Mia's Evaluation/Pictures

April 16, 2009

We had our evaluation at CT in Charlotte yesterday. It has been a longggg week! Mia was having a repeat pH Study (Reflux) from Tuesday to Wednesday morning in Atlanta (~1 hour each way), so there was already a lot of traveling going on... and after she finished yesterday morning, we headed straight to Charlotte (~3 1/2 hours each way) for her evaluation, and then headed home. We got back really late and then I had to scramble around all morning getting 'the sister' to preschool and Mia to back to back therapy. I need a long NAP!

Anyway, everything went fine at CT. It was actually really nice to SEE what I have been THINKING that I was seeing in photos and measurements. It makes me feel like I'm not just crazy. Mia really made them earn their keep, though. She has some sensory issues and really doesn't like being touched, especially her head.. so she screamed hysterically the entire time and all they were doing was trying to get photos and measurements! It made things very challenging. I was shocked that they even got the photos that they did because she barely stopped screaming the entire consult, and we were there for close to 2 hours! I was also worried that because she was so upset, the pictures wouldn't show her 'true' Torticollis, but they did for the most part. It's a bit worse in real life, but they saw that 'in person' - so it really doesn't matter.

Her actual Plagiocephaly is moderate. If it was JUST that, I wouldn't be so concerned and I can't say that we would band. In fact, I can almost certainly say that we wouldn't. She will have hair that will mostly cover it, and it isn't severe by any means. It's to the right, so it's difficult to get good photos of, and it's a bit worse than it appears - but not by much. They said that the flatness straight across is mostly because of her fontanelle that is still open, and that it's something we should watch.

But. And there's always a 'but', right? Because of the Torticollis/Plagiocephaly, she has some significant asymmetry going on.. which is what I was really concerned about going in. I had definitely noticed that her right ear seemed shifted forward.. but I had a hard time differentiating what was 'real' and what was her mommy over-analyzing things. So it was really comforting to have someone else see it, too. So my biggest concerns were her right ear being more forward than the left and her left eye seeming a bit smaller/weighed down (because there is more 'head' on that side). And those things were confirmed. The left side of her forehead is flatter than the right and her right ear/eye/cheek are anterior to the left. One side of her cheek/jaw is also shifted, but I can't recall which side. I want to say that it's the right, but I'm not sure.

And for those reasons, they think that she absolutely needs a band. Clearly, it's a cosmetic issue... I don't really want her to be insecure about having her hair up because one ear is closer to her face than the other.. or because one eye is smaller. It would also make things like getting glasses that fit complicated. And it could absolutely cause jaw issues later... I've had my fair share, including braces as an adult - so that's not something we need. So I left the visit pretty certain that we would go ahead with it.

But I still have some hestiations. I talked to her SLP (speech/feeding therapist) about it this morning and found out that she had Torticollis as a child, including surgery in the first grade to loosen the muscle! I had no idea! She said that she still has issues with finding glasses that fit on her ears and nose correctly, but that otherwise it doesn't bother her much - and she looks 'normal' to me. She seemed to agree with my outlook (that I stole from someone here! thank you, it's helped tremendously!) that we will never regret doing it, but may regret not doing it. I also asked her OT what she thought, and she seemed to agree also... though she gasped at the pricetag (and insisted that there were cheaper options) and she also said that usually kids that they see there with helmets have much more severe Plagiocephaly. Again, if she didn't have the facial asymmetry, I wouldn't be too concerned about her flatness. It's the facial shift that really concerns me. She recommended that I ask her PT what she thought.. since she knows much more about Torticollis, but her PT is usually all rainbows and sunshine and writes most things off because they could be worse , so I don't think her opinion will really alter mine.

So while I was pleased with our appointment for the most part, I still have some concerns/questions. If anyone has any insight, please share!

1) What ARE the other options, outside of CT? I know that there are other companies, but after researching it a bit - it seemed like CT was much more reputable and had better success. Are the other companies/types of bands significantly cheaper? The price won't hold us back if she needs it (it's $3k for us since we're military), but if it's like 'buying the name brand even though the store brand works fine', I'd like to know. I don't think that's the case, but I want to ask anyway! Cranial bands are a Tricare exclusion, so I'm not sure it's worth the trouble in appealing them a hundred times.

2) Can facial asymmetry ever correct itself without a band? Since Mia has developmental delays, she is not yet sitting and probably won't be anytime soon. She does spend a lot of time on her tummy, but the Tort/Plagio/Asymmetry has definitely worsened even with that.

3) If she does a band and her facial asymmetry corrects, how common is it to have it occur again after removing the band?

4) Could someone help me understand her measurements? I can't remember which mean what!

Traditional Cranial Vault Asymmetry: 5

fzR-euL: 138

fzL-euR: 133

Cranial Vault Asymmetry: 8

fzR-OcpL: 148

fzL-OcpR: 140

Skull Base Asymmetry: 10

sn-tL: 83

sn:tR: 73

Also, when you have your DSi photos done, do you usually notice that the measurements are the same as the manual ones, better, or worse?

I think that's it. Other than the inevitable, 'if you were in my shoes, what would you do?' question! I am uploading her scans under M shortly.

Kim

April 16, 2009

Generally speaking, the top 3 most used band types (DOC, Star and Hanger)

usually run between 3000-3600. There are some independant helmet

companies/orthos that might run cheaper, and there are sometimes Star or Hanger

orthos that cut breaks if there is no insurance coverage (though that is VERY

rare). I know it is a steep price, and we were lucky to have 75% of ours covered

by insurance, but when you keep in mind that it includes everything (the scan,

custom fabrication, and every office visit - even in-between visits for

unforeseen issues), it really isn't more than a doctor's office or specialist

would charge for their office visits (when the majority of those are covered by

insurance and we only pay co-pays, I think we lose sight of just how much

doctors charge for stuff).

Based on just her numbers, yes, it seems like her plagio is mild-moderate, but I

do see your concern in her asymmetry because her skull base is 10mm off (that is

the ears and lower part of the head). The asymmetry is the hardest and usually

last to correct, so I think you definitely need to go the helmet route. My son

wore 2 DOCBands and still had asymmetry after graduation, but only because he

wasn't banded until 17 months old and was growing much slower. If you band her

now, you have a better chance of correcting the asym (maybe not 100%, but my son

went from 15mm to 6mm for his skull base, so younger babies should see some

correction for sure).

