Re: How to Feed your dog raw food - Was: Thinking of getting a poodle - wondering how it will affect Crohn's?

March 22, 2010

lin,Thanks! for the info on feeding raw. How would you suggest transitioning over to raw for a young dog (3 years) and an older dog (maybe 11 years)?AmeliaTo: BTVC-SCD Sent: Mon, March 22, 2010 12:06:03 AMSubject: Re: Thinking of getting a poodle - wondering how it will affect Crohn's?

At 01:55 PM 3/21/2010, you wrote:

Marilyn, I have a 10 yr old

Swissy (100+ pounds). He's doing well but has some joint issues. I know

this is off topic but you offered and seeing that I already cook so much

as it is, what's a little more for the dog? He is practically our first

child. LOL! What do you cook?

<g> I don't. Shadow and Sunny eat raw food.

The "SCD for Dogs" which I use is a raw diet. Most dogs who

have been eating grain-based kibble for years need to transition over,

but then again.....

We just found a Beagle who was apparently abandoned in our neighborhood.

Shadow & Sunny haven't touched kibble in almost twelve years. I had

no idea what to give our small foundling. I looked at Harry and said,

"Well, let's try her on a chicken wing. If she can't handle it, I

can always run it through the grinder, but if I don't have to...."

Babette Beagle glanced at Shadow and Sunny, crunching their chicken

wings, latched onto her chicken wing. Crunch. Crunch. Crunch. Swallow.

Yes, that was food as she wished to know it. She has not looked

back.

As to how I came to feed raw, well.....

I was looking for healthier food for the Dachshund Duo. Part of my

research was through the now-sadly-deceased Natural Medicine Forum on

CompuServe. There was one Englishwoman who fed a large number of dogs for

less than I was paying for a bag of premium kibble for my two. More

research led me to a local veterinarian, Dr. Sagrera, of

Natural Pet

Care. Her recommendation was to feed raw.

When she told me to start with chicken wings or chicken drumsticks, I

boggled. I mean, really, EVERYONE KNOWS you don't feed poultry bones to

dogs! They'll splinter.. they'll kill them.... they'll....

No, said Dr. Sagrera, they won't. It's COOKED bones which are dangerous

and splinter. Test a raw wing or drumstick -- the bone is actually fairly

soft and flexible.

OK, says I, but what about e.coli and salmonella -- EVERYONE KNOWS raw

chicken has plenty of that! And same with raw turkey, while as for raw

pork...!

Dogs' stomachs are more acid, says the veterinarian, explaining that this

does in the bad bacteria.

But what about a properly balanced diet? asks Me the Paranoid Furkid

Mom.

I got a lecture in how to balance the diet with mixed crushed vegetables,

and if I really wanted to, I could add various supplements. Note that

although Dr. Sagrera does sell prepared raw diets and various items, she

encourages the owners of her patients to prepare their own from the same

human grade food they might purchase for themselves (if they aren't

vegan).

So, I stopped at the store on the way home and bought a package of raw

chicken drumsticks. I brought it home. I took out two drumsticks and

offered them to the Duo, who snatched them instantly.

When Sunny's not sure of something, she runs in circles, a precisely

paced circle like she once used in the show ring, click, click, click,

the train in running. The train was running -- I think she was afraid I

would take the prize away from her. She didn't know what to do with it,

but she knew she didn't want to surrender it in case I changed my

mind.

Shadow, on the other hand, was "mouth-feeling" the drumstick.

He couldn't get a good grip on it, so he brought it over and shoved it at

my hand, wanting me to hold it for him while he figured this out. (Who

says animals can't communicate? !)

I held it. Mouth, mouth, mouth....kay- runch! He got in one solid,

bone cracking bite, and you could see the stereotypical light bulb go off

over his dachshund head. NOW he knew what to do with this new item on the

menu! He snatched it away, crunch, crunch, crunch, munch, swallow, and

down the hatch went the first drumstick. Sunny hadn't stopped watching

her brother even while the train was running, and in a few more moments,

crunch, crunch, munch, her drumstick was also down the hatch.

OK, the dogs have eaten them.

Now we wait. I (after washing my hands to make sure I didn't get chicken

germs) proceeded to gnaw my fingernails down to the elbow, and on to the

shoulder blades.

Am I going to be making a run to the emergency vet? Have I murdered my

beloved fur kids? What if...? What if....?

I didn't sleep at all that night, not until I saw them poop with no

issues the next morning. The DOGS were fine. The DOGS were quite ready to

repeat the experiment for breakfast. Their Missy was collapsing with

nervous exhaustion.

But since that day, when they were about six months old, Shadow and

Sunny have eaten raw. Their breakfast is ground red meat, heart or liver

if I get some organic, mixed with crushed vegetables that I run through

my juicer and then mix juice and pulp back together. Usually the veggies

include green leaf lettuce, red leaf lettuce, romaine lettuces,

zucchini, cucumber, carrots, stems of broccoli, cauliflower

and ends of asparagus from our meals, and green beans. There

may be other stuff as is seasonally available. We toss in some salmon oil

caps, the occasional vitamin E, some kelp tablets. Dinner is Raw Meaty

Bones (50% bone and 50% meat). An evening snack of a beef cube is used to

wrap up a low potency B vitamin, plus a couple supplements they're

getting now they're twelve. They also get some DCCC and flax oil on the

recommendation of Dr. Sagrera.

Those dogs eat a better balanced diet than most humans!

And that is the story of the Nervous Dachshund Mom, whose furkids are now

advising her that it's time for their beef cube. Oh, and a lick or two of

my goat yogurt snack. After all, if it's people food....

