Guest guest Posted October 21, 2001 Report Share Posted October 21, 2001 what is the difference between the two again????????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 21, 2001 Report Share Posted October 21, 2001 As I understood it, one of the big reasons Deb was having such a hard time accepting what had happened to her was because the BPD was giving her lots of vomiting and other undesirable side effects. The last I heard of her was a while ago, but at that time she was several months out and still hadn't recovered enough to go back to work. Then, when she tried to get more information about what happened during the surgery, she encountered a lot of resistance from the doctors office. That made her suspicious of the doctors motives and/or surgical skills. No one wants to have something go wrong and then start to feel there is a 'cover-up' going on. I wonder how she is doing now... Shelly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 21, 2001 Report Share Posted October 21, 2001 I know this is going to start a war, but, Carole, let's cut the judgemental bit. There are people, for whatever reason, don't want the DS. I said my experience with Ren was that she explained both procedures carefully enough that I was able to make the right decision for MY needs, which was the DS. I don't consider this in any way a copout. I wouldn't go to a surgeon who offers no individual choice! What I said was that people have different needs and viewpoints and deserve to have access to procedures (whether WE approve or not) with which they feel they can comply. Marcia Re: Ren Cop Out In a message dated 10/21/01 2:42:45 PM Eastern Daylight Time, duodenalswitch writes: << Please don't make the assumption that she is exploring other avenues of WL relief because she CAN'T do DS, rather that not all morbidly obese people SHOULD have DS. This is only MHO Respectfully, Marcia >> I respectfully disagree with you or Dr. Ren or whoever says not all morbidly obese people should have DS. Why? I know there are those who want to suffer and choose RNY because of it. However, I also know there are thousands who don't even know about the DS and would choose it in a heartbeat if they KNEW about it. It sickens me that Dr. Ren waits for the " patient " to let her know that THEY know about DS instead of telling them about it, and will, instead, because the patient didn't know about DS, suggest some other procedure. Saying NOT ALL MORBIDLY OBESE PEOPLE SHOULD HAVE DS is a complete and TOTAL COP OUT and BS besides. Carole ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 21, 2001 Report Share Posted October 21, 2001 One BIG correction here.. Deb did not get " THE " BPD. What was done in her case was that, instead of a side stoma, Deb's pouch & stoma are directly connected at the bottom of her pouch, like a funnel.. everything that goes in her mouth is literally dumped straight into her intestines. Basically, Deb experiences the pain and discomfort of dumping from EVERYTHING she eats. Not a great quality of life, that. due to the straight pipe connection, she also cannot sleep at less than a 45 degree angle, or she has reflux. It also causes horrible halitosis that nothing can help, because any bowel odors/gas in her intestines rise straight up and exit her mouth. Nasty, huh? So no, Deb is not suing because she got a BPD.. if she had an actual BPD she would not have the dumping, the halitosis, or reflux as severe as hers is. She is suing because her quality of life is not very good. Just an FYI.. Liane > > In a message dated 10/21/01 4:12:45 PM, duodenalswitch@y... writes: > > << *note what is to follow is a personal opinion* > I believe the reason that Dr. Ren wants to do the BPD and not the DS is > because of her lawsuit. I think this is her way of proving that the BPD > without the DS is favorable and I think that is why she is trying to put less > importance on the pylorous. Like I said this is just an opinion based on what > I have read on here. > >> > > Hmmmmmm... Lisbeth -- you could very well be onto something here. This is a > very valid point. For newbies and those who are wondering: The case you are > referring to is Deb Mullins, who went for a DS but came out with a BPD due to > what Dr. REn claimed to be inadequate blood supply to the duodenum. <snip> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 21, 2001 Report Share Posted October 21, 2001 OMG, Lili - that must be devastating! Can she be converted to a DS? Can *anything* be done to fix her? What a nightmare... dee --- " Lili F. " wrote: > One BIG correction here.. > Deb did not get " THE " BPD. What