Re: Had anybody ever been cured using SCD?

[Guest guest]

Yes I realize a starchy diet is not necessarily normal which is why I put in

quotes. I suppose it more depends on whom you ask. However, most people go

through life eating all types of starches without experiencing severe bowel

problems like the people on this list. My question was has anybody ever gone

back to a diet that at least resembled what they ate before they got sick?

In BTVC, Elaine at the end of Ch. 9 says there may be a time (after say 1 or 2

years strictly on the diet) where you can reintroduce forbidden foods one at a

time. So my question is simple, has anybody actually ever reached this stage of

being able to bring back illegal foods into their diet???

>

> >By cured I mean gone back to a starchy

> >( " normal " ) diet without recurrence of symptoms. Any first-hand experiences?

>

> Well, first of all, I don't think a starchy diet

> is at all normal. Starchy diets became the norm

> about fifty years ago -- oddly, about the time

> the numbers of people with IBD went up.

>

> Dr. Haas felt that the earlier dietary

> intervention was started, the more likely a

> person was to be able to return to a more usual

> diet -- but by usual diet, he wasn't talking

> about a diet which has sugar and starch in everything instead of healthy fats.

>

> For those of us like myself, who didn't find SCD

> until I was almost 50, I'll probably always have

> to be careful. Does it bother me? Not a bit -- I

> like the food I make much better than that processed cr@p.

>

>

>

> — Marilyn

> New Orleans, Louisiana, USA

> Undiagnosed IBS since 1976, SCD since 2001

> Darn Good SCD Cook

> No Human Children

> Shadow & Sunny Longhair Dachshund

>

[Guest guest]

Yes, I love it.

Life Without Bread discusses dampening down the immune response to the gut on a

low carb diet, but also states this would take years, longer for UC than Chrons.

Seems all these theories are on the same page. The key is not to reinocculate

yourself with illegals.

PJ

> >

> > By cured I mean gone back to a starchy ( " normal " ) diet without recurrence of

symptoms. Any first-hand experiences?

>

> I started the SCD 25 months ago for Crohn's disease. I improved markedly in

the first year- put on 13 pounds of weight in the first 3 months, and my blood

values except one returned to normal within 6 months. After a year on the SCD, I

kind of morphed my diet into a grain-free, low-carb diet. Now, two years out, my

(extremely skeptical GI) is telling me to stay on the diet, and come back and

see him in a year instead of the usual 6 months.

>

> I find I am able to consume some grains- like rice, but I do that very rarely.

Other grains, like wheat, are probably very bad for me, and a single drop of

Bragg's Amino Acids (fermented soy) caused the disease to return instantly-

albeit painlessly- with blood and D for a single day, and never come back.

>

> The reason this diet takes so long to take hold is that several things have to

occur:

>

> 1) The dysbiosis in the gut has to break up, and the mucosa has to heal. This

allows the body to separate the proteins *inside* the gut from the body's immune

system. This means getting rid of the undesirable bacteria (probably klebsiella,

which LOVE carbohydrates, although I can't rule out candida playing a role), and

getting rid of the lectins (found in seeds- like grains- and cause the

semi-permeable membrane of the gut to become more permeable and less selective).

>

> 2) The body has to slowly " damp down " the inflammatory immune response,

backing down on the quantity and type of antibodies produced to antigens- in

this case, probably antigens to Klebsiella pneumoniae, which look like certain

types of collagen- the reason the intestines are attacked in IBD, as they have

lots of collagen after all. Once the antigens (the bits that " leak " though the

damaged intestinal mucosa) are removed from the system, the B cells and T cells

back off on producing the antibodies. This takes several years.

>

> Look at it as a " vaccination. " With Crohn's (and probably ulcerative colitis),

the body has been " vaccinated " against Klebsiella pneumoniae. Unfortunately,

that vaccine cross-reacts with the body's own collagen, and that's bad juju when

the antigen-producing organism lives in a tissue largely made of collagen, and

that tissue is now " leaky. " Net upshot: autoimmune attack on the collegsn of the

intestines.

>

> Like a vaccination, eventually it will wear off- provided the individual is

not " re-vaccinated " by the bacterial proteins again. For rabies, it lasts about

3 years. For tetanus, 10 years or so. For some types of influenza, it may last a

lifetime.

>

> So, you have to fix up the gut, and then sit this one out, waiting for the B

cells to stop producing antibodies to the klebsiella.

