Re: low protein, high fat and SCD.. Stupid nutritionist...

[Guest guest]

3 times as much protein may not be true.. It just feels like that.

Here is 4 days food journal:

http://scdandme.com/Startingscd/About_the_recipes_files/4%20days%20of%20food.pdf

Karianne

>

>

> Now I am just so angry and confused (again..).

>

>

>

> I talked with my nutritionist yesterday for 1

> hour and I don't

> agree with him.

>

>

>

> He want me to stay on SCD in combination with

> low oxalate,

> phenole and low carb/high fat. It is impossible for me right now to stay

> high

> fat because I don't digest fat so good. Thats why he want to give me bio

> gest, betaine

> HCI & pepsin and one more I can't remember the name on.

>

>

>

> I don't want to stay on a low oxalate. My goal

> with SCD is

> that I one day can eat all the fruit, honey and nuts that I want. I know

> it

> will be a long time before I can do it bu tone day.. And then I can't

> stay low

> oxalate!

>

>

>

> Spinach and alomonds are high in oxalate and he

> don't want

> me to eat this. I want to make almond yogurt and I like to use a small

> amount of

> spinach in my soup. Because I don't react to it! I don't understand why I

> need

> to avoid food I don't react to!

>

>

>

> We talked alot about protein, carbs and fat

> intake. He want

> me to eat 70g protein, 170g fat and 40-60 carbs per day. Well.. I can

> tell you

> one thing. That will never happen. It is NOT possible to eat only 70g

> protein.

> I eat at least 3 times as much as that now.

>

>

>

> He talked about high protein diets cause ammonia

> in my body

> that can effect my head and mood. Does anyonw know anything about this??

>

>

>

>

>

> He also talked about probiotic, fermented

> vegetable juices..

> I told him that I made coconut yoghurt and it was fermented for 10

> hours. He

> said I should do at least 24 hours because it takes time for the bacterias to

> start to grow.

> He said

> that he made a large batch of yoghurt that he use as a starter now and

> if I

> ferment my yoghurt in 24 hours I can do the same.

>

>

>

> He said I eat to much vegetables. Maybe I do? I

> am not sure.

> I think I eat about 3 lbs every day.

>

>

>

> I am just very pissed of on him now because I

> don't agree..

>

>

> karianne

> SCD since august 09

> 99% SCD legal 1,5 year before I restartet.

> I have ASD and undiagnosed gut issues.. (the doctors have given me up..)

>

[Guest guest]

Karianne,Wow! Someone who is putting it all together. You are very lucky! "Thats why he want to give me bio

gest, betaine

HCI & pepsin and one more I can’t remember the name on."I am not sure about all that he wants you on, but if he is familiar with SCD and wanting you to stay on it, he probably isn't going to recommend any illegal ingredients in your supplements -- check to be sure though. It sounds like you don't have enough stomach acid, did he run any tests to verify this?"I don’t want to stay on a low oxalate. My goal with SCD is

that I one day can eat all the fruit, honey and nuts that I want. I know

it

will be a long time before I can do it bu tone day.. And then I can’t stay low

oxalate! "You will most likely be able to eat all those things one day, but for now, your doctor thinks it is not in your best interest to eat those things. It won't be forever. Lots of people have trouble eating nuts and fruits at the beginning. Did you ask him the reason he believes you need to be low oxalate -- some test he did or symptoms you have that would correlate with the need to be low oxalate?"He talked about high protein diets cause ammonia

in my body

that can effect my head and mood. Does anyonw know anything about this??"That sounds correct according to what I have read. Eating high protein, if there is a problem elsewhere in the body (I believe it is the liver), can lead to high ammonia levels when the protein is broken down in the body."He also talked about probiotic, fermented vegetable juices..

I told him that I made coconut yoghurt and it was fermented for 10 hours. He

said I should do at least 24 hours because it takes time for the bacterias to

start to grow. He said

that he made a large batch of yoghurt that he use as a starter now and if I

ferment my yoghurt in 24 hours I can do the same. "That isn't quite correct. The full 24 hours is because it takes that long for the bacteria to act on all/most of the lactose and milk protein. You do not have cow milk protein nor lactose in coconut milk. I would think that unless you added lots of honey or other natural sweetener, the bacteria would actually die of starvation by the 24 hour mark. It is possible he knows of a study that show that you might not be getting as much good bacteria in 10 hours with coconut milk as you would 24 hours with cow's milk, but coconut milk also provides other benefits -- antibacterial properties in the fat for one thing."I am just very pissed of on him now because I don’t agree.. "Although it is a good thing to question a doctor about his treatment recommendations, one still needs to really truthfully consider what and why the doctor is making those recommendations. If he speaks the truth, even if you don't like it, it still needs to be acknowledged and his advice heeded. Of course, if you disagree based on good logic and science, you aren't required to take his advice.AmeliaTo: BTVC SCD <btvc-scd >; Pecanbread

