Re: PLEASE HELP!? Daughter on diet 5 days and pooping everywhere!

[Guest guest]

,

You didn't say.... but I'm assuming your daughter has an autism diagnosis?

Is she drinking anything? She must be..... after five days. ??

What you're seeing *could* be due to die-off toxins.... but if she has not

eaten anything at all for five days, I'd be very concerned. You need to get some

sort of nutrition and fluids into her.

How are you getting the activated charcoal supplements in? Mixed in food? Or

does she swallow capsules?

Kids new to SCD have been known to go on hunger strikes, holding out for the

" favorite foods " they are addicted to. In some cases, we've found that some

families really need to " ease in " to SCD... slowly transitioning to legal

foods.... rather than all at once.

If you have a child with extreme texture sensitivities and one that's a severe

picky eater..... very self-limiting... you may need to do it that way, then go

back to do the intro diet once you've been able to get off all illegals.

Is this your first post to the list? Or did you introduce yourself before

starting the diet and ask for some advance suggestions? It's helpful if we can

help a parent prepare in advance.

We also would hope that if things were going badly after even ONE day, you would

have asked for help then... not wait five days. We would be glad to help and

might have had some ideas that would have helped before you got to this point.

Please don't hesitate to ask for help!

I don't have experience with the poop smearing, so I'm not sure what to suggest

there except to dress her in clothing that she is not able to get off. I know

that's easy for me to say... my ten year old daughter does not have the motor

skills to remove any of her own clothing.

<<My husband is losing it. He's talking about killing himself.>>

Look.... I'm sure you're both very distressed. This is a difficult undertaking

to say the least. But please tell your husband that talk like that certainly

doesn't help the situation at all. I'm sorry, but if he needs to take a break

and get away for an hour, it seems that would be better than him being there...

but " losing it " . Can you have a friend or family member step in and let your

husband just catch his breath and calm down?

Do you have anyone who can come in and help you for a day or two.... just give

you some respite? Or stay and help you with clean-up ... and support you

emotionally.

I can only guess that your daughter is just feeling extremely unwell. Have you

been able to bathe her in epsom salts baths?

If I'm going to help you.... I really need to know if she is drinking anything

at all..... and how you're getting her to take the charcoal supplements. I'll

try to go from there.

Patti

PLEASE HELP!? Daughter on diet 5 days and pooping

everywhere!

I really hope someone can help me!! My 3 yr. old daughter started

the diet 5 days ago. I shouldn't even say she's doing the 'diet'

because she's not - she just stopped eating.

She never, ever ate good to begin with (Nutrigrain bars, toast,

yogurt, chicken nuggets. That's it.) but now she's not eating

anything since Wednesday. She had a small amount of Jello Tuesday

(made with Welch's Grape Juice) and that has been it. I made

homemade nuggets, applesauce, banana bread, peanut butter brownies,

everything I could think of that she might possible try. But nothing.

I took her out of school this week and next week, thinking i'd have

her eating by the following Monday but it's not looking good at all.

Here is my biggest dilema. She will not keep her clothes on or her

shoes. Nothing I put on her. She keeps taking her diaper off and

pooping on the floor (which is all diarrhea because she hasn't eaten

anything). We had to throw her sheets away last night because she

smeared it everywhere. She went on my living room floor. She just

went in her bedroom. She is a little red on her private area.

My husband is losing it. He's talking about killing himself. He said

he can't stand to see her smear her poop like an animal. He has been

so supportive of all the biomed we have done, all her supplements

and chelation. Everything. But this just set him over the edge. He

can't bear to see her like this.

I just don't know what to do. Is this die off? Is she starving? What

do I do if she won't eat anything? I'm at a loss. She has severe

texture issues - I even tried to give her baby food (I know it's not

legal but I just want her to eat). Do I try to force her to eat or

do I just lay it our there and she'll eat it eventually?

Any advice at all would be sooooooo appreciated! And any answers on

the poop smearing and not wearing clothes - has anyone else

experienced this before? How long does it last? I have been giving

her charcoal to try and absorb some die off but I don't even know if

that is what's going on.

Sorry for all the questions - we're just a mess over here and I'm on

the verge of losing my husband.

I have the book Breaking the Vicious Cycle and I didn't read

anything this horrible in there. I guess it's easier for people who

have children that actually eat. The diet isn't going to work for us

if I can't get her to eat ANYTHING.

Thank you all in advance,

[Guest guest]

,

This sounds to me like a horrrible die off reaction. I feel for you.

My son also had a bad reaction and I almost quit the diet. I am glad

that I continued because SCD is the right diet for him.

Since your daughter is not transitioning from GFCF,why not give her

the SCD yogurt? You had mentioned that she eats yogurt.

If you decide to do it with goat milk,avoid the Meyenburg brand. That

brand does not taste good. SCD yogurt made from cow milk might be OK

for use during the transition time.

How about doing a gradual transition to SCD? I remember one family

took several weeks to transition their child to SCD. They took their

child to a favorite playground and rewarded him for trying bits of new

foods with a chance to ride on favorite equipment. Or you might try

drops of the new foods mixed in her old foods and gradually increase

the amount.

Another option would be to try to get her to eat more gelatin and tough it out.

Mimi

> I really hope someone can help me!! My 3 yr. old daughter started

> the diet 5 days ago. I shouldn't even say she's doing the 'diet'

> because she's not - she just stopped eating.

>

> She never, ever ate good to begin with (Nutrigrain bars, toast,

> yogurt, chicken nuggets. That's it.) but now she's not eating

> anything since Wednesday. She had a small amount of Jello Tuesday

> (made with Welch's Grape Juice) and that has been it. I made

> homemade nuggets, applesauce, banana bread, peanut butter brownies,

> everything I could think of that she might possible try. But nothing.

>

> I took her out of school this week and next week, thinking i'd have

> her eating by the following Monday but it's not looking good at all.

>

> Here is my biggest dilema. She will not keep her clothes on or her

> shoes. Nothing I put on her. She keeps taking her diaper off and

> pooping on the floor (which is all diarrhea because she hasn't eaten

> anything). We had to throw her sheets away last night because she

> smeared it everywhere. She went on my living room floor. She just

> went in her bedroom. She is a little red on her private area.

>

> My husband is losing it. He's talking about killing himself. He said

> he can't stand to see her smear her poop like an animal. He has been

> so supportive of all the biomed we have done, all her supplements

> and chelation. Everything. But this just set him over the edge. He

> can't bear to see her like this.

>

> I just don't know what to do. Is this die off? Is she starving? What

> do I do if she won't eat anything? I'm at a loss. She has severe

> texture issues - I even tried to give her baby food (I know it's not

> legal but I just want her to eat). Do I try to force her to eat or

> do I just lay it our there and she'll eat it eventually?

>

> Any advice at all would be sooooooo appreciated! And any answers on

> the poop smearing and not wearing clothes - has anyone else

> experienced this before? How long does it last? I have been giving

> her charcoal to try and absorb some die off but I don't even know if

> that is what's going on.

>

> Sorry for all the questions - we're just a mess over here and I'm on

> the verge of losing my husband.

>

> I have the book Breaking the Vicious Cycle and I didn't read

> anything this horrible in there. I guess it's easier for people who

> have children that actually eat. The diet isn't going to work for us

> if I can't get her to eat ANYTHING.

>

> Thank you all in advance,

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

When my K has die-off, she will exibit those nasty behaviors. We had to change

the rug in the hallway and in her room. The die-off doesn't last a long time

but, comes and goes the longer you're on the diet. She will aslo eat toilet

paper sometimes. Hang in there and do not feed her anymore illegals because her

Diareah won't get better if she can't digest or has an insensitivity to the baby

foods.

My daughter actually went for 3 days without eating and then she chose something

out of the many SCD items I cooked for her during that time. They WILL eat when

they get hungry. Don't cave in to her by giving her illegals and you will see a

drastic improvement. We have had months of this experience so I know what I'm

talking about here. You have a friend and even someone that can talk to your

husband if you need some support. This is your daughter healing. You will see

what I mean if you can get past this ugly stage.

Did you clean up her gut BEFORE you did chelation? This can be a HUGE problem.

I would recommend you do not force her to eat. Those children with texture

issues, like my own, also have gagging reflex and can be dangerous to force

feed. Our children have lost the ability to swallow appropriately also. It takes

time.

Epsom salts baths will help to calm her down a bit and dad too. If you want to

email me offlist, jlessard1@...

Jenn & K

18 months SCD

PLEASE HELP!? Daughter on diet 5 days and pooping

everywhere!

I really hope someone can help me!! My 3 yr. old daughter started

the diet 5 days ago. I shouldn't even say she's doing the 'diet'

because she's not - she just stopped eating.

She never, ever ate good to begin with (Nutrigrain bars, toast,

yogurt, chicken nuggets. That's it.) but now she's not eating

anything since Wednesday. She had a small amount of Jello Tuesday

(made with Welch's Grape Juice) and that has been it. I made

homemade nuggets, applesauce, banana bread, peanut butter brownies,

everything I could think of that she might possible try. But nothing.

I took her out of school this week and next week, thinking i'd have

her eating by the following Monday but it's not looking good at all.

Here is my biggest dilema. She will not keep her clothes on or her

shoes. Nothing I put on her. She keeps taking her diaper off and

pooping on the floor (which is all diarrhea because she hasn't eaten

anything). We had to throw her sheets away last night because she

smeared it everywhere. She went on my living room floor. She just

went in her bedroom. She is a little red on her private area.

My husband is losing it. He's talking about killing himself. He said

he can't stand to see her smear her poop like an animal. He has been

so supportive of all the biomed we have done, all her supplements

and chelation. Everything. But this just set him over the edge. He

can't bear to see her like this.

I just don't know what to do. Is this die off? Is she starving? What

do I do if she won't eat anything? I'm at a loss. She has severe

texture issues - I even tried to give her baby food (I know it's not

legal but I just want her to eat). Do I try to force her to eat or

do I just lay it our there and she'll eat it eventually?

Any advice at all would be sooooooo appreciated! And any answers on

the poop smearing and not wearing clothes - has anyone else

experienced this before? How long does it last? I have been giving

her charcoal to try and absorb some die off but I don't even know if

that is what's going on.

Sorry for all the questions - we're just a mess over here and I'm on

the verge of losing my husband.

I have the book Breaking the Vicious Cycle and I didn't read

anything this horrible in there. I guess it's easier for people who

have children that actually eat. The diet isn't going to work for us

if I can't get her to eat ANYTHING.

Thank you all in advance,

[Guest guest]

Yes, she is autistic. Pretty extreme I guess - the whole " you eat

this and I'll give you this " strategy definitely isn't going to

work with her at all.

I just went in to get her from waking up this morning and she was

sitting on the bed naked with her diaper off and had smeared her

poop all over the bed. Definitely starting our day off great :-(

She is drinking watered down OJ and Welch's grape juice. I gave in

and gave her a banana last night. We tried this diet in April (after

GFCF didn't work for her) and she literally ate bananas for 5 weeks.

Nothing but bananas so I didn't want to give them to her again

because that's all she eat.

As for giving her the foods she likes and gradually transitioning in

legal foods, she'll just hold out for 5 days until I give her the

food she wants. If she knows that she's eventually going to get

yogurt or pudding, then she'll just wait till I give her that.

I put charcoal in her grape juice. She's pretty good about taking

all her supplements everyday.

As for my husband, well it's been an unbelievable rough 2 years. We

DO NOT have any help from family at all. They pretend to be here for

us and to understand what we go through but the don't babysit for us

ever. They all take our NT 5 yr. old daughter but NEVER take our

autistic daughter. Never. We probably wouldn't let them anyway

because they don't know how to handle her. It's just very

devastating to watch your child smear their feces all over walls and

furniture - there just isn't anything more heart breaking.

I have been giving her Epsom Salt baths everyday and the charcoal.

There aren't any clothes that she doesn't know how to take off, so

we are at a loss there too.

I honestly knows that she can't eat gluten and dairy and that she

needs to be on a restricted diet but we have tried this before and

just gave up because she was starving herself then too. But having

her get up every single night at 2 am and kick the walls for hours

on end, or schreech in that high pitched voice - the same sounds

over and over and over again, or giggle hysterically for no reason

at all. She might be starving right now but she has slept through

the night for the past 5 days and for that I am eternally grateful,

I haven't had nights like this in a long time. But when she's up,

she is definitely in her own world - one minute she seems to be 'on'

and the next she's somewhere else in a fog. It's just so confusing.

I read parents writing that their children eat chicken, beef, lamb,

peas, carrots, fruit, etc.....I just could NEVER IMAGINE our

daughter eating ANY of that. I swear that I literally dream of that

day but it seems sooooooooo out of reach with all of her sensory

issues. I put banana baby food in an empty yogurt container (her

favorite banana yogurt) yesterday and she took the biggest bite! As

soon as she realized that it wasn't yogurt, she spit it out all over

the floor and made a huge mess from continuing to spit until every

last drop was out of her mouth.

I honestly don't know if anyone can help me or not. I guess I just

really needed someone to talk to. I'm going to tough it out for the

next few days and see what happens.

