Re: Better? or worse? Please take a look

[Guest guest]

Kristy,

There is one thing that is wrong with this scan. When I took Maysa back to Orthomerica for a reevaluation scan, there were two lines: the red one (initial scan) and the blue one (second scan). All of the red line was inside while all of the blue line was outside. Check Maysa's reevaluation scan in the M folder.

In your report, I don't understand how the two lines intersect! In my understanding, that would mean that parts of Zach's head have moved "inward" while in fact we all know here and we have all been told that the helmet doesn't push ANY part in but allows for growth to fill in the areas that need to grow.

Look carefully at your scan, the two lines intersect which tells me that something went wrong while scanning. It seems like the center of the two head shapes has been moved out of place.

Does that make sense to everyone?

Leila

Maysa, 10m 2w, 4 weeks in DOC band + CST

http://mymaysa.wordpress.com/--- On Tue, 12/2/08, Kristy R. <krogers1579@...> wrote:

From: Kristy R. <krogers1579@...>Subject: Better? or worse? Please take a lookPlagiocephaly Date: Tuesday, December 2, 2008, 11:43 AM

Hi everyone- well we went to Zach's appt yesterday- and it was really strange. He went from 13.8 to 15.2! I was very confused- because to me his head looks better. The orthotist told me that I shouldn't go off of the numbers- but it seems really strange to me that this whole time the numbers have been going down- but now they went up? All his numbers are worse- even his CVAI is higher? One thing that we noticed last time is that his chin was down when we scanned- this time we made sure he was looking straight--could that have caused it? Also- he grew where we were trying to restrict the growth- the flat spot is on the other side!!!!!Another thing is- when we look in the mirror with him- his face looks really off- and she said it was because his flat spots are still causing the asymetrical effect. She said that as he gets older it will get better- but she doesn't think he will ever be 100%. I

understand that no ones head is perfect but still.....At first I was very upset- and so was my husband-then God kinda shook us and we both said that we know he will be ok- and we even thought about taking pics of my husbands head all different angles to compare. Because we can not ever take the EXACT angle to compare- and some agles he looks great and some- not so good....She asked me if we were satisfied and I just told her that I was in no hurry to get him out of the hat if we still have room for progress. She said none of her patients ever wore the hat past 15 months- and he will be 15 months Jan 9,. She said that after that there was not really any room for progress because their heads are not really moldable (sp) past then. I wanted to bring up all the wonderful stories I have heard on this group and how CT will band up to 2 years- but as you can understand I was too upset to argue.

Would you guys please take a look at my pictures and scan and Honestly let me know what you think? The scan is from our appt nov-dec.http://www.dropshot s.com/krogers157 9password is happyThanks for listen to me ramble- but I know you guys can understand and relate.- I cried on the way home because the guilt started to set back in- I just want my baby boy to have a happy life and not have to deal with cruel people making comments.I am looking forward to the responses.God Bless

[Guest guest]

That makes sense and I would say there is definitely something that

may just be human error that made the scans appear that way

(possibly the chin down versus straight issue). My bigger concern is

that even if those two lines shifted to line up better, it looks

like the head shape is exactly the same, can anyone else see that?

It looks like if you were able to move the two lines, they would

almost line up or overlap perfectly. Assuming the band is working

properly, there should be a difference in shape after significant

time in the band.

Also, with regards to the asym you see in the mirror, that will

always look worse in a mirror for two reasons. One, it's a

2dimensional image of a 3dimensional object. The same thing happens

in photos, it kind of makes the asym look worse than it actually is

because it's flat and the head is round. Two, you're looking at a

reflection of someone that you're used to seeing straight on. When

you look at yourself in the mirror, you probably don't notice

anything odd because it's all you've ever known, the only way to see

yourself is in a mirror or photo. You're used to looking at your son

in person, face to face, so when you see his reflection in a mirror,

it will look odd to you because it's backwards or opposite from the

way you usually see him. That's not to say that the asym is not

there, but it's at least a reason why it seems more prominent in

mirrors and photos than it might when directly looking at him. Next

time you and your husband are brushing your teeth side by side in

the bathroom, take a good look at his reflection in the mirror.

Chances are he'll look a little " off " to you too, simply because

it's not the way you're used to seeing him.