<pecanbread >Sent: Sun, May 23, 2010 6:01:12 AMSubject: low protein, high fat and SCD.. Stupid nutritionist...

Now I am just so angry and confused (again..).

I talked with my nutritionist yesterday for 1 hour and I don’t

agree with him.

He want me to stay on SCD in combination with low oxalate,

phenole and low carb/high fat. It is impossible for me right now to stay

high

fat because I don’t digest fat so good. Thats why he want to give me bio

gest, betaine

HCI & pepsin and one more I can’t remember the name on.

I don’t want to stay on a low oxalate. My goal with SCD is

that I one day can eat all the fruit, honey and nuts that I want. I know

it

will be a long time before I can do it bu tone day.. And then I can’t stay low

oxalate!

Spinach and alomonds are high in oxalate and he don’t want

me to eat this. I want to make almond yogurt and I like to use a small amount of

spinach in my soup. Because I don’t react to it! I don’t understand why I

need

to avoid food I don’t react to!

We talked alot about protein, carbs and fat intake. He want

me to eat 70g protein, 170g fat and 40-60 carbs per day. Well.. I can tell you

one thing. That will never happen. It is NOT possible to eat only 70g protein.

I eat at least 3 times as much as that now.

He talked about high protein diets cause ammonia

in my body

that can effect my head and mood. Does anyonw know anything about this??

He also talked about probiotic, fermented vegetable juices..

I told him that I made coconut yoghurt and it was fermented for 10 hours. He

said I should do at least 24 hours because it takes time for the bacterias to

start to grow. He said

that he made a large batch of yoghurt that he use as a starter now and if I

ferment my yoghurt in 24 hours I can do the same.

He said I eat to much vegetables. Maybe I do? I am not sure.

I think I eat about 3 lbs every day.

I am just very pissed of on him now because I don’t agree..

karianneSCD since august 0999% SCD legal 1,5 year before I restartet.I have ASD and undiagnosed gut issues.. (the doctors have given me up..)

[Guest guest]

My nutritionist, although very nice and seemingly knowledgeable, was trying to convince me to have soy milk, which I flat out said no to.

You would figure these people understand the negative affects of things like soy. It's frustrating because I don't like to act like a know it all at my Dr. appointments, but I really do feel like I know more about nutrition and its importance than some healthcare professionals.I feel like some of them need to go back to school or something -- point is, I understand what the original poster was so frustrated about.

[Guest guest]

Hi

Thanks for answer.

He is very familiar with SCD. I think he is the one in my country that nows most

about SCD

So all products he recommend me is legal.

Right know I don't eat any fruit, nuts or honey because my stomach don't like

it. But I want to eat them one day and then I don't want to think " no I can't

eat it because I om a lox oxalate diet " .

I asked him about why he thinks I should do low oxalate with and he said that

lots of people have problems with oxalate and it is hard to test for it. I have

done OAT (oraganic acid) a couple of times and it did not show anything there.

He also says that I may not have enough stomach acid and thats why I may have to

little enzymes. I do take digestive enzymes to every meal. But he did not talk

about any test to check it.

I am going to take a CDSA test now(comprehensive digestive stool analysis).

But if a high protein diet cause ammonia in my blood why haven't it done that

before? Because I have been high protein for 2 years!

Karianne

>

> Karianne,

>

> Wow! Someone who is putting it all together. You are very lucky!

>

> " Thats why he want to give me bio gest, betaine

> HCI & pepsin and one more I can’t remember the name on. "

>

> I am not sure about all that he wants you on, but if he is familiar with SCD

and wanting you to stay on it, he probably isn't going to recommend any illegal

ingredients in your supplements -- check to be sure though. It sounds like you

don't have enough stomach acid, did he run any tests to verify this?