If you have anymore suggestions or ideas, i'd appreciate it. This

day hasn't started off well at all :-(

Thanks,

>

> ,

>

> You didn't say.... but I'm assuming your daughter has an autism

diagnosis?

>

> Is she drinking anything? She must be..... after five days. ??

>

> What you're seeing *could* be due to die-off toxins.... but if

she has not eaten anything at all for five days, I'd be very

concerned. You need to get some sort of nutrition and fluids into

her.

>

> How are you getting the activated charcoal supplements in? Mixed

in food? Or does she swallow capsules?

[Guest guest]

....

You sound disheartened.... but you also sound like you are a devoted mom, and

determined to help her. You must have a strong feeling that this diet is the

right path to follow, but just can't figure out how to get past these initial

difficulties.

That's where.... we hope..... we will be able to offer some help.

It sounds like you've got one very strong-willed little girl on your hands. And

she has learned from experience that if she holds out long enough, she will

eventually get what she wants, food-wise anyway. Wow! That is one SMART girl.

I look at that as a real strength in her.... difficult for you at the moment,

but the future potential of that is bright! Now, let's just see how we can work

through it!

<<- the whole " you eat this and I'll give you this " strategy definitely isn't

going to

work with her at all.>>

That's okay.... you know her best. That's not the strategy to use now... but

we can still try some behavior strategies.... even if it's just attempting to

pair the new behavior you want (eating the new SCD food) with something else

that is highly reinforcing for her. Is there any particular music or video that

she really strongly prefers? Any kind of toy or activity that you could do

during the time that you are hoping to get her to eat? I wouldn't try this as a

direct " you eat this bite and then you get to watch this video " thing.... but

more like maybe putting the video on while you're having her drink her juice, so

that experience is extra rewarding for her. (Forgive me if this is just

completely NOT something she would respond to, ok?)

<<She is drinking watered down OJ and Welch's grape juice. I gave in

and gave her a banana last night.>>

Now..... this is a positive! This gives us a place to start. If she is

drinking the diluted juice, I think we can " sneak " other stuff in.... possibly.

Now, I mean VERY SLOWLY..... VERY small quantities.

Giving the banana at this point is fine.... as long as it was nice and ripe.

Well spotted with brown spots. I realise you don't want to let her have nothing

but bananas like she did before, so no problem.

What I would maybe try to do is ..... now stay with me here, I know this may not

be possible but let's give it a try. I would attempt to put the juice in the

blender... diluted.... but just a small amount. Now, add a chunk of RIPE

banana to that and whir. See if she will accept drinking that. Don't try to

fool her or force her.... just act like it's no big deal. Try to *pretend* that

you're not all stressed out over whether she drinks it or not. I know this might

be hard, because you are so worried.... but hang in there with me.

IF she accepts even the TINIEST amount of it, just smile and relax... give her

kisses and praise... hugs.... whatever she likes. But if she rejects it, just

don't react at all.... no negative reaction at ALL. Just put it aside and say

" oh, well... maybe later. "

If she DOES accept it.... that opens a whole new world of possibilities.

This is how got Dylan going.... but by freezing cooked fruit, whirred

into smoothie form, then frozen into popsicles. As she says, at one point this

is ALL he would eat.... but, you would be surprised at what you can sneak into a

smoothie/popsicle.

<<We tried this diet in April (after

GFCF didn't work for her) and she literally ate bananas for 5 weeks.

Nothing but bananas so I didn't want to give them to her again

because that's all she eat. >>

I can understand that... any time a kid self-limits to eating only ONE food,

even if it's SCD legal, you really need to figure out how to get more variety

in. You'll have to put them out of sight and limit her to a small amount,

maybe..... but we could use that small amount of banana she accepts to get her

to eat other things. A smoothie can include banana.... with legal juice, maybe

homemade coconut milk (helpful against yeast, too) and later, you can sneak just

a very TINY amount of pureed squash in with it and increase the amount very,

very gradually.

If she prefers banana mashed, you can also sneak in an EXTREMELY small amount of

something else legal, such as pureed squash, applesauce, SCD yogurt, nut butter,

etc.

<<As for giving her the foods she likes and gradually transitioning in

legal foods, she'll just hold out for 5 days until I give her the

food she wants. If she knows that she's eventually going to get

yogurt or pudding, then she'll just wait till I give her that.>>

Well, she is a very persistant kid! Again, I think this will eventually be a

positive trait! Unfortunately, she has learned that you'll eventually give in,

so she'll need to un-learn that. That's going to be a real hurdle for you.

Keep in mind that as long as she's drinking.... and getting some carbohydrate

and nutrition from the legal juices.... she is not in any danger of starving.

She's just trying her darnedest to hold out longer than you can. Stay strong!

<<I put charcoal in her grape juice. She's pretty good about taking

all her supplements everyday.>>

, would you mind telling us exactly what other supplements she's taking

right now? We sometimes suggest pulling all or most of the supps in the

beginning, until you get a good start on the diet. It's amazing how often the

supplements can end up working against you at first.... even though it's all

" good stuff " . Let's just make sure there's nothing there that's going to

sabotage all the effort you're putting forth right now.

<<As for my husband, well it's been an unbelievable rough 2 years. We

DO NOT have any help from family at all. >>

I'm sorry to hear you don't have that family support. I'm sure a lot of us here

can relate. I just wish you had someone.... friend? neighbor?.... who could

be there for you right now. You don't live anywhere near southwest Washington

state, do you? If so.... I'll be right over.

<<It's just very

devastating to watch your child smear their feces all over walls and

furniture - there just isn't anything more heart breaking.>>

I know this is breaking your heart right now... and frustrating you to no

end... but I am confident that this is the chemical toxins being given off by

the bad bacteria. The same toxins the gut pathogens have been giving off all

along, which drive the kids into their world of autism... are all being released

now, all at ONCE, as these bad guys bite the dust. Hopefully, you can think of

it that way... it's not your daughter.... it's like she's possessed by these bad

guys who are DESPERATE to survive and are driving her crazy.

They WANT TO SURVIVE.... so they are sending her messages to GO GET FOOD.

Meaning, they want their Nutrigrain bars and their sugary yogurt and all the

other stuff that they've been thriving on all this time. They KNOW they will DIE

if they don't get it.... so they are willing to go to desperate measures to

influence their " host " .... and break down your will to defeat them. This is a

life or death struggle for them and they mean to win. You must make up your mind

that your plan is to erradicate them from your daughter's body once and for

all..... and determine you won't give in to them!

<<I have been giving her Epsom Salt baths everyday and the charcoal.

There aren't any clothes that she doesn't know how to take off, so

we are at a loss there too.>>

I'm glad to hear you're doing the baths... I think that's a good thing. She's

not drinking the bathwater, is she? If so, that would cause diarrhea. I'm not

able to help you with the clothing issue, I guess. The only thing I can think of

is to use blanket sleepers.... zip them up to the neck and literally sew the

zipper shut with a needle and thread... just a few stitches with strong thread,

knotted securely. You'd then just have to clip that thread to get the zipper

down to change her. At least that might work at night. ??

<<She might be starving right now but she has slept through

the night for the past 5 days and for that I am eternally grateful,

I haven't had nights like this in a long time.>>

Aha! Now THIS is another positive sign! I see that as a strong indication that

you're on the right track. Keep hanging on to those positive little bits.

<<But when she's up,

she is definitely in her own world - one minute she seems to be 'on'

and the next she's somewhere else in a fog. It's just so confusing.>>

Listen, she is in the middle of die-off detox.... this is TOUGH. The times when

she's " on " will increase, I'm just sure of it.... but for right now, it's very

common for there to be ups and downs... and periods where the toxins are

definitely affecting her brain. Keep up with the charcoal and the epsom salts.

You're doing the right thing!

<<I read parents writing that their children eat chicken, beef, lamb,

peas, carrots, fruit, etc.....I just could NEVER IMAGINE our

daughter eating ANY of that.>>

Don't worry about that for now..... that's just too overwhelming. You *may* be

very delightfully surprised, just don't add that to your burden right now. Focus

on what legal things she will eat right now, and we'll slowly work from there.

<<I put banana baby food in an empty yogurt container (her

favorite banana yogurt) yesterday and she took the biggest bite! As

soon as she realized that it wasn't yogurt, she spit it out all over

the floor>>

Okay.... well, fooling her that way obviously isn't going to work. She's too

smart for that! That's okay. Now, do try to resist the urge to use commercial

baby food banana, okay? Just real, ripe bananas. Mashed, or whatever way she

will accept a little bit.

<<I honestly don't know if anyone can help me or not. I guess I just

really needed someone to talk to. I'm going to tough it out for the

next few days and see what happens.>>

That's what we're here for. Believe me, other parents here have been

through very, very rough times in the beginning. You can get through this....

just make up your mind that you are stronger than the bad gut bugs that want to

control your daughter's body and mind.

Patti

[Guest guest]

Does she enjoy taking baths? I have found that I can feed my boys cooked puree

pear, zuchinni, chicken, coconut oil, a little honey and cinnamin all mixed

together. While they are in the bath tub playing, I offer them bites of this

and they will eat without thinking about it while they are playing.

Dana

Garrett and

madisonandrylee wrote:

I really hope someone can help me!! My 3 yr. old daughter started

the diet 5 days ago. I shouldn't even say she's doing the 'diet'

because she's not - she just stopped eating.

She never, ever ate good to begin with (Nutrigrain bars, toast,

yogurt, chicken nuggets. That's it.) but now she's not eating

anything since Wednesday. She had a small amount of Jello Tuesday

(made with Welch's Grape Juice) and that has been it. I made

homemade nuggets, applesauce, banana bread, peanut butter brownies,

everything I could think of that she might possible try. But nothing.

I took her out of school this week and next week, thinking i'd have

her eating by the following Monday but it's not looking good at all.

Here is my biggest dilema. She will not keep her clothes on or her

shoes. Nothing I put on her. She keeps taking her diaper off and

pooping on the floor (which is all diarrhea because she hasn't eaten

anything). We had to throw her sheets away last night because she

smeared it everywhere. She went on my living room floor. She just

went in her bedroom. She is a little red on her private area.

My husband is losing it. He's talking about killing himself. He said

he can't stand to see her smear her poop like an animal. He has been

so supportive of all the biomed we have done, all her supplements

and chelation. Everything. But this just set him over the edge. He

can't bear to see her like this.

I just don't know what to do. Is this die off? Is she starving? What

do I do if she won't eat anything? I'm at a loss. She has severe

texture issues - I even tried to give her baby food (I know it's not

legal but I just want her to eat). Do I try to force her to eat or

do I just lay it our there and she'll eat it eventually?

Any advice at all would be sooooooo appreciated! And any answers on

the poop smearing and not wearing clothes - has anyone else

experienced this before? How long does it last? I have been giving

her charcoal to try and absorb some die off but I don't even know if

that is what's going on.

Sorry for all the questions - we're just a mess over here and I'm on

the verge of losing my husband.

I have the book Breaking the Vicious Cycle and I didn't read

anything this horrible in there. I guess it's easier for people who

have children that actually eat. The diet isn't going to work for us

if I can't get her to eat ANYTHING.

Thank you all in advance,

---------------------------------

Sponsored Link

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[Guest guest]

Didn't we have some new to scd post just a month back or so who had the same

problem with a hunger strike? I can't remember who it was, but I know that it

went on for days. Maybe she could be a huge support for right now.

Meleah scd 05/06

iel 3.5yrs. asd, Ethan 5yrs., Mark 18mths., both nt

Re: PLEASE HELP!? Daughter on diet 5 days and pooping

everywhere!

,

This sounds to me like a horrrible die off reaction. I feel for you.

My son also had a bad reaction and I almost quit the diet. I am glad

that I continued because SCD is the right diet for him.

Since your daughter is not transitioning from GFCF,why not give her

the SCD yogurt? You had mentioned that she eats yogurt.

If you decide to do it with goat milk,avoid the Meyenburg brand. That

brand does not taste good. SCD yogurt made from cow milk might be OK

for use during the transition time.

How about doing a gradual transition to SCD? I remember one family

took several weeks to transition their child to SCD. They took their

child to a favorite playground and rewarded him for trying bits of new

foods with a chance to ride on favorite equipment. Or you might try

drops of the new foods mixed in her old foods and gradually increase

the amount.

Another option would be to try to get her to eat more gelatin and tough it

out.

Mimi

> I really hope someone can help me!! My 3 yr. old daughter started

> the diet 5 days ago. I shouldn't even say she's doing the 'diet'

> because she's not - she just stopped eating.

>

> She never, ever ate good to begin with (Nutrigrain bars, toast,

> yogurt, chicken nuggets. That's it.) but now she's not eating

> anything since Wednesday. She had a small amount of Jello Tuesday

> (made with Welch's Grape Juice) and that has been it. I made

> homemade nuggets, applesauce, banana bread, peanut butter brownies,

> everything I could think of that she might possible try. But nothing.

>

> I took her out of school this week and next week, thinking i'd have

> her eating by the following Monday but it's not looking good at all.

