SCD for CD w/constipation?

[Guest guest]

I have atypical Crohn's Disease, with constipation instead of diarrhea. About

three years ago

I tried the SCD diet, but could not stay on it because nuts, meat (except

chicken) and dairy

products all make the constipation worse. Raw fruits and vegetables cause

severe cramping.

I tried eliminating these products, but then I was only able to eat chicken and

certain cooked

vegetables. I lost about 10 pounds in 2 & 1/2 weeks, and I certainly didn't

have 10 pounds

to lose.

I'm wondering if anyone with Crohn's and constipation has been able to make this

diet work

for them, and how they did it.

Thanks,

Chris

[Guest guest]

Welcome to the group

<< I have atypical Crohn's Disease, with constipation instead of

diarrhea. About three years ago

> I tried the SCD diet, but could not stay on it because nuts, meat

(except chicken) and dairy

> products all make the constipation worse. Raw fruits and

vegetables cause severe cramping.

> I tried eliminating these products, but then I was only able to

eat chicken and certain cooked

> vegetables. I lost about 10 pounds in 2 & 1/2 weeks, and I

certainly didn't have 10 pounds

> to lose. >>

How are your symptoms now? DId you see any improvement symptom-wise

when you did the SCD originally?

Weight loss is not uncommon at the onset of the diet. The body is

going through huge changes (switching from fermentative digestion to

human digestion) and those changes require energy. Also, healing

the body requires even more food energy (legal calories). Add onto

this the " wrapping the mind around what can I eat " factor and most

people aren't usually getting enough calories for what they need.

You probably need more veggies, fruits and honey to keep the weight

on especially if you are unable to tolerate the nuts at first. Good

oils like olive oil, sunflower oil , butter will also help.

Having snacks in between meals of foods that you are able to

tolerate will also help keep the weight on until your weight

stabilizes and you are able to tolerate more variety.

At the beginning of the diet many have found that taking a probiotic

supplement and/or yogurt helpful. It helps prevent hardy, nasty

microbes from taking up residence when the easy-to-starve nasties

die off.

Sheila, Feb,. 2001, UC 22yrs

mom of and

[Guest guest]

Thanks for your reply. No, I did not notice symptom improvement the

first time I was on the diet. The constipation, in particular,

worsened. I suspect I have a candida problem in addition to Crohn's

Disease, because I don't tolerate fruit unless I eat it blended first

thing in the morning in a smoothie. I can have small amounts of

honey, but nothing the amounts in the muffins and other SCD baked

goods. That's why I had such trouble with this diet... I can't

digest meat (other than chicken) and nuts, fruit and dairy cause gas

and bloating, and many high fiber and sulfurous vegetables (leafy

greens, broccoli, cauliflower, cabbage, onion, etc) cause cramping

and pain.

So what's left to eat for a guy whose normal weight is 185 and who

currently weighs 170? I need about 2500 calories just to maintain my

current weight... a meal of chicken and zucchini is about 300

calories. Would have to eat 8 of those meals in a day to prevent

further weight loss! So this is my dilemma. Perhaps the SCD is not

right for me.

Chris

[Guest guest]

Ripe avocado would be an excellent food to try.... pretty gentle on the

digestion and full of healthy fat and calories. Did you try avocado while on

SCD?

There are constipation remedies we can suggest that are legal with SCD.....

and some ideas for battling yeast, if you want to investigate that. Let us

know.

All those cabbage family foods are generally considered " advanced " as they are

not well tolerated until much healing has happened.

Patti

Re: SCD for CD w/constipation?

Thanks for your reply. No, I did not notice symptom improvement the

first time I was on the diet. The constipation, in particular,

worsened. I suspect I have a candida problem in addition to Crohn's

Disease, because I don't tolerate fruit unless I eat it blended first

thing in the morning in a smoothie. I can have small amounts of

honey, but nothing the amounts in the muffins and other SCD baked

goods. That's why I had such trouble with this diet... I can't

digest meat (other than chicken) and nuts, fruit and dairy cause gas

and bloating, and many high fiber and sulfurous vegetables (leafy

greens, broccoli, cauliflower, cabbage, onion, etc) cause cramping

and pain.