>

> " I don’t want to stay on a low oxalate. My goal

> with SCD is

> that I one day can eat all the fruit, honey and nuts that I want. I know it

> will be a long time before I can do it bu tone day.. And then I can’t

> stay low

> oxalate! "

>

> You will most likely be able to eat all those things one day, but for now,

your doctor thinks it is not in your best interest to eat those things. It

won't be forever. Lots of people have trouble eating nuts and fruits at the

beginning. Did you ask him the reason he believes you need to be low oxalate --

some test he did or symptoms you have that would correlate with the need to be

low oxalate?

>

>

> " He talked about high protein diets cause ammonia in my body

> that can effect my head and mood. Does anyonw know anything about this?? "

>

> That sounds correct according to what I have read. Eating high protein, if

there is a problem elsewhere in the body (I believe it is the liver), can lead

to high ammonia levels when the protein is broken down in the body.

>

> " He also talked about probiotic, fermented

> vegetable juices..

> I told him that I made coconut yoghurt and it was fermented for 10

> hours. He

> said I should do at least 24 hours because it takes time for the bacterias to

> start to grow.

> He said

> that he made a large batch of yoghurt that he use as a starter now and

> if I

> ferment my yoghurt in 24 hours I can do the same. "

>

> That isn't quite correct. The full 24 hours is because it takes that long for

the bacteria to act on all/most of the lactose and milk protein. You do not

have cow milk protein nor lactose in coconut milk. I would think that unless

you added lots of honey or other natural sweetener, the bacteria would actually

die of starvation by the 24 hour mark. It is possible he knows of a study that

show that you might not be getting as much good bacteria in 10 hours with

coconut milk as you would 24 hours with cow's milk, but coconut milk also

provides other benefits -- antibacterial properties in the fat for one thing.

>

> " I am just very pissed of on him now because I

> don’t agree.. "

>

> Although it is a good thing to question a doctor about his treatment

recommendations, one still needs to really truthfully consider what and why the

doctor is making those recommendations. If he speaks the truth, even if you

don't like it, it still needs to be acknowledged and his advice heeded. Of

course, if you disagree based on good logic and science, you aren't required to

take his advice.

>

> Amelia

>

>

>

>

>

>

> ________________________________

>

> To: BTVC SCD <btvc-scd >; Pecanbread

<pecanbread >

> Sent: Sun, May 23, 2010 6:01:12 AM

> Subject: low protein, high fat and SCD.. Stupid nutritionist...

>

>

> Now I am just so angry and confused (again..).

>

> I talked with my nutritionist yesterday for 1

> hour and I don’t

> agree with him.

>

> He want me to stay on SCD in combination with

> low oxalate,

> phenole and low carb/high fat. It is impossible for me right now to stay high

> fat because I don’t digest fat so good. Thats why he want to give me bio

gest, betaine

> HCI & pepsin and one more I can’t remember the name on.

>

> I don’t want to stay on a low oxalate. My goal

> with SCD is

> that I one day can eat all the fruit, honey and nuts that I want. I know it

> will be a long time before I can do it bu tone day.. And then I can’t

> stay low

> oxalate!

>

> Spinach and alomonds are high in oxalate and he

> don’t want

> me to eat this. I want to make almond yogurt and I like to use a small

> amount of

> spinach in my soup. Because I don’t react to it! I don’t understand why I

need

> to avoid food I don’t react to!

>

> We talked alot about protein, carbs and fat

> intake. He want

> me to eat 70g protein, 170g fat and 40-60 carbs per day. Well.. I can

> tell you

> one thing. That will never happen. It is NOT possible to eat only 70g

> protein.

> I eat at least 3 times as much as that now.

>

> He talked about high protein diets cause ammonia in my body

> that can effect my head and mood. Does anyonw know anything about this??

>

> He also talked about probiotic, fermented

> vegetable juices..

> I told him that I made coconut yoghurt and it was fermented for 10

> hours. He

> said I should do at least 24 hours because it takes time for the bacterias to

> start to grow.

> He said

> that he made a large batch of yoghurt that he use as a starter now and

> if I

> ferment my yoghurt in 24 hours I can do the same.

>

> He said I eat to much vegetables. Maybe I do? I

> am not sure.

> I think I eat about 3 lbs every day.

>

> I am just very pissed of on him now because I

> don’t agree..

> karianne

> SCD since august 09

> 99% SCD legal 1,5 year before I restartet.

> I have ASD and undiagnosed gut issues.. (the doctors have given me up..)