>

> Here is my biggest dilema. She will not keep her clothes on or her

> shoes. Nothing I put on her. She keeps taking her diaper off and

> pooping on the floor (which is all diarrhea because she hasn't eaten

> anything). We had to throw her sheets away last night because she

> smeared it everywhere. She went on my living room floor. She just

> went in her bedroom. She is a little red on her private area.

>

> My husband is losing it. He's talking about killing himself. He said

> he can't stand to see her smear her poop like an animal. He has been

> so supportive of all the biomed we have done, all her supplements

> and chelation. Everything. But this just set him over the edge. He

> can't bear to see her like this.

>

> I just don't know what to do. Is this die off? Is she starving? What

> do I do if she won't eat anything? I'm at a loss. She has severe

> texture issues - I even tried to give her baby food (I know it's not

> legal but I just want her to eat). Do I try to force her to eat or

> do I just lay it our there and she'll eat it eventually?

>

> Any advice at all would be sooooooo appreciated! And any answers on

> the poop smearing and not wearing clothes - has anyone else

> experienced this before? How long does it last? I have been giving

> her charcoal to try and absorb some die off but I don't even know if

> that is what's going on.

>

> Sorry for all the questions - we're just a mess over here and I'm on

> the verge of losing my husband.

>

> I have the book Breaking the Vicious Cycle and I didn't read

> anything this horrible in there. I guess it's easier for people who

> have children that actually eat. The diet isn't going to work for us

> if I can't get her to eat ANYTHING.

>

> Thank you all in advance,

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

,

I agree with Patty that you have some good signs here. She is drinking the

diluted juice, so you don't have to worry about hydration. I think that the

sleeping through the night is huge. Those two things are big accomplishments.

I'm not an expert at having to sneak in foods little by little. We were blessed

that iel didn't fast on us. He certainly didn't like the changes in

food...and he still won't eat a big variety...but we are fortunate that he will

eat meats, veggies, fruits, and dairy in various forms. I know that there are

some parents here who are experts in sneaking in food little by little. Like I

said, there is someone on this list who had a similar problem with hunger strike

when they started scd, and I hope that she will post for you. I do believe that

she used Patty's suggestion of acting like it was no big deal whether or not her

son ate. She left intro foods around where he could get them, and offer him the

food every so often. After several days, he finally ate something. Keep it up.

I will be offering some major prayers for your family. I live in Charlotte,

North Carolina. If you live within a few hours from here, I'll gladly come to

help you. Also, you can email me off list if you'd like, and get my phone

number or give me yours. I'll gladly call you if you need to talk or ask a

question.

rmcorner@...

Meleah scd 05/06

iel 3.5yrs. asd, Ethan 5yrs., Mark 18mths., both nt

Re: PLEASE HELP!? Daughter on diet 5 days and pooping

everywhere!

Yes, she is autistic. Pretty extreme I guess - the whole " you eat

this and I'll give you this " strategy definitely isn't going to

work with her at all.

I just went in to get her from waking up this morning and she was

sitting on the bed naked with her diaper off and had smeared her

poop all over the bed. Definitely starting our day off great :-(

She is drinking watered down OJ and Welch's grape juice. I gave in

and gave her a banana last night. We tried this diet in April (after

GFCF didn't work for her) and she literally ate bananas for 5 weeks.

Nothing but bananas so I didn't want to give them to her again

because that's all she eat.

As for giving her the foods she likes and gradually transitioning in

legal foods, she'll just hold out for 5 days until I give her the

food she wants. If she knows that she's eventually going to get

yogurt or pudding, then she'll just wait till I give her that.

I put charcoal in her grape juice. She's pretty good about taking

all her supplements everyday.

As for my husband, well it's been an unbelievable rough 2 years. We

DO NOT have any help from family at all. They pretend to be here for

us and to understand what we go through but the don't babysit for us

ever. They all take our NT 5 yr. old daughter but NEVER take our

autistic daughter. Never. We probably wouldn't let them anyway

because they don't know how to handle her. It's just very

devastating to watch your child smear their feces all over walls and

furniture - there just isn't anything more heart breaking.

I have been giving her Epsom Salt baths everyday and the charcoal.

There aren't any clothes that she doesn't know how to take off, so

we are at a loss there too.

I honestly knows that she can't eat gluten and dairy and that she

needs to be on a restricted diet but we have tried this before and

just gave up because she was starving herself then too. But having

her get up every single night at 2 am and kick the walls for hours

on end, or schreech in that high pitched voice - the same sounds

over and over and over again, or giggle hysterically for no reason

at all. She might be starving right now but she has slept through

the night for the past 5 days and for that I am eternally grateful,

I haven't had nights like this in a long time. But when she's up,

she is definitely in her own world - one minute she seems to be 'on'

and the next she's somewhere else in a fog. It's just so confusing.

I read parents writing that their children eat chicken, beef, lamb,

peas, carrots, fruit, etc.....I just could NEVER IMAGINE our

daughter eating ANY of that. I swear that I literally dream of that

day but it seems sooooooooo out of reach with all of her sensory

issues. I put banana baby food in an empty yogurt container (her

favorite banana yogurt) yesterday and she took the biggest bite! As

soon as she realized that it wasn't yogurt, she spit it out all over

the floor and made a huge mess from continuing to spit until every

last drop was out of her mouth.

I honestly don't know if anyone can help me or not. I guess I just

really needed someone to talk to. I'm going to tough it out for the

next few days and see what happens.

If you have anymore suggestions or ideas, i'd appreciate it. This

day hasn't started off well at all :-(

Thanks,

>

> ,

>

> You didn't say.... but I'm assuming your daughter has an autism

diagnosis?

>

> Is she drinking anything? She must be..... after five days. ??

>

> What you're seeing *could* be due to die-off toxins.... but if

she has not eaten anything at all for five days, I'd be very

concerned. You need to get some sort of nutrition and fluids into

her.

>

> How are you getting the activated charcoal supplements in? Mixed

in food? Or does she swallow capsules?

[Guest guest]

I believe it was me...! We are just passing our 3 month regression as we

speak. I have offered to help in any way I can and I have posted to

this morning. If your listening, I am here and I have experienced MANY

of the same things you are! Please e mail so I can help.

-MOM to Dylan PDD NOS

>

>Reply-To: pecanbread

>To: <pecanbread >

>Subject: Re: PLEASE HELP!? Daughter on diet 5 days and pooping

>everywhere!

>Date: Sun, 19 Nov 2006 15:39:15 -0500

>

>Didn't we have some new to scd post just a month back or so who had the

>same problem with a hunger strike? I can't remember who it was, but I know

>that it went on for days. Maybe she could be a huge support for right

>now.

>Meleah scd 05/06

>iel 3.5yrs. asd, Ethan 5yrs., Mark 18mths., both nt

>

> Re: PLEASE HELP!? Daughter on diet 5 days and

>pooping everywhere!

>

>

> ,

>

> This sounds to me like a horrrible die off reaction. I feel for you.

> My son also had a bad reaction and I almost quit the diet. I am glad

> that I continued because SCD is the right diet for him.

>

> Since your daughter is not transitioning from GFCF,why not give her

> the SCD yogurt? You had mentioned that she eats yogurt.

> If you decide to do it with goat milk,avoid the Meyenburg brand. That

> brand does not taste good. SCD yogurt made from cow milk might be OK

> for use during the transition time.

>

> How about doing a gradual transition to SCD? I remember one family

> took several weeks to transition their child to SCD. They took their

> child to a favorite playground and rewarded him for trying bits of new

> foods with a chance to ride on favorite equipment. Or you might try

> drops of the new foods mixed in her old foods and gradually increase

> the amount.

>

> Another option would be to try to get her to eat more gelatin and tough

>it out.

>

> Mimi

>

>

> > I really hope someone can help me!! My 3 yr. old daughter started

> > the diet 5 days ago. I shouldn't even say she's doing the 'diet'

> > because she's not - she just stopped eating.

> >

> > She never, ever ate good to begin with (Nutrigrain bars, toast,

> > yogurt, chicken nuggets. That's it.) but now she's not eating

> > anything since Wednesday. She had a small amount of Jello Tuesday

> > (made with Welch's Grape Juice) and that has been it. I made

> > homemade nuggets, applesauce, banana bread, peanut butter brownies,

> > everything I could think of that she might possible try. But nothing.

> >

> > I took her out of school this week and next week, thinking i'd have

> > her eating by the following Monday but it's not looking good at all.

> >

> > Here is my biggest dilema. She will not keep her clothes on or her

> > shoes. Nothing I put on her. She keeps taking her diaper off and

> > pooping on the floor (which is all diarrhea because she hasn't eaten

> > anything). We had to throw her sheets away last night because she

> > smeared it everywhere. She went on my living room floor. She just

> > went in her bedroom. She is a little red on her private area.

> >

> > My husband is losing it. He's talking about killing himself. He said

> > he can't stand to see her smear her poop like an animal. He has been

> > so supportive of all the biomed we have done, all her supplements

> > and chelation. Everything. But this just set him over the edge. He

> > can't bear to see her like this.

> >

> > I just don't know what to do. Is this die off? Is she starving? What

> > do I do if she won't eat anything? I'm at a loss. She has severe

> > texture issues - I even tried to give her baby food (I know it's not

> > legal but I just want her to eat). Do I try to force her to eat or

> > do I just lay it our there and she'll eat it eventually?

> >

> > Any advice at all would be sooooooo appreciated! And any answers on

> > the poop smearing and not wearing clothes - has anyone else

> > experienced this before? How long does it last? I have been giving

> > her charcoal to try and absorb some die off but I don't even know if

> > that is what's going on.

> >

> > Sorry for all the questions - we're just a mess over here and I'm on

> > the verge of losing my husband.

> >

> > I have the book Breaking the Vicious Cycle and I didn't read

> > anything this horrible in there. I guess it's easier for people who

> > have children that actually eat. The diet isn't going to work for us

> > if I can't get her to eat ANYTHING.

> >

> > Thank you all in advance,

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Also the Mom of the 2 1/2 year old boy and the five month old twins. Her screen

name is mrsdeals. Her boy did not eat for about nine days and then he broke

down and started eating like crazy.

desiree rinehart wrote: I believe it was me...! We

are just passing our 3 month regression as we

speak. I have offered to help in any way I can and I have posted to

this morning. If your listening, I am here and I have experienced MANY

of the same things you are! Please e mail so I can help.

-MOM to Dylan PDD NOS

>

>Reply-To: pecanbread

>To: <pecanbread >

>Subject: Re: PLEASE HELP!? Daughter on diet 5 days and pooping

>everywhere!

>Date: Sun, 19 Nov 2006 15:39:15 -0500

>

>Didn't we have some new to scd post just a month back or so who had the

>same problem with a hunger strike? I can't remember who it was, but I know

>that it went on for days. Maybe she could be a huge support for right

>now.

>Meleah scd 05/06

>iel 3.5yrs. asd, Ethan 5yrs., Mark 18mths., both nt

>

> Re: PLEASE HELP!? Daughter on diet 5 days and

>pooping everywhere!

>

>

> ,

>

> This sounds to me like a horrrible die off reaction. I feel for you.

> My son also had a bad reaction and I almost quit the diet. I am glad

> that I continued because SCD is the right diet for him.

>

> Since your daughter is not transitioning from GFCF,why not give her

> the SCD yogurt? You had mentioned that she eats yogurt.

> If you decide to do it with goat milk,avoid the Meyenburg brand. That

> brand does not taste good. SCD yogurt made from cow milk might be OK

> for use during the transition time.

>

> How about doing a gradual transition to SCD? I remember one family

> took several weeks to transition their child to SCD. They took their

> child to a favorite playground and rewarded him for trying bits of new

> foods with a chance to ride on favorite equipment. Or you might try

> drops of the new foods mixed in her old foods and gradually increase

> the amount.

>

> Another option would be to try to get her to eat more gelatin and tough

>it out.

>

> Mimi

>

>

> > I really hope someone can help me!! My 3 yr. old daughter started

> > the diet 5 days ago. I shouldn't even say she's doing the 'diet'

> > because she's not - she just stopped eating.

> >

> > She never, ever ate good to begin with (Nutrigrain bars, toast,

> > yogurt, chicken nuggets. That's it.) but now she's not eating

> > anything since Wednesday. She had a small amount of Jello Tuesday

> > (made with Welch's Grape Juice) and that has been it. I made

> > homemade nuggets, applesauce, banana bread, peanut butter brownies,

> > everything I could think of that she might possible try. But nothing.

> >

> > I took her out of school this week and next week, thinking i'd have

> > her eating by the following Monday but it's not looking good at all.

> >

> > Here is my biggest dilema. She will not keep her clothes on or her

> > shoes. Nothing I put on her. She keeps taking her diaper off and

> > pooping on the floor (which is all diarrhea because she hasn't eaten

> > anything). We had to throw her sheets away last night because she

> > smeared it everywhere. She went on my living room floor. She just

> > went in her bedroom. She is a little red on her private area.

> >

> > My husband is losing it. He's talking about killing himself. He said

> > he can't stand to see her smear her poop like an animal. He has been

> > so supportive of all the biomed we have done, all her supplements

> > and chelation. Everything. But this just set him over the edge. He

> > can't bear to see her like this.