I've never heard of facial asym getting worse again after graduating from the

band. If it corrects, it should be fine afterwards. My son's has gotten slightly

better as he's gotten older, not his ears, but his eye and cheek asym has

improved, with increased muscle tone in his face.

I've been on this board for over a year and have NEVER heard of Tricare paying

for a helmet ever. I feel bad that the military can't provide better coverage in

that area. Where are you located again? You would just need to do a internet

search to see if you have any other helmet options in your area. Again, with the

amount of time I've been on this board, I've never heard a bad thing about

Cranial Tech's DOCBand. I actually could have gotten a STARBand locally, but

travelled almost 3 hours to CT because I was certain they would be able to help

my son (who was older). Other bands, it just depends, they are supposed to work

just as well, but if you end up going to an inexperienced ortho, you could come

out of it worse than you went in (it's not a common thing, but it's definitely

happened quite a few times that I've heard of). If you do find other options in

your area, I would suggest posting them to see if anyone else has gone there and

what experiences they had. (or you can do a search of old messages).

The DSI scan does not take measurements at all. It's just a 3D image of the

head, done before and after treatment. The hand measurements are the only

numbers you'll see at CT, and they don't really put that much weight into the

numbers anyway. They make a " headsicle " mold of the baby's head that you will

see at every visit, so you can remember what they started as and see where

they've made improvement. They do things more visually there.

I tried to answer everything. Hope that helps!

Jake-2.5 (DOCBand Grad 9/08)

Jordan-5

>

> We had our evaluation at CT in Charlotte yesterday. It has been a longggg

> week! Mia was having a repeat pH Study (Reflux) from Tuesday to Wednesday

> morning in Atlanta (~1 hour each way), so there was already a lot of

> traveling going on... and after she finished yesterday morning, we headed

> straight to Charlotte (~3 1/2 hours each way) for her evaluation, and then

> headed home. We got back really late and then I had to scramble around all

> morning getting 'the sister' to preschool and Mia to back to back therapy. I

> need a long NAP!

>

> Anyway, everything went fine at CT. It was actually really nice to SEE what

> I have been THINKING that I was seeing in photos and measurements. It makes

> me feel like I'm not just crazy. Mia really made them earn their keep,

> though. She has some sensory issues and really doesn't like being touched,

> especially her head.. so she screamed hysterically the entire time and all

> they were doing was trying to get photos and measurements! It made things

> very challenging. I was shocked that they even got the photos that they did

> because she barely stopped screaming the entire consult, and we were there

> for close to 2 hours! I was also worried that because she was so upset, the

> pictures wouldn't show her 'true' Torticollis, but they did for the most

> part. It's a bit worse in real life, but they saw that 'in person' - so it

> really doesn't matter.

>

> Her actual Plagiocephaly is moderate. If it was JUST that, I wouldn't be so

> concerned and I can't say that we would band. In fact, I can almost

> certainly say that we wouldn't. She will have hair that will mostly cover

> it, and it isn't severe by any means. It's to the right, so it's difficult

> to get good photos of, and it's a bit worse than it appears - but not by

> much. They said that the flatness straight across is mostly because of her

> fontanelle that is still open, and that it's something we should watch.

>

> But. And there's always a 'but', right? Because of the

> Torticollis/Plagiocephaly, she has some significant asymmetry going on..

> which is what I was really concerned about going in. I had definitely

> noticed that her right ear seemed shifted forward.. but I had a hard time

> differentiating what was 'real' and what was her mommy over-analyzing

> things. So it was really comforting to have someone else see it, too. So my

> biggest concerns were her right ear being more forward than the left and her

> left eye seeming a bit smaller/weighed down (because there is more 'head' on

> that side). And those things were confirmed. The left side of her forehead

> is flatter than the right and her right ear/eye/cheek are anterior to the

> left. One side of her cheek/jaw is also shifted, but I can't recall which

> side. I want to say that it's the right, but I'm not sure.

>

> And for those reasons, they think that she absolutely needs a band. Clearly,

> it's a cosmetic issue... I don't really want her to be insecure about having

> her hair up because one ear is closer to her face than the other.. or

> because one eye is smaller. It would also make things like getting glasses

> that fit complicated. And it could absolutely cause jaw issues later... I've

> had my fair share, including braces as an adult - so that's not something we

> need. So I left the visit pretty certain that we would go ahead with it.

>

> But I still have some hestiations. I talked to her SLP (speech/feeding

> therapist) about it this morning and found out that she had Torticollis as a

> child, including surgery in the first grade to loosen the muscle! I had no

> idea! She said that she still has issues with finding glasses that fit on

> her ears and nose correctly, but that otherwise it doesn't bother her much -

> and she looks 'normal' to me. She seemed to agree with my outlook (that I

> stole from someone here! thank you, it's helped tremendously!) that we will

> never regret doing it, but may regret not doing it. I also asked her OT what

> she thought, and she seemed to agree also... though she gasped at the

> pricetag (and insisted that there were cheaper options) and she also said

> that usually kids that they see there with helmets have much more severe

> Plagiocephaly. Again, if she didn't have the facial asymmetry, I wouldn't be

> too concerned about her flatness. It's the facial shift that really concerns

> me. She recommended that I ask her PT what she thought.. since she knows

> much more about Torticollis, but her PT is usually all rainbows and sunshine

> and writes most things off because they *could* be worse , so I don't think

> her opinion will really alter mine.

>

> So while I was pleased with our appointment for the most part, I still have

> some concerns/questions. If anyone has any insight, please share!

>

> 1) What ARE the other options, outside of CT? I know that there are other

> companies, but after researching it a bit - it seemed like CT was much more

> reputable and had better success. Are the other companies/types of bands

> significantly cheaper? The price won't hold us back if she needs it (it's

> $3k for us since we're military), but if it's like 'buying the name brand

> even though the store brand works fine', I'd like to know. I don't think

> that's the case, but I want to ask anyway! Cranial bands are a Tricare

> exclusion, so I'm not sure it's worth the trouble in appealing them a

> hundred times.

>

> 2) Can facial asymmetry ever correct itself without a band? Since Mia has

> developmental delays, she is not yet sitting and probably won't be anytime

> soon. She does spend a lot of time on her tummy, but the

> Tort/Plagio/Asymmetry has definitely worsened even with that.

>

> 3) If she does a band and her facial asymmetry corrects, how common is it to

> have it occur again after removing the band?

>

> 4) Could someone help me understand her measurements? I can't remember which

> mean what!