>

[Guest guest]

Hi K,

 

I didn't have a doctor to go to when I started SCD.  Not the type who would test for things you are getting.  I just went by reactions to food.  It took me a long time to tolerate fruits and nuts.  I still don't do nuts often so that leaves out a lot of baked goods.  With fruits, I can't eat all I want as often as I want.  I still cook, deseed, etc. ;-).  Eventually I will be able to eat raw fruit whenever I want.

 

You may be intolerant today but that doesn't mean forever.  I wouldn't worry about that until further down the line. 

 

Didn't someone post here you'd have to eat 'extreme protein' without any carbs to hit the point of

 

But if a high protein diet cause ammonia in my blood why haven't it done that before? Because I have been high protein for 2 years!

One more thing, remember to start the yogurt with fresh starter each time and ferment it for 24 hours if it's dairy.  That removes the lactose and sugar from it.  Drip it also if that works better for you.  They are just tests--a flash in time for today.  Subject to change as you heal more.

 

Debbie 41 cd

[Guest guest]

Karianne,Then I would question him about how he is arriving at his conclusions that you have low stomach acid and should be on a low oxalate diet. Although, he must know something that you are not considering because you have already admitted that some of the things that are high oxalate in fact do cause you problems. I would also ask him how he knows that your particular protein intake is too high for your body. Are there symptoms that you have reported that would lead him to conclude that it is an ammonia problem? In any event, just because he is recommending it now, does not mean it will be forever. As you heal more, you should be able to add more of the things you want back in.AmeliaTo: BTVC-SCD Sent: Mon, May 24, 2010 6:25:52 AMSubject: Re: low protein, high fat and SCD.. Stupid nutritionist...

Hi

Thanks for answer.

He is very familiar with SCD. I think he is the one in my country that nows most about SCD

So all products he recommend me is legal.

Right know I don't eat any fruit, nuts or honey because my stomach don't like it. But I want to eat them one day and then I don't want to think "no I can't eat it because I om a lox oxalate diet".

I asked him about why he thinks I should do low oxalate with and he said that lots of people have problems with oxalate and it is hard to test for it. I have done OAT (oraganic acid) a couple of times and it did not show anything there.

He also says that I may not have enough stomach acid and thats why I may have to little enzymes. I do take digestive enzymes to every meal. But he did not talk about any test to check it.

I am going to take a CDSA test now(comprehensive digestive stool analysis).

But if a high protein diet cause ammonia in my blood why haven't it done that before? Because I have been high protein for 2 years!

Karianne

>

> Karianne,

>

> Wow! Someone who is putting it all together. You are very lucky!

>

> "Thats why he want to give me bio gest, betaine

> HCI & pepsin and one more I can’t remember the name on."

>

> I am not sure about all that he wants you on, but if he is familiar with SCD and wanting you to stay on it, he probably isn't going to recommend any illegal ingredients in your supplements -- check to be sure though. It sounds like you don't have enough stomach acid, did he run any tests to verify this?

>

> "I don’t want to stay on a low oxalate. My goal

> with SCD is

> that I one day can eat all the fruit, honey and nuts that I want. I know it

> will be a long time before I can do it bu tone day.. And then I can’t

> stay low

> oxalate! "

>

> You will most likely be able to eat all those things one day, but for now, your doctor thinks it is not in your best interest to eat those things. It won't be forever. Lots of people have trouble eating nuts and fruits at the beginning. Did you ask him the reason he believes you need to be low oxalate -- some test he did or symptoms you have that would correlate with the need to be low oxalate?

>

>

> "He talked about high protein diets cause ammonia in my body

> that can effect my head and mood. Does anyonw know anything about this??"

>

> That sounds correct according to what I have read. Eating high protein, if there is a problem elsewhere in the body (I believe it is the liver), can lead to high ammonia levels when the protein is broken down in the body.

>

> "He also talked about probiotic, fermented

> vegetable juices..

> I told him that I made coconut yoghurt and it was fermented for 10

> hours. He

> said I should do at least 24 hours because it takes time for the bacterias to

> start to grow.

> He said

> that he made a large batch of yoghurt that he use as a starter now and

> if I

> ferment my yoghurt in 24 hours I can do the same. "

>

> That isn't quite correct. The full 24 hours is because it takes that long for the bacteria to act on all/most of the lactose and milk protein. You do not have cow milk protein nor lactose in coconut milk. I would think that unless you added lots of honey or other natural sweetener, the bacteria would actually die of starvation by the 24 hour mark. It is possible he knows of a study that show that you might not be getting as much good bacteria in 10 hours with coconut milk as you would 24 hours with cow's milk, but coconut milk also provides other benefits -- antibacterial properties in the fat for one thing.