>

> Note that a certain type of chemotherapy for multiple sclerosis has been

developed called Campath (from Cambridge Pathology Lab). It goes in, nukes the B

cells, and your body loses track of what it's supposed to make antibodies to.

Presumably Campath gets rid of B cells that produce some antibody to some

bacterium that sufficiently resembles human myelin that MS is the result of

autoimmune attack based on this confusion. Get rid of the B cells, stop

producing the antibodies, and the disease goes away- until the host is

re-sensitized because the underlying problem- the bacterium- is still there, and

the disease comes back in a few months.

>

> Similarly, B-cell ablation therapies will probably be announced as effective

in Crohn's disease for the same reason. Unfortunately, the disease will come

back, and you'll need a shot every 6 months or whatever. But- if combined with a

grain-free, low-carb diet, it is conceivable that B-cell ablation might be able

to clear up the disease once and for all- provided the host is able to refrain

from gorging on starch and sugar once they are no longer sensitized.

>

> You read it here first, folks.

>

[Guest guest]

Bruce,

I always hesitate to write about this because I think a newbie will think it's OK to eat illegals. It's not.

Everyone is different. I came down with mild disease ( UC--which I found out later was procto-sigmoiditis which is less involved than UC that affects the whole colon) late in life( mid-life). I immediately found SCD by googling 'diet and UC'.I have a strong background in Biochemistry, Nutrition and Organic Chemistry . The book made so much sense. I followed SCD to the letter ( Of course I made mistakes as we all do) and I was taking Lialda. Within 3 months I was in remission. After one year, I weaned off my Lialda and started LDN, still on SCD. I was lucky because I was an experienced cook and I didn't find SCD hard, just time consuming and not always convenient. I didn't find this list until I was approx 6 months into the diet.

I then started to try different illegals and found I tolerated them. I found that I cannot eat the same illegal several days in a row. I still eat my yogurt every day ( and I love it) and I still make sure that I read all labels and follow SCD as much as possible, because I prefer it. I pick and choose my illegals on personal preference. I cannot tolerate milk, 'though I was never lactose intolerant prior to being diagnosed. Eating out is much easier for me now. I had one mild flare recently and went back to eating strict SCD and taking my Lialda. I recovered in 3 days. I think the SCD has enriched my life.

A cure means absence of any disease. I will find this out next year when I have a colonoscopy. If I still have inflammation in my bowel, I will not be discouraged. With SCD I know I have the tools to stay in remission and have a full life. It's not about being able to eat illegals, it's about your quality of life. With the incredible variety of food and recipes on SCD, the quality of life is wonderful. I prefer the taste of my mayo to commercial. I love my home made tomato sauce with home made sausage. We all make choices and I choose to make and grow my own food for my health, and the health of my family. With time, you get into a routine of cooking that works for you. I get busy and don't always get to cook everything, and that's OK, too. I don't always have time for the list, but I like to poke my head in once in awhile.

If you're asking this question, it might be because you're not happy with what you're eating. I encourage you to try some of the many on-line recipes or buy some of the cookbooks and ask on this list for recipe help. There are so many capable, friendly people willing to help, you will never feel alone. There is never any reason to feel deprived, either.

Terry

[Guest guest]

>

> How are we infected with Klebsiella? Can one be tested for it? I find this

> very interesting. I knew about MAP, but not what you described. Thanks.

Klebsiella pneumoniae is ubiquitous; even if you could rid yourself of it, it

would be a matter of hours or day before it were re-introduced. Most people-

maybe all people- carry it as one of a spectrum of organisms within their gut.

Like E. coli, when it gets where it shouldn't be- the lungs, the blood- it is an

extremely serious infection. Lung infection with Kleb pneumo is typically 50%

fatal, as it is usually very highly antibiotic resistant. Finding Kleb pneumo

within your own body- the feces, at least- would not be surprising. Finding a

larger number when you flare might be interesting, and Ebringer in the UK has

found that people with ankylosing spondylitis shed more Kp when they flare. All

of his work on KP and Crohn's stems from his work with ankylosing spondylitis,

and it may help explain back pain with Crohn's disease.

ly, klebsiella explains many more things about CD than MAP does. For

example, MAP is a facultative intracellular pathogen. It lives among live cells,

gaining its nutrients in this fashion. Why would dietary controls- such as the

SCD, or enteral diets, or parenteral nutrition- cause the disease to go into

remission if CD were caused by an organism that doesn't live on " human food " ? It

also explains why the disease cannot be cured with antibiotics; even if it were

MAP, individuals have been fed every imaginable anti-tuberculosis drug on the

market, and STILL not been cured of Crohn's. The explanation that it is caused

by a ubiquitous organism that lives nearly everyone that is almost immune to

antibiotics makes much more sense than to blame it on MAP.

