Guest guest Posted October 1, 2001 Report Share Posted October 1, 2001 > Hi > I am going to start my daughter(2 1/2 27lbs) on DMG plus folic and > B12 next week. She has been on it before, but am now trying the > hypoallergenic capsules. I ordered Mg from Kirkman's bc their site > (and the customer serv. rep) said extra Mg could reduce hyperactivity > with the DMG. However,I thought I read somewhere that it is possible > to " overdose " on Mg. I was wondering if anyone out there has any > information on this/has heard the same/has used the Mg with DMG with > success? > Thanks, > Janelle *** Janelle, I add extra folic acid with the DMG+B12+Folic acid. Yes, this means " extra " besides what it is in. The RDA for folic acid is 5000 mg. So you can make your count of how much folic acid your daughter takes through all the other supplements, and then add whatever amount of folic acid to increase, I would say, up to about 4000 mg. That will leave about 1000 mg to " play " with; that is to leave space for the folic acid that may be into foods or anything else. About Magnesium, you are not supposed to take magnesium w/o calcium; so if you take " xx " amount of Mg per day, you have to balamce it with " yy " amount of calcium; does that make sense? Here are the infos I have on that (from previous posts): ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ magnesium oxide is not assimilable and is a laxitive. the following is my expereince and these forms are assimilable. 1. chelated magnesium for migriane 2. magnesium glycinate for general health including enzyme produciton and aluminium chelation. 3. magnesium apsartate for general health. 4. magnesium orotate as a knock down for sleep. Here is a reputable source from a book on nutrition: " Magnesium chelated with amino acids is probably the most absorbable form. Less absorbable forms include magnesium bicarbonate, magnesium oxide, and magnesium carbonate. Magnesium oxide is probably somewhat better than magnesium carbonate (dolomite). The newly available salts of magnesium aspartate or citrate, both known as mineral transporters, have a better percentage of absorption. " http://www.healthy.net/asp/templates/article.asp? PageType=article & ID=2060 Here it points out the Magnesium citrate is a salt with increased absorption, and that magnesium oxide is kind of in the middle (that is how it reads to me). I ran across many supplements with oxide in it although a couple places say it is a popular form because there is a lot of mag by weight. I also read that magnesium citrate is absorbable as stated here, but also is a prime form that causes diarrhea. If you are dealing with constipation, then that is a preferable form. A couple places said that taking it with meals will decrease the chance of diarrhea. What chelate form means: " Magnesium Chelate (Amino Acid): A chemically reacted magnesium ion, bound to 1 or more amino acids, thus allowing the magnesium to enter through the intestinal wall via the amino acid pathway rather than active magnesium diffusion. A true reacted chelate differs from simply mixing the amino acids and minerals which is often referred to as " chelated " . " http://www.nutraceuticals.com/reactedmagnesium.htm I have seen many times that chelated forms of anything are very absorbable and this explains why. Next is a link to a short summary of magnesium and its role in the body: http://www.auravita.com/secure_check.asp? prodpage=http://www.auravita.com/healthnotesonline/ukinet50/Supp/Magne sium.asp An even shorter summary: http://health.yahoo.com/health/Diseases_and_Conditions/Disease_Feed_Da ta/Magnesium_in_diet Recommended Intakes RDAs: 350 mg/day for adult males over age 18 280 mg for females over age 18 320 mg for adult females - pregnant 355 mg for females lactating 0-6 months 340 mg for females lactating 6 months+ 400 mg for males ages 15-18 300 mg for females ages 15-18 270 mg for males ages 11-14 280 mg for females ages 11-14 170 mg for children ages 7-10 120 mg for children ages 4-6 80 mg for children ages 1-3 60 mg for infants ages 0.5-1.0 40 mg for infants ages 0-0.5 These amounts are for healthy people. A person with in an unwell or deficient state would need more. I also found it very interesting to read that one of the primary sources of dietary magnesium is whole grains and cereals. If one goes 100% gluten free, you would be loosing a main source of mag, and could go deficient especially if you are also supplementing with