>

> "I am just very pissed of on him now because I

> don’t agree.. "

>

> Although it is a good thing to question a doctor about his treatment recommendations, one still needs to really truthfully consider what and why the doctor is making those recommendations. If he speaks the truth, even if you don't like it, it still needs to be acknowledged and his advice heeded. Of course, if you disagree based on good logic and science, you aren't required to take his advice.

>

> Amelia

>

>

>

>

>

>

> ________________________________

>

> To: BTVC SCD <btvc-scd >; Pecanbread <pecanbread >

> Sent: Sun, May 23, 2010 6:01:12 AM

> Subject: low protein, high fat and SCD.. Stupid nutritionist...

>

>

> Now I am just so angry and confused (again..).

>

> I talked with my nutritionist yesterday for 1

> hour and I don’t

> agree with him.

>

> He want me to stay on SCD in combination with

> low oxalate,

> phenole and low carb/high fat. It is impossible for me right now to stay high

> fat because I don’t digest fat so good. Thats why he want to give me bio gest, betaine

> HCI & pepsin and one more I can’t remember the name on.

>

> I don’t want to stay on a low oxalate. My goal

> with SCD is

> that I one day can eat all the fruit, honey and nuts that I want. I know it

> will be a long time before I can do it bu tone day.. And then I can’t

> stay low

> oxalate!

>

> Spinach and alomonds are high in oxalate and he

> don’t want

> me to eat this. I want to make almond yogurt and I like to use a small

> amount of

> spinach in my soup. Because I don’t react to it! I don’t understand why I need

> to avoid food I don’t react to!

>

> We talked alot about protein, carbs and fat

> intake. He want

> me to eat 70g protein, 170g fat and 40-60 carbs per day. Well.. I can

> tell you

> one thing. That will never happen. It is NOT possible to eat only 70g

> protein.

> I eat at least 3 times as much as that now.

>

> He talked about high protein diets cause ammonia in my body

> that can effect my head and mood. Does anyonw know anything about this??

>

> He also talked about probiotic, fermented

> vegetable juices..

> I told him that I made coconut yoghurt and it was fermented for 10

> hours. He

> said I should do at least 24 hours because it takes time for the bacterias to

> start to grow.

> He said

> that he made a large batch of yoghurt that he use as a starter now and

> if I

> ferment my yoghurt in 24 hours I can do the same.

>

> He said I eat to much vegetables. Maybe I do? I

> am not sure.

> I think I eat about 3 lbs every day.

>

> I am just very pissed of on him now because I

> don’t agree..

> karianne

> SCD since august 09

> 99% SCD legal 1,5 year before I restartet.

> I have ASD and undiagnosed gut issues.. (the doctors have given me up..)

>

[Guest guest]