Kleb has one weak spot: it needs carbs. It cannot survive on protein or fat. The

SCD is high in " small " carbohydrates- the monosaccharides that are absorbed so

high in the gut that they don't make it to where the kleb " lives. " The SCD shuns

polymeric carbohydrates- the long-chain starches and higher polymers of sugars

that are not well-absorbed, including lactose, that go further into the GI

tract, feeding klebsiella.

The logical extension is that for some, the kleb may be living " higher. " CD can

affect any part of the GI tract, after all, and klebsiella are fantastically

facile organisms- they can live on almost any type of carbohydrate, so for those

that are not successful on the SCD, there is one last thing to try: very low

carb living. Lutz in " Life Without Bread " suggests that more than 90% (!) of

individuals with CD find relief for up to three years (!) provided they keep

carbs down to less than 72 grams/day (6 " bread units, " each comprised of 12

grams of carbohydrate). I suggest the SCD be combined with the Lutz diet: grain

elimination, low carb (under 72 grams/day). If absolutely nothing else works,

that combination might be the trick.

It does take a certain leap of faith, of course, to eat that much meat. All I

can say is this: Atkins was right. Maybe not *quite* right, but he had the right

idea. Low-carb diets are good for you; carbs are not your friend. They cause

obesity, cancer, and GI problems. Fats are more satiating; proteins are more

nutritious. There is no dietary requirement for carbohydrates. Carbs make for

higher triglyceride values in the blood, too- and trigs are more closely

correlated with heart disease than cholesterol. (Cholesterol is not your enemy.

Embrace it. Eat an egg, please.)

That's why we're all sick: too many carbs. Elaine didn't believe in the low-carb

approach, and I respect that. She was trained in " traditional " nutrition, and

probably realized that plugging a wacky diet that included low-carbing would

have been shunned by most people. There is still a strong stigma associated with

eating fat and protein over nice, tasty carbs- some lingering misconceptions

about how we " need " bread and grains and all that nonsense. Cultures that eat

nothing but meat- or nearly so- include the traditional Eskimo, the Masai of

Africa, Greenlanders- several successful civilizations with very healthy

individuals.

Overfeed and glut on carbs- as the American Heart Association tells us- leads to

GI distress, and then we're all sick. Don't expect any apologies from the AHA.

[Guest guest]

amen!!!!

I appreciate the comment on cholesterol. I am one of those people who has high

good cholesterol. It's been that way since I was young. I feel blessed, but my

total cholesterol number always gets attention.

After reading Good Calories, Bad Calories, Life Without Bread, and others, I

feel we are on the wrong path with cholesterol. It's high carbs that got our

country in this mess.

PJ

> >

> > How are we infected with Klebsiella? Can one be tested for it? I find this

> > very interesting. I knew about MAP, but not what you described. Thanks.

>

> Klebsiella pneumoniae is ubiquitous; even if you could rid yourself of it, it

would be a matter of hours or day before it were re-introduced. Most people-

maybe all people- carry it as one of a spectrum of organisms within their gut.

Like E. coli, when it gets where it shouldn't be- the lungs, the blood- it is an

extremely serious infection. Lung infection with Kleb pneumo is typically 50%

fatal, as it is usually very highly antibiotic resistant. Finding Kleb pneumo

within your own body- the feces, at least- would not be surprising. Finding a

larger number when you flare might be interesting, and Ebringer in the UK has

found that people with ankylosing spondylitis shed more Kp when they flare. All

of his work on KP and Crohn's stems from his work with ankylosing spondylitis,

and it may help explain back pain with Crohn's disease.

>

> ly, klebsiella explains many more things about CD than MAP does. For

example, MAP is a facultative intracellular pathogen. It lives among live cells,

gaining its nutrients in this fashion. Why would dietary controls- such as the

SCD, or enteral diets, or parenteral nutrition- cause the disease to go into

remission if CD were caused by an organism that doesn't live on " human food " ? It

also explains why the disease cannot be cured with antibiotics; even if it were

MAP, individuals have been fed every imaginable anti-tuberculosis drug on the

market, and STILL not been cured of Crohn's. The explanation that it is caused

by a ubiquitous organism that lives nearly everyone that is almost immune to

antibiotics makes much more sense than to blame it on MAP.