>

> Traditional Cranial Vault Asymmetry: 5

> fzR-euL: 138

> fzL-euR: 133

>

> Cranial Vault Asymmetry: 8

> fzR-OcpL: 148

> fzL-OcpR: 140

>

> Skull Base Asymmetry: 10

> sn-tL: 83

> sn:tR: 73

>

> Also, when you have your DSi photos done, do you usually notice that the

> measurements are the same as the manual ones, better, or worse?

>

> I think that's it. Other than the inevitable, 'if you were in my shoes, what

> would you do?' question! I am uploading her scans under M shortly.

>

> Kim

>

April 16, 2009

,

Thank you so much for your response! I really appreciate it.

I'm laughing at 'headsicle', ha!!

We traveled to CT because I repeatedly read exactly what you mentioned.. and I

figured that it made more sense to start with 'the best' than end up with 'the

best'. I'd rather not waste time/money using someone closer if we'll end up with

less success in the end.

You're right, it totally sucks that Tricare won't cover it. I think it's

ridiculous that any insurance won't, actually. We've had to jump through some

hoops, but they've ultimately covered all of her specialists, tests, therapy,

special formula, etc. So this is the first time that we've dealt with then

outright refusing to cover something. I had braces as an adult a few years ago,

so I'm just trying to look at this like I did that. I have never regretted my

decision to do that, even though some may consider it 'cosmetic', and I'm sure

we won't regret this decision, either. But if we don't do it and her asymmetry

does not correct or worsens, I'll always wonder 'what if' - but then it will be

too late.

They did say that we can use Angel Flight, but I'm not sure if it would just

make things more complicated. Has anyone done that? While the drive wouldn't be

fun, it could be worse. We will find our where we're moving next tomorrow.. if

it's to Norfolk, there is a CT about the same distance as what we would be

traveling now. If it's San Diego, there's one there. Anywhere else may be a bit

tricky, so we'll see.

There is a Hanger somewhere near here, I think.. but I've read a lot of negative

experiences about them. I am sure that there are plenty of people who think

other brands are just as good as CT, but CT seems to be the most consistent -

from what I've researched.

Thanks for the clarification on the DSi, I forgot that it was just digital

photographs compiled into a 'headsicle' - for some reason I thought that the 3-D

model would also give measurements, so it made me wonder how close they would be

to manual measurements.

The skull base measurement is from ear to ear across the back of the head? So

where you see her pen outline in the second set of photos, that's where the 10mm

are 'missing', right?

Or am I misunderstanding you? These measurements are a little (lot!) confusing!

Kim

> >

> > We had our evaluation at CT in Charlotte yesterday. It has been a longggg

> > week! Mia was having a repeat pH Study (Reflux) from Tuesday to Wednesday

> > morning in Atlanta (~1 hour each way), so there was already a lot of

> > traveling going on... and after she finished yesterday morning, we headed

> > straight to Charlotte (~3 1/2 hours each way) for her evaluation, and then

> > headed home. We got back really late and then I had to scramble around all

> > morning getting 'the sister' to preschool and Mia to back to back therapy. I

> > need a long NAP!

> >

> > Anyway, everything went fine at CT. It was actually really nice to SEE what

> > I have been THINKING that I was seeing in photos and measurements. It makes

> > me feel like I'm not just crazy. Mia really made them earn their keep,

> > though. She has some sensory issues and really doesn't like being touched,

> > especially her head.. so she screamed hysterically the entire time and all

> > they were doing was trying to get photos and measurements! It made things

> > very challenging. I was shocked that they even got the photos that they did

> > because she barely stopped screaming the entire consult, and we were there

> > for close to 2 hours! I was also worried that because she was so upset, the

> > pictures wouldn't show her 'true' Torticollis, but they did for the most

> > part. It's a bit worse in real life, but they saw that 'in person' - so it

> > really doesn't matter.

> >

> > Her actual Plagiocephaly is moderate. If it was JUST that, I wouldn't be so

> > concerned and I can't say that we would band. In fact, I can almost

> > certainly say that we wouldn't. She will have hair that will mostly cover

> > it, and it isn't severe by any means. It's to the right, so it's difficult

> > to get good photos of, and it's a bit worse than it appears - but not by

> > much. They said that the flatness straight across is mostly because of her

> > fontanelle that is still open, and that it's something we should watch.

> >

> > But. And there's always a 'but', right? Because of the

> > Torticollis/Plagiocephaly, she has some significant asymmetry going on..

> > which is what I was really concerned about going in. I had definitely

> > noticed that her right ear seemed shifted forward.. but I had a hard time

> > differentiating what was 'real' and what was her mommy over-analyzing

> > things. So it was really comforting to have someone else see it, too. So my

> > biggest concerns were her right ear being more forward than the left and her

> > left eye seeming a bit smaller/weighed down (because there is more 'head' on

> > that side). And those things were confirmed. The left side of her forehead

> > is flatter than the right and her right ear/eye/cheek are anterior to the

> > left. One side of her cheek/jaw is also shifted, but I can't recall which

> > side. I want to say that it's the right, but I'm not sure.

> >

> > And for those reasons, they think that she absolutely needs a band. Clearly,

> > it's a cosmetic issue... I don't really want her to be insecure about having

> > her hair up because one ear is closer to her face than the other.. or

> > because one eye is smaller. It would also make things like getting glasses

> > that fit complicated. And it could absolutely cause jaw issues later... I've

> > had my fair share, including braces as an adult - so that's not something we

> > need. So I left the visit pretty certain that we would go ahead with it.

> >

> > But I still have some hestiations. I talked to her SLP (speech/feeding

> > therapist) about it this morning and found out that she had Torticollis as a

> > child, including surgery in the first grade to loosen the muscle! I had no

> > idea! She said that she still has issues with finding glasses that fit on

> > her ears and nose correctly, but that otherwise it doesn't bother her much -

> > and she looks 'normal' to me. She seemed to agree with my outlook (that I

> > stole from someone here! thank you, it's helped tremendously!) that we will

> > never regret doing it, but may regret not doing it. I also asked her OT what

> > she thought, and she seemed to agree also... though she gasped at the

> > pricetag (and insisted that there were cheaper options) and she also said

> > that usually kids that they see there with helmets have much more severe

> > Plagiocephaly. Again, if she didn't have the facial asymmetry, I wouldn't be

> > too concerned about her flatness. It's the facial shift that really concerns

> > me. She recommended that I ask her PT what she thought.. since she knows

> > much more about Torticollis, but her PT is usually all rainbows and sunshine

> > and writes most things off because they *could* be worse , so I don't think

> > her opinion will really alter mine.

