Guest guest Posted October 7, 2009 Report Share Posted October 7, 2009 Stefani, It's interesting how different the information taught to pulmonary patients can be from location to location. I'm curious what kind of data they have to justify saying that pursed lip breathing is useless for us. I've seen data that shows the opposite. Interesting huh? Actually at Duke pursed lip breathing is taught to all pulmonary patients. While it is more beneficial to those with obstructive lung disease, it definitely benefits those of us with restrictive lung disease. It is the very best way to get rid of that out of control short of breath panicky feeling that all of us have had to deal with. You breathe in through the nose as deeply as you can and then exhale through pursed lips. The slight back pressure provided by the pursed lips causes the alveoli to collapse more efficiently and empty of the old Co2 rich air. That makes it easier for our lungs to take in the O2 rich air on our next inhale. I was taught pursed lip breathing specifically for me. I didn't just over hear and adopt it. It has helped me many many times to maintain my sats if I'm without oxygen for some reason, such as when my car broke down a few months ago and I was without O2 for nearly an hour. I use it when I'm exercising and can count on my sats rising when I'm using it. It's a great tool for almost anyone who needs a way to ease their breathing in a stressful situation. Beth Moderator Fibrotic NSIP 06/06 Dermatomyositis 11/08 To: Breathe-Support Sent: Wed, October 7, 2009 5:07:24 PMSubject: Re: Finishing up Beth -I too am in pulmonary rehab (at the University of Utah). Because I am in their pulmonary fibrosis study group I have an additional two weeks. I have had additional "instruction" units. I just had one to day on the good health practices for pulmonary "patients". Last week there was a component on "pacing". I have also had components on "nutrition" (I also have diabetes) and "occupational therapy" (how to go about your 'noraml' day). I found out today why they mention the pursed lip breathing. They have found that as they instruct their COPD patients through their regimen, fibrosis patients often overhear the instructions and adopt the practice. The reality is that it does not help us, but some patients find it calming and stress relieving to monitor and pace their breathing using the technique. That may be why some doctors, clinicians and technicians mention the technique to pulmonary fibrosis patients. Stefani 61 year old UtahnILD 2/2006, NSIP (cellular) 6/2009, UIP 9/2009, Diabetes II 2/2006, Sleep Apnea 4/2009>> Hi everybody,> This is the final week for me of the "Intensive pulmonary rehab" program at the Duke Center for Living. "Graduation" is on Friday. So I am on the home stretch and still enjoying it. > Today I see Dr. MacIntyre again. He's the medical director of the program and we see him once at the beginning of the program and once at the end. In between times he follows our progress on our charts and conferencing with the staff.> Today and tomorrow they will tell us more about the graduate programs the center offers. My intention is to finish up the intensive program on Friday and go right back on Monday to pick up with a graduate program. Hopefully it will work out.> > Beth> Moderator> Fibrotic NSIP 06/06 Dermatomyositis 11/08> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 7, 2009 Report Share Posted October 7, 2009 Beth and Stefani i was taught pursed lip breathing and diaphragmatic breathing in the beginning of pulmonary rehab i never mastered the diaphragmatic and don't understand it i think Beth explained this to me once before but the pursed lip breathing helps all the time when i need it and remember to use it still don't understand how it works even though Beth just explained it i need to reread it a couple of times posted in couple of places in my house are the phrase "smell the roses, blow out the candles" Jerry is supposed to remind me of it when i am having a problem sometimes i do it automatically without thinking about it -- it sort of comes naturally hope this makes sense Pink Joyce R (IPF 3/06) IFA 5/09 Pennsylvania Donate Life Listed 1/09 Inactive 4/09 www.transplantfund.org--- Subject: Re: Re: Finishing upTo: Breathe-Support Date: Wednesday, October 7, 2009, 5:40 PM Stefani, It's interesting how different the information taught to pulmonary patients can be from location to location. I'm curious what kind of data they have to justify saying that pursed lip breathing is useless for us. I've seen data that shows the opposite. Interesting huh? Actually at Duke pursed lip breathing is taught to all pulmonary patients. While it is more beneficial to those with obstructive lung disease, it definitely benefits those of us with restrictive lung disease. It is the very best way to get rid of that out of control short of breath panicky feeling that all of us have had to deal with. You breathe in through the nose as deeply as you can and then exhale through pursed lips. The slight back pressure provided by the pursed lips causes the alveoli to collapse more efficiently and empty of the old Co2 rich air. That makes it easier for our lungs to take in the O2 rich air on our next inhale. I was taught pursed lip breathing specifically for me. I didn't just over hear and adopt it. It has helped me many many times to maintain my sats if I'm without oxygen for some reason, such as when my car broke down a few months ago and I was without O2 for nearly an hour. I use it when I'm exercising and can count on my sats rising when I'm