Jake-2 (DOCBand Grad 9/19/08)

Jordan-4.5

>

> From: Kristy R. <krogers1579@...>

> Subject: Better? or worse? Please take a look

> Plagiocephaly

> Date: Tuesday, December 2, 2008, 11:43 AM

>

>

>

>

>

>

> Hi everyone- well we went to Zach's appt yesterday- and it was

really

> strange. He went from 13.8 to 15.2! I was very confused- because

to

> me his head looks better. The orthotist told me that I shouldn't

go

> off of the numbers- but it seems really strange to me that this

whole

> time the numbers have been going down- but now they went up? All

his

> numbers are worse- even his CVAI is higher? One thing that we

noticed

> last time is that his chin was down when we scanned- this time we

made

> sure he was looking straight--could that have caused it? Also- he

grew

> where we were trying to restrict the growth- the flat spot is on

the

> other side!!!!!

>

> Another thing is- when we look in the mirror with him- his face

looks

> really off- and she said it was because his flat spots are still

> causing the asymetrical effect. She said that as he gets older it

will

> get better- but she doesn't think he will ever be 100%. I

understand

> that no ones head is perfect but still.....

>

> At first I was very upset- and so was my husband-then God kinda

shook

> us and we both said that we know he will be ok- and we even

thought

> about taking pics of my husbands head all different angles to

compare.

> Because we can not ever take the EXACT angle to compare- and some

agles

> he looks great and some- not so good....

>

> She asked me if we were satisfied and I just told her that I was

in no

> hurry to get him out of the hat if we still have room for

progress.

> She said none of her patients ever wore the hat past 15 months-

and he

> will be 15 months Jan 9,. She said that after that there was not

> really any room for progress because their heads are not really

> moldable (sp) past then. I wanted to bring up all the wonderful

> stories I have heard on this group and how CT will band up to 2

years-

> but as you can understand I was too upset to argue.

>

> Would you guys please take a look at my pictures and scan and

Honestly

> let me know what you think? The scan is from our appt nov-dec.

>

> http://www.dropshot s.com/krogers157 9

> password is happy

>

> Thanks for listen to me ramble- but I know you guys can understand

and

> relate.- I cried on the way home because the guilt started to set

back

> in- I just want my baby boy to have a happy life and not have to

deal

> with cruel people making comments.

>

> I am looking forward to the responses.

>

> God Bless

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Liela and -

Thanks for the response....what about the pictures though- doesn't

his head look pretty good? My husband feels like the band has

helped with his ears- but not much with his head shape...I don't

know what to think-

I uploaded the other scan from start until yesterday just now

http://www.dropshots.com/krogers1579 password happy

- I understand what you are saying about the scan and the lines

intersecting...-I think they are all like that though.....- I hope

that it is just human error- I can upload comparsion photos from

july until now if anyone would like- maybe that would help.

Thanks for your help-and that is how I explained it to my

hubby- about the mirror-thanks for confirming that- that is why we

said we may take pics of him too- so we can see how his head looks

in pics lol...

>

> From: Kristy R. <krogers1579@...>

> Subject: Better? or worse? Please take a look

> Plagiocephaly

> Date: Tuesday, December 2, 2008, 11:43 AM

>

>

>

>

>

>

> Hi everyone- well we went to Zach's appt yesterday- and it was

really

> strange. He went from 13.8 to 15.2! I was very confused- because

to

> me his head looks better. The orthotist told me that I shouldn't

go

> off of the numbers- but it seems really strange to me that this

whole

> time the numbers have been going down- but now they went up? All

his

> numbers are worse- even his CVAI is higher? One thing that we

noticed

> last time is that his chin was down when we scanned- this time we

made

> sure he was looking straight--could that have caused it? Also- he

grew

> where we were trying to restrict the growth- the flat spot is on

the

> other side!!!!!

>

> Another thing is- when we look in the mirror with him- his face

looks

> really off- and she said it was because his flat spots are still

> causing the asymetrical effect. She said that as he gets older it

will

> get better- but she doesn't think he will ever be 100%. I

understand

> that no ones head is perfect but still.....

>

> At first I was very upset- and so was my husband-then God kinda

shook

> us and we both said that we know he will be ok- and we even

thought

> about taking pics of my husbands head all different angles to

compare.

> Because we can not ever take the EXACT angle to compare- and some

agles

> he looks great and some- not so good....

>

> She asked me if we were satisfied and I just told her that I was

in no

> hurry to get him out of the hat if we still have room for

progress.

> She said none of her patients ever wore the hat past 15 months-

and he

> will be 15 months Jan 9,. She said that after that there was not

> really any room for progress because their heads are not really

> moldable (sp) past then. I wanted to bring up all the wonderful

> stories I have heard on this group and how CT will band up to 2

years-

> but as you can understand I was too upset to argue.