> >

> > So while I was pleased with our appointment for the most part, I still have

> > some concerns/questions. If anyone has any insight, please share!

> >

> > 1) What ARE the other options, outside of CT? I know that there are other

> > companies, but after researching it a bit - it seemed like CT was much more

> > reputable and had better success. Are the other companies/types of bands

> > significantly cheaper? The price won't hold us back if she needs it (it's

> > $3k for us since we're military), but if it's like 'buying the name brand

> > even though the store brand works fine', I'd like to know. I don't think

> > that's the case, but I want to ask anyway! Cranial bands are a Tricare

> > exclusion, so I'm not sure it's worth the trouble in appealing them a

> > hundred times.

> >

> > 2) Can facial asymmetry ever correct itself without a band? Since Mia has

> > developmental delays, she is not yet sitting and probably won't be anytime

> > soon. She does spend a lot of time on her tummy, but the

> > Tort/Plagio/Asymmetry has definitely worsened even with that.

> >

> > 3) If she does a band and her facial asymmetry corrects, how common is it to

> > have it occur again after removing the band?

> >

> > 4) Could someone help me understand her measurements? I can't remember which

> > mean what!

> >

> > Traditional Cranial Vault Asymmetry: 5

> > fzR-euL: 138

> > fzL-euR: 133

> >

> > Cranial Vault Asymmetry: 8

> > fzR-OcpL: 148

> > fzL-OcpR: 140

> >

> > Skull Base Asymmetry: 10

> > sn-tL: 83

> > sn:tR: 73

> >

> > Also, when you have your DSi photos done, do you usually notice that the

> > measurements are the same as the manual ones, better, or worse?

> >

> > I think that's it. Other than the inevitable, 'if you were in my shoes, what

> > would you do?' question! I am uploading her scans under M shortly.

> >

> > Kim

> >

>

April 16, 2009

Sorry, I hadn't even looked at her photostudy when I first responded, I was

simply going by the numbers you posted in your message. What stuck out to me

there, was that the highest number was in her skull base, and " typically " the

cranial vault numbers will be higher or equal to the skull base, not less than,

so that jumped out to me there.

The skull base asym is the difference of each side measured nose to ear (nose to

right ear minus nose to left ear, or vice versa). So in her photostudy, the one

where she's lying down, looking up her nose, and the pen marks are showing the

misalignment in her ears...that's the 10mm of asym in her skull base. As the

ears shift into alignment, that number will go down.

At least two people on the board have used Angel Flights, so hopefully they'll

tell you their experiences. Hopefully you'll end up in San Diego and it won't be

an issue!

Good luck!

Jake-2.5 (DOCBand Grad 9/08)

Jordan-5

> > >

> > > We had our evaluation at CT in Charlotte yesterday. It has been a longggg

> > > week! Mia was having a repeat pH Study (Reflux) from Tuesday to Wednesday

> > > morning in Atlanta (~1 hour each way), so there was already a lot of

> > > traveling going on... and after she finished yesterday morning, we headed

> > > straight to Charlotte (~3 1/2 hours each way) for her evaluation, and then

> > > headed home. We got back really late and then I had to scramble around all

> > > morning getting 'the sister' to preschool and Mia to back to back therapy.

I

> > > need a long NAP!

> > >

> > > Anyway, everything went fine at CT. It was actually really nice to SEE

what

> > > I have been THINKING that I was seeing in photos and measurements. It

makes

> > > me feel like I'm not just crazy. Mia really made them earn their keep,

> > > though. She has some sensory issues and really doesn't like being touched,

> > > especially her head.. so she screamed hysterically the entire time and all

> > > they were doing was trying to get photos and measurements! It made things

> > > very challenging. I was shocked that they even got the photos that they

did

> > > because she barely stopped screaming the entire consult, and we were there

> > > for close to 2 hours! I was also worried that because she was so upset,

the

> > > pictures wouldn't show her 'true' Torticollis, but they did for the most

> > > part. It's a bit worse in real life, but they saw that 'in person' - so it

> > > really doesn't matter.

> > >

> > > Her actual Plagiocephaly is moderate. If it was JUST that, I wouldn't be

so

> > > concerned and I can't say that we would band. In fact, I can almost

> > > certainly say that we wouldn't. She will have hair that will mostly cover

> > > it, and it isn't severe by any means. It's to the right, so it's difficult

> > > to get good photos of, and it's a bit worse than it appears - but not by

> > > much. They said that the flatness straight across is mostly because of her

> > > fontanelle that is still open, and that it's something we should watch.

> > >

> > > But. And there's always a 'but', right? Because of the

> > > Torticollis/Plagiocephaly, she has some significant asymmetry going on..

> > > which is what I was really concerned about going in. I had definitely

> > > noticed that her right ear seemed shifted forward.. but I had a hard time

> > > differentiating what was 'real' and what was her mommy over-analyzing

> > > things. So it was really comforting to have someone else see it, too. So

my

> > > biggest concerns were her right ear being more forward than the left and

her

> > > left eye seeming a bit smaller/weighed down (because there is more 'head'

on

> > > that side). And those things were confirmed. The left side of her forehead

> > > is flatter than the right and her right ear/eye/cheek are anterior to the

> > > left. One side of her cheek/jaw is also shifted, but I can't recall which

> > > side. I want to say that it's the right, but I'm not sure.

> > >

> > > And for those reasons, they think that she absolutely needs a band.

Clearly,

> > > it's a cosmetic issue... I don't really want her to be insecure about

having

> > > her hair up because one ear is closer to her face than the other.. or

> > > because one eye is smaller. It would also make things like getting glasses

> > > that fit complicated. And it could absolutely cause jaw issues later...

I've

> > > had my fair share, including braces as an adult - so that's not something

we

> > > need. So I left the visit pretty certain that we would go ahead with it.

