Re: Does lowering your carbs also lower your energy?

May 21, 2010

Kim, I don't think I have candida overgrowth. Other then fatigue and brain fog,

I don't have any of the symptoms, and I can eat carbs without any bad reaction.

While sweets taste best to me, I don't NEED to eat them. I do think my thyroid

is an issue, but unless it suddenly got a lot worse in the last month, I don't

think it's related to my fatigue suddenly worsening. I saw my doc a couple days

ago, and of course he just blew it off. He just blames it on having crohn's. He

did order a B-12 and folate test (as well as a new TSH), but said not to do them

until I seem him again in 4 months. Lame!

Mara, LOL, my meals are rather pathetic! Lack of appetite (I stopped taking

Zyrtec, which was an appetite stimulant for me) and lack of energy = eating the

same ol' boring thing everyday. I think I probably need more calories, but am at

a loss as to how. I don't think I should increase my fat (I fear it sets off my

pancreas), and I already eat more protein then Fitday says I should. I can't

remember who all said I ate too many carbs, but I think n was one. I get

paranoid about creating a yeast issue.

Jodi, nope I didn't up my fats. I'm scared of angering my pancreas again. For

the month of April, I averaged 85 g of carbs. The lowest day was 33 g, a day

when I didn't eat much due to pain issues. The highest was 104 g, due to my high

carb cranberry sauce. My total calories averaged only a bit over 1000, due to my

potential pancreas? issues. For the month of May, my carbs have gone up to an

average of 107 g, and calories average 1250.

Oh, but good news! I do NOT have adrenal fatigue. I got my saliva test back, and

conferred with the experts at another board, and I'm just barely low on

cortisol. They said I could stand to boost it a tiny bit in the morning, but not

to mess with it much since it's already decent. One less thing to worry about!

And I think I do tend to worry too much about things like this. Hypochondriac, I

guess.

Thank you all for your input!

Holly

Crohn's

SCD 12/01/08

May 26, 2010

Holly,"

*TMI Alert* I hoped that lowering carbs would help my BMs, but no such

luck. I have not found a reason as to why they are so inconsistent

(fine one day, mushy another, D the next). Worse, I have days where I

have small amounts of mushy stool with gas throughout the day.

Sometimes I think I'm wasting my time trying to come up with what food

might be the issue, and that's it's just from lacking the ileocecal

valve. But why fine one day, and not the next? A puzzle I cannot solve."This might be related to thyroid/adrenal issues -- My doctor seems to indicate that it is.Amelia

To: BTVC-SCD Sent: Tue, May 25, 2010 10:48:25 PMSubject: Re:Re: Does lowering your carbs also lower your energy?

Hi Jodi,

The saliva test, TSH (which was high), and free T4 (which was normal) are the only tests I've had. I'm STILL trying to get one of my docs to run the other thyroid tests, and I'll also ask about the adrenal antibodies and DHEA tests. I had the epstein barr test in the past, but it's probably been a couple of years.

How much fat can you handle? I've gotten up to the 70's (grams) as of late, and seem to be okay. I'm just scared of another "attack," although I really don't know for certain whether it was pancreas, biliary, or maybe even a hiatal hernia. The pain was in the center, behind the lower part of the rib cage, and worse in the back. Hopefully my GI can shed some light on things next month.

I cooked a pancake in coconut oil yesterday, so I can handle at least a little bit (I think I only used a teaspoon). Avocados are iffy though.

*TMI Alert* I hoped that lowering carbs would help my BMs, but no such luck. I have not found a reason as to why they are so inconsistent (fine one day, mushy another, D the next). Worse, I have days where I have small amounts of mushy stool with gas throughout the day. Sometimes I think I'm wasting my time trying to come up with what food might be the issue, and that's it's just from lacking the ileocecal valve. But why fine one day, and not the next? A puzzle I cannot solve.

I used to drink green tea, but stopped because it was staining my teeth so bad. Maybe I'll start up again. I also like your idea of rotating high and low carb days too. It's worth a shot at least.

Sorry to hear you're still struggling with fatigue too :-(. You would think we would be past all of that by now! Do you have any pains from your surgery still, or are they gone? I recently have started having twinges at the area of my resection. I'm hoping it's just nerves getting around to regrowing, but it worries me. I'm actually kind of hoping my GI will want to do a colonoscopy soon. How nuts is that!

Holly

Crohn's

SCD 12/01/08

>

> Heya Holly,

>

> Just because your cortisol is in normal range does not mean you don't have adrenal issues. What is your reverse T3 and what is your DHEA blood serum numbers.

>

> I too can't really up my fat intake due to biliary or possible pancreas issues. Post surgery it got better but when I take my allergy meds the right upper quadrent totally acts up.

>

> Have you tried plant derived fat at all? I add a bit of coconut oil and eat coconut yogurt and can handle avocados.

>

> I found when I lowered my carb intake on one hand my stools were better, had less PMS symptoms but my exhaustion got much worse. Haven't really worked through that so I turned to acupuncture and using chinese herbs (SCD illegal- but since I am on the diet a while now I feel comfortable with that and my kelp derived iodine supplement)

>

> Have you had your whole thyroid panel checked including thyroid antibodies and adrenal antibodies?