>

> Would you guys please take a look at my pictures and scan and

Honestly

> let me know what you think? The scan is from our appt nov-dec.

>

> http://www.dropshot s.com/krogers157 9

> password is happy

>

> Thanks for listen to me ramble- but I know you guys can understand

and

> relate.- I cried on the way home because the guilt started to set

back

> in- I just want my baby boy to have a happy life and not have to

deal

> with cruel people making comments.

>

> I am looking forward to the responses.

>

> God Bless

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Kristy

Your baby looks great! If I had'nt known he had plagio I would have never known. His head has a nice round shape and his forehead does not look bossed. He looks great dont worry. God Bless him

From: Kristy R. <krogers1579@...>Plagiocephaly Sent: Tuesday, December 2, 2008 8:43:25 AMSubject: Better? or worse? Please take a look

Hi everyone- well we went to Zach's appt yesterday- and it was really strange. He went from 13.8 to 15.2! I was very confused- because to me his head looks better. The orthotist told me that I shouldn't go off of the numbers- but it seems really strange to me that this whole time the numbers have been going down- but now they went up? All his numbers are worse- even his CVAI is higher? One thing that we noticed last time is that his chin was down when we scanned- this time we made sure he was looking straight--could that have caused it? Also- he grew where we were trying to restrict the growth- the flat spot is on the other side!!!!!Another thing is- when we look in the mirror with him- his face looks really off- and she said it was because his flat spots are still causing the asymetrical effect. She said that as he gets older it will get better- but she doesn't think he will ever be 100%. I

understand that no ones head is perfect but still.....At first I was very upset- and so was my husband-then God kinda shook us and we both said that we know he will be ok- and we even thought about taking pics of my husbands head all different angles to compare. Because we can not ever take the EXACT angle to compare- and some agles he looks great and some- not so good....She asked me if we were satisfied and I just told her that I was in no hurry to get him out of the hat if we still have room for progress. She said none of her patients ever wore the hat past 15 months- and he will be 15 months Jan 9,. She said that after that there was not really any room for progress because their heads are not really moldable (sp) past then. I wanted to bring up all the wonderful stories I have heard on this group and how CT will band up to 2 years- but as you can understand I was too upset to argue.

Would you guys please take a look at my pictures and scan and Honestly let me know what you think? The scan is from our appt nov-dec.http://www.dropshot s.com/krogers157 9password is happyThanks for listen to me ramble- but I know you guys can understand and relate.- I cried on the way home because the guilt started to set back in- I just want my baby boy to have a happy life and not have to deal with cruel people making comments.I am looking forward to the responses.God Bless

[Guest guest]

Thanks Maggie I appreciate the kind words

>

> Hi Kristy

> Your baby looks great! If I had'nt known he had plagio I would

have never known. His head has a nice round shape and his forehead

does not look bossed.   He looks great dont worry.  God Bless him

>

>

>

>

> ________________________________

> From: Kristy R. <krogers1579@...>

> Plagiocephaly

> Sent: Tuesday, December 2, 2008 8:43:25 AM

> Subject: Better? or worse? Please take a look

>

>

> Hi everyone- well we went to Zach's appt yesterday- and it was

really

> strange. He went from 13.8 to 15.2! I was very confused- because

to

> me his head looks better. The orthotist told me that I shouldn't

go

> off of the numbers- but it seems really strange to me that this

whole

> time the numbers have been going down- but now they went up? All

his

> numbers are worse- even his CVAI is higher? One thing that we

noticed

> last time is that his chin was down when we scanned- this time we

made

> sure he was looking straight--could that have caused it? Also- he

grew

> where we were trying to restrict the growth- the flat spot is on

the

> other side!!!!!

>

> Another thing is- when we look in the mirror with him- his face

looks

> really off- and she said it was because his flat spots are still

> causing the asymetrical effect. She said that as he gets older it

will

> get better- but she doesn't think he will ever be 100%. I

understand

> that no ones head is perfect but still.....

>

> At first I was very upset- and so was my husband-then God kinda

shook

> us and we both said that we know he will be ok- and we even

thought

> about taking pics of my husbands head all different angles to

compare.

> Because we can not ever take the EXACT angle to compare- and some

agles

> he looks great and some- not so good....

>

> She asked me if we were satisfied and I just told her that I was

in no

> hurry to get him out of the hat if we still have room for

progress.

> She said none of her patients ever wore the hat past 15 months-

and he

> will be 15 months Jan 9,. She said that after that there was not

> really any room for progress because their heads are not really

> moldable (sp) past then. I wanted to bring up all the wonderful

> stories I have heard on this group and how CT will band up to 2

years-

> but as you can understand I was too upset to argue.