was done in her > case was that, > instead of a side stoma, Deb's pouch & stoma are > directly connected at > the bottom of her pouch, like a funnel.. everything > that goes in her > mouth is literally dumped straight into her > intestines. Basically, > Deb experiences the pain and discomfort of dumping > from EVERYTHING she > eats. Not a great quality of life, that. due to the > straight pipe > connection, she also cannot sleep at less than a 45 > degree angle, or > she has reflux. It also causes horrible halitosis > that nothing can > help, because any bowel odors/gas in her intestines > rise straight up > and exit her mouth. Nasty, huh? So no, Deb is not > suing because she > got a BPD.. if she had an actual BPD she would not > have the dumping, > the halitosis, or reflux as severe as hers is. She > is suing because > her quality of life is not very good. > > Just an FYI.. > Liane > > > > > > In a message dated 10/21/01 4:12:45 PM, > duodenalswitch@y... writes: > > > > << *note what is to follow is a personal opinion* > > I believe the reason that Dr. Ren wants to do the > BPD and not the DS > is > > because of her lawsuit. I think this is her way of > proving that the > BPD > > without the DS is favorable and I think that is > why she is trying to > put less > > importance on the pylorous. Like I said this is > just an opinion > based on what > > I have read on here. > > >> > > > > Hmmmmmm... Lisbeth -- you could very well be onto > something here. > This is a > > very valid point. For newbies and those who are > wondering: The > case you are > > referring to is Deb Mullins, who went for a DS but > came out with a > BPD due to > > what Dr. REn claimed to be inadequate blood supply > to the duodenum. > <snip> > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 21, 2001 Report Share Posted October 21, 2001 Hi Marcia - I don't want to start a war, either, but your statements are just a bit unclear. You said that the DS isn't the right surgery for everyone. Is there anyone who doesn't want to eat normally? Is there anyone who wants more weight to come back post op? Is there anyone who prefers to have marginal ulcers? Is there anyone who never wants to eat meat (or anything with fiber) that hasn't been run through a food processor - maybe they'd actually prefer Gerber's baby foods? Is there someone out there who really wants to clog up their stoma and run on down for a bit of endoscopic maintenance? Is there anyone without psychological pathology who actually wants to dump? Does somebody out there actually want to have band slippage or erosion? Please let me know just who these people are because I can't picture anyone who is well informed picking the RNY or Gastric Band . . . or any other weight loss surgery. I, for one, will not be quite as wishy-washy. Let me go out on a limb here. Anybody who gets the RNY (or other WLS) is a victim of misinformation or a lack of information. Anyone who hopes to lose significant weight and keep it off with the AGB is in fantasyland - unless they haven't bothered to read the results of the FDA trials. Best, Nick in Sage Re: Ren Cop Out > > In a message dated 10/21/01 2:42:45 PM Eastern Daylight Time, > duodenalswitch writes: > > << Please don't make the assumption that she is exploring other > avenues of WL relief because she CAN'T do DS, rather that not all morbidly > obese people SHOULD have DS. > This is only MHO > Respectfully, > Marcia > >> > I respectfully disagree with you or Dr. Ren or whoever says not all morbidly > obese people should have DS. Why? I know there are those who want to > suffer > and choose RNY because of it. However, I also know there are thousands who > don't even know about the DS and would choose it in a heartbeat if they KNEW > about it. > It sickens me that Dr. Ren waits for the " patient " to let her know that THEY > know about DS instead of telling them about it, and will, instead, because > the patient didn't know about DS, suggest some other procedure. > Saying NOT ALL MORBIDLY OBESE PEOPLE SHOULD HAVE DS is a complete and TOTAL > COP OUT and BS besides. > Carole > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 21, 2001 Report Share Posted October 21, 2001 Nick, I agree whole-heartedly with you. I can't imagine someone picking the RNY over the DS. But there are people who can't have the DS and must have the RNY instead. Not to long ago on this list there was a woman who had low albium levels so she couldnt get the DS she is having the RNY with Dr. G and if you join the OSSG list dont mention the DS there. The RNY'ers on that list think that dumping is the cure to obesity...I guess different strokes for different folks...