using it. It's a great tool for almost anyone who needs a way to ease their breathing in a stressful situation. Beth Moderator Fibrotic NSIP 06/06 Dermatomyositis 11/08 From: Stefani <sfshaner (AT) gmail (DOT) com>To: Breathe-Support@ yahoogroups. comSent: Wed, October 7, 2009 5:07:24 PMSubject: Re: Finishing up Beth -I too am in pulmonary rehab (at the University of Utah). Because I am in their pulmonary fibrosis study group I have an additional two weeks. I have had additional "instruction" units. I just had one to day on the good health practices for pulmonary "patients". Last week there was a component on "pacing". I have also had components on "nutrition" (I also have diabetes) and "occupational therapy" (how to go about your 'noraml' day). I found out today why they mention the pursed lip breathing. They have found that as they instruct their COPD patients through their regimen, fibrosis patients often overhear the instructions and adopt the practice. The reality is that it does not help us, but some patients find it calming and stress relieving to monitor and pace their breathing using the technique. That may be why some doctors, clinicians and technicians mention the technique to pulmonary fibrosis patients. Stefani 61 year old UtahnILD 2/2006, NSIP (cellular) 6/2009, UIP 9/2009, Diabetes II 2/2006, Sleep Apnea 4/2009>> Hi everybody,> This is the final week for me of the "Intensive pulmonary rehab" program at the Duke Center for Living. "Graduation" is on Friday. So I am on the home stretch and still enjoying it. > Today I see Dr. MacIntyre again. He's the medical director of the program and we see him once at the beginning of the program and once at the end. In between times he follows our progress on our charts and conferencing with the staff.> Today and tomorrow they will tell us more about the graduate programs the center offers. My intention is to finish up the intensive program on Friday and go right back on Monday to pick up with a graduate program. Hopefully it will work out.> > Beth> Moderator> Fibrotic NSIP 06/06 Dermatomyositis 11/08> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 7, 2009 Report Share Posted October 7, 2009 MB, I was told the same thing. smell the coffee and blow out the candles.. sure brings my 02 up quickly. My Dr. and the head guy in the Pulmonary Therapy Dept. at Shands had me do that too when I was out of air.. Hey, works for me. Love & Prayers, Peggy Florida, IPF/UIP 2004"I believe that friends are quiet angels who lift us to our feet, when our wings have trouble remembering how to fly." Stefani, It's interesting how different the information taught to pulmonary patients can be from location to location. I'm curious what kind of data they have to justify saying that pursed lip breathing is useless for us. I've seen data that shows the opposite. Interesting huh? Actually at Duke pursed lip breathing is taught to all pulmonary patients. While it is more beneficial to those with obstructive lung disease, it definitely benefits those of us with restrictive lung disease. It is the very best way to get rid of that out of control short of breath panicky feeling that all of us have had to deal with. You breathe in through the nose as deeply as you can and then exhale through pursed lips. The slight back pressure provided by the pursed lips causes the alveoli to collapse more efficiently and empty of the old Co2 rich air. That makes it easier for our lungs to take in the O2 rich air on our next inhale. I was taught pursed lip breathing specifically for me. I didn't just over hear and adopt it. It has helped me many many times to maintain my sats if I'm without oxygen for some reason, such as when my car broke down a few months ago and I was without O2 for nearly an hour. I use it when I'm exercising and can count on my sats rising when I'm using it. It's a great tool for almost anyone who needs a way to ease their breathing in a stressful situation. BethModeratorFibrotic NSIP 06/06 Dermatomyositis 11/08 From: Stefani <sfshaner (AT) gmail (DOT) com>To: Breathe-Support Sent: Wed, October 7, 2009 5:07:24 PMSubject: Re: Finishing up Beth -I too am in pulmonary rehab (at the University of Utah). Because I am in their pulmonary fibrosis study group I have an additional two weeks. I have had additional "instruction" units. I just had one to day on the good health practices for pulmonary "patients". Last week there was a component on "pacing". I have also had components on "nutrition" (I also have diabetes) and "occupational therapy" (how to go about your 'noraml' day). I found out today why they mention the pursed lip breathing. They have found that as they instruct their COPD patients through their regimen, fibrosis patients often overhear the instructions and adopt the practice. The reality is that it does not help us, but some patients find it calming and stress relieving to monitor and pace their breathing using the technique. That may be why some doctors, clinicians and technicians mention the technique to pulmonary fibrosis patients. Stefani 61 year old UtahnILD 2/2006, NSIP (cellular) 6/2009, UIP 9/2009, Diabetes II 2/2006, Sleep Apnea 4/2009>> Hi everybody,> This is the final week for me of the "Intensive pulmonary rehab" program at the Duke Center for Living. "Graduation" is on Friday. So I am on the home stretch and still enjoying it. > Today I see Dr. MacIntyre again. He's the medical director of the program and we see him once at the beginning of the program and once at the end. In between times he follows our progress on our charts and conferencing with the staff.