Amelia,I think Karianne is saying she doesn't understand how she can eat that way at the momentbecause what he appears to be recommending does not agree with her body right now, so it won't help her heal. Karianne, Did you stress this to him during your appt, that you are not sure what you could eatif you were to switch to this? If I were you I would write downall these issues as notes to yourself for when you see him again. So you won't forgetanything you want to mention in this context. Ask him in particular what symptoms he is seeing that makes him think that too muchammonia is effecting you. MaraKarianne,Then I would question him about how he is arriving at his conclusions that you have low stomach acid and should be on a low oxalate diet. Although, he must know something that you are not considering because you have already admitted that some of the things that are high oxalate in fact do cause you problems. I would also ask him how he knows that your particular protein intake is too high for your body. Are there symptoms that you have reported that would lead him to conclude that it is an ammonia problem? In any event, just because he is recommending it now, does not mean it will be forever. As you heal more, you should be able to add more of the things you want back in.AmeliaTo: BTVC-SCD Sent: Mon, May 24, 2010 6:25:52 AMSubject: Re: low protein, high fat and SCD.. Stupid nutritionist...HiThanks for answer.He is very familiar with SCD. I think he is the one in my country that nows most about SCD So all products he recommend me is legal. Right know I don't eat any fruit, nuts or honey because my stomach don't like it. But I want to eat them one day and then I don't want to think "no I can't eat it because I om a lox oxalate diet". I asked him about why he thinks I should do low oxalate with and he said that lots of people have problems with oxalate and it is hard to test for it. I have done OAT (oraganic acid) a couple of times and it did not show anything there. He also says that I may not have enough stomach acid and thats why I may have to little enzymes. I do take digestive enzymes to every meal. But he did not talk about any test to check it.I am going to take a CDSA test now(comprehensive digestive stool analysis). But if a high protein diet cause ammonia in my blood why haven't it done that before? Because I have been high protein for 2 years!Karianne>> Karianne,> > Wow! Someone who is putting it all together. You are very lucky! > > "Thats why he want to give me bio gest, betaine> HCI & pepsin and one more I can’t remember the name on."> > I am not sure about all that he wants you on, but if he is familiar with SCD and wanting you to stay on it, he probably isn't going to recommend any illegal ingredients in your supplements -- check to be sure though. It sounds like you don't have enough stomach acid, did he run any tests to verify this?> > "I don’t want to stay on a low oxalate. My goal > with SCD is> that I one day can eat all the fruit, honey and nuts that I want. I know it> will be a long time before I can do it bu tone day.. And then I can’t > stay low> oxalate! "> > You will most likely be able to eat all those things one day, but for now, your doctor thinks it is not in your best interest to eat those things. It won't be forever. Lots of people have trouble eating nuts and fruits at the beginning. Did you ask him the reason he believes you need to be low oxalate -- some test he did or symptoms you have that would correlate with the need to be low oxalate?> > > "He talked about high protein diets cause ammonia in my body> that can effect my head and mood. Does anyonw know anything about this??"> > That sounds correct according to what I have read. Eating high protein, if there is a problem elsewhere in the body (I believe it is the liver), can lead to high ammonia levels when the protein is broken down in the body.> > "He also talked about probiotic, fermented > vegetable juices..> I told him that I made coconut yoghurt and it was fermented for 10 > hours. He> said I should do at least 24 hours because it takes time for the bacterias to> start to grow. > He said> that he made a large batch of yoghurt that he use as a starter now and > if I> ferment my yoghurt in 24 hours I can do the same. "> > That isn't quite correct. The full 24 hours is because it takes that long for the bacteria to act on all/most of the lactose and milk protein. You do not have cow milk protein nor lactose in coconut milk. I would think that unless you added lots of honey or other natural sweetener, the bacteria would actually die of starvation by the 24 hour mark. It is possible he knows of a study that show that you might not be getting as much good bacteria in 10 hours with coconut milk as you would 24 hours with cow's milk, but coconut milk also provides other benefits -- antibacterial properties in the fat for one thing.> > "I am just very pissed of on him now because I > don’t agree.. "> > Although it is a good thing to question a doctor about his treatment recommendations, one still needs to really truthfully consider what and why the doctor is making those recommendations. If he speaks the truth, even if you don't like it, it still needs to be acknowledged and his advice heeded. Of course, if you disagree based on good logic and science, you aren't required to take his advice.> > Amelia> > > > > > > ________________________________> > To: BTVC SCD <btvc-scd >; Pecanbread <pecanbread >> Sent: Sun, May 23, 2010 6:01:12 AM> Subject: low protein, high fat and SCD.. Stupid nutritionist...> > > Now I am just so angry and confused (again..). > > I talked with my nutritionist yesterday for 1 > hour and I don’t> agree with him.> > He want me to stay on SCD in combination with > low oxalate,> phenole and low carb/high fat. It is impossible for me right now to stay high> fat because I don’t digest fat so good. Thats why he want to give me bio gest, betaine> HCI & pepsin and one more I can’t remember the name on. > > I don’t want to stay on a low oxalate. My goal > with SCD is> that I one day can eat all the fruit, honey and nuts that I want. I know it> will be a long time before I can do it bu tone day.. And then I can’t > stay low> oxalate! > > Spinach and alomonds are high in oxalate and he > don’t want> me to eat this. I want to make almond yogurt and I like to use a small > amount of> spinach in my soup. Because I don’t react to it! I don’t understand why I need> to avoid food I don’t react to! > > We talked alot about protein, carbs and fat > intake. He want> me to eat 70g protein, 170g fat and 40-60 carbs per day. Well.. I can > tell you> one thing. That will never happen. It is NOT possible to eat only 70g > protein.> I eat at least 3 times as much as that now. > > He talked about high protein diets cause ammonia in my body> that can effect my head and mood. Does anyonw know anything about this?? > > He also talked about probiotic, fermented > vegetable juices..> I told him that I made coconut yoghurt and it was fermented for 10 > hours. He> said I should do at least 24 hours because it takes time for the bacterias to> start to grow. > He said> that he made a large batch of yoghurt that he use as a starter now and > if I> ferment my yoghurt in 24 hours I can do the same. > > He said I eat to much vegetables. Maybe I do? I > am not sure.> I think I eat about 3 lbs every day. > > I am just very pissed of on him now because I > don’t agree.. > karianne> SCD since august 09> 99% SCD legal 1,5 year before I restartet.> I have ASD and undiagnosed gut issues.. (the doctors have given me up..)>