> >

> > I just don't know what to do. Is this die off? Is she starving? What

> > do I do if she won't eat anything? I'm at a loss. She has severe

> > texture issues - I even tried to give her baby food (I know it's not

> > legal but I just want her to eat). Do I try to force her to eat or

> > do I just lay it our there and she'll eat it eventually?

> >

> > Any advice at all would be sooooooo appreciated! And any answers on

> > the poop smearing and not wearing clothes - has anyone else

> > experienced this before? How long does it last? I have been giving

> > her charcoal to try and absorb some die off but I don't even know if

> > that is what's going on.

> >

> > Sorry for all the questions - we're just a mess over here and I'm on

> > the verge of losing my husband.

> >

> > I have the book Breaking the Vicious Cycle and I didn't read

> > anything this horrible in there. I guess it's easier for people who

> > have children that actually eat. The diet isn't going to work for us

> > if I can't get her to eat ANYTHING.

> >

> > Thank you all in advance,

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Yes. That's who I was thinking of. Ilene, please chyme in here for some

encouragement and suggestions for . You just went through this, so I think

you'll be awesome.

Meleah

Re: PLEASE HELP!? Daughter on diet 5 days and

>pooping everywhere!

>

>

> ,

>

> This sounds to me like a horrrible die off reaction. I feel for you.

> My son also had a bad reaction and I almost quit the diet. I am glad

> that I continued because SCD is the right diet for him.

>

> Since your daughter is not transitioning from GFCF,why not give her

> the SCD yogurt? You had mentioned that she eats yogurt.

> If you decide to do it with goat milk,avoid the Meyenburg brand. That

> brand does not taste good. SCD yogurt made from cow milk might be OK

> for use during the transition time.

>

> How about doing a gradual transition to SCD? I remember one family

> took several weeks to transition their child to SCD. They took their

> child to a favorite playground and rewarded him for trying bits of new

> foods with a chance to ride on favorite equipment. Or you might try

> drops of the new foods mixed in her old foods and gradually increase

> the amount.

>

> Another option would be to try to get her to eat more gelatin and tough

>it out.

>

> Mimi

>

>

> > I really hope someone can help me!! My 3 yr. old daughter started

> > the diet 5 days ago. I shouldn't even say she's doing the 'diet'

> > because she's not - she just stopped eating.

> >

> > She never, ever ate good to begin with (Nutrigrain bars, toast,

> > yogurt, chicken nuggets. That's it.) but now she's not eating

> > anything since Wednesday. She had a small amount of Jello Tuesday

> > (made with Welch's Grape Juice) and that has been it. I made

> > homemade nuggets, applesauce, banana bread, peanut butter brownies,

> > everything I could think of that she might possible try. But nothing.

> >

> > I took her out of school this week and next week, thinking i'd have

> > her eating by the following Monday but it's not looking good at all.

> >

> > Here is my biggest dilema. She will not keep her clothes on or her

> > shoes. Nothing I put on her. She keeps taking her diaper off and

> > pooping on the floor (which is all diarrhea because she hasn't eaten

> > anything). We had to throw her sheets away last night because she

> > smeared it everywhere. She went on my living room floor. She just

> > went in her bedroom. She is a little red on her private area.

> >

> > My husband is losing it. He's talking about killing himself. He said

> > he can't stand to see her smear her poop like an animal. He has been

> > so supportive of all the biomed we have done, all her supplements

> > and chelation. Everything. But this just set him over the edge. He

> > can't bear to see her like this.

> >

> > I just don't know what to do. Is this die off? Is she starving? What

> > do I do if she won't eat anything? I'm at a loss. She has severe

> > texture issues - I even tried to give her baby food (I know it's not

> > legal but I just want her to eat). Do I try to force her to eat or

> > do I just lay it our there and she'll eat it eventually?

> >

> > Any advice at all would be sooooooo appreciated! And any answers on

> > the poop smearing and not wearing clothes - has anyone else

> > experienced this before? How long does it last? I have been giving

> > her charcoal to try and absorb some die off but I don't even know if

> > that is what's going on.

> >

> > Sorry for all the questions - we're just a mess over here and I'm on

> > the verge of losing my husband.

> >

> > I have the book Breaking the Vicious Cycle and I didn't read

> > anything this horrible in there. I guess it's easier for people who

> > have children that actually eat. The diet isn't going to work for us

> > if I can't get her to eat ANYTHING.

> >

> > Thank you all in advance,

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

,

Thanks for jumping in to help out with . I'm sure you'll be a big support

for her.

Meleah

Re: PLEASE HELP!? Daughter on diet 5 days and

>pooping everywhere!

>

>

> ,

>

> This sounds to me like a horrrible die off reaction. I feel for you.

> My son also had a bad reaction and I almost quit the diet. I am glad

> that I continued because SCD is the right diet for him.

>

> Since your daughter is not transitioning from GFCF,why not give her

> the SCD yogurt? You had mentioned that she eats yogurt.

> If you decide to do it with goat milk,avoid the Meyenburg brand. That

> brand does not taste good. SCD yogurt made from cow milk might be OK

> for use during the transition time.

>

> How about doing a gradual transition to SCD? I remember one family

> took several weeks to transition their child to SCD. They took their

> child to a favorite playground and rewarded him for trying bits of new

> foods with a chance to ride on favorite equipment. Or you might try

> drops of the new foods mixed in her old foods and gradually increase

> the amount.

>

> Another option would be to try to get her to eat more gelatin and tough

>it out.

>

> Mimi

>

>

> > I really hope someone can help me!! My 3 yr. old daughter started

> > the diet 5 days ago. I shouldn't even say she's doing the 'diet'

> > because she's not - she just stopped eating.

> >

> > She never, ever ate good to begin with (Nutrigrain bars, toast,

> > yogurt, chicken nuggets. That's it.) but now she's not eating

> > anything since Wednesday. She had a small amount of Jello Tuesday

> > (made with Welch's Grape Juice) and that has been it. I made

> > homemade nuggets, applesauce, banana bread, peanut butter brownies,

> > everything I could think of that she might possible try. But nothing.

> >

> > I took her out of school this week and next week, thinking i'd have

> > her eating by the following Monday but it's not looking good at all.

> >

> > Here is my biggest dilema. She will not keep her clothes on or her

> > shoes. Nothing I put on her. She keeps taking her diaper off and

> > pooping on the floor (which is all diarrhea because she hasn't eaten

> > anything). We had to throw her sheets away last night because she

> > smeared it everywhere. She went on my living room floor. She just

> > went in her bedroom. She is a little red on her private area.

> >

> > My husband is losing it. He's talking about killing himself. He said

> > he can't stand to see her smear her poop like an animal. He has been

> > so supportive of all the biomed we have done, all her supplements

> > and chelation. Everything. But this just set him over the edge. He

> > can't bear to see her like this.

> >

> > I just don't know what to do. Is this die off? Is she starving? What

> > do I do if she won't eat anything? I'm at a loss. She has severe

> > texture issues - I even tried to give her baby food (I know it's not

> > legal but I just want her to eat). Do I try to force her to eat or

> > do I just lay it our there and she'll eat it eventually?

> >

> > Any advice at all would be sooooooo appreciated! And any answers on

> > the poop smearing and not wearing clothes - has anyone else

> > experienced this before? How long does it last? I have been giving

> > her charcoal to try and absorb some die off but I don't even know if

> > that is what's going on.

> >

> > Sorry for all the questions - we're just a mess over here and I'm on

> > the verge of losing my husband.

> >

> > I have the book Breaking the Vicious Cycle and I didn't read

> > anything this horrible in there. I guess it's easier for people who

> > have children that actually eat. The diet isn't going to work for us

> > if I can't get her to eat ANYTHING.

> >

> > Thank you all in advance,

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

First, I would like to thank all of you from the bottom of my heart

for all your replies and help!

It has been such a tough week for me and my husband. We don't have a

support system besides each other and my discussion boards. I was

just about to throw in the towel when I signed on and read all of

your wonderful replies. It just gives me hope that we CAN get

through this.

I know the screaming and crying drives my husband nuts BUT her

sleeping through the night is a blessing for me. I have been the one

that gets up with her everytime she woke up screaming, whether it

be the weekdays or weekends, it's me. My husband could literally

sleep through a tornado (I'm not even joking) and I wake up when the

wind blows - so i've always been the lucky one to get 3 hours of

sleep a night.

Although she is sleeping through the night, her bedtime routine has

changed. We used to just put her in the bed, say I love you and

night-night and she would stay in bed whether she went to sleep or

not. This past week, she has been getting up after we shut the door,

she turns the light on and starts playing. The more we went in

there, the more she got back up. Last night, I unscrewed the light

bulb, and we heard her sitting in there in the dark playing. I don't

know if this is the 'toddler' in her coming through or if it's a bad

thing. We're so confused if the new little things she is doing are

good or bad.

As for her supplements, I didn't give her anything today since Patti

said it could be making things worse. She is on the following:

Vitamin C, D, E, K

B Complex

Cod Liver Oil

EFA

DHA

Zinc, Molybdeum, Selenium, Manganese, Magnesium

Lithium Oratate, Vanadium

Gaba

Grape seed Extract

Ibedone (sp?)

Diflucan (1ml 2 times a day)

she was on Valtrex until 2 weeks ago

Gastrocrom (for IBS)

B-12 Nasal Spray (every 3 days)

I've been giving her No-Fenol with GSE (I read that combo is good

for yeast)

Pro Bio Gold (I know it's not legal but I just spent $50 on the

bottle and hate to waste it)

Td-DMSA (every other weekend)

I think that's it. I didn't give her anything today though. Maybe

she needs a break from all of it anyway. Do you think I should still

give her Diflucan since she is chelating?

She should be starting a round of DMSA on Thursday, should I skip

this round if she is still not eating?

I also put her PJ's on backwards last night (I think Patti suggested

this) and so far so good! Thanks so much - I would have never

thought about that. She keeps getting one of her arms out but she

can't get the other one, so she just gives up! It's the first

morning in a week I haven't had to clean up poop, so thank you -

thank you - thank you!

She still hasn't eaten and we're on day 7 (she has had 3 bites of

jello and 2 bananas). I read about the smoothies and Rylee doesn't

care for that too much. she wouldn't eat the popsicles I made

because of the shape and she spotted the smallest piece of fruit you

could ever imagine. She inspects EVERYTHING! I just read one of the

replies and she said that she cooked down apples and peaches and

then froze them into little cubes. I think I might try that tonight,

it sounds hopeful!

Thank you everyone for all of the ideas. My Rylee is a tough nut

when it comes to food and textures but I really feel like I can do

this now. It's amazing how many good people are out there - thank

you all for everything. I was really feeling down and out this

weekend - very alone and at the end of my rope. Thank you all!

>

> ....

>

> You sound disheartened.... but you also sound like you are a

devoted mom, and determined to help her. You must have a strong

feeling that this diet is the right path to follow, but just can't

figure out how to get past these initial difficulties.

>

> That's where.... we hope..... we will be able to offer some help.

>

> It sounds like you've got one very strong-willed little girl on

your hands. And she has learned from experience that if she holds

out long enough, she will eventually get what she wants, food-wise

anyway. Wow! That is one SMART girl. I look at that as a real

strength in her.... difficult for you at the moment, but the future

potential of that is bright! Now, let's just see how we can work

through it!

>

> <<- the whole " you eat this and I'll give you this " strategy

definitely isn't going to

> work with her at all.>>

>

> That's okay.... you know her best. That's not the strategy to use

now... but we can still try some behavior strategies.... even if

it's just attempting to pair the new behavior you want (eating the

new SCD food) with something else that is highly reinforcing for

her. Is there any particular music or video that she really strongly

prefers? Any kind of toy or activity that you could do during the

time that you are hoping to get her to eat? I wouldn't try this as

a direct " you eat this bite and then you get to watch this video "

thing.... but more like maybe putting the video on while you're

having her drink her juice, so that experience is extra rewarding

for her. (Forgive me if this is just completely NOT something she

would respond to, ok?)

>

>

> <<She is drinking watered down OJ and Welch's grape juice. I gave

in

> and gave her a banana last night.>>

>

> Now..... this is a positive! This gives us a place to start. If

she is drinking the diluted juice, I think we can " sneak " other

stuff in.... possibly. Now, I mean VERY SLOWLY..... VERY small

quantities.

>

> Giving the banana at this point is fine.... as long as it was nice

and ripe. Well spotted with brown spots. I realise you don't want to

let her have nothing but bananas like she did before, so no

problem.

>

> What I would maybe try to do is ..... now stay with me here, I

know this may not be possible but let's give it a try. I would

attempt to put the juice in the blender... diluted.... but just a

small amount. Now, add a chunk of RIPE banana to that and whir.

See if she will accept drinking that. Don't try to fool her or

force her.... just act like it's no big deal. Try to *pretend* that

you're not all stressed out over whether she drinks it or not. I

know this might be hard, because you are so worried.... but hang in

there with me.

