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Dennis,

Strange you should mention tonsils . . . but my sister and I both started

putting on weight after we had ours removed at ages 4 and 5. And I've never

heard anyone until now mention a tie with tonsils and weight gain. NOT a

coincidence I believe. Anyone else have a similar experience?

Rev. Pam

Open RNY 12/11/02

318.5/184

Re: Laugh if you will

> I was normal till I had my tonsils removed at about the age of five. Then

I

> started gaining weight. My mother said I was eating so much my father said

> " maybe we should have had only one tonsil removed " . Well I have been fat

> till my surgery in Oct. 2000. Of course I have lost a few times with

Weight

> Watchers and two with the Optifast diet. I lost 150 pounds then gained

back

> ten and have stabilized since then. It is extremely hard for me to see

> myself as thin, especially standing in front of the mirror in the morning.

I

> look at pictures of the old me then look at the new me and do not really

see

> much difference. Being huge all my life it is hard to fathom the fact that

I

> am relatively thin, I just don't see it. As for weight issues they did not

> bother me when I was losing as I would gain a little every week but then

> loose it and more and this was while weighing myself every day.

> > Do guys do this? Don didn't really go through it. He was kinda lanky

> > til he was 40, went directly to morbid without even pausing at pudgy,

> > which is his family history. Happy birthday, 40, be huge. He never

> > related to large. So, whether he is at 175 or 190, he doesn't

> > particularly care. His whole self is not wrapped up in weight issues

> > at all.

> >

>

>

> Homepage: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Graduate-OSSG

>

> Unsubscribe: mailto:Graduate-OSSG-unsubscribe

>

>

>

>

>

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I have another man mention it to me, also the registered dietician that

headed up the Optifast program said that she had run across this before. Any

body else out there with this experience.

Re: Laugh if you will

>

>

> > I was normal till I had my tonsils removed at about the age of five.

Then

> I

> > started gaining weight. My mother said I was eating so much my father

said

> > " maybe we should have had only one tonsil removed " . Well I have been fat

> > till my surgery in Oct. 2000. Of course I have lost a few times with

> Weight

> > Watchers and two with the Optifast diet. I lost 150 pounds then gained

> back

> > ten and have stabilized since then. It is extremely hard for me to see

> > myself as thin, especially standing in front of the mirror in the

morning.

> I

> > look at pictures of the old me then look at the new me and do not really

> see

> > much difference. Being huge all my life it is hard to fathom the fact

that

> I

> > am relatively thin, I just don't see it. As for weight issues they did

not

> > bother me when I was losing as I would gain a little every week but then

> > loose it and more and this was while weighing myself every day.

> > > Do guys do this? Don didn't really go through it. He was kinda lanky

> > > til he was 40, went directly to morbid without even pausing at pudgy,

> > > which is his family history. Happy birthday, 40, be huge. He never

> > > related to large. So, whether he is at 175 or 190, he doesn't

> > > particularly care. His whole self is not wrapped up in weight issues

> > > at all.

> > >

> >

> >

> > Homepage: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Graduate-OSSG

> >

> > Unsubscribe: mailto:Graduate-OSSG-unsubscribe

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

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Mine was not tonsils (had mine out at 2). I had an extreme kidney

infection at the age of 5 and they did not get it under control

until I was 6. Started school soon after reaching 6 and started to

blossom! My Dad has always thought that it had something to do with

my wt gain. Don't know...my sons started to gain wt when they got

into school too. I think that we were just so active that sitting

in a classroom didn't allow us to burn the calories we were used to

burning. Also, the added stress of changing from a home life to a

school life may have made us eat for emotional reasons. Guess I

will never know.

Reba

***********************

> > Dennis,

> >

> > Strange you should mention tonsils . . . but my sister and I

both started

> > putting on weight after we had ours removed at ages 4 and 5.

And I've

> never

> > heard anyone until now mention a tie with tonsils and weight

gain. NOT a

> > coincidence I believe. Anyone else have a similar experience?

> >

> > Rev. Pam

> > Open RNY 12/11/02

> > 318.5/184

> > Re: Laugh if you will

> >

> >

> > > I was normal till I had my tonsils removed at about the age of

five.