extra calcium to make up for the casein free part. Most places recommend a 2:1 calcium:magnesium ratio for regular function, not including a deficient state. Magnesium deficiency is associated with fibromyalgia, chronic fatigue, migraines, and a bunch of other ailments. Supplementing with mag has helped many of these conditions in clinical studies. I can get references and links for those if anyone is interested. Overall, the chelated magnesium and magnesium glycinate are often refered to as being very absorbable. Most magnesium forms are pretty close and equal in terms of absorption with the following guidelines from the Encyclopedia of Nutritional Supplements. The organic forms of mag with aspartate, malate, glycinate, citrate and succinate (sp) are better absorbed by the body for nutrition. The chelates are very good and absorbable. The inorganic salts such as oxide, chloride, and carbonate are not as well absorbed, with oxide being better of the three. The inorganic salts are much more likely to cause diarrhea than the organinc forms. So, remember if you are taking it for nutrition or to assist in relieving constipation. Most of the supplements have a mixture of mag forms. Nature's Plus had just amino acid chelate. KAL has a magnesium glycinate supplement and a mixed mag supplement. TwinLabs had mag oxide+mag aspartate. And some had as many as 4-5 different types in the mixture. The symptoms of mag deficiency are irritability, tantrums, seizures, insomnia, muscle cramps/twitching, hyperactivity and poor digestion among others. Magnesium is needed for proper electrolyte function, over 300 enzyme functions, and calcium absorbtion. Mag is supposed to help with pain,migraines, chronic fatigue and fibro. The Brainchild Night-Cal supplement contains the following, each 2 Teaspoon Dose of NightCal: Calcium from Kreb's Chelates450 mg Magnesium from Kreb's Chelates50 mg Potasium Alpha Ketoglutarate100 mg Selenium from Selenomethionine100 mcg Vitamin D-3 as Cholecalciferol100 IU The direct link with description is: http://www.brainchildnutritionals.com/Night_Calx.html Also, we saw again and again that there was not a toxicity problem because the body does not store mag as it does calcium. The body excretes what is not used. You upper limit will be when you notice continuous loose stools. I read that excessive amounts of magnesium hinders the uptake of calcium. It doesn't say how much an excessive amount is, though. And if you take magnesium to absorbe calcium, this says that the amino acid lysine IS NEEDED for calcium absorption and magnesium AIDS in calcium absorption. So: Excessive magnesium inhibits calcium and excessive calcium inhibits magnesium - although I didn't see any amount as given as " excessive " for mag. Calcium had the number of 2500 mg/day most likely for an adult - from the Encyclopedia of Nutritions Supplements at the HFS. It is a balancing act. It also says that calcium and magnesium should be taken inbetween meals, on an empty stomach for best absorption. " The many enzyme systems that require magnesium help restore normal energy levels. Because of this function and its nerve and muscle support, magnesium may also be helpful for nervousness, anxiety, insomnia, depression, and muscle cramps. Magnesium is also given as part of a treatment for autism or hyperactivity in kids, usually along with vitamin B6. " --------------------------------------------- Clinical indications of magnesium deficiency were associated with the following: ·ADD/ADHD ·Alzheimer's disease ·Anxiety ·Asthma ·Attention deficit disorder ·Autism ·Auto immune disorders- all types ·Cerebral Palsy- in children from magnesium deficient mothers ·Chronic fatigue syndrome ·Chronic pain ·Congestive heart failure ·Constipation ·Crohn's disease ·Depression ·Diabetes mellitus ·Endometriosis ·Fibromyalgia ·Gut disorders- including peptic ulcer, Crohn's disease, colitis, food allergy ·Headaches ·Hyperactivity ·Hypertension ·Hypoglycemia ·Insomnia ·Irritable bowel syndrome ·Menopause ·Migraines ·Multiple sclerosis ·Muscle cramps ·Muscle weakness, fatigue ·Osteoarthritis ·Osteoporosis ·Parkinson's disease ·PMS ·Psoriasis ·Schizophrenia ·Stress ·Systemic lupus erythematosus (SLE) ·Tension ·Ulcerative colitis ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ I am sure you can find some useful infos up here. Cristina-WA Proud mom to 4.9 yo ASD, & 2.1 yo NT twins. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 1, 2001 Report Share Posted October 1, 2001 > Hi > I am going to start my daughter(2 1/2 27lbs) on DMG plus folic and > B12 next week. She has been on it before, but am now trying the > hypoallergenic capsules. I ordered Mg from Kirkman's bc their site > (and the customer serv. rep) said extra Mg could reduce hyperactivity > with the DMG. However,I thought I read somewhere that it is possible > to " overdose " on Mg. I was wondering if anyone out there has any > information on this/has heard the same/has used the Mg with DMG with > success? > Thanks, > Janelle *** Janelle, I add extra folic acid with the DMG+B12+Folic acid. Yes, this means " extra " besides what it is in. The RDA for folic acid is 5000 mg. So you can make your count of how much folic acid your daughter takes through all the other supplements, and then add whatever amount of folic acid to increase, I would say, up to about 4000 mg. That will leave about 1000 mg to " play " with; that is to leave space for the folic acid that may be into foods or anything else. About Magnesium, you are not supposed to take magnesium w/o calcium; so if you take " xx " amount of Mg per day, you have to balamce it with " yy " amount of calcium; does that make sense? Here are the infos I have on that (from previous posts): ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ magnesium oxide is not assimilable and is a laxitive. the following is my expereince and these forms are assimilable. 1. chelated magnesium for migriane 2. magnesium glycinate for general health including enzyme produciton and aluminium chelation. 3. magnesium apsartate for general health. 4. magnesium orotate as a knock down for sleep. Here is a reputable source from a book on nutrition: " Magnesium chelated with amino acids is probably the most absorbable form. Less absorbable forms include magnesium bicarbonate, magnesium oxide, and magnesium carbonate. Magnesium oxide is probably somewhat better than magnesium carbonate (dolomite). The newly available salts of magnesium aspartate or citrate, both known as mineral transporters, have a better percentage of absorption. " http://www.healthy.net/asp/templates/article.asp? PageType=article & ID=2060 Here it points out the Magnesium citrate is a salt with increased absorption, and that magnesium oxide is kind of in the middle (that is how it reads to me). I ran across many supplements with oxide in it although a couple places say it is a popular form because there is a lot of mag by weight. I also read that magnesium citrate is absorbable as stated here, but also is a prime form that causes diarrhea. If you are dealing with constipation, then that is a preferable form. A couple places said that taking it with meals will decrease the chance of diarrhea. What chelate form means: " Magnesium Chelate (Amino Acid): A chemically reacted magnesium ion, bound to 1 or more amino acids, thus allowing the magnesium to enter through the intestinal wall via the amino acid pathway rather than active magnesium diffusion. A true reacted chelate differs from simply mixing the amino acids and minerals which is often referred to as " chelated " . " http://www.nutraceuticals.com/reactedmagnesium.htm I have seen many times that chelated forms of anything are very absorbable and this explains why. Next is a link to a short summary of magnesium and its role in the body: http://www.auravita.com/secure_check.asp? prodpage=http://www.auravita.com/healthnotesonline/ukinet50/Supp/Magne sium.asp An even shorter summary: http://health.yahoo.com/health/Diseases_and_Conditions/Disease_Feed_Da ta/Magnesium_in_diet Recommended Intakes RDAs: 350 mg/day for adult males over age 18 280 mg for females over age 18 320 mg for adult females - pregnant 355 mg for females lactating 0-6 months 340 mg for females lactating 6 months+ 400 mg for males ages 15-18 300 mg for females ages 15-18 270 mg for males ages 11-14 280 mg for females ages 11-14 170 mg for children ages 7-10 120 mg for children ages 4-6 80 mg for children ages 1-3 60 mg for infants ages 0.5-1.0 40 mg for infants ages 0-0.5 These amounts are for healthy people. A person with in an unwell or deficient state would need more. I also found it very interesting to read that one of the primary sources of dietary magnesium is whole grains and cereals. If one goes 100% gluten free, you would be loosing a main source of mag, and could go deficient especially if you are also supplementing with extra calcium to make up for the casein