>

> IF she accepts even the TINIEST amount of it, just smile and

relax... give her kisses and praise... hugs.... whatever she likes.

But if she rejects it, just don't react at all.... no negative

reaction at ALL. Just put it aside and say " oh, well... maybe later. "

>

> If she DOES accept it.... that opens a whole new world of

possibilities. This is how got Dylan going.... but by

freezing cooked fruit, whirred into smoothie form, then frozen into

popsicles. As she says, at one point this is ALL he would eat....

but, you would be surprised at what you can sneak into a

smoothie/popsicle.

>

> <<We tried this diet in April (after

> GFCF didn't work for her) and she literally ate bananas for 5

weeks.

> Nothing but bananas so I didn't want to give them to her again

> because that's all she eat. >>

>

> I can understand that... any time a kid self-limits to eating

only ONE food, even if it's SCD legal, you really need to figure out

how to get more variety in. You'll have to put them out of sight and

limit her to a small amount, maybe..... but we could use that small

amount of banana she accepts to get her to eat other things. A

smoothie can include banana.... with legal juice, maybe homemade

coconut milk (helpful against yeast, too) and later, you can sneak

just a very TINY amount of pureed squash in with it and increase the

amount very, very gradually.

>

> If she prefers banana mashed, you can also sneak in an EXTREMELY

small amount of something else legal, such as pureed squash,

applesauce, SCD yogurt, nut butter, etc.

>

>

> <<As for giving her the foods she likes and gradually

transitioning in

> legal foods, she'll just hold out for 5 days until I give her the

> food she wants. If she knows that she's eventually going to get

> yogurt or pudding, then she'll just wait till I give her that.>>

>

> Well, she is a very persistant kid! Again, I think this will

eventually be a positive trait! Unfortunately, she has learned that

you'll eventually give in, so she'll need to un-learn that. That's

going to be a real hurdle for you.

>

> Keep in mind that as long as she's drinking.... and getting some

carbohydrate and nutrition from the legal juices.... she is not in

any danger of starving. She's just trying her darnedest to hold out

longer than you can. Stay strong!

>

>

> <<I put charcoal in her grape juice. She's pretty good about

taking

> all her supplements everyday.>>

>

> , would you mind telling us exactly what other supplements

she's taking right now? We sometimes suggest pulling all or most of

the supps in the beginning, until you get a good start on the diet.

It's amazing how often the supplements can end up working against

you at first.... even though it's all " good stuff " . Let's just make

sure there's nothing there that's going to sabotage all the effort

you're putting forth right now.

>

>

> <<As for my husband, well it's been an unbelievable rough 2 years.

We

> DO NOT have any help from family at all. >>

> I'm sorry to hear you don't have that family support. I'm sure a

lot of us here can relate. I just wish you had someone.... friend?

neighbor?.... who could be there for you right now. You don't live

anywhere near southwest Washington state, do you? If so.... I'll be

right over.

>

> <<It's just very

> devastating to watch your child smear their feces all over walls

and

> furniture - there just isn't anything more heart breaking.>>

>

> I know this is breaking your heart right now... and frustrating

you to no end... but I am confident that this is the chemical

toxins being given off by the bad bacteria. The same toxins the gut

pathogens have been giving off all along, which drive the kids into

their world of autism... are all being released now, all at ONCE, as

these bad guys bite the dust. Hopefully, you can think of it that

way... it's not your daughter.... it's like she's possessed by these

bad guys who are DESPERATE to survive and are driving her crazy.

>

> They WANT TO SURVIVE.... so they are sending her messages to GO

GET FOOD. Meaning, they want their Nutrigrain bars and their sugary

yogurt and all the other stuff that they've been thriving on all

this time. They KNOW they will DIE if they don't get it.... so they

are willing to go to desperate measures to influence

their " host " .... and break down your will to defeat them. This is a

life or death struggle for them and they mean to win. You must make

up your mind that your plan is to erradicate them from your

daughter's body once and for all..... and determine you won't give

in to them!

>

>

> <<I have been giving her Epsom Salt baths everyday and the

charcoal.

> There aren't any clothes that she doesn't know how to take off, so

> we are at a loss there too.>>

>

> I'm glad to hear you're doing the baths... I think that's a good

thing. She's not drinking the bathwater, is she? If so, that would

cause diarrhea. I'm not able to help you with the clothing issue, I

guess. The only thing I can think of is to use blanket sleepers....

zip them up to the neck and literally sew the zipper shut with a

needle and thread... just a few stitches with strong thread,

knotted securely. You'd then just have to clip that thread to get

the zipper down to change her. At least that might work at night. ??

>

> <<She might be starving right now but she has slept through

> the night for the past 5 days and for that I am eternally

grateful,

> I haven't had nights like this in a long time.>>

>

> Aha! Now THIS is another positive sign! I see that as a strong

indication that you're on the right track. Keep hanging on to those

positive little bits.

>

>

> <<But when she's up,

> she is definitely in her own world - one minute she seems to

be 'on'

> and the next she's somewhere else in a fog. It's just so

confusing.>>

>

> Listen, she is in the middle of die-off detox.... this is TOUGH.

The times when she's " on " will increase, I'm just sure of it.... but

for right now, it's very common for there to be ups and downs... and

periods where the toxins are definitely affecting her brain. Keep up

with the charcoal and the epsom salts. You're doing the right thing!

>

>

> <<I read parents writing that their children eat chicken, beef,

lamb,

> peas, carrots, fruit, etc.....I just could NEVER IMAGINE our

> daughter eating ANY of that.>>

>

> Don't worry about that for now..... that's just too

overwhelming. You *may* be very delightfully surprised, just don't

add that to your burden right now. Focus on what legal things she

will eat right now, and we'll slowly work from there.

>

>

> <<I put banana baby food in an empty yogurt container (her

> favorite banana yogurt) yesterday and she took the biggest bite!

As

> soon as she realized that it wasn't yogurt, she spit it out all

over

> the floor>>

>

> Okay.... well, fooling her that way obviously isn't going to work.

She's too smart for that! That's okay. Now, do try to resist the

urge to use commercial baby food banana, okay? Just real, ripe

bananas. Mashed, or whatever way she will accept a little bit.

>

> <<I honestly don't know if anyone can help me or not. I guess I

just

> really needed someone to talk to. I'm going to tough it out for

the

> next few days and see what happens.>>

>

> That's what we're here for. Believe me, other parents here

have been through very, very rough times in the beginning. You can

get through this.... just make up your mind that you are stronger

than the bad gut bugs that want to control your daughter's body and

mind.

>

> Patti

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

> She never, ever ate good to begin with (Nutrigrain bars, toast,

> yogurt, chicken nuggets. That's it.) but now she's not eating

> anything since Wednesday. She had a small amount of Jello Tuesday

> (made with Welch's Grape Juice) and that has been it.

....

> so supportive of all the biomed we have done, all her supplements

> and chelation. Everything. But this just set him over the edge. He

> can't bear to see her like this.

>

> I just don't know what to do. Is this die off? Is she starving?

A couple of thoughts:

What kind of yogurt has she eaten in the past? Since she is doing

chelation yeast and other nasty microbes maybe increasing. This

*could be* at the root of some of these behaviours. Giving her some

of the SCD yogurt may help keep yeast down while she's chelating.

Starting the SCD and Chelating at the same time are probably causing

massive die off.

Depending on the yogurt she ate before if it was commercial yogurt

with fruit or plain etc.. we may be able to suggest a SCD recipe that

mimics it for you in taste and texture. That would give her a source

of protein and good bacteria among other things.

The homemade jello gives her some protein and legal carbs.

If she continues to barely eat and you are concerned about

dehydration you could try the electrolyte mix:

ELECTROLYTE DRINK

from the LI Listserve

1 quart boiled water

2 tbsp. honey

1/4 tsp. of salt

1/4 tsp.baking soda

Can be kept in refrigerator for 24 hours.

After that, a new batch should be made.

The Elec. mix has helped a number of parents make it through food

strikes.

Sheila, SCD Feb. 2001, UC 22yrs

mom of and

[Guest guest]

Hi Sheila,

She ate banana yogurt with NO FRUIT. It was the Smooth and Creamy

kind with no bits of anything in it.

She ate the Giant Eagle brand for a long time (that is a grocery

store chain here in Ohio - I wasn't sure if it was around the U.S.)

but then I tried to get some better stuff in her and I found

Stonyfield Farms Yogurt in the Organic Aisle. It comes in Banana and

Strawberry. She liked both of those.

Her DAN! Dr. told us to do SCD without dairy. I asked him if I could

try and make the yogurt and he said he would prefer that we didn't.

Is it okay for her to have the yogurt? Are their other children that

eat the yogurt or 'acceptable' cheeses ? Rylee immediately starts

spinning in circles and repeating the same low-pitched sounds over

and over again everytime she eats yogurt.

I made a batch of the yogurt about 4 months ago and it looked great.

I put it in the freezer and when it defrosted it looked like spoiled

milk. It was watery and broken down into little chunks. It looked

nothing like it did before I put it in the freezer. I'm assuming I

did something very wrong!

I was thinking at the time to blend some very ripe bananas in the

yogurt with a little vanilla extract but I never made it that far. I

am willing to give it a shot again if you think it's okay for her to

have it.

Any suggestions would be great - I just want her to eat something!

Thanks again,

>

> Hi ,

>

> > She never, ever ate good to begin with (Nutrigrain bars, toast,

> > yogurt, chicken nuggets. That's it.) but now she's not eating

> > anything since Wednesday. She had a small amount of Jello

Tuesday

> > (made with Welch's Grape Juice) and that has been it.

>

> ...

>

> > so supportive of all the biomed we have done, all her

supplements

> > and chelation. Everything. But this just set him over the edge.

He

> > can't bear to see her like this.

> >

> > I just don't know what to do. Is this die off? Is she starving?

>

> A couple of thoughts:

>

> What kind of yogurt has she eaten in the past? Since she is doing

> chelation yeast and other nasty microbes maybe increasing. This

> *could be* at the root of some of these behaviours. Giving her

some

> of the SCD yogurt may help keep yeast down while she's chelating.

>

> Starting the SCD and Chelating at the same time are probably

causing

> massive die off.

>

> Depending on the yogurt she ate before if it was commercial yogurt

> with fruit or plain etc.. we may be able to suggest a SCD recipe

that

> mimics it for you in taste and texture. That would give her a

source

> of protein and good bacteria among other things.

>

> The homemade jello gives her some protein and legal carbs.

>

> If she continues to barely eat and you are concerned about

> dehydration you could try the electrolyte mix:

>

> ELECTROLYTE DRINK

> from the LI Listserve

>

> 1 quart boiled water

> 2 tbsp. honey

> 1/4 tsp. of salt

> 1/4 tsp.baking soda

>

> Can be kept in refrigerator for 24 hours.

> After that, a new batch should be made.

>

>

> The Elec. mix has helped a number of parents make it through food

> strikes.

>

> Sheila, SCD Feb. 2001, UC 22yrs

> mom of and

>

[Guest guest]

>

> Is it okay for her to have the yogurt? Are their other children that

> eat the yogurt or 'acceptable' cheeses ? Rylee immediately starts

> spinning in circles and repeating the same low-pitched sounds over

> and over again everytime she eats yogurt.

>

> I made a batch of the yogurt about 4 months ago and it looked great.

> I put it in the freezer and when it defrosted it looked like spoiled

> milk. It was watery and broken down into little chunks. It looked

> nothing like it did before I put it in the freezer. I'm assuming I

> did something very wrong!

>

> I was thinking at the time to blend some very ripe bananas in the

> yogurt with a little vanilla extract but I never made it that far. I

> am willing to give it a shot again if you think it's okay for her to

> have it.

,

You are asking Sheila whether she should give you permission to go against your

doctor's

orders. I think you have to make your own decision.

Many DANs are anti dairy and yet we get some awsome results with yogurt

introduced

gradually. And that is by parents who were formerly GFCF.

I would not feed the thawed separted yogurt. It sounds like it's off and if in

doubt,

wasting a quart of milk is better than risking making a child ill. Yogurt can be

used in

frozen dessert recipes, but usually they get eaten soon after. After several

months in the

freezer many foods should not be used and it does sound like something went

wrong

making that yogurt.

Give some thought to introducing the yogurt later and discussing with your

doctor how

the casein in our homemade yogurt gets denatured and the lactose is almost

entirely

consumed in the incubating process. If you can win him ovet=r, you will feel

more

comfortable with using the SCD approved dairy. However, you can certainly do SCD

dairy

free if you wish to.

Carol F.

SCD 6 years, celiac

[Guest guest]

,

The getting out of bed to play is a completely normal toddler thing. Both my

neurotypical child, age five, and my asd child, iel-age three have done

this when they transitioned from a crib to a bed. I know that your daughter has

been in a bed all along, but I think that she's slowly beginning to exhibit some

typical behaviors. When my oldest went through this, I asked friends what to

do. They told me just to let it go as long as he didn't come out of his room.