>

> Just some thoughts.

> Also, have you been checked for epstein barr virus at all?

>

> I found if I do rotations meaning two low carb days 1 higher carb and the fourth I throw in some pineapple juice it kind of helps.

>

> Also, green tea can give you a good boost.

>

> You might think of supplementing a low dose of DHEA like 5mg to see if that helps at all.

>

> It's a bummer but the fatigue is still super present in me as well.

>

> Jodi

May 26, 2010

Holly,

Maybe try some berries?

Squash is a beautiful thing too!

Jodi

> > >

> > > In April I tried going low carb (when I've posted what I eat, people often

say I eat too many carbs). I've upped protein in there place. Starting at the

beginning of May, my already poor energy dropped even further. Does this happen

when you lower carbs? Does it eventually go away, or should I bump the carbs

back up? I think I could probably sleep all day, which makes it tough to

function. Yesterday, I got in the car to go to a doctor appointment, and had to

think really hard about where his office was.

> > >

> > > Holly

> > > Crohn's

> > > SCD 12/01/08

> > >

> >

>

May 31, 2010

, I'll answer you questions the best I can :-)

1. Well, since you can only eat simple carbs on SCD (with the exception of

legumes in advanced stages), it's kind of a moot point. I haven't eaten any

complex carbs for 1.5 years.

2. I do pretty good on protein, which is surprising, because I'm not a big meat

eater. The yogurt/cheese/eggs are my main sources. I average between 50 and 60

grams most days, depending on whether I eat much meat for dinner.

I'm guessing you meant to say your body needs carbs (not complex carbs)? Right

now I'm getting about 100 grams a day. For fats, I'm averaging between 70 and 80

grams.

3. My calcium doesn't have any magnesium in it, but my multi has a little bit. I

used to be able to tolerate large amounts of magnesium, but since my surgery, my

bowels no longer like it.

4. I don't need to lose weight. I weigh 102 pounds right now (5' 5 " ), which is

12 pounds more then my lowest point on SCD. I decided to try low carb because

I've seen many many people here say they feel better with less carbs, and that

carbs feed some of the bacteria/yeast we're trying to get rid of.

5. I don't have an adrenal problem, *whew*. I got the saliva test done recently,

and all was well. I wonder if LDN didn't help me out? I used to be most alert in

evening, and could stay up very late into the night. I've had bouts where I was

awake all night, and went to sleep at 6 in the morning. For the last few months,

I'm actually tired by late evening and can go to sleep.

6. I used to have a good appetite, thanks to Zyrtec. I was one who had the

reportedly rare side effect of hunger. But I decided to try to get off the

Zyrtec, because these days my allergy symptoms do not match the outrageous

results I had on the scratch test (thanks SCD and raw local honey!). I figured

why take an illegal med that I don't truly seem to need. I have flirted with

restarting it just for the appetite enhancement though. I think my lack of

appetite, and lack of weight loss with low calories, is due to hypothyroidism.

So far, I can't get my doctor to treat it.

7. I don't think it would be possible to do a 3 day food rotation. I've thought

about it in the past, but there are a lot of foods I pretty much have to eat

every day, or I'd have nothing to eat. Yogurt, eggs, cheese, almond butter,

honey, butter, coconut oil, and gelatin are in something I eat everyday. Fruits

are easy to rotate, because I tolerate several of those. Vegetables, not so

much. I'm limited to a smaller number of them, and just don't tolerate them as

well (more gas, doesn't digest as well). I'm allergic to all nuts, but don't

have any noticeable reaction to almond, so I stick with small amounts of it day

in and day out (probably no more then 2 tbsp a day).

Today was a lousy calorie day. I tried some raw apple this afternoon (something

new that I've been craving now for months), and also took an enzyme with it. It

seemed to go over fine, and later I had frozen yogurt, and later yet I had an

almond butter pancake. Then I got the familiar old feeling that my insides had

come to a screeching halt. Kind of bloated, and gurgles too far and few between.

I was not hungry for supper, and my body was telling me not to eat, but I did

have 3 chicken wingettes. After that, my body was really telling me not to eat

anymore (I don't even feel like yogurt, the one thing I'm always up for) so I

missed a lot of things I would usually eat. Only got to 1000 calories today. So

was it the apple? Really hard to say, because this bowel slow down is something

that happens once in awhile. I'm just crossing my fingers that there isn't a

blockage forming :-(

That was an incredibly long explanation, wasn't it!

Holly

Crohn's

SCD 12/01/08

> > >

> > > > Hi Jodi,

> > > >

> > > > How I wish I'd never started counting calories and grams! I started

> > > > entering everything into Fitday the day I started SCD, and have been

> > > > obsessing ever since.

> > >

> > > So, why are you doing that? :-)

> > >

> > > Is there a reason you think you need to count calories?

> > >

> > > n

> >

>

June 1, 2010

Hey ,

> Also, it's important not to eat the same thing everyday. Guidelines say,

> ideally, a food should not be eaten more frequently than every 3 days. Well,

> I've never even gotten close to that in my life, though I desired to, and I

> don't think SCDers can, especially in the beginning, nor should try, but

> it's important to keep in mind. eating the same thing all the time does not

> just have psychological problems with it.