free part. Most places recommend a 2:1 calcium:magnesium ratio for regular function, not including a deficient state. Magnesium deficiency is associated with fibromyalgia, chronic fatigue, migraines, and a bunch of other ailments. Supplementing with mag has helped many of these conditions in clinical studies. I can get references and links for those if anyone is interested. Overall, the chelated magnesium and magnesium glycinate are often refered to as being very absorbable. Most magnesium forms are pretty close and equal in terms of absorption with the following guidelines from the Encyclopedia of Nutritional Supplements. The organic forms of mag with aspartate, malate, glycinate, citrate and succinate (sp) are better absorbed by the body for nutrition. The chelates are very good and absorbable. The inorganic salts such as oxide, chloride, and carbonate are not as well absorbed, with oxide being better of the three. The inorganic salts are much more likely to cause diarrhea than the organinc forms. So, remember if you are taking it for nutrition or to assist in relieving constipation. Most of the supplements have a mixture of mag forms. Nature's Plus had just amino acid chelate. KAL has a magnesium glycinate supplement and a mixed mag supplement. TwinLabs had mag oxide+mag aspartate. And some had as many as 4-5 different types in the mixture. The symptoms of mag deficiency are irritability, tantrums, seizures, insomnia, muscle cramps/twitching, hyperactivity and poor digestion among others. Magnesium is needed for proper electrolyte function, over 300 enzyme functions, and calcium absorbtion. Mag is supposed to help with pain,migraines, chronic fatigue and fibro. The Brainchild Night-Cal supplement contains the following, each 2 Teaspoon Dose of NightCal: Calcium from Kreb's Chelates450 mg Magnesium from Kreb's Chelates50 mg Potasium Alpha Ketoglutarate100 mg Selenium from Selenomethionine100 mcg Vitamin D-3 as Cholecalciferol100 IU The direct link with description is: http://www.brainchildnutritionals.com/Night_Calx.html Also, we saw again and again that there was not a toxicity problem because the body does not store mag as it does calcium. The body excretes what is not used. You upper limit will be when you notice continuous loose stools. I read that excessive amounts of magnesium hinders the uptake of calcium. It doesn't say how much an excessive amount is, though. And if you take magnesium to absorbe calcium, this says that the amino acid lysine IS NEEDED for calcium absorption and magnesium AIDS in calcium absorption. So: Excessive magnesium inhibits calcium and excessive calcium inhibits magnesium - although I didn't see any amount as given as " excessive " for mag. Calcium had the number of 2500 mg/day most likely for an adult - from the Encyclopedia of Nutritions Supplements at the HFS. It is a balancing act. It also says that calcium and magnesium should be taken inbetween meals, on an empty stomach for best absorption. " The many enzyme systems that require magnesium help restore normal energy levels. Because of this function and its nerve and muscle support, magnesium may also be helpful for nervousness, anxiety, insomnia, depression, and muscle cramps. Magnesium is also given as part of a treatment for autism or hyperactivity in kids, usually along with vitamin B6. " --------------------------------------------- Clinical indications of magnesium deficiency were associated with the following: ·ADD/ADHD ·Alzheimer's disease ·Anxiety ·Asthma ·Attention deficit disorder ·Autism ·Auto immune disorders- all types ·Cerebral Palsy- in children from magnesium deficient mothers ·Chronic fatigue syndrome ·Chronic pain ·Congestive heart failure ·Constipation ·Crohn's disease ·Depression ·Diabetes mellitus ·Endometriosis ·Fibromyalgia ·Gut disorders- including peptic ulcer, Crohn's disease, colitis, food allergy ·Headaches ·Hyperactivity ·Hypertension ·Hypoglycemia ·Insomnia ·Irritable bowel syndrome ·Menopause ·Migraines ·Multiple sclerosis ·Muscle cramps ·Muscle weakness, fatigue ·Osteoarthritis ·Osteoporosis ·Parkinson's disease ·PMS ·Psoriasis ·Schizophrenia ·Stress ·Systemic lupus erythematosus (SLE) ·Tension ·Ulcerative colitis ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ I am sure you can find some useful infos up here. Cristina-WA Proud mom to 4.9 yo ASD, & 2.1 yo NT twins. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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