So what's left to eat for a guy whose normal weight is 185 and who

currently weighs 170? I need about 2500 calories just to maintain my

current weight... a meal of chicken and zucchini is about 300

calories. Would have to eat 8 of those meals in a day to prevent

further weight loss! So this is my dilemma. Perhaps the SCD is not

right for me.

Chris

[Guest guest]

Hi

I tend toward constipation too. One thing that keeps me going is juicing

vegetables. I juice spinach, celery and an apple and drink it. i get lots

of nutrients and it cleans me out too. I also use enemas that I make myself

I just bought a bag. Lemon water is good. The diet is helping me get

better though. When I notice something I eat that makes me constipated, I

take it out of the diet for now. I also drink a TON of water.

Hope this helps,

-- [Norton AntiSpam] SCD for CD w/constipation?

I have atypical Crohn's Disease, with constipation instead of diarrhea.

About three years ago

I tried the SCD diet, but could not stay on it because nuts, meat (except

chicken) and dairy

products all make the constipation worse. Raw fruits and vegetables cause

severe cramping.

I tried eliminating these products, but then I was only able to eat chicken

and certain cooked

vegetables. I lost about 10 pounds in 2 & 1/2 weeks, and I certainly didn't

have 10 pounds

to lose.

I'm wondering if anyone with Crohn's and constipation has been able to make

this diet work

for them, and how they did it.

Thanks,

Chris

[Guest guest]

Dear and Chris:

The website has an electrolyte recipe that really helps with constipation. It

seems to help me get my muscle working better. Don't know why but it really

helps. Eileen Brown

Severe constipation my whole life UC SCD12/04

[Guest guest]

Hi

<< Thanks for your reply. No, I did not notice symptom improvement

the first time I was on the diet. The constipation, in particular,

> worsened. I suspect I have a candida problem in addition to

Crohn's Disease, because I don't tolerate fruit unless I eat it

blended first thing in the morning in a smoothie. >>

It is not uncommon to have constipation problems with yeast

overgrowth.

> I can have small amounts of

> honey, but nothing the amounts in the muffins and other SCD baked

> goods. That's why I had such trouble with this diet...

Do you have any other symptoms of yeast: thrush (white spots in

mouth/white coating on tongue), itchy anus, " rolling " gas in the

intestines, cravings for sweet foods (legal or illegal cravings).

You may find the file " Yeast and SCD " helpful. It is located at

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/pecanbread/files/

<< I can't digest meat (other than chicken) and nuts, fruit and dairy

cause gas and bloating, and many high fiber and sulfurous vegetables

(leafy greens, broccoli, cauliflower, cabbage, onion, etc) cause

cramping and pain. >>

Many of these are what we call 'advanced foods' - that are known to

cause GI problems if you aren't healed sufficiently to digest them.

If you eat any food you aren't ready for you'll likely experience

diarrhea/constipation, gas etc..

Constipation may be caused by the yeast fermenting the food you are

unable to digest. As the yeast go through their life cycle since you

aren't able to digest the foods they multiply more than they should

and you end up with yeast overgrowth. Their metabolites, (by-

products) irritate the GI tract and you end up with constipation. I

went through this about a year and a half ago (ended up in the ER

with a blockage). If you stick with foods that your body can digest

and starve out the harmful bacteria and yeast to acheive a better

balance of good microflora you'll likely alleviate your

constipation. At the beginning you'll have to stick to easy to

digest foods. This means peeled and cooked vegetables and fruits,

along with whichever meats you are able to digest. As you heal you

slowly add in more complex foods. It is pretty important to go slow

enough that you'll be able to determine if you aren't ready yet for a

specific food. You'll find more info on this/ and constipation:

http://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.info/

Go to the " Knowledge Base " and then to

1. " Constipation " and

2. " Constipation continued "

Did you start with the intro and then gradually add foods in?

If not that may help. It will give you a baseline to " jump off "

from. The intro is in BTVC (p69, 10th edition), also at

http://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.info/beginners_guide/the_intro_diet

2.htm

a dairy free version at http://pecanbread.com/foodprep.html#intro

You'd probably only need 2-3 days on the intro since you suffer with

constipation.