The novelty of realizing that he could get up if he wanted to was worth the

punishment that I was giving him. They both outgrew it, and I'm sure that we'll

go through it again when my 18 mth. old moves to a bed. I think she's on a huge

amount of supplements. I think that it is good that you pull them all for a

bit. Personally, I'd reintroduce the efa or cod liver oil first because it

seems like one of the supps that kids rarely have a problem with. If you can

get the B12 in injection form, you could put that back in as well. That way

would bipass the gut, so shouldn't cause problems. I didn't see any form of

folate(folinic or folic acid) on that supp list. Those two usually go hand in

hand, and you can see hyperactivity/agressive behavior come out if the two

aren't working together. Is your physician really familiar with scd? I was

just talking to a friend locally last week whose son is chelation with DMSA, and

she was telling me that it is more harsh than DMPS. We used the DMPS, and saw

great results with the first round. However, we were scd for four months before

beginning that. It is true that chelation can be hard on the gut, and that it

might be good to give scd a chance to heal her gut before you begin chelating.

Have you talked to your doctor about this? Can I ask who your doctor is? As

far as reintroducing the supps, this is my personal opinion of how I would bring

them back in. First, I'd bring in a good, scd legal probiotic. That is

absolutely critical. Then, I'd bring in a multi vitamin a few days later.

After that, I'd start the clo or efa for those good brrain fats. Then, I'd do a

B12. I honestly don't know a whole lot about most of the supps you're using,

but here's my thought. You've got to get that gut repopulated with good

bacteria first. Then, you want to bring in a general scd legal mutlivitamin for

general health since she's limiting her foods right now. Next, you'd want those

good, brain developing fats, and the B12 will help with brain development,

language, and even natural chelation a bit. Remember to check on folinic acid

with the B12. I really think that you're going to see great results with scd.

It seems like not much progress to you, but you've got some really good signs

going for you so far. How old is your daughter? I'll keep praying for you.

Meleah scd 05/06

iel 3.5yrs. asd, Ethan 5yrs., Mark 18mths., both nt

Re: PLEASE HELP!? Daughter on diet 5 days and pooping

everywhere!

First, I would like to thank all of you from the bottom of my heart

for all your replies and help!

It has been such a tough week for me and my husband. We don't have a

support system besides each other and my discussion boards. I was

just about to throw in the towel when I signed on and read all of

your wonderful replies. It just gives me hope that we CAN get

through this.

I know the screaming and crying drives my husband nuts BUT her

sleeping through the night is a blessing for me. I have been the one

that gets up with her everytime she woke up screaming, whether it

be the weekdays or weekends, it's me. My husband could literally

sleep through a tornado (I'm not even joking) and I wake up when the

wind blows - so i've always been the lucky one to get 3 hours of

sleep a night.

Although she is sleeping through the night, her bedtime routine has

changed. We used to just put her in the bed, say I love you and

night-night and she would stay in bed whether she went to sleep or

not. This past week, she has been getting up after we shut the door,

she turns the light on and starts playing. The more we went in

there, the more she got back up. Last night, I unscrewed the light

bulb, and we heard her sitting in there in the dark playing. I don't

know if this is the 'toddler' in her coming through or if it's a bad

thing. We're so confused if the new little things she is doing are

good or bad.

As for her supplements, I didn't give her anything today since Patti

said it could be making things worse. She is on the following:

Vitamin C, D, E, K

B Complex

Cod Liver Oil

EFA

DHA

Zinc, Molybdeum, Selenium, Manganese, Magnesium

Lithium Oratate, Vanadium

Gaba

Grape seed Extract

Ibedone (sp?)

Diflucan (1ml 2 times a day)

she was on Valtrex until 2 weeks ago

Gastrocrom (for IBS)

B-12 Nasal Spray (every 3 days)

I've been giving her No-Fenol with GSE (I read that combo is good

for yeast)

Pro Bio Gold (I know it's not legal but I just spent $50 on the

bottle and hate to waste it)

Td-DMSA (every other weekend)

I think that's it. I didn't give her anything today though. Maybe

she needs a break from all of it anyway. Do you think I should still

give her Diflucan since she is chelating?

She should be starting a round of DMSA on Thursday, should I skip

this round if she is still not eating?

I also put her PJ's on backwards last night (I think Patti suggested

this) and so far so good! Thanks so much - I would have never

thought about that. She keeps getting one of her arms out but she

can't get the other one, so she just gives up! It's the first

morning in a week I haven't had to clean up poop, so thank you -

thank you - thank you!

She still hasn't eaten and we're on day 7 (she has had 3 bites of

jello and 2 bananas). I read about the smoothies and Rylee doesn't

care for that too much. she wouldn't eat the popsicles I made

because of the shape and she spotted the smallest piece of fruit you

could ever imagine. She inspects EVERYTHING! I just read one of the

replies and she said that she cooked down apples and peaches and

then froze them into little cubes. I think I might try that tonight,

it sounds hopeful!

Thank you everyone for all of the ideas. My Rylee is a tough nut

when it comes to food and textures but I really feel like I can do

this now. It's amazing how many good people are out there - thank

you all for everything. I was really feeling down and out this

weekend - very alone and at the end of my rope. Thank you all!

>

> ....

>

> You sound disheartened.... but you also sound like you are a

devoted mom, and determined to help her. You must have a strong

feeling that this diet is the right path to follow, but just can't

figure out how to get past these initial difficulties.

>

> That's where.... we hope..... we will be able to offer some help.

>

> It sounds like you've got one very strong-willed little girl on

your hands. And she has learned from experience that if she holds

out long enough, she will eventually get what she wants, food-wise

anyway. Wow! That is one SMART girl. I look at that as a real

strength in her.... difficult for you at the moment, but the future

potential of that is bright! Now, let's just see how we can work

through it!

>

> <<- the whole " you eat this and I'll give you this " strategy

definitely isn't going to

> work with her at all.>>

>

> That's okay.... you know her best. That's not the strategy to use

now... but we can still try some behavior strategies.... even if

it's just attempting to pair the new behavior you want (eating the

new SCD food) with something else that is highly reinforcing for

her. Is there any particular music or video that she really strongly

prefers? Any kind of toy or activity that you could do during the

time that you are hoping to get her to eat? I wouldn't try this as

a direct " you eat this bite and then you get to watch this video "

thing.... but more like maybe putting the video on while you're

having her drink her juice, so that experience is extra rewarding

for her. (Forgive me if this is just completely NOT something she

would respond to, ok?)

>

>

> <<She is drinking watered down OJ and Welch's grape juice. I gave

in

> and gave her a banana last night.>>

>

> Now..... this is a positive! This gives us a place to start. If

she is drinking the diluted juice, I think we can " sneak " other

stuff in.... possibly. Now, I mean VERY SLOWLY..... VERY small

quantities.

>

> Giving the banana at this point is fine.... as long as it was nice

and ripe. Well spotted with brown spots. I realise you don't want to

let her have nothing but bananas like she did before, so no

problem.

>

> What I would maybe try to do is ..... now stay with me here, I

know this may not be possible but let's give it a try. I would

attempt to put the juice in the blender... diluted.... but just a

small amount. Now, add a chunk of RIPE banana to that and whir.

See if she will accept drinking that. Don't try to fool her or

force her.... just act like it's no big deal. Try to *pretend* that

you're not all stressed out over whether she drinks it or not. I

know this might be hard, because you are so worried.... but hang in

there with me.

>

> IF she accepts even the TINIEST amount of it, just smile and

relax... give her kisses and praise... hugs.... whatever she likes.

But if she rejects it, just don't react at all.... no negative

reaction at ALL. Just put it aside and say " oh, well... maybe later. "

>

> If she DOES accept it.... that opens a whole new world of

possibilities. This is how got Dylan going.... but by

freezing cooked fruit, whirred into smoothie form, then frozen into

popsicles. As she says, at one point this is ALL he would eat....

but, you would be surprised at what you can sneak into a

smoothie/popsicle.

>

> <<We tried this diet in April (after

> GFCF didn't work for her) and she literally ate bananas for 5

weeks.

> Nothing but bananas so I didn't want to give them to her again

> because that's all she eat. >>

>

> I can understand that... any time a kid self-limits to eating

only ONE food, even if it's SCD legal, you really need to figure out

how to get more variety in. You'll have to put them out of sight and

limit her to a small amount, maybe..... but we could use that small

amount of banana she accepts to get her to eat other things. A

smoothie can include banana.... with legal juice, maybe homemade

coconut milk (helpful against yeast, too) and later, you can sneak

just a very TINY amount of pureed squash in with it and increase the

amount very, very gradually.

>

> If she prefers banana mashed, you can also sneak in an EXTREMELY

small amount of something else legal, such as pureed squash,

applesauce, SCD yogurt, nut butter, etc.

>

>

> <<As for giving her the foods she likes and gradually

transitioning in

> legal foods, she'll just hold out for 5 days until I give her the

> food she wants. If she knows that she's eventually going to get

> yogurt or pudding, then she'll just wait till I give her that.>>

>

> Well, she is a very persistant kid! Again, I think this will

eventually be a positive trait! Unfortunately, she has learned that

you'll eventually give in, so she'll need to un-learn that. That's

going to be a real hurdle for you.

>

> Keep in mind that as long as she's drinking.... and getting some

carbohydrate and nutrition from the legal juices.... she is not in

any danger of starving. She's just trying her darnedest to hold out

longer than you can. Stay strong!

>

>

> <<I put charcoal in her grape juice. She's pretty good about

taking

> all her supplements everyday.>>

>

> , would you mind telling us exactly what other supplements

she's taking right now? We sometimes suggest pulling all or most of

the supps in the beginning, until you get a good start on the diet.

It's amazing how often the supplements can end up working against

you at first.... even though it's all " good stuff " . Let's just make

sure there's nothing there that's going to sabotage all the effort

you're putting forth right now.

>

>

> <<As for my husband, well it's been an unbelievable rough 2 years.

We

> DO NOT have any help from family at all. >>

> I'm sorry to hear you don't have that family support. I'm sure a

lot of us here can relate. I just wish you had someone.... friend?

neighbor?.... who could be there for you right now. You don't live

anywhere near southwest Washington state, do you? If so.... I'll be

right over.

>

> <<It's just very

> devastating to watch your child smear their feces all over walls

and

> furniture - there just isn't anything more heart breaking.>>

>

> I know this is breaking your heart right now... and frustrating

you to no end... but I am confident that this is the chemical

toxins being given off by the bad bacteria. The same toxins the gut

pathogens have been giving off all along, which drive the kids into

their world of autism... are all being released now, all at ONCE, as

these bad guys bite the dust. Hopefully, you can think of it that

way... it's not your daughter.... it's like she's possessed by these

bad guys who are DESPERATE to survive and are driving her crazy.

>

> They WANT TO SURVIVE.... so they are sending her messages to GO

GET FOOD. Meaning, they want their Nutrigrain bars and their sugary

yogurt and all the other stuff that they've been thriving on all

this time. They KNOW they will DIE if they don't get it.... so they

are willing to go to desperate measures to influence

their " host " .... and break down your will to defeat them. This is a

life or death struggle for them and they mean to win. You must make

up your mind that your plan is to erradicate them from your

daughter's body once and for all..... and determine you won't give

in to them!

>

>

> <<I have been giving her Epsom Salt baths everyday and the

charcoal.

> There aren't any clothes that she doesn't know how to take off, so

> we are at a loss there too.>>

>

> I'm glad to hear you're doing the baths... I think that's a good

thing. She's not drinking the bathwater, is she? If so, that would

cause diarrhea. I'm not able to help you with the clothing issue, I

guess. The only thing I can think of is to use blanket sleepers....

zip them up to the neck and literally sew the zipper shut with a

needle and thread... just a few stitches with strong thread,

knotted securely. You'd then just have to clip that thread to get

the zipper down to change her. At least that might work at night. ??

>

> <<She might be starving right now but she has slept through

> the night for the past 5 days and for that I am eternally

grateful,

> I haven't had nights like this in a long time.>>

>

> Aha! Now THIS is another positive sign! I see that as a strong

indication that you're on the right track. Keep hanging on to those

positive little bits.

>

>

> <<But when she's up,

> she is definitely in her own world - one minute she seems to

be 'on'

> and the next she's somewhere else in a fog. It's just so

confusing.>>

>

> Listen, she is in the middle of die-off detox.... this is TOUGH.

The times when she's " on " will increase, I'm just sure of it.... but

for right now, it's very common for there to be ups and downs... and

periods where the toxins are definitely affecting her brain. Keep up

with the charcoal and the epsom salts. You're doing the right thing!

>

>

> <<I read parents writing that their children eat chicken, beef,

lamb,

> peas, carrots, fruit, etc.....I just could NEVER IMAGINE our

> daughter eating ANY of that.>>

>

> Don't worry about that for now..... that's just too

overwhelming. You *may* be very delightfully surprised, just don't

add that to your burden right now. Focus on what legal things she

will eat right now, and we'll slowly work from there.

>

>

> <<I put banana baby food in an empty yogurt container (her

> favorite banana yogurt) yesterday and she took the biggest bite!

As

> soon as she realized that it wasn't yogurt, she spit it out all

over

> the floor>>

>

> Okay.... well, fooling her that way obviously isn't going to work.