For how much raw stuff, I know it by heart. <g>

Multiply your dog's weight by 16 to get the number of ounces he weighs.

Multiply that by .02, which gives you 2 % of his body weight.

Multiply that by .6 to give you the weight of RMB you should feed.

That is chicken necks, wings, backs etc.

Go back to the 2% of his body weight again and multiply that number by .4

to get the weight in ounces of vegetable patty mix you should

feed.

"Vegetable patty" is the only thing you need a food processor

or grinder for. I toss in romaine lettuce, green leaf lettuce, red leaf

lettuce, zucchini, cucumber, carrots, broccoli stems (buy whole broccoli

for us, trim florets for us, stick the stem in a bag in the freezer for

veggie slop when I make it), ditto cauliflower, ditto almost any other

veggies you use. Veggies can be cheap -- some people i used to know in

Texas were able to talk their grocery into giving them the discards each

day for cheap. I run it all through the grinder, stir well, and freeze in

boxes... an easy way for you would be to figure how much you need for

each dog, and freeze in a box which contains one day's serving for all.

Then defrost and serve.

I don't do a lot of fancy prep for Shadow and Sunny -- I hand measure,

more or less, the amount of raw meaty bones into freezer packages, then

defrost and serve. No grinding, the dogs think it's great fun.

It's also not a bad idea to give red meat from time to time -- if you can

find a cheap source for beef heart or something, that works really well.

Otherwise, I use a good grade of ground beef. I also give them liver from

time to time.

Shadow and Sunny are each 30 pounds, so

30 x 16 = 480 ounces

..02 x 480 = 9.6 ounces of food daily (This usually gets rounded up to ten

ounces for my convenience. )

..6 x 9.6 = 5.76 (we usually round up to 6) ounces of RMBs, aka raw meaty

bones. RMBs should be roughly 50% meat and 50% easily eaten bones (which

is why chicken necks, backs, and wings (if affordable) are ideal. So are

turkey necks and pork neck bones.). This is what they get for

dinner.

They get about a quarter cup of crushed vegetables and an ounce of red

meat for breakfast. We do give them a low potency multi-B, and various

omega 3s -- salmon oil (and as prescribed by their holistic vet, flax oil

and DCCC mixed. They get about a tablespoon of DCCC and a teaspoon

of flax oil mashed together. Flax oil is not SCD illegal, but it

does go rancid easily, so we buy it in small quantities.)

For your hundred pounder:

100 x 16 = 1600 ounces

..02 x 1600 = 32 ounces of food daily

..6 x 32 = 19.2 (I would round up to 20) ounces of RMBs, This

is for dinner.

..4 x 32 - 12.8 ounces of "other." I would probably give about a

cup of veggie slop and 4-5 ounces of red meat. If your dog isn't used to

eating vegetables, you might have to start with less veggies and more

meat. If you can, I would include some heart and liver in with the red

meat. You can grind them up and mix them into the veggies so the

!@#$#@! too-smart-for- our-good beast doesn't pick the meat out and leave

the veggies.

Too many homemade dog food recipes include grains.... And we all know

what grains can do to our digestions. Besides, ever see a wolf roasting

an ear of corn?

Interestingly, it was through this diet for Shadow and Sunny that I found

SCD for me. They were doing great on their raw diet, and I mentioned in

the NatMed Forum (now deceased) that I wished I could find a grain-free

diet for humans. Someone pointed me to Breaking the Vicious Cycle,

and the rest, as they say, is history.

â€”

Marilyn

New

Orleans, Louisiana, USA

Undiagnosed IBS since 1976, SCD since 2001

Darn Good SCD Cook

No Human Children

Shadow & Sunny Longhair Dachshund

Babette the Foundling Beagle

March 22, 2010

At 08:06 AM 3/22/2010, you wrote:

Thanks! for the info on

feeding raw. How would you suggest transitioning over to raw

for a young dog (3 years) and an older dog (maybe 11

years)?

Well, since I wasn't sure what I was doing with Shadow and Sunny, I was

very careful about introducing vegetables, and such. I ground each

vegetable separately, and packaged it separately, and was really careful

about making sure they got some of each kind of vegetable every week....

and in one sense, it was worth it. I read, many times, of people having

trouble with getting their dogs to eat vegetables. I never had an issue

with Shadow and Sunny, because they got to try the single veggies. (I

established that they loved green beans, baby peas, avocado, carrots,

spinach, lettuces, zucchini, cucumbers, parsley, broccoli, and

cauliflower, and really, really didn't like turnips or lima

beans.

Now I do a big batch of the lettuces with either spinach or parsley,

always zucchini and cucumber because it helps by grinder/juicer handle

the leafy stuff, carrots, green beans, and whatever other pieces of

vegetables I have left over from making veggie soup or our meals. I

freeze it in containers, and take down one container a day. If we are

traveling, I will succumb to using jarred baby food, but I don't

recommend it. We mix the red meat with the veggies just before we feed

them.

With Babette, well... I offered the chicken wings, and she hasn't looked

back. She thinks red meat and veggies is fine. Absolutely NO hesitation

on that girl's part!

On weekends, when we have poached eggs, I split one jumbo egg between the

three of them as an extra snack each day.

Have I mentioned they like almond bread and pecan bread? The Great

Galoot, aka Shadow, figured out how to push a heavy oak dining chair away

from my dining table, get up on the chair, get up on the table, and ate

TWO WHOLE LOAVES of nut bread! He didn't even share them with his

sister!!

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