*shrugs* Lisbeth Nick wrote: Hi Marcia - I don't want to start a war, either, but your statements are just a bit unclear. You said that the DS isn't the right surgery for everyone. Is there anyone who doesn't want to eat normally? Is there anyone who wants more weight to come back post op? Is there anyone who prefers to have marginal ulcers? Is there anyone who never wants to eat meat (or anything with fiber) that hasn't been run through a food processor - maybe they'd actually prefer Gerber's baby foods? Is there someone out there who really wants to clog up their stoma and run on down for a bit of endoscopic maintenance? Is there anyone without psychological pathology who actually wants to dump? Does somebody out there actually want to have band slippage or erosion? Please let me know just who these people are because I can't picture anyone who is well informed picking the RNY or Gastric Band . . . or any other weight loss surgery. I, for one, will not be quite as wishy-washy. Let me go out on a limb here. Anybody who gets the RNY (or other WLS) is a victim of misinformation or a lack of information. Anyone who hopes to lose significant weight and keep it off with the AGB is in fantasyland - unless they haven't bothered to read the results of the FDA trials. Best, Nick in Sage Re: Ren Cop Out > > In a message dated 10/21/01 2:42:45 PM Eastern Daylight Time, > duodenalswitch writes: > > << Please don't make the assumption that she is exploring other > avenues of WL relief because she CAN'T do DS, rather that not all morbidly > obese people SHOULD have DS. > This is only MHO > Respectfully, > Marcia > >> > I respectfully disagree with you or Dr. Ren or whoever says not all morbidly > obese people should have DS. Why? I know there are those who want to > suffer > and choose RNY because of it. However, I also know there are thousands who > don't even know about the DS and would choose it in a heartbeat if they KNEW > about it. > It sickens me that Dr. Ren waits for the " patient " to let her know that THEY > know about DS instead of telling them about it, and will, instead, because > the patient didn't know about DS, suggest some other procedure. > Saying NOT ALL MORBIDLY OBESE PEOPLE SHOULD HAVE DS is a complete and TOTAL > COP OUT and BS besides. > Carole > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 21, 2001 Report Share Posted October 21, 2001 Hi Lisbeth- That low albumin level was a surgeon specific impediment. I, too, had a low albumin level. All that happened in my case was for Dr. Keshishian's to call me and tell me not to diet as a pre-op (a novel call, indeed). So far, I have survived. I plan on continuing to do so for a many more years, and then to die in my nineties from a lightening strike! As to the RNYers who love dumping, note that I didn't expect to bring along those with psychological problems. I recently corresponded with someone who had low albumin levels and suggested that she talk with other doctors. Apparently she didn't do so. Again, if someone chooses not to learn of their options, the RNY is going to be their chosen surgery. A person of some notoriety who had the RNY is reputed to have confided that, when that person had it , that person was not aware of the DS. I think what can best be said is that some people don't care enough about their quality of life or the long-term implications of their chosen therapy to make an effort to become informed about their options. That doesn't mean that the DS might be good for one person and the RNY for others. It just means that some people are happy remaining ignorant. I guess that getting what we want is getting what we deserve. Personally, I deserve the DS. Best- Nick Re: Ren Cop Out > > > > In a message dated 10/21/01 2:42:45 PM Eastern Daylight Time, > > duodenalswitch writes: > > > > << Please don't make the assumption that she is exploring other > > avenues of WL relief because she CAN'T do DS, rather that not all > morbidly > > obese people SHOULD have DS. > > This is only MHO > > Respectfully, > > Marcia > > >> > > I respectfully disagree with you or Dr. Ren or whoever says not all > morbidly > > obese people should have DS. Why? I know there are those who want to > > suffer > > and choose RNY because of it. However, I also know there are thousands > who > > don't even know about the DS and would choose it in a heartbeat if they > KNEW > > about it. > > It sickens me that Dr. Ren waits for the " patient " to let her know that > THEY > > know about DS instead of telling them about it, and will, instead, because > > the patient didn't know about DS, suggest some other procedure. > > Saying NOT ALL MORBIDLY OBESE PEOPLE SHOULD HAVE DS is a complete and > TOTAL > > COP OUT and BS besides. > > Carole > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 21, 2001 Report Share Posted October 21, 2001 I can't imagine what this poor woman is going through. This sounds like negligence of the grossest kind. Why on earth would she connect vertically rather than on the side?! I always wondered why the pouches were connected on the side. I hope Deb wins big time, but it is small compensation if she can't get this fixed. :-((( Chris > > > > In a message dated 10/21/01 4:12:45 PM, duodenalswitch@y... writes: > > > > << *note what is to follow is a personal opinion* > > I believe the reason that Dr. Ren wants to do the BPD and not the DS > is > > because of her lawsuit. I think this is her way of proving that the > BPD > > without the DS is favorable and I think that is why she is trying to > put less > > importance on the pylorous. Like I said this is just an opinion > based on what > > I have read on here. > > >> > > > > Hmmmmmm... Lisbeth -- you could very well be onto something here. > This is a > > very valid point. For newbies and those who are wondering: The > case you are > > referring to is Deb Mullins, who went for a DS but came out with a > BPD due to > > what Dr. REn claimed to be inadequate blood supply to the duodenum. > <snip> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 21, 2001 Report Share Posted October 21, 2001 I feel compelled to add to Nick's observations. Although a surgeon might and I will use that might conditionally, be inclined to discuss the differences in procedures and compliance, I doubt sincerely that any of them pushing RNY or BPD or band are being straight forward in the long term outcome of these surgeries. Where it is commonplace to discuss risks of surgery, unless one is selling a procedure, they are unlikely to provide statistics indicating that the long term repercussions are weight regain, increased ulcer and cancer risks, as well as pointing out that if " we " were so good at dieting long term, we wouldn't be seeking WLS in the first place. Please, understand that anyone who knowingly chooses their surgery has my full support. I just have to wonder in my heart, if I or anyone else would chose a surgery that relies on my ability to " diet " long term, and that only gives me a 50-50 chance of keeping the wieght off. Back when I was on my liquid fast diet, I was shown how rapidly the weight would come off, and I knew that if I could just stay on the fast for 7 months, I would reach goal. What I didn't research was that to maintain my weight loss, I would have to subsist on 800 calories a day along with 2 hours of exercise per day, for the rest of my life. Would I have still done the diet? Perhaps...because I was desperate and very ill at the time. If anyone had told me about the DS, and/or, if I had access to computer research, and/or if I had been more mature, I would never have done that to my metabolism. End of discourse....yawn, theresa > Hi Marcia - > > I don't want to start a war, either, but your statements are just a bit > unclear. > > You said that the DS isn't the right surgery for everyone. Is there anyone > who doesn't want to eat normally? Is there anyone who wants more weight to > come back post op? Is there anyone who prefers to have marginal ulcers? > Is there anyone who never wants to eat meat (or anything with fiber) that > hasn't been run through a food processor - maybe they'd actually prefer > Gerber's baby foods? Is there someone out there who really wants to clog > up their stoma and run on down for a bit of endoscopic maintenance? > > Is there anyone without psychological pathology who actually wants to dump? > > Does somebody out there actually want to have band slippage or erosion? > > Please let me know just who these people are because I can't picture anyone > who is well informed picking the RNY or Gastric Band . . . or any other > weight loss surgery. > > I, for one, will not be quite as wishy-washy. Let me go out on a limb here. > Anybody who gets the RNY (or other WLS) is a victim of misinformation or a > lack of information. Anyone who hopes to lose significant weight and keep > it off with the AGB is in fantasyland - unless they haven't bothered to read > the results of the FDA trials. > > Best, > > Nick in Sage > > > Re: Ren Cop Out > > > > In a message dated 10/21/01 2:42:45 PM Eastern Daylight Time, > > duodenalswitch@y... writes: > > > > << Please don't make the assumption that she is