After the intro and you are ready to add more complex foods you may

find this chart helpful:

http://pecanbread.com/foodprep.html#beyond

> So what's left to eat for a guy whose normal weight is 185 and who

> currently weighs 170? I need about 2500 calories just to maintain

my

> current weight... a meal of chicken and zucchini is about 300

> calories. Would have to eat 8 of those meals in a day to prevent

> further weight loss! So this is my dilemma. Perhaps the SCD is

not

> right for me.

I was recently in your shoes 15 pounds underweight. It took a while

to stabilize my symptoms and the weight loss before I started to put

the weight back on. I had to redo the intro and when the bowels

finally settled down I added in good oils, lots of food (whatever I

tolerated) between meals and then I slowly re-introduced yogurt made

from 10%mf cream. It's taken about 1 month to put 10-12 of the

pounds back on.

Sheila, SCD Feb, UC 22yrs

mom of and

[Guest guest]

Hi again

I just remembered something. I was going to ask what kind of meats do you have

trouble with - ground meats, beef, turkey, duck lamb, organic/storebought,

roasts, steaks, eggs, free range chciken eggs etc..

Sheila, SCD Feb, UC 22yrs

mom of and

[Guest guest]

Hi Sheila,

I really appreciate your continued efforts!

> Do you have any other symptoms of yeast: thrush (white spots in

> mouth/white coating on tongue), itchy anus, " rolling " gas in the

> intestines, cravings for sweet foods (legal or illegal cravings).

> You may find the file " Yeast and SCD " helpful. It is located at

> http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/pecanbread/files/

I have every single one of these symptoms. Especially a very thick white

coating on my

tongue and " rolling " gas in the intestines (never heard that description but it

fits perfectly).

I also have toenail fungus on every toe on my left foot (started when I cut my

toe on a

tropical reef seven years ago but has worsened considerably lately).

> At the beginning you'll have to stick to easy to

> digest foods. This means peeled and cooked vegetables and fruits,

> along with whichever meats you are able to digest. As you heal you

> slowly add in more complex foods. It is pretty important to go slow

> enough that you'll be able to determine if you aren't ready yet for a

> specific food.

Hmmm... it was my impression that fruit sugar feeds the yeast. In any event, I

don't think

I can tolerate much fruit at this point. It causes terrible gas and bloating,

especially if I eat

it later in the day after I've consumed protein. One or two pieces first thing

in the morning

seems okay, but beyond that it causes problems.

> Did you start with the intro and then gradually add foods in?

> If not that may help. It will give you a baseline to " jump off "

> from. The intro is in BTVC (p69, 10th edition), also at

> http://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.info/beginners_guide/the_intro_diet

> 2.htm

I did start with the intro foods, but I was including dairy in that.

> a dairy free version at http://pecanbread.com/foodprep.html#intro

> You'd probably only need 2-3 days on the intro since you suffer with

> constipation.

Intuitively this sounds like a much better choice.

> I was recently in your shoes 15 pounds underweight. It took a while

> to stabilize my symptoms and the weight loss before I started to put

> the weight back on. I had to redo the intro and when the bowels

> finally settled down I added in good oils, lots of food (whatever I

> tolerated) between meals and then I slowly re-introduced yogurt made

> from 10%mf cream. It's taken about 1 month to put 10-12 of the

> pounds back on.

I guess I'm just going to have to tolerate more weight loss until I can get my

gut

functioning properly, and then slowly gain the weight back. Actually, you've

gained weight

quite rapidly which is inspiring.

> I just remembered something. I was going to ask what kind of meats do you

have

> trouble with - ground meats, beef, turkey, duck lamb, organic/storebought,

roasts,

> steaks, eggs, free range chciken eggs etc..

Chicken and fish are best, but I'm concerned about mercury with too much fish.

Turkey is

sometimes okay, sometimes not. Lean ground beef is a gamble, but sometimes I

can

digest it. Steaks, lamb chops and any meats like that which aren't ground are

the worst.

Eggs I'm not sure about. I once had an ELISA food allergy test and the only

food I had a

" medium " sensitivity to was egg whites. I only buy free-range, organic meats

and eggs

(and organic produce too).

