of this origin, and in a survey of American Jews, the large majority (87%) do not believe that the Torah is the actual word of God. Jewish circumcision has never had anything to do with health concerns. http://jewishcircumcision.org/ is a thoughtful site run by many rabbis, if you wish to pursue the religious angle of circumcision. Z Re: Where to get info??? To: ossg-pregnant =================== MODERATOR'S NOTE: Circumcision is a hot-button topic. Restating the rules: Please feel free to share YOUR OWN EXPERIENCE AND/OR DECISION regarding this topic. Do NOT feel free to belittle, demean, attack, or use inflammatory words in an attempt to persuade anyone else to make a decision that isn't their own. I want us to be able to freely discuss hot-button topics on this forum, but I don't want things to disintegrate into a shouting match. Thanks, Kris ==================== In a message dated 8/16/2004 2:19:57 PM Eastern Daylight Time, juliaz@... writes: " Few people are aware of the fact that circumcision was introduced to our culture in an attempt to eliminate masturbation. " Do not forfeit this decision out of respectful submission to your doctor. There are many benefits to keeping the foreskin intact. [...] People mistakenly believe the circumcised penis is cleaner. The myth that the penis with a foreskin is difficult to clean is exactly that -- a myth. [...] The big hoopla over hygiene is pure and unnecessary paranoia. --------------------------------------------- Incorrect info 1) Circumcision was introduced to Abraham in the Old Testament.. it was part of the Covenant that God had with his chosen people. 2) If you are familiar with Jewish law... it is all about Clean vs Unclean. The uncirc'd penis IS unclean... and the reason behind the circ was about hygenics. I don't mind people who are fanatics about not circ thier children.. that is thier right.. but please do not give out inaccurate facts. *************************************************** K in Ft Lauderdale Noah - 10/14/02 - 31 weeker Jonah - edd 11/18/04 ( currently High Risk Pg.. not WLS related) Open RNY - 12/02/03 262/200/someday maybe in the 120's?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 18, 2004 Report Share Posted August 18, 2004 Ivy I would do a search through google.com and see if u find anything on both subjects.. i can certainly understand not wanting biased opinions as this is a personal decision for u and hubby to make...i got kyle circ and vacin, but it was again a pesonal decision and i dont feel anyone has the right to say weather its wrong or right its what you feel your comfortable with and that of your child...i hope u find the info your looking for ... > I need to get information on circumcision and also vaccinations. My husband is against both but I want to read more about both to make an informed decision on these-- I don't know where to go to get info on BOTH sides... it seems that the doctors are slanted with their views (pro) and I cannot get unbaised information so I can make an informed decision on both. Anyone out there not vaccinated their children? I would really love to hear from you... would you please email me privately if you feel comforable. I have so many questions! sij2003@c... > Any ideas where to get info??? > Thanks! > Ivy Nielsen > EDD 8/22/04 > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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