>

> Would you guys please take a look at my pictures and scan and

Honestly

> let me know what you think? The scan is from our appt nov-dec.

>

> http://www.dropshot s.com/krogers157 9

> password is happy

>

> Thanks for listen to me ramble- but I know you guys can understand

and

> relate.- I cried on the way home because the guilt started to set

back

> in- I just want my baby boy to have a happy life and not have to

deal

> with cruel people making comments.

>

> I am looking forward to the responses.

>

> God Bless

>

[Guest guest]

Kristy,

I haven't had the time to respond the way I wanted to to your email "Better or Worse?" but I just want to tell you that I am still a little bothered by the scans from Starcranial.

This is what I did. I printed two copies of the last scan and then cut around the blue line of the first copy and also around the red line of the second copy so that I ended up with two head shapes that I could actually put right on top of one another. (You can try it at home with the actual size copies). What I noticed is that the blue line shows that his headshape is a tiny bit fuller on the back right side (triangle MAX-Center-Diag1) but not anywhere else.

This said, I am now convinced that when they gave you the second scan, the center of the first headshape wasn't sitting right on top of the other one and that made things look worse than what they actually are, meaning that without paying too much attention to the color of the two lines at first, you get the feeling that he has been growing in the wrong directions (front right and back left).

Now, I was also looking at his head circumference numbers. He hasn't grown much which again explains why I only see a little bit of improvement in the back of the head. When I look back at Maysa's reevaluation sheet from Orthomerica, it showed that she grew about 3.5 cm in 3 and a half months. Zach's shows that he has grown about 0.3 cm or so... (I hope I am reading this right).

Anyhow, regarding the pictures that you took. It is hard for me to really compare them because almost all of them are taken at a different angle and a different distance. He does look better, but I feel like there is still room for improvement.

If I were you, I would go back to Orthomerica to ask them to reanalyze their data. Also, they might be able to tell you whether or not his ears have actually shifted from wearing the band (ie; ask them to show you were his ears were in the first scan as opposed to the second scan). One more thing they should be able to give you is a copy of the 3D picture of his headshape at different angles before treatment and now. I got one (posted on Maysa's blog) back when I had to convince my husband that she did have brachycephaly.

This said, again, from me putting the two headshapes right on top of one another, I can clearly see that whatever small growth Zach has had has gone to the right place on the back right side...

Good luck with it all.

Leila

Maysa, 10m 3w, 5 weeks in DOC band +CST

http://mymaysa.wordpress.com/ --- On Tue, 12/2/08, L R <leilarem@...> wrote:

From: L R <leilarem@...>Subject: Re: Better? or worse? Please take a lookPlagiocephaly Date: Tuesday, December 2, 2008, 2:37 PM

Kristy,

There is one thing that is wrong with this scan. When I took Maysa back to Orthomerica for a reevaluation scan, there were two lines: the red one (initial scan) and the blue one (second scan). All of the red line was inside while all of the blue line was outside. Check Maysa's reevaluation scan in the M folder.

In your report, I don't understand how the two lines intersect! In my understanding, that would mean that parts of Zach's head have moved "inward" while in fact we all know here and we have all been told that the helmet doesn't push ANY part in but allows for growth to fill in the areas that need to grow.

Look carefully at your scan, the two lines intersect which tells me that something went wrong while scanning. It seems like the center of the two head shapes has been moved out of place.

Does that make sense to everyone?

Leila

Maysa, 10m 2w, 4 weeks in DOC band + CST

http://mymaysa.wordpress.com/--- On Tue, 12/2/08, Kristy R. <krogers1579@...> wrote:

From: Kristy R. <krogers1579@...>Subject: Better? or worse? Please take a lookPlagiocephaly Date: Tuesday, December 2, 2008, 11:43 AM

