Re: MRSA /Kim

July 16, 2003

Hi Kim,

I wanted to tell you that this time I printed this post. You have

written about this before and I fail to printed but this time I got

it.

Also, I bought from Shaklee, Chewable Cal Mag plus. I assume a

serving is for an adult, so it says, serving size, 4 tablets, which

contains the following things, Vitamin D (as cholecalciferol) 250 IU,

Calcium as CA carbonate and CA citrate, 1000mg, Magnesium as Mg oxide

100mg, it also has zinc, copper, manganese and Boron but very

minimal. Here are my questions for you, Is this a good thing for

a, she is getting ready to start TOBI, come September, so I want

to prepare her body. If you think that this supplement is good for

somebody with cf how much should I give her, She will be 10 come July

28th, she is 4ft6in and weighs around 85lbs.

Also, and yourself have been talking(posts) on Sharktank,

about the interaction between Calcium and magnesium in the cells, in

your opinion, do you think is a good thing for a Cf patient to take

both elements together as in the one that I bought. God I wish I had

listen more closely when I took Chemistry I!!!!:-)

Thank you!!!

mom of a 9 wcf, Venanzio 7 nocf, Pepe 3nocf

> > Dear Group,

> >

> > I'm new to this list, as a woman with CF who has not

> > yet reached parenthood. I have a question to impose on

> > the group. When a CF individual has MRSA is there any

> > hope of eradicating it completely from his or her

> > lungs? What is the prevalence of MRSA amongst the CF

> > population? Can infected individuals continue to

> > pursue a nursing career? Must this also be given up?

> > Earnestly waiting and hoping to receive some replies.

> > Thank you.

> >

> > Mindy

July 16, 2003

In a message dated 7/16/2003 4:46:38 PM Central Daylight Time,

annapalazola@... writes:

>

> Hi Kim,

>

> I wanted to tell you that this time I printed this post. You have

> written about this before and I fail to printed but this time I got

> it.

> Also, I bought from Shaklee, Chewable Cal Mag plus. I assume a

> serving is for an adult, so it says, serving size, 4 tablets, which

> contains the following things, Vitamin D (as cholecalciferol) 250 IU,

> Calcium as CA carbonate and CA citrate, 1000mg, Magnesium as Mg oxide

> 100mg, it also has zinc, copper, manganese and Boron but very

> minimal. Here are my questions for you, Is this a good thing for

> a, she is getting ready to start TOBI, come September, so I want

> to prepare her body. If you think that this supplement is good for

> somebody with cf how much should I give her, She will be 10 come July

> 28th, she is 4ft6in and weighs around 85lbs.

> Also, and yourself have been talking(posts) on Sharktank,

> about the interaction between Calcium and magnesium in the cells, in

> your opinion, do you think is a good thing for a Cf patient to take

> both elements together as in the one that I bought. God I wish I had

> listen more closely when I took Chemistry I!!!!:-)

> Thank you!!!

>

> mom of a 9 wcf, Venanzio 7 nocf, Pepe 3nocf

,

I have two daughters with CF and I have them both on the Shaklee magnesium

Calcium chewable they take two a day. My oldest will be 11 on July 21 and she

weight about 89 pounds. They have used these vitamins while they are on the Tobi

and off of the Tobi and have had know problems with them. I hope this helps

Deb A

July 16, 2003

Hi ,

If this product works for a, then fine. Personally, I'm not

thrilled with the types of minerals in this product. They're cheap,

poorly absorbed minerals.

They used calcium carbonate, which isn't well absorbed (can actually

cause constipation in some people). Calcium citrate is better absorbed

than carbonate. And the magnesium they used is magnesium oxide, which

is the least bioavailable of all forms and can cause diarrhea or loose

stools at high doses. So why bother?

Boron is necessary for bone health; zinc, copper and manganese are

necessary minerals too. I've read reports of low manganese associated

with asthma. And as previously mentioned, vitamin D can't be absorbed

if the body is deficient in magnesium.

It seems rather irresponsible that the company didn't list on the

bottle whether this is an adult or child dose. But based on the values

of four tablets it looks like an adult dose.

According to the USDA, a *healthy* girl a's age needs 240 mg.

magnesium a day. After she reaches age 13, she'll need 360 mg. a day

(and more protein to help absorb the magnesium).

Remember, this amount is the *minimum* daily requirement for a

*healthy* girl. The NIH and USDA admit that RDA's were developed as

*minimum* amounts necessary to *prevent* death in otherwise healthy

people. RDA's were not calculated to ensure health, prevent disease,

or help chronic health problems -- they are only the minimum needed to

prevent death in otherwise healthy people!

And they especially recognize that in malabsorption syndromes (i.e.,

celiac, CF, etc.) daily requirement needs are higher. Though they

won't tell you how much higher because everyone is different.

The USDA bases nutrient needs (RDAs) by age groups. However, a

California nutritionist who studies magnesium deficiency uses a

different technique for determining magnesium needs. Her rule of thumb

is 2.4 to 4.5 mg. per pound of IDEAL body weight.