exploring other > > avenues of WL relief because she CAN'T do DS, rather that not all > morbidly > > obese people SHOULD have DS. > > This is only MHO > > Respectfully, > > Marcia > > >> > > I respectfully disagree with you or Dr. Ren or whoever says not all > morbidly > > obese people should have DS. Why? I know there are those who want to > > suffer > > and choose RNY because of it. However, I also know there are thousands > who > > don't even know about the DS and would choose it in a heartbeat if they > KNEW > > about it. > > It sickens me that Dr. Ren waits for the " patient " to let her know that > THEY > > know about DS instead of telling them about it, and will, instead, because > > the patient didn't know about DS, suggest some other procedure. > > Saying NOT ALL MORBIDLY OBESE PEOPLE SHOULD HAVE DS is a complete and > TOTAL > > COP OUT and BS besides. > > Carole > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------ ---- > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 21, 2001 Report Share Posted October 21, 2001 Recently on the Today show there was a discussion about albumin levels and surgery. A study has shown that low albumin levels are associated with increased mortality in surgery--ALL surgery. If tests reveal a low level, the remedy is to postpone the operation until the level is raised, and this is done by eating plenty of protein. Also, if you know you'll be having surgery, you can get tested about 2 months prior and eat more protein in preparation. For a surgeon to say that low albumin precludes you from having DS but makes RNY acceptable is ridiculous, IMNSHO. And Nick, GREAT letter about DS vs RNY! Chris Hi Marcia - > > > > I don't want to start a war, either, but your statements are just a bit > > unclear. > > > > You said that the DS isn't the right surgery for everyone. Is there anyone > > who doesn't want to eat normally? Is there anyone who wants more weight to > > come back post op? Is there anyone who prefers to have marginal ulcers? > > Is there anyone who never wants to eat meat (or anything with fiber) that > > hasn't been run through a food processor - maybe they'd actually prefer > > Gerber's baby foods? Is there someone out there who really wants to clog > > up their stoma and run on down for a bit of endoscopic maintenance? > > > > Is there anyone without psychological pathology who actually wants to > dump? > > > > Does somebody out there actually want to have band slippage or erosion? > > > > Please let me know just who these people are because I can't picture > anyone > > who is well informed picking the RNY or Gastric Band . . . or any other > > weight loss surgery. > > > > I, for one, will not be quite as wishy-washy. Let me go out on a limb > here. > > Anybody who gets the RNY (or other WLS) is a victim of misinformation or a > > lack of information. Anyone who hopes to lose significant weight and keep > > it off with the AGB is in fantasyland - unless they haven't bothered to > read > > the results of the FDA trials. > > > > Best, > > > > Nick in Sage > > > > > > Re: Ren Cop Out > > > > > > In a message dated 10/21/01 2:42:45 PM Eastern Daylight Time, > > > duodenalswitch@y... writes: > > > > > > << Please don't make the assumption that she is exploring other > > > avenues of WL relief because she CAN'T do DS, rather that not all > > morbidly > > > obese people SHOULD have DS. > > > This is only MHO > > > Respectfully, > > > Marcia > > > >> > > > I respectfully disagree with you or Dr. Ren or whoever says not all > > morbidly > > > obese people should have DS. Why? I know there are those who want to > > > suffer > > > and choose RNY because of it. However, I also know there are thousands > > who > > > don't even know about the DS and would choose it in a heartbeat if they > > KNEW > > > about it. > > > It sickens me that Dr. Ren waits for the " patient " to let her know that > > THEY > > > know about DS instead of telling them about it, and will, instead, > because > > > the patient didn't know about DS, suggest some other procedure. > > > Saying NOT ALL MORBIDLY OBESE PEOPLE SHOULD HAVE DS is a complete and > > TOTAL > > > COP OUT and BS besides. > > > Carole > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- ------ > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 22, 2001 Report Share Posted October 22, 2001 is the RNY reversable? Im not sure. Im still learning what surgery's do what. LOL I am having gastric bypass surgery...the same one carney wilson had. I havent seen to many people talk about that particular surgery. Can you tell me what the difference is between that surgery......and one you DONT DUMP with? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 22, 2001 Report Share Posted October 22, 2001 Your right....and everyone's body is different....I have talk to dozens of people who have had different WLS and they are all different....even if they have had the same surgery. Everyones experiences are different. Some people have had RNY and have had no problems.....no dumping, and others have and had dumping. It depends on your body and what it can and can't tolerate. But doctors need to tell patients ALL the pros and cons of EVERY surgery. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 22, 2001 Report Share Posted October 22, 2001 hahahaha......that was a good comparason.........lol love it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 22, 2001 Report Share Posted October 22, 2001 Kdlddd1219@... said: > And I don't think the people who have had the RNY > > done.......Like to dump.....no one likes to > dump. So, I think that was a silly remark. Well, if you really believe what you said, why would anyone who is truly informed have the RNY? Best - Nick in Sage Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 22, 2001 Report Share Posted October 22, 2001 Everyone IS entitled to their own opinions. However, when we make our informed choices as to the appropriate weight loss surgery, we should count on facts, studies and research, not other people's opinions. Nick Re: Re: Ren Cop Out > Everyone is entitiled to their own opinions I guess. > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 22, 2001 Report Share Posted October 22, 2001 It sickens me that Dr. Ren waits for the " patient " > to let her know that THEY > know about DS instead of telling them about it, > Carole > ****When I saw Dr. Ren in Sept. she gave me a packet of info and then she went through the info and showed me all the wls being done. BE HAPPY ===== B 36yrs Pre-op 11-13-01 Wt.308 BMI 49 BCBS of MI Blue Choice POS __________________________________________________ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 22, 2001 Report Share Posted October 22, 2001 > Is there anyone without psychological pathology who actually wants to dump? Actually Nick there are quite a few with this pathology. These people feel that they are out of control and need to be " punished " for eating sugar. It seems strange to me, but then there are men who pay women to dominate them, so we live in a strange world. Hull Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 22, 2001 Report Share Posted October 22, 2001 You dont think anyone likes to dump join the OSSG list the way they talk about Dumping you would think its the second coming!!!!! Some people are into torture! Lisbeth kdlddd1219@... wrote: And I dont think the people who have had the RNY done.......Like to dump.....no one likes to dump. So, I think that was a silly remark ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 22, 2001 Report Share Posted October 22, 2001 Nick, No war with me. If I was unclear, I apologize. My feeling is that some people (whether " pathological " or not) are unwilling to undergo the risks THEY PERCEIVE to be part of DS. Others, again for their own reasons (and who, other than a trained professional, can say they are pathological) feel the need to " limit " themselves through the restrictions imposed by lapband and RNY. You may think they're crazy, I may think they're crazy but this is America, and if they are fully informed of their choices and options (as, from my own experience, I can attest that Ren does), then who are we to say they can't go with their choice? That is the only point I have been trying to make. INFORMED consumers have a right to make their own choices, even if WE feel they're wrong. Marcia Re: Re: Ren Cop Out Hi Marcia - I don't want to start a war, either, but your statements are just a bit unclear. You said that the DS isn't the right surgery for everyone. Is there anyone who doesn't want to eat normally? Is there anyone who wants more weight to come back post op? Is there anyone who prefers to have marginal ulcers? Is there anyone who never wants to eat meat (or anything with fiber) that hasn't been run through a food processor - maybe they'd actually prefer Gerber's baby foods? Is there someone out there who really wants to clog up their stoma and run on down for a bit of endoscopic maintenance? Is there anyone without psychological pathology who actually wants to dump? Does somebody out there actually want to have band slippage or erosion? Please let me know just who these people are because I can't picture anyone who is well informed