Could you please expand on this? I've heard/read that you shouldn't eat the same

foods every day because your can develop food intolerances/allergies from it,

but I was wondering if there were other issues that could arise from doing so.

Thanks!

Amber

June 1, 2010

I had to do that in the beginning because I couldn't tolerate a lot of fruits and vegetables. I really got into spices and herbs to switch things up. One problem is after so long, there is potential for melt down. Then you just have to go the x-treme opposite and try something totally different. If it makes you sick enough, you'll be happy to go back to eating the same thing. If it doesn't, you have healed enough to start introducing new foods into the diet.

It's not an option for for some people to eat everything available on the diet for the first year or two.

The first salad I had since I first got sick made me soo nervous. It was a plain salad with grilled chicken. I ate it--awesome. Did not get sick at all, didn't effect me. You can get stuck in a mental 'thing' where you are afraid of what will happen if you vary. Just my .3$

Hey , > Also, it's important not to eat the same thing everyday. Guidelines say,> ideally, a food should not be eaten more frequently than every 3 days. Well,> I've never even gotten close to that in my life, though I desired to, and I

> don't think SCDers can, especially in the beginning, nor should try, but> it's important to keep in mind. eating the same thing all the time does not> just have psychological problems with it.

Could you please expand on this? I've heard/read that you shouldn't eat the same foods every day because your can develop food intolerances/allergies from it, but I was wondering if there were other issues that could arise from doing so.

Thanks!Amber

June 2, 2010

That's so very true! I'm scared of most anything stage 3 and up, and rarely

venture there. I had my first raw apple the other day, and later that day, my

system slowed down to a crawl. Guess who won't be trying raw again anytime soon?

Holly

Crohn's

SCD 12/01/08

>

> I had to do that in the beginning because I couldn't tolerate a lot of

> fruits and vegetables. I really got into spices and herbs to switch things

> up. One problem is after so long, there is potential for melt down. Then

> you just have to go the x-treme opposite and try something totally

> different. If it makes you sick enough, you'll be happy to go back to

> eating the same thing. If it doesn't, you have healed enough to start

> introducing new foods into the diet.

>

> It's not an option for for some people to eat everything available on the

> diet for the first year or two.

>

> The first salad I had since I first got sick made me soo nervous. It was a

> plain salad with grilled chicken. I ate it--awesome. Did not get sick at

> all, didn't effect me. You can get stuck in a mental 'thing' where you are

> afraid of what will happen if you vary. Just my .3$

June 2, 2010

Amber

I'm not , but thought I'd share my thoughts on your question. Food

rotation due to having extensive food sensitivities is something I had to deal

with when I started SCD, and still do to some degree. There are several good

reasons for eating as much variety as possible.

There is a very real possibility of developing food sensitivities from eating

the same foods each day and every day, especially for those of us dealing with

overwhelmed immune systems (which many of us are when we first start SCD) or

because we have gut dysbiosis.

The other concern with eating the same foods all the time is nutrition. We need

more variety in our foods so we get a wide range of nutrients. The colors of

food are a helpful way to consider variety. The latest buzzword for encouraging

variety in foods is eating from the rainbow. There have been several books out

recently using this term, but it actually is a strategy in use for decades, if

not centuries.

It helps to eat foods from several colors with each meal, or at least several

colors over the course of a day or two. I'm taking a nutrition class from a

clinical dietician, and she stresses eating " rainbow meals " every day if

possible, but at least over the week, making sure we eat vegetables of rainbow

colors (red, orange, white, yellow, green) along with blue fruits. Also eating

proteins of varying colors as well. There is a lot of nutrition contained in

the chemicals that cause the coloration of food.

Of course this can be difficult in the beginning stages of SCD, and we certainly

don't have to obsess on food rotation strategies. But I found it helped me

during my first years on SCD to eat as much variety as I could, and I've

continued doing so, although orange veggies cause major GI and immune reactions

for me so I just eat them sparingly and eat more orange fruits, which may or may

not be exactly what the dieticians are getting at!

What is important is that our digestions do better with variety, and our

nutrient needs are met from whole foods sources more than with supplements.

Supplement usage is another subject, however...

Kim M.

SCD 6 years

>

> Hey ,

>

> > Also, it's important not to eat the same thing everyday. Guidelines say,

> > ideally, a food should not be eaten more frequently than every 3 days. Well,

> > I've never even gotten close to that in my life, though I desired to, and I

> > don't think SCDers can, especially in the beginning, nor should try, but

> > it's important to keep in mind. eating the same thing all the time does not

> > just have psychological problems with it.

>

> Could you please expand on this? I've heard/read that you shouldn't eat the

same foods every day because your can develop food intolerances/allergies from

it, but I was wondering if there were other issues that could arise from doing

so.

>

> Thanks!

>

> Amber

>

June 2, 2010

Thanks, Kim.

Yes, I have heard about eating a " rainbow " variety before. It definitely makes

sense. I appreciate your input.