> Then

> > I

> > > started gaining weight. My mother said I was eating so much my

father

> said

> > > " maybe we should have had only one tonsil removed " . Well I

have been fat

> > > till my surgery in Oct. 2000. Of course I have lost a few

times with

> > Weight

> > > Watchers and two with the Optifast diet. I lost 150 pounds

then gained

> > back

> > > ten and have stabilized since then. It is extremely hard for

me to see

> > > myself as thin, especially standing in front of the mirror in

the

> morning.

> > I

> > > look at pictures of the old me then look at the new me and do

not really

> > see

> > > much difference. Being huge all my life it is hard to fathom

the fact

> that

> > I

> > > am relatively thin, I just don't see it. As for weight issues

they did

> not

> > > bother me when I was losing as I would gain a little every

week but then

> > > loose it and more and this was while weighing myself every day.

> > > > Do guys do this? Don didn't really go through it. He was

kinda lanky

> > > > til he was 40, went directly to morbid without even pausing

at pudgy,

> > > > which is his family history. Happy birthday, 40, be huge.

He never

> > > > related to large. So, whether he is at 175 or 190, he

doesn't

> > > > particularly care. His whole self is not wrapped up in

weight issues

> > > > at all.

> > > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Homepage: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Graduate-OSSG

> > >

> > > Unsubscribe: mailto:Graduate-OSSG-unsubscribe

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

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Actually, I went from a very skinny poor eater at age 6 or 7, to a chubby kid

right after having my tonsils removed. I always thought it had to do with

the fact that I " discovered " ice cream post-tonsilectomy, which I was given to

soothe my throbbing raw throat. Wouldn't eat it before. Wouldn't eat most

things. Seemed that after the tonsils got pulled, I was not a fussy picky

eater anymore.

Lucille

In a message dated 12/12/2003 8:37:34 AM Eastern Standard Time,

Graduate-OSSG writes:

>

> I have another man mention it to me, also the registered dietician that

> headed up the Optifast program said that she had run across this before. Any

> body else out there with this experience.

> Re: Tonsils

>

>

> > Dennis,

> >

> > Strange you should mention tonsils . . . but my sister and I both started

> > putting on weight after we had ours removed at ages 4 and 5. And I've

> never

> > heard anyone until now mention a tie with tonsils and weight gain. NOT a

> > coincidence I believe. Anyone else have a similar experience?

> >

> > Rev. Pam

>

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re: gaining weight after a tonsillectomy...

.... actually, when I think about this it makes sense! I worked in an ENT

office for many years and saw lots of kids with big, bad tonsils.

Almost universally, two things were true when their tonsils were really bad.

It was not easy for them to swallow, and they had sleep issues like snoring

because of the occlusion that enlarged tonsils cause on an airway.

They worked harder to breathe.. ie: used more calories.

Enlarged tonsils make it more difficult to swallow, which really precludes

eating just to eat.

After a tonsillectomy, less calories are probably burned just simply because

the airway is improved.. AND food goes down easier, making it easier to get

more calories IN.

Then, add on top of that someone who is prone to eating problems anyway..

and they start to " make up for lost time " .

Never thought about it before.. but it makes sense to me.

The converse is also true, and this I HAD intellectualized before...

Kids also can become MORE active after a tonsillectomy if that is their

personality type.. and actually lose weight rather than gain because it is

easier for them to breathe... therefore athletics are more possible, as is

increased activity of all kinds.

Go figure.. It works both ways.

deb

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Actually, haven't studies shown that sleep deprivation is one of the factors

in weight *gain*? That snorers, and those with apnea are more prone to

weight gain than weight loss.

---

365/194/160

Lap RnY, Distal - Dr. s

Vanderbilt University Hospital

Surgery date June 3, 2002

----- Original Message -----

>they had sleep issues like snoring

> because of the occlusion that enlarged tonsils cause on an airway.

>

> They worked harder to breathe.. ie: used more calories.

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Hmmm - interesting. That is when I began to gain weight too. Amber/FL

Re: Tonsils

I have another man mention it to me, also the registered dietician that

headed up the Optifast program said that she had run across this before.

Any body else out there with this experience.

Re: Laugh if you will

>

>

> > I was normal till I had my tonsils removed at about the age of five.