> Today and tomorrow they will tell us more about the graduate programs the center offers. My intention is to finish up the intensive program on Friday and go right back on Monday to pick up with a graduate program. Hopefully it will work out.> > Beth> Moderator> Fibrotic NSIP 06/06 Dermatomyositis 11/08> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 7, 2009 Report Share Posted October 7, 2009 Joyce, You are not the only one who has had a difficult time getting the hang of diaphragmatic breathing. I struggled mightily with it in my first round of rehab 3 years ago. I think it has to do with the fact that it's hard for us to locate and feel our diapragm working. I mean if you want to exercise your bicep, you do curls and you can feel your bicep flexing. It's much more difficult to do that with your diaphragm but it is doable. When you can do it your are flexing your diaphragm which allows you to take a much fuller breath then when you just flex your rib cage. The best way I can think of to explain it is to lay back in a chair or in bed and put your hands on your belly. Inhale and concentrate on your belly rising rather than expanding your chest. When you exhale, let your belly fall completely. This is actually considered by many to be healthy breathing technique and with practise can become ones' normal breathing. You can also combine this with pursed lip breathing, doing both techniques at once. It can become habit. I'm still working on it but it comes easier to me than it did before. I think the fact that I do it now every single day in rehab helps. Repitition is one way of getting something into this middle aged brain of mine! Beth Moderator Fibrotic NSIP 06/06 Dermatomyositis 11/08 To: Breathe-Support Sent: Wed, October 7, 2009 6:06:27 PMSubject: Re: Re: Finishing up Beth and Stefani i was taught pursed lip breathing and diaphragmatic breathing in the beginning of pulmonary rehab i never mastered the diaphragmatic and don't understand it i think Beth explained this to me once before but the pursed lip breathing helps all the time when i need it and remember to use it still don't understand how it works even though Beth just explained it i need to reread it a couple of times posted in couple of places in my house are the phrase "smell the roses, blow out the candles" Jerry is supposed to remind me of it when i am having a problem sometimes i do it automatically without thinking about it -- it sort of comes naturally hope this makes sense Pink Joyce R (IPF 3/06) IFA 5/09 Pennsylvania Donate Life Listed 1/09 Inactive 4/09 www.transplantfund. org From: Beth <mbmurtha (AT) yahoo (DOT) com>Subject: Re: Re: Finishing upTo: Breathe-Support@ yahoogroups. comDate: Wednesday, October 7, 2009, 5:40 PM Stefani, It's interesting how different the information taught to pulmonary patients can be from location to location. I'm curious what kind of data they have to justify saying that pursed lip breathing is useless for us. I've seen data that shows the opposite. Interesting huh? Actually at Duke pursed lip breathing is taught to all pulmonary patients. While it is more beneficial to those with obstructive lung disease, it definitely benefits those of us with restrictive lung disease. It is the very best way to get rid of that out of control short of breath panicky feeling that all of us have had to deal with. You breathe in through the nose as deeply as you can and then exhale through pursed lips. The slight back pressure provided by the pursed lips causes the alveoli to collapse more efficiently and empty of the old Co2 rich air. That makes it easier for our lungs to take in the O2 rich air on our next inhale. I was taught pursed lip breathing specifically for me. I didn't just over hear and adopt it. It has helped me many many times to maintain my sats if I'm without oxygen for some reason, such as when my car broke down a few months ago and I was without O2 for nearly an hour. I use it when I'm exercising and can count on my sats rising when I'm using it. It's a great tool for almost anyone who needs a way to ease their breathing in a stressful situation. Beth Moderator Fibrotic NSIP 06/06 Dermatomyositis 11/08 From: Stefani <sfshaner (AT) gmail (DOT) com>To: Breathe-Support@ yahoogroups. comSent: Wed, October 7, 2009 5:07:24 PMSubject: Re: Finishing up Beth -I too am in pulmonary rehab (at the University of Utah). Because I am in their pulmonary fibrosis study group I have an additional two weeks. I have had additional "instruction" units. I just had one to day on the good health practices for pulmonary "patients". Last week there was a component on "pacing". I have also had components on "nutrition" (I also have diabetes) and "occupational therapy" (how to go about your 'noraml' day). I found out today why they mention the pursed lip breathing. They have found that as they instruct their COPD patients through their regimen, fibrosis patients often overhear the instructions and adopt the practice. The reality is that it does not help us, but some patients find it calming and stress relieving to monitor and pace their breathing using the technique. That may be why some doctors, clinicians and technicians mention the technique to pulmonary fibrosis patients. Stefani 61 year old UtahnILD 2/2006, NSIP (cellular) 6/2009, UIP 9/2009, Diabetes II 2/2006, Sleep Apnea 4/2009>> Hi everybody,> This is the final week for me of the "Intensive pulmonary rehab" program at the Duke Center for Living. "Graduation" is on Friday. So I am on the home stretch and still enjoying it. > Today I see Dr. MacIntyre again. He's the medical director of the program and we see him once at the beginning of the program and once at the end. In between times he follows our progress on our charts and conferencing with the staff.