I find it hard not to eat the same things most days, especially with protein. I

eat eggs every day. I guess part of it is because I eat a mix of different meat

every day. For example I make meatballs with a mix of beef and pork or turkey

and those have eggs added in.

So, do you guys think it would be more beneficial to eat one source of protein

for three days and then switch to another source? (I really don't know if I see

myself doing that though. It seems a little obsessive.) I wonder if it would

really make a difference.

How do we know if we are developing food sensitivities from eating too much of

the same foods, do we have to get tested, or is it more of a reaction type

thing?

I would think that most of us eat yogurt every day, so are we at risk for

developing sensitivities towards it?

I guess I was very much into eating the same types of foods even pre-SCD. It

would definitely take an effort to rotate my foods every 3 days.

Amber

> >

> > Hey ,

> >

> > > Also, it's important not to eat the same thing everyday. Guidelines say,

> > > ideally, a food should not be eaten more frequently than every 3 days.

Well,

> > > I've never even gotten close to that in my life, though I desired to, and

I

> > > don't think SCDers can, especially in the beginning, nor should try, but

> > > it's important to keep in mind. eating the same thing all the time does

not

> > > just have psychological problems with it.

> >

> > Could you please expand on this? I've heard/read that you shouldn't eat the

same foods every day because your can develop food intolerances/allergies from

it, but I was wondering if there were other issues that could arise from doing

so.

> >

> > Thanks!

> >

> > Amber

> >

>

June 2, 2010

At 01:07 AM 6/2/2010, you wrote:

That's so very true! I'm scared

of most anything stage 3 and up, and rarely venture there. I had my first

raw apple the other day, and later that day, my system slowed down to a

crawl. Guess who won't be trying raw again anytime

soon?

So keep cooking your apples. Did you peel the raw one?

—

Marilyn

New

Orleans, Louisiana, USA

Undiagnosed IBS since 1976, SCD since 2001

Darn Good SCD Cook

No Human Children

Shadow & Sunny Longhair Dachshund

Babette the Foundling Beagle

June 2, 2010

, I'll answer you questions the best I can :-)

1. Well, since you can only eat simple carbs on SCD (with the exception of legumes in advanced stages), it's kind of a moot point. I haven't eaten any complex carbs for 1.5 years.

Hey :)yeah, ok, no... there are lots of complex carbs on SCD, and they are very important. there are even complex carbs on intro. Carrots are complex carbs - a great source of starch, one of the best vegetable ones. squash (summer and winter) is also a great source of complex carbs. etc. etc.

and there is a little bit of complex carbs (although not always in the most useful form) in almost all foods, for example the fiber in your fruit, a little in 'protein' foods like nuts, and even a little in meat. ....so, it's not possible to go 1.5 years without eating complex carbs, unless you're strictly on some sort of horrible liquid scientifically formulated compound, and still not probable.

2. I do pretty good on protein, which is surprising, because I'm not a big meat eater. The yogurt/cheese/eggs are my main sources. I average between 50 and 60 grams most days, depending on whether I eat much meat for dinner.

I'm guessing you meant to say your body needs carbs (not complex carbs)? nope, your body needs complex carbs

Right now I'm getting about 100 grams a day. For fats, I'm averaging between 70 and 80 grams.

3. My calcium doesn't have any magnesium in it, but my multi has a little bit. I used to be able to tolerate large amounts of magnesium, but since my surgery, my bowels no longer like it.

I'm really sorry to hear your body is responding badly to magnesium, but do keep in mind that if you do not consume sufficient magnesium with your calcium supplement the calcium cannot absorb properly, and will go into other areas of your body, causing problems. such problems include arthritis and alzheimers. If you want to rely on the mag in your multi, you should take those at the same time. Also, you want to make sure it's enough mag. common practice is a 2:1 ratio cal to mag, i.e. 1000 mg cal and 500 mg mag. a 1:1 ratio is more ideal, but 2:1 is most common and better than nothing. it's important to keep all this stuff in mind. I find myself, with my ailments, walking down what I consider a razorblade inbetween counterindications and uncomfortably close to what engineers refer to as " interlock "

in calculating your ratio, you might not want to forget that there is probably a little calcium in your multi

4. I don't need to lose weight. I weigh 102 pounds right now (5' 5 " ), which is 12 pounds more then my lowest point on SCD. I decided to try low carb because I've seen many many people here say they feel better with less carbs, and that carbs feed some of the bacteria/yeast we're trying to get rid of.

yeah sugars and yeast are a bitch, I think there are pretty sophisticated guidelines for what works what doesn't in the files and the SCD yeast info. as far as the bacteria, as far as I understand, if you stay SCD legal and stage appropriate, and water down juices etc, the bacteria won't get a chance to benefit.

5. I don't have an adrenal problem, *whew*. I got the saliva test done recently, and all was well. I wonder if LDN didn't help me out? I used to be most alert in evening, and could stay up very late into the night. I've had bouts where I was awake all night, and went to sleep at 6 in the morning. For the last few months, I'm actually tired by late evening and can go to sleep.

