New to SCD and looking for help!!!

[Guest guest]

Hi,

My name is Debbie and my son is nearly 3 and on the sprectrum. We've

been GF/CF/SF since Nov. '06 and on an elimination diet (no phenols, egg

yolks, corn) since Dec. '06. Nystatin was started Jan.'07. We have

seen dramatic improvements at times, but also continuous, slow progress.

We just started seeing Stuart Freedenfeld in NJ(DAN! doc) who suggested

we go on SCD as his yeast rash frequently returns to his diaper area,

especially if one or more doses of Nystatin are missed.

I have been reading and researching, but need some help from others who

are more experienced and wiser in this than I. (I am also feeling very

pressed as I am due to have our second child on Jan. 4, and I am also

trying to implement the GF/CF/SF diet for myself at the urging of our

DAN! and our local lactation consultants. Oh--my OB is also ruling out

preecclampsia, so I have a lot on my plate!!)

Here are my initial concerns:

1)We are nervous to start phenolic foods again, and many fruits on the

diet are phenolic. Should we just stay clear of these at first and

slowly introduce later with an enzyme like Phenol Assist from Kirkman's?

Our DAN! suggested Isogest--can/should this be given together?

2)My understanding is that almonds, and thus almond flour (phenolic)

would be out for us--what about pecan flour, is there such a thing?

3)If all carbs are to be removed, isn't it dangerous, like those protein

diets that were so popular years ago?

4)If no milk is legal, what about calcium? Supplement? I think Kirkman

has a legal one, but do I need to be concerned about the amount of

vitamin D if he is also starting cod liver oil?

5)Why are canned fruits not allowed? The only fruit he is currently on

is all natural pears in their own juice.

6)Am I correct that most or all things need to be cooked, and why?

7)We use Melatonin from a local grocery store. Is this legal, or do I

need to go with Kirkman's?

8)I'm going to call our pharmacy tomorrow that gives us our Nystatin

powder, hoping they can compound zinc, P5P, and folinic acid for us so

that Medical Assistance will pay for. Will they be legal on the diet

though?

9)Tell me more about the use of this goat yogurt! I've read some good

testimonials, but it scares me like crazy to put him back on any milk

with casein in it again.

Whew!!!! I know this is a lot-- can someone help me out of the kindness

of their heart? I want to get as much of this straight as I can before

the baby comes.

Thank you so much!!

Debbie H

[Guest guest]

Hi, Debbie!

Congratulations on the upcoming addition to your

family! My niece is pregnant with her second SCD baby, and is due in May.

I can't answer all your concerns, but I can comment on a couple of them.

>> My understanding is that almonds, and thus

almond flour (phenolic) would be out for us--what

about pecan flour, is there such a thing? <<

Yes, there's pecan flour (pecan meal). That's why

this list is called " Pecan Bread " ! When I don't

make my own pecan flour, I order it from Sunnyland Farms.

http://www.sunnylandfarms.com/ProductsList.aspx?CategoryID=19&SubCatID=56

>> If all carbs are to be removed, isn't it

dangerous, like those protein diets that were so popular years ago? <<

This is a common misconception about SCD. SCD is

the SPECIFIC Carbohydrate Diet, not the No

Carbohydrate Diet. There are plenty of legal

carbs in fruits, vegetables, properly prepared yogurt, honey, and so forth.

>> Why are canned fruits not allowed? The only

fruit he is currently on is all natural pears in their own juice. <<

Check the label. Does it say " Pears in their own

juice " ? Or does it say " Pears in pear juice " ?

There's a major difference. Or does it say,

" Pears in juice " ? You might be surprised. (I used

to wonder why I often felt sick after eating

" tuna in spring water " until I learned on the

original SCD list to check the label -- and

discovered while the brands of tuna I was using

said " tuna in spring water " in big letters on the

front, it had " tuna, spring water, and VEGETABLE

BROTH on the back -- and vegetable broth can be a

big source of MSG, to which I am highly sensitive. Very aggravating.)

Commercially canned goods, with the exception of

Dole Pineapple in its own juice, and a couple

kinds of tomato juice, are not permitted because

the manufacturers often add a big squirt of sugar

syrup to the processing vat to change the PH. But

they don't always do it, so it doesn't have to be

on the label. Canned goods made at home with no

illegal additives are permitted.