>

> Kleb has one weak spot: it needs carbs. It cannot survive on protein or fat.

The SCD is high in " small " carbohydrates- the monosaccharides that are absorbed

so high in the gut that they don't make it to where the kleb " lives. " The SCD

shuns polymeric carbohydrates- the long-chain starches and higher polymers of

sugars that are not well-absorbed, including lactose, that go further into the

GI tract, feeding klebsiella.

>

> The logical extension is that for some, the kleb may be living " higher. " CD

can affect any part of the GI tract, after all, and klebsiella are fantastically

facile organisms- they can live on almost any type of carbohydrate, so for those

that are not successful on the SCD, there is one last thing to try: very low

carb living. Lutz in " Life Without Bread " suggests that more than 90% (!) of

individuals with CD find relief for up to three years (!) provided they keep

carbs down to less than 72 grams/day (6 " bread units, " each comprised of 12

grams of carbohydrate). I suggest the SCD be combined with the Lutz diet: grain

elimination, low carb (under 72 grams/day). If absolutely nothing else works,

that combination might be the trick.

>

> It does take a certain leap of faith, of course, to eat that much meat. All I

can say is this: Atkins was right. Maybe not *quite* right, but he had the right

idea. Low-carb diets are good for you; carbs are not your friend. They cause

obesity, cancer, and GI problems. Fats are more satiating; proteins are more

nutritious. There is no dietary requirement for carbohydrates. Carbs make for

higher triglyceride values in the blood, too- and trigs are more closely

correlated with heart disease than cholesterol. (Cholesterol is not your enemy.

Embrace it. Eat an egg, please.)

>

> That's why we're all sick: too many carbs. Elaine didn't believe in the

low-carb approach, and I respect that. She was trained in " traditional "

nutrition, and probably realized that plugging a wacky diet that included

low-carbing would have been shunned by most people. There is still a strong

stigma associated with eating fat and protein over nice, tasty carbs- some

lingering misconceptions about how we " need " bread and grains and all that

nonsense. Cultures that eat nothing but meat- or nearly so- include the

traditional Eskimo, the Masai of Africa, Greenlanders- several successful

civilizations with very healthy individuals.

>

> Overfeed and glut on carbs- as the American Heart Association tells us- leads

to GI distress, and then we're all sick. Don't expect any apologies from the

AHA.

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Bruce,

During my first 2 years on SCD, I was pretty obsessed with this topic. One link I found that helped put it into perspective is (I believe) from one of the Long Island listserve archives and it talks about the problem being that people don't just add back in a few illegals now and then - they tend to go crazy and overindulge in those foods they've missed. Like instead of eating one slice of bread once in awhile, they eat a whole loaf in one day.

http://www.scdiet.org/7archives/scd035.html

I can tell you from my own experience that I still get frustrated because ever since having some outpatient surgery last March where I received antibiotics, I've been fighting little bleeding flares that don't seem to respond to any type of dietary adjustments (i.e., eliminating dairy, going intro, only eating super-easy-to-digest foods, lots of broth, digestive enzymes, etc.). The only thing that's helped is using lots of Canasa.

However, I do believe in the science Elaine spent her life researching, so I figure it's better to stay on the diet for no other reason than general prevention - it HAS to be better for my gut. In fact, I've never had such normal, comfortable digestion my entire life!

I will admit that I've tried limited illegals in the past year - homemade sourdough that's fermented for 24 hours and some brown rice. Neither seemed to have any impact on my system. However, I still haven't felt comfortable eating those things on a regular basis because I believe so strongly in SCD and they're illegal.

So ... my thought is that if, at some point, I can get back to being 100% symptom free and med-free like I was in 2008, I may try to introduce some illegals again and see what happens. But that's not my goal anymore. I really like my SCD food and have gotten so used to it, I just don't miss the "old" stuff much anymore.

KathyUC since 12/05SCD since 7/07Med-free and symptom-free from 7/08 to 3/09Intermittent bleeding flares since 4/09Currently back on sulfasalazine and Canasa

>> By cured I mean gone back to a starchy ("normal") diet without recurrence of symptoms. Any first-hand experiences?>

[Guest guest]

I don't even know where to start, I am just so excited by all of the amazing

responses in this thread!

To ahicks51- your scientific insight is invaluable! It was so great reading your

explanations and further insight into why this diet works. Sometimes when I am

explaining it to my friends/family/co-workers I feel like a big hippy-dippy...