> > >

> > > But I still have some hestiations. I talked to her SLP (speech/feeding

> > > therapist) about it this morning and found out that she had Torticollis as

a

> > > child, including surgery in the first grade to loosen the muscle! I had no

> > > idea! She said that she still has issues with finding glasses that fit on

> > > her ears and nose correctly, but that otherwise it doesn't bother her much

-

> > > and she looks 'normal' to me. She seemed to agree with my outlook (that I

> > > stole from someone here! thank you, it's helped tremendously!) that we

will

> > > never regret doing it, but may regret not doing it. I also asked her OT

what

> > > she thought, and she seemed to agree also... though she gasped at the

> > > pricetag (and insisted that there were cheaper options) and she also said

> > > that usually kids that they see there with helmets have much more severe

> > > Plagiocephaly. Again, if she didn't have the facial asymmetry, I wouldn't

be

> > > too concerned about her flatness. It's the facial shift that really

concerns

> > > me. She recommended that I ask her PT what she thought.. since she knows

> > > much more about Torticollis, but her PT is usually all rainbows and

sunshine

> > > and writes most things off because they *could* be worse , so I don't

think

> > > her opinion will really alter mine.

> > >

> > > So while I was pleased with our appointment for the most part, I still

have

> > > some concerns/questions. If anyone has any insight, please share!

> > >

> > > 1) What ARE the other options, outside of CT? I know that there are other

> > > companies, but after researching it a bit - it seemed like CT was much

more

> > > reputable and had better success. Are the other companies/types of bands

> > > significantly cheaper? The price won't hold us back if she needs it (it's

> > > $3k for us since we're military), but if it's like 'buying the name brand

> > > even though the store brand works fine', I'd like to know. I don't think

> > > that's the case, but I want to ask anyway! Cranial bands are a Tricare

> > > exclusion, so I'm not sure it's worth the trouble in appealing them a

> > > hundred times.

> > >

> > > 2) Can facial asymmetry ever correct itself without a band? Since Mia has

> > > developmental delays, she is not yet sitting and probably won't be anytime

> > > soon. She does spend a lot of time on her tummy, but the

> > > Tort/Plagio/Asymmetry has definitely worsened even with that.

> > >

> > > 3) If she does a band and her facial asymmetry corrects, how common is it

to

> > > have it occur again after removing the band?

> > >

> > > 4) Could someone help me understand her measurements? I can't remember

which

> > > mean what!

> > >

> > > Traditional Cranial Vault Asymmetry: 5

> > > fzR-euL: 138

> > > fzL-euR: 133

> > >

> > > Cranial Vault Asymmetry: 8

> > > fzR-OcpL: 148

> > > fzL-OcpR: 140

> > >

> > > Skull Base Asymmetry: 10

> > > sn-tL: 83

> > > sn:tR: 73

> > >

> > > Also, when you have your DSi photos done, do you usually notice that the

> > > measurements are the same as the manual ones, better, or worse?

> > >

> > > I think that's it. Other than the inevitable, 'if you were in my shoes,

what

> > > would you do?' question! I am uploading her scans under M shortly.

> > >

> > > Kim

> > >

> >

>

April 16, 2009

I use angel flights weeklySent via BlackBerry from T-MobileFrom: "" Date: Thu, 16 Apr 2009 19:42:37 -0000<Plagiocephaly >Subject: Re: Mia's Evaluation/Pictures Sorry, I hadn't even looked at her photostudy when I first responded, I was simply going by the numbers you posted in your message. What stuck out to me there, was that the highest number was in her skull base, and " typically " the cranial vault numbers will be higher or equal to the skull base, not less than, so that jumped out to me there. The skull base asym is the difference of each side measured nose to ear (nose to right ear minus nose to left ear, or vice versa). So in her photostudy, the one where she's lying down, looking up her nose, and the pen marks are showing the misalignment in her ears...that's the 10mm of asym in her skull base. As the ears shift into alignment, that number will go down. At least two people on the board have used Angel Flights, so hopefully they'll tell you their experiences. Hopefully you'll end up in San Diego and it won't be an issue! Good luck! Jake-2.5 (DOCBand Grad 9/08) Jordan-5 > > > > > > We had our evaluation at CT in Charlotte yesterday. It has been a longggg > > > week! Mia was having a repeat pH Study (Reflux) from Tuesday to Wednesday > > > morning in Atlanta (~1 hour each way), so there was already a lot of > > > traveling going on... and after she finished yesterday morning, we headed > > > straight to Charlotte (~3 1/2 hours each way) for her evaluation, and then > > > headed home. We got back really late and then I had to scramble around all > > > morning getting 'the sister' to preschool and Mia to back to back therapy. I > > > need a long NAP! > > > > > > Anyway, everything went fine at CT. It was actually really nice to SEE what > > > I have been THINKING that I was seeing in photos and measurements. It makes > > > me feel like I'm not just crazy. Mia really made them earn their keep, > > > though. She has some sensory issues and really doesn't like being touched, > > > especially her head.. so she screamed hysterically the entire time and all > > > they were doing was trying to get photos and measurements! It made things > > > very challenging. I was shocked that they even got the photos that they did > > > because she barely stopped screaming the entire consult, and we were there > > > for close to 2 hours! I was also worried that because she was so upset, the > > > pictures wouldn't show her 'true' Torticollis, but they did for the most > > > part. It's a bit worse in real life, but they saw that 'in person' - so it > > > really doesn't matter. > > > > > > Her actual Plagiocephaly is moderate. If it was JUST that, I wouldn't be so > > > concerned and I can't say that we would band. In fact, I can almost > > > certainly say that we wouldn't. She will have hair that will mostly cover > > > it, and it isn't severe by any means. It's to the right, so it's difficult > > > to get good photos of, and it's a bit worse than it appears - but not by > > > much. They said that the flatness straight across is mostly because of her > > > fontanelle that is still open, and that it's something we should watch. > > > > > > But. And there's always a 'but', right? Because of the > > > Torticollis/Plagiocephaly, she has some significant asymmetry going on.. > > > which is what I was really concerned about going in. I had definitely > > > noticed that her right ear seemed shifted forward.. but I had a hard time > > > differentiating what was 'real' and what was her mommy over-analyzing > > > things. So it was really comforting to have someone else see it, too. So my > > > biggest concerns were her right ear being more forward than the left and her > > > left eye seeming a bit smaller/weighed down (because there is more 'head' on > > > that side). And those things were confirmed. The left side of her forehead > > > is flatter than the right and her right ear/eye/cheek are anterior to the > > > left. One side of her cheek/jaw is also shifted, but I can't recall which > > > side. I want to say that it's the right, but I'm not sure. > > > > > > And for those reasons, they think that she absolutely needs a band. Clearly, > > > it's a cosmetic issue... I don't really want her to be insecure about having > > > her hair up because one ear is closer to her face than the other.. or > > > because one eye is smaller. It would also make things like getting glasses > > > that fit complicated. And it could absolutely cause jaw issues later... I've > > > had my fair share, including braces as an adult - so that's not something we > > > need. So I left the visit pretty certain that we would go ahead with it. > > > > > > But I still have some hestiations. I talked to her SLP (speech/feeding > > > therapist) about it this morning and found out that she had Torticollis as a > > > child, including surgery in the first grade to loosen the muscle! I had no > > > idea! She said that she still has issues with finding glasses that fit on > > > her ears and nose correctly, but that otherwise it doesn't bother her much - > > > and she looks 'normal' to me. She seemed to agree with my outlook (that I > > > stole from someone here! thank you, it's helped tremendously!) that we will > > > never regret doing it, but may regret not doing it. I also asked her OT what > > > she thought, and she seemed to agree also... though she gasped at the > > > pricetag (and insisted that there were cheaper options) and she also said > > > that usually kids that they see there with helmets have much more severe > > > Plagiocephaly. Again, if she didn't have the facial asymmetry, I wouldn't be > > > too concerned about her flatness. It's the facial shift that really concerns > > > me. She recommended that I ask her PT what she thought.. since she knows > > > much more about Torticollis, but her PT is usually all rainbows and sunshine > > > and writes most things off because they *could* be worse , so I don't think > > > her opinion will really alter mine. > > > > > > So while I was pleased with our appointment for the most part, I still have > > > some concerns/questions. If anyone has any insight, please share! > > > > > > 1) What ARE the other options, outside of CT? I know that there are other > > > companies, but after researching it a bit - it seemed like CT was much more > > > reputable and had better success. Are the other companies/types of bands > > > significantly cheaper? The price won't hold us back if she needs it (it's > > > $3k for us since we're military), but if it's like 'buying the name brand > > > even though the store brand works fine', I'd like to know. I don't think > > > that's the case, but I want to ask anyway! Cranial bands are a Tricare > > > exclusion, so I'm not sure it's worth the trouble in appealing them a > > > hundred times. > > > > > > 2) Can facial asymmetry ever correct itself without a band? Since Mia has > > > developmental delays, she is not yet sitting and probably won't be anytime > > > soon. She does spend a lot of time on her tummy, but the > > > Tort/Plagio/Asymmetry has definitely worsened even with that. > > > > > > 3) If she does a band and her facial asymmetry corrects, how common is it to > > > have it occur again after removing the band? > > > > > > 4) Could someone help me understand her measurements? I can't remember which > > > mean what! > > > > > > Traditional Cranial Vault Asymmetry: 5 > > > fzR-euL: 138 > > > fzL-euR: 133 > > > > > > Cranial Vault Asymmetry: 8 > > > fzR-OcpL: 148 > > > fzL-OcpR: 140 > > > > > > Skull Base Asymmetry: 10 > > > sn-tL: 83 > > > sn:tR: 73 > > > > > > Also, when you have your DSi photos done, do you usually notice that the > > > measurements are the same as the manual ones, better, or worse? > > > > > > I think that's it. Other than the inevitable, 'if you were in my shoes, what > > > would you do?' question! I am uploading her scans under M shortly. > > > > > > Kim > > > > > >