6. I used to have a good appetite, thanks to Zyrtec. I was one who had the reportedly rare side effect of hunger. But I decided to try to get off the Zyrtec, because these days my allergy symptoms do not match the outrageous results I had on the scratch test (thanks SCD and raw local honey!). I figured why take an illegal med that I don't truly seem to need. I have flirted with restarting it just for the appetite enhancement though. I think my lack of appetite, and lack of weight loss with low calories, is due to hypothyroidism. So far, I can't get my doctor to treat it.

I hope you don't have an adrenal problem, and honestly I don't remember the specifics on all the many tests you can do for it. But, I am overly familiar with the common failures of western medicine testing and diagnostics. Also, endocrine is complicated and often interrelated - it is not infrequent that if the thyroid goes, the adrenals are having problems too. Often if the adrenals have gone, they take the thyroid down. Not always though. Anyways, I'd still look into the book The Circadian Prescription.

7. I don't think it would be possible to do a 3 day food rotation. I've thought about it in the past, but there are a lot of foods I pretty much have to eat every day, or I'd have nothing to eat. Yogurt, eggs, cheese, almond butter, honey, butter, coconut oil, and gelatin are in something I eat everyday. Fruits are easy to rotate, because I tolerate several of those. Vegetables, not so much. I'm limited to a smaller number of them, and just don't tolerate them as well (more gas, doesn't digest as well). I'm allergic to all nuts, but don't have any noticeable reaction to almond, so I stick with small amounts of it day in and day out (probably no more then 2 tbsp a day).

do you cook the bejinkers out of the vegetables you are having trouble with? I find I really have to cook mine extremely thoroughly. my string beans, when freshest, can take up to 1.5 hours to steam before I can eat

them (sometimes if not so fresh only 45 mins though) And I still have to puree and water down the spinach

Today was a lousy calorie day. I tried some raw apple this afternoon (something new that I've been craving now for months), and also took an enzyme with it. It seemed to go over fine, and later I had frozen yogurt, and later yet I had an almond butter pancake. Then I got the familiar old feeling that my insides had come to a screeching halt. Kind of bloated, and gurgles too far and few between. I was not hungry for supper, and my body was telling me not to eat, but I did have 3 chicken wingettes. After that, my body was really telling me not to eat anymore (I don't even feel like yogurt, the one thing I'm always up for) so I missed a lot of things I would usually eat. Only got to 1000 calories today. So was it the apple? Really hard to say, because this bowel slow down is something that happens once in awhile

.. I'm just crossing my fingers that there isn't a blockage forming :-(

I hope you feel better soon!

That was an incredibly long explanation, wasn't it!

Holly

Crohn's

SCD 12/01/08

Best wishes!p.s. I'm sorry if I was a little edgy in my first email, blithely advising someone to go " low carb " without specifics on cause and effect and which ones when is like advising them to give up foods that start with the letter " B " . it's dangerous. there are many nuances with foods, and you have trouble with different ones for different reasons at different times. For example, with our digestive problems, we end up on what is called the _Specific_ carbohydrate diet.

> > >

> > > > Hi Jodi,

> > > >

> > > > How I wish I'd never started counting calories and grams! I started

> > > > entering everything into Fitday the day I started SCD, and have been

> > > > obsessing ever since.

> > >

> > > So, why are you doing that? :-)

> > >

> > > Is there a reason you think you need to count calories?

> > >

> > > n

> >

>

June 2, 2010

Hey Amber,It's awhile since I've looked into this, but unfortunately the only concern is not just intolerances. I think it's a little complicated, but from what I remember, basically, every food has its own extremely complicated constituencies and signature, and unfortunately these compounds gather in your body, and if they gather too much without time to clear them, they become almost counterproductive or as some call it " poisonous " . Too much of like things are bad.. As Kim was mentioning, life thrives on diversity.

....for example, a classic chinese medicine expression is that medicine when you are not sick will make you ill. Many herbs and spices are considered fundamentally medicinal in chinese medicine, and it is considered a strong warning not to carelessly consume them, nor to medicate yourself unnecessarily. Well, with the understanding that some foods are effectively medicinal, and its undesirable to overconsume them when not specifically ill, and with the understanding that along the lines of " let food be thy medicine and medicine be thy food " and that all food is somewhat medicinal in some way, you start to get a better perspective on the importance of spacing out your consumption. Basically, all the little uniquenesses of each food gather in your body, and your body needs to stay clear and balanced, so you want to give your body a chance to clear them and not gather. You are what you eat, literally. And to clarify, the recommendation I think you might have misunderstood as eat something for 3 days then rotate. it's not. it's eat something, then don't eat it again for 3 days.

Anyways, it's real hard to do on SCD! :PBest!!

Hey ,

> Also, it's important not to eat the same thing everyday. Guidelines say,

> ideally, a food should not be eaten more frequently than every 3 days. Well,

> I've never even gotten close to that in my life, though I desired to, and I

> don't think SCDers can, especially in the beginning, nor should try, but

> it's important to keep in mind. eating the same thing all the time does not

> just have psychological problems with it.

Could you please expand on this? I've heard/read that you shouldn't eat the same foods every day because your can develop food intolerances/allergies from it, but I was wondering if there were other issues that could arise from doing so.

Thanks!