Hi everyone- well we went to Zach's appt yesterday- and it was really strange. He went from 13.8 to 15.2! I was very confused- because to me his head looks better. The orthotist told me that I shouldn't go off of the numbers- but it seems really strange to me that this whole time the numbers have been going down- but now they went up? All his numbers are worse- even his CVAI is higher? One thing that we noticed last time is that his chin was down when we scanned- this time we made sure he was looking straight--could that have caused it? Also- he grew where we were trying to restrict the growth- the flat spot is on the other side!!!!!Another thing is- when we look in the mirror with him- his face looks really off- and she said it was because his flat spots are still causing the asymetrical effect. She said that as he gets older it will get better- but she doesn't think he will ever be 100%. I

understand that no ones head is perfect but still.....At first I was very upset- and so was my husband-then God kinda shook us and we both said that we know he will be ok- and we even thought about taking pics of my husbands head all different angles to compare. Because we can not ever take the EXACT angle to compare- and some agles he looks great and some- not so good....She asked me if we were satisfied and I just told her that I was in no hurry to get him out of the hat if we still have room for progress. She said none of her patients ever wore the hat past 15 months- and he will be 15 months Jan 9,. She said that after that there was not really any room for progress because their heads are not really moldable (sp) past then. I wanted to bring up all the wonderful stories I have heard on this group and how CT will band up to 2 years- but as you can understand I was too upset to argue.

Would you guys please take a look at my pictures and scan and Honestly let me know what you think? The scan is from our appt nov-dec.http://www.dropshot s.com/krogers157 9password is happyThanks for listen to me ramble- but I know you guys can understand and relate.- I cried on the way home because the guilt started to set back in- I just want my baby boy to have a happy life and not have to deal with cruel people making comments.I am looking forward to the responses.God Bless

[Guest guest]

Liela,

You are too kind to take that much time to help me....We decided the

same thing after looking at numerous pictures and comparing scans as

well- something went wrong- and it made us nervous to think our

orthotist didn't catch that the scans do not make sense- she is

supposed to be the professional....

We feel the same way that there has not been that much improvement

from the helmet other than the ears- but that alone is amazing! We

feel that the rest - (the rounding of his head) has probably been

because he has grown. Whether this is from the orthotist not

knowing exactly what she is doing- or from him not growing too much-

we don't know. What we do know is looking at him he looks really

good. The main time you can see is when you are looking down at his

head and I feel like there is a chance that if other people who

didn't know about plagio- may not be able to tell much of a

difference.

Another thing- one of his adjustments we noticed his helmet was very

loose- and we didn't know any better at the time- but that may have

lost us 3 weeks?

We still have about a month to two months left to go- who knows- he

could have a major growth spurt this month- we are praying

The other change is that the " dent " in the left of his forehead has

rounded out- it may not appear that way on the scans- but in person

you can tell.

I will definately take your advice to heart and plan on contacting

orthoamerica next week. Again thanks for your advice

>

> From: Kristy R. <krogers1579@...>

> Subject: Better? or worse? Please take a look

> Plagiocephaly

> Date: Tuesday, December 2, 2008, 11:43 AM

>

>

>

>

>

>

> Hi everyone- well we went to Zach's appt yesterday- and it was

really

> strange. He went from 13.8 to 15.2! I was very confused- because

to

> me his head looks better. The orthotist told me that I shouldn't

go

> off of the numbers- but it seems really strange to me that this

whole

> time the numbers have been going down- but now they went up? All

his

> numbers are worse- even his CVAI is higher? One thing that we

noticed

> last time is that his chin was down when we scanned- this time we

made

> sure he was looking straight--could that have caused it? Also- he

grew

> where we were trying to restrict the growth- the flat spot is on

the

> other side!!!!!

>

> Another thing is- when we look in the mirror with him- his face

looks

> really off- and she said it was because his flat spots are still

> causing the asymetrical effect. She said that as he gets older it

will

> get better- but she doesn't think he will ever be 100%. I

understand

> that no ones head is perfect but still.....

>

> At first I was very upset- and so was my husband-then God kinda

shook

> us and we both said that we know he will be ok- and we even

thought

> about taking pics of my husbands head all different angles to

compare.

> Because we can not ever take the EXACT angle to compare- and some

agles

> he looks great and some- not so good....

>

> She asked me if we were satisfied and I just told her that I was

in no

> hurry to get him out of the hat if we still have room for

progress.

> She said none of her patients ever wore the hat past 15 months-

and he

> will be 15 months Jan 9,. She said that after that there was not

> really any room for progress because their heads are not really

> moldable (sp) past then. I wanted to bring up all the wonderful

> stories I have heard on this group and how CT will band up to 2

years-

> but as you can understand I was too upset to argue.

>

> Would you guys please take a look at my pictures and scan and

Honestly

> let me know what you think? The scan is from our appt nov-dec.

>

> http://www.dropshot s.com/krogers157 9

> password is happy

>

> Thanks for listen to me ramble- but I know you guys can understand

and

> relate.- I cried on the way home because the guilt started to set

back

> in- I just want my baby boy to have a happy life and not have to

deal

> with cruel people making comments.

>

> I am looking forward to the responses.

>

> God Bless

>