Then

> I

> > started gaining weight. My mother said I was eating so much my

> > father

said

> > " maybe we should have had only one tonsil removed " . Well I have been

> > fat till my surgery in Oct. 2000. Of course I have lost a few times

> > with

> Weight

> > Watchers and two with the Optifast diet. I lost 150 pounds then

> > gained

> back

> > ten and have stabilized since then. It is extremely hard for me to

> > see myself as thin, especially standing in front of the mirror in

> > the

morning.

> I

> > look at pictures of the old me then look at the new me and do not

> > really

> see

> > much difference. Being huge all my life it is hard to fathom the

> > fact

that

> I

> > am relatively thin, I just don't see it. As for weight issues they

> > did

not

> > bother me when I was losing as I would gain a little every week but

> > then loose it and more and this was while weighing myself every day.

> > > Do guys do this? Don didn't really go through it. He was kinda

> > > lanky til he was 40, went directly to morbid without even pausing

> > > at pudgy, which is his family history. Happy birthday, 40, be

> > > huge. He never related to large. So, whether he is at 175 or

> > > 190, he doesn't particularly care. His whole self is not wrapped

> > > up in weight issues at all.

> > >

> >

> >

> > Homepage: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Graduate-OSSG

> >

> > Unsubscribe: mailto:Graduate-OSSG-unsubscribe

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

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I was a skinny sickly child, had my tonsils out when I was 5 years old, but

it wasn't until 3rd grade that I remember thinking that my knees looked

funny, then 5th grade when I wasn't bone skinny any more. But I developed

anorexia when I was 15, 5f 6i and I weighed under 100 pounds. Was anorexic

for quite some time, into my late 20's then I just became a binger and

starver without ever being really thin. What is very interesting to me, is

that I have never been able to go on a " diet " without ending up starving

myself, we are talking 3 days or up to 4 weeks without food. There is

something emotionally in me that changed with this surgery and it stopped

this feeling that I've had for most of my life. ... hmm hope that was too

much info. LOL

Joanie

Re: Tonsils

>

>

> > Dennis,

> >

> > Strange you should mention tonsils . . . but my sister and I both

> > started putting on weight after we had ours removed at ages 4 and 5.

> > And I've

> never

> > heard anyone until now mention a tie with tonsils and weight gain.

> > NOT a coincidence I believe. Anyone else have a similar experience?

> >

> > Rev. Pam

> > Open RNY 12/11/02

> > 318.5/184

> > ----- Original Message -----

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Hal,

Ohhhh, I feel bad for little Hal. Those days were awful; when they

didn't let parents stay 24 hours a day with thier children. That was

so hard for the young children. Thank goodness, those days are gone!

Gale

> Having my tonsils out at age four years was traumatic! I truly

believe

> it is why I lost most of my hair by age sixty, got wrinkles, and

can no

> longer run a four minute mile. I was taken to the local hospital by

my

> mother, who left me there in the children's ward (boys only, of

course)

> where I tearfully thought she was deserting me. When the nurse

left the

> ward, I went to the locker next to my bed, put on my clothes, and

walked

> out of the front door of the hospital (I was so tiny, no one

noticed)

> heading towards my aunt and uncle's home which was a few blocks

away.

> My aunt made the best chocolate cake in the world. Unfortunately, my

> break for freedom was short lived.an attendant ran after me, picked

me

> up and carried me back to the ward. My clothes were taken away

from me,

> and I was left totally embarrassed in a flimsy gown. The next

things I

> can recall is counting backwards from ten, and getting a lot of

chicken

> broth and sherbet for the next several days. I still like lime.

Hal

>

>

>

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Hal, you must have been quite the character!

Tonsils

Having my tonsils out at age four years was traumatic! I truly believe

it is why I lost most of my hair by age sixty, got wrinkles, and can no

longer run a four minute mile. I was taken to the local hospital by my

mother, who left me there in the children's ward (boys only, of course)

where I tearfully thought she was deserting me. When the nurse left the

ward, I went to the locker next to my bed, put on my clothes, and walked

out of the front door of the hospital (I was so tiny, no one noticed)

heading towards my aunt and uncle's home which was a few blocks away.

