Guest guest Posted October 22, 2001 Report Share Posted October 22, 2001 If she didn't think that the DS was superior, why was she checking with DS surgeons for a revision? It sounds like she didn't make the best choice the first time. That is precisely my point. Best- Nick in Sage Re: Ren Cop Out/nick > Anyone who would not be a candidate for the DS due to previous > surgeries or other medical issues. I wish I could be more specific, > but Im not a doctor, so I cant quote case studies.. but I can tell you > that I have a friend who had a previous WLS and there are so many > problems with that, DS is not available for her. This has been > confirmed by two DS surgeons.. there must be others like her, > unfortunately. > > > > > > Hi Marcia - > > > > > > > > I don't want to start a war, either, but your statements are > just a > > > bit > > > > unclear. > > > > > > > > You said that the DS isn't the right surgery for everyone. Is > there > > > anyone > > > > who doesn't want to eat normally? Is there anyone who wants > more > > > weight to > > > > come back post op? Is there anyone who prefers to have > marginal > > > ulcers? > > > > Is there anyone who never wants to eat meat (or anything with > fiber) > > > that > > > > hasn't been run through a food processor - maybe they'd actually > > > prefer > > > > Gerber's baby foods? Is there someone out there who really > wants > > > to clog > > > > up their stoma and run on down for a bit of endoscopic > maintenance? > > > > > > > > Is there anyone without psychological pathology who actually > wants > > > to dump? > > > > > > > > Does somebody out there actually want to have band slippage or > > > erosion? > > > > > > > > Please let me know just who these people are because I can't > picture > > > anyone > > > > who is well informed picking the RNY or Gastric Band . . . or > any > > > other > > > > weight loss surgery. > > > > > > > > I, for one, will not be quite as wishy-washy. Let me go out on > a > > > limb here. > > > > Anybody who gets the RNY (or other WLS) is a victim of > > > misinformation or a > > > > lack of information. Anyone who hopes to lose significant > weight > > > and keep > > > > it off with the AGB is in fantasyland - unless they haven't > bothered > > > to read > > > > the results of the FDA trials. > > > > > > > > Best, > > > > > > > > Nick in Sage > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 22, 2001 Report Share Posted October 22, 2001 Well, that would explain the choice. However, the fact that the DS is the superior surgery is still pretty clear. After all, she tried to get one, albeit 18 years later. Best- Nick Re: Ren Cop Out/nick > Because when she had her original surgery done was 18 years ago, dear. > DS wasnt available and so she's stuck with the old 'gastroplasty'.. my > point in a nutshell. > > > > > > > > Hi Marcia - > > > > > > > > > > > > I don't want to start a war, either, but your statements are > > > just a > > > > > bit > > > > > > unclear. > > > > > > > > > > > > You said that the DS isn't the right surgery for everyone. > Is > > > there > > > > > anyone > > > > > > who doesn't want to eat normally? Is there anyone who wants > > > more > > > > > weight to > > > > > > come back post op? Is there anyone who prefers to have > > > marginal > > > > > ulcers? > > > > > > Is there anyone who never wants to eat meat (or anything > with > > > fiber) > > > > > that > > > > > > hasn't been run through a food processor - maybe they'd > actually > > > > > prefer > > > > > > Gerber's baby foods? Is there someone out there who really > > > wants > > > > > to clog > > > > > > up their stoma and run on down for a bit of endoscopic > > > maintenance? > > > > > > > > > > > > Is there anyone without psychological pathology who actually > > > wants > > > > > to dump? > > > > > > > > > > > > Does somebody out there actually want to have band slippage > or > > > > > erosion? > > > > > > > > > > > > Please let me know just who these people are because I can't > > > picture > > > > > anyone > > > > > > who is well informed picking the RNY or Gastric Band . . . > or > > > any > > > > > other > > > > > > weight loss surgery. > > > > > > > > > > > > I, for one, will not be quite as wishy-washy. Let me go out > on > > > a > > > > > limb here. > > > > > > Anybody who gets the RNY (or other WLS) is a victim of > > > > > misinformation or a > > > > > > lack of information. Anyone who hopes to lose significant > > > weight > > > > > and keep > > > > > > it off with the AGB is in fantasyland - unless they haven't > > > bothered > > > > > to read > > > > > > the results of the FDA trials. > > > > > > > > > > > > Best, > > > > > > > > > > > > Nick in Sage > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 22, 2001 Report Share Posted October 22, 2001 Sue - What concerns me is that you have yet to answer the question as to just who it is for whom the DS is not the right surgery. You have nothing to back up your position, or at least you haven't provided it as yet. It is all very nice and sweet to be tolerant of everyone and accept their individual choices. However, if there is no scientific study, research or evidence to back it up, it should not be paraded about as fact. I shudder to think that someone might read your posts and use them as a basis for their decisions. If you have something other than a feeling in your head to back it up, please let us have it. I am sure that everyone will join me in accepting what you say. Otherwise, it is not helpful to allow our personal opinions to masquerade as scientific fact. Right now, the surgeons who have conducted studies indicate that the DS IS the BEST surgery for the super morbidly obese - or at least the ones who want to keep the weight off long term. Nick in Sage Re: Ren Cop Out/nick > Of course its superior, but not for everyone.. Im trying to say that > there are circumstances that would prevent a DS being done.. and there > are Im sure other scenarios.... ( .. and that's what my response to > the post was about... its not fair or right to 'assume' that DS is > best for everyone.. cause its not.. even if its the best thing we > have. > > > > > > > > > > > Hi Marcia - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I don't want to start a war, either, but your statements > are > > > > > just a > > > > > > > bit > > > > > > > > unclear. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You said that the DS isn't the right surgery for > everyone. > > > Is > > > > > there > > > > > > > anyone > > > > > > > > who doesn't want to eat normally? Is there anyone who > wants > > > > > more > > > > > > > weight to > > > > > > > > come back post op? Is there anyone who prefers to have > > > > > marginal > > > > > > > ulcers? > > > > > > > > Is there anyone who never wants to eat meat (or anything > > > with > > > > > fiber) > > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > hasn't been run through a food processor - maybe they'd > > > actually > > > > > > > prefer > > > > > > > > Gerber's baby foods? Is there someone out there who > really > > > > > wants > > > > > > > to clog > > > > > > > > up their stoma and run on down for a bit of endoscopic > > > > > maintenance? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Is there anyone without psychological pathology who > actually > > > > > wants > > > > > > > to dump? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Does somebody out there actually want to have band > slippage > > > or > > > > > > > erosion? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please let me know just who these people are because I > can't > > > > > picture > > > > > > > anyone > > > > > > > > who is well informed picking the RNY or Gastric Band . . > . > > > or > > > > > any > > > > > > > other > > > > > > > > weight loss surgery. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I, for one, will not be quite as wishy-washy. Let me go > out > > > on > > > > > a > > > > > > > limb here. > > > > > > > > Anybody who gets the RNY (or other WLS) is a victim of > > > > > > > misinformation or a > > > > > > > > lack of information. Anyone who hopes to lose > significant > > > > > weight > > > > > > > and keep > > > > > > > > it off with the AGB is in fantasyland - unless they > haven't > > > > > bothered > > > > > > > to read > > > > > > > > the results of the FDA trials. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Best, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nick in Sage > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 22, 2001 Report Share Posted October 22, 2001 Sue - You are like trying to put your finger into a blob of mercury. First you said that different people were better off with different surgeries. Next you said that you were right because you knew someone who said that two doctors told them that a prior procedure disqualified them from the DS. Now you are saying that some people can't have the DS because of something that might turn up in their pre-op testing. There was a 60's book on human behavior called " Games People Play. " One of those games is " Yes, but . . . " This is a game at which you excel. Sue, do you believe that, assuming someone who is morbidly obese and is a candidate for any kind of surgery, might find something other than the DS to be a better surgery for them? Please support your answer with factual data. It doesn't have to be medicalese, but it does have to represent what can be found in studies and not merely in your mind. In case you haven't been through the pre-op testing, you will find that most of it has to do with how they have to prepare to take care of predictable situations that might occur during surgery. For example, a person with a penchant for DVT will probably find the doctor installing a Greenfield Filter. People with respiratory problems will likely have precautions taken by a pulmonologist - and so on. Anyone with a problem uncovered at this point and is not able to have the DS could not have other procedures, either, unless they were given an AGB or, perhaps, one of those little balls they inflate in your stomach. Anyone who fails the psych test will likely not get the surgery, either. That would be equally true, though, for any weight loss surgery. I could care less if you are sweet or tolerant. What I do care is that you post accurate information and not present your opinion as fact. I have yet to see you back up what you say with anything remotely resembling facts. Best - Nick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 22, 2001 Report Share Posted October 22, 2001 I have to think that the lady's noncompliance with the DS would have been a problem with any procedure. The shrink just plain blew it with her. Nick Re: Ren Cop Out/nick > I can't quote scientific studies either, I know of at least one case where > DS was the wrong choice. I remember mentioning it to you a while ago. > Where a young woman was non-compliant with her supplements and protein > intake. She thought she felt fine with out them. Unfortunately you don't > show signs for some time with multiple vitamin deficiencies. She was also > warned a short time before her death from massive systemic infection that > she was probably protein deficient. > I have also heard of other cases like hers, maybe not as drastic. > Someone like this isn't a DS candidate. A RNY (not distal) would have been > better for her. > > Also I know several people who have had RNY years ago, who have kept the > weight off. One of them is just recently started regaining some weight. > But, she is now 77 years old and has slowed down drastically because of > arthritis. > > I know this isn't a scientific sample, but if there is one case that I know > of, there must be many more. > > Rita Black > > <<What concerns me is that you have yet to answer the question as to just > who > it is for whom the DS is not the right surgery. You have nothing to back up > your position, or at least you haven't provided it as yet. > > It is all very nice and sweet to be tolerant of everyone and accept their > individual choices. However, if there is no scientific study, research or > evidence to back it up, it should not be paraded about as fact.>> > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 23, 2001 Report Share Posted October 23, 2001 OMG.........YOU GUYS STOP!!!!!!!!!!!!! LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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