April 16, 2009

Do you mind sharing how well it works for you?

When you get there, do you take a taxi or rent a car? Is it easy to get flights back or do you often have to stay overnight? Do the flights depart/arrive near you or at a major airport?

Kim

On Thu, Apr 16, 2009 at 4:49 PM, <mommy2jaylina@...> wrote:

I use angel flights weekly Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile

From: " " Date: Thu, 16 Apr 2009 19:42:37 -0000<Plagiocephaly >Subject: Re: Mia's Evaluation/Pictures

Sorry, I hadn't even looked at her photostudy when I first responded, I was simply going by the numbers you posted in your message. What stuck out to me there, was that the highest number was in her skull base, and " typically " the cranial vault numbers will be higher or equal to the skull base, not less than, so that jumped out to me there.

The skull base asym is the difference of each side measured nose to ear (nose to right ear minus nose to left ear, or vice versa). So in her photostudy, the one where she's lying down, looking up her nose, and the pen marks are showing the misalignment in her ears...that's the 10mm of asym in her skull base. As the ears shift into alignment, that number will go down.

At least two people on the board have used Angel Flights, so hopefully they'll tell you their experiences. Hopefully you'll end up in San Diego and it won't be an issue!Good luck!Jake-2.5 (DOCBand Grad 9/08)

Jordan-5

> > >> > > We had our evaluation at CT in Charlotte yesterday. It has been a longggg> > > week! Mia was having a repeat pH Study (Reflux) from Tuesday to Wednesday> > > morning in Atlanta (~1 hour each way), so there was already a lot of

> > > traveling going on... and after she finished yesterday morning, we headed> > > straight to Charlotte (~3 1/2 hours each way) for her evaluation, and then> > > headed home. We got back really late and then I had to scramble around all

> > > morning getting 'the sister' to preschool and Mia to back to back therapy. I> > > need a long NAP!> > > > > > Anyway, everything went fine at CT. It was actually really nice to SEE what

> > > I have been THINKING that I was seeing in photos and measurements. It makes> > > me feel like I'm not just crazy. Mia really made them earn their keep,> > > though. She has some sensory issues and really doesn't like being touched,

> > > especially her head.. so she screamed hysterically the entire time and all> > > they were doing was trying to get photos and measurements! It made things> > > very challenging. I was shocked that they even got the photos that they did

> > > because she barely stopped screaming the entire consult, and we were there> > > for close to 2 hours! I was also worried that because she was so upset, the> > > pictures wouldn't show her 'true' Torticollis, but they did for the most

> > > part. It's a bit worse in real life, but they saw that 'in person' - so it> > > really doesn't matter.> > > > > > Her actual Plagiocephaly is moderate. If it was JUST that, I wouldn't be so

> > > concerned and I can't say that we would band. In fact, I can almost> > > certainly say that we wouldn't. She will have hair that will mostly cover> > > it, and it isn't severe by any means. It's to the right, so it's difficult

> > > to get good photos of, and it's a bit worse than it appears - but not by> > > much. They said that the flatness straight across is mostly because of her> > > fontanelle that is still open, and that it's something we should watch.