My aunt made the best chocolate cake in the world. Unfortunately, my

break for freedom was short lived.an attendant ran after me, picked me

up and carried me back to the ward. My clothes were taken away from me,

and I was left totally embarrassed in a flimsy gown. The next things I

can recall is counting backwards from ten, and getting a lot of chicken

broth and sherbet for the next several days. I still like lime. Hal

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Hal, that's terrible!I'm so sorry to hear that experience was so

traumatic for you that you still remember so vividly all these years

later, it must have been so scary.We try so hard to do whats best

for our children, sometimes even with the best of intentions we pave

the way for years of hurt.I'm so thankful we can stay with our

children now, our physical as well as emotional support is such an

important part of their overall well-being.Thankyou for sharing your

thoughts with us!

Patty, mom to Tyler 8 wcf and 2wocf

> Having my tonsils out at age four years was traumatic! I truly

believe

> it is why I lost most of my hair by age sixty, got wrinkles, and

can no

> longer run a four minute mile. I was taken to the local hospital

by my

> mother, who left me there in the children's ward (boys only, of

course)

> where I tearfully thought she was deserting me. When the nurse

left the

> ward, I went to the locker next to my bed, put on my clothes, and

walked

> out of the front door of the hospital (I was so tiny, no one

noticed)

> heading towards my aunt and uncle's home which was a few blocks

away.

> My aunt made the best chocolate cake in the world. Unfortunately,

my

> break for freedom was short lived.an attendant ran after me,

picked me

> up and carried me back to the ward. My clothes were taken away

from me,

> and I was left totally embarrassed in a flimsy gown. The next

things I

> can recall is counting backwards from ten, and getting a lot of

chicken

> broth and sherbet for the next several days. I still like lime.

Hal

>

>

>

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Deborah, and neither he nor I has an ounce of a sense of humor!

Love to all at cfparents,

n

Tonsils

Having my tonsils out at age four years was traumatic! I truly believe

it is why I lost most of my hair by age sixty, got wrinkles, and can no

longer run a four minute mile. I was taken to the local hospital by my

mother, who left me there in the children's ward (boys only, of course)

where I tearfully thought she was deserting me. When the nurse left the

ward, I went to the locker next to my bed, put on my clothes, and walked

out of the front door of the hospital (I was so tiny, no one noticed)

heading towards my aunt and uncle's home which was a few blocks away.

My aunt made the best chocolate cake in the world. Unfortunately, my

break for freedom was short lived.an attendant ran after me, picked me

up and carried me back to the ward. My clothes were taken away from me,

and I was left totally embarrassed in a flimsy gown. The next things I

can recall is counting backwards from ten, and getting a lot of chicken

broth and sherbet for the next several days. I still like lime. Hal

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  • 2 years later...

,

Max had to have his tonsils removed because he kept getting colds,

strep, and had asthma. Dr. Harbison suggested it because removal was

supposed to help stop the infections. And it did, for the most part.

The hospital stay is usually a couple of days for our kids. They need

to be admitted the night before to keep up their blood sugar while

fasting. The surgery is done fairly quickly and then there is the

recovery. Kids without RSS do this as an outpatient, but our kids

need more time. You will have to restart Maddison slowly on her g-

tube feeds and gradually increase them until she can tolerate the full

strength, regular rate. I don't know how long that will take.

Because she has the g-tube, you won't have to stay until she is eating

by mouth.

One word of caution: the ENT may suggest that you have the adenoids

removed, too. Be careful with this. Our kids have weakened soft

palates and removal of the adenoids will take away the little support

they have. It is better to kind of reform them, taking out anything

that is an excess instead of complete removal. When Max had even this

done, he spoke with lots of nasal emissions for a long time. The

speech therapist had to work long and hard to correct that.

Jodi Z

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  • 6 months later...

Many of Kirkman's products are for children. We use their " Every Day

Multivitamin " which is scd legal. We also use their L. acidopholus

probiotic which is legal, too. Great that he's now growing like a weed.

Meleah scd 05/06

iel 3yrs., asd, Ethan 5yrs., Mark 1yr.

Tonsils

>I read some of the other posts about children having tonsilactomy.

> I have been trying to avoid it but we are having surgery this tuesday

> on my 4 year old who has obstructive sleep apnea and just started

> having normal bm thanks to scd. He was dgn with celiac. I am

> wondering if anyone knows if the freeda scd legal vitamins are for

> children it does not say on web site. but I think the capsules are

> adult dosage. And if anyone knows another company for kids multis. i

> am thinking about doing the pea protien from kirkman if SCD legal to

> help keep his weight going up and make sure he gets everything he

> needs after tonsils are out. The doctor said first week willbe rough.