Amber

June 3, 2010

Hey ,

Thanks for the further clarification. Very interesting. It makes sense just in

the general idea that your body needs balance. It reminds me of a story I read

in the New York times a few weeks ago. Some woman ate too much raw bok choy and

ended up in the hospital with extremely low thyroid function when she didn't

even have any history of thyroid disesase.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/25/health/research/25regi.html?ref=nutrition

I'm very guilty of eating many of the same things every day. I really need to

make an effort to mix things up. Sometimes I get stuck in ruts, because it's

easier for me to prepare the same things.

Oh, and yes, I did misunderstand the 3-day rotation. Thanks for clearing that

up. I'm not going to drive myself nuts trying to strive for that yet, I'm just

going to make it a goal to add more variety.

Thanks again!

Amber

>

> >

> > Hey ,

> >

> > > Also, it's important not to eat the same thing everyday. Guidelines say,

> > > ideally, a food should not be eaten more frequently than every 3 days.

> > Well,

> > > I've never even gotten close to that in my life, though I desired to, and

> > I

> > > don't think SCDers can, especially in the beginning, nor should try, but

> > > it's important to keep in mind. eating the same thing all the time does

> > not

> > > just have psychological problems with it.

> >

> > Could you please expand on this? I've heard/read that you shouldn't eat the

> > same foods every day because your can develop food intolerances/allergies

> > from it, but I was wondering if there were other issues that could arise

> > from doing so.

> >

> > Thanks!

> >

> > Amber

> >

>

June 3, 2010

At 12:38 AM 6/3/2010, you wrote:

yeah, ok, no... there are lots

of complex carbs on SCD, and they are very important. there are even

complex carbs on intro. Carrots are complex carbs - a great source of

starch, one of the best vegetable ones. squash (summer and winter) is

also a great source of complex carbs. etc. etc.

,

This is not the first time you've made statements like this which are not

correct.

http://www.innvista.com/health/foods/vegetables/carrots.htm

Carrots contain a high amount of sugars, <snip>, but very little

starch or fat.

Winter squashes are significantly higher in carbohydrates than summer

squashes. I didn't tolerate the winter squashes for some months -- I had

to stick with good old zucchini. A friend of mine who is diabetic can

have summer squash but winter squash sends his blood glucose

soaring.

—

Marilyn

New

Orleans, Louisiana, USA

Undiagnosed IBS since 1976, SCD since 2001

Darn Good SCD Cook

No Human Children

Shadow & Sunny Longhair Dachshund

Babette the Foundling Beagle

June 3, 2010

Oh yes, I definitely peeled! No loss, because I've never liked peels on any of

my fruits and veggies. It's possible I'm overreacting, and that the apple had

nothing to do with my system slow down (it was back to normal by morning), but

as you know, I'm super paranoid ;-).

I'm just tired of cooked apples and pears, since I've been eating them for such

a long time. But peaches are starting to appear in the store, and berries. I

just read an article that peaches and berries are terribly pesticide ridden, but

I suppose that's just life. They will be a nice change from the norm :-).

Holly

Crohn's

SCD 12/01/08

> >That's so very true! I'm scared of most anything

> >stage 3 and up, and rarely venture there. I had

> >my first raw apple the other day, and later that

> >day, my system slowed down to a crawl. Guess who

> >won't be trying raw again anytime soon?

>

> So keep cooking your apples. Did you peel the raw one?

>

> — Marilyn

> New Orleans, Louisiana, USA

> Undiagnosed IBS since 1976, SCD since 2001

> Darn Good SCD Cook

> No Human Children

> Shadow & Sunny Longhair Dachshund

> Babette the Foundling Beagle

>

June 4, 2010

" High-starch vegetables tend to be roots or tubers like potatoes, yams, turnips, winter squash, carrots, and beets. " http://www.alphanutrition.com/nutrition/carbohydrates.htm

" Healthier Starches (one or two daily): Turnips, parsnips, butternut & acorn squash, corn, sweet potato, peas, carrots, wild rice & brown rice, quinoa & millet, and steel cut oats & oatmeal. " http://www.diseaseproof.com/archives/healthy-food-watch-out-for-starch.html " Foodstuffs In Carrots

Carrots contain sugar,

gum, and about one-fourth as much starch as potatoes do; of the mineral

compounds

in them the most important are potash salts, yet there are less of these than there are in potatoes. " http://chestofbooks.com/food/science/Theory-And-Practice-Of-Cookery/Study-Of-A-Carrot.html

Potatoes are considered very high starch. I don't know about you, but 1/4 potato is pretty starchy to me.It's pretty classic nutrition that carrots are considered a starch. Granted, it is not common knowledge.

Yes, winter squash has much more complex carbs than summer, and is considered a starch while zucchini is considered a " non-starchy " vegetable. However, zucchini still does have complex carbs, and relatively speaking for SCD, especially in early stages, is a pretty good source of complex carbs. Try it. Try eating nothing for a long while, then drinking a whole lot of watered down juice, then eating a whole lot of steamed zucchini. See if you can observe how they effect you differently.