She's too smart for that! That's okay. Now, do try to resist the

urge to use commercial baby food banana, okay? Just real, ripe

bananas. Mashed, or whatever way she will accept a little bit.

>

> <<I honestly don't know if anyone can help me or not. I guess I

just

> really needed someone to talk to. I'm going to tough it out for

the

> next few days and see what happens.>>

>

> That's what we're here for. Believe me, other parents here

have been through very, very rough times in the beginning. You can

get through this.... just make up your mind that you are stronger

than the bad gut bugs that want to control your daughter's body and

mind.

>

> Patti

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

I am glad you found a trick that will help you keep her jammies on. I think I

suggested stitching the zipper shut, so putting them on backward was someone

elses idea. And a good one!

I want to address the supplements.... but first, I must tell you that I know

EXACTLY how what you mean by this:

<<My husband could literally sleep through a tornado (I'm not even joking) and I

wake up when the wind blows - so i've always been the lucky one to get 3 hours

of sleep a night.>>

I have a feeling many husbands have this convenient trait. Mine is certainly one

of them!

Now.... on the supplements and medications....

First, I don't think you should stop any prescription medication that she's

taking (unless you and her doctor agree that it has not been helping anyway)...

but you should make every effort you can to get the med compounded without

illegals, or at least, get the Rx filled in a tablet or capsule form that has as

few illegal starches/sugars as possible. Compounding pharmacies can make up a

special Rx with zero fillers in most cases (but it can be expensive).

Supplement wise, you didn't say when you started all of these. Are most of them

ones she's been taking for quite a while? Or did you start some of them

recently? Anything that has illegals in it can definitely get in the way of you

making progress on SCD..... and even *some* things that look like they're

perfectly legal can cloud the picture and make it more difficult to get off to a

good start. That's why I just kind of like to pull back on almost everything in

the beginning.... for most kids. That's MY opinion, based on what I've seen for

a lot of other kids.

I don't think you need to stop the B-12 since it's a nasal spray. That shouldn't

be a problem.

I'm sorry to tell you that the Pro-Bio Gold.... WILL interfere with progress. I

know you hate to " waste " the $50... but let me jump up on my soapbox for a

minute.....

If you and your husband had scrimped and saved and finally scraped together

enough money to build a beautiful new home.... your DREAM house... would you

tell the builder to skimp on the foundation, and use the cheapest possible

materials to save money so you could have nice siding and windows, and enough

cash left over for pretty furniture??

If the builder said he could save you even more money by hiring unskilled

laborers with no experience whatsoever and pay them next to nothing to set that

cheapie foundation in place.... and hurry the process along to get going on the

actual house... would you think that was a good idea? Of course not!

It's obvious that you would want to safeguard your investment in something as

important as your home by building it on a solid foundation. Otherwise, even the

most fabulous new home could soon begin to crumble around you, ruining all your

hard work and COSTING you money in the long run!

I don't want to see you waste all the hard work you're putting forth right now,

and I don't want you to EVER have to go back to square one and go through ALL of

this again! I want to do everything I can to help you get it right from the

get-go.... and build that solid foundation for your sweet Rylee.

Now, she DOES need a probiotic.... but you need to make sure that you're giving

one that includes ONLY legal strains... l.acidophilus and s.boulardii are the

only ones allowed in a probiotic supplement, and one that does not contain any

illegal fillers. I know a lot of the DANs feel the kids need the bifidus

strains... but you need to know that they are illegal on true SCD... for good

reason. We have seen more than a few kids get into real trouble using them.

Acidophilus is the MAIN one you need to be sure she's getting.... s.boulardii is

effective against clostridia, if that has shown up in her tests. Anyway...

acidophilus... in a LEGAL form (check the www.pecanbread.com website).... will

help keep yeast from taking over as the bacterial colonies die off. So, it's

essential to get that going.

I don't know if you started chelation at the same time as the diet.... that's

another thing that can throw a monkey wrench into the mix. I personally just

wish the DAN docs would insist that everyone get on the diet.... do it right...

get stable..... and THEN start all these other good things.

Instead, I think they have this big " bag of tricks " and it's ALL GOOD... but

they want to throw it ALL at the kid at the same time. A " some is good.... more

is better " approach that tends to (IN MY OPINION) undermine true healing and

overwhelm the parents.... who then give up in frustration, saying " SCD didn't

work for my child " . Not to mention the fact that it's just plain HARD on these

poor kids to take so much at once.

We have some information that supports the idea that a healed, healthy gut

enables the body to chelate metals out.... all on it's own! At the very least,

getting the gut balanced and stable, and getting *some* healing down first would

make chelation more effective, in my view. It's common sense to me... others may

disagree.

If I were you, I would try to hold off on chelation for now.... but that's a

decision YOU need to make with your husband. Consult your own " gut feelings "

about this (pun intended!). Learn to trust what YOU really feel in your heart is

the best course of action. (OK... that's gut AND heart feelings. )

Keep in mind that a number of things (including selenium) work to pull mercury

and other metals out of the brain... and elsewhere in the body... but when you

stir them up and they're floating around in there, they *can* cause further

damage before they leave the body. This is not a process to take lightly.

We all wish that toxic metals could just instantly be OUT of our kid's bodies...

but think of it as sort of like removing a fish hook from your finger. If you

just grab it and RIP it out, that would certainly be the fastest way to get it

out, but you could cause more damage, scarring and infection than if you thought

it through carefully, took your time and removed it in a sensible way, under

CLEAN circumstances. OK...enough with the analogies!

When it comes to all the vitamins and minerals, etc... it's not that she doesn't

NEED these nutrients. I'm sure her test results are what the DAN is going by....

but it's questionable whether or not she is actually absorbing any of them. You

could be throwing $100's of dollars worth of supplements down the drain as they

just pass right through her. Gotta fix that gut!!

I have never heard of No-Fenol enzymes being good for yeast... but maybe that's

something new. I know the Candex enzymes are (and some other anti-yeast

enzymes)... and they are legal on SCD. No-Fenol is legal, too... but I am just

puzzled about it being for yeast. GSE is definitely anti-fungal... but do use

caution with all of those natural anti-fungals as the yeast can develop

resistance.... so you will need to rotate them to keep the effectiveness.

The prescription anti-fungal is different... although I am personally uneasy

about some of those, too... but I think you need to keep giving any

prescription medication that her doc has her on, unless you want to discuss that

with him and he agrees to let you wait. If you feel it's effective, you should

keep it in place... but make SURE there are no illegals in the Rx.

You said:

<<She still hasn't eaten and we're on day 7 (she has had 3 bites of

jello and 2 bananas). >>

So.... she IS eating! That's good. It may not seem like much, but it's a

start. I really liked the idea someone gave you last night of mixing broth into

her juice. You can do that with jello, too..... strain the broth really well

through cheesecloth (so there's no " bits " to inspect!)... and use that liquid to

mix with juice to make the jello. The broth has such good healing qualities.

Let's see what today brings...

Patti

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

> As for her supplements, I didn't give her anything today since

Patti

> said it could be making things worse. She is on the following:

> Vitamin C, D, E, K

> B Complex

> Cod Liver Oil

> EFA

> DHA

> Zinc, Molybdeum, Selenium, Manganese, Magnesium

> Lithium Oratate, Vanadium

> Gaba

> Grape seed Extract

> Ibedone (sp?)

What are the ingredients in the supps? If you want to send it to me

off list I can double check to make sure there are no SCD illegals.

> Diflucan (1ml 2 times a day)

> she was on Valtrex until 2 weeks ago

> Gastrocrom (for IBS)

> B-12 Nasal Spray (every 3 days)

> I've been giving her No-Fenol with GSE (I read that combo is good

> for yeast)

> Pro Bio Gold (I know it's not legal but I just spent $50 on the

> bottle and hate to waste it)

Although you may hate to waste it, the bifidum bacteria has be shown

to be extremely problematic for those on SCD. For those with pretty

good bowels bifidum may be a good choice , but once people start the

cd and start starving out the harmful microbes, the bifidum goes a

bit nuts and starts to overgrow. For some it happens immediately for

others, like myself, it takes a while. My bifidum flare started with

symptoms of " headfog " , gut pain, then cramps, diarrhea etc.. The

bifidum could be making her symptoms worse.

> Td-DMSA (every other weekend)

>

> I think that's it. I didn't give her anything today though. Maybe

> she needs a break from all of it anyway. Do you think I should

still

> give her Diflucan since she is chelating?

You may wish to discuss that with your doctor (doctor prescribed?).

It could be that the diflucan is too strong or needs to be adjusted

for the addition of SCD to the chelating.

> She should be starting a round of DMSA on Thursday, should I skip

> this round if she is still not eating?

You may want to discuss it with your doc. Is this something you can

start and stop? can you delay it a bit..., these types of questions.

All of it together may too intense on your daughter's system. When

I have gone through die off it has sometimes been very intense and I

only ever did one antifungal at a time. When I tried to combine

enzymes and antifungals I ended up with diarrhea.

Sheila, SCD Feb. 2001, UC 22yrs

mom of and

[Guest guest]

Okay, I don't know how many times I can say thank you to all of you

but THANK YOU!

I really, really feel like i'm ready to do this. I just started to

make a batch of yogurt and I also ordered the Acidophilus from

Kirkmans.

Before I forget, here is the link from the website that I read about

No-Fenol helping break down yeast.

http://www.enzymestuff.com/conditionbacteria.htm

They have tons of info about enzymes and other stuff.

I have tons more to thank you guys for but I have to run - I

promised my oldest daughter I would take her for ice cream after

school and she is standing here in my face :-)

Talk to you all soon,

>

> Hi ,

>

> I am glad you found a trick that will help you keep her jammies

on. I think I suggested stitching the zipper shut, so putting them

on backward was someone elses idea. And a good one!

>

> I want to address the supplements.... but first, I must tell you

that I know EXACTLY how what you mean by this:

>

> <<My husband could literally sleep through a tornado (I'm not even

joking) and I wake up when the wind blows - so i've always been the

lucky one to get 3 hours of sleep a night.>>

>

> I have a feeling many husbands have this convenient trait. Mine is

certainly one of them!

>

> Now.... on the supplements and medications....

>

> First, I don't think you should stop any prescription medication

that she's taking (unless you and her doctor agree that it has not

been helping anyway)... but you should make every effort you can to

get the med compounded without illegals, or at least, get the Rx

filled in a tablet or capsule form that has as few illegal

starches/sugars as possible. Compounding pharmacies can make up a

special Rx with zero fillers in most cases (but it can be expensive).

>

> Supplement wise, you didn't say when you started all of these. Are

most of them ones she's been taking for quite a while? Or did you

start some of them recently? Anything that has illegals in it can

definitely get in the way of you making progress on SCD..... and

even *some* things that look like they're perfectly legal can cloud

the picture and make it more difficult to get off to a good start.

That's why I just kind of like to pull back on almost everything in

the beginning.... for most kids. That's MY opinion, based on what

I've seen for a lot of other kids.

>

> I don't think you need to stop the B-12 since it's a nasal spray.

That shouldn't be a problem.

>

> I'm sorry to tell you that the Pro-Bio Gold.... WILL interfere

with progress. I know you hate to " waste " the $50... but let me

jump up on my soapbox for a minute.....

>

> If you and your husband had scrimped and saved and finally scraped

together enough money to build a beautiful new home.... your DREAM

house... would you tell the builder to skimp on the foundation, and

use the cheapest possible materials to save money so you could have

nice siding and windows, and enough cash left over for pretty

furniture??

>

> If the builder said he could save you even more money by hiring

unskilled laborers with no experience whatsoever and pay them next

to nothing to set that cheapie foundation in place.... and hurry the

process along to get going on the actual house... would you think

that was a good idea? Of course not!

>

> It's obvious that you would want to safeguard your investment in

something as important as your home by building it on a solid

foundation. Otherwise, even the most fabulous new home could soon

begin to crumble around you, ruining all your hard work and COSTING

you money in the long run!

>

> I don't want to see you waste all the hard work you're putting

forth right now, and I don't want you to EVER have to go back to

square one and go through ALL of this again! I want to do

everything I can to help you get it right from the get-go.... and

build that solid foundation for your sweet Rylee.

>

> Now, she DOES need a probiotic.... but you need to make sure that

you're giving one that includes ONLY legal strains... l.acidophilus

and s.boulardii are the only ones allowed in a probiotic supplement,

and one that does not contain any illegal fillers. I know a lot of

the DANs feel the kids need the bifidus strains... but you need to

know that they are illegal on true SCD... for good reason. We have

seen more than a few kids get into real trouble using them.

>

> Acidophilus is the MAIN one you need to be sure she's getting....

s.boulardii is effective against clostridia, if that has shown up in

her tests. Anyway... acidophilus... in a LEGAL form (check the

www.pecanbread.com website).... will help keep yeast from taking

over as the bacterial colonies die off. So, it's essential to get

that going.

>

> I don't know if you started chelation at the same time as the

diet.... that's another thing that can throw a monkey wrench into

the mix. I personally just wish the DAN docs would insist that

everyone get on the diet.... do it right... get stable..... and THEN

start all these other good things.