> has gained 2lbs so far but weight slipped after he grew an

> inch:) this last month. He is 8 lbs below normal kids his age . -Due

> to celiac and being on antibiotics 1/2 his life. We just now know

> that we have been feeding yeast not our child.

>

> Any thoughts on all this would be helpful.

>

>

> adhd scd 3 1/2 months (5 yrsold)

> celiac 2 months (4 yrsold)

> Nate no dgn scd 2 months (15 months)

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> For information on the Specific Carbohydrate Diet, please read the book

> _Breaking the Vicious Cycle_ by Elaine Gottschall and read the following

> websites:

> http://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.info

> and

> http://www.pecanbread.com

>

>

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You can use the Freeda vitamins... if you calculate your child's dose based on

his weight. Adult dosages are based on a 150 lb adult weight, so just cut the

tablet down accordingly. I have done that with my daughter. The Kirkman vites

are a good option, though, too.... and no guesswork on the dosing, or cutting

tablets.

Pea protein is not SCD legal, however. If you're concerned about keeping his

weight up, I would do smoothies with a coconut milk (homemade, of course)

base.... and maybe try to sneak some avacado in with other fruits like ripe

banana or peaches.

I know one child who accepted " green smoothies " when his mom started calling

them " Incredible Hulk Shakes " .... she was even able to add a little bit of

pureed green beans and squash to these shakes.

Patti

Tonsils

I read some of the other posts about children having tonsilactomy.

I have been trying to avoid it but we are having surgery this tuesday

on my 4 year old who has obstructive sleep apnea and just started

having normal bm thanks to scd. He was dgn with celiac. I am

wondering if anyone knows if the freeda scd legal vitamins are for

children it does not say on web site. but I think the capsules are

adult dosage. And if anyone knows another company for kids multis. i

am thinking about doing the pea protien from kirkman if SCD legal to

help keep his weight going up and make sure he gets everything he

needs after tonsils are out. The doctor said first week willbe rough.

has gained 2lbs so far but weight slipped after he grew an

inch:) this last month. He is 8 lbs below normal kids his age . -Due

to celiac and being on antibiotics 1/2 his life. We just now know

that we have been feeding yeast not our child.

Any thoughts on all this would be helpful.

adhd scd 3 1/2 months (5 yrsold)

celiac 2 months (4 yrsold)

Nate no dgn scd 2 months (15 months)

Recent Activity

a.. 24New Members

Visit Your Group

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-Thanks we can not do coconut milk but the other ideas were great.

I also tried yogurt today no gastro symptoms but alot of conjestion

through nasal. He always got ear infections on milk prior. HE also

took a drink of goats milk. Could be from that??

-- In pecanbread , " Patti " wrote:

>

> You can use the Freeda vitamins... if you calculate your child's

dose based on his weight. Adult dosages are based on a 150 lb adult

weight, so just cut the tablet down accordingly. I have done that

with my daughter. The Kirkman vites are a good option, though,

too.... and no guesswork on the dosing, or cutting tablets.

>

> Pea protein is not SCD legal, however. If you're concerned about

keeping his weight up, I would do smoothies with a coconut milk

(homemade, of course) base.... and maybe try to sneak some avacado in

with other fruits like ripe banana or peaches.

>

> I know one child who accepted " green smoothies " when his mom

started calling them " Incredible Hulk Shakes " .... she was even able

to add a little bit of pureed green beans and squash to these shakes.

>

> Patti

> Tonsils

>

>

> I read some of the other posts about children having tonsilactomy.

> I have been trying to avoid it but we are having surgery this

tuesday

> on my 4 year old who has obstructive sleep apnea and just started

> having normal bm thanks to scd. He was dgn with celiac. I am

> wondering if anyone knows if the freeda scd legal vitamins are

for

> children it does not say on web site. but I think the capsules

are

> adult dosage. And if anyone knows another company for kids

multis. i

> am thinking about doing the pea protien from kirkman if SCD legal

to

> help keep his weight going up and make sure he gets everything he

> needs after tonsils are out. The doctor said first week willbe

rough.