>> Am I correct that most or all things need to be cooked, and why? <<

You are correct. Fruits and vegetables are

peeled, seeded, and well-cooked at the beginning

og the diet because they are easier to digest

that way. Many find they also need to puree

them. The object of SCD is to provide only

easily digestible foods. Cooking them makes them easier to digest.

Someone else will have to help with your other questions! <smile>

— Marilyn

New Orleans, Louisiana, USA

Undiagnosed IBS since 1976, SCD since 2001

Darn Good SCD Cook

No Human Children

Shadow & Sunny Longhair Dachshund

[Guest guest]

> 1)We are nervous to start phenolic foods again, and many fruits on the

> diet are phenolic. Should we just stay clear of these at first and

> slowly introduce later with an enzyme like Phenol Assist from Kirkman's?

> Our DAN! suggested Isogest--can/should this be given together?

Yes, you can steer clear at first. It is very likely that your child

will be able to eat these foods again after some healing occurs. If

you find that there are not enough things to eat while steering clear,

you could try the Phenol Assist in order to expand the diet. I know

that Isogest is legal, but I'm not really sure what it does, so I

can't comment about giving it together with Phenol Assist. If they

are both enzyme products, then I think you could. If they overlap in

their ingredients, then you wouldn't need both.

> 4)If no milk is legal, what about calcium? Supplement? I think Kirkman

> has a legal one, but do I need to be concerned about the amount of

> vitamin D if he is also starting cod liver oil?

If you are taking cod liver oil, then you are getting a good source of

vitamin D. Calcium can be gotten from various non-dairy foods. And

later, when you start yogurt, you'll feel confident that your child is

getting plenty. Since your child was DF, it is recommended that you

wait 3-4 months before starting goat yogurt so that you can tell a

reaction to casein from a die-off reaction. The goat yogurt is more

easily digestible that cow yogurt and the casein is altered by the

fermentation process so that it does not have the same bad effect it

did without fermentation.

> 5)Why are canned fruits not allowed? The only fruit he is currently on

> is all natural pears in their own juice.

Manufacturers add sugar without saying so on the label. They do this

to keep up a consistent level of sweetness in the product. However,

if the can says these exact words, " in its own juice " , then it is

legal. There are very few products like this around.

> 7)We use Melatonin from a local grocery store. Is this legal, or do I

> need to go with Kirkman's?

The melatonin in the grocery store probably has illegal additives.

Kirkman's is a legal type. Elaine was not a fan of melatonin, but I

know that many of our kids on the spectrum need it. Follow the advice

of your doctor.

> 8)I'm going to call our pharmacy tomorrow that gives us our Nystatin

> powder, hoping they can compound zinc, P5P, and folinic acid for us so

> that Medical Assistance will pay for. Will they be legal on the diet

> though?

Take the list of legal and illegal supplement additives found here:

http://www.pecanbread.com/new/Sup1.html

with you to the pharmacy and have them use it as a guide to compound

your Rx.

mom to -12

SCD 4/23/04

[Guest guest]

Welcome to the group Debbie H.,

>

> Hi,

>My name is Debbie and my son is nearly 3 and on the sprectrum. We've

> been GF/CF/SF since Nov. '06 and on an elimination diet (no

phenols, egg

>yolks, corn) since Dec. '06. Nystatin was started Jan.'07. We have

> seen dramatic improvements at times, but also continuous, slow

progress.

> We just started seeing Stuart Freedenfeld in NJ(DAN! doc) who

suggested

>we go on SCD as his yeast rash frequently returns to his diaper area,

> especially if one or more doses of Nystatin are missed.

>

>I have been reading and researching, but need some help from others

who

>are more experienced and wiser in this than I. (I am also feeling

very

> pressed as I am due to have our second child on Jan. 4, and I am

also

> trying to implement the GF/CF/SF diet for myself at the urging of

our

> DAN! and our local lactation consultants. Oh--my OB is also ruling

out

> preecclampsia, so I have a lot on my plate!!)

>

> Here are my initial concerns:

> 1)We are nervous to start phenolic foods again, and many fruits on

the> diet are phenolic. Should we just stay clear of these at first

and> slowly introduce later with an enzyme like Phenol Assist from

Kirkman's?>>>>>

The best way to start the diet is with the intro diet. You can find

the ASD (dairy free) version of the intro diet at

http://pecanbread.com/new/scdfoods1.html#intro For those with

diarrhea 4-5 days is suggested and 2-3 days for other symptoms. Five

days is the maximum anyone should be on the intro diet. After the

intro diet introduce cooked fruits and cooked veggies etc. There is

a chart at http://pecanbread.com/new/scdfoods1.html#beyond that can

give you an idea on what foods to try next.