>

> Instead, I think they have this big " bag of tricks " and it's ALL

GOOD... but they want to throw it ALL at the kid at the same time.

A " some is good.... more is better " approach that tends to (IN MY

OPINION) undermine true healing and overwhelm the parents.... who

then give up in frustration, saying " SCD didn't work for my child " .

Not to mention the fact that it's just plain HARD on these poor kids

to take so much at once.

>

> We have some information that supports the idea that a healed,

healthy gut enables the body to chelate metals out.... all on it's

own! At the very least, getting the gut balanced and stable, and

getting *some* healing down first would make chelation more

effective, in my view. It's common sense to me... others may

disagree.

>

> If I were you, I would try to hold off on chelation for now....

but that's a decision YOU need to make with your husband. Consult

your own " gut feelings " about this (pun intended!). Learn to trust

what YOU really feel in your heart is the best course of action.

(OK... that's gut AND heart feelings. )

>

> Keep in mind that a number of things (including selenium) work to

pull mercury and other metals out of the brain... and elsewhere in

the body... but when you stir them up and they're floating around in

there, they *can* cause further damage before they leave the body.

This is not a process to take lightly.

>

> We all wish that toxic metals could just instantly be OUT of our

kid's bodies... but think of it as sort of like removing a fish hook

from your finger. If you just grab it and RIP it out, that would

certainly be the fastest way to get it out, but you could cause more

damage, scarring and infection than if you thought it through

carefully, took your time and removed it in a sensible way, under

CLEAN circumstances. OK...enough with the analogies!

>

> When it comes to all the vitamins and minerals, etc... it's not

that she doesn't NEED these nutrients. I'm sure her test results are

what the DAN is going by.... but it's questionable whether or not

she is actually absorbing any of them. You could be throwing $100's

of dollars worth of supplements down the drain as they just pass

right through her. Gotta fix that gut!!

>

> I have never heard of No-Fenol enzymes being good for yeast...

but maybe that's something new. I know the Candex enzymes are (and

some other anti-yeast enzymes)... and they are legal on SCD. No-

Fenol is legal, too... but I am just puzzled about it being for

yeast. GSE is definitely anti-fungal... but do use caution with

all of those natural anti-fungals as the yeast can develop

resistance.... so you will need to rotate them to keep the

effectiveness.

>

> The prescription anti-fungal is different... although I am

personally uneasy about some of those, too... but I think you need

to keep giving any prescription medication that her doc has her on,

unless you want to discuss that with him and he agrees to let you

wait. If you feel it's effective, you should keep it in place... but

make SURE there are no illegals in the Rx.

>

> You said:

> <<She still hasn't eaten and we're on day 7 (she has had 3 bites

of

> jello and 2 bananas). >>

>

> So.... she IS eating! That's good. It may not seem like much,

but it's a start. I really liked the idea someone gave you last

night of mixing broth into her juice. You can do that with jello,

too..... strain the broth really well through cheesecloth (so

there's no " bits " to inspect!)... and use that liquid to mix with

juice to make the jello. The broth has such good healing qualities.

>

> Let's see what today brings...

>

> Patti

>

>

[Guest guest]

,

I forgot to type this earlier... but we do *usually* suggest that parents wait

a few weeks... or even a couple of months into SCD to start the yogurt, if their

kids have been casein free prior. Starting the acidophilus now is great... but

you may want to give it just a wee bit longer. The yogurt is powerful stuff (in

a good way), but can trigger more die-off.

Patti

Re: PLEASE HELP!? Daughter on diet 5 days and pooping

everywhere!

I just started to

make a batch of yogurt and I also ordered the Acidophilus from

Kirkmans.

Recent Activity

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[Guest guest]

Hi ,

I just read your post and I do have some answers for you!! The issue

of not keeping her clothes on is caused from the DIE-OFF, alot of

kids going through die-off don't like to wear clothes and remove

them,it just feels better to them. So, I'd say let her run around the

house naked if it makes her happy. I would negotiate the matter with

her, and make a reward system. She must wear clothes after bath to

bed and keep them on if she gets to go without during the day.

The other issue with smearing poop, that is a imbalance what have you

changed (vitamins)? Taken away or started new? It's good to keep a

journal so you can look back and referance what you have changed or

when you started something new. It can better lead you in the correct

direction of what she is doing new or regressed.What you changed and

if there are things you should stop or start in her reginum. I have

had the problem and also talked to other people about the sensory

regarding pooping. Our kids with autism really go through a rough

time. My son now almost 5, and has autism. I caught him smearing poop

1 time. I't was because I had changed some of his vitamins. Started

them again have not had the problem again.I as well talked to him

about what he did and was very calm, he had to help clean it up. Tell

your child in a calm voice what she did is not OK and have her help

clean it up. They will lean and use the stool. Sometimes its harder

on the parent than the kids. Hang in there, I will say a prayer for

you. Hope your husband finds strengh, does he read these post as

well? Hope he does!

Blessings, Christy Mom of Tristen

---

>

> > I really hope someone can help me!! My 3 yr. old daughter started

> > the diet 5 days ago. I shouldn't even say she's doing the 'diet'

> > because she's not - she just stopped eating.

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Christy,

Thanks for your reply!

Rylee actually wore her clothes all day yesterday so the die off

period must be ending (Yippee!!!!). We actually went to the grocery

store together yesterday and picked up a few things - she wouldn't

wear her shoes but i'll settle for clothes right now.

As for negotiating - You may have not read one of my messages but

Rylee isn't on that level yet. She doesn't have any language and she

is just starting to recognize commands like " we're going bye-bye "

or " it's night-night time " . Besides that, she doesn't really

understand too much.

I haven't changed or started/stopped any supplements in months.

We've been at biomed for almost 2 years now, i'm not new to that,

but i'm definitely new to SCD. We did GFCF and that didn't work out

because we still fought yeast continually because all she wanted was

GFCF pizza every single day.

And I agree about keeping journals.....I probably have around 30 of

them in my 'Rylee files' - I look back at them often to see how her

behaviors have changed over time and what we did to make them

change. If it weren't for the journals, i'd be lost.

I think her poop smearing had alot to do with the die off because

she hasn't done it since Sunday morning (keeping my fingers crossed

on that one), she was real red around her anus and that seems to be

disappearing now.

I cooked up apples and peaches and a little Welchs grape juice and

made popsicles, she actually took 3 small bites this morning! I'm

hoping that's a start.

I have an appt. to start feeding therapy with the Cleveland Clinic

on Dec. 5th, so i'm hoping they can help me with all of her texture

and sensory issues. We'll see how it goes.

Thank you all so much ~~ I honestly couldn't have gotten through any

of this without all of you. I was going to throw in the towel and

give her a Nutrigrain bar this weekend because I was so tired of the

screaming and crying but all of your posts and emails really helped

me pull through it. I know this is what is best for her and I know

now that I really have to stick to my guns and tough it out with her!

Thank you all!

> > > I really hope someone can help me!! My 3 yr. old daughter

started

> > > the diet 5 days ago. I shouldn't even say she's doing

the 'diet'

> > > because she's not - she just stopped eating.

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

,

That is huge! She took a couple of bites of the popsicle! You are definitely

on the right track. Get her started on that probiotic from Kirkman as soon as

it comes in.

Meleah

Re: PLEASE HELP!? Daughter on diet 5 days and pooping

everywhere!

Hi Christy,

Thanks for your reply!

Rylee actually wore her clothes all day yesterday so the die off

period must be ending (Yippee!!!!). We actually went to the grocery

store together yesterday and picked up a few things - she wouldn't

wear her shoes but i'll settle for clothes right now.

As for negotiating - You may have not read one of my messages but

Rylee isn't on that level yet. She doesn't have any language and she

is just starting to recognize commands like " we're going bye-bye "

or " it's night-night time " . Besides that, she doesn't really

understand too much.

I haven't changed or started/stopped any supplements in months.

We've been at biomed for almost 2 years now, i'm not new to that,

but i'm definitely new to SCD. We did GFCF and that didn't work out

because we still fought yeast continually because all she wanted was

GFCF pizza every single day.

And I agree about keeping journals.....I probably have around 30 of

them in my 'Rylee files' - I look back at them often to see how her

behaviors have changed over time and what we did to make them

change. If it weren't for the journals, i'd be lost.

I think her poop smearing had alot to do with the die off because

she hasn't done it since Sunday morning (keeping my fingers crossed

on that one), she was real red around her anus and that seems to be

disappearing now.

I cooked up apples and peaches and a little Welchs grape juice and

made popsicles, she actually took 3 small bites this morning! I'm

hoping that's a start.

I have an appt. to start feeding therapy with the Cleveland Clinic

on Dec. 5th, so i'm hoping they can help me with all of her texture

and sensory issues. We'll see how it goes.

Thank you all so much ~~ I honestly couldn't have gotten through any

of this without all of you. I was going to throw in the towel and

give her a Nutrigrain bar this weekend because I was so tired of the

screaming and crying but all of your posts and emails really helped

me pull through it. I know this is what is best for her and I know

now that I really have to stick to my guns and tough it out with her!

Thank you all!

> > > I really hope someone can help me!! My 3 yr. old daughter

started

> > > the diet 5 days ago. I shouldn't even say she's doing

the 'diet'

> > > because she's not - she just stopped eating.

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

> She ate banana yogurt with NO FRUIT. It was the Smooth and Creamy

> kind with no bits of anything in it.

>

> She ate the Giant Eagle brand for a long time (that is a grocery

> store chain here in Ohio - I wasn't sure if it was around the U.S.)

> but then I tried to get some better stuff in her and I found

> Stonyfield Farms Yogurt in the Organic Aisle. It comes in Banana

and

> Strawberry. She liked both of those.

>

> Her DAN! Dr. told us to do SCD without dairy. I asked him if I

could

> try and make the yogurt and he said he would prefer that we didn't.

>

> Is it okay for her to have the yogurt? Are their other children

that

> eat the yogurt or 'acceptable' cheeses ?

Yes, some of the kids start the diet with the legal cheeses and the

yogurt. Some don't start with dairy but add it in later slowly.

Others stay dairy free.

Some of the problem that people experience with dairy is the

lactose. Commercial yogurt has quite a bit of lactose in it as do

some cheeses. In BTVC Elaine listed legal cheeses, the illegal

cheese list are the ones with lactose. SCD yogurt is fermented fully

to break down all the lactose.

Some people's problem with dairy is casein. When milk is made into

yogurt the (fermentation) process changes the casein from a 3-

dimensional (more difficult to digest) to a 2-dimensional shape

(easier to digest).

Lastly, some have a problem with cow dairy. The milk proteins in

cow dairy are fairly large. On the other hand the milk proteins in

goat milk are smaller and easier to digest. Couple this with the

yogurt process and you have dairy that is lactose free, the casein is

altered and it has small easy to digest milk proteins. This is why

we suggest goat dairy as a starting point for those interested in

starting or restarting dairy.

Since the yogurt is fully fermented it is extremely high in good

bacteria. To minimize die off symptoms (which are sometimes confused

with intolerance of dairy) we also recommend starting with a tiny

amount and gradually increasing it 1/8 -1/4 tsp every second day.

Adding epsom salt baths and/or activated charcoal as needed to help

with die off symptoms. 1/8tsp has ~2 billion CFU's of good bacteria

and 1/4tsp of dairy yogurt has almost 4 billion CFU's of good

bacteria. The bacteria in yogurt are encapsulated so they will

travel further in the GI tract than the good bacteria in powdered

probiotics/capsules, so for those who are used to giving probiotics

there will likely still be increased die off with the addition of SCD

yogurt.

> Rylee immediately starts

> spinning in circles and repeating the same low-pitched sounds over

> and over again everytime she eats yogurt.

Rylees problem could be from die off, regular casein, lactose or the

bacteria strains in the commercial yogurt etc.

> I made a batch of the yogurt about 4 months ago and it looked

great.

> I put it in the freezer and when it defrosted it looked like

spoiled

> milk. It was watery and broken down into little chunks. It looked

> nothing like it did before I put it in the freezer. I'm assuming I

> did something very wrong!

No. Plain yogurt will lose its' texture when frozen. If fruit is

added or honey (eg. making it into ice cream adding fruit to make a

fruity frozen yogurt) this will help maintain the texture.

>

> I was thinking at the time to blend some very ripe bananas in the

> yogurt with a little vanilla extract but I never made it that far.

I

> am willing to give it a shot again if you think it's okay for her

to

> have it.

I think it is very important to have a source of good bacteria

especially when battling yeast. It need not be yogurt. You can also

use probiotics ;legal ones at

http://pecanbread.com/probiotics.html#brands

or fermented non-dairy foods like homemade kimchi or sauerkraut. In

my opinion the SCD yogurt is your best bet because you have three

great strains which interact to help fight yeast.

> Any suggestions would be great - I just want her to eat something!

If you do decide to go with the yogurt let me know as I have a few

more suggestions to make it easier to tolerate and some recipe ideas.

Sheila, SCD Feb. 2001, UC 22yrs

mom of and