Re: Protocol question...

[Guest guest]

The reason we are asking is that we needed to know timing and how much

of each chelator you took in order to help determine how to make it go

easier for you. If it were dmsa/ala every three hours for three days

including at night. Or if it were dmsa only every four hours for those

three days including at night. If it were 12mg of 200mg..makes a big

difference in symptoms.

You don't have to use the dmsa. It just makes it go better for some

people. Taking the proper minerals supplements and liver support help

with that too. But again...you don't have to use it. It just helps

reduce the mental effects of ala in some people. I did try ala alone

on my dd and it made her mental effects worse. So for her, she has to

take both.

Hg in the brain causes the mental problems, yes. the more Hg in the

brain, the more problems. It poisons the hypothalamus and causes mood

disorders. Also interferes with neurotransmitters by blocking the

receptor sites. See what Andy says that might help you....I posted it

below.

Subject: What to do about depression

From: " andrewhallcutler " <AndyCutler>

Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2007 20:37:51 -0000

There are several kinds of depression, and also anxiety and fear and

apprehension which

often come along with them.

The only one size fits all remedy is omega 3 oils. Good for all of it,

takes several weeks to

help.

Anxiety, fear, apprehension = low GABA problems.

Obsessive, compulsive, thinking about bad things, can't let things go,

dream of being run

over on the freeway and things like that, think of hurting yourself,

lots of psychic distress

and suffering = low serotonin problems.

Hopeless helpless crying depression = problems in the limbic system.

No motivation, no energy, don't enjoy anything, sit around like a bump

on alog,

unaroused, unaware, but mood OK (you don't feel DEPRESSED, you just

don't feel much at

all) = low histamine depression.

Poor mood, attention deficit, emotionally flat, not much drive or

focus =catecholamine

depression.

If you have GABA and serotonin problems you have adrenal problems

causing both of

them. In this case you START with adrenal support, like adrenal cortex

extract, licorice,

etc. Often DHEA, 7 keto DHEA and pregnenolone may help - these should

NEVER EVER

EVER EVER UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES be used in children or adolescents.

Sometimes

hydrocortisone itself may be needed, this must be used with care and

sensibly. THEN

when that is working worry about the rest.

Magnesium and taurine often help with spacey almost disoriented

anxiety anddistress.

These usually go along with a high heart rate and not sweating much.

Take them several

times a day for best effect, magnesium in forms OTHER than oxide or

carbonate or

hydroxide, if you use too much it is laxative. Most people tolerate

somewhere between

100-200 mg per serving of magnesium. 500-1000 mg of Taurine at a time

is about right.

Serotoninergic depression = use Inositol, 1-3 tsp a day as needed. If

that isn't enough,

add tryptophan or 5 HTP. If that still doesn't do it, consider asking

doctor for an SSRI if

you are not chemically sensitive. If you are chemically sensitive or

if you can't take

codeine you are very unlikely to be able to tolerate SSRI's. In this

case add adrenal support

whether or not you think you need it.

For GABA problems, try GABA (duh - it doesn't work for everyone though

and has to be

taken several times a day), theanine, eating protein at every meal,

adrenalsupport and if

that isn't enough ask your doctor about anxiolytics. If the doc is

reasonable they'll offer

you BuSpar and a valium like drug (a benzodiazepine) for a month or

two until the BuSpar

starts working. BuSpar does not always work, you have to see if it is

good for you or not.

Ativan and Xanax seem to be fairly well tolerated. If you need round

the clock coverage

then Klonopin is a good choice - also this is good if you have MS or

mood instability.

Some over the counter anxiolytics are Kava Kava and chamomile. Do note

that all

anxiolytics are also sedatives.

For limbic problems make sure you have enough thyroid and sex

hormones, tryB-12 and

folic acid in large amounts ONLY if you are not prone to agitation,

the nutritional

supplement forskolin 10-30 mg 1-3 times a day, maybe try

dl-phenylalanine 500 mg 3-4

times a day (if you have a lot of pain or malaise this is good),

l-tyrosine 1-3 grams, or the

prescription drug selegiline 5-10 mg a day. All the stimulant

medications work excellently

for this but mostly it is not lawful to prescribe them for this purpose.

If you have low histamine depression, IF YOU ARE NOT ALLERGIC AND HAVE NO

INFLAMMATORY PROBLEM, try l-histidine 1-3 grams a day. If you are

allergicthis will

make your allergies dramatically worse and you must NOT do it. In that

case, take a lot of

nonsedating antihistamines and other allergy medications, for example

Allegra

(fexofenadine) and Singulair or Accolate and Nasalchrom as this may

let your body tolerate

more histamine. AVOID all medications that have antihistaminic side

effects and all

antihistamines that get into the brain (which is all the over the

counter ones).

For catecholamine depression try l-tyrosine 500-3000 mg a day, and

forskolin 10-30 mg

1-3 times a day.

If you have a lot of fear or apprehension sometimes beta blockers or

the alpha agonists

clonidine or guanfacine will releive that. These also lower blood

pressure.If your blood

pressure is already low you have adrenal problems and need to take

more adrenal support

before considering these.

If your mood is bouncing all over the place, you may have mood

instability and need

something for mood stabilization. Most doctors do not know that a lot

of these

medications work well at lower than normal doses but with much less

side effects - the

first thing to do if you may need them and aren't in such bad shape

you need a lot right

away to keep yourself out of trouble is to try 1/4 or 1/2 of the usual

amount and see how

you do. Most of the choices are Rx, GABA being the most notable OTC

choice. GABA has

to be taken several times a day. the Atkins diet also helps with this.

If your mood is bouncing and the period is days or longer, it can be

you are reacting to

dietary issues you haven't figured out yet, or you are chemically

sensitive. In these cases

all of the above won't help much until you avoid the offending foods

or chemicals, then

you may not need much help.