Regarding phenolic foods: There are different fruits and veggies

that can be tried that allow you to avoid phenolic or at least the

highest phenolic foods for a while. Pears, Golden delicious apple

peeled or double peeled as most phenolic compounds are found near the

peels/skins. Some families have reported that after some healing

takes place they are able to tolerate foods , including phenolic

ones, that they were not able to use before.

This link may be of help (if you haven't already seen it):

http://www.danasview.net/phenol.htm

<<<< Our DAN! suggested Isogest--can/should this be given together?

>>>>

You may be able to take them together, but there is a lot of overlap

in the enzymes in each product.

<<<<2)My understanding is that almonds, and thus almond flour

(phenolic)> would be out for us--what about pecan flour, is there

such a thing?>>>

Yes, you can use pecan flour or pecan butter. Some ASD kids were

unable to tolerate almonds and pecans are the easiest to digest nut

besides the almond - that's where the Pecanbread name comes from.

I make pecan butter by whizzing pecans in my food processor with just

a little sunflower oil. I only use enough oil to get the pecans to

start to form butter: pecans have lots of good natural oils so you

don't need to add much.

<<<<3)If all carbs are to be removed, isn't it dangerous, like those

protein> diets that were so popular years ago?>>>>

You aren't removing all carbs, just *specific* ones. The specific

carbs are the complex, hard-to-digest ones like starch, refined

sugars, rice etc... The diet allows for all the natural sugars in

ripe fruits and veggies, natural sugars in 24 hour yogurt (glucose

and galactose) and some complex carbs - but only the easiest to

digest ones (amylose).

<<<<4)If no milk is legal, what about calcium? Supplement?>>>

Milk is not legal, but yogurt is. Yogurt has more 'bioavailable'

calcium than an equal portion of milk. If you don't want to use the

yogurt or other legal dairy you can supplement . There is a legal

Calcium supplement listed at

http://www.lucyskitchenshop.com/freedavitamins.html

<<<<<I think Kirkman> has a legal one, but do I need to be concerned

about the amount of> vitamin D if he is also starting cod liver oil?

>>>>

According to http://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/vitamind.asp the upper

limit for Vitamin D for a 3 yo is 2000 IU/day (25 micrograms/day).

<<<< 5)Why are canned fruits not allowed? The only fruit he is

currently on> is all natural pears in their own juice.>>>>

Fruits that are canned in their own juice are legal. Most can

find " pineapple in its own juice " , but have a hard time finding other

fruits that meet this criteria. This should not be confused

with 'pineapple in pineapple juice' or pineapple in pineapple juice

from concentrate' etc... The key phrase that should be on the can

is : " ...in its own juice " .

<<<<6)Am I correct that most or all things need to be cooked, and why?

>>>

At the beginning when symptoms are still present it is best to peel

and cook fruits and veggies. Peeling and cooking Fruits and veggies

makes them easier to digest. If foods aren't digested they will go

down into the gut and feed the harmful microbes that you want to

starve. As symptoms improve less cooking is needed (lightly steamed

etc.. and eventually raw fruits and veggies will be tolerated.

<<<<<7)We use Melatonin from a local grocery store. Is this legal,

or do I> need to go with Kirkman's?>>>

What are the ingredients? It may be okay.

<<<<8)I'm going to call our pharmacy tomorrow that gives us our

Nystatin> powder, hoping they can compound zinc, P5P, and folinic

acid for us so> that Medical Assistance will pay for. Will they be

legal on the diet> though?>>>>

Zinc, P5P and folinic acid are legal.

<<<<9)Tell me more about the use of this goat yogurt! I've read some

good> testimonials, but it scares me like crazy to put him back on

any milk> with casein in it again.>>>>

The casein in SCD's 24 hour yogurt is denatured. The pH of the

yogurt causes all of the casein to change from a difficult-to-digest

3-dimensional form to a 2-dimensional shape - which is easier to

digest. There is more information on goat yogurt at

http://pecanbread.com/new/yogurt1.html

>

> Whew!!!! I know this is a lot-- can someone help me out of the

kindness

> of their heart? I want to get as much of this straight as I can

before

> the baby comes.

> Thank you so much!!

>

> Debbie H>>

Sheila, SCD Feb. 2001, UC 23yrs, PCOD 22yrs

mom of and