> Today and tomorrow they will tell us more about the graduate programs the center offers. My intention is to finish up the intensive program on Friday and go right back on Monday to pick up with a graduate program. Hopefully it will work out.> > Beth> Moderator> Fibrotic NSIP 06/06 Dermatomyositis 11/08> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 7, 2009 Report Share Posted October 7, 2009 Beth, I bet you're glad to be finishing up " boot camp. " It's good to see you'll be following through with a graduate program. I started back to rehab this week and will be finished next Thursday. I'm excited to be one step closer to my surgery and will continue my own exercise program at home. It was helpfull to get a refresher on practices I had not in a quite a while. Best wishes, 34 FL IPF dx 1/06 > > > > Hi everybody, > > This is the final week for me of the " Intensive pulmonary rehab " > program at the Duke Center for Living. " Graduation " is on Friday. So > I am on the home stretch and still enjoying it. > > Today I see Dr. MacIntyre again. He's the medical director of the > program and we see him once at the beginning of the program and once > at the end. In between times he follows our progress on our charts > and conferencing with the staff. > > Today and tomorrow they will tell us more about the graduate > programs the center offers. My intention is to finish up the > intensive program on Friday and go right back on Monday to pick up > with a graduate program. Hopefully it will work out. > > > > Beth > > Moderator > > Fibrotic NSIP 06/06 Dermatomyositis 11/08 > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 7, 2009 Report Share Posted October 7, 2009 Pursed lip breathing would be helpful to even a perfectly healthy person as would breathing from the diaphragm. A perfectly healthy person exerting themselves and needed to " catch their breath " could still benefit. It's a technique to create an exchange of gases. Actually the exhaling portion is probably more important than the inhaling. Now, might it be more helpful to some than others? I'm sure. Many other breathing exercises are helpful, including incentive spirometer and muscle trainer. When you do PFT's you actually do a bit extreme version of pursed lip breathing. The " push push push push " part is to see how much you can exhale but also to prepare you to inhale the maximum you can. We don't use our full lung capacities or breathing skills most of the time. The entire focus of all these and of pulmonary rehab is to get us to use as much of whatever percent of normal capacity as we can. I know my breathing habits are so much better on the treadmill, but I don't always translate those into walking. However, when I find myself short and remember to breath deeper and use some pursed lip it really helps me recover a bit. > > > > Hi everybody, > > This is the final week for me of the " Intensive pulmonary rehab " program at the Duke Center for Living. " Graduation " is on Friday. So I am on the home stretch and still enjoying it. > > Today I see Dr. MacIntyre again. He's the medical director of the program and we see him once at the beginning of the program and once at the end. In between times he follows our progress on our charts and conferencing with the staff. > > Today and tomorrow they will tell us more about the graduate programs the center offers. My intention is to finish up the intensive program on Friday and go right back on Monday to pick up with a graduate program. Hopefully it will work out. > > > > Beth > > Moderator > > Fibrotic NSIP 06/06 Dermatomyositis 11/08 > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 7, 2009 Report Share Posted October 7, 2009 Beth/Joyce Funny, the diaphragmatic breathing was an easy concept for me because I naturally breathe from the diaphragm. The reason is I started voice lessons when I was 7 years old and was taught to breathe that way for singing. It became my normal breathing pattern. Now, where I was doing lousy involved going on and filling the upper part and also because of esophagus problems I'd started breathing shallow. So I was originating the breath correctly but cutting it short to avoid coughing and discomfort. My worst habit still it not remembering to breathe when I lift something. Like most people I tend to hold my breath when lifting, except probably more to the extreme. Now, if I do that it doesn't matter how much oxygen I'm on my sats drop. So, I have to remember, but its hard to retrain our bodies and change our habits. > >> > >> Hi everybody, > >> This is the final week for me of the " Intensive pulmonary rehab " program at the Duke Center for Living. " Graduation " is on Friday. So I am on the home stretch and still enjoying it. > >> Today I see Dr. MacIntyre again. He's the medical director of the program and we see him once at the beginning of the program and once at the end. In between times he follows our progress on our charts and conferencing with the staff. > >> Today and tomorrow they will tell us more about the graduate programs the center offers. My intention is to finish up the intensive program on Friday and go right back on Monday to pick up with a graduate program. Hopefully it will work out. > >> > >> Beth > >> Moderator > >> Fibrotic NSIP 06/06 Dermatomyositis 11/08 > >> > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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