As a rule, if you really hate the mood stabilizers and don't want to

take them because of

how " flat " they make you feel, you truly do need them and it is

crucial to take them.

If you find yourself changing your program around a lot because of

what is happening to

you and are never sure what is going on, try adrenal support,

anxiolytics, identifying food

and chemical sensitivities, and if those don't resolve it, then try

mood stabilizers.

Most MD doctors just hand out SSRI's for everyone no matter what kind

of depression they

have. This is not useful. Find one who will at least try some

different stuff. If one or two

SSRI's didn't work, don't bother trying any more. Try different kinds

of agents. If the

doctor doesn't want to do that, go find a real doctor instead.

Andy

-- In frequent-dose-chelation , " Jen " wrote:

>

> As I noted in a previous post today, I did several months (in divided

> cycles) of DMSA about five years ago. I did some ALA at the time too.

> I remember thinking " When I start this again, I don't want to do the

> DMSA anymore. " I don't know why, as the ALA pulls it out of the brain

> as well. Maybe I've got a lot in my brain and I actually feel some

> relief from ALA that I don't feel from DMSA? Since I did DMSA then, is

> it ok to just start in on the ALA and see how it goes? Maybe a really

> low dose to start? I just remember feeling more toxic on the DMSA.

> Like the difference between a drug and a natural remedy. The ALA felt

> less harsh.

>

> Do people who have severe depression from detox have a lot of Hg in

> their brains? Is that a given? Is that why they have such extreme

> psychiatric symptoms?

>

[Guest guest]

Wow, that was a goldmine of information. Thanks for that Jada.

I burst out laughing about that comment about how there are many

different kinds of depression. I'll second that. I'm like the

eskimos with their many kinds of snow where that's concerned. It was

just funny to see it in print.

I think this is a seratonin issue. Haven't heard before about

inositol. Will look into that.

In my 20's I was on Trazadone and lithium for 8 years (I self-

diagnosed bipolar -- went into a psychiatrists office and made a

great case for it and he was happy to medicate me. It did help a

little with mood but I just got sicker and sicker physically and the

meds themselves eventually started causing panic attacks. A few

years before the panic attacks I added Buspar to the mix, I think now

because the other two were causing anxiety and eventually the trio

led to not only anxiety but all out panic attacks. I can't take

Tylenol anymore (not that I ever liked taking it and rarely did)

because it causes anxiety. I don't think my liver could/can handle

Rx drugs. I have read though that Hg toxicity can cause lithium

deficiency so I might consider taking that low-dose again.

My moods are all over the place this summer. Haven't experienced

anything like this in a long time. When I learned about the mercury

and got off all the Rx meds, the panic attacks stopped. No

consequences re: stopping those meds. Minerals and herbs --

everything else I was supplementing with after that seemed to take

care of it. After that I could identify what was causing the

depression and address it. I could see it was all cause and effect.

Might try GABA again, can't remember what happened when I took that

before...

OK! I found my old e-mails about my dosing in '03. I wonder if the

recommendations haven't changed since then because I thought at the

time I was taking what most others were taking.

" >With the DMSA, I started at 25 mg every 3-4 hrs, even at night, and

increased by 25 mg/dose every 3 days or so. "

Another e-mail to someone I'm talking about how sick I felt but I was

drinking green tea at the time as well which is on my no-no list of

detoxifiers now, and surely that didn't help matters, but I was up to

100 mg/dose of ALA every 3-4 hrs. (!)

I also found: " >I took ALA with some DMSA thrown

in last fall and only DMSA the last few weeks. " My mother was asking

about DMSA for her lead chelation so it sounds like I only took the

DMSA during that fall and the rest of the time I was taking only ALA.

Also, in one of those e-mails, I say that people have advised me that

DMSA is a stronger chelator of iron and that my first few cycles with

it went better than the later ones. My theory was that it was

draining me of iron. This was before I realized how much iron I need

to take on a daily basis. Maybe I would tolerate it better now

because I know that.

And I found this, re: colostrum, which I've since forgotten, is this

the case? Would this help during chelation?: " it protects against

infection, binds to iron and gets it to the blood cells before any

bacteria or anything can feed on it or before any chelator can grab

it so it helps to prevent anemia while you are chelating. "

So I was taking pretty decent doses of chelators. I seem to remember

going through at least 5 or 6 bottles of DMSA.

Is there any way to get tryptophan without a prescription? 5HTP did

funky things to me, can't remember what, might have been a blood-

sugar problem or something. Just promised myself I'd never take that

stuff again.

I dunno. Knowing how perfectly stable my moods were and how great I

felt just keeping the Hg locked in place makes it tempting to just

live out the rest of my life that way. It certainly didn't have any

consequences for me in terms of my moods just sitting there,

undisturbed.

Thanks again,

Jen

> >

> > As I noted in a previous post today, I did several months (in

divided

> > cycles) of DMSA about five years ago. I did some ALA at the time

too.

> > I remember thinking " When I start this again, I don't want to do

the

> > DMSA anymore. " I don't know why, as the ALA pulls it out of the

brain

> > as well. Maybe I've got a lot in my brain and I actually feel

some

> > relief from ALA that I don't feel from DMSA? Since I did DMSA

then, is

> > it ok to just start in on the ALA and see how it goes? Maybe a

really

> > low dose to start? I just remember feeling more toxic on the

DMSA.

> > Like the difference between a drug and a natural remedy. The ALA

felt

> > less harsh.

> >

> > Do people who have severe depression from detox have a lot of Hg

in

> > their brains? Is that a given? Is that why they have such

extreme

> > psychiatric symptoms?

> >

>