Thanks again for all of your help.

Chris

[Guest guest]

Hi

<< Hmmm... it was my impression that fruit sugar feeds the yeast. In

any event, I don't think

> I can tolerate much fruit at this point. It causes terrible gas

and bloating, especially if I eat

> it later in the day after I've consumed protein. One or two pieces

first thing in the morning

> seems okay, but beyond that it causes problems. >>

The peeled cooked fruits on the SCD are easier to digest. But if you

have substanial yeast overgrowth you may have to limit the amounts

of the fruit you eat. When my yeast was severe I was unable to

tolerate any fruit. As the yeast symptoms improved using the " one-

two punch " of enzymes and antifungals combined with SCD, I started

with a tsp of ripe banana (yellow with lots of spots/freckles) and

worked up from there. I tried homemade applesauce but I just didn'

toloerate it. Everyone is a a bit different on what works for them

but peeling and cooking the fruit is essential for maximum

digestibility. And if you can't digest it your yeast will be happy to

digest it. (Ripe banana and avocado are the exceptions - they do not

need to be cooked.)

<< I did start with the intro foods, but I was including dairy in

that. >>

What dairy were you using? HAve you been using yogurt? If yes,

which yogurt starter are you using?

<< I guess I'm just going to have to tolerate more weight loss until

I can get my gut

> functioning properly, and then slowly gain the weight back.

Actually, you've gained weight

> quite rapidly which is inspiring. >>

I am a dedicated eater. LOL! Once I started feeling better my

appetite came back with a vengeance. For the first while I wasn't

doing much _ I was too tired from being sick so I didn't burn a lot

of the calories that I ate and managed to add the majority back

then. The last week or so I am super busy playing catch up with

everything that I have lost a pound or two with all the activity, so

the weight still does fluctuate. I've added a good cod liver oil,

eat canned wild salmon, homemade mayo (made with sunflower oil and

two free range eggs) and the yogurt. These have been my staples to

hget the weight back on.

<< > > I just remembered something. I was going to ask what kind of

meats do you have

> > trouble with - ground meats, beef, turkey, duck lamb,

organic/storebought, roasts,

> > steaks, eggs, free range chciken eggs etc..

>

> Chicken and fish are best, but I'm concerned about mercury with too

much fish. >>

I stick to the smaller fish to avoid the mercury and other nasties.

I eat salmon and sardines because they have good fat and have lots of

good omega 3's (anti-inflammatory properties). I also need the fish

for treating my Poly cystic Ovarian disease (PCOD). Not something

you need to worry about though.

<< Turkey is sometimes okay, sometimes not. Lean ground beef is a

gamble, but sometimes I can digest it. Steaks, lamb chops and any

meats like that which aren't ground are the worst.

> Eggs I'm not sure about. I once had an ELISA food allergy test and

the only food I had a " medium " sensitivity to was egg whites. I

only buy free-range, organic meats and eggs (and organic produce too).

Steaks, roast, chops also bothered me. I've since learned that the

reason is likely the level of arachidonic acid (A.a.)present in tose

cuts of meat. Regular storebought meats have a very high level of

A.a., while organic meats have a much lower level. Grilled ground

meats will have a higher level of omega 3's than these other meats

which will help combat the inflammation response of the Arachidonic

acid. Grilling also reduces the amount of arachidonic acid in meats

Here is a technique some use that allows them to tolerate the various

cuts of meat:

Place meat in a large resealable ( " zipper bag) plastic bag along with

1 cup SCD legal red wine and 1 cup of good oil (olive oil is a good

one to use, I like EVO for the flavour it gives the meat.) Marinate

for 24 hours in the refrigerator. You can flip it a couple of times

while marinating to ensure all the meat is treated. After the 24

hours, remove the meat and discard the marinade. The marinade will

contain the arachidonic acid that has been pulled out of the meat.

You can then proceed with cooking the meat. It works on stew meat,

roasts steaks etc. I don't know if this will work for you but it may

be something to try when you are doing better. If you doo try it

only try a small amount of the meat the first time.

Sheila, SCD Feb. 2001, UC 23 yrs

mom of and