picking the RNY or Gastric Band . . . or any other weight loss surgery. I, for one, will not be quite as wishy-washy. Let me go out on a limb here. Anybody who gets the RNY (or other WLS) is a victim of misinformation or a lack of information. Anyone who hopes to lose significant weight and keep it off with the AGB is in fantasyland - unless they haven't bothered to read the results of the FDA trials. Best, Nick in Sage Re: Ren Cop Out > > In a message dated 10/21/01 2:42:45 PM Eastern Daylight Time, > duodenalswitch writes: > > << Please don't make the assumption that she is exploring other > avenues of WL relief because she CAN'T do DS, rather that not all morbidly > obese people SHOULD have DS. > This is only MHO > Respectfully, > Marcia > >> > I respectfully disagree with you or Dr. Ren or whoever says not all morbidly > obese people should have DS. Why? I know there are those who want to > suffer > and choose RNY because of it. However, I also know there are thousands who > don't even know about the DS and would choose it in a heartbeat if they KNEW > about it. > It sickens me that Dr. Ren waits for the " patient " to let her know that THEY > know about DS instead of telling them about it, and will, instead, because > the patient didn't know about DS, suggest some other procedure. > Saying NOT ALL MORBIDLY OBESE PEOPLE SHOULD HAVE DS is a complete and TOTAL > COP OUT and BS besides. > Carole > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 22, 2001 Report Share Posted October 22, 2001 Wait a damn second!!! Do you actually mean there are women who get paid for this??? shakes head and mutters to herself as she walks down the hall.... Grrrrrrrrrr, Theresa It seems strange to me, but then there are men who > pay women to dominate them, so we live in a strange world. > > Hull Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 22, 2001 Report Share Posted October 22, 2001 Hey Thresa remember when I said that I needed a second job to pay for my new clothes you thinking what I am thinking *wink* LOL Lisbeth Theresa wrote: Wait a damn second!!! Do you actually mean there are women who get paid for this??? shakes head and mutters to herself as she walks down the hall.... Grrrrrrrrrr, Theresa It seems strange to me, but then there are men who > pay women to dominate them, so we live in a strange world. > > Hull ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 22, 2001 Report Share Posted October 22, 2001 Hi Marcia - I guess you're right. In America, people have the right to be nutty and make nutty choices. That doesn't mean that their choices are good, though, nor does it mean that they are receiving the best possible surgery. Why, all of a sudden, are so many people championing people's rights to make bad choices? No matter how much we defend that right, the choices are still bad. Best, Nick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 22, 2001 Report Share Posted October 22, 2001 --- Nick wrote: > Hi Marcia - > > I guess you're right. In America, people have the > right to be nutty and > make nutty choices. > > That doesn't mean that their choices are good, > though, nor does it mean that > they are receiving the best possible surgery. > > Why, all of a sudden, are so many people championing > people's rights to make > bad choices? No matter how much we defend that > right, the choices are still > bad. **Nick, Somewhere along these post I must have missed something because you sure sound like someone who feels threatened and has the need to lash out. SO what, Dr. Ren has decided not to do the DS and instead of offering nothing, she is offering the nexted best thing in my opinion. I am certain she isn't doing that to hurt you in anyway so you can stop worrying. If someone wants the DS they have the option to go to another doctor. If all Doctors stopped doing the DS tomarrow you can bet I'd agree to have the BPD. > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 22, 2001 Report Share Posted October 22, 2001 ROTFLMAO I am with you Theresa! Lisbeth Theresa wrote: Darlin, I think we could rent ourselves out and heck....shop only at Sax! Laughing, Theresa Wait a damn second!!! > > Do you actually mean there are women who get paid for this??? > > shakes head and mutters to herself as she walks down the hall.... > > Grrrrrrrrrr, > Theresa > > It seems strange to me, but then there are men who > > pay women to dominate them, so we live in a strange world. > > > > Hull > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- -- > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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