On Thu, Jun 3, 2010 at 1:29 PM, Wizop Marilyn L. Alm wrote:

At 12:38 AM 6/3/2010, you wrote:

yeah, ok, no... there are lots

of complex carbs on SCD, and they are very important. there are even

complex carbs on intro. Carrots are complex carbs - a great source of

starch, one of the best vegetable ones. squash (summer and winter) is

also a great source of complex carbs. etc. etc.

,

This is not the first time you've made statements like this which are not

correct.

http://www.innvista.com/health/foods/vegetables/carrots.htm

Carrots contain a high amount of sugars, <snip>, but very little

starch or fat.

Winter squashes are significantly higher in carbohydrates than summer

squashes. I didn't tolerate the winter squashes for some months -- I had

to stick with good old zucchini. A friend of mine who is diabetic can

have summer squash but winter squash sends his blood glucose

soaring.

—

Marilyn

New

Orleans, Louisiana, USA

Undiagnosed IBS since 1976, SCD since 2001

Darn Good SCD Cook

No Human Children

Shadow & Sunny Longhair Dachshund

Babette the Foundling Beagle

June 4, 2010

,

From http://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.info/beginners_guide/beginners.htm :

" The allowed carbohydrates are monosaccharides and have a single molecule

structure that allow them to be easily absorbed by the intestine wall. Complex

carbohydrates which are disaccharides (double molecules) and polysaccharides

(chain molecules) are not allowed. Complex carbohydrates that are not easily

digested feed harmful bacteria in our intestines causing them to overgrow

producing by products and inflaming the intestine wall. The diet works by

starving out these bacteria and restoring the balance of bacteria in our gut. "

So I maintain that I'm not eating any complex carbs, as they are illegal on SCD.

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on this issue.

I'll try adding some magnesium supplements back today, and see what happens. I

definitely need the calcium supplements for my bad bones, and would rather not

cut back.

Oh, and added Zyrtec back 2 days ago. It was funny, I took it at about 5 pm,

forgot about it, and at 9 pm, I thought, " Weird, I feel hungry. " Then I

remembered that I took the Zyrtec. Yesterday, I got a bit over 1400 calories!

That's pretty much my limit, because it doesn't take much for me to gain weight

these days.

Holly

Crohn's

SCD 12/01/08

>

> >

> > , I'll answer you questions the best I can :-)

> >

> > 1. Well, since you can only eat simple carbs on SCD (with the exception of

> > legumes in advanced stages), it's kind of a moot point. I haven't eaten any

> > complex carbs for 1.5 years.

> >

> > Hey

>

> yeah, ok, no... there are lots of complex carbs on SCD, and they are very

> important. there are even complex carbs on intro. Carrots are complex carbs

> - a great source of starch, one of the best vegetable ones. squash (summer

> and winter) is also a great source of complex carbs. etc. etc.

>

> and there is a little bit of complex carbs (although not always in the most

> useful form) in almost all foods, for example the fiber in your fruit, a

> little in 'protein' foods like nuts, and even a little in meat. ....so,

> it's not possible to go 1.5 years without eating complex carbs, unless

> you're strictly on some sort of horrible liquid scientifically formulated

> compound, and still not probable.

>

> > 2. I do pretty good on protein, which is surprising, because I'm not a big

> > meat eater. The yogurt/cheese/eggs are my main sources. I average between 50

> > and 60 grams most days, depending on whether I eat much meat for dinner.

> >

> > I'm guessing you meant to say your body needs carbs (not complex carbs)?

> >

>

> nope, your body needs complex carbs

>

> > Right now I'm getting about 100 grams a day. For fats, I'm averaging

> > between 70 and 80 grams.

> >

> > 3. My calcium doesn't have any magnesium in it, but my multi has a little

> > bit. I used to be able to tolerate large amounts of magnesium, but since my

> > surgery, my bowels no longer like it.

> >

> > I'm really sorry to hear your body is responding badly to magnesium, but do

> keep in mind that if you do not consume sufficient magnesium with your

> calcium supplement the calcium cannot absorb properly, and will go into

> other areas of your body, causing problems. such problems include arthritis

> and alzheimers. If you want to rely on the mag in your multi, you should

> take those at the same time. Also, you want to make sure it's enough mag.

> common practice is a 2:1 ratio cal to mag, i.e. 1000 mg cal and 500 mg mag.

> a 1:1 ratio is more ideal, but 2:1 is most common and better than nothing.

> it's important to keep all this stuff in mind. I find myself, with my

> ailments, walking down what I consider a razorblade inbetween

> counterindications and uncomfortably close to what engineers refer to as

> " interlock "

>

> in calculating your ratio, you might not want to forget that there is

> probably a little calcium in your multi

>

> > 4. I don't need to lose weight. I weigh 102 pounds right now (5' 5 " ), which

> > is 12 pounds more then my lowest point on SCD. I decided to try low carb

> > because I've seen many many people here say they feel better with less

> > carbs, and that carbs feed some of the bacteria/yeast we're trying to get

> > rid of.

> >

> > yeah sugars and yeast are a bitch, I think there are pretty sophisticated

> guidelines for what works what doesn't in the files and the SCD yeast info.

> as far as the bacteria, as far as I understand, if you stay SCD legal and

> stage appropriate, and water down juices etc, the bacteria won't get a

> chance to benefit.