[Guest guest]

To Amelia:

I don't have any problems with eating spinach. And I ate almond yogurt, but got

so bad die of that I did want to make more.

I think I do tolerate a certain amount of fruit but I am very unsure on how

much. I did make pear sauce for a while ago and it went good in the beginning

but then I reacted. The same with banana and orange juice. So I have just

stopped eating and trying fruit because I did not want to get sick.

He knows that my protein intake is to high based on my food journal that you can

find here:

http://scdandme.com/Startingscd/About_the_recipes_files/4%20days%20of%20food.pdf

To Mara:

If I switch to the food he want me to eat I will get sick and he knows that.

Thats why he says that this diet must be my goal. The goal is 70g protein and

140g fat. My goal is to be able to eat 3 meals a day without being hungry in

between. But right now it is not possible and he agrees.

But it makes a big mess in my head. Because I have had a hard time before coping

with the thoughts of eating so much protein because other people have told me

that is is bad, and the same with betacaroten (because my skin is yellow and I

eat lots of winter squash). Sometimes in the evening I was hungry and went to

the fridge. I had some roasted chicken and baked butternut squash. But I

couldn't decide between beta carotene or protein. So I didn't eat anything, only

took a glass of water. Because I was afraid of protein and betacarotene.. I have

finally been able to " pass that stage " and eat what I want, when I want. And not

think about how much protein and betacarotene. But now I am back on old tracks

and don't want to eat protein... So yesterday I only ate about 1400kcal and that

is TO little. When I wrote it into my calori counting programe I saw that it was

only 1400 I did manage to find a pork chop and eat. But it was to little

calories..

My father is going to send him a email to night and ask more about what he ment

with ammonia, oxalate ++ And I will try to read more about oxalate issues.

He is very very very good in SCD and other diets.

Karianne

19 year old with ASD

> > >

> > > Karianne,

> > >

> > > Wow! Someone who is putting it all together. You are very lucky!

> > >

> > > " Thats why he want to give me bio gest, betaine

> > > HCI & pepsin and one more I can’t remember the name on. "

> > >

> > > I am not sure about all that he wants you on, but if he is familiar with

SCD and wanting you to stay on it, he probably isn't going to recommend any

illegal ingredients in your supplements -- check to be sure though. It sounds

like you don't have enough stomach acid, did he run any tests to verify this?

> > >

> > > " I don’t want to stay on a low oxalate. My goal

> > > with SCD is

> > > that I one day can eat all the fruit, honey and nuts that I want. I know

it

> > > will be a long time before I can do it bu tone day.. And then I can’t

> > > stay low

> > > oxalate! "

> > >

> > > You will most likely be able to eat all those things one day, but for now,

your doctor thinks it is not in your best interest to eat those things. It won't

be forever. Lots of people have trouble eating nuts and fruits at the beginning.

Did you ask him the reason he believes you need to be low oxalate -- some test

he did or symptoms you have that would correlate with the need to be low

oxalate?

> > >

> > >

> > > " He talked about high protein diets cause ammonia in my body

> > > that can effect my head and mood. Does anyonw know anything about this?? "

> > >

> > > That sounds correct according to what I have read. Eating high protein, if

there is a problem elsewhere in the body (I believe it is the liver), can lead

to high ammonia levels when the protein is broken down in the body.

> > >

> > > " He also talked about probiotic, fermented

> > > vegetable juices..

> > > I told him that I made coconut yoghurt and it was fermented for 10

> > > hours. He

> > > said I should do at least 24 hours because it takes time for the bacterias

to

> > > start to grow.