> > > > > > But. And there's always a 'but', right? Because of the> > > Torticollis/Plagiocephaly, she has some significant asymmetry going on..> > > which is what I was really concerned about going in. I had definitely

> > > noticed that her right ear seemed shifted forward.. but I had a hard time> > > differentiating what was 'real' and what was her mommy over-analyzing> > > things. So it was really comforting to have someone else see it, too. So my

> > > biggest concerns were her right ear being more forward than the left and her> > > left eye seeming a bit smaller/weighed down (because there is more 'head' on> > > that side). And those things were confirmed. The left side of her forehead

> > > is flatter than the right and her right ear/eye/cheek are anterior to the> > > left. One side of her cheek/jaw is also shifted, but I can't recall which> > > side. I want to say that it's the right, but I'm not sure.

> > > > > > And for those reasons, they think that she absolutely needs a band. Clearly,> > > it's a cosmetic issue... I don't really want her to be insecure about having> > > her hair up because one ear is closer to her face than the other.. or

> > > because one eye is smaller. It would also make things like getting glasses> > > that fit complicated. And it could absolutely cause jaw issues later... I've> > > had my fair share, including braces as an adult - so that's not something we

> > > need. So I left the visit pretty certain that we would go ahead with it.> > > > > > But I still have some hestiations. I talked to her SLP (speech/feeding> > > therapist) about it this morning and found out that she had Torticollis as a

> > > child, including surgery in the first grade to loosen the muscle! I had no> > > idea! She said that she still has issues with finding glasses that fit on> > > her ears and nose correctly, but that otherwise it doesn't bother her much -

> > > and she looks 'normal' to me. She seemed to agree with my outlook (that I> > > stole from someone here! thank you, it's helped tremendously!) that we will> > > never regret doing it, but may regret not doing it. I also asked her OT what

> > > she thought, and she seemed to agree also... though she gasped at the> > > pricetag (and insisted that there were cheaper options) and she also said> > > that usually kids that they see there with helmets have much more severe

> > > Plagiocephaly. Again, if she didn't have the facial asymmetry, I wouldn't be> > > too concerned about her flatness. It's the facial shift that really concerns> > > me. She recommended that I ask her PT what she thought.. since she knows

> > > much more about Torticollis, but her PT is usually all rainbows and sunshine> > > and writes most things off because they *could* be worse , so I don't think> > > her opinion will really alter mine.

> > > > > > So while I was pleased with our appointment for the most part, I still have> > > some concerns/questions. If anyone has any insight, please share!> > > > > > 1) What ARE the other options, outside of CT? I know that there are other

> > > companies, but after researching it a bit - it seemed like CT was much more> > > reputable and had better success. Are the other companies/types of bands> > > significantly cheaper? The price won't hold us back if she needs it (it's

> > > $3k for us since we're military), but if it's like 'buying the name brand> > > even though the store brand works fine', I'd like to know. I don't think> > > that's the case, but I want to ask anyway! Cranial bands are a Tricare

> > > exclusion, so I'm not sure it's worth the trouble in appealing them a> > > hundred times.> > > > > > 2) Can facial asymmetry ever correct itself without a band? Since Mia has

> > > developmental delays, she is not yet sitting and probably won't be anytime> > > soon. She does spend a lot of time on her tummy, but the> > > Tort/Plagio/Asymmetry has definitely worsened even with that.

> > > > > > 3) If she does a band and her facial asymmetry corrects, how common is it to> > > have it occur again after removing the band?> > > > > > 4) Could someone help me understand her measurements? I can't remember which

> > > mean what!> > > > > > Traditional Cranial Vault Asymmetry: 5> > > fzR-euL: 138> > > fzL-euR: 133> > > > > > Cranial Vault Asymmetry: 8

> > > fzR-OcpL: 148> > > fzL-OcpR: 140> > > > > > Skull Base Asymmetry: 10> > > sn-tL: 83> > > sn:tR: 73> > > > > > Also, when you have your DSi photos done, do you usually notice that the

> > > measurements are the same as the manual ones, better, or worse?> > > > > > I think that's it. Other than the inevitable, 'if you were in my shoes, what> > > would you do?' question! I am uploading her scans under M shortly.