> has gained 2lbs so far but weight slipped after he grew an

> inch:) this last month. He is 8 lbs below normal kids his age . -

Due

> to celiac and being on antibiotics 1/2 his life. We just now know

> that we have been feeding yeast not our child.

>

> Any thoughts on all this would be helpful.

>

>

> adhd scd 3 1/2 months (5 yrsold)

> celiac 2 months (4 yrsold)

> Nate no dgn scd 2 months (15 months)

> Recent Activity

> a.. 24New Members

> Visit Your Group

>

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<<I also tried yogurt today no gastro symptoms but alot of conjestion

through nasal. He always got ear infections on milk prior. HE also

took a drink of goats milk. Could be from that?? >>

Hmmmm... well, it *could* be from the drink of regular milk, and not from the

yogurt itself. Impossible to know. Yogurt can trigger further die-off when it's

introduced... so a bit of stuffiness *could* possibly be an effect of that. All

I can say is that you need to make sure he doesn't have access to drinking the

unfermented milk in the future.... then try the yogurt again and see if you get

the other symptoms.

Was it goat milk dairy that used to cause his ear infections? Or cow?

You might want to try some other nut milk base for the smoothies if you can't do

coconut.... but just banana and other fruits, avacado and the other things I

mentioned can be done without the base. Try freezing chunks of cooked peach,

pear and banana... then whir them up in the blender with just a bit of water.

Patti

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--- No it was regular cows milk that gave him ear infections. It is

so hard to keep the fridge under lock and key. The fruit smoothies

are going to work great Thanks!!

When you say try other nut base milk -do you mean doing the make your

own almond milk I have not tried it yet.

In pecanbread , " Patti " wrote:

>

> <<I also tried yogurt today no gastro symptoms but alot of

conjestion

> through nasal. He always got ear infections on milk prior. HE also

> took a drink of goats milk. Could be from that?? >>

>

> Hmmmm... well, it *could* be from the drink of regular milk, and

not from the yogurt itself. Impossible to know. Yogurt can trigger

further die-off when it's introduced... so a bit of stuffiness

*could* possibly be an effect of that. All I can say is that you need

to make sure he doesn't have access to drinking the unfermented milk

in the future.... then try the yogurt again and see if you get the

other symptoms.

>

> Was it goat milk dairy that used to cause his ear infections? Or

cow?

>

> You might want to try some other nut milk base for the smoothies if

you can't do coconut.... but just banana and other fruits, avacado

and the other things I mentioned can be done without the base. Try

freezing chunks of cooked peach, pear and banana... then whir them up

in the blender with just a bit of water.

>

>

> Patti

>

>

>

>

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You can get a frig lock from

www.onestepahead.com

I think you can also buy them from places like Babies R Us, but I ordered my

from One Step Ahead. We did actually have to keep our frig and freezer

under lock when we switched to scd. It's just a simple child lock for the

frig. They run about $5 a piece.

Meleah

Re: Tonsils

> --- No it was regular cows milk that gave him ear infections. It is

> so hard to keep the fridge under lock and key. The fruit smoothies

> are going to work great Thanks!!

>

> When you say try other nut base milk -do you mean doing the make your

> own almond milk I have not tried it yet.

>

>

>

>

>

> In pecanbread , " Patti " wrote:

>>

>> <<I also tried yogurt today no gastro symptoms but alot of

> conjestion

>> through nasal. He always got ear infections on milk prior. HE also

>> took a drink of goats milk. Could be from that?? >>

>>

>> Hmmmm... well, it *could* be from the drink of regular milk, and

> not from the yogurt itself. Impossible to know. Yogurt can trigger

> further die-off when it's introduced... so a bit of stuffiness

> *could* possibly be an effect of that. All I can say is that you need

> to make sure he doesn't have access to drinking the unfermented milk

> in the future.... then try the yogurt again and see if you get the

> other symptoms.

>>

>> Was it goat milk dairy that used to cause his ear infections? Or

> cow?

>>

>> You might want to try some other nut milk base for the smoothies if

> you can't do coconut.... but just banana and other fruits, avacado

> and the other things I mentioned can be done without the base. Try

> freezing chunks of cooked peach, pear and banana... then whir them up

> in the blender with just a bit of water.

>>

>>

>> Patti

>>

>>

>>

>>

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