When I questioned her about IDEAL body weight, she confirmed that she

means this is what you should weigh for your height and age, which may

be different from your *current* body weight.

She said a healthy person would use the lower number (2.4 mg.) but

someone with health issues or chronic disease would use higher

amounts, up to 4.5 mg.

There must be something to her system. I've gradually increased my

intake and when I went back to do the math, my daily magnesium intake

matches her calculations of 4.5 x ideal body weight!

So because a has health issues (CF), you use the higher number --

4.5 mg. instead of 2.4 mg. to calculate her daily needs.

I don't know a's " ideal " weight, but based on her current weight:

4.5 mg. x 85 pounds = 382.5 mg. per day.

According to a book I have, average height and weight for girls age

11-13 is 5' 1 " and 101 pounds. Average height and weight for girls age

7-10 is 4' 3 " and 62 pounds.

4.5 mg. x 101 lbs. = 454.5 mg.

4.5 mg. x 62 lbs. = 279 mg.

I'm inclined to think that a's current weight of 85 lbs. --

whether or not that's her ideal weight, is a good marker. Cutting up

the one of the magnesium tablets to get exactly 382.5 mg. is nuts. So

heck, I'd just go with 3 1/2 to 4 tablets.

Wait. I forgot you don't have the same magnesium I do. I have 100 mg.

tablets of magnesium glycinate, but you don't. So forget what I said

about cutting the tablet unless you have 100 mg. tablets.

Anyway, I wouldn't bother with calcium carbonate or magnesium oxide

products. You don't want to risk constipation or loose stools, or

bother with poor absorption. Minerals are trickier things then most

people realize, so just go ahead and get the good stuff. (The product

you want is on the top left or top right of the page. They're the same

thing, but the one on the right is a better buy.)

http://www.houseofnutrition.com/m1.html

Also, I've read that eventually poorly absorbed minerals can cause

long term absorption problems for all minerals. But I haven't

investigated that claim.

Kim

--- " Palazola " <annapalazola@y...>

wrote:

> Hi Kim,

>

> I wanted to tell you that this time I printed this post. You have

> written about this before and I fail to printed but this time I got

> it.

> Also, I bought from Shaklee, Chewable Cal Mag plus. I assume a

> serving is for an adult, so it says, serving size, 4 tablets, which

> contains the following things, Vitamin D (as cholecalciferol) 250

IU,

> Calcium as CA carbonate and CA citrate, 1000mg, Magnesium as Mg

oxide

> 100mg, it also has zinc, copper, manganese and Boron but very

> minimal. Here are my questions for you, Is this a good thing for

> a, she is getting ready to start TOBI, come September, so I want

> to prepare her body. If you think that this supplement is good for

> somebody with cf how much should I give her, She will be 10 come

July

> 28th, she is 4ft6in and weighs around 85lbs.

> Also, and yourself have been talking(posts) on Sharktank,

> about the interaction between Calcium and magnesium in the cells, in

> your opinion, do you think is a good thing for a Cf patient to take

> both elements together as in the one that I bought. God I wish I had

> listen more closely when I took Chemistry I!!!!:-)

> Thank you!!!

>

> mom of a 9 wcf, Venanzio 7 nocf, Pepe 3nocf

July 17, 2003

Kim,

Shaklee is known to be one of the best for absorbing the most of your

vitamin. I was told to put a pill in a glass of water and see how fast it starts

to

desolve and it did very quickly. Deb A

July 17, 2003

Hi Deb,

Minerals dissolve in water. The thing is the process gets trickier

trying to get complex minerals across cell membranes. Bioavailable

means something is available for the cell to use. Just because

something is absorbed, doesn't mean it's bioavailable. And certain

inorganic or salts such as carbonates, oxides, etc. aren't highly

bioavailable.

Think of a mesh window screen -- pretend that's like the membrane of a

cell. It's permeable to an extent. Next, pour water filled with

marbles onto the mesh. The marbles are complex minerals. Complex

minerals have a higher molecular weight that prevents them from being

taken up by the cell.

The intestines absorb smaller molecular items first. It was thought

that amino acids were the smallest, but dipeptides are smaller. So

basically what this means is that if you wrap amino acid or dipeptide

molecules around a mineral, you fool the body and the mineral is

sneaked into the cell.

BUT, that doesn't work for just every chelated mineral. It all

involves ions and electrical stuff. Albion Labs patented a away to

remove the electrical charge, making it a neutral, so the chelated

mineral is stable, and more highly absorbable.

To the general " healthy " population, maybe this isn't so important.

But when you're dealing with malabsorption problems and chronic

illness, nutrients are a big deal.