> > > > > > Kim> > >> >>

April 16, 2009

Hey! You will always stay over night. Our appointments are always on Mondays. So our flights are always Sunday morning. We stay over night, go to our 7 am appt at CT and meet the pilot at the airport at 10 am. We usually take a taxi, and when we do stay over night we stay at the Mc house. The pilots never fly out of major airports, they always fly from the smaller ones which, can be semi near the normal airports. The planes are small usuallly 4 seats, so taking a stroller is a no. Which really sucks. But, you do what you have to do. My son is so used to it by now. All the pilots are so nice! Angel flights has been greatSent via BlackBerry from T-MobileFrom: K S Date: Thu, 16 Apr 2009 17:17:33 -0500<Plagiocephaly >Subject: Re: Re: Mia's Evaluation/Pictures Do you mind sharing how well it works for you? When you get there, do you take a taxi or rent a car? Is it easy to get flights back or do you often have to stay overnight? Do the flights depart/arrive near you or at a major airport? KimOn Thu, Apr 16, 2009 at 4:49 PM, <mommy2jaylinaaol> wrote:I use angel flights weekly Sent via BlackBerry from T-MobileFrom: " " Date: Thu, 16 Apr 2009 19:42:37 -0000<Plagiocephaly >Subject: Re: Mia's Evaluation/Pictures Sorry, I hadn't even looked at her photostudy when I first responded, I was simply going by the numbers you posted in your message. What stuck out to me there, was that the highest number was in her skull base, and " typically " the cranial vault numbers will be higher or equal to the skull base, not less than, so that jumped out to me there.The skull base asym is the difference of each side measured nose to ear (nose to right ear minus nose to left ear, or vice versa). So in her photostudy, the one where she's lying down, looking up her nose, and the pen marks are showing the misalignment in her ears...that's the 10mm of asym in her skull base. As the ears shift into alignment, that number will go down. At least two people on the board have used Angel Flights, so hopefully they'll tell you their experiences. Hopefully you'll end up in San Diego and it won't be an issue!Good luck!Jake-2.5 (DOCBand Grad 9/08) Jordan-5 > > >> > > We had our evaluation at CT in Charlotte yesterday. It has been a longggg> > > week! Mia was having a repeat pH Study (Reflux) from Tuesday to Wednesday> > > morning in Atlanta (~1 hour each way), so there was already a lot of > > > traveling going on... and after she finished yesterday morning, we headed> > > straight to Charlotte (~3 1/2 hours each way) for her evaluation, and then> > > headed home. We got back really late and then I had to scramble around all > > > morning getting 'the sister' to preschool and Mia to back to back therapy. I> > > need a long NAP!> > > > > > Anyway, everything went fine at CT. It was actually really nice to SEE what > > > I have been THINKING that I was seeing in photos and measurements. It makes> > > me feel like I'm not just crazy. Mia really made them earn their keep,> > > though. She has some sensory issues and really doesn't like being touched, > > > especially her head.. so she screamed hysterically the entire time and all> > > they were doing was trying to get photos and measurements! It made things> > > very challenging. I was shocked that they even got the photos that they did > > > because she barely stopped screaming the entire consult, and we were there> > > for close to 2 hours! I was also worried that because she was so upset, the> > > pictures wouldn't show her 'true' Torticollis, but they did for the most > > > part. It's a bit worse in real life, but they saw that 'in person' - so it> > > really doesn't matter.> > > > > > Her actual Plagiocephaly is moderate. If it was JUST that, I wouldn't be so > > > concerned and I can't say that we would band. In fact, I can almost> > > certainly say that we wouldn't. She will have hair that will mostly cover> > > it, and it isn't severe by any means. It's to the right, so it's difficult > > > to get good photos of, and it's a bit worse than it appears - but not by> > > much. They said that the flatness straight across is mostly because of her> > > fontanelle that is still open, and that it's something we should watch. > > > > > > But. And there's always a 'but', right? Because of the> > > Torticollis/Plagiocephaly, she has some significant asymmetry going on..> > > which is what I was really concerned about going in. I had definitely > > > noticed that her right ear seemed shifted forward.. but I had a hard time> > > differentiating what was 'real' and what was her mommy over-analyzing> > > things. So it was really comforting to have someone else see it, too. So my > > > biggest concerns were her right ear being more forward than the left and her> > > left eye seeming a bit smaller/weighed down (because there is more 'head' on> > > that side). And those things were confirmed. The left side of her forehead > > > is flatter than the right and her right ear/eye/cheek are anterior to the> > > left. One side of her cheek/jaw is also shifted, but I can't recall which> > > side. I want to say that it's the right, but I'm not sure. > > > > > > And for those reasons, they think that she absolutely needs a band. Clearly,> > > it's a cosmetic issue... I don't really want her to be insecure about having> > > her hair up because one ear is closer to her face than the other.. or > > > because one eye is smaller. It would also make things like getting glasses> > > that fit complicated. And it could absolutely cause jaw issues later... I've> > > had my fair share, including braces as an adult - so that's not something we > > > need. So I left the visit pretty certain that we would go ahead with it.> > > > > > But I still have some hestiations. I talked to her SLP (speech/feeding> > > therapist) about it this morning and found out that she had Torticollis as a > > > child, including surgery in the first grade to loosen the muscle! I had no> > > idea! She said that she still has issues with finding glasses that fit on> > > her ears and nose correctly, but that otherwise it doesn't bother her much - > > > and she looks 'normal' to me. She seemed to agree with my outlook (that I> > > stole from someone here! thank you, it's helped tremendously!) that we will> > > never regret doing it, but may regret not doing it. I also asked her OT what > > > she thought, and she seemed to agree also... though she gasped at the> > > pricetag (and insisted that there were cheaper options) and she also said> > > that usually kids that they see there with helmets have much more severe > > > Plagiocephaly. Again, if she didn't have the facial asymmetry, I wouldn't be> > > too concerned about her flatness. It's the facial shift that really concerns> > > me. She recommended that I ask her PT what she thought.. since she knows > > > much more about Torticollis, but her PT is usually all rainbows and sunshine> > > and writes most things off because they *could* be worse , so I don't think> > > her opinion will really alter mine. > > > > > > So while I was pleased with our appointment for the most part, I still have> > > some concerns/questions. If anyone has any insight, please share!> > > > > > 1) What ARE the other options, outside of CT? I know that there are other > > > companies, but after researching it a bit - it seemed like CT was much more> > > reputable and had better success. Are the other companies/types of bands> > > significantly cheaper? The price won't hold us back if she needs it (it's > > > $3k for us since we're military), but if it's like 'buying the name brand> > > even though the store brand works fine', I'd like to know. I don't think> > > that's the case, but I want to ask anyway! Cranial bands are a Tricare > > > exclusion, so I'm not sure it's worth the trouble in appealing them a> > > hundred times.> > > > > > 2) Can facial asymmetry ever correct itself without a band? Since Mia has > > > developmental delays, she is not yet sitting and probably won't be anytime> > > soon. She does spend a lot of time on her tummy, but the> > > Tort/Plagio/Asymmetry has definitely worsened even with that. > > > > > > 3) If she does a band and her facial asymmetry corrects, how common is it to> > > have it occur again after removing the band?> > > > > > 4) Could someone help me understand her measurements? I can't remember which > > > mean what!> > > > > > Traditional Cranial Vault Asymmetry: 5> > > fzR-euL: 138> > > fzL-euR: 133> > > > > > Cranial Vault Asymmetry: 8 > > > fzR-OcpL: 148> > > fzL-OcpR: 140> > > > > > Skull Base Asymmetry: 10> > > sn-tL: 83> > > sn:tR: 73> > > > > > Also, when you have your DSi photos done, do you usually notice that the > > > measurements are the same as the manual ones, better, or worse?> > > > > > I think that's it. Other than the inevitable, 'if you were in my shoes, what> > > would you do?' question! I am uploading her scans under M shortly. > > > > > > Kim> > >> >>

April 16, 2009

,

You're a genius as far as I'm concerned ). Thank you for explaining that!

Kim

On Thu, Apr 16, 2009 at 2:42 PM, <nwilkens2275@...> wrote:

Sorry, I hadn't even looked at her photostudy when I first responded, I was simply going by the numbers you posted in your message. What stuck out to me there, was that the highest number was in her skull base, and " typically " the cranial vault numbers will be higher or equal to the skull base, not less than, so that jumped out to me there.

The skull base asym is the difference of each side measured nose to ear (nose to right ear minus nose to left ear, or vice versa). So in her photostudy, the one where she's lying down, looking up her nose, and the pen marks are showing the misalignment in her ears...that's the 10mm of asym in her skull base. As the ears shift into alignment, that number will go down.

At least two people on the board have used Angel Flights, so hopefully they'll tell you their experiences. Hopefully you'll end up in San Diego and it won't be an issue!Good luck! Jake-2.5 (DOCBand Grad 9/08)Jordan-5