> > > He said

> > > that he made a large batch of yoghurt that he use as a starter now and

> > > if I

> > > ferment my yoghurt in 24 hours I can do the same. "

> > >

> > > That isn't quite correct. The full 24 hours is because it takes that long

for the bacteria to act on all/most of the lactose and milk protein. You do not

have cow milk protein nor lactose in coconut milk. I would think that unless you

added lots of honey or other natural sweetener, the bacteria would actually die

of starvation by the 24 hour mark. It is possible he knows of a study that show

that you might not be getting as much good bacteria in 10 hours with coconut

milk as you would 24 hours with cow's milk, but coconut milk also provides other

benefits -- antibacterial properties in the fat for one thing.

> > >

> > > " I am just very pissed of on him now because I

> > > don’t agree.. "

> > >

> > > Although it is a good thing to question a doctor about his treatment

recommendations, one still needs to really truthfully consider what and why the

doctor is making those recommendations. If he speaks the truth, even if you

don't like it, it still needs to be acknowledged and his advice heeded. Of

course, if you disagree based on good logic and science, you aren't required to

take his advice.

> > >

> > > Amelia

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > ________________________________

> > > From: karianne plener <kannne@>

> > > To: BTVC SCD <btvc-scd >; Pecanbread

<pecanbread >

> > > Sent: Sun, May 23, 2010 6:01:12 AM

> > > Subject: low protein, high fat and SCD.. Stupid nutritionist...

> > >

> > >

> > > Now I am just so angry and confused (again..).

> > >

> > > I talked with my nutritionist yesterday for 1

> > > hour and I don’t

> > > agree with him.

> > >

> > > He want me to stay on SCD in combination with

> > > low oxalate,

> > > phenole and low carb/high fat. It is impossible for me right now to stay

high

> > > fat because I don’t digest fat so good. Thats why he want to give me bio

gest, betaine

> > > HCI & pepsin and one more I can’t remember the name on.

> > >

> > > I don’t want to stay on a low oxalate. My goal

> > > with SCD is

> > > that I one day can eat all the fruit, honey and nuts that I want. I know

it

> > > will be a long time before I can do it bu tone day.. And then I can’t

> > > stay low

> > > oxalate!

> > >

> > > Spinach and alomonds are high in oxalate and he

> > > don’t want

> > > me to eat this. I want to make almond yogurt and I like to use a small

> > > amount of

> > > spinach in my soup. Because I don’t react to it! I don’t understand

why I need

> > > to avoid food I don’t react to!

> > >

> > > We talked alot about protein, carbs and fat

> > > intake. He want

> > > me to eat 70g protein, 170g fat and 40-60 carbs per day. Well.. I can

> > > tell you

> > > one thing. That will never happen. It is NOT possible to eat only 70g

> > > protein.

> > > I eat at least 3 times as much as that now.

> > >

> > > He talked about high protein diets cause ammonia in my body

> > > that can effect my head and mood. Does anyonw know anything about this??

> > >

> > > He also talked about probiotic, fermented

> > > vegetable juices..

> > > I told him that I made coconut yoghurt and it was fermented for 10

> > > hours. He

> > > said I should do at least 24 hours because it takes time for the bacterias

to

> > > start to grow.

> > > He said

> > > that he made a large batch of yoghurt that he use as a starter now and

> > > if I

> > > ferment my yoghurt in 24 hours I can do the same.

> > >

> > > He said I eat to much vegetables. Maybe I do? I

> > > am not sure.

> > > I think I eat about 3 lbs every day.

> > >

> > > I am just very pissed of on him now because I

> > > don’t agree..

> > > karianne

> > > SCD since august 09

> > > 99% SCD legal 1,5 year before I restartet.

> > > I have ASD and undiagnosed gut issues.. (the doctors have given me up..)

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Right know I don't eat any fruit, nuts or honey because my stomach don't like it. But I want to eat them one day and then I don't want to think "no I can't eat it because I om a lox oxalate diet". If I were you, I'd take your doctor's advice. It sounds like he knows what he's talking about, and if you aren't eating many of the high oxalate foods anyways, then it seems like you're halfway there. I don't think he'll make you sign a contract saying you'll be on low oxalate forever, either. I'm sure you'll get back to eating fruits and nuts one day just like you say, and maybe being low oxalate now will help you get there faster! Peace =)Alyssa 16 yo UC April 2008, dx Sept 2008SCD June 2009 (restarted)Azathioprine 75 mg 1x per dayPrednisone 30 mg 1x per day