Sure, I saw my son improve after adding just 128 mg. daily of

magnesium chloride. We feel that his body was so starved for

magnesium that it latched on to whatever it could get. But his health

really started improving more when he switched to Albion's chelated

magnesium glycinate. And there's no denying that magnesium oxide,

magnesium chloride, and magnesium citrate did absolutely nothing for

me. But within 48-hours of using Albion's magnesium glycinate I saw

incredible results. My two-month bout of insomnia ended and I had

incredible energy. And after increasing my dose to 400 mg. a day, I

know longer have chronic sinus headaches, no more IBS, and my

migraines are few and far between and when I do get a migraine I can

control it at home with meds.

Each of us has to use what we're comfortable with. But all the

research I've read shows that magnesium oxide is the least

bioavailable -- remember, the cells won't take it up as well as

others. And if you take certain forms of magnesium at high doses, then

you run the risk of loose stools or diarrhea, and with CF you just

can't fool around with that.

By the way, I *still* think you need to get those girls of yours

modeling contracts! Has any pharmaceutical company ever approached you

about using their photo in one of the calendars they usually produce?

Kim

Kim,

Shaklee is known to be one of the best for absorbing the most of

your vitamin. I was told to put a pill in a glass of water and see how

fast it starts to desolve and it did very quickly. Deb A

July 18, 2003

Dawn, thanks for this tip. I've talked to a few other moms who've said

they've tried crushing and adding the magnesium to fruit sauces but

apparently it makes it chalky or something, I can't remember now.

I'm wondering if you've ever tried mixing it into yogurt? I've

suggested it in the past but I don't know if anyone has actually tried

it in yogurt. Putting it in yogurt kills two birds with one stone

because of the probiotic effect yogurt has. But magnesium really needs

something acidic to be absorbed well.

I know a couple moms still struggling to get magnesium into their

kids, so if anyone has any other suggestions, I'd really love to hear

success stories!

Kim

I crush Patti's magnesium, add a tad of powdered sugar and then pour

in just enough apple and white grape juice to make it smooth. Patti

eats it right down and says it's yummy...of course she is two. That's

how we get all her large pills or yucky meds down her.

Dawn mom of 4, 7 and under, the youngest wcf

July 18, 2003

It is chalky, but the sweet of the powdered sugar and the juice make it a

nonissue for her. My kids don't eat many sweets so **viola ** she thinks it's

good. :-)

By the way Kim, Patti just successfully beat her first cold with out an

antibiotic. Big hip-hoorays to the magnesium and teatree oil.

Dawn mom of 4, 7 and under, the youngest wcf

Re: MRSA /Kim

Dawn, thanks for this tip. I've talked to a few other moms who've said

they've tried crushing and adding the magnesium to fruit sauces but

apparently it makes it chalky or something, I can't remember now.

I'm wondering if you've ever tried mixing it into yogurt? I've

suggested it in the past but I don't know if anyone has actually tried

it in yogurt. Putting it in yogurt kills two birds with one stone

because of the probiotic effect yogurt has. But magnesium really needs

something acidic to be absorbed well.

I know a couple moms still struggling to get magnesium into their

kids, so if anyone has any other suggestions, I'd really love to hear

success stories!

Kim

I crush Patti's magnesium, add a tad of powdered sugar and then pour

in just enough apple and white grape juice to make it smooth. Patti

eats it right down and says it's yummy...of course she is two. That's

how we get all her large pills or yucky meds down her.

Dawn mom of 4, 7 and under, the youngest wcf

July 18, 2003

Oh, hurray on beating the cold!

Our family still swears by the vitamin C + zinc regimen whenever we

feel a cold coming on, which is really rare. I remember 's

freshman year of college -- all his friends caught colds but he

didn't. At the time, he said he thought it was because he takes 1,000

mg. vitamin C a day. That was back in '98, and since then has

only had two colds, but the first one he nipped in the bud with

vitamin C, zinc, and lavender EO inhalations. The second cold he was

just worn down and weathered through it, but still the cold didn't

even last a week.

Dawn, I can't remember if you're also on Crataegus list, if so, have

you seen the posts from about how quickly magnesium quieted his

dry night time cough spasms? He called me a couple days ago, still

amazed and singing praises that bumping his magnesium dose to 1,000

mg. worked so quickly to control his nonproductive cough. It makes

sense, after all, ERs sometimes give magnesium sulphate via IV for

people presenting with a severe asthma episode. He checked with his

doctor who said that using 1,000 mg. for a while is perfectly okay.

I wish had his open-minded doctor!

Kim

--- " & Dawn Meeks " <johndawn@w...> wrote:

It is chalky, but the sweet of the powdered sugar and the juice make

it a nonissue for her. My kids don't eat many sweets so **viola **

she thinks it's good. :-)

By the way Kim, Patti just successfully beat her first cold with out

an antibiotic. Big hip-hoorays to the magnesium and teatree oil.

Dawn mom of 4, 7 and under, the youngest wcf

July 18, 2003

No, I'm not on the Crataegus list...but perhaps I should be. :-) I'll have to

remember that about the nonproductive cough.