" you see, I am starving the bad bacteria!!! " But I feel even more validated now

that I have read your postings.

To everyone who shared your success stories- THANK YOU! It's not the hope of

eating " normal " again that got me so jazzed, but just the idea that it's been so

helpful for so many people. I hope I can come out on the other side one day and

share my success story.

To PJ- you are on the right track with cholesterol! I bought into the whole

" hereditary " theory- my dad runs every day, is fit and thin and has high

cholesterol. My cholesterol used to be high as well. Then I cut down on carbs

(even before this diet) and cut my levels in half. That was proof enough for me.

Now if I could just convince my dad...

I hope everyone has a great weekend and aren't too snowed in like we are here in

Ohio!

-Joanna

SCD 9/2009, Crohn's 1992

[Guest guest]

Hi everyone:

Thanks for the responses. Just for information's sake, I'm not a newbie, I've

been off and on SCD for a few years now. I know it works. But all of the

cooking and preparation is frustrating. I'm a single guy. Boy do I need a

wife. ) No offence ladies.

B

[Guest guest]

>

> amen!!!!

>

> I appreciate the comment on cholesterol. I am one of those people who has high

good cholesterol. It's been that way since I was young. I feel blessed, but my

total cholesterol number always gets attention.

> After reading Good Calories, Bad Calories, Life Without Bread, and others, I

feel we are on the wrong path with cholesterol. It's high carbs that got our

country in this mess.

If you are unafraid of cholesterol, then I recommend the Ultimate Snack Food for

SCD'ers: pemmican. You take meat, and dry it- no higher than 120F so as to keep

the vitamin C intact (yes, there's some vitamin C in meat). Take it to complete

dryness, then powder it in the blender.

Then you take fat scraps- the butcher store saves them for me- and render them.

Mix the fat with the powdered meat, 50/50 mix by weight, and let it cool. 3/4 of

a pound of the stuff is enough for most people for an entire day.

http://www.traditionaltx.us/images/PEMMICAN.pdf

The taste takes a little getting used to, but it's very good, very nutritious-

and completely SCD compatible.

[Guest guest]

i think everyone thinks that way until you look back and pouf 2 years have gone

by and you're better (most of the time) LOL and so you love your scd life -minus

the cooking LOL - but the thought of going back isn't really there anymore and

I'd go back to sugar so I'm just asking for trouble if I do - as I'm still

filled with yeast on the candida scd diet!!

one taste woud make me want more, so since most often i don't want it - and

don't think about it -I don't when that will be - would like to recieve

communion (just the wine) at Mass someday though :-(

eileen

> >

> > By cured I mean gone back to a starchy ( " normal " ) diet without

> recurrence of symptoms. Any first-hand experiences?

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Do you have a culinary school in the area? Post a sign there and I'm sure

you'll get a lot of responses from students who would be willing to

cook for a LOT less than that!

I hope you're feeling better.

-

>

>

> Thanks for the responses. Just

> for information's sake, I'm not a newbie, I've been off and on SCD for a

> few years now. I know it works. But all of the cooking and preparation is

> frustrating. I'm a single guy. Boy do I need a wife. ) No offence

> ladies.

>

> Consider the thought of hiring a personal chef to prepare meals for you.

> Less expensive than eating out. Gives you the ability to stay on the

> diet.

>

>

>

> —

> Marilyn

>

> New

> Orleans, Louisiana, USA

>

> Undiagnosed IBS since 1976, SCD since 2001

>

> Darn Good SCD Cook

>

> No Human Children

>

> Shadow & Sunny Longhair Dachshund

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> _________________________________________________________________

> Hotmail: Trusted email with powerful SPAM protection.

> http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/201469227/direct/01/

>

[Guest guest]

I can't speak for others but I know that I probably would not have been able to

start the diet if I didn't originally think that I would eventually be able to

eat normally again. Having such a dramatic change in diet can be somewhat

traumatizing for people. And switching your diet literally overnight while

saying, " well, that's it. Remember all the stuff you love; all that stuff you

could eat yesterday? You're never going to be able to eat it ever again " isn't

going to help you stay strictly SCD. I think that it can actually be pretty

healthy to " envision the healthy person you will become with adherence to SCD "

so that you can be healthy enough to, for example, do something like be able to

go out with friends to dim sum every once in a while. I don't think I'll ever

go back to eating SAD again but I would give anything to be able to go out to

eat every once in a while with friends or add cacao back (they make this amazing

organic, pure cacao/honey drink in the Philippines that I have all the

ingredients and equipment for but am unable to use) occasionally.