>

> > 5. I don't have an adrenal problem, *whew*. I got the saliva test done

> > recently, and all was well. I wonder if LDN didn't help me out? I used to be

> > most alert in evening, and could stay up very late into the night. I've had

> > bouts where I was awake all night, and went to sleep at 6 in the morning.

> > For the last few months, I'm actually tired by late evening and can go to

> > sleep.

> >

> > 6. I used to have a good appetite, thanks to Zyrtec. I was one who had the

> > reportedly rare side effect of hunger. But I decided to try to get off the

> > Zyrtec, because these days my allergy symptoms do not match the outrageous

> > results I had on the scratch test (thanks SCD and raw local honey!). I

> > figured why take an illegal med that I don't truly seem to need. I have

> > flirted with restarting it just for the appetite enhancement though. I think

> > my lack of appetite, and lack of weight loss with low calories, is due to

> > hypothyroidism. So far, I can't get my doctor to treat it.

> >

> > I hope you don't have an adrenal problem, and honestly I don't remember the

> specifics on all the many tests you can do for it. But, I am overly familiar

> with the common failures of western medicine testing and diagnostics. Also,

> endocrine is complicated and often interrelated - it is not infrequent that

> if the thyroid goes, the adrenals are having problems too. Often if the

> adrenals have gone, they take the thyroid down. Not always though. Anyways,

> I'd still look into the book The Circadian Prescription.

>

> > 7. I don't think it would be possible to do a 3 day food rotation. I've

> > thought about it in the past, but there are a lot of foods I pretty much

> > have to eat every day, or I'd have nothing to eat. Yogurt, eggs, cheese,

> > almond butter, honey, butter, coconut oil, and gelatin are in something I

> > eat everyday. Fruits are easy to rotate, because I tolerate several of

> > those. Vegetables, not so much. I'm limited to a smaller number of them, and

> > just don't tolerate them as well (more gas, doesn't digest as well). I'm

> > allergic to all nuts, but don't have any noticeable reaction to almond, so I

> > stick with small amounts of it day in and day out (probably no more then 2

> > tbsp a day).

> >

> do you cook the bejinkers out of the vegetables you are having trouble with?

> I find I really have to cook mine extremely thoroughly. my string beans,

> when freshest, can take up to 1.5 hours to steam before I can eat them

> (sometimes if not so fresh only 45 mins though) And I still have to puree

> and water down the spinach

>

> > Today was a lousy calorie day. I tried some raw apple this afternoon

> > (something new that I've been craving now for months), and also took an

> > enzyme with it. It seemed to go over fine, and later I had frozen yogurt,

> > and later yet I had an almond butter pancake. Then I got the familiar old

> > feeling that my insides had come to a screeching halt. Kind of bloated, and

> > gurgles too far and few between. I was not hungry for supper, and my body

> > was telling me not to eat, but I did have 3 chicken wingettes. After that,

> > my body was really telling me not to eat anymore (I don't even feel like

> > yogurt, the one thing I'm always up for) so I missed a lot of things I would

> > usually eat. Only got to 1000 calories today. So was it the apple? Really

> > hard to say, because this bowel slow down is something that happens once in

> > awhile

> >

> . I'm just crossing my fingers that there isn't a blockage forming :-(

> >

> I hope you feel better soon!

>

> That was an incredibly long explanation, wasn't it!

> >

> > Holly

> > Crohn's

> > SCD 12/01/08

> >

> Best wishes!

>

> p.s. I'm sorry if I was a little edgy in my first email, blithely advising

> someone to go " low carb " without specifics on cause and effect and which

> ones when is like advising them to give up foods that start with the letter

> " B " . it's dangerous. there are many nuances with foods, and you have trouble

> with different ones for different reasons at different times. For example,

> with our digestive problems, we end up on what is called the _Specific_

> carbohydrate diet.

June 4, 2010

Hey Holly,Well, without getting too far into it, for example, fiber is a complex carbohydrate. Are you not aware that there is fiber in a lot of the foods that you eat, like fruits?Best!

,

From http://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.info/beginners_guide/beginners.htm :

" The allowed carbohydrates are monosaccharides and have a single molecule structure that allow them to be easily absorbed by the intestine wall. Complex carbohydrates which are disaccharides (double molecules) and polysaccharides (chain molecules) are not allowed. Complex carbohydrates that are not easily digested feed harmful bacteria in our intestines causing them to overgrow producing by products and inflaming the intestine wall. The diet works by starving out these bacteria and restoring the balance of bacteria in our gut. "

So I maintain that I'm not eating any complex carbs, as they are illegal on SCD. I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on this issue.

I'll try adding some magnesium supplements back today, and see what happens. I definitely need the calcium supplements for my bad bones, and would rather not cut back.

Oh, and added Zyrtec back 2 days ago. It was funny, I took it at about 5 pm, forgot about it, and at 9 pm, I thought, " Weird, I feel hungry. " Then I remembered that I took the Zyrtec. Yesterday, I got a bit over 1400 calories! That's pretty much my limit, because it doesn't take much for me to gain weight these days.