I can't go 1 month without symptoms and I've been strict, strict, strictly SCD

for 4 years. It's depressing sometimes. I'm not planning on giving up but what

helps me stay strict actually is that hope that I'll be able to eat something

else some day. So I disagree, it's not counterproductive, it's inspiring. And

it's human nature. *Dwelling* on what you can't have and letting it depress you

is counterproductive. Some people are lucky, they don't crave it anymore. For

some people the smell disgusts them. That has never happened with me and I

suspect I'm not the only one.

Stacey

>

> This focus on when one can resume illegal foods is counterproductive. Why

waste your time thinking about rewarding your recovery with things that have

poisoned you over the years? Why not spend your time envisioning the healthy

person you will become with adherence to SCD whenever you feel deprived ?

[Guest guest]

Pre SCD, my triglycerides were 162. After 10 months of SCD, they were 82. I'm

not even super low carb (I probably average 110 grams of carbs a day). My total

cholesterol is 268 (285 pre-SCD), HDL is 76 (61 pre-SCD) and my LDL is 176 (192

pre-SCD). Just goes to show how bad the SAD diet was for me.

Holly

Crohn's

SCD 12/01/08

>

Carbs make for higher triglyceride values in the blood, too- and trigs are more

closely correlated with heart disease than cholesterol. (Cholesterol is not your

enemy. Embrace it. Eat an egg, please.)

>

[Guest guest]

I think this is a great question for lots of reasons. I was under the

impression that " lots " of people fully recovered after several years of SCD, and

by recovered I mean, go back to SAD.

I have all of my kids on SCD, two who really, really need it since they have had

digestive isues from birth. But I wonder often if they will be able to tolerate

going out to eat with friends as teeenagers, etc.

I also wonder WHY...what is the root cause of these digestive disorders. Yes, I

understand genetics play an enormous role ( you should see my kids, the two with

digestive problems look so much alike!)...but are there other fundamental

problems...mineral defidiencies, microbial changes in the environement, GMO's,

metals, etc.?

> >

> > amen!!!!

> >

> > I appreciate the comment on cholesterol. I am one of those people who has

high good cholesterol. It's been that way since I was young. I feel blessed, but

my total cholesterol number always gets attention.

> > After reading Good Calories, Bad Calories, Life Without Bread, and others, I

feel we are on the wrong path with cholesterol. It's high carbs that got our

country in this mess.

>

> If you are unafraid of cholesterol, then I recommend the Ultimate Snack Food

for SCD'ers: pemmican. You take meat, and dry it- no higher than 120F so as to

keep the vitamin C intact (yes, there's some vitamin C in meat). Take it to

complete dryness, then powder it in the blender.

>

> Then you take fat scraps- the butcher store saves them for me- and render

them. Mix the fat with the powdered meat, 50/50 mix by weight, and let it cool.

3/4 of a pound of the stuff is enough for most people for an entire day.

>

> http://www.traditionaltx.us/images/PEMMICAN.pdf

>

> The taste takes a little getting used to, but it's very good, very nutritious-

and completely SCD compatible.

>

[Guest guest]

The first question my doctor asked when I took my son in for bacterial

overgrowth was, was he a c-section, which he was. He did indicate that the

babies probably received less beneficial bacteria that way. There is a high

incidence, from what I have read, of infant colic leading to

ADHD/autism/allergies/etc. On the other hand, I did nurse all of my babies. I

just doubt I had many good guys to pass on to them. My mother went through a

bunch of " altnerative " type healing stuff at a huge center in Indiana. She has

scleroderma. Her doc said her yeasts were through the roof. So was her

mercury. So yes, I definately believe there is a generational/inherited element

to intestinal gut flora, even if there is no definately proof yet.

jessica

>

> > I have all of my kids on SCD, two who really, really need it since

> > they have had digestive isues from birth.

>

>

> Just curious: were your two kids who have had digestive issues from

> birth natural birth or C-section? I was C-section, and I read

> somewhere that the baby first encounters beneficial bacteria during

> birth through the mother's vagina. So C-section babies might already

> be lacking in the good guys, leaving the baddies room to take over. I

> had colic as a baby, I guess a sign of things to come and possibly as

> a result of not being natural birth.. can never be sure though! It all

> seems very connected.

>

> Peace =)

> Alyssa 15 yo

> UC April 2008, dx Sept 2008

> SCD June 2009 (restarted)

> Chinese Herbs (not legal but helping!)

>